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Partner Sites => Oath-Keepers => Topic started by: Elias Alias on August 13, 2009, 12:43:39 am

Title: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 13, 2009, 12:43:39 am
Heh! We're getting to 'em!

Please read all three pages of this report, and take note of how fedgov's mental warriors can distort and twist reality in their programmed little minds.....

http://www.splcenter.org/news/item.jsp?pid=414

Teasers -

And on the site in Lexington, Mass., where the opening shots of the Revolutionary War were fired in 1775, members of Oath Keepers, a newly formed group of law enforcement officers, military men and veterans, "muster" on April 19 to reaffirm their pledge to defend the U.S. Constitution. "We're in perilous times … perhaps far more perilous than in 1775," says the man administering the oath. April 19 is the anniversary not only of the battle of Lexington Green, but also of the 1993 conflagration at the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, and the lethal bombing two years later of the Oklahoma City federal building — seminal events in the lore of the extreme right, in particular the antigovernment Patriot movement. (snip)

Swearing at the Government
Oath Keepers, the military and police organization that was formed earlier this year and held its April muster on Lexington Green, may be a particularly worrisome example of the Patriot revival. Members vow to fulfill the oaths to the Constitution that they swore while in the military or law enforcement. "Our oath is to the Constitution, not to the politicians, and we will not obey unconstitutional (and thus illegal) and immoral orders," the group says. Oath Keepers lists 10 orders its members won't obey, including two that reference U.S. concentration camps.

That same pugnacious attitude was on display after conservatives attacked an April report from the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) that suggested a resurgence of radical right-wing activity was under way. "We will not fear our government; they will fear us," one man, who appeared to be on active duty in the Army, said in an angry video sent to the Oath Keepers blog. In another video at the site, a man who said he was a former Army paratrooper in Afghanistan and Iraq described President Obama as "an enemy of the state," adding, "I would rather die than be a slave to my government." The Oath Keepers site soon began hawking T-shirts with slogans like "I'm a Right Wing Extremist and Damn Proud of It!"

In April, Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes — a Yale Law School graduate and former aide to U.S. Rep. Ron Paul (a Texas Republican and hard-line libertarian) — worried about a coming dictatorship. "We know that if the day should come where a full-blown dictatorship would come, or tyranny … it can only happen if those men, our brothers in arms, go along and comply with unconstitutional, unlawful orders," Rhodes told conspiracy-minded radio host Alex Jones. "Imagine if we focus on the police and military. Game over for the New World Order."

He's not the first to think so. In the 1990s, retired Phoenix cop and conspiracy enthusiast Jack McLamb created an outfit called Police Against the New World Order and produced a 75-page document entitled Operation Vampire Killer 2000: American Police Action Plan for Stopping World Government Rule.

It's not known how large Oath Keepers is. But there is some evidence beyond the group's mere existence to suggest that today's Patriots are again making inroads into law enforcement — the leak of the DHS report, along with those of a couple of similar law enforcement reports, was likely the work of a sworn officer. Rhodes claims to know a federal officer leaked the DHS report, and says Oath Keepers is "hearing from more and more federal officers all the time."

The group does seem to be on the radar of federal law enforcement officers. In May, a member complained on the group's website of a visit to his farm by FBI agents who asked him, he said, about training he provides in firearms, survival skills and the like.

One Oath Keeper is longtime militia hero Richard Mack, a former sheriff of a rural Arizona county who collaborated with white supremacist Randy Weaver on a book and who, along with others, won a U.S. Supreme Court decision that weakened the Brady Bill gun control law in the 1990s. "The greatest threat we face today is not terrorists; it is our federal government," Mack says on his website. "One of the best and easiest solutions is to depend on local officials, especially the sheriff, to stand against federal intervention and federal criminality." Mack's views echo those of the Posse Comitatus, which believed that sheriffs are the highest law enforcement authorities in America. "I pray for the day that a sheriff in this country will arrest an IRS agent for trespassing or attempting to victimize citizens in that particular sheriff's county," Mack said in a video he made for Oath Keepers.


How 'bout dat? :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: cole on August 13, 2009, 02:29:33 am
The only "paper terrorism" (cute term) I know of comes from banks, corporations, and the rest of the US government.

But maybe that's just me.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 13, 2009, 03:57:03 am
"members of Oath Keepers, a newly formed group of law enforcement officers, military men and veterans, "muster" on April 19 to reaffirm their pledge to defend the U.S. Constitution."

Is this a paper defense because in order to defend the Constitution you will need men and women under arms and ready to fight right?

Simply educating the zombies will not defend it one bit as they will be so desperate for their welfare (health care, unemployment checks, etc...)  and handouts that they will defend their masters...

I do support and like the fact the message from OK is starting to show results, we need more Sheriff's under our belt...
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Bill St. Clair on August 13, 2009, 05:54:40 am
Noticed by the SPLC? Must be doing something very right. You can't buy advertising that good.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: CorbinKale on August 13, 2009, 11:12:27 am
Despised by the despicable. What better endorsement could we get?  :laugh:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: bowhunter on August 13, 2009, 03:45:12 pm
       LIVE FREE OR DIE !!!    SEMPER FI  !!!     BOWHUNTER
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Canadian Mamma on August 13, 2009, 04:01:13 pm
You made it to their "HATE GROUP" Lists?

IS that a bonus? How despicable they are to label what they do not understand in such a way.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Bear on August 13, 2009, 04:25:31 pm
Man, you couldn't ask for a better letter to show people who are waking up
to the way things are. The SPLC is objecting to people swearing to honor
their oath to uphold and defend the Constitution!

This begs the question, "So why is defending the Constitution a problem?"
and that opens the door to a lot of things.

:thumbsup:

Bear
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 14, 2009, 01:20:43 am
Noticed by the SPLC? Must be doing something very right. You can't buy advertising that good.

Amen, Bill! Totally agree. That BS by SPLC just got Stewart another invite to be on the Alex Jones show. What the SPLC and their ilk do not comprehend is the fact of the great American grassroots awakening. It's happening everywhere, all over the place right now. And the grass roots awakening is very fond of their Oath Keepers, and those who've never even heard of us are now aware that we're here - and since nearly all Americans just now are fearful of anything their government says and does, and since the SPLC is tied in with the DHS blunders earlier this year, I'm guessing that that SPLC article will bring thousands of new members and supporters into Oath Keepers. Couldn't agree with you more, Bill.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: jessme on August 14, 2009, 02:38:34 pm
Quote
The Oath Keepers site soon began hawking T-shirts with slogans like "I'm a Right Wing Extremist and Damn Proud of It!"

Please tell me that they are wrong about that part. I was told that Oathkeepers is a non-partisan organization, and if that is true, then there shouldn't be tshirts that say that. Some of us love the constitution AND are democrats.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: socalserf on August 14, 2009, 04:59:51 pm
Noticed by the SPLC? Must be doing something very right. You can't buy advertising that good.

Amen, Bill! Totally agree. That BS by SPLC just got Stewart another invite to be on the Alex Jones show. What the SPLC and their ilk do not comprehend is the fact of the great American grassroots awakening. It's happening everywhere, all over the place right now. And the grass roots awakening is very fond of their Oath Keepers, and those who've never even heard of us are now aware that we're here - and since nearly all Americans just now are fearful of anything their government says and does, and since the SPLC is tied in with the DHS blunders earlier this year, I'm guessing that that SPLC article will bring thousands of new members and supporters into Oath Keepers. Couldn't agree with you more, Bill.

Salute!
Elias

A huge congratulations are in order to all those who have worked so hard to get the Oath Keepers message out!!
Who says that the Good Guy and Girls never get ahead?

David Codrea's take on the mater.
"Lumping patriots and Constitutionalists with haters. "Return of the Militias" points a trembling finger at, among others, the principled members of Oath Keepers. I guess the fund raising efforts require that some threats be fabricated by accusation.

SPLC's Larry Keller asserts they are "particularly worrisome." A fair question might be "Why"" or "To whom?" It's not like they're associated with anything other than patriotism, in spite of his attempts to insinuate racist ties."
http://www.examiner.com/x-1417-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m8d14-SPLC-report-smears-Oath-Keepers-militias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 14, 2009, 07:37:38 pm
Quote
The Oath Keepers site soon began hawking T-shirts with slogans like "I'm a Right Wing Extremist and Damn Proud of It!"

Please tell me that they are wrong about that part. I was told that Oathkeepers is a non-partisan organization, and if that is true, then there shouldn't be tshirts that say that. Some of us love the constitution AND are democrats.


They are wrong. No actually, they are lying by stretching the parameters of reality.
It is properly called propaganda.

To answer your question directly .... Oath Keepers has not sold any tee shirts with that statement on it. EVER. Period.

People who post on the blog-spot site were offering lots of different things. Bumper stickers, flags, tee shirts, who knows what-all ?
All Oath Keepers has ever offered are tee shirts with the Lexington message on it, patches, shoulder tabs and window stickers of our patch. [So Far .... we hope to get more designs up sooner or later.]

You do recognize the reference don't you ?
It is a direct response to the SPLC sponsored DHS "Right Wing Extremist" Report that claimed that ALL returning combat veterans are "right wing extremists" .
Oath Keepers did not put up the post nor was it an official Oath Keepers position. We did not, however, take the post down either and mostly because we are largely a veterans organization and that "Report" was felt as a personal attack to a lot of us.

Oath Keepers is NON-political.
Here is a quote from a response I gave to an poster who claimed we were all Liberals ....

"We are not Liberals.

I think you May have missed the fact that Oath Keepers is Not political in mission.

Our mission, in case you missed it, is to Reach, Teach and Inspire any and all of those who have sworn to "support and defend the Constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic"  to actually Keep that Oath.

It makes not a whit of difference who is in the Oval Office or any other office for that matter.
If they took an Oath of office or Oath of service and that Oath included the passage above then they are oath takers.
If they are oath takers our aim is to get them to become Oath Keepers.

Oath Keepers the Organization is Not Political in that we do not use any label BUT Oath Keeper.

We are not Liberals, [although some Oath Keepers May Be Liberals]

We are not Conservatives [although some Oath Keepers May Be Conservatives] and

We are not Demopublicans or Republicrats. [although .... but by now you have gotten the general idea I'd wager.]

Oath Keepers has No Political Agenda beyond preserving our Constitution and its Constitutional Republic."



Now ....  About the Claims of the SPLC ....
IF I go to The website of the SPLC and advertise there my tee shirt store that sells tees that say Smart People Love Cockatiels .... does that mean that the entire SPLC organization is now endorsing a particular bird breed ?

But if I refer to that blurb on their website comments as the SPLC site "soon began hawking T-shirts with slogans like " ... Cockatiel's are all bird brained 1d1ot5"  does it actually make my statement true ? Just because I said it someplace else and I then refer to that [my own] statement as a reference towards validation of the slam ?
SEE How that works ?

I make something up and put it online.
Then I go someplace else and refer back to it as "Proof" of the false original statement.

Propaganda is all it is Joseph Goebbels (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Special:Search&search=joseph%2Bgoebbels&limitn=old) would be proud. 

The folks at SPLC are nowadays little more than Fear Mongers.   Laugh at them.  It is better than they deserve.
To cry for them would be more fitting because they started SPLC with such High Ideals and now it has sunk so low and all in the quest for filthy lucre.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 14, 2009, 08:05:04 pm
"members of Oath Keepers, a newly formed group of law enforcement officers, military men and veterans, "muster" on April 19 to reaffirm their pledge to defend the U.S. Constitution."

Is this a paper defense because in order to defend the Constitution you will need men and women under arms and ready to fight right?

Simply educating the zombies will not defend it one bit as they will be so desperate for their welfare (health care, unemployment checks, etc...)  and handouts that they will defend their masters...

I do support and like the fact the message from OK is starting to show results, we need more Sheriff's under our belt...

Are you being intentionally dense ?

How many times do you have to hear the same message before you finally realize that that Is the message ?

You have become a laughingstock here with your apparently intentional and belligerent ignorance,  you know that right ?

