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9/11 Discussion => 9/11 => Topic started by: Elias Alias on October 07, 2004, 11:59:12 am

Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 07, 2004, 11:59:12 am
I'm just doing this to see what I might think, okay? :)

I have been discussing "conspiracy theories" with Edison_Carter in private messages, and I asked him if we could take the discussion into the public zones here. E_C kindly agreed, so I would like to initiate a thread which deals with unanswered questions regarding governmental involvement in crime, and, specifically, governmental involvement in the creation of terrorism.

I had made a comment on another thread to the effect that elements within the U.S. government assisted in the events of 911. That is a fairly bizzare statement, on the surface of it. I'll admit that it sounds far-fetched. Yet there are some anomalies involved in the government's story about what happened on 911. For instance, George W. Bush himself is recorded saying that he saw on a tv screen the first plane hit the first tower. At the time he said that, there was no known film of that first plane hitting the tower, and Bush now knows for a fact that he could not have seen that plane hit the tower as he said he did. We now know that after all, he *could* see it, but only if his "tv screen" was connected with a Secret Service command-and-control communications grid being operated that morning by Dick Cheney and his staff. Cheney, we learned recently, was in charge of five separate "wargames" drills on the morning of 911. We'll get into that later, but I mention it here simply to show that by Bush's own mouth, he has caught himself in a lie. Nobody out here in the civilian world saw the footage of the first flight hitting the first tower, not until much later. Bush's statement, which I repeat was recorded, is an anomaly.

There are quite a few very interesting questions, of which the above is one example. Another example is the official Pentagon photos shot immediately after the incident at the Pentagon. The government says a 757 hit the Pentagon. Yet in the photos issued by the Pentagon, there is no wreckage of a 757, and the structural damage which was apparent after the event suggests that there is no way a 757 could have impacted the Pentagon. More on that laters.

This topic is huge, and I would like to take the reader back in time, back in American history, prior to looking directly at the events of 911 and the government's explanations of those events. I would like to note for the reader that I am not "stating" anything as fact, but am instead simply asking questions which the media refuses to ask. I hope some of the readers here will join in. I think we could use this thread to organize a lot of presently-chaotic consciousness about who committed the acts of 911, and why, and who benefitted.

Before I bring up some questions asked of me by Edison_Carter, and attempt to answer them, please allow me to first set the stage for my personal perspective. Let's take a look at our mentality, just briefly, and then let's go way back in time....

~

Okay, I'm teaching to myself here, but I'm doing so by speaking with you, as I imagine that you are external to "me" and are therefore real. Given that you are you and I am me, I'll ask for your forgiveness right up front. I'm sorry I feel that I must use you to teach myself.
 
The mind is something, as I presume all possessed of one might agree. Whatever it is, our five carnal senses cannot apprehend it, and that is despite the belief that a mind owns a body which cannot prove that its owner, the mind, exists. Can't smell or hear a mind, nor feel it nor see it nor taste it. Can't take out a loan on it, trade it, rent it (well, maybe rent it..... ) weigh it, displace water with it, or any other useful commerce in which our bodily existence marks its days and ways
 
The mind is said to possess the potential for a "sixth sense", be that via inspiration, intuition, or a lifespan's experiential summation. That is what some people say. I enjoy using my mind as something other than a "sense", such as any "body" might possess. To call my mind a mere "sense", like the sense of hearing or tasting, would be to place the template of finite pronouncement upon what was intrinsically the infinite; in other words, it would be an attempt to define the infinite.  Definition and infinition exist as poles of the same spectrum, do they not?
 
Personally, I think the mind is simply the sum of its contents, comprising itself of thoughts, psychegies, emotions, memory, imagery, and a sublime associative process which conceptualizes, as an example and among other manifest things, the root of figurative language.

To understand anything, to "know" anything, we rely upon our minds. But the "set" of the mind has much to do with our perception, and that is important as we try to unravel the contradictions we've been given in the government's explanations of 911. For instance, if I were to say to you that an organized, structured conspiracy to take over the U.S. Federal government has existed for a long time in this country, your pre-911 consciousness would tend to object to such a "conspiracy theory". I don't blame you, as I myself have long resisted succumbing to the tempting idea of a conspiracy.

The terrorists don't have armies, yet we send forth our armies to conquer them. Pray, how can an army shoot, blow up, gas or bomb a hatred which exists in the minds of the targeted people? Why do we not consider approaching the war on terror from a platform of intelligence, (and here I do not mean CIA-type "intelligence", but genuine intelligence unmotivated by greed or quest), a platform featuring that plank which states: hatred is an invisible enemy which must be approached through the correct use of the mind instead of by the arraying of tanks and bombs and military police tactics upon innocent people.
 
But we can't *afford* to think that way, not up on the Hill in DC or over at the Pentagon or down at Langley; not even on Wall Street, which itself now is dependant upon the others' combined functions and operations. I'm guessing that when Colin Powell leaves or is disposed of in the coming Presidential cycle, he shall have a view from the top of the U.S. State Department stored neatly inside his mind, and I'll guess further that after a respectable lapse of months or maybe even a few years Colin Powell shall issue commentary relative to my statement, that we can't *afford* to cease with the military and its umbilically outsourced dependents, the Defense Contractors. You know that I mean here the coat-and-tie crowd, the important cats who make the bombs and the stuff that goes boom in the night, and the anthrax and unspeakable bio/chem wmds and the domestic police "research and development", and worse like DARPA contractors and "policy think tanks" and NGOs and etc and etc.  
 
Cut all that money-flow out of the Wall Street charts and the banks will go bust overnight and we all know it. It is a mechanism with momentum, and that momentum is achieving quantum acceleration as we speak.  
 
Yet we know that the mechanism was built with deliberation, that it was planned, charted, graphed, projected, implemented, deployed, managed, even guarded every step of the way since dating back from the American Revolution and the birth of this sovereign nation-state.
 
And we know that if the mechanism requires its own unique and primary infrastructure for the strongest extension of its enforceable authority, that infrastructure itself has to be managed.
 
Question: Who are the managers who planned Western policy while they were being thrown out of this country by George Washington's troops not so long ago? Who called Thomas Jefferson's inaugural speech "radical usurpation"? Who had the ties with British banking and commerce whilst establishing this nation's collegiate community? Who resisted the Revolution and remained loyal to the British crown? And who ran the Clipper ship fleets for England's opium trade into China?
 
There were many Loyalists within the ranks of the Tory Party at the founding of this nation. Some of them did not take well to defeat by a rag-tag band of rebellious misfits who, as thought by the loyalists and Tories, should have gotten along with the King's law, the King's economy, the King's taxes, the King's security forces. Either love the Colonies or leave 'em. Rebelling against the law of the land, the order of the day, the very throne which sustained the immigrations into America, was treasonous, wickedly evil, and totally unnecessary. Besides, it could greatly harm the profitability of long-established business connections back in England. So let's have none of this revolution talk!  
 
I note that mood simply to indicate that the Tory Party of the early 1800s had a conscious logic as their mindset, and that logic was a loyalty to the King, who buttered their bread. Such businesses as held fast to British ties even after the Revolution included the Russell Company of Boston, prime jewel of the Russell family, themselves New England Tories.  
 
Questions: Could the elite of the New England Tory families, families such as the Lows, Pierponts, Edwards, Delanos, all of them, have, in defeat but not resignation, gone "underground" by using their British wealth to found the American university system? Could they from there have moved their sons and fellow Loyalists into seats of State and Federal governance? Could their wealth be applied to enterprising American banking? Could their wealth have found leverage on Wall Street? Could they have set in motion a gradual, incremental assault upon George Washington's and Thomas Jefferson's America -- from *within*? Could that assault be poised now, a mere two centuries later, to announce its ownership of the United States Government?
 
Question: Could an infrastructure of banking, finance, trade, industry, and business present the potential of influence through lobbying the Federal Government? And if these social institutions and others unmentioned can be shown to be inter-related through family interaction and relationships for two centuries, while lobbying the Federal Government, can we not correctly state that it is "possible" that within the legacy of American history exists, to this day, the plot of the Tory Loyalists of New England to re-take what Washington's and Jefferson's Revolution had ripped in violence from the throne of England?
 
Question: If so, does there not at least exist the *possibility*, however remote or seemingly unlikely, of a conspiracy?

~

Okay. This is a place where anyone is welcome to voice one's ideas on "conspiracy theories". I'll get my tinfoil hat out and dust it off and will try to keep the thread contained to conspiracies which may have affected "terrorism" in general. Let's have some fun here, before the guys with the white coats come to take me away....

:)

Elias
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Basil Fishbone on October 07, 2004, 12:45:11 pm
It's been said the Constitution amounted to a coup against the Articles of Confederation on the part of the Federalists.  Hamilton and his cronies.  What they were working toward was an imposition of the British mercantilist economic system on American soil.  This became a decades-long attempt to engineer this transformation away from Jeffersonian ideals, throughout the first half of the 1800s, by people such as John Quincy Adams, Henry Clay, and Abraham Lincoln.  I wouldn't be surprised if advocates of Clay's "American System" of high tariffs, and "internal improvements" (subsidies to private canal, road and railroad companies) had links to the Tory banking interests Elias mentioned. (Any info on this, Elias?)

It seems clear there must be an inter-generational program to consolidate power in the hands of central government institutions and favored corporations.  I know there is an enormous literature devoted to ferreting out the details.   The problem is so pervasive and deep-rooted one wonders what it would take to return to Jeffersonian ideals, and even to eradicate all forms of coercive authority.   Something like plowing the ground and sowing it with salt, I'm afraid.

Basil Fishbone
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on October 07, 2004, 03:34:27 pm
This quote from a pastor friend of mine.
Quote
The leaders of the developing world-state aren't conducting a conspiracy.  They've stated their goals, and they outline the steps, in regular public forums.[italics mine] Yesterday, on C-Span, Geraald Levin, the CEO of Time Warner...said, in essence, Well, we've got to maintain control of Information Technology, which is now going through a revolution. If we don't, you'll have amoral machines running the show, and just look at the move "Matrix" and you'll see the result of what  that would be like.

Hmmm. Thanks Gerry, for telling me what message you were trying to instill in the populace with the movie "Matrix". Very good approach. You can't trust amoral machines, so us "folks" who are running the world-state will have to maintain personal control of IT in the new globalism...
[skipping ahead]
There has to be an absolute Interpol controlled by the world-state. No nuts riding the rails incognito and killing and eating nice folks whose houses happen to front on rail lines. I like that one  too. (Gadzooks, folks, I like every single idea the globalists can come up with for the necessity of globalism. The more they talk the more it sounds like commons sense and the less it sounds like conspiracy.) Of course,  that also means the world-state has to track ME around (and YOU) just to  make sure we're not some of those nutcases, international terrorists, or
what-not.

In other words, once again, in order to achieve this worthy goal I absolutely MUST willingly surrender my personal freedom in order to guarantee my security. How can they track me? Well, lots of ways.  The best would simply be to take my personal data and put it on file for comparison. My personal data includes some of the following and more: fingerprints, cornea prints, palm and footprints, DNA, as well as various electronic data. If and when they come and ask for this, for the good of  all mankind, I'm going to give it willingly, aren't you? Since I'm  not on the verge of murdering anyone, eating anyone, raping anyone, or  even blowing up a building owned by my favorite government, I have no particular reason to say no. At that point the personal-freedom folks will simply look silly.
I should point out that this was written in 2000 when none of us knew what 911 or the Patriot Act meant.  I should also point out that his tone is one of irony -- he's not in favor of this!
If it's a conspiracy then it's a dreadfully botched one, since laypeople such as us know so much about it.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Basil Fishbone on October 07, 2004, 04:01:43 pm
Quote
If it's a conspiracy then it's a dreadfully botched one, since laypeople such as us know so much about it.

They don't particularly try to hide it.  They assume that the unwashed are not going to be reading Foreign Affairs (a journal put out by the Council on Foreign Relations) or listening to NPR, for instance.  Those who do, are assumed to be sufficiently enlightened that they will approve and understand that this is the natural course of events.  Anyone who disapproves is labelled a "right wing conspiracy theorist" or otherwise denigrated.  Most of the managerial elites who have been processed through elite universities have been pretty well indoctrinated by elite social class expectations and assumptions, to understand and accept that the nation state is on the way out, in favor of "world governance".  I have actually heard the term "new world order" used approvingly on NPR more than once as if, of course educated and enlightened people understand that it's a done deal, and we assume you are all on board.

Unfortunately for them, awareness is growing at an entirely unacceptable rate because of uncontrolled information flow.

Basil Fishbone
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on October 07, 2004, 04:47:02 pm
I don't think it is unfortunate for them.
The same means which enable us to express opposition enable them to spread their propoganda.  The thing is, most people want it.  The neighbors who snitch on people for having anti-government bumper stickers, the teeming hordes who think guns are inherently evil...these are not shady politicians in smoky back rooms doing sinister deals under the table, they are the mainstream.  It's so out in the open that it's the dominant feature on the landscape.  Watch MTV, VH1, Comedy Central.  Read Rolling Stone or Time magazine.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 07, 2004, 05:52:45 pm
It seems a goodly number of the constitution writers were involved with big money. Particularly Hamilton and a New York group. Details have long since vanished from my pourous skull. I'll see what I can dig up and watch for the flow twixt Boston and NY.

Some evidence is more likely to be social. They've been an intermarrying, dynastic group. For instance, J.P married into the New York Dutch big money. There just a "Who was who" will be helpful (and quite a bit of research time). I'll post details of what I work on at
The Eeecks! Files: The Great American Conspiracy (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TheEeecksFiles).

Others are welcome if they get the urge.

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 08, 2004, 07:55:43 pm
Constitutional Convention Delegates (55)

Lawyers 45%
Politicians 31%

Occupation with Public Security Interests, Lending and Investments, or Real Estate & Land Speculation 78%

Graduates of Yale, Harvard, or Princeton 38%

- - -

But, why expect anything different?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lark on October 11, 2004, 09:57:06 am
Conspiracy implies that it is rogue elements at work,

I dont think it is and I dont think anyone who has read things like the Project for a New American Century, think that's the proper title, can have any doubt, if your declared aims are American state domination of all fields, cloaked in the flag and old time religion, then I dont think there is any level or low that you wont stoop to,

it's ironic, you guys used to be so sharp to this kind of thing, subverting anglo world hegemony long after the revolution but then when you all became to hegemons everything changed, oh well, power corrupts,

Lark
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on October 11, 2004, 10:17:59 am
Quote
Conspiracy implies that it is rogue elements at work,
Then I guess we are the conspiracy.  Call it the Liberty Conspiracy.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Alton Speers on October 11, 2004, 10:29:00 am
Quote
Quote
Conspiracy implies that it is rogue elements at work,
Then I guess we are the conspiracy.  Call it the Liberty Conspiracy.
Why... you rogue! :D

Alton
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 11, 2004, 12:42:49 pm

 
 
Quote
Conspiracy implies that it is rogue elements at work,

 
Yes, at this time I agree that "conspiracy" denotes/connotes rogue elements at work.
 
Quote
I dont think it is and I dont think anyone who has read things like the Project for a New American Century, think that's the proper title, can have any doubt, if your declared aims are American state domination of all fields, cloaked in the flag and old time religion, then I dont think there is any level or low that you wont stoop to,

 
Okay, please allow me to make my perspective, my "hypothesis" clear. I have read a noteworthy portion of the PNAC's website, and I've read Zbigniew Brzezinski's "The Grand Chessboard", among other readings. My hypothesis inludes the *possibility* that a few "elite" manipulators have quietly, clandestinely, taken over the U.S. government and are using that government, in conjunction with the United Nations, to establish a global Empire. My hypothesis also includes the idea that to accomplish this the elite few who've stolen our government are deliberately removing our Constitution and Bill of Rights, to accomplish what Brzezinski calls the fashioning of "a consensus on matters of U.S. foreign policy". [my paraphrase from his book.] Please understand that the current Federal government is NOT reflecting the interests, desires, wishes, or needs of the American people, that our government is out of the people's control, and that all "foreign policy" of the past Century has been influenced by men who have a common plan, a conspiracy if you will, a secret agenda. The purpose of this thread is to look into that and related items of interest.
 
