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Special Interest => Hardyville => Topic started by: Tribeless on October 06, 2003, 07:49:26 pm

Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Tribeless on October 06, 2003, 07:49:26 pm
Hi Claire

This is my first post to your forum. I've been following your blog for a couple of months now and enjoying it very much - I think I came to it through SOLO (sense of life objectivists), but that is not really all that important.

As one of those crusty people who often prefers animals to humans :) I just wanted to thank you for your blog some weeks ago now regarding the dogs on the freeways. It was very well written, and very touching. Actually, it was a very powerful piece; I still have the images you created in my mind, and not just a little bit of the anger.

Cheers
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 06, 2003, 08:33:56 pm
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As one of those crusty people who often prefers animals to humans :) I just wanted to thank you for your blog some weeks ago now regarding the dogs on the freeways. It was very well written, and very touching. Actually, it was a very powerful piece; I still have the images you created in my mind, and not just a little bit of the anger.
 
Hello, Tribeless. Good to have you here. And thanks for giving a damn. You know, sometimes I hesitate about putting posts like that one on the blog ... not political, very personal. I worry people might only want news & Attitude. So it means a lot when someone responds.

I, too, can't get those images out of my mind, especially the yellow lab trotting down the road one minute and ... um, let's not go there. It happened just the night before I wrote, and I still ache over not being able to think of a safe way to save the poor old guy.

On a more cheerful subject: I'll have to check out SOLO. I'm not acquainted with it, so thanks for the pointer.

Claire

P.S. Crusty is good.  :)  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Carl on October 06, 2003, 10:26:17 pm
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As one of those crusty people who often prefers animals to humans :)
 
Well, it depends on the critter. But I usually like animals better too. Especially cats.

Breaded and deep fried.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Jac on October 07, 2003, 12:06:47 am
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Especially cats. Breaded and deep fried.
Carl! Don't you know you're not supposed to give your dogs fried food?!? :P  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 07, 2003, 12:25:54 am
Carl's dogs ARE fried food. Or launched into orbit.  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Carl on October 07, 2003, 12:27:04 am
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Carl! Don't you know you're not supposed to give your dogs fried food?!? :P
You're kiddin', right?

Let the canines fry their own damned kitties.

 
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Carl on October 07, 2003, 12:28:43 am
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Carl's dogs ARE fried food. Or launched into orbit.
I've only had roasted dog.

And I only put smores in orbit.

So far.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Jac on October 07, 2003, 06:10:43 pm
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Carl's dogs ARE fried food.
"101 ways to wok you're dog. -- An Indonesian cookbook."
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 07, 2003, 06:39:41 pm
Er, ahem, guys. There are some serious dog lovers here. I mean of the type who don't like 'em roasted or toasted or barbecued or basted. Of the kind who cry at the thought of a dead puppy. The kind who rescue abused dogs and vanish them into the doggie underground. The kind who leave everything they own in trust for their pets. I'm talking serious, serious heartbreaking love -- which is the thing that inspired this thread.

Now cats, you can say anything you want about cats. But if any of you feel the slightest bit of respect for me -- you know, the woman whose name is all scripty and important looking up there at the top of your browser, the wonderful, kind person some of you actually know and love, the woman whose five enourmous dogs crawl lickingly into her bed each morning -- will you kindly, kindly please, take the dog-munching talk elsewhere?

And if you won't do it for me, do it for Robbie. The pit bull. With the very bad temper. Whom I may bring to next year's LRT conclave, where I know several of you worst offenders are planning to be. Robbie, I assure you, really, really, really doesn't approve of this sort of conversation.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Jac on October 07, 2003, 06:54:37 pm
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Er, ahem, guys. There are some serious dog lovers here. I mean of the type who don't like 'em roasted or toasted or barbecued or basted. Of the kind who cry at the thought of a dead puppy. The kind who rescue abused dogs and vanish them into the doggie underground. The kind who leave everything they own in trust for their pets. I'm talking serious, serious heartbreaking love -- which is the thing that inspired this thread.
Actually, I am that kind of dog lover. Honestly, my dogs _are_ my friends.

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Now cats, you can say anything you want about cats.
Absolutely! Don't like cats.