Somebody send this person a map ... he's lost.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Mr. Dare on August 14, 2009, 09:40:09 pm
  What really grates my gears is that some jackass from the SPLC will quote him as an example of how dangerous we all are.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 15, 2009, 01:51:34 am
  What really grates my gears is that some jackass from the SPLC will quote him as an example of how dangerous we all are.

What grates me is the possibility that oxi works for the SPLC, the ADL, or some damned Federal agency. He simply cannot be as dense as he appears to be - we've told him over and over just what our mission is, what we're all about, and the ignorant sombitch continues to act like he's here to show us the way to everything on earth but the fulfillment of our mission. He wants Oath Keepers to "organize", to "do something". Any fool could finally get the message, after being told as many times as we've told oxi - so it's very obvious that he is either lower than a fool or is deliberately baiting Oath Keepers.  Personally, I'm tired of babying him. I may take his case up with Admins here on grounds of suspicion. At best, he's insensitive and has no intention of learning anything about Oath Keepers; at worst, he's a baiter.

Like, do we really need his kind of liability here? I doubt it. When we look at the mentailty which permeates the SPLC's published documents, it is very easy to imagine someone like oxi being sent here to set us up, to create more fuel for the SPLC's bonfire. It is just for this kind of reason that I'm glad Oath Keepers has shut down their national forum. Any idiot group like SPLC can send any willing idiot or over-zealous brain-damaged provocateur to anyone's respectable website and then use his postings to illustrate wildly-wrong interpretations of the intent of that website. Is that happening here?

oxi, what can you say for yourself?

Salute!
Elias

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Klapton Isgod on August 15, 2009, 06:28:16 am
At best, he's insensitive and has no intention of learning anything about Oath Keepers; at worst, he's a baiter.

Given our excellent history here, he's going to have to bone up on his skills to join the ranks of the master-baiters.

/rimshot
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Mr. Dare on August 15, 2009, 08:29:33 am
 :rolleyes:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 15, 2009, 10:56:59 am
:) :) :) !
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 15, 2009, 11:03:44 am
Sheriff Mack's challenge to the SPLC's blast at Oath Keepers and himself -

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2009/08/14/sheriff-richard-mack-ret-responds-to-southern-poverty-law-center-smear-attack-on-oath-keepers-and-on-sheriff-mack/

And another good read -

Mission Creep and the Southern Poverty Law Center’s Misguided Focus
Huffington Post
Carol M. Swain

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2009/08/14/rather-than-monitoring-hate-groups-the-southern-poverty-law-center-has-become-one/

Salute!
Elias

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 15, 2009, 01:41:06 pm
At best, he's insensitive and has no intention of learning anything about Oath Keepers; at worst, he's a baiter.

Given our excellent history here, he's going to have to bone up on his skills to join the ranks of the master-baiters.

/rimshot

*groan*

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: jessme on August 16, 2009, 06:04:12 am
Thank you Gooch for clearing the air for me. I thought that was the case but just wanted to make sure.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 07:47:17 am

Quote
Are you being intentionally dense ?

How many times do you have to hear the same message before you finally realize that that Is the message ?

You have become a laughingstock here with your apparently intentional and belligerent ignorance,  you know that right ?

Somebody send this person a map ... he's lost.

I think you guys are lost with your name-calling and think you know it all attitudes...
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 07:50:25 am
  What really grates my gears is that some jackass from the SPLC will quote him as an example of how dangerous we all are.

You are dangerous, most are former military with an oath to defend the Constitution and restore the Republic, you threaten the establishment right now that believes in doing as they please with no regards to the Constitution...
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 08:05:19 am

Quote
oxi, what can you say for yourself?

Why don't you just label me an "enemy combatant" and throw me in a jail without due process?

You guys must be related to the federal government and the mainstream media with your constant name calling to swing the opinion of other members to your fold?

Like I have said before the message is great but their is no teeth and if you do not have a plan for that you are doomed to fail when they strike...

If you guys are convinced the federal government no longer works for us and our interests, it is great to educate people to it but it will not solve anything, those policies and procedures the feds are working on continue to unfold and nobody is gonna stop them from doing as they please whenever they want!

I was awakened to U.S. brutality during the Serbia 1999 immoral attack and guess what educating people to the horrors of U.S. imperialistic and brutal policies abroad and brainwashing the sleeping U.S. public at home did so much good now the U.S. is involved in 2 additional imperalistic adventures in Iraq and Afghanistan while they impose near Nazi-type Gestapo procedures slowly upon us...

Nothing has changed but I am educated right...


Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 16, 2009, 11:36:56 am

Quote
oxi, what can you say for yourself?

Why don't you just label me an "enemy combatant" and throw me in a jail without due process?

You guys must be related to the federal government and the mainstream media with your constant name calling to swing the opinion of other members to your fold?

Like I have said before the message is great but their is no teeth and if you do not have a plan for that you are doomed to fail when they strike...

If you guys are convinced the federal government no longer works for us and our interests, it is great to educate people to it but it will not solve anything, those policies and procedures the feds are working on continue to unfold and nobody is gonna stop them from doing as they please whenever they want!

I was awakened to U.S. brutality during the Serbia 1999 immoral attack and guess what educating people to the horrors of U.S. imperialistic and brutal policies abroad and brainwashing the sleeping U.S. public at home did so much good now the U.S. is involved in 2 additional imperalistic adventures in Iraq and Afghanistan while they impose near Nazi-type Gestapo procedures slowly upon us...

Nothing has changed but I am educated right...



Yawn ....

Obviously a fedgov plant trying to stir up sedition and conspiracy to be able to press those charges and shut us down.
Or worse a deluded zealot on a rampage ....

Elias ?  Your call ....
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 16, 2009, 11:44:28 am

Quote
Are you being intentionally dense ?

How many times do you have to hear the same message before you finally realize that that Is the message ?

You have become a laughingstock here with your apparently intentional and belligerent ignorance,  you know that right ?

Somebody send this person a map ... he's lost.

I think you guys are lost with your name-calling and think you know it all attitudes...

Pot - Kettle ?

Nawww that would make us one as well.

Yep  Laughingstock (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/laughing_stock) fits just right for this idjit.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 16, 2009, 12:20:22 pm
  What really grates my gears is that some jackass from the SPLC will quote him as an example of how dangerous we all are.

You are dangerous, most are former military with an oath to defend the Constitution and restore the Republic, you threaten the establishment right now that believes in doing as they please with no regards to the Constitution...

Oxi, here is a warning for you. You are about to lose your privilege to post here. Oath Keepers is not a "threat" [your word] to anyone or anything. Oath Keepers does not "threaten" [your word] anything. You apparently want to enlist Oath Keepers into your own fear-driven campaign to confront the federal government. That is not the Oath Keepers mission. Repeat - Oath Keepers is not threatening the government. Oath Keepers is not your personal horse upon which to ride against the federal government's policies. Oath Keepers is an educational organization which admonishes all law enforcement and military personnel to keep their legally-required oath to the Constitution. Oath Keepers is in the bosom of the Federal government and is no threat to the Federal government - we only advise our troops and LEOs to honor that oath which the Federal government requires of them when they enlist or join.

Now. You can either get that into your head and act accordingly here, or I'm going to personally take away your privilege to post at TMM or at Oath Keepers. Got it? Get it or be gone. Your call. You've been warned.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 12:58:02 pm

Quote
Obviously a fedgov plant trying to stir up sedition and conspiracy to be able to press those charges and shut us down.
Or worse a deluded zealot on a rampage ....

Elias ?  Your call ....


You guys act like the feds, are you sure your not the ones?

Yep, the Oath Keepers Dept. of Homeland Security backed by their Patriot Act is in full swing here folks.  Next I will be labeled a terrorist or enemy combatent for not bowing down to their opinions and views as being official...

In only takes a few "power hungry" members to hijack the whole community on this forum just like how the few in power from Washignton subject us all to their way of life... hmmmm
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: socalserf on August 16, 2009, 01:04:13 pm
Epic fail.(Flail?)
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: jessme on August 16, 2009, 01:11:15 pm
While in most cases no matter how belligerent someone is, I don't want a person to be banned, however in this instance, when Oathkeepers are trying to stick to the straight and narrow as far as why they were formed and what the purpose of their being is, then people with their own agendas that can make the Oathkeepers get a "bad rap" (for want of a better word) and that is harmful to OK as a whole, and because of that, as Johnny Cash would say, people need to "walk the line". There is a great deal of interest, investigation, and more than a little media coverage and we need to maintain and stick by the rules we have set for ourselved, and those that can't do so need to be made unable to continue to speak AS an Oathkeeper in any capacity at all, and that includes online. I am pretty new to this myself, but I have really grasped a hold of how damn NECESSARY the Oathkeepers are, and for that very reason we need to make sure that all members understand our purpose and standards.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 01:21:48 pm
Quote
Oath Keepers is not a "threat" [your word] to anyone or anything. Oath Keepers does not "threaten" [your word] anything.


Quote
You can either get that into your head and act accordingly here, or I'm going to personally take away your privilege to post at TMM or at Oath Keepers. Got it? Get it or be gone. Your call. You've been warned.

Wow, you just threatened me, you accuse others of threats yet its ok for you to issue them?  Double standard just like U.S. foreign policy.  

I guess the word "organize" is like the word "terrorism" with the U.S. government to you guys...

Your fear of the U.S. government coming and supposedly shutting down the site is a sign of weakness and that the federal government has already won the battle and the war and you know it.  We are not the PRC (China) where they routinly shut down sites but we are getting there soon...



  




Quote
your own fear-driven campaign


And what about yours with your threats to ban or take away posting priveledges to shut down your opposition and opposing opinions to your personal cause?


Quote
Oath Keepers is not threatening the government

With a title of "Militia" and pictures of the Revolutionary War fighting the Brits for freedom, hmmm I guess their is a hidden message now isn't there?  If your about peace why haven't you aligned with Greenpeace, United Nations or other peace loving groups?  Why so much talk of guns and the 2nd Amendement in here?  People with guns are a threat to the establishment you know...

Quote
all law enforcement and military personnel to keep their legally-required oath to the Constitution. Oath Keepers is in the bosom of the Federal government and is no threat to the Federal government - we only advise our troops and LEOs to honor that oath which the Federal government requires of them when they enlist or join.


That would be defending the Constitution from domestic enemies right?  And how will you do that?  With a paper defense?  Educating is fine but it will not win over Washignton...

Your from the military, explain to me how defending the Constitution without weapons from a determined enemy with weapons will be achieved?  You can have all the education you want and an oath to respect the Constitution but when the feds arrive loaded with weapons, what will you do?  The Constitution has been eroded severly under Bush and now Obama so soon who will care about it is the likely outcome...

Washignton serves Washignton, they do not care about us except hand over their tax revenue and sons and daughters to die for the name of oil and imperialism dominance...  

As the economy gets worse over time, things will move rapidly, will you be ready with your paper defense or will you just go into hiding to be found some day by the masters?



Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: dogsledder54 on August 16, 2009, 01:22:25 pm
Sounds like a woefully ignorant wannabee trying unsuccessfully to start a coup d etat in a family gathering. Sorry, we won't bite, Agent O-X-1.  :laugh:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 01:34:07 pm
While in most cases no matter how belligerent someone is, I don't want a person to be banned, however in this instance, when Oathkeepers are trying to stick to the straight and narrow as far as why they were formed and what the purpose of their being is, then people with their own agendas that can make the Oathkeepers get a "bad rap" (for want of a better word) and that is harmful to OK as a whole, and because of that, as Johnny Cash would say, people need to "walk the line". There is a great deal of interest, investigation, and more than a little media coverage and we need to maintain and stick by the rules we have set for ourselved, and those that can't do so need to be made unable to continue to speak AS an Oathkeeper in any capacity at all, and that includes online. I am pretty new to this myself, but I have really grasped a hold of how damn NECESSARY the Oathkeepers are, and for that very reason we need to make sure that all members understand our purpose and standards.

This a forum where you can speak various thoughts and opinions, this is not the original OK site, stop confusing the two...