 
Quote
it's ironic, you guys used to be so sharp to this kind of thing, subverting anglo world hegemony long after the revolution but then when you all became to hegemons everything changed, oh well, power corrupts,

 
The only thing I'm trying to subvert is dishonesty, secrecy, falsehood, deception, and the lies of the U.S. Federal government. Truth be known, I suspect, we're going to learn that British and German financiers have done more subverting of the American experience than  Americans have to British hegemony. I look forward to getting into all this with you and others on this thread.  
 
My basic position is that "government" itself is not good for individual liberty.  
 
I have spent some hours composing posts for this thread, but none of them are at this time ready to post-up here. They will be ready to post shortly. My apologies for taking too much time.
 
Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 11, 2004, 12:54:15 pm
If you might have time, Elias, I would appreciate a short list (~10) of players in the 1600-1900 range if you could quickly/easily post such a list.

~1900: Morgan, Rockefeller, Dupont, other names already well known-- so I suppose I might be looking for earlier actors on this stage. Sorry I'm so vague, but you might still be able to target what I'm looking for.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Pitchfork on October 11, 2004, 03:40:02 pm
The most dangerous conspiracies, are those that aren't even considered too be conspiracies.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Loxosceles_Reclusa on October 11, 2004, 04:51:31 pm

 I don't believe the Bush administration, for all its faults, was in any way complicit in the September 11 hijackings/attacks.

 That being said, I do get annoyed when people use the word "conspiracy" to mean something imaginary, like a superstion.

 If there is no such thing as a conspiracy, then somebody better let about 40-some-odd percent of all the convicts out of prison, since about 40-some-odd percent of them are in prison for one or another sort of *conspiracy."

 Lox
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: EconGeek on October 12, 2004, 02:44:46 am


I am certain that the bush administration was complicit-- they were clearly negligent.

I suspect that they were involved and deliberately wanted to see it happen.

But I do not believe that this is the case.


Let me restate that with emphasis:

I am <b>certain</b> that the bush administration was complicit-- they were clearly negligent.

I <b>suspect</b> that they were involved and deliberately wanted to see it happen.

But I do not <b>believe</b> that this is the case.


I also do not <b>believe</b> that it is not the case.

This is the thing about conspiracy theories-- those debunking them, and those proposing them, often fail to keep track of the level what is being stated.  Asking a question implies no belief.  Expressing a suspicion doesn't either-- it merely indicates that you do not have sufficient evidence to believe it to be the case, but think that it might be, or think that it might even likely be, the case.

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 12, 2004, 03:19:34 am

Basil Fishbone has noted:
 
Quote
It's been said the Constitution amounted to a coup against the Articles of Confederation on the part of the Federalists. Hamilton and his cronies. What they were working toward was an imposition of the British mercantilist economic system on American soil. This became a decades-long attempt to engineer this transformation away from Jeffersonian ideals, throughout the first half of the 1800s, by people such as John Quincy Adams, Henry Clay, and Abraham Lincoln. I wouldn't be surprised if advocates of Clay's "American System" of high tariffs, and "internal improvements" (subsidies to private canal, road and railroad companies) had links to the Tory banking interests Elias mentioned. (Any info on this, Elias?)

 
Brother Fishbone, you've got a very fine mind, and your insightful view of things commands my respect and gratitude. I don't know beans about American history --- wish I did. I'm just another dumbassed dude from down South who was too busy livin' the good life to worry about the details of how our beloved America came to be. Now I'm thirsty to know, because right here in our America we are being oppressed by a mechanism put in place to control us, and I want to know who is managing that process, how they're doing it, where the money goes, and a few other questions. I figure that if I can find out the why, and the how, and the who (or the what), is managing the nation's governance and policy I can then know what to do about it. And in my curiosity, as I explore the roots of our present society, culture, and sovereignty, there arises a swelling parade of coincidences which only serve to tease my curiosity to a greater and expanding intensity.
 
So I was amazed to find out somewhat late in life that British banking interests were active in this new country immediately after the Revolution, and that they primarily operated within the network of New England Tory and Loyalist families ("Houses", as I like to call them). I discovered about the Opium Wars with China and England, and the roles played by New England loyalist businesses such as the Russell Company which I mentioned above. It floored me to learn that the fortunes which funded the Ivy League came through families who did not even try to hide their sources. They were opium smugglers for British banking interests, operating fleets of ships carrying opium into Shanghai and Canton.  
 
Anyway, in reading your post above I realized that I'm fairly uninformed about the first half of the 19th Century in America. I figure I want to find out about Henry Clay and Daniel Webster, among other interests. I'm presently reading Gore Vidal's "Burr", which is an informative novel about Aaron Burr's place in our new nation, and the book so far has included some good stuff on Hamilton and Washington as well, and I hope it provides me with more of a grasp of the post-Revolution era. (As it's taken me so long to make this reply to you, I now note that Junker has made a request which parallels your observations, so I'll be speaking to you as well when I reply to Junker.)
 
Basil Fishbone stated:
 
Quote
It seems clear there must be an inter-generational program to consolidate power in the hands of central government institutions and favored corporations. I know there is an enormous literature devoted to ferreting out the details. The problem is so pervasive and deep-rooted one wonders what it would take to return to Jeffersonian ideals, and even to eradicate all forms of coercive authority. Something like plowing the ground and sowing it with salt, I'm afraid.

 
Well, Fishbone, I am not ready to draw conclusions yet, hehehe. But I'm taking your first sentence to mean an "extra-generational" instead of "inter-generational" program. Not sure if that makes a difference, but it seems that we're looking at a tran-generational scheme, or program when we take on the foundations of today's infrastructure which runs the global market. One thing for sure, if there was a concerted effort to consolidate (or concentrate or centralize) power, we'll smell 'em out soon enough. Personally, I suspect there is. I don't think this sort of massive mechanism of globally-engineered aparatus could have possibly happened simply by chance. I'll leave off now and go visit with Junker in reply to his most recent post.
 
Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 12, 2004, 04:04:08 am
Quote
If you might have time, Elias, I would appreciate a short list (~10) of players in the 1600-1900 range if you could quickly/easily post such a list.

~1900: Morgan, Rockefeller, Dupont, other names already well known-- so I suppose I might be looking for earlier actors on this stage. Sorry I'm so vague, but you might still be able to target what I'm looking for.
Junker, you're a good-natured rascal. I'm betting you already knew that I'd immediately go to Chaitkin and Tarpley to dig up some data for your query, lol.  Thanks for the que. :)

Looking into the familial history relevant to the Russell Trust (Skull and Bones) at Yale University, with the good work of Chaitkin and Tarpley we find the following passages:

~

begin quoted passages from Chaitkin and Tarpley's "George H.W. Bush: The Unauthorized Biography":

Observers of Skull and Bones, apologists and critics alike, have accepted various deceptive notions about the order. There are two outstanding, among these falsehoods:
 
 1) that it is essentially an American group, an assembly of wealthy, elite ``patriots''; it is in fact, an agency for British Empire penetration and subversion of the American republic; and
 
 2) that it is somehow the unique center of conspiratorial control over the United States. This misconception is certainly understandable, given the rather astonishing number of powerful, historically important and grotesquely anti-human individuals, who have come out of Skull and Bones. But there are in fact congruent organizations at other Ivy League colleges, which reflect, as does Skull and Bones, the over-arching oligarchical power of several heavily intermarried financier families.
 
 The mistaken, speculative notions may be corrected by examining the history of Skull and Bones, viewed within the reality of the American Eastern Establishment.
 
 Skull and Bones--the Russell Trust Association--was first established among the class graduating from Yale in 1833. Its founder was William Huntington Russell of Middletown, Connecticut. The Russell family was the master of incalculable wealth derived from the largest U.S. criminal organization of the nineteenth century: Russell and Company, the great opium syndicate.
 
 There was at that time a deep suspicion of, and national revulsion against, freemasonry and secret organizations in the United States, fostered in particular by the anti-masonic writings of former U.S. President John Quincy Adams. Adams stressed that those who take oaths to politically powerful international secret societies cannot be depended on for loyalty to a democratic republic.
 
 But the Russells were protected as part of the multiply-intermarried grouping of families then ruling Connecticut (see accompanying chart). The blood-proud members of the Russell, Pierpont, Edwards, Burr, Griswold, Day, Alsop and Hubbard families were prominent in the pro- British party within the state. Many of their sons would be among the members chosen for the Skull and Bones Society over the years.
 
 The background to Skull and Bones is a story of Opium and Empire, and a bitter struggle for political control over the new U.S. republic.
 
 Samuel Russell, second cousin to Bones founder William H., established Russell and Company in 1823. Its business was to acquire opium from Turkey and smuggle it into China, where it was strictly prohibited, under the armed protection of the British Empire.
 
 The prior, predominant American gang in this field had been the syndicate created by Thomas Handasyd Perkins of Newburyport, Massachusetts, an aggregation of the self-styled ``blue bloods'' or Brahmins of Boston's north shore. Forced out of the lucrative African slave trade by U.S. law and Caribbean slave revolts, leaders of the Cabot, Lowell, Higginson, Forbes, Cushing and Sturgis families had married Perkins siblings and children. The Perkins opium syndicate made the fortune and established the power of these families. By the 1830s, the Russells had bought out the Perkins syndicate and made Connecticut the primary center of the U.S. opium racket. Massachusetts families (Coolidge, Sturgis, Forbes and Delano) joined Connecticut (Alsop) and New York (Low) smuggler-millionaires under the Russell auspices.
 
 ** Certain of the prominent Boston opium families, such as Cabot and Weld, did not affiliate directly with Russell, Connecticut and Yale, but were identified instead with Harvard.
 
 John Quincy Adams and other patriots had fought these men for a quarter century by the time the Russell Trust Association was set up with its open pirate emblem--Skull and Bones.
 
 With British ties of family, shipping and merchant banking, the old New England Tories had continued their hostility to American independence after the Revolutionary War of 1775-83. These pretended conservative patriots proclaimed Thomas Jefferson's 1801 presidential inauguration ``radical usurpation.''
 
 The Massachusetts Tories (``Essex Junto'') joined with Vice President Aaron Burr, Jr. (a member of the Connecticut Edwards and Pierpont families) and Burr's cousin and law partner Theodore Dwight, in political moves designed to break up the United States and return it to British allegiance.
 
 The U.S. nationalist leader, former Treasury Secretary Alexander Hamilton, exposed the plan in 1804. Burr shot him to death in a duel, then led a famous abortive conspiracy to form a new empire in the Southwest, with territory to be torn from the U.S.A. and Spanish Mexico. For the ``blue bloods,'' the romantic figure of Aaron Burr was ever afterwards the symbol of British feudal revenge against the American republic.
 
 The Connecticut Tory families hosted the infamous Hartford Convention in 1815, toward the end of the second war between the U.S. and Britain (the War of 1812). Their secessionist propaganda was rendered impotent by America's defensive military victory. This faction then retired from the open political arena, pursuing instead entirely private and covert alliances with the British Empire. The incestuously intermarried Massachusetts and Connecticut families associated themselves with the British East India Company in the criminal opium traffic into China. These families made increased profits as partners and surrogates for the British during the bloody 1839-42 Opium War, the race war of British forces against Chinese defenders.
 
 Samuel and William Huntington Russell were quiet, wary builders of their faction's power. An intimate colleague of opium gangster Samuel Russell wrote this about him:
 
 While he lived, no friend of his would venture to mention his name in print. While in China, he lived for about twenty-five years almost as a hermit, hardly known outside of his factory [the Canton warehouse compound] except by the chosen few who enjoyed his intimacy, and by his good friend, Hoqua [Chinese security director for the British East India Company], but studying commerce in its broadest sense, as well as its minutest details. Returning home with well-earned wealth he lived hospitably in the midst of his family, and a small circle of intimates. Scorning words and pretensions from the bottom of his heart, he was the truest and staunchest of friends; hating notoriety, he could always be absolutely counted on for every good work which did not involve publicity.
 
 The Russells' Skull and Bones Society was the most important of their domestic projects ``which did not involve publicity.''
 
 A police-blotter type review of Russell's organization will show why the secret order, though powerful, was not the unique organ of ``conspiracy'' for the U.S. Eastern Establishment. The following gentlemen were among Russells' partners:
 
 Augustine Heard (1785-1868): ship captain and pioneer U.S. opium smuggler.
 John Cleve Green (1800-75): married to Sarah Griswold; gave a fortune in opium profits to Princeton University, financing three Princeton buildings and four professorships; trustee of the Princeton Theological Seminary for 25 years.
 Abiel Abbott Low (1811-93): his opium fortune financed the construction of the Columbia University New York City campus; father of Columbia's president Seth Low.
 John Murray Forbes (1813-98): his opium millions financed the career of author Ralph Waldo Emerson, who married Forbes's daughter, and bankrolled the establishment of the Bell Telephone Company, whose first president was Forbes's son.
 Joseph Coolidge: his Augustine Heard agency got $10 million yearly as surrogates for the Scottish dope-runners Jardine Matheson during the fighting in China; his son organized the United Fruit Company; his grandson, Archibald Cary Coolidge, was the founding executive officer of the Anglo-Americans' Council on Foreign Relations.
 Warren Delano, Jr.: chief of Russell and Co. in Canton; grandfather of U.S. President Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
 Russell Sturgis: his grandson by the same name was chairman of the Baring Bank in England, financiers of the Far East opium trade.
 
 Such persons as John C. Green and A.A. Low, whose names adorn various buildings at Princeton and Columbia Universities, made little attempt to hide the criminal origin of their influential money. Similarly with the Cabots, the Higginsons and the Welds for Harvard. The secret groups at other colleges are analogous and closely related to Yale's Skull and Bones.

(ea snip)

Young South Carolinian Joseph Heatly Dulles, whose family bought their slaves with the money from contract-security work for the British conquerors in India, was in a previous secret Yale group, the ``Society of Brothers in Unity.'' At Yale Dulles worked with the Northern secessionists and attached himself to Daniel Lord; their two families clove together in the fashion of a gang. The Lords became powerful Anglo-American Wall Street lawyers, and J.H. Dulles's grandson was the father of Allen Dulles and John Foster Dulles.
 
(ea snip, with a note first: John Foster Dulles and his brother Allen Dulles, descended as they were from Skull and Bones roots, were the Wall Street bankers who ran liaison for the Harrimans, Walker, and Bush in their buildup of Hitler's Nazi party in Germany throughout the 1930s. Oddly, or coincidentally?, they helped Clark Clifford write the National Security Act of 1947 for President Truman, creating the CIA, the Black Budget, and the government's "right" to lie to the American people. Clark Clifford then went on to bring the infamous CIA drug-running, money-laundering, and illegal arms dealing Bank of Commerce and Credit International - BCCI - into America, which had ties to Bush family business interests, Kissinger and Associates, and all the usual suspects. Of course, John Foster Dulles went on to become Secretary of State, and Allen Dulles became head of CIA, until Kennedy fired his ass over the Bay of Pigs fiasco. Amazing!)

(continuing after my interjection)

Alphonso Taft was a Bonesman alongside William H. Russell in the Class of 1833. As U.S. Attorney General in 1876-77, Alphonso Taft helped organize the backroom settlement of the deadlocked 1876 presidential election. The bargain gave Rutherford B. Hayes the presidency (1877-81) and withdrew the U.S. troops from the South, where they had been enforcing blacks' rights.
 
 Alphonso's son, William Howard Taft (S&B 1878), was U.S. President from 1909 to 1913. President Taft's son, Robert Alphonso Taft (S&B 1910), was a leading U.S. Senator after World War II; his family's Anglo-Saxon racial/ancestral preoccupation was the disease which crippled Robert Taft's leadership of American nationalist ``conservatives.''
 