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But if any of you feel the slightest bit of respect for me -- you know, the woman whose name is all scripty and important looking up there at the top of your browser, the wonderful, kind person some of you actually know and love, the woman whose five enourmous dogs crawl lickingly into her bed each morning -- will you kindly, kindly please, take the dog-munching talk elsewhere?
I'm sorry. Please forgive me. :unsure:

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And if you won't do it for me, do it for Robbie. The pit bull. With the very bad temper. Whom I may bring to next year's LRT conclave, where I know several of you worst offenders are planning to be. Robbie, I assure you, really, really, really doesn't approve of this sort of conversation.
Robbie sounds cool! If I can get to the conclave, I'd like to meet Robbie. :)

(Oh, yeah... THEY STARTED IT!)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 07, 2003, 08:43:00 pm

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I'm sorry. Please forgive me. :unsure:

Awwww, don't worry, Jac. It's not like I actually expect anybody to pay any attention. I just thought I'd play the whine card on the off chance it might work.  :rolleyes:

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(Oh, yeah... THEY STARTED IT!)

That's the spirit! Hunter ... Carl, you're a BAAAAAAD influence.

(And no doubt you're proud of the fact.)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 07, 2003, 09:31:35 pm
Quite.  :ph34r:  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Tribeless on October 07, 2003, 09:57:47 pm
One of the good things I find about freedom loving people (as diametrically opposed to freedom hating lefties, generalisations aside :)) is that they, as I do, tend to have broad shoulders and very good senses of humour (although perhaps not all objectivists fall into that category ...)  I suspect that this is because freedom lovers normally recogise the existence of an objective reality, and thus know the difference between fictional levity (above), and the stark reality of those shits with their trucks/dogs on your freeways.

Thus I don't mind the dog eating jokes :) But our great dane would rather like some time with some of those gentlemen in their trucks :)

Actually, the subject of animals is one that I often run aground on in objectivist circles (as in on the rocks). Many objectivists seemed to have inferred from the dictim that animals are below us on the intellectual chain as meaning that they have no rights over humans, therefore, treat them as you want. I can't agree with that on any level: yes, if it comes down to survival between an animal and a human, I grudgingly suppose the human should take precedence (although I would demand the right to see who the human was before making the final decision :)), however, such a cruel attitude (because cruelty is how such an attitude always ends up), completely ignores the fact that animals have nervous systems and feel pain, and fear. Also, I know there are numerous studies evidencing a link between humans who have been monstrous to other humans as having their grounding in cruelty to animals.

I always feel safer with the animal lovers .

Although nothing in the above should be read to infer that I am an anti-GE luddite. But that would be another discussion.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 07, 2003, 10:24:13 pm
To be completely serious for a moment, any two-legged creature that would mistreat an animal is not a human - it is a large, cruel insect that should be stamped on as quickly as possible. How exactly to reconcile that opinion with the ZAP I have never bothered figuring out. Claire knows a little about my cats, what I haven't told her is that I *love* dogs, specifically german sheperds - but my lifestyle would quickly render a dog insane, and I won't do that to one. I pretty regularly joke about skinning my cats and making throw rugs out of them; they have never seemed very worried. I could tell some stories about Carl and animals that DON'T involve a stewpot or a frying pan, but I won't embarass him. <grin>  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Carl on October 07, 2003, 10:42:17 pm
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Carl, you're a BAAAAAAD influence.
 
{ proud smile }

And if it does worry you, check out my short piece about how pissed I got when I thought I was going to have to kill a dog:

http://www.gbronline.com/cwb/samizdat/dog.html (http://www.gbronline.com/cwb/samizdat/dog.html)

And I can give most of the cats in the neighborhood as references; Blossom and Buster know a sucker when they see one. :)  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Carl on October 07, 2003, 10:53:24 pm
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I could tell some stories about Carl and animals that DON'T involve a stewpot or a frying pan, but I won't embarass him. <grin>
No. Really. That was... my _sister_.