Now if OK took eveything from their forum as official and on their main site, then one would question... 

Forums are usually full of debates and arguments, hence the word "forum" a gathering to share anything and everything...

Your fear and others of your own government has brainwashed you guys to assume a forum is a threat to the establishment... I tend to laugh at that...

I am sure at Fort Meade their is a database (one of millions) about OK and their members, you cannot ride and hide from them, they keep track of everything you do these days unless you do not live with power, have a car, own property, drivers liscense, Social Security Card, phone number, cell phone, Internet access, which most of you possess, so I doubt a little forum will send their troops marching...

What makes this forum so special that any talk against the government will ban someone?  That kind of talk is just about everywhere if not on most forums.  Nobody trusts the federal government anymore and many people like myself are getting ticked off to Washignton's bullcrap policies and raping of us all, why fear that?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on August 16, 2009, 01:39:10 pm
Quote
woefully ignorant

Ignorant are the ones that simply bend over and take whatever the government tells them... complain and whine all you want but I see nothing changing the ways things are conducted out of Washignton...

That's because nobody cares and they seek the status quo...
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 16, 2009, 01:44:33 pm
Quote
Quote Elias ....
"Oath Keepers is an educational organization which admonishes all law enforcement and military personnel to keep their legally-required oath to the Constitution."

I  WILL be borrowing that line my friend .... just to let you know in advance.   :rolleyes:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: dogsledder54 on August 16, 2009, 01:55:58 pm
Quote
woefully ignorant


Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy & good with ketchup


woefully ignorant    does not know whereof he speaks or to whom
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 16, 2009, 05:23:14 pm
Oath Keepers is presently under a focused beam of national attention. Anyone attempting here or at Oath Keepers national site or Oath Keepers state sites to provoke comments which would indicate a divergence from Oath Keepers' declared mission statement will meet with whatever moderation we deem necessary.

I did warn oxi to cease with his provocations. I see that my warning went unheeded. I do not think he'll mistake what I've done.

I have just removed oxi's privilege of posting at TMM for 14 days. Because his offenses have happened primarily at this Partner Site forum for Oath Keepers, I did not consult with TMM Administration before doing this.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: socalserf on August 16, 2009, 05:31:54 pm
You Mods and Admins have the patients of saints.
Thanks for all your work.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 16, 2009, 06:25:56 pm
You Mods and Admins have the patients of saints.
Thanks for all your work.


You're welcome, socalserf. And thank you for being an excellent member here. I appreciate your contributions here.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: SoundTheBell on August 19, 2009, 03:31:00 pm
Egads, the rhetoric in that article in the OP is so thick I could only get through half of it. What would that author do without his adjectives? Pugnacious... conspiracy-minded... gee, if you took his adjectives away you might have a halfway decent article.

Good call on the temp Oxi ban.  I've been wondering if he wasn't a plant of some sort to get the board shut down. It seems like he's consistently egging people on, *trying* to get them to say something that could be used for that purpose.

I can't be an Oath Keeper (never been in the military or law enforcement) but I support everything you guys stand for.

Any idea how a police station would react to someone bringing in a stack of Oath Keeper flyers outlining the ten promises and asking if they can be hung up around the station and a stack left by the duty desk?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: CorbinKale on August 19, 2009, 04:19:10 pm
I can't be an Oath Keeper (never been in the military or law enforcement) but I support everything you guys stand for.

Our message is directed at those who have taken the Oath as a requirement of their profession, but there is nothing stopping any citizen from taking an Oath. In fact, every time you have said the Pledge of Allegiance to the flag, you have taken an Oath to the Constitutional Republic, for which it stands.

You can be an Oath Keeper in two easy* steps.

1. Take the Oath to the Constitution.
2. Honor your Oath.

*Taking the Oath is easy. Honoring it may prove more difficult. That will require educating yourself on our Founding documents and speaking out in support and defense of the Constitution. You may encounter opposition and end up on a terrorist watch list.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 19, 2009, 09:09:20 pm

Well said CorbinKale.

If you are not careful you will wind the Oath Keeper master of the understatement.
:thumbsup:
Truly said this is ...
"Taking the Oath is easy. Honoring it may prove more difficult. "

Depending on the reception at the police station receptionist it can be painless or ... well ... pack a toothbrush used to be the caution BUT now-a-days they don't let you keep your toothbrush.

While a pile of brochures will get the word out.  Having someone standing beside them ready to answer questions has a more lasting effect.
One on one is still the best way to spread a message.

Best, I think, would be to approach One Peace Officer and introduce him to Oath Keepers.
Keep in touch with him and have him place the brochures in the station house for you.

Still and all IF they will let you use the space PLEASE do put them out and Thank You.

CaptGooch
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: TNT on August 24, 2009, 11:34:59 am
I think Oxi clean failed to understand we uphold our oath as voluntarily as we took it.  Nothing was forced upon us we are just fulfilling our oaths.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 24, 2009, 02:32:21 pm
Yep.

I personally think he is/was an agent provocateur sent to try to stir up threats of violence against specific people and promises of meetings for "planning" and such.
Which are [in order of appearance]  terroristic threats and conspiracy to commit sedition.  Then he could have the Fed Gov [his "handlers" break bad on our home server and scoop up all of our info and such.

It doesn't make any sense that a person with his apparent vocabulary wouldn't understand our mission and our goals after reading them and being reminded of them what ? seven or eight times ?
It is like he was conditioned to Not Hear those sentences.

I think we should flush the POS and be done with it.
Just in case anyone wanted to know MY opinion. 

:rolleyes:

gooch
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: PatriotsWrath on August 25, 2009, 10:35:15 am
Well, so this is my first post around here and at the risk of being accused of being a replacement account for that other guy...

I agree the guy was being a bonehead if for no other reason than it was clear people were not looking to discuss what he was discussing.

But at the same time it seems strange that there is a need for so much fear about our Government just for asking people to support an oath they took.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 25, 2009, 05:45:19 pm
Well, so this is my first post around here and at the risk of being accused of being a replacement account for that other guy...

I agree the guy was being a bonehead if for no other reason than it was clear people were not looking to discuss what he was discussing.
Because it is NOT a goal of Oath Keepers to foment rebellion.
Quote

But at the same time it seems strange that there is a need for so much fear about our Government just for asking people to support an oath they took.

I am not sure I understand this sentence.

I don't understand what "need for ... fear" and/or whose "need for ... fear" you are referring to ?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MacCoinneach on August 25, 2009, 06:43:42 pm
Their "slam" our "dunk"! 

and the SPLC loses the game.

Oath Keepers has officially been targeted by hatemongers.  It will only be to our benefit.  Thanks SPLC...thank you very much.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: PatriotsWrath on August 25, 2009, 08:24:16 pm
Well, so this is my first post around here and at the risk of being accused of being a replacement account for that other guy...

I agree the guy was being a bonehead if for no other reason than it was clear people were not looking to discuss what he was discussing.
Because it is NOT a goal of Oath Keepers to foment rebellion.
Quote

But at the same time it seems strange that there is a need for so much fear about our Government just for asking people to support an oath they took.

I am not sure I understand this sentence.

I don't understand what "need for ... fear" and/or whose "need for ... fear" you are referring to ?


Okay, so at the risk of potentially annoying some people I will do my best to explain what I was trying to say.  At the same time it is not my intent to annoy anyone.

Perhaps I was not following the thread accurately, I did read through it quickly so that is possible.  I understand completely that it is not a goal of Oathkeepers to foment rebellion.  Then again I don't believe you can actually foment rebellion by demanding that Government act in a lawful fashion and remain constrained to the bounds placed upon it by and at its creation.  I think the other guy in an unfortunately combative manner was trying to get at some of the same points that I'm thinking about.  But he was belligerent and unproductive in his approach.

Perhaps a question is the best way to address part of this point.

Assuming those who serve and protect the People swear an oath and then reaffirm that oath, sticking to the list of things that will and won't be done.  What do you do when you are asked to do the things you won't do?  Obviously you are not going to do them, but what do you do about all those who will do them?  I'm sure there are many reasons why those that will do whatever is asked of them will do it, fear, rationalization, etc.  Rationalization being the biggest enemy.  After all should such an event come to pass there will be a great deal of propaganda employed to shift stories to a reasonable explanation as to why the Government is asking the military or law enforcement to do the things on the will not do list.  Simply refusing to participate may not be enough. If others are going to go ahead and do those things, then someone also has to stop them.

As for my fear comment as I read through the thread it just seemed like there was an almost tangible amount of fear around anything that even at a wild extreme could be construed as seditious.  The Government at any given time will not see its actions as wrong.  One must assume if they did they would not do whatever it is because they saw it as wrong.  Instead it will be rationalized and twisted to seem right, though it violates the Constitution and the principles this country is founded on.  From that definition and when seen clearly it could be defined as wrong.  However given that the Government will not see its actions as wrong.  Refusing to follow those orders or worse acting to stop others from following those orders, which would be mandated by the oath, to protect and defend...  will then be seen as a seditious act.  You and I might know that it is not, because it complies with the oath and is supported by the Constitution.  In the end though, a monopoly of force and title dictates what is seditious.

If fear of that label is to be as a toxin which causes paralysis, then there would be no way to actually maintain the oath.

I don't know that in the end this made what I was trying to say and ask any more clear... But I am hopeful that it did.

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Undefined on August 25, 2009, 08:54:04 pm

Is there any interest/intention to draft a response to the SPLC? Preferably in the form of an open letter?

If so, I volunteer my services. I am both southern and poor. :P

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 25, 2009, 09:17:00 pm

Is there any interest/intention to draft a response to the SPLC? Preferably in the form of an open letter?

If so, I volunteer my services. I am both southern and poor. :P



Please do George Please do.

Write it up and send it to Stewart [or Elias or myself ] and it will more than likely wind up on the website.

Stewart is writing one, Sheriff Mack has already written one and it is currently up on the website.

We will welcome your erudite offerings most gladly.

Keep in mind we agree with  Mike V. at the Sipsey Street Irregulars [dotblogspotdotcom]  who says  "No Fort Sumters". (http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2009/05/simple-matter-of-force-olofson.html)


Thank you,

gooch
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: CorbinKale on August 25, 2009, 09:18:09 pm
I don't know that in the end this made what I was trying to say and ask any more clear... But I am hopeful that it did.

There may be a time when honoring the Oath is considered sedition, but that time has not yet come. We are anticipating such an occurance and attempting to head it off. We are still able to do this within current constraints. By crossing a line that invites the government to 'legally' infringe upon our 1st Amendment Rights, we would be forced into resorting to other methods. We choose to, peacefully, educate and inspire loyalty to the Constitution, so that those other methods are never required.

If one requires a group that is less scrupulous of the law, there are plenty available. That is not Oath Keepers, though. Our mission is narrowly defined, and we resist efforts to broaden, or redefine it.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 25, 2009, 09:42:42 pm
I see CorbinKale has answered your question before me but I will post my response as well.

Okay, so at the risk of potentially annoying some people I will do my best to explain what I was trying to say.  At the same time it is not my intent to annoy anyone.

Perhaps I was not following the thread accurately, I did read through it quickly so that is possible.  I understand completely that it is not a goal of Oathkeepers to foment rebellion.  Then again I don't believe you can actually foment rebellion by demanding that Government act in a lawful fashion and remain constrained to the bounds placed upon it by and at its creation.  I think the other guy in an unfortunately combative manner was trying to get at some of the same points that I'm thinking about.  But he was belligerent and unproductive in his approach.
As well as totally off base in his understanding of our goals in spite of having them explained numerous times as you saw if you read up to this point.
Quote
Perhaps a question is the best way to address part of this point.