 Other pre-Civil War Bonesmen were:
 
 William M. Evarts (S&B 1837): Wall Street attorney for British and southern slaveowner projects, collaborator of Taft in the 1876 bargain, U.S. Secretary of State 1877-81;
 Morris R. Waite (S&B 1837): Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court 1874-88, whose rulings destroyed many rights of African- Americans gained in the Civil War; he helped his cohorts Taft and Evarts arrange the 1876 presidential settlement scheme to pull the rights- enforcing U.S. troops out of the South;
 Daniel Coit Gilman (S&B 1852): co-incorporator of the Russell Trust; founding president of Johns Hopkins University as a great center for the racialist eugenics movement;
 Andrew D. White (S&B 1853): founding president of Cornell University; psychic researcher; and diplomatic cohort of the Venetian, Russian and British oligarchies;
 Chauncey M. Depew (S&B 1856): general counsel for the Vanderbilt railroads, he helped the Harriman family to enter into high society.
 
 By about the mid-1880s, the Skull and Bones membership roster began to change from its earlier, often ``scholarly,'' coloration; the change reflected the degradation of American political and economic life by imperialist, neo-pagan and racialist ideology.
 
 Irving Fisher (S&B 1888) became the racialist high priest of the economics faculty (Yale professor 1896-1946), and a famous merchant of British Empire propaganda for free trade and reduction of the non-white population. Fisher was founding president of the American Eugenics Society under the financial largesse of Averell Harriman's mother.
 
 Gifford Pinchot (S&B 1889) invented the aristocrats' ``conservation'' movement. He was President Theodore Roosevelt's chief forester, substituting federal land-control in place of Abraham Lincoln's free-land-to-families farm creation program. Pinchot's British Empire activitism included the Psychical Research Society and his vice-presidency of the first International Eugenics Congress in 1912.
 
 Helping Pinchot initiate this century's racialist environmentalism were his cohorts George W. Woodruff (S&B 1889), Teddy Roosevelt's Assistant Attorney General and Acting Interior Secretary; and Henry Solon Graves (S&B 1892), chief U.S. forester 1910-20. Frederick E. Weyerhauser (S&B 1896), owner of vast tracts of American forest, was a follower of Pinchot's movement, while the Weyerhauser family were active collaborators of British-South African super-racist Cecil Rhodes. This family's friendship with President George Bush is a vital factor in the present environmentalist movement.
 
 With Henry L. Stimson (S&B 1888) we come to the Eastern Liberal Establishment which has ruled America during the twentieth century. Stimson was President Taft's Secretary of War (1911-13), and President Herbert Hoover's Secretary of State (1929-33). As Secretary of War (1940-45), this time under President Harry Truman, Stimson pressed Truman to drop the atomic bomb on the Japanese. This decision involved much more than merely ``pragmatic'' military considerations. These Anglophiles, up through George Bush, have opposed the American republic's tradition of alliance with national aspirations in Asia; and they worried that the invention of nuclear energy would too powerfully unsettle the world's toleration for poverty and misery. Both the U.S. and the Atom had better be dreaded, they thought.
 
 The present century owes much of its record of horrors to the influential Anglophile American families which came to dominate and employ the Skull and Bones Society as a political recruiting agency, particularly the Harrimans, Whitneys, Vanderbilts, Rockefellers and their lawyers, the Lords and Tafts and Bundys.
 
 The politically aggressive Guaranty Trust Company, run almost entirely by Skull and Bones initiates, was a financial vehicle of these families in the early 1900s. Guaranty Trust's support for the Bolshevik and Nazi revolutions overlapped the more intense endeavors in these fields by the Harrimans, George Walker and Prescott Bush a few blocks away, and in Berlin.
 
 Skull and Bones was dominated from 1913 onward by the circles of Averell Harriman. They displaced remaining traditionalists such as Douglas MacArthur from power in the United States.
 
 For George Bush, the Skull and Bones Society is more than simply the British, as opposed to the American, strategic tradition. It is merged in the family and personal network within which his whole life has been, in a sense, handed to him prepackaged.

end of quoted passages from "George H.W. Bush: The Unauthorized Biography" by Chaitkin and Tarpley

~
 
Entire article found here:

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=239&mode=mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

~

I am aware of some other sources. That newest book you've just purchased, "The Soong Dynasty" by Sterling Seagrave, Harper and Row, contains some good history on the Opium wars and what catalyzed them, i.e., British banking interests which sought to reclaim the outflow of silver from England to China over British importation of silk and tea from China. Also in your new book you'll enjoy learning about Julian Carr, the Methodist Mission Program, and Duke University, and the role each played in 20th Century Chinese revolutions. I'm very glad you got that book. Seagrave is a powerful source.

I hope this gets us started into connecting the dots between the families of banking, the Ivy League campuses, the secret societies, and the over-all template into which the inter-familial relationships in business and in social engineering mark the high points of American history, that part of history which the government schools today positively refuse to teach. Interesting, eh?

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 12, 2004, 04:46:07 am
Quote
I don't believe the Bush administration, for all its faults, was in any way complicit in the September 11 hijackings/attacks.

 
Well, Lox, I can't recall if you're a registered member at TMM, but if you are, you just got a group email announcing Michael Ruppert's new book, "Crossing The Rubicon". In case you didn't get that email, here's the link:

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/store/index.shtml (http://www.fromthewilderness.com/store/index.shtml)

In this book, Ruppert is accusing Dick Cheney of mass murder. From that page, we learn this much about what is in the book:

After two and a half years of research and writing, Ruppert said:

"In my new book I will be making several key points:

1. I will name Vice President Richard Cheney as the prime suspect in the mass murders of 9/11 and will establish that, not only was he a planner in the attacks, but also that on the day of the attacks he was running a completely separate Command, Control and Communications system which was superceding any orders being issued by the FAA, the Pentagon, or the White House Situation Room;

2. I will establish conclusively that in May of 2001, by presidential order, Richard Cheney was put in direct command and control of all wargame and field exercise training and scheduling through several agencies, especially FEMA. This also extended to all of the conflicting and overlapping NORAD drills -- some involving hijack simulations -- taking place on that day.

3. I will also demonstrate that the TRIPOD II exercise being set up on Sept. 10th in Manhattan was directly connected to Cheney's role in the above.
 
 4. I will also prove conclusively that a number of public officials, at the national and New York City levels, including then-Mayor Rudolph Giuliani, were aware that flight 175 was en route to lower Manhattan for 20 minutes and did nothing to order the evacuation of, or warn the occupants of the South Tower. One military officer was forced to leave his post in the middle of the attacks and place a private call to his brother - who worked at the WTC - warning him to get out. That was because no other part of the system was taking action.

5. I will also show that the Israeli and British governments acted as partners with the highest levels of the American government to help in the preparation and, very possibly, the actual execution of the attacks."

~

That's pretty powerful-sounding stuff, eh? But Ruppert is a former LAPD narcotics detective with DEA training. He is a man who knows how to dig out the hidden stuff. I'm not saying he is god, and in fact I'm presently involved in arguing his case with people at WingTV and over at LetsRoll!911dot com, who are quite hot at him. Seems he's not the nicest player at the table. But I've personally found his resources to be very good, and I use his film here all the time. There is a debate ongoing over at TMM's front page right now. http://www.thementalmilitia.org (http://www.thementalmilitia.org)

Next thing I'd bring up for your perusal is the amazing evidence which shows conclusively that no commercial airliner hit the Pentagon on the morning of 911. That is brought to us by the "Power Hour", a radio talk show in Pennslyvania.

http://www.thepowerhour.com/press_release/press10.htm (http://www.thepowerhour.com/press_release/press10.htm)

When we put this film together with Ruppert's revelations about Cheney's playroom on the morning of 911, and we realize what it means that Cheney was in charge of five, count 'em, five wargames which effectively disabled the FAA, NORAD, the Pentagon's Air Defense sections, certain local defense systems, and other important elements within this nation's air defense system, we are given reason for pause in our beliefs. Couple all that with the uncanny intuition of bin Laden and al Qaeda to launch their attacks on that very same morning, and one has to ask: *If* bin Laden knew the defense system would be disabled on that morning, *how* did he know that? And the next question is: Did bin Laden even know it? But after watching closely  von Kleist's amazing footage of the flights hitting the twin towers, I am left with serious doubts that al Qaeda was even involved at all, other than to have furnished unwittingly the nineteen suspects. I think that the truth movement in America right now is onto something positively HUGE. I think Cheney did it. If you want to become as crazy as me, just buy Crossing The Rubicon and von Kleist's film, "911 In Plane Site". Damn, what a world we've inherited! :)

Thanks for your post,

Elias
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 12, 2004, 01:21:57 pm
Continuing my look at the constitutional convention delegates...

of the first 15 of 55 I've looked up...


The average number of years feeding at the public trough: 22

The least: 11 years

The most: 35 years


More to come as I get the info on these hard-working, colonial patriots.

Oh, and so far, none died in the Revolutionary War.
But, one was accused of treason.

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 12, 2004, 07:58:49 pm
Nice footwork, Junker.

Sometime, if you get a chance, I would love to see a list of the 55 Constitutional delegates' names, or a link to the proper site which features the men.

Salute!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Plinker-MS on October 12, 2004, 10:42:31 pm
Quote
Oh, and so far, none died in the Revolutionary War.
 
Uh...  how the hell could they do *that*?

Anybody who died in the Revolutionary War (1775ish - ?) could not be around during the Constitional Convention (1789)

Or are you referring to the War of 1812?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ladylearning on October 12, 2004, 10:52:32 pm
Quote
Quote
Oh, and so far, none died in the Revolutionary War.
 
Anybody who died in the Revolutionary War (1775ish - ?) could not be around during the Constitional Convention (1789)

 
Ummm, not sure, but i kinda think that was his point  :huh:

LL
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 12, 2004, 11:42:14 pm
In some sense, yeah, but I also had an internal time warp. I was tracking what they did in the revolution and, well... you know, screwed up my time frames. In any case...served as a lt col in Phil defense but saw no action...served on the pay committee...made maps for George...made capt while serving under his father the general...

so not killed...and not very threatened either.

Sorry about the, my, confusion, Plink.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 12, 2004, 11:45:15 pm
Elias,

got easily both, the shorter for here is

http://teachingamericanhistory.org/convent...tion/delegates/ (http://teachingamericanhistory.org/convention/delegates/)

Individual Biographies of the Delegates to the Constitutional Convention by Gordon Lloyd and Jeff Sammon

Also, of course, my conspiracy wiki
http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Co...itutionCongress (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConstitutionCongress)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 13, 2004, 08:33:18 am
Nice work, Junker;

I'll enjoy reading the bios of the delegates; perhaps there will be some connections to some family names which may later prove to have import.

And btw, I've probably not told you, but I really like this idea of Wiki. Wiki is the potential of the Internet, imo.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 13, 2004, 09:53:47 am
Wikis -- I think so too. I work at Bill St. Clair's AnCapWiki (http://www.billstclair.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?AnCapWiki), Bill's hosted Open Source FAQ (http://www.billstclair.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OpenSourceFAQ), and my own Conspiracy Wiki (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TheEeecksFiles) and Firefly Dictionary Wiki (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TheFireflyDictionary). Then there is the Great Work of WikipediA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page), the Free Encyclopedia, both free in cost and free in attitude. Most of The Firefly Dictionary could prolly just link to it.

They are easy to edit and provide a nice interface for group work. I think Post-Nuke has a wiki built in so you could do your own at TMM (http://www.thementalmilitia.org). And the wiki that Bill and now I use is very easy to install-- edit one line in the program text file, create one sub-diectory for its use, and copy the one program file (158KB) to "cgi-bin". There are more options in the program file if one wishes to do more, but all the base options work fine. I was thinking that FIJA (http://fija.org) might profitably use it too.

Btw, my Conspiracy Wiki is called The Eeecks! Files. And Eeecks is the German pronunciation of 'X'. So thus, also "The X Files", a double entendre, s'il vous plait.  :)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 13, 2004, 10:14:02 am
Also, Brother Fishbone's:
 
Quote
It's been said the Constitution amounted to a coup against the Articles of Confederation on the part of the Federalists. Hamilton and his cronies. What they were working toward was an imposition of the British mercantilist economic system on American soil.

is, I think, a bit too sterile a description. "imposition of the British mercantilist economic system" sounds like an exercise in political-economic theory. I suggest that they noted the king's perogative to grant monopoly to his friends and they wanted to be able to manipulate and acquire the same from the US. I.e., they were thieves looking for booty. That is not to criticize Basil, but to emphasize a thief is a thief by any other name and stinks no matter what.

Too often I think the perfidity of the thieves is made bland by choice of words. As I read through the biographies of the constitutional congress delegates, all I see are the fat and lazy going for a free ride and not all too concerned about founding a new nation of prosperity and freedom.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 13, 2004, 11:35:28 am
Quote
Also, Brother Fishbone's:
 
Quote
It's been said the Constitution amounted to a coup against the Articles of Confederation on the part of the Federalists. Hamilton and his cronies. What they were working toward was an imposition of the British mercantilist economic system on American soil.

is, I think, a bit too sterile a description. "imposition of the British mercantilist economic system" sounds like an exercise in political-economic theory. I suggest that they noted the king's perogative to grant monopoly to his friends and they wanted to be able to manipulate and acquire the same from the US. I.e., they were thieves looking for booty. That is not to criticize Basil, but to emphasize a thief is a thief by any other name and stinks no matter what.

Too often I think the perfidity of the thieves is made bland by choice of words. As I read through the biographies of the constitutional congress delegates, all I see are the fat and lazy going for a free ride and not all too concerned about founding a new nation of prosperity and freedom.
Yes, you're correct, imo, regarding the motives of the delegates, who doubtless could smell the gravy cooking in the kitchen before the house was even built.

But about Basil Fishbone's choice/selection of words, that is one of the things I like most about him. He is the perfect gentleman, so far as totally-committed revolutionaries go. :) Personally, I had no difficulty reading into his phraseology the true color of what was going down back then, but I can see how you might anticipate that some readers might glaze it over due to Basil's word selection.

Ah, mayhaps that is why all of us together, so many voices coming together here, produce a greater and more insightful view on so many liberty-related topics. Variety among individuals seems to be quite in order, eh? I salute you both! :)

But now I'm out of here so I can get more written about the world's greatest conspiracy theory....

Back soon!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lark on October 14, 2004, 07:20:56 am
Quote
Okay, please allow me to make my perspective, my "hypothesis" clear. I have read a noteworthy portion of the PNAC's website, and I've read Zbigniew Brzezinski's "The Grand Chessboard", among other readings. My hypothesis inludes the *possibility* that a few "elite" manipulators have quietly, clandestinely, taken over the U.S. government and are using that government, in conjunction with the United Nations, to establish a global Empire. My hypothesis also includes the idea that to accomplish this the elite few who've stolen our government are deliberately removing our Constitution and Bill of Rights, to accomplish what Brzezinski calls the fashioning of "a consensus on matters of U.S. foreign policy". [my paraphrase from his book.] Please understand that the current Federal government is NOT reflecting the interests, desires, wishes, or needs of the American people, that our government is out of the people's control, and that all "foreign policy" of the past Century has been influenced by men who have a common plan, a conspiracy if you will, a secret agenda. The purpose of this thread is to look into that and related items of interest.