No! I mean... My sister's_dog_. Errrr, _cat_ Ummm... gerbil!
 :P  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: suijurisfreeman on October 08, 2003, 06:25:47 am
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To be completely serious for a moment, any two-legged creature that would mistreat an animal is not a human - it is a large, cruel insect that should be stamped on as quickly as possible. How exactly to reconcile that opinion with the ZAP I have never bothered figuring out. Claire knows a little about my cats, what I haven't told her is that I *love* dogs, specifically german sheperds - but my lifestyle would quickly render a dog insane, and I won't do that to one. I pretty regularly joke about skinning my cats and making throw rugs out of them; they have never seemed very worried. I could tell some stories about Carl and animals that DON'T involve a stewpot or a frying pan, but I won't embarass him. <grin
I'll have to admit, I'm partial to felines, but that's only because I ran a "cathouse" for 27 years!  Yes I said CATHOUSE!  Now you can get your minds out of the gutter and come down here with mine, actually I owned and operated a business that I started in 1974 wherein I designed, manufactured and delivered custom built indoor carpeted cat furniture to pet shops throughout the midwest.  Purr-fect Cat Creations - my motto was "We're fur cats only!"  Anyway it was a pretty cool way to support myself and family for 27 years allowing me a great deal of freedom to pursue my real interests.  I've got two jet black felines that hang out on my 20 acres in southcentral Kentucky, Midnight and Smokie.  
But then there's Zesus, a black and silver German shephard that calls the 20 acres home also.  He's a free dog, a Canine Liber, just like I'm a Freeman, Homo Liber.  Last Thursday I was in the Sheriff's Office and noticed a sign on the wall stating that all dogs over 6 months of age are "required" to be licensed, Zesus and I had a good laugh about that one!  Zesus just smiled and said, "You know it's one thing for Humans to try and enslave other Humans, but no Human is gonna tell me that I need a license!  Pretty damn independent dog that Zesus!
Come to think of it, Zesus's teeth were showing when I thought he was smiling, maybe that wasn't a smile after all!  Zesus has large, strong teeth inside that big mouth, his chew toy is a 15 pound block of firewood (white oak at that!) - good doggie!  A couple of years back a neighbor brought his "preacher" over with him to my property, I was coming up the hill and saw this guy running like hell for his car - it musta been the sight of Zesus a couple hundred feet in front of me!  I think after he left a little "drawer" cleaning was necessary when he got home!

If anyone is interested, you can see where Midnight, Smokie, Zesus and I hang out in southcentral Kentucky at:  http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion2/suijurisfreeman (http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion2/suijurisfreeman)
Yes it really is a cardboard yurt, it only cost $1,200 to construct!  It's still standing 4 years later, just as warm and dry as the day we errected it back in November of 1999.  I'm not hooked up to any public utilities, heat and cook with wood.  It's pretty primitive by most people's standards, but it's home sweet home for me!
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 08:01:32 am
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How exactly to reconcile that opinion with the ZAP

If yer me, it's not a stretch to to extend the "human being" part of the ZAP to critters as well.

Ergo, them that mistreat animals are initiating force, and are fair game for "stamping."

'Course the state doesn't share my viewpoint...
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 08:03:25 am
Oh, and it was a fine and infuriating piece in the 'blog.

I move we elect Claire chairwoman for life! ::grin::
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 08, 2003, 08:45:04 am
Augustwest, how COULD you do something like that to poor Claire?


Hunter's Hundred Eighty-Sixth Rule: If you look back and there's folks behind you, you're either a leader or about to get mugged. Not that there's much difference.
 
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 08:53:13 am
milelongmeanstreak?
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 08, 2003, 09:46:53 am
Oh, well, that's not so bad then.  :D  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: debra on October 08, 2003, 10:28:40 am
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Claire knows a little about my cats, what I haven't told her is that I *love* dogs, specifically german sheperds
Ah, Hunter. I knew you were a man of refined and discerning taste.  I shall take advantage of this opportunity to show off pictures of my precious:

(http://www.theclairefiles.com/mystuff/kirby.jpg)

(http://www.theclairefiles.com/mystuff/kirby2.jpg)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: debra on October 08, 2003, 10:33:09 am
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But if any of you feel the slightest bit of respect for me -- you know, the woman whose name is all scripty and important looking up there at the top of your browser,
And so it begins - power doth corrupt <shakes head sadly>

Quote

And if you won't do it for me, do it for Robbie. The pit bull. With the very bad temper. Whom I may bring to next year's LRT conclave, where I know several of you worst offenders are planning to be. Robbie, I assure you, really, really, really doesn't approve of this sort of conversation.