Assuming those who serve and protect the People swear an oath and then reaffirm that oath, sticking to the list of things that will and won't be done.  What do you do when you are asked to do the things you won't do?  Obviously you are not going to do them, but what do you do about all those who will do them?  I'm sure there are many reasons why those that will do whatever is asked of them will do it, fear, rationalization, etc.  Rationalization being the biggest enemy.  After all should such an event come to pass there will be a great deal of propaganda employed to shift stories to a reasonable explanation as to why the Government is asking the military or law enforcement to do the things on the will not do list.  Simply refusing to participate may not be enough. If others are going to go ahead and do those things, then someone also has to stop them.
And when that time comes what happens happens.  You see ...
Discussing any sort of action that might even possibly express the intention of violence in any form against an agent of any government is pure plain sedition and we are not about sedition. We are about educating those agents and having them refuse to follow the order to "whatever it is you are envisioning".

oxi refused to take "I won't discuss it in public" for an answer.   Will you ?
Quote

As for my fear comment as I read through the thread it just seemed like there was an almost tangible amount of fear around anything that even at a wild extreme could be construed as seditious.  The Government at any given time will not see its actions as wrong.  One must assume if they did they would not do whatever it is because they saw it as wrong.  Instead it will be rationalized and twisted to seem right, though it violates the Constitution and the principles this country is founded on.  From that definition and when seen clearly it could be defined as wrong.  However given that the Government will not see its actions as wrong.  Refusing to follow those orders or worse acting to stop others from following those orders, which would be mandated by the oath, to protect and defend...  will then be seen as a seditious act.  You and I might know that it is not, because it complies with the oath and is supported by the Constitution.  In the end though, a monopoly of force and title dictates what is seditious.

Our refusal to commit sedition or any other felonious act should not be confused with "fear".

Would you say that not stepping out into traffic against the light [while flowing traffic is present] was fear or common sense self preservation ?

We have no fear of "the Government" because as Pogo so clearly put it "We have met the enemy and he is us."

Oath Keepers fully intends to reach out to and educate all of the oath takers and inspire them to become Oath Keepers.
If every oath taker became an Oath Keeper there would be very little chance of unlawful orders being issued because all government employees swear to support and defend the Constitution so who would issue the unlawful order ?
No violence or sedition needed .... or wanted.
Quote
If fear of that label is to be as a toxin which causes paralysis, then there would be no way to actually maintain the oath.

I don't know that in the end this made what I was trying to say and ask any more clear... But I am hopeful that it did.



And I hope that I have answered your question.

captgooch
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: PatriotsWrath on August 26, 2009, 12:37:19 am
gooch - CorbinKale


Thank you both for your responses.  That was essentially the question.  Is it a dance we engage in carefully planned to not break toes or are we playing house?  I am satisfied with the answer in that all seem to understand the importance of that which faces us and none of us needs broken toes.

gooch, I noted the subtle "Will You?" which I assume was a thinly veiled threat or perhaps an intent to bait me?  Either way have no fear neither is required.  I hope you noted I wrote my previous response carefully, or at least intended to.  I have absolute respect for dead horses and believe they should be buried not beaten.  :violent1: 

CorbinKale, a very compact answer that said it all well.

Thank you both for taking the time to respond.

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 26, 2009, 11:58:14 am
gooch - CorbinKale


Thank you both for your responses.  That was essentially the question.  Is it a dance we engage in carefully planned to not break toes or are we playing house?  I am satisfied with the answer in that all seem to understand the importance of that which faces us and none of us needs broken toes.

gooch, I noted the subtle "Will You?" which I assume was a thinly veiled threat or perhaps an intent to bait me?  Either way have no fear neither is required.  I hope you noted I wrote my previous response carefully, or at least intended to.  I have absolute respect for dead horses and believe they should be buried not beaten.  :violent1: 

CorbinKale, a very compact answer that said it all well.

Thank you both for taking the time to respond.



emphasis mine

No sir.  Neither one of those two choices.
It is yet another option that I intended.
It was meant as a plain straight forward question.

oxi refused to take "I won't discuss it in public" for an answer.   Will you ? could also have been written as ...
"Will you accept "I won't discuss it in public." as an answer to your question "what do {we} intend to do about ...." ? " and I probably should have worded it that way.

oxi apparently never saw that option and therefore would not accept our answer as what it is.
He-she felt the need to label our response as "fear" or "cowardice" or some other thing which it is not.

I was not attempting to be "subtle" [I'm not at all good at subtle] I was asking a question.
Which you have answered. Thank You.

Welcome Aboard.

OH and we do have a :deadhorse:  thingie in case you have need of it .... :thrbiggrin:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on August 26, 2009, 12:05:08 pm
Their "slam" our "dunk"! 

and the SPLC loses the game.

Oath Keepers has officially been targeted by hatemongers.  It will only be to our benefit.  Thanks SPLC...thank you very much.

I agree completely MacCoinneach.

My only concern is that so many Americans don't think for themselves and therefore any Public Statement that agrees with the talking heads on the propaganda tube they will take as Truth.
"They can't put it on TV if it isn't the Truth.   Right ?"   :rolleyes:   *sigh*

And keep in mind that the administration uses the SPLC as a "real" resource for intel.  That part is really scary to me. 
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MacCoinneach on August 26, 2009, 12:33:47 pm
Their "slam" our "dunk"! 

and the SPLC loses the game.

Oath Keepers has officially been targeted by hatemongers.  It will only be to our benefit.  Thanks SPLC...thank you very much.

I agree completely MacCoinneach.

My only concern is that so many Americans don't think for themselves and therefore any Public Statement that agrees with the talking heads on the propaganda tube they will take as Truth.
"They can't put it on TV if it isn't the Truth.   Right ?"   :rolleyes:   *sigh*

And keep in mind that the administration uses the SPLC as a "real" resource for intel.  That part is really scary to me. 

It is my concern as well.  Based on communicating with the populace, many do NOT think for themselves.  They believe absolutely everything that comes out of the "propaganda" tube and into their minds.  I call these people lemmings, because lemmings do not think for themselves at all.  They know only what the leader tells them and do what the leader tells them to do...period.  It is funny, well, not really, but many of these people actually believe they are independent thinkers.  What a shame it is to see the blind leading the blind.  The only way to snap them out of it is to get them to ask questions.  Once they start asking questions and those who should give them the answers don't; that seems to spark the awakening.

But you already know what I am talking about.  No need to go any further.

It is scary that the government looks upon the SPLC as a "real" resource of intel.  It may be scary, but should we be surprised since there is such an extreme disconnect between those in our government and we the people?  Nah.  We should expect it.  They have god complexes.  They truly believe that they know best for the American people!!  What a shame.  And what a shame it is that the American people have allowed it to happen.

Thus the reason Oath Keepers is so important and why I am a member of this honorable association.

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 29, 2009, 04:01:11 am

It is scary that the government looks upon the SPLC as a "real" resource of intel. 


Amen to that! I may yet do a piece on the SPLC, but at the moment I'm focusing my interest on their little-brother here in Montana, the Montana Human Rights Network. Sheesh, this local version of SPLC is astonishingly mis-directed in its perception. I called into a local talk-radio show this week and challenged the MHRN to debate me publicly. I will follow up on that by corresponding with MHRN directly. Their "concern" about Oath Keepers shall be catapulted into the public arena, and once again I'll use the MHRN and SPLC to enlist more new members into Oath Keepers. The more the MHRN attacks Oath Keepers, the greater our appeal to the public. Montanans are waking up in droves right now, and Montanans, by and large, love Oath Keepers. The more the MHRN and SPLC attempt to demonize Oath Keepers, the more they swell our ranks. I love it. :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on August 29, 2009, 04:16:08 am
  Simply refusing to participate may not be enough. If others are going to go ahead and do those things, then someone also has to stop them.


Welcome aboard, PatriotsWrath. The two sentences of yours which I've quoted above caused me to blink when I read them. Please allow me to elucidate the error for your better understanding.

Oath Keepers is asking Oath Takers to be Oath Keepers. It is not asking Oath Keepers to make sure others keep their oaths - we are only asking each person, individually, to honor his/her oath to the U.S. Constitution. We are not asking any Oath Keeper to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. Oath Keepers believes in personal responsibility. The individual is responsible for his own actions and no one else's. Oath Keepers remains focused on the individual Oath Taker's willingness to understand and honor his/her oath. Oath Keepers does not imply, suggest, or require of any individual Oath Keeper that he "do" anything to "force" any other individual to honor that oath. Oath Keepers does not condone coercion, does not require any Oath Keeper to mind the business of any other individual. No one is required to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. To require that would be the endorsement of coercion, and Oath Keepers does not endorse coercion. Each Oath Keeper is responsible only to himself, same as is any Oath Taker.

The following paragraph is not directed at you personally, but I'm including it here for the benefit of other readers. Please don't take this personally, okay? Thanks!

Everyone who tries to come in here and motivate Oath Keepers to advocate any particular course of action other than the mission of Oath Keepers, which is to inspire and educate all Oath Takers to become Oath Keepers, is attempting to do the impossible. Oath Keepers' leadership is extremely intelligent, experienced, educated, dedicated, and knowledgeable. We are well-versed in the struggle for liberty, and we are well versed in the tactics of the enemies of liberty, such as the misguided employees at MHRN and SPLC. Subtle or overt attempts to align Oath Keepers with any position, philosophy, policy, process, or purpose other than our simple mission statement shall be exposed quickly and disposed of properly.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Cache Creek on August 30, 2009, 07:22:52 pm
I'm all for allowing people to debate and have differences of opinion but you guys dealing with Oxi is somewhat similar to me dealing with my delusional/paranoid brother.  You say (for example) "A,B,C", he says "Yeah but 'P".  You say "No, I said A,B,C".  He says "So what your saying is V".  And so on and on. 
Without meds my brother can keep this type of conversation up for hours in the face of any fact I say or show.  With meds he just gets tired of the conversation as fast as I do. 

Good luck if you persist in trying to show him the facts.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: PatriotsWrath on August 30, 2009, 08:56:02 pm
  Simply refusing to participate may not be enough. If others are going to go ahead and do those things, then someone also has to stop them.


Welcome aboard, PatriotsWrath. The two sentences of yours which I've quoted above caused me to blink when I read them. Please allow me to elucidate the error for your better understanding.

Oath Keepers is asking Oath Takers to be Oath Keepers. It is not asking Oath Keepers to make sure others keep their oaths - we are only asking each person, individually, to honor his/her oath to the U.S. Constitution. We are not asking any Oath Keeper to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. Oath Keepers believes in personal responsibility. The individual is responsible for his own actions and no one else's. Oath Keepers remains focused on the individual Oath Taker's willingness to understand and honor his/her oath. Oath Keepers does not imply, suggest, or require of any individual Oath Keeper that he "do" anything to "force" any other individual to honor that oath. Oath Keepers does not condone coercion, does not require any Oath Keeper to mind the business of any other individual. No one is required to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. To require that would be the endorsement of coercion, and Oath Keepers does not endorse coercion. Each Oath Keeper is responsible only to himself, same as is any Oath Taker.

The following paragraph is not directed at you personally, but I'm including it here for the benefit of other readers. Please don't take this personally, okay? Thanks!

Everyone who tries to come in here and motivate Oath Keepers to advocate any particular course of action other than the mission of Oath Keepers, which is to inspire and educate all Oath Takers to become Oath Keepers, is attempting to do the impossible. Oath Keepers' leadership is extremely intelligent, experienced, educated, dedicated, and knowledgeable. We are well-versed in the struggle for liberty, and we are well versed in the tactics of the enemies of liberty, such as the misguided employees at MHRN and SPLC. Subtle or overt attempts to align Oath Keepers with any position, philosophy, policy, process, or purpose other than our simple mission statement shall be exposed quickly and disposed of properly.

Salute!
Elias

I sent a PM to you and to gooch.  I think you have misunderstood my statemet, either way it's something I struggle with so... Perhaps after reading the PM you can help.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on September 02, 2009, 05:22:11 am
  Simply refusing to participate may not be enough. If others are going to go ahead and do those things, then someone also has to stop them.


Welcome aboard, PatriotsWrath. The two sentences of yours which I've quoted above caused me to blink when I read them. Please allow me to elucidate the error for your better understanding.