I dont think it is an elite, its business as usual/what's to be expected from institutions of this kind, I dont think it is covert either and I very, very much doubt that the UN has anything at all to do with it, for instance, in the UK the Blairites are now saying that part of the reason they joined in the continuing war in iraq was inorder to prevent a total humiliation of the UN resulting in a League of Nations style collapse of world governance,

I dont see why the UN keeps cropping up in conspiracy theories, its especially popular in American conspiracy theories and American power features in the same way in some european conspiracy theories, more convincingly I think but then I am European and would say that wouldnt I,

I think the consensus on foreign policy has existed for a long, long time, at least from the time of the first war and pre-dating the Russian revolution at least, when I see conservative rallies in the US, like Arnie's electoral campaign, the people who talk to the cameras complain about "the red menace" and "commies everywhere", it's just the perpetuation of the cold war, even though American was supposed to have "won" that one,

the consensus on domestic policy and economic policy is at least as interesting, I think it existed from before Jimmy Carter was elected and would date it from the time when southern evangelists began accumulating political clout, no one questions business boards, big capital, the banks, border skipping corporations etc. now but they sure dont like unions, temps, itinerant workers etc. not to say anything of immigration,

What about the dollar standard and the masonic bank notes? There's intent to control the money system if ever there was any, the oil economy? Iraq was going to adopt the Euro for oil trading before it was invaded and Sudan, Iran etc. would have followed suit making the Euro the dominant trade currency and breaking the control of the money system by anglo-american banks,

Lark
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 14, 2004, 07:49:54 am
Elias,

Interesting, S&B back to 1833. Any idea how much the S&B founder was worth? Before I'd begun to track old big money, but the Boston crew didn't show up much. Prolly the opium and lack of publicity. The typical big money list begins with J.P.Morgan as 1 and Gates as 2. I'll have to continue that search and fill in as I can.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Alton Speers on October 14, 2004, 08:11:12 am
Lark,

How about some links to these European conspiracy theories? I think a different perspective would be interesting.

Also,
Quote
I dont think it is an elite, its business as usual/what's to be expected from institutions of this kind, I dont think it is covert either and I very, very much doubt that the UN has anything at all to do with it, for instance, in the UK the Blairites are now saying that part of the reason they joined in the continuing war in iraq was inorder to prevent a total humiliation of the UN resulting in a League of Nations style collapse of world governance,

I dont see why the UN keeps cropping up in conspiracy theories, its especially popular in American conspiracy theories and American power features in the same way in some european conspiracy theories, more convincingly I think but then I am European and would say that wouldnt I,

I think I would tend to agree with you here on the prominence of the UN. In a more global perspective the existence and function of the UN seems to be more of a diversionary tactic than anything else. It seems to also serve as a place to dump off political busybodies and political hangers-on, people who are without a clue as to the true operation of the world. Kind of like the kids play area at a McDonald's.

Alton

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 14, 2004, 09:53:12 pm
Major (& rich) Skull & Bones Families

Whitney - 1635, Watertown, Mass.
Wadsworth - 1632, Newton, Mass.
Payne - Standard Oil
Perkins - 1631, Boston, Mass.
Lord - 1635, Cambridge, Mass.
Davison - J.P. Morgan
Phelps - 1630, Dorchester, Mass.
Gilman - 1638, Hingham, Mass.
Weyerhaeuser - lumber
Bundy - 1635, Boston, Mass.
Harriman - trains
Pillsbury - food
Taft - 1679, Braintree, Mass.
Rockefeller - Standard Oil
Sloane - trade
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 16, 2004, 04:42:07 am
And the Skull & Bones Membership List (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?MembershipList), since 1833, has grown kinda large,
and may certainly be indicative of...no! not that!...yes, it's a


Conspiracy!

Maybe not as serious as twinkies, but then again, who really knows?
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on October 16, 2004, 07:11:09 am
Nothing is as serious as twinkies.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 16, 2004, 12:13:08 pm
Quote
And the Skull & Bones Membership List (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?MembershipList), since 1833, has grown kinda large,
and may certainly be indicative of...no! not that!...yes, it's a


Conspiracy!

Maybe not as serious as twinkies, but then again, who really knows?
Nice going, Junker.

As readers who've read this thread from the start know, we're going to be looking into government complicity in the events of the WTC bombing in 1993, the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995, and the events of 9/11, 2001. But it is an excellent approach to begin with the Tory families, the Loyalists who were in bed with the King of England during and after the American Revolution. From there we can trace the complicity into Skull and Bones, then into the heart of American governance down through the years, leading finally to Jekyll Island in 1910 and the National Security Act of 1947, which finally cut America's throat and handed the corpse to British and German banking interests. There is this:

 
~
 
 
 
For some time I have been disturbed by the way [the] CIA has been diverted from its original assignment. It has become an operational arm and at times a policy-making arm of the Government. This has led to trouble and may have compounded our difficulties in several explosive areas.
 
I never had any thought when I set up the CIA that it would be injected into peacetime cloak and dagger operations. Some of the complications and embarrassments that I think we have experienced are in part attributable to the fact that this quiet intelligence arm of the President has been so removed from its intended role that it is being interpreted as a symbol of sinister and mysterious foreign intrigue --- and a subject for Cold War enemy propaganda.
 
With all the nonsense put out by Communist propaganda about "Yankee imperialism", "exploitive capitalism", "war-mongering", "monopolists" in their name-calling assault on the West, the last thing we needed was for the CIA to be seized upon as something akin to a subverting influence in the affairs of other people.
 
But there are now some searching questions that need to be answered. I, therefore, would like to see the CIA be restored to its original assignment as the intelligence arm of the President, and whatever else it can properly perform in that special field, and that its operational duties be terminated or properly used elsewhere.
 
We have grown up as a nation, respected for our free institutions and for our ability to maintain a free and open society. There is something about the way the CIA has been functioning that is casting a shadow over our historical position, and I feel that we need to correct it.
 
Harry S. Truman, December 22, 1963
 
~
 
Above quote by Truman taken from the book, "The Crimes of Patriots" by Jonathan Kwitny, 1987; W.W. Norton & Company, New York and London; ISBN: 0-393-02387-7. Published simultaneously in Canada by Penguin Books Canada Ltd, Markham, Ontario L3R 1B4.

~

Perhaps some things to add to your list....

F. Trubee Davison (Skull and Bones '18), was Director of Personnel at the CIA in the early years. Some of the other Bonesmen connected with the "intelligence community" are:  
 
 
William Sloane Coffin, Jr. ('49);  
 V. Van Dine ('49);  
 James Buckley ('44);  
 Bill Buckley ('50);  
 Hugh Cunnigham ('34);  
 Hugh Wilson;  
 Reuben Holden;  
 Charles R. Walker; "Yale's unofficial Secretary of War,"  
 Robert D. French ('10);  
 Archibald MacLiesh ('15);  
 Dino Pionzio ('50), CIA Deptuy Chief of Station during Allende overthrow;  
 William and McGeorge Bundy;  
 Richard A. Moore ('3?);  
 Senator David Boren ('63);  
 Senator John Kerry;  
 and of course George Bush. Bush "tapped" Coffin, who, tapped Buckley.  
 Henry Luce ('20), Time-Life;  
 John Thomas Daniels, founder Archer Daniels Midland;  
 Gifford Pinchot ('89);  
 President Theodore Roosevelt's chief forester, Frederick E. Weyerhaeuser ('96);  
 Harold Stanley ('08),  founder Morgan Stanley, investment banker;  
 Alfred Cowles ('13), Cowles Communication,  
 Henry P. Davison ('20), senior partner Morgan Guaranty Trust;  
 Thomas Cochran ('04)   Morgan partner;  
 Senator John Heinz;  
 Pierre Jay ('92), first chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York;  
 George Herbert Walker, Jr. ('27), financier and co-founder of the NY Mets;  (Our President's grandfather)
 Artemus Gates ('18), President of New York Trust Company, Union Pacific, TIME, Boeing Company;  
 William Draper III, the Defense Department, UN and Import-Export Bank;  
 Dean Witter, Jr., investment banker;  
 Senator Jonathan Bingham;  
 Potter Stewart ('36), Supreme Court Justice;  
 Senator John Chaffe;  
 Harry Payne Whitney ('94), married Gertrude Vanderbilt, investment banker;  
 Russell W. Davenport ('23), editor Fortune Magazine, created Fortune 500 list;  
 van G. Galbraith, Ambassador to France and Managing Director of Morgan Stanley;  
 Judge John Steadman, the Court of Appeals in the District of Columbia;  
 Richard Gow ('55), president Zapata Oil (George Bush's company);  [That is: George H.W. Bush]
 Amory Howe Bradford ('34), married Carol Warburg Rothschild and was general manager for the New York Times ;  
 C. E. Lord ('49), Comptroller of the Currency;  
 Winston Lord ('59), Chairman of CFR, Ambassador to China and a Clinton assistant Secretary of State;  
 John Lilley, ambassador to China.

~

This is some potent shit. Pregnant with possibility, eh?

Looking back up four lines on that list to "Amory Howe Bradford", we see he married Carol Warburg Rothschild. Damn! I did not know there was any one person, ever, bearing both the Warburg and the Rothschild names! Amazing!

However, we do know that England and Germany play host to the Rothschilds and Warburgs evenly, that those Houses use both countries at their whim, same as they now use the Federal Reserve System, Inc. here in the good ol' USofA.

Again, Junker, nice work. The Wiki is coming along just fine.

Just wait until we get to the CFR and its control over the American media! :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 16, 2004, 12:23:38 pm
Quote
Nothing is as serious as twinkies.
Of course, PSM! Twinkies Rule!

However, twinkies aside, you may enjoy looking into this page....

http://www.policestate21.com/ (http://www.policestate21.com/)

I've just picked up 15 copies of this film to pass around to friends and neighbors out here. It's the finest thing I've seen yet. I've got more to share, after we read that page and buy the film and view it a couple of times. :)

This one is a "must see".

Salute!
Elias

PS: Ragnar, your copy will be in next week's mail. :)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 16, 2004, 12:46:48 pm
---
William Huntington Russell ('33) studied in Germany from 1831-32. When Russell returned to Yale in 1832, he formed a senior society. According to information acquired from a break-in to the Skull and Bones meeting hall in 1876, "Bones is a chapter of a corps in a German University.... General Russell, its founder, was in Germany before his Senior Year and formed a warm friendship with a leading member of a German society. He brought back with him to college, authority to found a chapter here."
---

So, who, what, or where are the German/European chapters?

---
The secretive Order of Skull and Bones exists only at Yale. Fifteen juniors are "tapped" each year by the seniors to be initiated into next year's group. Some say each initiate is given $15,000...
---

Now this thing started in 1833. So from 1833 to 1932, $15,000 is equivalent to ~1,500,000 of today's dollars. That's a bit of an allowance. Curious, no?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 16, 2004, 07:06:20 pm
I've read that what you say is true, that W.H. Russell connected S and B to a German school.

Note that the Warburgs of Germany and the Rothschilds of England/Germany work hand in hand. Both Houses were present at Jekyll Island.

Note aside: the British firm, Brown and Co., has operated in this country since prior to the Civil War. I believe it was merged with Harriman's operation, making "Brown Brothers Harriman". These people included George Herbert Walker, Averell Harriman, and Prescott Bush and John Foster Dulles and Allen Dulles. The two Dulles brothers were Wall Street lawyers who managed Bush's finances with Germany while bring Hitler to power for British and Wall Street powers. All of them, excepting possibly G.H. Walker, about whom I'll have to research, have ancestral roots, direct or indirect,  to Skull and Bones.

Skull and Bones does indeed grant the fifteen graduates each year a "generous" financial "stipend", or cash gift, with which to assist the graduates in starting their careers.

The Skull and Bonesman presently sitting in our White House is the very person who put Cheney in charge of F_ I _ V _ E  wargame drills for the morning of 911. His opponent is also Skull and Bones. The globalizing socialist bankers can't lose, no matter which one of the candidates wins. Bush will lead us into deeper levels of fascism; Kerry will lead us into the UN. Both will cost America her sovereignty as a nation. Dissent will be surpressed by the Justice Department, or worse. There will be another "terrorist" event either way, for both of them carry the agenda of the GSBs forward, and one more "terrorist event" is needed to take down the Constitution, suspend it, declare martial law, and establish their police state. Model Health Emergency Powers Act is a hint of what is to come. (Google that one, eh?)

More laters,

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 16, 2004, 07:38:34 pm
Google? Ahh, yes...

What You Need to Know About The Proposed Model State Emergency Health Powers Act in Your State

The terrorist attacks on New York City and Washington, D.C. on September 11, 2001, and the subsequent threats of biological warfare against U.S. citizens have prompted calls by public health officials to prepare for mass vaccination campaigns for anthrax and smallpox. National vaccination programs targeting civilians, including children, are being proposed in model state legislation that would give public health officials the power to use the state militia to enforce vaccination during state-declared health emergencies.

- - -

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul61.html (http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul61.html)

Oppose the New Homeland Security Bureaucracy!
by Rep. Ron Paul, MD

"HR 5710 also expands the federal police state by allowing the attorney general to authorize federal agency inspectors general and their agents to carry firearms and make warrantless arrests."
- - -

Now multiple states have passed legislation based on the Model Health Emergency Powers Act which includes provisions for quarantining and detaining American civilians.

- - -

...Virginia passed Chapter Law No. 18, which provides hospitals immunity for smallpox vaccine administration under the smallpox preparedness program for certain but shall not be limited to: (i) employees of a health care provider referenced in subdivision 3, (ii) independent contractors with a health care provider referenced in subdivision 3, (iii) persons who have practice privileges in a hospital, (iv) persons who have agreed to be on call in an emergency room, (v) persons who otherwise regularly deliver prehospital care to patients admitted to a hospital, and (vi) first responders. [Why? So, these won't be killed by an 'odd' vaccine batch?]
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 16, 2004, 08:23:27 pm
2
Quote
...
and the subsequent threats of biological warfare against U.S. citizens have prompted calls by public health officials to prepare for mass vaccination campaigns for anthrax and smallpox
+

2
Quote
from the Micro Chip  (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/clairefiles/index.php?act=ST&f=4&t=2394) thread: OMG, y'all. As I read this article, it seems that a simple vaccination-shot-like procedure is all it takes to get a chip into you.

= 4?  :blink:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on October 16, 2004, 08:58:03 pm
Quote
2 QUOTE (Junker @ Oct 16 2004, 08:38 PM)
...
and the subsequent threats of biological warfare against U.S. citizens have prompted calls by public health officials to prepare for mass vaccination campaigns for anthrax and smallpox

+

2
QUOTE (Lightning @ Oct 13 2004, 01:53 PM)
from the Micro Chip thread: OMG, y'all. As I read this article, it seems that a simple vaccination-shot-like procedure is all it takes to get a chip into you.


= 4? 

Exactly what I was thinking, RD.   :ph34r:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 17, 2004, 12:42:33 am
Quote
Quote
2 QUOTE (Junker @ Oct 16 2004, 08:38 PM)
...
and the subsequent threats of biological warfare against U.S. citizens have prompted calls by public health officials to prepare for mass vaccination campaigns for anthrax and smallpox

+

2
QUOTE (Lightning @ Oct 13 2004, 01:53 PM)
from the Micro Chip thread: OMG, y'all. As I read this article, it seems that a simple vaccination-shot-like procedure is all it takes to get a chip into you.


= 4? 

Exactly what I was thinking, RD.   :ph34r:
Heh! Yer both prolly right, I'd guess.  ;)

An association with which to verify your addition, Ragnar --- What's the CFR-controlled media doing right now here in the USA?

Answer: Among a zillion other official agendas, the media is pumping out all over the place the memes with which to build a mass desire for shots.  The media is harping ceaselessly that *everybody* WANTS a flu shot, but that only government-sanctioned recipients may have them. Story after story is harping on how long so many people have been standing in lines, waiting patiently in line to get their flu shots, with the sad sad result that so many of them have to be told that the vaccine is all gone, or worse, that they do not fit the health-profile composed by Fedgov for eligibility. LIke, "Oh master master please let me have a shot!" followed by "The LAW sayeth that thou art too young, strong, and healthy to get thy shot before the elderly and children get theirs, as is ajudged in moral supremacy by your fearless leaders in governmental seats of power."

I mean, it's so blatant, so pervasive, all over the news right now, in the papers, on the radio. It's everywhere all the time. Zillions of Americans want the flu shots but government has announced that there is a shortage so government must decide *who* may and *who* may not get the shots. This is driving the herd mentality of the pubilc consciousness bonkers, and the trusting people are falling for the subliminal message in it.

Nobody questions whether DARPA, who specializes in "air-borne bio/chem crowd-control delivery systems", is associated with those long lazy thin clouds of chemical trails with which Fedgov has been spraying our skies for several years now (while denying flat out that they're spraying anything, of course). Nobody wonders when they look up and see those horrid spray trails over their heads that their own damn government could be spraying flu virii over the nation.