Hee hee hee. I love Robbie.  He's so snuggly. Except when he's trying to eat my beloved Kirby....
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 08, 2003, 11:02:38 am
Debra, that is one FINE sheperd. <sigh> I need to get a life so I can get one. I really miss having a dog.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 08, 2003, 11:24:50 am
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Quote
But if any of you feel the slightest bit of respect for me -- you know, the woman whose name is all scripty and important looking up there at the top of your browser,
And so it begins - power doth corrupt <shakes head sadly>

You may be right about the corrupting part. But somehow, even if I wanted it, I don't think this crowd is going to let me have any actual power. (All for the best, that.)

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Quote
And if you won't do it for me, do it for Robbie. The pit bull. With the very bad temper. Whom I may bring to next year's LRT conclave, where I know several of you worst offenders are planning to be. Robbie, I assure you, really, really, really doesn't approve of this sort of conversation.

Hee hee hee. I love Robbie.  He's so snuggly. Except when he's trying to eat my beloved Kirby....

Yeah ... I don't think these jokers really believed me when I threatened to bring a bad-tempered pit bull to the next LRT conclave. But Debra knows. Robbie: The Scourge of All Dogdom. He may not be all pit bull, but he's all pit bull in attitude. And every dog that gets within 100 yards of him knows -- and fears. (So Debra, *please* don't tell anybody that, when it comes to humans, the worst Robbie would do is lick them until they're pruney. I'm trying to instill some respect in these rowdies.)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 08, 2003, 11:31:16 am
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Debra, that is one FINE sheperd. <sigh> I need to get a life so I can get one. I really miss having a dog.
Anybody: If you can't have a dog, for any reason, DO NOT hang out with Debra! DO NOT accept any invitation from her to go hiking or four-wheeling in the desert. Do not even KNOW her. Avoid this woman!

(So, Debra, are you going to tell how you acquired Kirby? And Copper?)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: debra on October 08, 2003, 12:04:37 pm
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Quote
Debra, that is one FINE sheperd. <sigh> I need to get a life so I can get one. I really miss having a dog.
Anybody: If you can't have a dog, for any reason, DO NOT hang out with Debra! DO NOT accept any invitation from her to go hiking or four-wheeling in the desert. Do not even KNOW her. Avoid this woman!

(So, Debra, are you going to tell how you acquired Kirby? And Copper?)
Well, since you insist <leans back in a rocking chair, lighting her pipe...no, not THAT kind of pipe!>

It all began back in Ought Two.  It was a beautiful spring day, and we were out 4-wheelin' in the mountains surrounding the Las Vegas valley. It was me, my husband, our two kids, and our 100 lb Golden Retriever in our doorless, topless jeep (well, of COURSE the doors and top were off!)

We pulled down a little dirt road and stopped to switch over into 4WD when my daughter asked, "What's that?" and pointed toward a yucca tree. We saw a little movement, and suddenly two tiny German Shepherd pups (perhaps 4 weeks old) came bounding up to the jeep.  Two more had remained underneath the yucca.  

Naturally we all started cooing, but my husband wouldn't let us get out until he scoped out for a possibly feral momma. No tracks, no scat - they were by themselves.  We put out water for them (which we had brought for the golden), and three of them drank eagerly (though we initially had to coax one of the ones who had been under the yucca). But the fourth remained under the yucca tree, refusing to move. We tried to get it to drink, but it just looked at us with flat, dead eyes, and then looked away.  When we picked him up, we could feel something jutting out from his side - a rib, most likely.

Well, we couldn't just leave them there.  So each child was given one of the two lethargic ones, and I had the two frisky ones in my lap up front, whom I kept trying to stuff into an insulated tote bag to keep them from jumping out of the jeep.  