Oath Keepers is asking Oath Takers to be Oath Keepers. It is not asking Oath Keepers to make sure others keep their oaths - we are only asking each person, individually, to honor his/her oath to the U.S. Constitution. We are not asking any Oath Keeper to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. Oath Keepers believes in personal responsibility. The individual is responsible for his own actions and no one else's. Oath Keepers remains focused on the individual Oath Taker's willingness to understand and honor his/her oath. Oath Keepers does not imply, suggest, or require of any individual Oath Keeper that he "do" anything to "force" any other individual to honor that oath. Oath Keepers does not condone coercion, does not require any Oath Keeper to mind the business of any other individual. No one is required to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. To require that would be the endorsement of coercion, and Oath Keepers does not endorse coercion. Each Oath Keeper is responsible only to himself, same as is any Oath Taker.

The following paragraph is not directed at you personally, but I'm including it here for the benefit of other readers. Please don't take this personally, okay? Thanks!

Everyone who tries to come in here and motivate Oath Keepers to advocate any particular course of action other than the mission of Oath Keepers, which is to inspire and educate all Oath Takers to become Oath Keepers, is attempting to do the impossible. Oath Keepers' leadership is extremely intelligent, experienced, educated, dedicated, and knowledgeable. We are well-versed in the struggle for liberty, and we are well versed in the tactics of the enemies of liberty, such as the misguided employees at MHRN and SPLC. Subtle or overt attempts to align Oath Keepers with any position, philosophy, policy, process, or purpose other than our simple mission statement shall be exposed quickly and disposed of properly.

Salute!
Elias

I sent a PM to you and to gooch.  I think you have misunderstood my statemet, either way it's something I struggle with so... Perhaps after reading the PM you can help.

PatriotsWrath,
Not avoiding your PM or this thread deliberately, but I must confess that I've had an incredible and impossible pace here for the past few days, and simply have not had time to be here. Tonight's not muchly improved over the last few days, either. But I want to thank you for the PM, and I promise I'll find some time soon to reply to that and to this thread.
I often muse about the difficulties encountered when dealing only with words between two people, as compared to speaking face to face in "real life". I'm totally open to reviewing what's been said here and seeing your words more closely as you intended them. But I'm really truly fighting for minutes here to do too many tasks each moment, so I'll close this with that appeal to your understanding. Thanks, Mon!
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: socalserf on September 02, 2009, 07:29:08 am


Oath Keepers is asking Oath Takers to be Oath Keepers. It is not asking Oath Keepers to make sure others keep their oaths - we are only asking each person, individually, to honor his/her oath to the U.S. Constitution. We are not asking any Oath Keeper to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. Oath Keepers believes in personal responsibility. The individual is responsible for his own actions and no one else's. Oath Keepers remains focused on the individual Oath Taker's willingness to understand and honor his/her oath. Oath Keepers does not imply, suggest, or require of any individual Oath Keeper that he "do" anything to "force" any other individual to honor that oath. Oath Keepers does not condone coercion, does not require any Oath Keeper to mind the business of any other individual. No one is required to make sure anyone else keeps his/her oath. To require that would be the endorsement of coercion, and Oath Keepers does not endorse coercion. Each Oath Keeper is responsible only to himself, same as is any Oath Taker.

Salute!
Elias


That's why I love OKs. Regardless of what my personal politics are.
A more sane and reasonable approach to our current problems I can't imagine.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: onebigelf on September 06, 2009, 09:05:16 am
Quote
who collaborated with white supremacist Randy Weaver on a book

So I'm going to jump in with my first post here by pointing out that this article makes that error of parroting the official government line on this.  Randy Weaver was not a white supremacist (or not proven to be one).  The FBI's notes revealed that they believed that Randy's views would make him acceptable to the local WS group the FBI was trying to infiltrate and they wanted him to spy for them.  Weaver refused, but denied any involvement with the white supremacist movement, citing numerous religious differences with their views.  The FBI entrapped him with a weapons charge in an effort to coerce him into serving their needs.  The accusation of being a white supremacist was cooked up AFTER the Ruby Ridge attack to partially justify the actions there.  The statement in the article makes clear the "journalist's" bias.

John

I am as happy to be despised by the despicable as I am to be admired by the admirable.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: 2ndA on September 06, 2009, 04:35:38 pm
Weaver was never a supremacist.  He was and remains a separatist.  He believed then and believes now(at least the last time I talked to him a couple or three years back) that different races should live apart because there are fundamental differences between them that for the most part can never be overcome.  Of course he was also of the opinion(rightly so as far as I am concerned) that the same race living in high density would exhibit most of the same problems, hence why he lived in BFE. 

It was these things the Feebs thought would work well for their purposes, not really grasping any difference(as usual).  The media accepted the label because they, too, see no difference since he doesn't fit the current leftist definition of "tolerance".
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on September 09, 2009, 04:07:28 am
Quote
By crossing a line that invites the government to 'legally' infringe upon our 1st Amendment Rights, we would be forced into resorting to other methods. We choose to, peacefully, educate and inspire loyalty to the Constitution, so that those other methods are never required.

What happened to my 1st Amendment rights on this forum?

Opposing certain moderators positions and their response was banning, typical behavior of the federal government.  Your not allowed to oppose the moderators in this forum because they will use their dictator powers and remove you...

This is a grim testimony to the effectiveness of the fascist efforts to program and divide and conquer the Oath Keepers. We still have a Constitution and a First Amendment the last time I checked. Beyond that, we have a God-given right to express our thoughts and knowledge to others we think might find them of value.

As for his 'fearful' senior members and moderators...they are an integral part of the evil, and sheer mindlessness, that is consuming so much of this foundering, forlorn society.

The world has always been run via conspiracy now more than ever and any efforts to reveal and expose these dark machinations are among the highest forms of patriotism one can reach for.

Shame on Oath Keepers moderators and shame on those who live in fear of any 'new' ideas or concepts that are presented to them. Sheep are bonded by fear...that is why they remain in a herd, heads down, chewing...chewing...and chewing...

Working with local Sheriff's will not cut it, you need generals from the National Guard and even in the federal army if your going to have success.  You need them to cross the lines because they command the firepower unlike local Sheriff's that will be forced to surrender or be removed...

Men commanding tanks, helicopters, fighters and naval ships will determine the fate of the Constitution, not your local Sheriff!

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: freewoman on September 09, 2009, 05:46:22 am
Same old, same old.  This forum, as with other internet forums, is voluntary.  You abide by the terms of agreement, you may stay. 

Quote
This is a grim testimony to the effectiveness of the fascist efforts to program and divide and conquer the Oath Keepers. We still have a Constitution and a First Amendment the last time I checked. Beyond that, we have a God-given right to express our thoughts and knowledge to others we think might find them of value.

A "fascist" combines government and corporate power to serve the interests of the state.  Not much of that being advocated here.  Your use of inflammatory terminology will get you nowhere.

As for dividing Oath Keepers--you're the one trying to divide here, not the OK leadership.

Your God-given right to express your thoughts ends when you aggress toward others.  It's called the Zero-Aggression Principle.  Maybe you might try it out sometime.

I'm sure you will say that the admins have shown aggression toward you.  I will point out that you were warned several times that you were violating the Terms of Agreement and the spirit of Oath Keepers, and that the admins showed considerable forebearance in your case.  It appears to have been for naught.

The "senior members and moderators" are "fearful", "an integral part of the evil, and sheer mindlessness"?  Oh, please.  You have shown over and over again your own mindlessness.  You have refused to accept anyone's view but your own.  That, my friend, is mindless.  Because no one individual has all the answers.

As to the importance of the local sheriff, I disagree.  But then, you won't listen to anything anyone has to say, anyway.  Because you're right, and we're wrong.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Scarmiglione' on September 09, 2009, 11:03:28 am
I'm going to go out on a limb, Oxi, and state that coming out of the penalty box spitting at the referees may not be the best way to stay in the game.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: ZooT_aLLures on September 09, 2009, 11:40:08 am
Quote
What happened to my 1st Amendment rights on this forum?

You're on private property there....................you don't have any first amendment rights................you have posting priviledges granted by the owners of this property.........and there's a difference......
I don't have first amendment rights here...................I have posting "priviledges"..............and nothing more
The only "right" you have here, is the right to redress and to remove your own content........ it's spelled out in simple words in the TOS................and you've already had your redress..............you alerted Bill that your 14 days was over............I went and dug up the thread, and yes indeed Elias said 14 days.......I posted the thread in the back room so the other moderators could see it, and that Elias specified 14 days........and you got reinstated.............

Had Elias not specified 14 days, you'd still be gone...........Now....................it's up to you guy..................where do you want to take this?

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Carl Bussjaeger on September 09, 2009, 12:13:19 pm
What happened to my 1st Amendment rights on this forum?

Nothing. The First Amendment protects your speech against government restrictions; it does not entitle you to totally unfettered use of a soap box bought with someone else's money. If you don't like the remarkably mild restrictions by which the owners ask you to abide, buy your own soap box; go start your own forum with your own rules. As is, you are committing the Internet equivalent of going to a private shooting range and insisting on your right to ignore the range master's instructions to keep the muzzle aimed down range, blowing out the shop windows, and complaining that your Second Amendment rights are being violated when asked to leave.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Mr. Dare on September 09, 2009, 04:23:23 pm
Quote
Working with local Sheriff's will not cut it, you need generals from the National Guard and even in the federal army if your going to have success.  You need them to cross the lines because they command the firepower unlike local Sheriff's that will be forced to surrender or be removed...

Men commanding tanks, helicopters, fighters and naval ships will determine the fate of the Constitution, not your local Sheriff!

   Oxi, you have every right to your opinions, but statements like this are tantamount to advocating the violent overthrow of the government. That could be a criminal offense these days, and certainly violates the spirit of Oath Keepers, TMM (which is not the same thing as Oath Keepers btw) and the letter of the Terms of Service you agreed to when you signed up here. Short and sweet, KNOCK IT OFF! This is without a doubt the last batch of warnings you will get.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on September 09, 2009, 04:44:34 pm

Quote
You're on private property


Private property, where?  You pay taxes right on property?  That means your simply renting it, the government owns it and that's why you pay taxes on it...  If you do not pay any property taxes then you own 100% of it, be careful about debating "private" property because you really do not own squat!

Quote
you don't have any first amendment rights

Ofcourse, you guys do not respect the Constitution!

Quote
I don't have first amendment rights here...................I have posting "priviledges"..............and nothing more

You guys uphold the oath but cannot even honor one of the biggest Amendments, the 1st one...
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on September 09, 2009, 04:58:10 pm

Quote
Oxi, you have every right to your opinions, but statements like this are tantamount to advocating the violent overthrow of the government. That could be a criminal offense these days

So I don't have a right to my opinions is what you are saying...

Wow, we live in a parnoid society that fears their own government, how pathetic!  Bush has spooked you guys into submission and fear, exactly what they wanted to achieve with post 9/11...

It's a criminal offense to violate the Constitution, but nobody seems to give a dam about that!!! 

By the way I stand correct, if you really want those in power to respect the oath, it starts with the armed forces of every state and federal, you know the ones violating their oaths in Iraq and Afghanistan.  You need to be worried about their intentions and plans because if they violate their oaths today, they will violate them tomorrow and run over the little Sheriff's all across the nation and then what?

Sheriff's do not control tanks, fighters and warships, they control some squad cars and a few guns, maybe some small boats, and when the federal government comes marching in with their federal troops to do as they please because their is no accountability with the federal government, they do as they please, so naturally your local Sheriff will be under their command and orders or they will be arrested or worse killed because soldiers follow orders, they do not give a dam about rules and laws or even oaths as evident with Iraq and Afghanistan...

Then what?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Klapton Isgod on September 09, 2009, 05:00:30 pm
Maybe you can understand this version of "private property."

Who is PAYING for these forums?  Hint:  It's not you nor me nor the taxpayers.  The person who is paying for it gets to make the rules.  Kinda like my dad got to make the rules in "his house" because he was the guy paying the mortgage, even though he technically didn't "own" the house.  And he would often tell me, "Whey you pay the bills, then you can make the rules."