Nobody is questioning just how it came to pass that something within the structure of government itself has somehow proclaimed itself to be the great provider of health, happiness, and vaccinations for every American whether they want to accept that blessing or not.  All that the masses are clamoring for now is to find out who's responsible for this unnaceptable shortage of vaccine, so that they can correct that oversight in time for next year's flu epidemics, so there can be enough for every man, woman, and child to have all the goddam shots they think they need.

The whole media blitz about flu shots is to condition the masses to trust the government when it comes to taking shots administered by the Government. Plain and simple. Two plus two.

How that scenario may fit into the overall hypothesis of this thread; whether it denotes a specific facet of an overall plan for mind control of the masses; how it reveals the power of the State now over personal-body concerns; how it reinforces the State's authority in the minds of the compliant citizenry..... all of it fits right in after reading that phony Report From Iron Mountain and then reading Brzezinski's "The Grand Chessboard" and then noticing that the Government has lied to the American people about who attacked us on 911. And why....

The CIA has been involved in mass-mind-control since back in the 1950s. Congress investigated it in the MKULTRA hearings. It's real, it happens, CIA is doing it. Again, we go back to the Harold Pratt house, noting Pratt's connections with Skull and Bones, and we note that the CFR and the CIA are in cahoots, with CFR being liaison between CIA and the national media. And now we have a perfect example in this flu shot scare, especially in light of the Model States Emergency Health Powers Act, eh?

Amazing.

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: byron on October 17, 2004, 01:01:56 am
All this talk about flu shots, shortages, and 2 things I have found interesting....

1) Bush, who has said that Canadian pharmacies must be avoided because of quality control issues? Well, he said earlier this week that he hoped that Canada could help us out with the flu shot shortages.

2) While Texans are standing in lines hoping to get a flu shot, the state made sure that all state prisoners were vaccinated. This I find very peculiar.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 17, 2004, 02:16:05 am
Quote
but that only government-sanctioned recipients may have them.
Heaven forbid we should let the market decide
Quote
Caught off-guard by a last-minute flu vaccine shortage, hospitals and health officials are grappling with a side-effect perhaps more virulent than the bug itself: price gouging.

Around the country, officials say some vaccine suppliers are trying to cash in on the flu shot shortage by hiking up prices for hospitals and pharmacies. A recent survey found that the vaccine is sometimes being offered for 10 times its original value.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Basil Fishbone on October 17, 2004, 11:51:21 am
No way would I get a flu shot.  They use a mercury preservative which contributes to Alzheimer's and autism.  Fits in nicely with government schooling.  More subtle ways to lobotomize the sheeple.  Basil

http://www.lewrockwell.com/miller/miller14.html (http://www.lewrockwell.com/miller/miller14.html)

"...An excellent review of thimerosal and autism, titled "Mercury in Medicine – Taking Unnecessary Risks," is to be found, of all places, in the Congressional Record. Prepared by its Subcommittee on Human Rights and Wellness, this report was presented to the Committee on Government Reform, chaired by Congressman Dan Burton (who has an autistic grandson). Congressional Record, May 21, 2003, E1011–E1030.

SafeMinds president, Lyn Redwood, presented testimony at a Congressional hearing held on September 8, 2004 that exposes malfeasance by the CDC and FDA related to thimerosal. It is titled "Truth Revealed: New Scientific Discoveries Regarding Mercury in Medicine and Autism" and is posted on their website, safeminds.org. See also this organization’s 84-page Report to Congress titled, "A Brief Analysis of Recent Efforts in Medical Mercury Induced Neurological and Autism Spectrum Disorders" (September 8, 2004). . . ."
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 17, 2004, 01:57:42 pm
To keep interest up in this thread, I'd like to depart from the ancient history we've been focusing upon by beginning to reply to Edison_Carter, who's private messages to me sparked the idea to take this topic onto the boards here.
 
Edison_Carter note to me:
 
Quote
Let's get into 9-11....
 
Were you of the opinion that the 4 airliners were 
controlled by remote control?

 
*Actually, it is my opinion at this time, (subject to change with the import of new info or new perspectives on existing info), that the four hijacked airliners were being controlled by "remote- control". I think that pilots executed the takeoffs of the four planes, but that at some point in flight the planes were commandeered and placed on auto-remote-control. It is also my opinion that a number of other U.S. military and/or other-sourced military aircraft, and even missiles, were aloft that morning and that some of them also were under remote control. I think that at least six, and probably more, aircraft in the air that morning were in flight under remote control, and that also there were other aircraft in the air which were not under remote control but which played a role in the events of 911.  
 
Dave von Kleist notes that the four "events" of the morning of 911 which involved aircraft diving into buildings and one going down in Pennslyvania, were four events which are most likely all married together as individual parts or features of one driving plot. I agree with von Kleist. I think all four of these events were married together by one over-riding plan or plot. Can you and I agree that the four events were connected? If so, then anyone involved in any one of the four events was also involved, either directly or indirectly, in all of the four events. That is an important point which I'd like to enter into the record here as we discuss this, and I humbly and happily note that it's von Kleist's expression, and that I'm simply one little dude out here who agrees with his logic on that question.
 
I think that it is possible that three of the remote-controlled aircraft *may have been* flown out over the Atlantic ocean (or somewhere else, like perhaps the great lakes) and ditched, the planes and their passengers sent to watery graves.  
 
The reason I suspect that could have happened begins to become clear when we notice that no 757 hit the Pentagon. Government says a 757 slammed into the Pentagon. I think the Fedgov is lying about that. And I think the major news media in this nation is also lying about that, covering-up for the Fedgov.  
 
That all sounds pretty bizarre, does it not? I mean, for a man to say that he suspects that elements within the Fedgov itself would have planned the hijacking of commercial airliners, the traumatic deaths of thousands of people, and the destruction of tall buildings in downtown New York City and a wing of the Pentagon is some far-fetched speculation at best, it would seem on the surface of things. Certainly, all the unquestioning little Americans running about with flags and stickers on their cars in support of Bush's approach to his War on Terror indicate that by and large the American public "believes" that a Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon. And *that* is exactly what the Fedgov wants people everywhere to believe.
 
But the premise of a "conspiracy" draws more gravity once we consider the "Northwoods Document", an article which cannot, imo, be disputed. I'm planning on bringing the Northwoods Document to this thread soon; thanks for being patient as I slowly unravel this stuff; for it's very inclusive of numerous related conceptualizations, each of which need to be laid in properly here before their true import can be seen in the greater portrait of my "conspiracy theory".  
 
Yes, that is what I think, that "remote-control" was a factor in 911, and I'm most certainly not the only one in this nation who thinks so. So let's look at it a little more closely.  
 
Let's begin by asking if a large plane can be flown by remote control. To begin to answer that question, I simply have to go back to 1967, the last calendar year in which I was on the ground in Viet Nam. I was with "C" Battery, 2nd LAAM Battalion, Fleet Marine Force Pacific (FMFPac), stationed just south of Chu Lai in I-Corps area. What the "LAAM" stands for is "Light Anti-Aircraft Missle". We had racks of LAAMs, and my outfit was in charge of maintaining missile-factor air defenses for the Chu Lai area. (Of course, there were no VC airforce planes for us to worry about, but the NVA up north did have some MIGs which in theory *could* have made it to Chu Lai, as Chu Lai was just a little over a hundred miles below the DMZ. But the truth is that my outfit never had to fire on an enemy aircraft while I was there. We did, however make "test drill" firings one day at a "Drone" aircraft which had been flown pilot-less over the South China Sea for the purpose of giving our missile-jocks a target for practice. (Embarrassing enough, 2nd LAAM Battalion couldn't hit the damn Drone, lol. Our missiles were HAWKs (Homing-All-The-Way-Killers), HAWK missiles which were launched from the ground; surface to air missiles. I've got photos of some of them which I took while there. They were painted Marine Corps green, yuk.) Anyway, on the day our outfit fired missiles at that Drone, we were assured that there was no pilot aboard that target aircraft, and I tend to believe that to this day.
 
Now I've not kept up with military stuff since back in the 1960s, but I'm aware that the Pentagon and the corporate defense-contractor community has done extensive research and development since 1967 which far surpasses the technology available in 1967. I have no doubt that large aircraft *can* be flown by remote control. Does anyone wish to deny that? If so, here is the place to do so.
 
We know that the four hijacked airliners came "from the factory" with remote-control devices which would activate at certain speeds, that the planes were equipped with remote control technology. Can we agree on that? If not, please let me know and I'll drag up the data for you and put it here. I'm leaving off the proof of that presently in the interest of time.
 
But as I said, some of the aircraft in the air that morning over the east-coast sector did have pilots and were *not* under remote-control.  
 
An example of a plane flying that morning which was not under remote control but instead was under the control of a pilot could be an F-16 from the 119th Fighter Wing, affectionately known as the "Happy Hooligans", on temporary assignment from North Dakota to Langley Air Force base in Virginia. The F-16 to which I refer was piloted, I am told,  by one Major Rick Gibney, who  received a Congressional decoration on 9-13-2001 for firing two sidewinder missiles into hijacked Flight 93 over Pennslyvania, successfully terminating that plane's flight. You can read about that here:
 
http://letsroll911.org/articles/flight93shotdown.html (http://letsroll911.org/articles/flight93shotdown.html)
 
And you're welcome to argue about that right here on this thread. I cannot verify the authenticity of that page, but in light of other things of which I'm presently aware, I tend to believe that Flight 93 was shot down by sidewinder missiles that morning, and that Major Gibney was the dude who did the deed. And please note, as is explained fully on that page, that I do not "blame" Major Gibney one bit. I also do not blame a large number of other trusting but unwitting complicitors in the plot of 911, like other pilots and air-traffic control people and etc and etc. They had no way of knowing what was truly going down that morning. The people who arranged the events of that morning, however, DID know what they were doing, and they knew how to use our military and other agencies to benefit their own wicked purposes, their "conspiracy". Those are the bastards I'm wanting to arrest and put on trial pubicly.
 
That brings up another interesting question: Why does Fedgov deny that it shot down Flight 93 over Pennslyvania? Let that question sink in for a moment, eh? *Why* does Fedgov deny it shot down Flight 93 over Pennslyvania?
 
And *why* does Fedgov insist that a 757 hit the Pentagon on the morning of 911? Why?
 
But to move forward, let me repeat in answer to your question that I do think it is entirely possible that up to six or more aircraft which were in the air on the morning of 911 over the east coast sectors were being piloted by "remote-control", and other U.S. military aircraft were aloft with pilots aboard. What I would like to suggest to interested readers here who would like to challenge this view is that any reader with doubts should go to this website and order the video named "911 In Plane Site" by Dave von Kleist.
 
http://www.policestate21.com/ (http://www.policestate21.com/)
 
While that page itself is interesting enough, it hardly does justice to the video. I've seen this video five times or more, most recently being yesterday when I showed the film to Bark, this site's engineer and TMM's webmaster. I strongly urge anyone and everyone to get this film and view it several times, and then come to this thread with any refutations or doubts about the content of the film. That's an invitation and a friendly suggestion. :)
 
Edison_Carter asked:
 
Quote
Were passengers and crew still on them?
If so wouldn't the pilots have been screaming on the radio?
Wouldn't the passengers have been on those high priced air-phones?
If not, where were they deplaned, and how would you exterminate 
that many Americans without word getting out?

 
Well, it now seems that word HAS gotten out. Remember, the Manhattan Project involved a large number of civilian and military people, and it was somehow kept completely secret from the world and the American people until the U.S. government was ready for the people to know. I mention that as Mike Ruppert has already stated it, to show that some massive secrets *have* been kept from the public successfully by Fedgov. But this operation, the events of 911, were not guarded so closely as the Manhattan Project was guarded, and some very serious unanswered questions have a very valid reason to be asked, which our patriotic friends over at LetsRoll911.org and the lone-anti-CIA fighter Michael Ruppert and others are seeking to answer.
 
I think there were several hundred people on those four hijacked flights, in total, and I think they were deliberately "sacrificed" by Dick Cheney and his Cheney-Bush Junta for the purpose of implementing a large step forward in the establishment of a New World Order, which is a fancy name used by George H.W. Bush on at least three occasions in public addresses to denote a "One World Government", and was named by Gary Hart in a speech to the CFR, which I have on film here. That is what this thread is all about -- my own "conspiracy theory" which claims that some sinister and secret force has conspired to take America from within, from within our own government's seats of power, which I think they now control completely.
 
Striking as this may seem, I'm with Dave von Kleist when he said that the real "conspiracy theory" is the "theory", projected to the world by Fedgov and its obedient media, that Osama bin Laden had anything to do with the attacks on 911. Of course, I've a lot more tidbits of interesting material to display here at this thread, as we shall see; but I'm trying to keep the horse in front of the cart as we go into this, and I do believe that it is necessary, as we go along, to continue to denote the historic precedence for governmental criminality on this sort. Skull and Bones, the Federal Reserve System, Inc., and the Council on Foreign Relations and the "National security Act of 1947, plus much more, all come into play for anyone seeking the truth of what happened on 911 and at Oklahoma City in 1995 and the 1993 WTC bombing. More laters,
 
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 17, 2004, 05:18:22 pm
Quote
We had racks of LAAMs
Before I finish Elias' post, I just had to comment. I love a good rack of laam. Outback Steakhouse has a great rack of lamb with a Cabernet Sauce that is too good to describe. Nothing like a rack of lamb, unless maybe a nice MLT, mutton lettuce and tomato when the mutton is nice and lean... :lol:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 17, 2004, 05:24:58 pm
Quote
Quote
We had racks of LAAMs
Before I finish Elias' post, I just had to comment. I love a good rack of laam. Outback Steakhouse has a great rack of lamb with a Cabernet Sauce that is too good to describe. Nothing like a rack of lamb, unless maybe a nice MLT, mutton lettuce and tomato when the mutton is nice and lean... :lol:
LOL, Ragnar!

Rack o' laam indeed. But methinks thee to be a bit hungover from b'day celebrations....

:)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 18, 2004, 04:52:04 am
Even though I'm sure that all of you here have long-ago read this classic leakage from the Pentagon, I've typed it in here, just for the record on this thread. This is irrefutable proof of our beloved government's ability to lie to the American people for the purpose of gaining "consensus" for going to war. It also shows clearly the lengths the Pentagon would go to provoke a war even back in 1962. (And also, it shows that the US military had "drones" using remote-control flying commands even back then.) This is one of the more damning documents ever released by Fedgov. Looking at this document closely, studying it, can we not see it as a precursor to the deceptions arranged for our entertainment on the morning of 911?

It's too late tonight to get into commentary on this damned document, but I'll return asap to make some notes about it, and connect its meaning to the conspiracy theory I'm putting forward here. Thanks for re-reading this old piece.... :)

~

The Northwoods Document Typed
 Thanks to The Emperor's Clothes website.  Entire photographic copies of official document available here:
 
http://emperors-clothes.com/images/north-i.htm (http://emperors-clothes.com/images/north-i.htm)
 
~
 
 
Page i:
 
UNCLASSIFIED
 
REPORT BY THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE AND JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF REPRESENTATIVE ON THE CARRIBEAN SURVEY GROUP
 
to the
 
JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF'
 
on
 
CUBA PROJECT (TS)
 
The Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, has requested that he be furnished the views of the Joint Chiefs of Staff on this matter by 13 March 1962.
 
Top Secret . Special Handling . NOFORN
 
Page I-a:
 
TOP SECRET * SPECIAL HANDLING * NOFORN (Unclassified)
 
THE JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF
WASHINGTON 25, D.C.
 
13 March, 1962
 
MEMORANDUM FOR THE SECRETARY OF DEFENSE
 
 Subject: Justification for U.S. Military Intervention in Cuba (TS)
 
1. The Joint Chiefs of Staff have considered the attached Memorandum for the Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, which responds to a request from that office for brief but precise description of pretexts which would provide justification for US military intervention in Cuba.
 