Upon arrival home, we ran to the vet with the injured pup. Closed. Off to Petsmart, where they had a vet. The vet was closed, but one of the trainers there had an emergency number. She held the puppy and went to call...and returned a few minutes later. The pup had died in her arms.  After the three of us bawled like idiots for 10 minutes, we went home to our remaining three (the trainer was going to take the pup's body to the vet).  

Took them to the vet the next day, and they weighed between 5 and 7 lbs each.  We found homes for all three (whom we named Random, Chance, and Chaos), which was good because we adored them. Especially the frisky duo, Random & Chance, who did everything in tandem, like little furry Marines.  After one week, Chaos came back - seems that after he was fed for a few days, he perked up and began driving their cat insane.  I had fallen in love with him before he left, so when he came back, I figured it was destiny. He's been my baby ever since (although we did rechristen him Kirby by my son's request. Chaos is more fitting, however). At 88lbs, it's hard to believe he was ever so tiny.

Now Copper came to us just this last spring, about a month before the Grand Western Conference. We were offroading in ANOTHER part of the valley when this lone Australian Shepherd (red merle, if anyone's interested) came trotting up to the jeep.  No tags, no chip, and a partial faded tattoo in his ear.  We ran ads in the paper and put signs all over, but no dice.  People in the neighborhood near where we discovered him hadn't seen him before, but indicated that people dumped dogs out there all the time.  I could confirm this since we had found decayed corpses of dogs in the area before.

Now, I had been telling Claire how it was simply impossible for us to have three dogs.  But Copper had other plans.  Kirby's not overly friendly with other dogs, but he and Copper became inseparable within 24 hours.  Within 72 hours, it was as though he had been part of our family for years.  So we kept him, and even brought him - as well as Kirby and Laz-the-giant-golden-retriever - to the GWC with us.  (Copper travels beautifully, btw.  Falls into a coma while the car is moving, and leaps into action when it stops.)

So if anyone needs a dog, just say the word and I'll wander out to the desert and pick one up for ya.  ;)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 01:11:14 pm
Well, since we're talking about dogs coming back to be with us, there's the story of Maisey...

Me an t'other half wanted to get a dog a few years ago. Tried several times to go to the shelter in my town, but they always seemed to be closed. So we went to another place a few towns north of here. Wanted, of course, to take 'em all home. But we were getting ONE dog.

So there's this lab mix there, jumping against his cage, looking happy. A likely choice. Pretty sure he's the one. But to be fair, we check out everyone else, including this small-side-of-medium-sized terrier/whippet cross with wiry red fur. She looks scared and forlorn - had been abused, was very skinny, and covered with tick bite scabs. Pulled at the heartstrings, she did.

But we meet the labish one, and he's it. While I'm filling out paperwork, the director of the shelter asks my wife if she'd like to walk the red dog. "Sure," she says. Goes out for a while, and comes back with an unmistakeable, "I want this one, too" look about her.

So I fill out another set of papers.

Next day, we go and pick up both dogs. Get home, and as I'm letting the red one in the house, she slips her collar, and takes off down the railroad tracks behind us.

I give chase, but any time I get within 100 yards, she takes off again. While we're on the tracks, she's easy to see, but it was autumn, and she's reddish, and decides to run off into the leaves.

We call the dog warden in case anybody finds her. I'm out traipsing through the woods for hours (with my trusty Maglight after a while, 'cause it's fall, and gets dark early.) I go back to the house to take a break, really upset. This poor little dog who came out of the woods and got rescued is lost in the woods again.

We decide to take one more look around before we give up, open the door to go out, and there she is, standing by the door, wagging her tail. ::sniff::

She's been home ever since, mostly. Although, as I mentioned to someone a little while ago, just this morning I figured out how she's been sneaking out once a week or so, and sheepishly greeting me when I get home from work.

So that's the story of Maisey the red dog. Some day she won't be around, and I hate that.

Oh, and Ruben, the lab? He's a good dog. 'cept for a fiendish prey drive. And the fact that once he got done barking, he'd probably lick an intruder to death.

Hate that he won't be around forever too.