Get it now?  You aren't paying the bills, you don't get to make the rules.  You are a guest here.  A very rude and disrespectful one at this point.

You are welcome to go set up and pay for your own forums where you get to make the rules.  Or you can have none at all if you like.  There is actually another forum out there in cyberspace that was founded by some folks who weren't happy with the rules here, so they went and made a forum of there own that has almost no rules at all.  Including no rules against making annoying people feel VERY unwelcome.  They don't bend over BACKWARD like people have been doing here to keep you around.

It seems that we are trying harder than you are to keep you here.  That by itself says a whole lot.  You are welcome to grow the hell up at any time though.  We'd all be very happy if you did.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on September 09, 2009, 05:18:33 pm
Bigger picture, strategic thinking, your local Sheriff will be powerless in the face of a federal army that will not care about any oaths... they do not even recognize the Constitution anymore by their constant violations, so in reality the federal army serves the politicians not the nation.  They answer to a dictator electoral college president that has no accountability for their actions and decisions by a Congress that keeps on chewing whatever their campaign contributors tell them to do and so forth...

So set your mine fields now and sniper positions and you just might make it before they call in the air strikes to wipe your community down if you do not comply to their command...

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Mr. Dare on September 09, 2009, 05:25:58 pm
   Oxi, What exactly are you proposing then? We offered Oath Keepers space on our forum to discuss ideas and to spread what we see as a constructive message to anyone who is willing listen with an open mind. You seem to think that it is necessary to exercise military force in order to achieve freedom. I assure you that military force is exactly the opposite of freedom. Whether you use it or somebody else does it, the end result is the same. People die, and those who live are not free. The initiation of force is the essence of fascism. If you advocate anything like it, you are not welcome here. You have had ample opportunity to express your ideas, and I think I am understanding you. If I do, then I disagree most emphatically and am asking you to leave and stop using our forum to spread a message of power mongering and violence. That is not the way to freedom. If you persist, I consider the staff of this forum well within it's rights to revoke your posting privileges permanently. You can exercise you first amendment rights on someone else's dime, but not ours.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: oxi on September 09, 2009, 05:39:40 pm
  Oxi, What exactly are you proposing then? We offered Oath Keepers space on our forum to discuss ideas and to spread what we see as a constructive message to anyone who is willing listen with an open mind. You seem to think that it is necessary to exercise military force in order to achieve freedom. I assure you that military force is exactly the opposite of freedom. Whether you use it or somebody else does it, the end result is the same. People die, and those who live are not free. The initiation of force is the essence of fascism. If you advocate anything like it, you are not welcome here. You have had ample opportunity to express your ideas, and I think I am understanding you. If I do, then I disagree most emphatically and am asking you to leave and stop using our forum to spread a message of power mongering and violence. That is not the way to freedom. If you persist, I consider the staff of this forum well within it's rights to revoke your posting privileges permanently. You can exercise you first amendment rights on someone else's dime, but not ours.

You'll never win with that attitude!
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Klapton Isgod on September 09, 2009, 05:45:29 pm
You'll never win with that attitude!

One who is not striving does not "lose."
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Bill St. Clair on September 09, 2009, 06:14:22 pm
I'm always surprised when people seem to think the First Amendment applies to anybody but who it plainly says it applies: "Congress shall make no law...". It applies to the United States Congress. Nobody else. I realize that the nine nazgul have expanded its meaning to forbid prayer in schools, and much more. Guess what? They're wrong. Of course, they claim to be the final arbiter of disputes, but that's nowhere in the Constitution either. They decided that themselves (don't remember the name of the case). In actual fact, we the jurors are the final arbiters, since if even one juror votes to acquit, it's at worst a hung jury, and the defendant walks.

But even the nine nazgul won't support requiring us to let anybody say or do anything he wants on our property. The forum owners make the forum rules. They can be totally ridiculous, though I think TMM's rules are pretty sensible and lenient. If you want to hang out here, you must comply. Your ONLY moral recourse, if you don't like the property owner's rules, is to stay off of his property.

I agree that we don't really OWN property in the US, we rent it with property taxes. But that's just a protection racket, demanding that we pay their protection money or have our legs broken. My property is still MY property.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: suijurisfreeman on September 09, 2009, 07:05:40 pm
Bill St.Clair posted, "I realize that the nine nazgul have expanded its meaning to forbid prayer in schools, and much more. Guess what? They're wrong. Of course, they claim to be the final arbiter of disputes, but that's nowhere in the Constitution either. They decided that themselves (don't remember the name of the case)."

I believe that would be: Marbury v. Madison, 5 U.S. (1 Cranch) 137 (1803).
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Bernie on September 13, 2009, 07:44:28 am
Oxi is a great unifier.  He shows us all how not to act at this forum.  I am truly surprise that he is still lurking about.  Perhaps this is the only forum that has not banned his rants.  I am not posting to fan the flames but to point out that your posts are counter productive to what is being expressed here.  The WWW is a vast and diverse place.  Go find a forum that appreciates all that you have to share.  IMHO this is not it.
 :tinfoil:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Scarmiglione' on September 18, 2009, 07:34:32 am
Oathkeepers make LA Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-oath-keepers18-2009sep18,0,4937225.story?page=1) and by extension, Fark (http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4644150).

That latter link goes to the Fark comments on the article, and Farkers are notoriously merciless. If you choose to visit, wear your thickest internet armor.

There is no such thing as bad publicity, just bad responses to publicity.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Who...me? on September 18, 2009, 09:10:01 am
Wow those fark comments get to be pretty rabid at times.  I noticed more than one that advocated killing all of "them".
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: freewoman on September 18, 2009, 03:11:41 pm
The LA Times article was great--except for that heading.  After reading the headline part about "antigovernment" and all the usual liberal fearmongering, the article was a nice surprise.  The fark commentary was hilarious, IMO--these internet dweebs talk about Oath Keepers being "pussies".  Hee hee hee.  Put them face to face with some of OK's folks and they'd wet their pants.  But one of them did point out that the Times "journalist" was trying to bait Rand, which I find interesting--usually folks of that ilk see nothing wrong with backwoods small-town "flyover" people being riduculed by the press.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on September 18, 2009, 09:18:05 pm
Having never been to Fark before I was a little surprised that there were actually people there with intelligence enough to state truth.
Not that anyone listened but it was there.

My favorite was the genius that kept saying Read the Constitution again and again.
My two cents will wager that s/he-it cannot tell me how many times the word democracy* is used in it.

I-Net show offs with way too much time on their hands to borrow a statement from there ....

Oathkeepers make LA Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-oath-keepers18-2009sep18,0,4937225.story?page=1) and by extension, Fark (http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4644150).

That latter link goes to the Fark comments on the article, and Farkers are notoriously merciless. If you choose to visit, wear your thickest internet armor.

There is no such thing as bad publicity, just bad responses to publicity.

emphasis is mine

Hear hear
I concur Scarmig




* Never
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: socalserf on September 20, 2009, 11:37:58 am
Oathkeepers make LA Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-oath-keepers18-2009sep18,0,4937225.story?page=1) and by extension, Fark (http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4644150).

There is no such thing as bad publicity, just bad responses to publicity.

BTW, my mother in law subsrcibes to that particular yellow sheet.
It was on the front page in "Column One."
Get ready for a great deal of attention.

Congratulations, and be careful, the EVIL EYE has turned your way.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: 2ndA on September 20, 2009, 03:50:18 pm
To say that Fark in general is a joke and the den primarily of people too stupid to type and think at the same time would be an understatement.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Scarmiglione' on September 21, 2009, 06:03:51 am
Sort of agree there 2nd.  I find Fark to be a good, wide slice of current America.  It is good because the environment there is no-holds-barred, no opinions right, and the demographic is very, very wide, and vocal.  It's a good way for to keep aware of attitudes to ideas, because every idea is challenged on every point, ridiculed, dissected, overblown in every possible way.

It's kind of an internet crucible.  If you, as a person or an idea, can survive Fark you'll probably be just fine.  Oathkeepers did well that day.  Much better than, say, Ron Paul and his supporters.  That was embarrassing.

But yes, the Evil Eyes have turned towards Oathkeepers, and I suspect the heat is about to be turned up.

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: mystry_tour on September 21, 2009, 12:04:50 pm
.....A little heat is good to simmer the pot into a tasty meal
Tour
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on September 21, 2009, 11:13:46 pm
Sort of agree there 2nd.  I find Fark to be a good, wide slice of current America.  It is good because the environment there is no-holds-barred, no opinions right, and the demographic is very, very wide, and vocal.  It's a good way for to keep aware of attitudes to ideas, because every idea is challenged on every point, ridiculed, dissected, overblown in every possible way.

It's kind of an internet crucible.  If you, as a person or an idea, can survive Fark you'll probably be just fine.  Oathkeepers did well that day.  Much better than, say, Ron Paul and his supporters.  That was embarrassing.

But yes, the Evil Eyes have turned towards Oathkeepers, and I suspect the heat is about to be turned up.



Well I think it landed this weekend. Or maybe we just had a glitch ... *sigh*
We had people banned, peoples posts removed, all sorts of sh.. stuff happening.

I was forced to ban a fellow and the next morning he was back with the exact same name everything just like I had never touched the button ... weird stuff Ning.
So I banned him again and tomorrow and the day after and the day after ad infinitum ad nauseum.

Me no likee Ning.


The newspapers [was it Miami ?] had an article today that was actually an honest statement about OK BUT it was in the middle of a smear article about violent militias.
*sigh*
No one but us will notice that it did not SAY that Oath Keepers is a violent militia .... infer, smear, smear, infer  *sigh*
Publicity ... it is all good but sometimes it doesn't seem like it.

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: hermit on September 23, 2009, 10:03:35 am
I have thought for a while now that the sudden resurgence of attention - and media blitz - by SPLC had financial underpinnings to it. Dees is not one to lose a dollar, or to let someone else make a dollar, if he can help it.
And now we have the financial statements - they lost over 30% of their funds (over 50 million bucks) for fiscal '08 in the stock market plunge. Report from Oct '08, which is about the same time they started rattling cages again - helping with the Missouri report, DHS report, interviews, etc.
Link here (PDF warning):
http://www.splcenter.org/pdf/static/SPLCfinancial2008.pdf
Good analysis of it on VDARE:
http://vdare.com/cleburne/090408_splc.htm
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: freewoman on September 23, 2009, 03:51:13 pm
Good point, hermit.  The SPLC and their ilk enjoy collecting money from fear ("they're all against us, so you'd better send money quick!").  Sort of like the government. . . .
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: NuclearDruid on October 28, 2009, 02:49:54 pm
Rob Waters, SPLC, keeps stirring the pot over at AlterNet.

Right-Wing Extremist Group on Active Military Duty? (http://www.alternet.org/story/143500/right-wing_extremist_group_on_active_military_duty/)
By Rob Waters, Southern Poverty Law Center. Posted October 26, 2009.

Quote
“I’m not accusing Stewart Rhodes or any member of his group of being Timothy McVeigh or a future Timothy McVeigh. But these kinds of conspiracy theories are what drive a small number of people to criminal violence. … What’s troubling about Oath Keepers is the idea that men and women armed and ordered to protect the public in this country are clearly being drawn into a world of false conspiracy theory.”

Rhodes and Potok also faced off last night on MSNBC’s “Hardball with Chris Matthews.”

And how does the Pentagon feel about Oath Keepers? “I don’t have a formal assessment of Oath Keepers for you,” Melnyk, the Pentagon spokesman, said in an E-mail. He noted that it is “a fairly new group” and said the Defense Department would defer to the judgment of the Department of Justice and the FBI. “Certainly if they were on an FBI list of gangs or groups espousing hate, DoD would find this a compelling reason for prohibiting membership.”

ND
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: freewoman on October 28, 2009, 03:21:51 pm
Hee hee.  Had to giggle over the fact that the Rhodes-Matthews discussion on Hardball was mentioned, but absolutely no detail was provided.  Of course, they wouldn't want Stewart's "thrill up your leg" comment to be divulged to the liberal public; then some of them might get the idea that Matthews and Potok may be seriously misled.