2. The Joint Chiefs of Staff recommend tht the proposed memorandum be forwarded as a preliminary submission suitable for planning purposes. It is assumed that there will be similar submissions from other agencies and that these inputs will be used as a basis for developing a time-phased plan. Individual projects can then be considered on a case-by-case basis.
 
3. Further, it is assumed that a single agency will be given the primary responsibility for developing military and para-military aspects of the basic plan. It is recommended that this responsibility for both overt and covert military operations be assigned the oint Chiefs of Staff.
 
For the Joint Chiefs of Staff:
L.L. Lemnitzer
Chairman
Joint Chiefs of Staff
 
1) Enclosure
Memo for Chief of Operations, Cuba Project  
Excluded from GDS
Excluded from automatic regrading; DOD DIS 5200.10 Does not apply.
 
 
Page ii:
 
Top Secret  
JCS 1969/321
12 March, 1962
Page 2165
 
Note by the Secretaries To The Joint Chiefs of Staff on Northwoods (S)
 
A report* on the above subject is submitted for consideration by the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
 
F.J. Bloun
N.J. Ingelido
Joint Secretariat
 
*Not reproduced herewith; on file in Joint Secretariat
 
Page iii: Mostly obscurred. You can see it here:
 
http://emperors-clothes.com/images/north-iii.htm (http://emperors-clothes.com/images/north-iii.htm)
 
Page 1:
 
9 March 1962
Copy of copies
Special Distribution (Unclassified)
 
Report By the Department of Defense and Joint Chiefs of Staff Representative on the Caribbean Survey Group to the Joint Chiefs of Staff on Cuba Project (TS)
 
The Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, has requested that he be furnished the views of the Joint Chiefs of Staff on this matter by 13 March 1962.
 
Excluded from GDS
 
Top Secret * Special Handling * NOFORN
 
Page 2:
 
JUSTIFICATION FOR US MILITARY INTERVENTION IN CUBA (TS)
 
The Problem
 
1. As requested* by Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, the Joint Chiefs of Staff are to indicate brief but precise description of pretexts which they consider would provide justification for US military intervention in Cuba.
 
FACTS BEARING ON THE PROBLEM
 
2.  it is recognized that any action which becomes pretext for US military intervention in Cuba will lead to a political decision which then would lead to military action.  
 
3. Cognizance has been taken of a suggested course or action proposed** by the US Navy relating to generated instances in Guantanamo area.
 
4. For additional facts see Enclosure B.
 
DISCUSSION
 
5. The suggested course of action appended to Enclosure A re based on the premise that US military intervention will result from a period of heightened US-Cuban tensions which place the United States in the position of suffering justifiable grievances. World opinion, and the United Nations forum should be favorably affected by developing the international image of theCuban government as rash and irresponsible, and as an alarming and unpreictable threat to the peace of the Western Hemisphere.
 
6. While the foregoing premise can be utilized at the present time it will continue to hold good only as long as there can be reasonable certainty that US military intervention in Cuba would not directly involve the Soviet Union. There is...
 
*Memorandum for General Craig from Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, subject: "Operation MONGOOSE", dated 5 March 1962, on file in General Craig' office.
 
**Memorandum for the Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff, from Chief of Naval Operations, subject: "Instances to provoke military actions in Cuba (TS)", dated 8 March 1962, on file in General Craig's office.
 
Page 3:
 
...to the defense of Cuba, Cuba has not yet become a member of the Warsaw Pact (spell?), (illegible) have the Soviets established Soviet bases in Cuba in the pattern of US bases in Western Europe. Therefore, since time appears to be an important factor in resolution of the Cuba problem, all projects are suggested within the time frame of the next few months.
 
CONCLUSION
 
7. The suggested course of action appended to Enclosure A satisfactorily respond to the statement of thep problem. However, these suggestions should be forwarded as a preliminary submission suitable for planning purposes, and together with similar inputs from other agencies, provide a basis for development of a single, integrated, time-phased plan to focus all efforts on the objective of justification for US military intervention in Cuba.  
 
RECOMMENDATIONS
 
8. It is recommended that:
 
a. Enclosure A together with its attachments should be forwarded to the Secretary of Defense for approval and transmitted to the Chief of Operations, Cuba Project.
 
b. This paper NOT be forwarded to commanders of unified or specified commands.
 
c. This paper NOT be forwarded to US officers assigned to NATO activities.
 
d. This paper NOT be forwarded to the Chairman, US Delegation, United Nations Military Staff Committee.
 
Page 4:
 
MEMORANDUM FOR THE SECRETARY OF DEFENSE
 
Subject: Justification for US Military Intervention in Cuba (TS)
 
1. The Joint Chiefs of Staff have considered the attached Memorandum for the Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, which responds to a request* of that office for brief but precise description of pretexts which would provide justification for US military intervention in Cuba.
 
2. The Joint Chiefs of Staff recommend that the proposed memorandum be forwarded as a preliminary submission suitable for planning purposes. It is assumed that ther will be similar submissions from other agencies and that these inputs will be used as a basis for developing a time-phased plan. Individual projects can then be considered on a case-by-case basis
 
3. Further, it is assumed that a single agency will be given the primary responsibility for developing military and para-military aspects of the basic plan. It is recommended that this responsibility for bothovert and covert military operations be assigned the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
 
*Memorandum for Gen Graig from Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, subject: "Operatin MONGOOSE", dated 5 March 1962, on file in Gen Graig's office
 
Page 5:
 
APPENDIX TO ENCLOSURE A
 
DRAFT
 
MEMORANDUM FOR CHIEF OF OPERATIONS, CUBA PROJECT
 
Subject: Justification for US Military Intervention in Cuba (TS)
 
1. Reference is made to memorandum from Chief of Operations, Cuba Project, for General Craig, subject: "Operaton MONGOOSE", dated 5 March 1962, which requested brief but precise description of pretexts which the Joihnt Chiefs of Staff consider would provide justification for US military intervention in Cuba.
 
2. The projects listed in the enclosure hereto are forwarded on a preliminary submission suitable for planning purposes. It is assumed that there will be similar submissions from other agencies and that those inputs will be used as a basis for developing a time-phased plan. The individual projects can then be considered on a case-by-case basis.
 
3. This plan, incorporating projects selected from the attached suggestions, or from other sources, should be developed to focus all efforts on a specific ultimate objective which would provide adequate justification for US military intervention. Such a plan would enable a logical build-up of incidents to be combined with other seemingly unreleated events to camouflage the ultimate objective and create the necessary impression of Cuban rashness and irresponsibility on a large scale, directed at other countries as well as the United States. The plan would also properly integrate and time phase the courses of action to be pursued. The desired resultant from the execution of this plan would be to place the United States in the apparent position of sufferiung defensible grievances from a rash and irresponsible government of Cuba and to develop an international image of Cuban threat to peace in the Western Hemisphere.
 
Page 6:
 
4. Time is an important factor in resolution of the Cuban problem. Therefore, the plan should be so time-phased that projects would be operable within the next few months.
 
5. Inasmuch as the ultimate objective is overt military intervention, it is recommended that primary responsibility for developing military and para-military aspects of the plan for both overt and covert military operations be assigned the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
 
Page 7:
 
ANNEX TO APPENDIX TO ENCLOSURE A
 
PRETEXTS TO JUSTIFY US MILITARY INTERVENTION IN CUBA
 
(Note: The courses of action which follow are a preliminary submission suitable only for planning purposes. They are arranged neither chronologically nor in ascending order. Together with similar inputs from other agencies, they are intended to provide a point of departure for the development of a single, integrated, time-phased plan. Such a plan would permit the evaluation of individual projects within the context of cummulative, correlated actions designed to lead inexorably to the objective of adequate justification for US military intervention in Cuba).
 
1. Since it would seem desirable to use legitimate provocation as the basis for US military intervention in Cuba a cover and deception plan, to include requisite preliminary notions such as has been developed in response to Task 33 (x), could be executed as an initial effort to provoke Cuban reactions. Harassment plus deceptive actions to convince the Cubans of imminent invasion would be emphasized. Our military posture throughout execution of theplan will allow a rapid change from exercise to intervention if Cuban response justifies.
 
2. A series of well coordinated incidents will be planned to take place in and around Guantanamo to give genuine appearance of being done by hostile Cuban forces.
 
a. Incidents to establish a credible attack (not in chronological order):  
 
(1) Start rumors (many). Use clandestine radio.
(2) Land friendly Cubans in uniform "over-the-fence" to stage attack no base.
(3) Capture Cuban (friendly) saboteurs inside the base.
(4) Start riots near the base main gate (friendly Cubans).
 
Page 8:  
 
(5) Blow up ammunition inside the base; start fires.
(6) Burn aircraft on air base (sabotage).
(7) Lob mortar shells from outside of base into base. Some damage to installations.
(8) Capture assault teams approaching from the sea or vicinity of Guantanamo City.
(9) Capture militia group which storms the base.
(10) Sabotage ship in harbor; large fires -- napthalene.
(11) Sink ship near harbour entrance. Conduct funerals for mock victims (may be lieu of [10]).
 
b. United States would respond by executing offensive operations to secure water and power supplies, destroying artillery and mortar emplacements which threaten the base.
 
c. Commence large scale United States military operations.
 
3. A "Remember the Maine" incident could be arranged in several forms:
 
a. We could blow up a US ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba.
 
b. We could blow up a drone (unmanned) vessel anywhere in the Cuban waters. We could arrange to cause such incident in the vicinity of Havana or Santiago as a spectacular result of Cuban attack from the air or sea, or both. The presence of Cuban planes or ships merely investigating the intent of the vessel could be fairly compelling evidence that the ship was taken under attack.  The nearness to Havana or Santiago would add credibility especially to those people that might have heard the blast or have seen the fire. The US could follow up with an air/sea rescue operatoin covered by US fighters to "evacuate" remaining members of the non-existant crew. Casualty lists in US newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation.
 
4. We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington.
 
Page 9:
 
The terror campaign could be pointed at Cuban refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans enroute to Florida (real or simulated). We could foster attempts on lives of Cuban refugees in the United States even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized. Exploding a few plastic bombs in carefully chosen spots, the arrest of Cuban agents and the release of prepared documents substantiating Cuban involvement would also be helpful in projecting theidea of an irresponsible government.
 
5. A "Cuban-based, Castro-supported" filibuster could be similated against a neighboring Caribbean nation (in the vein of the 14th of June invasion of the Dominican Republic).  We know that Castro is backing subversive efforts clandestinely against Haiti, Dominican Republic, Guatemala, and Nicaragua at present and possibly others. These efforts can be magnified and additional ones contrived for exposure. For example, advantage  can be taken of the sensitivity of theDominican Air Force to intrusions within their national air space. "Cuban" B-26 or C-46 type aircraft could make cane-burning raids at night. Soviet Bloc incendiaries could be found. This could be coupled with "Cuban" messages to the Communist underground in the Dominican Republic and "Cuban" shipments of arms which would be found, or intercepted, on the beach.
 
6. Use of MIG type aircraft by US pilots could provide additional provocation. Harassment of civil air, attack on surface shipping and destruction of US military drone aircraft by MIG type planes would be useful as complementary actions. An F-86 properly painted would convince air passengers that they saw a Cuban MIG, especially if the pilot of the transport were to announce such fact. The primary drawback to this suggestion appears to be the security risk inherent in obtaining or modifying an aircraft. However, reasonable copies of the MIG could be produced from US resources in about three months.
 
Page 10:
 
7. Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft should appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the government of Cuba. Concurrently, genuine defections of Cuban civil and military air and surface craft should be encouraged.
 
8. It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner enroute from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuala. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight.
 
a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to to a drone.
 
b. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rondezvous south of Florida. From the rondezvous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly into an auxiliary field at Eglin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight air plan. When over Cuba the drone will begin transmitting on the international distress frequency a "MAY DAY" message stating he is under attack byCuban MIG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by destruction of theaircraft which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow ICAO radio ...
 
Page 11:
 
... stations in the Western Hemisphere to tell the US what has happened to the aircraft instead of the US trying to "sell" the incident.
 
9. It is possible to create an incident which will make it appear that Communist Cuban MIGs have destroyed a USAF aircraft over international waters in an unprovoked attack.
 
a. Approximately 4 or 5 F-101 aircraft will be dispatched in trail from Homestead AFB, Florida, to the vicinity of Cuba. Their mission will be to reverse course and similate fakir aircraft for an air defense exercise in southern Florida.  These aircraft would conduct variations of these flights at frequent intervals. Crews would be briefed to remain at least 12 miles off the Cuban coast; however, they would be required to carry live ammunition in the event that hostile actions were taken by the Cuban MIGs.
 
b. On one such flight, a pre-briefed pilot would fly tail-end Charley at considerable interval between aircraft. While near Cuban Island this pilot would broadcast that he had been jumped by MIGs and was going down. No other calls would be made. The pilot would then fly directly west at extremely low altitude and land at a secure base, an Eglin auxiliary. The aircraft would be met by the proper people, quickly stored and given a new tail number. The pilot who had performed the mission under an alias, would resume his proper identity and return to his normal place of business. The pilot and aircraft would have then disappeared.
 
c. At precisely the same time that the aircraft was presumably shot down a submarine or small surface craft would disperse F-101 parts, parachute, etc., at approximately 15 to 20 miles off the Cuban coast and depart. the pilots returning to Homestead would have a true story as faras they knew. Search ships and aircraft could be dispatched and parts of aircraft found.
 
Page 12:
 
ENCLOSURE B
 
FACTS BEARING NO THE PROBLEM
 
1. The Joint Chiefs fo Staff have previously stated* that US unilateral military intervention in Cuba can be undertaken in the event that the Cuban regime commits hostile acts against US forces or property which would serve as an incident upon which to base overt intervention.
 
2. The need for positive actoin in the event that current covert efforts to foster an internal Cuban rebellion are unsuccessful was indicated ** by the Joint Chiefs of Staff on 7 March 1962, as follows:
 
"- - - determination that a credible internal revolt is impossible of attainment during the next 9-10 months will require a decision by the United States to develop a Cuban "provocation" as justification for positive US military action."
 
3. It is understood that the Department of State also is preparing suggested courses of action to develop justification for US military intervention in Cuba.
 
*JCS 1969/303
**JCS 1969/313

end

~

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 18, 2004, 07:26:52 am
All 15 images of govt docs & Elias' typed version can be had at n.tar.gz (http://toddmontanye.com/n.tar.gz) (1MB).

Net downloadable software to untar/unzip '.tar.gz' files is available. Winzip, etc. Problems? PM me.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 18, 2004, 11:55:41 am
NameBase - a cumulative index of books and clippings at http://www.namebase.org/nbhome.html (http://www.namebase.org/nbhome.html)

Google no longer indexes most of NameBase

Citations to names of individuals and groups involving * assassinations, organized crime, and scandals * Wall Street and transnational corporations * foreign policy and media establishments * political elites from the Right and Left * Cold War history and intelligence

Academia | Assassinations | Big Business | Cults | Drugs | Elites | High Tech | Intelligence | Media | Military | Nazis | Organized Crime | Repression | Scandals | Terrorism | UFOs | U.S. Foreign Policy | Vietnam War

name search - Usually a good place to start. Search phonetically, with leading letters, or use exact spelling. Shows citations for all names that match your input.

proximity search - Lock in a name. Data mining (extracting related names) and data visualization (cluster analysis that produces the social network diagram) are then used to trace connections to that name. [NameBase tutorial]

country search - For area specialists. Names located in or associated with a non-U.S. country for a period of years are extracted by specifying country and time frame.

document scan - Enter the address of an English-language document anywhere on the web. We extract the names, and then look up each name in NameBase.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 18, 2004, 01:48:04 pm
Quoting from the above-posted "Northwoods Document"...

Quote
Page 10:
 
7. Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft should appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the government of Cuba. Concurrently, genuine defections of Cuban civil and military air and surface craft should be encouraged.
 