But it's worth it...  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 08, 2003, 01:40:21 pm
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One of the good things I find about freedom loving people (as diametrically opposed to freedom hating lefties, generalisations aside :)) is that they, as I do, tend to have broad shoulders and very good senses of humour (although perhaps not all objectivists fall into that category ...) 

Actually, the subject of animals is one that I often run aground on in objectivist circles (as in on the rocks). Many objectivists seemed to have inferred from the dictim that animals are below us on the intellectual chain as meaning that they have no rights over humans, therefore, treat them as you want. I can't agree with that on any level: yes, if it comes down to survival between an animal and a human, I grudgingly suppose the human should take precedence (although I would demand the right to see who the human was before making the final decision :)), however, such a cruel attitude (because cruelty is how such an attitude always ends up), completely ignores the fact that animals have nervous systems and feel pain, and fear. Also, I know there are numerous studies evidencing a link between humans who have been monstrous to other humans as having their grounding in cruelty to animals.

I always feel safer with the animal lovers .

Hey, Tribeless! I checked out Sense of Life Objectivists (http://solohq.com/) and thought it was pretty good. I admit to prejudice against Objectivism (in the sense that ex-smokers or ex-religionists are sometimes prejudiced against cigarettes or gods), but SOLO had solid freedom info even us benighted bigots could perceive. Thank you.

I think you're right about a sense of humor (and right that perhaps, just perhaps, not all Objectivists share it  ;) ). I'd go further and say that in general, intelligent people (which, naturally includes all of us  :P ) tend to have stronger senses of humor than less-intelligent.

I agree with you about treatment of animals and thank you for taking that position.

The more I see of my dogs the more I realize that, even though they're below me in intellect (except on my really bad days :rolleyes: ), they're obviously superior to me in various ways, like being able to sense danger or perceive a friend coming at a distance, and in some senses they're superior to me in character; I have nowhere near their capacity for unadulterated love.Even if one argues that their love comes from pack-preservation or whatever ... well, they still have something I find enviable and noble.

LOL, I've seen various studies of dog intelligence & I notice that, to the dog-smarts researcher, "intelligence" is measured almost entirely by how well the dog can obey what a human wants it to do. Thus the uncanny border collie always tops the list, while the lowly bassett, who just sits there with a "so what" gaze of ennui, is somewhere near the bottom.

I consider the possibility that some of dogdoms dummies are smarter than we think, having figured out how to get fed for nothin'.

To close: If you're a great Dane person, you must be one fine human being. God, I love Danes! And you must have a sense of humor because no one could watch a Dane sit on a couch with its front feet on the floor and not laugh.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Scarmiglione' on October 08, 2003, 01:42:46 pm
Dog stories.

My wife one day decides, "We're getting a dog."

I'm not up for a dog at this point, I'm still trying to get used to being married and having to share living space with someone.  I compromise that we will go and *look* at dogs, but we aren't taking one home because we don't have the fence repaired/money in the budget/time to train/etc.

So we are at the rescue and I like this older, sedate female German Shepherd.  She'd been abused, but she needed a home for her remaining years.  But my wife goes straight for this young golden...  thing.  Matted hair and stickers and mud and bouncing in his cage like a crazy puppy.

So the predictable result happens.

"I want the golden."

"Okay, but he's your dog.  You pay for him.  You feed him.  You get his shots.  You clean up the dog shit out of *my* back yard.  I'm not doing it. (Famous last words)"

So we go home with this golden.  I take him home and show him around, and he's very subdued.  New place, new male, very apprehensive.  I stay home with him while my wife goes to the pet store to buy all the stuff a dog needs.  We just sit next to each other, the dog and I, not really looking at each other at all.

Fast forward a bit.  My wife has mostly kept up her part of the deal, except for cleaning the dog shit out of *my* back yard.  He housebreaks easily.  Was well-behaved through the night after the first couple of weeks.  He responds to my training some, but it was just obligation for both of us.  He stayed outside during the day and inside at night.

One day I came home and opened the back door to let him in.  But he wasn't there.  Odd.  I walked out onto our deck and called his name.  I heard a muffled wimper and a cry.  I called his name again and heard him crying again, but I couldn't tell where it was coming from.  It was somewhere very close, but I couldn't see him.  Finally a grab a flashlight and get to see the entire story.