"False conspiracy theory"?  Potok's got his own version of conspiracy theory:  that anyone who does not do his bidding is conspiring against him.  He espouses that viewpoint consistently.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Rarick on October 29, 2009, 07:36:46 am
"Americans, in particular law enforcement officers, need to take the dangers it presents seriously. That is equally true for the politicians, pundits and preachers who, through pandering or ignorance, abet the growth of a movement marked by a proven predilection for violence."  (I cut and paste directly from the last paragraph on the 1st page from the link you put up on original post)

That Quote had me on the floor laughing in tears!  They are talking about the police and military in the government, and a "Known Prediliection for Violence".  Whoever was writing obviously did not realize the very people he is saying should quell the alleged threat are likely to be oath takers/ keepers and aren't a threat.  They are not ACTORS, they are simply following the law.  The second sentance is not about abeting.  The second sentance is probably the movement he is ranting about.

How do you get the possible criminals to police themselves............

The article, in this single passage, shows that we have a frothing rabid dog barking without a clue what it is barking at or about.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on November 03, 2009, 05:03:33 pm
"Americans, in particular law enforcement officers, need to take the dangers it presents seriously. That is equally true for the politicians, pundits and preachers who, through pandering or ignorance, abet the growth of a movement marked by a proven predilection for violence."  (I cut and paste directly from the last paragraph on the 1st page from the link you put up on original post)

That Quote had me on the floor laughing in tears!  They are talking about the police and military in the government, and a "Known Prediliection for Violence".  Whoever was writing obviously did not realize the very people he is saying should quell the alleged threat are likely to be oath takers/ keepers and aren't a threat.  They are not ACTORS, they are simply following the law.  The second sentance is not about abeting.  The second sentance is probably the movement he is ranting about.

How do you get the possible criminals to police themselves............

The article, in this single passage, shows that we have a frothing rabid dog barking without a clue what it is barking at or about.

Quote
" .... a movement marked by a proven predilection for violence."

HUH ? 

He must be referring to SPLC ... Right ?   :rolleyes:

You hit that nail dead on Rarick.  "frothing rabid dog barking without a clue what it is barking at or about."

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: joeofthemountain on November 30, 2009, 06:25:03 pm
Said without a hint of irony...

Quote
“I’m not accusing Stewart Rhodes or any member of his group of being Timothy McVeigh or a future Timothy McVeigh. But these kinds of conspiracy theories are what drive a small number of people to criminal violence. … What’s troubling about Oath Keepers is the idea that men and women armed and ordered to protect the public in this country are clearly being drawn into a world of false conspiracy theory.”

ND
Quote
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: WWalker on December 23, 2009, 09:42:44 am
Said without a hint of irony...

Quote
“ … What’s troubling about Oath Keepers is the idea that men and women armed and ordered to protect the public in this country are clearly being drawn into a world of false conspiracy theory.”

What is more troubling is that this is the way that many of the "men and women armed and ordered to protect the public" feel also.

It is, to me, mind boggling how many of those “men and women” coming to the Oath Keepers web site feel that way.   

The MSM is a powerful propaganda machine that has been and is working extremely well.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Rarick on December 24, 2009, 04:11:08 am
no, it is the dichotomy of the USA, love the land-hate the government.  The problem is that the hate of the government has gone from that to cranky dissent, to a watchful eye, to ambivelent acceptance, to "you my daddy!".    Dads do have a problem of, some times, being overprotective and using their power to enforce that protection when it is not needed. 
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Basil Fishbone on February 05, 2010, 10:45:04 pm
http://www.examiner.com/x-1417-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2010m2d5-Southern-Poverty-Law-Center-equates-gun-owners-with-haters

 Southern Poverty Law Center equates gun owners with haters

February 5, 6:37 AMGun Rights ExaminerDavid Codrea

A hate group masquerading as a civil rights organization continues to spread a message of intolerance and bigotry. Here's the latest from the seething haters at the Southern Poverty Law Center, from their "Hate Watch" page:

    Gun rights advocates, including some in the antigovernment “Patriot” movement for whom the specter of gun restrictions is a recurring theme, are planning to march in Washington, D.C., and some individual states on April 19.

They're referring to the Second Amendment March, an event being led by Grand Rapids Gun Rights Examiner Skip Coryell. ... <snip>...


http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2010/02/01/gun-rights-advocates-to-march-against-phantom-threat/

...Speakers scheduled for the “Second Amendment March” in D.C. include

    * Stewart Rhodes, founder of Oath Keepers, a conspiracy-minded, antigovernment organization composed mostly of active-duty police and military officers and veterans... <snip>...
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Rarick on February 06, 2010, 03:41:34 am
Yep, frothers :rolleyes:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: CorbinKale on February 07, 2010, 12:33:57 am

http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2010/02/01/gun-rights-advocates-to-march-against-phantom-threat/

I know what has the SPLC all upset. They can't answer the question, "WHY HAVEN'T THEY GOTTEN TIRED AND GONE BACK TO SLEEP?" I know the answer. We have awakened in record numbers, and we keep shaking the people closest to us. Can't go back to sleep in that situation.

The comments from the Progressives are entertaining. Being so full of hatred, yet incapable of effectively venting to the those who vex them, must cause them ulcers. I'm OK with that. :)
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MinuteSnake on February 20, 2010, 09:34:17 am
Howdy, Thank you so much for this posting.  My first post on this site included the fact that the Government see's much if not all of what is happening on the internet (aka Eschelon) so, thanks to this dim bulb from the SPLC, I now have infiltated "Their Web Site" and can gather intelligence on them.  Also, because of him I can further my Patriotic awakening and research on a couple of the names that "he provided" such as:  Jack McLamb and Richard Mack and dang, I didn't even know what an SPLC was.  I don't know the whole story, I only woke up about six years ago to see how the Progressives can put a spin on anything to feed to their base.  There is a good story I read once or twice and I will Change the names for this posting:  An Oath Keeper was in his field one day sowing seed.  Some of the seed fell onto good soil some seed fell into bad soil and some seed fell amongst the rocks.  This fellow that you provided is on the rocks.......they sprout but die off quickly but the seed that fell onto good soil buy the Oath Keeper will grow and flourish and will be so strong that it will choke off the weeds.  :mellow:

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Klapton Isgod on February 20, 2010, 10:00:27 am
Howdy, Thank you so much for this posting.  My first post on this site included the fact that the Government see's much if not all of what is happening on the internet (aka Eschelon) so, thanks to this dim bulb from the SPLC, I now have infiltated "Their Web Site" and can gather intelligence on them.  Also, because of him I can further my Patriotic awakening and research on a couple of the names that "he provided" such as:  Jack McLamb and Richard Mack and dang, I didn't even know what an SPLC was.  I don't know the whole story, I only woke up about six years ago to see how the Progressives can put a spin on anything to feed to their base.  There is a good story I read once or twice and I will Change the names for this posting:  An Oath Keeper was in his field one day sowing seed.  Some of the seed fell onto good soil some seed fell into bad soil and some seed fell amongst the rocks.  This fellow that you provided is on the rocks.......they sprout but die off quickly but the seed that fell onto good soil buy the Oath Keeper will grow and flourish and will be so strong that it will choke off the weeds.  :mellow:



It is exciting to see people "awakening."  One little food for thought...  You mentioned finding out about this from O'Reilly's show the other night.  That's great.  But the idea I'd like you to consider is that Fox is also a propaganda machine for TPTB (the powers that be).  They merely have a different target audience for their misinformation, lies, brainwashing, and distraction.

What are they trying to distract you from?

There is no Left or Right.  There is only Top and Bottom.  The Top is a VERY small group of elites who own pretty much everything, buy elections and politicians, and tell their minion politicians what to do.  We caught a very small glimpse of them with the bailout.  (Normally they prefer to not be visible to the ignorant masses.)  BOTH major political parties are beholden to these people, and care nothing for you or me (the Bottom).  We are merely worker drones who are supposed to shut up and toil for their enrichment.

This is why the Left and the Right continually argue vehemently about their pet issues that you and I care about, but will NEVER even discuss any of the following:

1)  Fiat Currency and the Federal Reserve System

2)  Fractional reserve banking

3)  The income tax

All of these things funnel wealth away from the Bottom and into the Top.  And no one dares even talk about them, except for bold people like Ron Paul, who get dismissed by their own party as nutjobs, in spite of the fact that people like him are actually the salvation of the pathetic, dying party.  Towing the line for their REAL masters is more important than doing the will of the people.  And when the will of the people rears it's ugly head, like the Tea party movement, the republican party will attempt to water it down and destroy its effectiveness.  They will pretend to agree with them about small government, etc. but they will go on with business as usual once elected.  And most of the Tea Partiers will fall for it, because they will still be concerned with the "lesser of two evils" myth and will vote for republicans in order to vote against the democrats, who they naively believe are actually DIFFERENT from republicans.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MinuteSnake on February 21, 2010, 07:40:41 am
Hello, I would like to respectfully disagree that Fox news is a Propaganda Machine.  I have seen the other News Networks that constantly pushes the Lefty's agenda.  I would say that Fox leans to Conservative values and why not?  When you see folks like Chris Mathews, Rossie O'Donnell, Janean Graffalo, John Stewart spewing their ideology it makes me very concerned about the future of this country.  It was only Fox News (Specifically Glenn Beck) who pointed out all of the Marxist folks like Van Jones, Annita Dunn, Mark Lloyd, Cass Sunstein, Valery Jarrett (who's mother worked along with William Ayer's Father), John Holderin and others our President has surrounded himself with has been an eye opener for me.  Both parties have played us far too long and was the reason I left the Republican party 6 years ago.  When News Companies Like NBC and MSNBC that are owned by companies like GE and in bed with Obama and stand to make billions at our expense how and where can you go to get real news?  I'll stick with Talk Radio and Fox for a while longer.  The Mask has been pulled off both parties and hopefully with patience and diligence Americans will get Washington back to the Constitution.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Klapton Isgod on February 21, 2010, 08:10:41 am
By all means, consume whatever media you choose.  I'm glad to hear you have your gaurd up and your BS filter in place no matter who is doing the talking.

When it comes to the mouthpieces on Fox, I'm more concerned with what their bosses do NOT let them talk about.  Here's an example of investigative reporters who got fired for refusing to lie about bovine growth hormone in milk (Monsanto):  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL1pKlnhvg0

Another example is questioning ANYTHING about 9-11.  Fox is just as dedicated as the other networks to the "Call them all crazy for asking and don't DARE repeat their question or expect an answer."  Even Beck who bases most of his entire show on "just asking questions" (and insinuating lots of answers) won't touch 9-11 with a 10-foot pole.  Is this because he is naive enough to believe that our government will lie to us about ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING ELSE, but didn't lie to us about anything regarding 9-11? 

No, Beck and any other thinking person who has gotten past the emotional response of revulsion and incredulity, that has looked at what the government has actually told us to believe...  There are HUGE problems with their story.  Some of the things they have said are laughably stupid.  (Google "magic passport" some time.)

Now, I'm not trying to turn this into a 9-11 truther thread, and I'm DEFINITELY not trying to say I have any idea what really happened.  I'm just trying to point out that Fox, just like any other network, has VERY specific marching orders for their PERFORMERS who are paid LOTS of money to SELL ADVERTISING.  And I'm not some commie dissing the profit-motive here.  I'm just not so naive as to ignore it.  I don't blame a used car salesman for telling me this car is great.  That's his job.  I'm going to smile at him and look under the hood for myself.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MinuteSnake on February 21, 2010, 08:42:04 am
Howdy, At 57 years old I have seen and heard about many things that our Government is capable of going all the way beck to when they imprisoned Japanese Americans in WWII.  Testing Gas in New York Subway's? and saw a possibility that maybe our Government knew that the 9/11 hijackers were already in the cockpit (According to a Jesse Ventura show that I saw) and let them take off anyway.  My Radar in on high, and now that I am retired, I look and research news during much of my day.  When I see the indoctrination of our youngest children singing praise to Mr. President and Young Men wearing Camo Pants doing a march step while stating that because of Mr. President they are going to be this and that and when I see posters of Mr. President that look just like the ones you see in Red China, North Korea and some radical Islamic Countries it makes me a tad uncomfortable. I already did the Duck and Cover drills in the late 50's and early 60's (Like that plastic picnic blanket would do anything other than shrink wrap my carcass).  I'm too old to run. All I can do is stand and defend.