8. It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner enroute from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuala. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight.
 
a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to to a drone.
 
b. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rondezvous south of Florida. From the rondezvous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly into an auxiliary field at Eglin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight air plan. When over Cuba the drone will begin transmitting on the international distress frequency a "MAY DAY" message stating he is under attack byCuban MIG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by destruction of theaircraft which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow ICAO radio ...
 
Page 11:
 
... stations in the Western Hemisphere to tell the US what has happened to the aircraft instead of the US trying to "sell" the incident.

Awright, what the hell is this? I'm sure I'm crazy, but to me this looks to be a God-damned Conspiracy going on in our Pentagon back in 1962!  And it is not a "Conspiracy Theory", but is recorded historic FACT.

Am I wrong? Is this not proof-positive that Fedgov has, for nearly half a century, felt licensed to deceive the American people and the world regarding matters of  "Policy"? Is this not proof that Fedgov considers the resorting to violence to forward its agenda to be quite fine and dandy?

Jesus H. Christ! You've got the God-damned Joint Chiefs of Staff, the freakin' Pentagon, planning to blow up stuff at Guantanamo Base, blow up a ship, shoot down an aircraft or several, and blame it on Cuba!

Does this bother anyone? Is there any other interpretation for this Bullshit that I'm missing, or is this just what it appears to be? I ask, because if this is how our illustrious God-damned Pentagon Brass employs what is left of their mentality, then the suspicions about 911 have every foundation in reality to exist and to demand answers.

Are y'all beginning to see what I'm driving at here? If the Pentagon was capable of conspiracies against the American public in 1962, how much moreso is the Pentagon capable today? Or how possible was "conspiracy" in the events of 911? This unclassified document shows clearly that an "agenda" (invading Cuba) was more important than the values on which this nation was founded; it shows that the Pentagon couldn't care less about deceiving the American people to get them into a God damned war! Am I wrong about this, or am I right about this.

Since 911, we've been asked to accept the demolishing of our Bill of Rights. We've been asked to pay for two illegal and immoral wars abroad. We've been asked to suffer "terrorism" on U.S. soil. We've been asked to live in constant fear. We've been asked to spy on each other. We've been asked to have our library habits scrutinized by the FBI. We've been asked to have our book-buying activities at book stores reported to the FBI. We've been asked to accept a national ID card. We've been asked to allow Fedgov and the Corporate Dynasty to track our consumer habits via our Social Security number. We've been asked to do away with the spirit and intent of the 2nd Amendment, the 1rst Amendment, the 4th Amendment, and etc and etc. We've been asked to pay ridiculous prices for our gasoline. We've been asked to believe that Islam hates us because we're "free".

And the, perhaps, biggest one thing we've been asked by Fedgov to do is to accept the *Conspiracy Theory* that says that Osama bin Laden had something to do with 911. And we are being asked to believe that Osama bin Laden somehow, miraculously, against the most astonishing odds ever, somehow managed to "guess" just what day the entire US defense system over the northeast sector of this nation would be in effect shut down (or "disabled"), so that he could quickly launch four simultaneous hijackings and do the damage done on the morning of 911.

That conspiracy theory is just that, a God damned "conspiracy theory" put forth for public consumption by the Cheney-Bush Junta. Here is the beginnings of the proof, with thanks and a huge TMM salute to Michael Ruppert:

~

being quote from Michael Ruppert:

For me, the pivotal evidence absolutely demonstrating direct government complicity in, and management of, the attacks was found in a number of undisputed, yet virtually unaddressed wargames that I will show were being conducted, coordinated and/or controlled by Vice President Dick Cheney or his immediate staff on the morning of September 11th. The names of those wargames are known to include: Vigilant Guardian, Vigilant Warrior, Northern Guardian, Northern Vigilance, and Tripod II. All have been reported on by major press organizations relying on undisputed quotes from participating military personnel. They have also been confirmed by NORAD press releases. All, except for Northern Vigilance and Tripod II, had to do with hijacked airliners inside the continental United States, specifically within the Northeast Air Defense Sector where all four 9/11 hijackings occurred.
 
 According to a clear record, some of these exercises involved commercial airline hijackings. In some cases, false blips were deliberately inserted onto FAA and military radar screens and they were present during (at least) the first attacks. This effectively paralyzed fighter response because, with only eight fighters available in the region, there were as many as 22 possible hijackings taking place. Other exercises, specifically Northern Vigilance, had pulled significant fighter resources away from the northeast U.S. - just before 9/11 - into northern Canada and Alaska. In addition, a close reading of key news stories published in the spring of 2004 revealed for the first time that some of these drills were "live-fly" exercises where actual aircraft, likely flown by remote control - were simulating the behavior of hijacked airliners in real life. All of this as the real attacks began. The fact that these exercises had never been systematically and thoroughly explored in the mainstream press, or publicly by Congress, or at least publicly in any detail by the so-called independent 9/11 Commission, made me think that they might be the holy grail of 9/11.
 
 That's exactly what they turned out to be. Only one wargame exercise, Vigilant Guardian, was mentioned in a footnote to the Kean Commission report and then it was deliberately mislabeled as an exercise intended to intercept Russian bombers instead of a hijack exercise in the northeast sector. Even then, a deliberate lie was told to the American people as NORAD commander Ralph Eberhart testified to the Commission that the exercise actually expedited US air force response during the attacks.
 
 When Michael Kane, a brilliant young New York activist and budding investigative reporter, approached General Eberhart on an FTW assignment at the conclusion of the Commission's last public hearing and asked for information on the other exercises, Eberhart's only response was, "No comment."

 And an additional nonmilitary biowarfare exercise called Tripod II, being "set up" in Manhattan on September 11th was under the direct coordination of FEMA and - by White House directive - the immediate control of the Vice President. The setup for that exercise conveniently placed a fully staffed FEMA, New York City and Department of Justice command post on Manhattan's Pier 29 in time for it to be conveniently used as the command post after the Twin Towers had collapsed.

 There are many, many areas where the official account and the findings of the Kean Commission are contradicted by hard evidence, official records, mainstream news investigations and even sworn testimony. Both the Los Angeles Times and the New York Times have noted some of the lesser, but no less glaring, inconsistencies. In my book I will provide you with many more.
 
 In my book I will make several key points:

 1. I will name Richard Cheney as the prime suspect in the mass murders of 9/11 and will establish that, not only was he a planner in the attacks, but also that on the day of the attacks he was running a completely separate command, control and communications system which was superceding any orders being issued by the NMCC, or the White House Situation Room. To accomplish that end he relied on a redundant and superior communications system maintained by the US Secret Service in or near the presidential Emergency Operations Center - the bunker to which he and National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice were reportedly "rushed" after flight 175 struck the WTC's south tower. I will demonstrate that the Secret Service possessed radar screens which gave them, and the Vice President, whose side they never left, with real-time information as good as or better than that available to the Pentagon.
 
 2. I will demonstrate that, in what are called national special security events, the US Secret Service is the supreme US agency for operational control with complete authority over the military and all civilian agencies.
 
 3. I will establish conclusively that in May of 2001, by presidential order, Richard Cheney was put in direct command and control of all wargame and field exercise training and scheduling through several agencies, especially FEMA. This also extended to all of the conflicting and overlapping NORAD drills on that day.
 
 4. I will also demonstrate that the Tripod II exercise being set up on Sept. 10th in Manhattan was directly connected to Cheney's role in number 3 above.

 5. I will also prove conclusively that a number of public officials, at the national and New York City levels, including then-Mayor Rudolph Giuliani, were aware that flight 175 was en route to lower Manhattan for 20 minutes and did nothing - absolutely nothing - to order the evacuation of or warn the occupants of the World Trade Center. One military officer was forced to leave his post in the middle of the attacks and place a private call to his brother - who worked at the WTC - warning him to get out. That was apparently an act of desperation because no other part of the system was taking action.
 
 6. I will also show that the Israeli and British governments acted as partners with the highest levels of the American government to help in the preparation and, very possibly, the actual execution of the attacks.
 
end excerpt from transcript of Mike Ruppert's recent address to the Commonwealth Club of California. I am grateful to Ragnar for dragging this article up for TMM.

You may read the whole thing here:

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=287&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

~

Item number six above is a hint, eh Junker? It fits in well with our suspicion of an international cartel of financiers who chance to own the bulk of the national debts of most industrialized nations on earth, thereby having leverage and influence in the cultural, social, institutional, governmental, Intelligence-communal, policy-making, and military aspects of those owned nation-states. Let that one sink in for a moment, eh?

Of course, there is more. But this post is enough to ponder for the moment. More laters.... :)

Elias




 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: unstructuredreality on October 18, 2004, 03:34:51 pm
Sounds like Michael Ruppert is talking about trying to get something back- note his last statement about getting the republic back- that cannot be had short of full scale all out war.  Pretty depressing huh?

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 19, 2004, 12:45:30 am
Quote
Sounds like Michael Ruppert is talking about trying to get something back- note his last statement about getting the republic back- that cannot be had short of full scale all out war.  Pretty depressing huh?

Peace and Good Day
The scope and magnitude of this "theory" is at least awesome, overpowering, and shocking. But do not let it depress you.

Five years ago I got together with some very fine thinkers and created The Mental Militia. Scarmig, ladylearning, and others you'll find here were involved in helping me create TMM. We felt at that time that "consciousness works", and we still do.

I am not saying that we may not have to resort finally to blood in the streets of this nation in order to save ourselves. But at this point in time I'm still with Claire: "It's too early to shoot the bastards."

Know what I want to do?

I want to go up to Washington DC and arrest the Federal government, shut down the Federal Reserve System, Inc., shut down the IRS, shut down the FBI, DEA, ATF, IRS, and etc., shut down the clandestine/active arm of the CIA and every other Intel group, arrest the membership roster of the CFR, Trilateral Commission, Bilderberger group, various corporate CEOs, the entire Cheney-Bush Cabinet, Ashcroft, Rumsfield, Powell, Rice, Wolfowitz, Libby, Zalmay Khalilzad, etc and etc, arrest Dan Rather and his peer CFR news giants, the media owners themselves, all of Congress excepting Ron Paul's "Liberty Committee", and a fairly long list of other suspects. Just walk into every office building in DC and sweep the rats up, carry them out into the light of day, read 'em their charges and put 'em away. I'm for trying the bastards publicly before the world and sentencing them accordingly. Treason, as I recall, carries the death penalty. I think that mass murder also carries the death penalty. Fraud, violating oaths of office, betrayal of the public trust, robbery, abuse of the U.S. Military, and countless other crimes which are rife up on Capitol Hill also carry significant penalties.

You see, we don't have to have a violent revolution --- we can simply use the same government these bastards have been using against us to bring them all to exposure and justice. The "LAW" the sons of bitches have been using to torment and enslave and oppress us is sufficient to bust their asses properly, without a shot being fired. Help me find about two million Americans who're willing to walk on Washington DC and I'll serve the goddam papers on their sorry asses personally. That is all it would take, if even that many; just a couple million liberty-loving Americans who've awakened to this insane conspiracy theory which the globalizing socialist bankers have used to enslave America. Walking together up the hill with arrest warrants and criminal charges to deliver.

Wouldn't that be better than a bloody revolution? I think so. One thing's for sure -- we'll either do something very quickly or the bastards are gonna do us with another "terrorist" event and clamp us all down with the iron net of totalitarian military-police-state slavery, curfew, rations, relocation, immobilization, forced innoculations, communication-interdictions, suspension of all founding documents, and other such blessings of martial law under King George.

But shoot, unstructuredreality, most Americans still won't believe what we're discovering here, so we may not be able to get 2 million conscientious Americans to do that. But you got to admit, the idea is romantic as all getout, eh? :)

Meanwhile, we'll continue to build our case right here, so that at least the few, the proud, the Freedom Outlaws will know *why* what is *is*.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lark on October 19, 2004, 05:09:19 am
Alton,

I actually tell a lie, the UN does infact feature in some conspiracy theories, in Dublin, Ireland, Spain and Italy there are R. Catholic conspiracies about the UN, pharmaceutical companies and contraception, sterilisation etc. in the third and first world,

when you consider 9/11 etc. I think whether or not a huge expensive and largely useless institution like the UN passing out contraceptives is anything to worry about (I did almost get punched by one of the idiots once, stupid, rural, cow shit smelling...),

I cant think of any websites first hand, well kosher ones, not the dumb "world jewery from New York" kind of ones, the Euro-Communists (they're liberals now) during the cold war used to write whole screeds of stuff about a post-cold war scenario in which the solitary super power having effected massive social, economic, cultural etc. change to win the cold war, witch hunts and paranoia at home and war against small time third parties to intimidate larger nations abroad, wouldnt be able to restructure itself back to a pre-cold war state of play,

none of it is online but most of it, interestingly enough, thought that the reds would win out,

There are others to do with the US experimenting on their troops, civilian populations, public taxpayers money being used through the university system to give private corporations no expenses edges in technology and industrial esponiage through the planting of junior CIA operatives in foreign universities doing research in fields not open to study in the US, ie stem cell research, American journalists planting stories in foreign press to lend objectivity to reporting once it filters back to the US,

pretty standard stuff,

Lark  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: unstructuredreality on October 19, 2004, 01:03:48 pm
Elias,

That's why I love it here, we truely are building something that has real power.  When the march gets going I'm there with ya, serving those papers.  Meanwhile, I'm reading many of the same things as you are, creating my own little thinking militia, and gathering folks who would march with you.  I'll bet there are two million folks that are willing to go, they just haven't found organization or even the Claire Files, or Mental Militia.  Two hundred seventy eight million or so are now so sedated that honestly would be what it took- a small percentage comparatively.  I go through all of the emotions I suppose someone would who is in a small population of clarity when it concerns our future.  Not that I am any sage like you, mind you, ;) but many of the folks here are seeing things and refuse to sleep, or are fighting the sedation and won't close their eyes.  They see in full bloom, what freedom is.  They see a vast, clear horizon that the others have not been too sleepy to see.  It will happen quick when it does.  I do shed a tear at times internally when I think about the complete tyranny this world faces, but not because I'm weak, because I'm moving on to fight a battle.  Anytime one moves on, they leave behind something that was of value, whether that is a thought, a dream, or a love.  I know inside as many here do, that new loves and new dreams, and new realities can be achieved.

Peace to you and make sure when the march starts I get a message of some sort so I can gather some folks.

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 19, 2004, 03:57:43 pm
Quote
I want to go up to Washington DC and arrest the Federal government, shut down the Federal Reserve System, Inc., shut down the IRS, shut down the FBI, DEA, ATF, IRS, and etc.,
...
You see, we don't have to have a violent revolution --- we can simply use the same government these bastards have been using against us to bring them all to exposure and justice.
...
I'm with you. However, what we face was predicted by Patrick Henry in this (http://www.lexrex.com/enlightened/writings/liberty_empire.htm) speech "Shall Liberty or Empire be Sought?," June 5, 1788 - Patrick Henry speaking in the Virginia Convention for ratifying the Federal Constitution. I highly recommend reading the entire speech.

Quote
This Constitution is said to have beautiful features; but when I come to examine these features, sir, they appear to me horribly frightful. Among other deformities, it has an awful squinting; it squints toward monarchy, and does not this raise indignation in the breast of every true American? Your president may easily become king. Your Senate is so imperfectly constructed that your dearest rights may be sacrificed to what may be a small minority; and a very small minority may continue for ever unchangeably this government, altho horridly defective. Where are your checks in this government? Your strongholds will be in the hands of your enemies. It is on a supposition that your American governors shall be honest that all the good qualities of this government are founded; but its defective and imperfect construction puts it in their power to perpetrate the worst of mischiefs should they be bad men; and, sir, would not all the world, blame our distracted folly in resting our rights upon the contingency of our rulers being good or bad? Show me that age and country where the rights and liberties of the people were placed on the sole chance of their rulers being good men without a consequent loss of liberty! I say that the loss of that dearest privilege has ever followed, with absolute certainty, every such mad attempt.