See, this dog is a retriever.  But somehow he got a double-dose of the retriever instinct.  He will chase a ball 24/7, or until his heart explodes.  No joke.  Always carrying a ball, always chasing it, always begging someone to throw it for him to fetch.  Apparantly he was playing with it out in the yard and bumped it under our deck.  Well he stuck his head in after it, and bumped it further under the deck.  So he twisted sideways and stuck his shoulders under the deck, and bumped it again.  (Can you see where this is going?  He didn't.)  Lather, Rinse, Repeat.  By the time I got home, after how many hours I have no idea, he was firmly wedged a full 5 feet from where he had first gone under the deck, with his ball in his mouth and completely panicked and terrified that he couldn't get out.   I took a crowbar and had to tear up the steps to my deck, lay on my belly and drag him out by his front paws.

Long story short it was our bonding moment and we became good friends after that.  We've had some rough spots since the baby was born, but he's taken them in stride.

This is him lying next to my daughter. (http://www.scarmig.com/rowan-2003/July/images/July-2003-0009.JPG)
 
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 01:48:45 pm
Buncha fancy people with your purebred dogs ;)  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Scarmiglione' on October 08, 2003, 01:51:51 pm
My dog ain't purebred.  He's prettier (and poncier) than that!
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 02:01:57 pm
You can stay then...  :D  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 08, 2003, 02:07:01 pm
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Buncha fancy people with your purebred dogs ;)
All of my dogs are purebreds. Only problem is, there's at least 15 identifiable "purebreds" and only five dogs to divide all those breeds among.

(Actually, one IS a purebred. I got her from Debra. See what I mean about not hanging out with Debra if you aren't supposed to have a dog?)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 02:21:27 pm
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All of my dogs are purebreds. Only problem is, there's at least 15 identifiable "purebreds" and only five dogs to divide all those breeds among.

LOL. Ok, everyone might as well stay then.

Coolest dog (other than any I've had, of course) I've ever known was Samson - a Doberman who still had his ears and tail.
 
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Tribeless on October 08, 2003, 02:38:59 pm
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And you must have a sense of humor because no one could watch a Dane sit on a couch with its front feet on the floor and not laugh.
Or setting her bottom down on what she thought was a couch, but was actually a tax inspector sitting on her couch, then eyeballing same most indignantly while pinning him there and definitely not moving :)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 08, 2003, 02:41:02 pm
Quote
Quote
And you must have a sense of humor because no one could watch a Dane sit on a couch with its front feet on the floor and not laugh.
Or setting her bottom down on what she thought was a couch, but was actually a tax inspector sitting on her couch, then eyeballing same most indignantly while pinning him there and definitely not moving :)
A tax inspector? Oh, my. You'd better have a sense of humor AND bail money!
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 08, 2003, 04:32:45 pm
Quote
...even though they're below me in intellect...

I felt the same way until a few minutes ago, when I got home and the Red Menace ran up and greet me before I was even outta the Jeep.  :D

Thought I had a pretty good solution to her escape hatch. Back to the drawing board...
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: debra on October 08, 2003, 04:58:33 pm
Quote

I felt the same way until a few minutes ago, when I got home and the Red Menace ran up and greet me before I was even outta the Jeep.  :D

Thought I had a pretty good solution to her escape hatch. Back to the drawing board...
Another Jeeper.  Cool.  B)  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 09, 2003, 06:46:27 am
::shaking head:: Um, that shoulda been "greeted me."

Jeeps are a very good thing  :)

With a goodly amount of wire, and some oak logs in place, I believe the red dog will greet me from inside the house this evening.

'course that's what I was thinking yesterday at this time, so...
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 09, 2003, 07:04:34 am
Where'd ya leave your chainsaw?   :blink:  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 09, 2003, 07:46:39 am
Outta reach of my wiley mutts, for sure. Same goes for the shovels.  :)  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Hunter on October 09, 2003, 08:08:53 am
Good man! <laugh> I will be quite interested to see how they make good their escape this time. <twinkle>  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 09, 2003, 08:20:35 am
Aw hell, I think I left a come-along and a good-sized length of chain out in the kitchen this morning.