P.S.  What would Mr. President need a civilian force that equals our Army for anyway?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: jamie on February 21, 2010, 04:26:49 pm
Howdy, At 57 years old I have seen and heard about many things that our Government is capable of going all the way beck to when they imprisoned Japanese Americans in WWII.  Testing Gas in New York Subway's? and saw a possibility that maybe our Government knew that the 9/11 hijackers were already in the cockpit (According to a Jesse Ventura show that I saw) and let them take off anyway.  My Radar in on high, and now that I am retired, I look and research news during much of my day.  When I see the indoctrination of our youngest children singing praise to Mr. President and Young Men wearing Camo Pants doing a march step while stating that because of Mr. President they are going to be this and that and when I see posters of Mr. President that look just like the ones you see in Red China, North Korea and some radical Islamic Countries it makes me a tad uncomfortable. I already did the Duck and Cover drills in the late 50's and early 60's (Like that plastic picnic blanket would do anything other than shrink wrap my carcass).  I'm too old to run. All I can do is stand and defend.

P.S.  What would Mr. President need a civilian force that equals our Army for anyway?

Well the only thing that immediately comes to mind to answer your question is this... The SS started in much the same way. A separate armed force, ideologically driven with an oath of absolute obedience to a man, Adolf Hitler.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MinuteSnake on February 21, 2010, 04:58:08 pm
Well, I didn't want to come out and say that.  I am not into any White movement nor have ever been. From what I have seen in the last 2 years when it comes to Mr. President with his youth indoctrination and Marxist friends all I can say is, "If It Walks Like A Duck And Quacks Like A Duck, It May Be A Marxist Duck"
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: mutti on April 21, 2010, 01:44:04 pm
I put this here because Stewart is mentioned page 3 (http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/publications/the-patriots?page=0,2). Wow - SPLC has pictures and "catchy" titles for everyone they think are "bad". Sigh - must be time for fund raising again.

Quote
Of Cops and Conspiracies
Stewart Rhodes, 44

A former aide to Texas congressman Ron Paul (see profile in "The Enablers"), Stewart Rhodes founded a group called Oath Keepers in early 2009. The rapidly growing organization is comprised mostly of active-duty police and military, as well as veterans, who fret about things like gun control and the much-feared "New World Order." Members swear (a second time) to uphold their oath to the Constitution and not to obey orders they think conflict with that. Among those orders (10 "Orders We Will Not Obey" are listed on the Oath Keepers website): Imposing martial law or a state of emergency on a state, and forcing those who resist into detention camps.

Rhodes is an Army veteran and a Yale Law School graduate. He and others in his organization have been frequent speakers at Tea Party rallies, helping channel Patriot ideas into that movement. Rhodes insists his group isn't antigovernment, but he and other Oath Keepers do describe the government as tyrannical and repressive. "We saw a dangerous increase in power of the executive branch and a dangerous increase in government power over the American people," he told Watergate felon G. Gordon Liddy on the latter's radio show in April 2009.

In interviews, Rhodes has suggested that his worries about concentration camps and martial law are purely theoretical concerns. That is false. At the top of the list of orders his group will not obey is a quote from George Washington, saying now is the time to decide whether we are "freemen" or "slaves." Rhodes' site then says, "Such a time is near at hand again," clearly suggesting imminent catastrophe.

Rhodes also has appeared for friendly questioning at least twice on the radio show of über-conspiracist Alex Jones. And, last November, he explained on the Conservative Political Network why his organization doesn't focus on politicians, lawyers or judges. "They've already demonstrated by their behavior they have contempt for the Constitution and have no regard for their oaths," he said. "So I focus on the military and the police because they still have honor, and if they stand down … and refuse unlawful orders, it doesn't make a difference what the politicians want, it can't be done."

Ron Paul, Glenn Beck, and Napolitano get honorable mentions as "Enablers" .

The last page is a "Timeline" since 1992 of the "Patriots" evil ways.

SPLC  - why not put a picture of any person who says "No" to being bent over on this "list"? Save some pixels/bandwidth and gives more time for the Latte patrol.

Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: ZooT_aLLures on April 21, 2010, 02:43:31 pm
Quote
"If It Walks Like A Duck And Quacks Like A Duck, It May Be A Marxist Duck"
unfortunately it's not marxist, nor were the nazis marxists............the nazis were, like mussolini's italy, fascists....

Marxism(communism) declares that all is owned by the state.
fascism on the other hand, (and they're definately fascists) declares that all is owned by "people" and merely controlled by the state.

The distinction is, that status quo gets upset, as people lose their businesses to nationalization under marxism, whereas in fascism, they still own them, but government controls them, and thus they can do extremely well (huge profit margins for favored entities) but can also lose their butts to this nonproductive business partner, who's only there to steal the profits and leave the past owners holding the bag in the event of failure.........

He has sent forth swarms of agents to harrass the people and eat out their substance.

Some things never change.............do they?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on April 21, 2010, 04:58:23 pm
Quote
"If It Walks Like A Duck And Quacks Like A Duck, It May Be A Marxist Duck"
unfortunately it's not marxist, nor were the nazis marxists............the nazis were, like mussolini's italy, fascists....

Marxism(communism) declares that all is owned by the state.
fascism on the other hand, (and they're definately fascists) declares that all is owned by "people" and merely controlled by the state.

The distinction is, that status quo gets upset, as people lose their businesses to nationalization under marxism, whereas in fascism, they still own them, but government controls them, and thus they can do extremely well (huge profit margins for favored entities) but can also lose their butts to this nonproductive business partner, who's only there to steal the profits and leave the past owners holding the bag in the event of failure.........

He has sent forth swarms of agents to harrass the people and eat out their substance.

Some things never change.............do they?

For those that don't recognize it .... Zoot is quoting the Declaration of Independence.

"He has sent forth swarms of agents to harass the people and eat out their substance."
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: ZooT_aLLures on April 21, 2010, 06:18:14 pm
Geez gooch...............anyones who's read the constitution but not the declaration of independance, only has half the picture............if that much............
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: CorbinKale on April 21, 2010, 10:00:07 pm
Geez gooch...............anyones who's read the constitution but not the declaration of independance, only has half the picture............if that much............

Precisely. The two have to be taken together for a complete picture. The DoI states WHAT they intended to do and WHY. The Constitution was the structure for HOW they intended to do it. Anyone who tries to separate them is selling something other than freedom.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: da gooch on April 24, 2010, 03:03:32 pm
Geez gooch...............anyones who's read the constitution but not the declaration of independance, only has half the picture............if that much............

Precisely. The two have to be taken together for a complete picture. The DoI states WHAT they intended to do and WHY. The Constitution was the structure for HOW they intended to do it. Anyone who tries to separate them is selling something other than freedom.

"Anyone who tries to separate them is selling something other than freedom."

You mean like the political system in place currently CK ?

edit to add:

There was a time when Both were taught to every child in every school system in this country.
When that stopped is when your school system was co-opted by the NWO.
Just in case you wondered.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: ZooT_aLLures on April 26, 2010, 06:51:07 am
Quote
The DoI states WHAT they intended to do and WHY. The Constitution was the structure for HOW they intended to do it. Anyone who tries to separate them is selling something other than freedom.

I believe the DoI giveth, and the constitution taketh away..............but then again the DoI was written before the war to beat the drums of war, and the constitution was written after the war to ensure that the new boss supported the existing status quo, and thus would be the same as the old boss...........and it wasn't two years later when they proved such to be the case.

It's also amazing how quickly(less than 100 years) that this country got settled from coast to coast by people running away from what their parents ran away from europe to find........
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: CorbinKale on April 26, 2010, 08:42:33 am
It's just a cycle, Zoot. A never ending cycle. I chalk it up to human nature and enjoy the ride. I decided long ago that I was not going to waste my short life trying to achieve perfect freedom. Where humans are concerned, perfect freedom CAN'T exist.

Like most folks, however, I do enjoy trying to tweak the system in my favor. We can't win, but if we can enjoy the game while keeping our self respect, I think that's just as good.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Elias Alias on May 13, 2010, 01:55:17 am
Well, as James Jaeger puts it, we've got cultural-Marxism on the extreme left, and corporate-fascism on the extreme right, and between the two jaws of that political vise we find our American people, still struggling to perfect the vision of this nation's founders, but beset on both flanks by evil.

For a century or two, we were being led down that primrose path of temptation. Now we're being pushed down that path. Look for a very hot summer in 2010.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: jamie on May 13, 2010, 03:21:00 am
Well, I didn't want to come out and say that.  I am not into any White movement nor have ever been. From what I have seen in the last 2 years when it comes to Mr. President with his youth indoctrination and Marxist friends all I can say is, "If It Walks Like A Duck And Quacks Like A Duck, It May Be A Marxist Duck"

My reply had nothing, absolutely nothing to do with any kind of "white movement". 
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Bernie on May 19, 2010, 08:40:31 am
Cycle, more like a spiral.  In this hemisphere it flushes spirals counterclockwise.
 :tinfoil:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: FDD on June 07, 2015, 08:40:58 pm
the SPLC is the Jewish control group of the US Government, folks.

if you are not promoting multiculturalism, then you are the problem for them, and they will try and stop you.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 08, 2015, 06:06:49 am
the SPLC is the Jewish control group of the US Government, folks.

if you are not promoting multiculturalism, then you are the problem for them, and they will try and stop you.

I don't have any problems with "multiculturalism" in a libertarian context. Live and let live. It's the forced kind that is a problem...  Different cultures get along just fine if nobody can force anyone else to do thing or approve.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: FDD on June 08, 2015, 06:14:16 am
and that is why they would not like you Mama.

They do what to force it on everyone here.

want to live among other whites? do bad, you need non-whites with you are you are raciest.

just stop and look around you, at other cities, what are the main problem with them?
the root problem?

It is not letting people live with others of their own choosing.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 08, 2015, 11:34:10 am
just stop and look around you, at other cities, what are the main problem with them?
the root problem?

It is not letting people live with others of their own choosing.

Only lived in a city once. Never did fit in at all.  But I have lived with a lot of different people, different races and cultures, different nationalities.  I can't remember having any real problems with any of them... except for the radical fundamentalist religious "whites" in one place. They really didn't believe their shit smelled bad...

Never did understand why anyone got upset to be called "racist" or any other such label. I don't give a damn what people label me, actually... I just watch their hands. It's what they do that counts.
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Tahn L. on June 08, 2015, 02:04:34 pm
Never did understand why anyone got upset to be called "racist" or any other such label. I don't give a damn what people label me, actually... I just watch their hands. It's what they do that counts.

I am saving this quote in my freedom quotes box, if I may ML?
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 08, 2015, 02:08:50 pm
Never did understand why anyone got upset to be called "racist" or any other such label. I don't give a damn what people label me, actually... I just watch their hands. It's what they do that counts.

I am saving this quote in my freedom quotes box, if I may ML?

Be my guest. :)
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: Tahn L. on June 08, 2015, 02:12:57 pm
Never did understand why anyone got upset to be called "racist" or any other such label. I don't give a damn what people label me, actually... I just watch their hands. It's what they do that counts.

I am saving this quote in my freedom quotes box, if I may ML?

Be my guest. :)

Thank You! :wub:
Title: Re: SPLC Slams Oath Keepers
Post by: FDD on June 19, 2018, 10:25:25 am
SPLC to pay 3.4 mil to a Muslim for calling and listing him an Anti-Muslim terrorist

  http://www.foxnews.com%2Fus%2F2018%2F06%2F18%2Fsplc-makes-huge-settlement-with-anti-extremist-group-it-called-anti-muslim.html&usg=AOvVaw0dJHuTPRUVstL30Wru7YD8