Gotta run...
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 10, 2003, 08:31:29 am
I'd hoped to have a photo of my lil red intellectual rival hosted somewhere by now, but a combination of work, minor natural disasters, procrastination, and figuring out how to prevent my sapper of a mutt from dismantling good, solid chain link fence hasn't afforded the time.

For them that's interested, this link to Yeehaw is a temporary fix.

Red Dog (http://f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/augustwest1968/vwp?.dir=/My+Photos&.dnm=Red+Dog++Nose.jpg&.view=t)

Doesn't paint the whole picture - it gets the strange part across pretty well, but not the beautiful part. 'Course they're always beautiful to members of their own pack :-)
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Josh2923 on October 11, 2003, 02:48:07 am
Speaking of animals, was Claire advocating animal rights legislation in her blog entry that mentioned Nat Hentoff?

http://www.clairewolfe.com/wolfesblog/00000294.html (http://www.clairewolfe.com/wolfesblog/00000294.html)
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"Hentoff is one of the great voices for freedom (despite not raising his voice in favor of the guardian amendment)."

From what I could find out about guardian amendments through Google, it seems they're the brainchildren of PETA-like animal rights activists:

http://www.akc.org/love/dip/legislat/tcapr01.cfm (http://www.akc.org/love/dip/legislat/tcapr01.cfm)
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IDA and other extreme animal rights groups want to raise the stature of animals to that of human beings, to convince the courts that animals have rights. Part of the extreme animal rights agenda is to do away with animal ownership. Replacing owner with guardian is the first step towards achieving that goal. The guardian promotion is a carefully orchestrated campaign to chip away at ownership.

http://www.massfeddogs.org/nl_archive/mass...dspring2003.pdf (http://www.massfeddogs.org/nl_archive/massfedspring2003.pdf)
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In 2001, Rhode Island became the first and only state to approve the "guardian" concept, an animal rights initiative that denigrates owners and equates owned animals with slaves. Animal rights activists were able to convince Rhode Island legislators that animals "are not our property and we are not their owners." Rather than "owners," activists campaigned,individuals who keep animals should be referred to as "guardians." The AKC and other opponents argued that this was just the first step in a mission to end all animal ownership.

HB5817 brings these concerns to reality, creating several new categories of animal neglect and abuse that will be enforced not just by police and "special humane agents," but also must be reported by a whole series of professionals ranging from school employees to photographers to the media. If any of these “experts” suspect a guardian is not providing adequate care, the animal can be confiscated and guardianship terminated.

In addition, HB5817 prohibits "bodily alterations," a broad category which includes ear cropping, tail docking, dewclaw removal, and debarking.

I'm not drawing any conclusions, since this is all based solely on one offhand mention by CW in a blog post that dealt with an entirely different topic. But I'd be interested in whether she really supports the animal rights agenda that seems to underlie these guardian amendments.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 11, 2003, 08:21:46 am
[understatement/] I'm pretty certain [/understatement] she was referring to Amendment II.

The 2nd being the one that guards the rights reiterated in other 9 from complete infringement by the government. In theory, at least.
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 11, 2003, 09:10:45 am
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[understatement/] I'm pretty certain [/understatement] she was referring to Amendment II.

 
I'm pretty sure you're right about that, Augustwest.  B)  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Josh2923 on October 11, 2003, 12:55:02 pm
Ah. Should have known. My bad.  
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Claire on October 11, 2003, 03:12:48 pm
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Ah. Should have known. My bad.
S'okay, Josh2923. You've still got some newbie credits in your account.  :) And that reference on my blog to the guardian amendment wasn't explicit enough for most people outside the gun-rights movement to "get."
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 11, 2003, 03:36:44 pm
Ah crud. Am I part of a movement now?
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Wulfgar on October 11, 2003, 03:43:06 pm
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Ah crud. Am I part of a movement now?
It's OK Augustwest, all the kids are doing it...
Title: Dog/Freeway Article very good
Post by: Augustwest on October 12, 2003, 09:16:12 am
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It's OK Augustwest, all the kids are doing it...

Well if there's peer pressure involved, count me in. Don't wanna be shunned  :D