If your American chief be a man of ambition and abilities, how easy is it for him to render himself absolute! The army is in his hands, and if he be a man of address, it will be attached to him, and it will be the subject of long meditation with him to seize the first auspicious moment to accomplish his design, and, sir, will the American spirit solely relieve you when this happens? I would rather infinitely--and I am sure most of this Convention are of the same opinion--have a king, lords, and commons, than a government so replete with such insupportable evils. If we make a king we may prescribe the rules by which he shall rule his people, and interpose such checks as shall prevent him from infringing them; but the president, in the field, at the head of his army, can prescribe the terms on which he shall reign master, so far that it will puzzle any American ever to get his neck from under the galling yoke. I can not with patience think of this idea. If ever he violate the laws, one of two things will happen: he will come at the head of the army to carry everything before him, or he will give bail, or do what Mr. Chief Justice will order him. If he be guilty, will not the recollection of his crimes teach him to make one bold push for the American throne? Will not the immense difference between being master of everything an being ignominiously tried and punished powerfully excite him to make this bold push? But, sir, where is the existing force to punish him? Can he not, at the head of his army, beat down every opposition? Away with your president! we shall have a king: the army will salute him monarch; your militia will leave you, and assist in making him king, and fight against you: and what have you to oppose this force? What will then become of you and your rights? Will not absolute despotism ensue?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 20, 2004, 02:17:10 am
Thanks very much for that addition to the thread, Ragnar.  I love reading Henry! :)

This evening while digging up old archived stuff at TMM, I came across something else which we need to tuck into this thread somewhere, as it shall come into play often. At least we should keep this article's facts in mind as we look at the over-view of this amazing conspiracy theory. Remember, Cheney has open access to the CIA, as former CIA Analyst Ray McGovern makes clear, and for a man in Cheney's position to have access to this kind of clandestine capability only adds to our suspicions regarding his standing down of the northeast air defense sector on the morning of 911. As a comment under the article entitled "A Timeline of CIA Atrocities" was another linked article regarding the CIA's importing of high-up Nazi scientists and Intelligence workers from Hitler's fallen Germany right after WWII, many of whom CIA hid from the Nuremburg War Crimes trials:

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=217 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=217)

We'll be coming back to both of these articles as the conspiracy is unveiled.

Salute!
Elias

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 20, 2004, 02:28:28 am
Quote
Thanks very much for that addition to the thread, Ragnar.  I love reading Henry! :)
As regards that other post - the above was an example of the eloquence of which I spoke.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 20, 2004, 02:38:51 am
Well, I enjoyed reading that impassioned statement by Patrick Henry, Ragnar. There are several wonderful passages in there, including this one:

~

This Constitution is said to have beautiful features; but when I come to examine these features, sir, they appear to me horribly frightful. Among other deformities, it has an awful squinting; it squints toward monarchy, and does not this raise indignation in the breast of every true American? Your president may easily become king. Your Senate is so imperfectly constructed that your dearest rights may be sacrificed to what may be a small minority; and a very small minority may continue for ever unchangeably this government, altho horridly defective. Where are your checks in this government? Your strongholds will be in the hands of your enemies. It is on a supposition that your American governors shall be honest that all the good qualities of this government are founded; but its defective and imperfect construction puts it in their power to perpetrate the worst of mischiefs should they be bad men; and, sir, would not all the world, blame our distracted folly in resting our rights upon the contingency of our rulers being good or bad? Show me that age and country where the rights and liberties of the people were placed on the sole chance of their rulers being good men without a consequent loss of liberty! I say that the loss of that dearest privilege has ever followed, with absolute certainty, every such mad attempt.

(Patrick Henry)

~

Excellent, eh? Henry knew then the potential for what Cheney and the Cheney-Bush Junta have done against us, and to us, for the banking masters.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 20, 2004, 09:47:41 am
Rothschild --> French Revolution --> Masonic involvement --> American Revolution --> Bank of England --> Schiff to US --> Fed Reserve - Income tax --> ww1 --> Russian revolution --> CFR --> ww2 --> cold war --> Korea --> all the others

It's all fascinating in its detail and play-out, but perhaps it is enough to only espy the CFR. Like Jekyll island, where J.P. Morgan, John B. Rockefeller, Colonel House, Senator Nelson Aldrich, Schiff, Stillman and Vandlelip of the New York National City Bank, W. and J. Seligman, Eugene Myer, Bernard Berouk, Herbert Lehman, Paul Warburg, in short; all of the international bankers in America met and showed that big money does conspire, so too just the list of current CFR members asserts conspiracy on-going continually at the highest levels.

Govt passes law X <-- but govt is controlled by CFR  <-- but the head of CFR is David Rockefeller  <-- but he's one of the international bankers in America  <-- but they conspire with the world international bankers <-- who are Rothsvhild & co.

Btw, do you know how much money they pumped into the Bolsheviks to ensure a revolution in Russia?

Or, who started CFR? Let's see, 1921 it was, then John Rockefeller?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 20, 2004, 12:45:05 pm
Quote
Rothschild --> French Revolution --> Masonic involvement --> American Revolution --> Bank of England --> Schiff to US --> Fed Reserve - Income tax --> ww1 --> Russian revolution --> CFR --> ww2 --> cold war --> Korea --> all the others

It's all fascinating in its detail and play-out, but perhaps it is enough to only espy the CFR.

(snip)

Govt paases law X <-- but govt is controlled by CFR  <-- but the head of CFR is David Rockefeller  <-- but he's one of the international bankers in America  <-- but they conspire with the world international bankers <-- who are Rothsvhild & co.

Btw, do you know how much money they pumped into the Bolsheviks to ensure a revolution in Russia?

Or, who started CFR? Let's see, 1921 it was, then John Rockefeller?
For those who live above fear, and do not mind Fedgov's knowing where their computers might go, the CFR has an online book which serves as a thumbnail sketch of their history. I suggest anyone visiting that site save-to-disc the info presently residing there, as I have done.

~

IT ALL STARTED as an inquiry, indeed, "The Inquiry." To the select few who knew, this was the name of a working fellowship of distinguished scholars, tasked to brief Woodrow Wilson about options for the postwar world once the kaiser and imperial Germany fell to defeat. Through the winter of 1917­18, this academic band gathered discreetly in a hideaway at 155th Street and Broadway in New York City, to assemble the data they thought necessary to make the world safe for democracy.

Historians still differ about how seriously President Wilson, though a former university president, took this exercise. The notion had been pressed upon him by Edward M. House, his trusted aide; in the modern style, House would be called Wilson's national security adviser. But there is no question about how seriously the intellectuals took their unprecedented mission. Modesty was neither a prerequisite nor even a virtue. "We are skimming the cream of the younger and more imaginative scholars," declared Walter Lippmann, the 28-year-old Harvard graduate who recruited the scholars and managed the Inquiry in its formative phase. "What we are on the lookout for is genius--sheer, startling genius, and nothing else will do."

The vision that stirred the Inquiry became the work of the Council on Foreign Relations over the better part of a century: a program of systematic study by groups of knowledgeable specialists of differing ideological inclinations would stimulate a variety of papers and reports to guide the statecraft of policymakers. What began as an intellectual response to a juncture of history grew into an institution that would thrive through all the diplomacy of America's twentieth century. Perpetually renewing its membership and its mission, reaching out beyond an elite circle to help educate the entire public, the Council grew into a model that is now emulated by a host of newer research centers, in the United States and abroad. Their common challenge is to stimulate concerned citizens in their thinking about power and politics among nations.

Colonel House set off for Europe shortly before the November 1918 armistice. The Atlantic crossing proceeded with all the speed then available for this first exercise in high-level shuttle diplomacy (and under destroyer escort to guard against lurking German submarines). His mission was to arrange the U.S. presence at the peace conference and, he decided, to establish reliable sources of information about conditions in Europe. The scholars of the Inquiry had relied upon the books, maps, and documents they could locate, principally in the Library of Congress and the Columbia University library; House determined that the president needed, at the least, something more current.

 The scholars of the Inquiry helped draw the borders of post­World War I central Europe over tea at the Quai d'Orsay, a more congenial venue than the plenary sessions held in Versailles' Hall of Mirrors, shown above.

When Wilson himself set sail for Paris a month or so later (House had booked the Americans into the Hotel Crillon), his presidential cruiser could accommodate no more than 23 of the Inquiry scholars. Suspicious diplomats of the Department of State saw to it that these amateurs in foreign policy were confined to quarters in the lower decks. Briefing papers in hand from their study groups, the cadre of the Inquiry suddenly found their intellectual confidence challenged by the working diplomacy of the Paris Peace Conference of 1919.

"Now suddenly there was less time for deliberation," wrote Colonel House's aide, Whitney H. Shepardson. "Also, to their surprise, they found themselves assigned to work on multinational committees--not to study problems but to come up with practical solutions. They found themselves down from the ivory tower, testing something with their feet that might be either rock or quicksand."


The historical record of the Paris Peace Conference focuses on the meetings of the major powers: Britain, France, Italy, and the United States. To those of the Inquiry, however, and the colleagues they gathered among diplomatic and military officers in Europe, these plenary sessions mattered little. For them the daily teas at the Quai d'Orsay, the bridge games, the breakfast and dinner meetings of experts from a dozen countries gave enduring personal meaning to the peace conference.

In congenial and civilized encounters, they floated ideas in the noncommittal style of an Oxford Common Room; they noted each others' expertise and forged lifelong friendships without regard to age or nationality. In these unrecorded discussions the frontiers of central Europe were redrawn (subject, of course, to their principals' sanction), vast territories were assigned to one or another jurisdiction, and economic arrangements were devised on seemingly rational principles. "It seemed to us that the drafting of peace would be a brisk, amicable, and hugely righteous affair," wrote Harold Nicolson, one of the young Britons in attendance.

This was all too reassuring to let fade once the statesmen had gone home. On May 30, 1919, a little group of diplomats and scholars from Britain and the United States convened at the Hotel Majestic, billet of the British delegation, to discuss how their fellowship could be sustained after the peace. They proposed a permanent Anglo-American Institute of International Affairs, with one branch in London, the other in New York.

As the American peacemakers drifted home over the next months, they found their fellow citizens absorbed in isolationism and prohibition, thoroughly inhospitable to the ideals of the League of Nations and the other stillborn creations of the Versailles Treaty. Intellectual dynamism was exhausted in "the physical and spiritual breakdown" of the veteran scholars from Paris, wrote Shepardson, who left House's staff to become a pioneer of the American branch.

To be sure, loose associations of idealistic Americans already existed. Industrialist Andrew Carnegie had founded his Carnegie Endowment for International Peace in 1910. A group of public-minded citizens established a League of Free Nations early in 1918 to promote the League of Nations on the then-popular lecture circuits. (When the Senate rejected the League of Nations in 1920, the League of Free Nations became the Foreign Policy Association.)

Elihu Root (second from left) headed the original Council on Foreign Relations and was instrumental in the founding of its successor. He had been secretary of state and received the 1912 Nobel Peace Prize. He is shown here (left to right) with Council President and former U.S. Ambassador to Great Britain John W. Davis, gary of War Newton D. Baker, and Foreign Affairs Editor Hamilton Fish Armstrong at the 1930 opening of the Council's 65th Street headquarters.

But it was a more discreet club of New York financiers and international lawyers organized in June 1918 that most attracted the attention of the Americans from the Peace Conference. Headed by Elihu Root, the secretary of state under Theodore Roosevelt and a Nobel Peace Prize laureate, this select group called itself the Council on Foreign Relations. It began with 108 members, Shepardson recorded, "high-ranking officers of banking, manufacturing, trading and finance companies, together with many lawyers." Its purpose was to convene dinner meetings, to make contact with distinguished foreign visitors under conditions congenial to future commerce.

Despite growing opposition to Wilson's internationalism, the early Council members supported the League of Nations, but not necessarily on Wilson's rationale. As Shepardson put it, they "were concerned primarily with the effect that the war and the treaty of peace might have on postwar business." At an early meeting, for instance, several members stressed economic advantages that could flow from the League; others hastened to register on the record the argument that world peace was surely more important than immediate profits. For whatever reasons, by April 1919 the members' interest in the dinner meetings dwindled, and the Council went dormant.

The scholars of the Inquiry, returning from Paris, saw an opportunity. The American Institute of International Affairs envisioned at the Hotel Majestic could provide diplomatic experience, expertise, and high-level contacts but no funds. The men of law and banking, by contrast, could tap untold resources of finance but sorely needed an injection of intellectual substance, dynamism, and contacts--whether to promote business expansion, world peace, or, indeed, both. This was the synergy that produced the modern Council and promoted its unique utility for decades to come: academic and government expertise meeting practical business interests, and, in the process, helping conceptual thinkers to test whether they stood on "rock or quicksand."

Not until February 3, 1921, did the diverse interests and egos of the two groups permit a preliminary encounter. Merger negotiations proceeded for five months. The established members of the Council rented New York office space at 25 West 43rd Street, and they agreed to enlarge the businessmen's club "by selecting and inviting to membership," as Shepardson put it, "a number of carefully chosen individuals."

A fortuitous transatlantic circumstance solved the problem of naming the surviving organization. The British diplomats returning from Paris had made great headway in founding their Royal Institute of International Affairs. Undeterred by isolationism or the inhibitions of the Americans, they had even acquired an elegant London headquarters, the St. James's mansion once owned by William Pitt, known as Chatham House. The American branch foreseen at the Hotel Majestic, by contrast, seemed unable to keep up.

Gradually dawning upon the American veterans of the Inquiry was the realization that, in the mood of post-Wilson America, they could no longer promote the congenial Anglo-American fellowship of the Peace Conference common rooms. A combined membership of the two branches, London and New York, was simply not on. During the merger negotiations, Shepardson noted that membership in the New York branch would have to be "restricted to American citizens, on the grounds that discussions and other meetings, confidential in nature, would be more productive if participants and speakers knew for sure that the others in the room were all Americans."

To Shepardson fell the task of informing the British colleagues of this unfortunate reality. Crossing to London, he recalled thinking that "it might be quite unpleasant to have to say for the first time that the Paris Group of British colleagues could not be members" of the American branch. "The explanation to the British was begun (shall we say?) haltingly. However, instead of the frigid look which had been feared, the faces of the British governing body showed slightly red and very happy. They had reached the same conclusion in reverse, but had not yet found a good way of getting word to the other side of the Atlantic!"

To make the distinction clear, the American academics were relieved to adopt the name of their preexisting institutional partner. On July 29, 1921, a New York certificate of incorporation was prepared and the new Council on Foreign Relations came into being.

end of chapter

EA note: I did not get permission from the God-damned treasonous sons of bitches at the CFR to reprint this chapter. Maybe they'll sue my ass, eh?

~

Awright, Junker, here's the link for the official history of the CFR:

http://www.cfr.org/about/grosse00a.php (http://www.cfr.org/about/grosse00a.php)

On that site exist at this time many very valuable pictures from American history. I recommend reading the online book at the CFR's site and, for those interested in enhancing their library, copying the photos as jpeg files and saving them. Just a suggestion for serious conspiracy theorists.

To any reader: if this linked site asks anyone to accept cookies, my recommendation is to decline the request. I've no idea why I would say such a thing, but it "feels" right to add the caution. These people are the puppets of the Globalizing Socialist Bankers who are attempting to sell out American sovereignty for a One World Government or an Amerikan Empire, Inc. And yes, I'm accusing them of that, for the record. :)

Salute!
Elias
   
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: neoteny on October 20, 2004, 02:50:16 pm
Please forgive my 'new guy' post. But, to add another source; there is the book "Tragedy and Hope" by Caroll Quigley. I obtained it a few years ago and have yet to read much of it, but it is recommended by sites like AMPP - Architecture of Modern Political Power. By the way, that site is incredibly deep, extensive. Someone has done an awful lot of research. If you have not seen it. The address used to be http://mega.nu:8080/ampp/ (http://mega.nu:8080/ampp/)
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 20, 2004, 03:10:49 pm
Neoteny,

It's a hit, rather than 'new guy' post. Thank you for adding.

I've run across reference to  "Tragedy and Hope" by Caroll Quigley here and there, but I've yet to get it much less read it. But, I figure I'm gonna have to.

Then there's the site you post. I know I've seen that url before, but I lost it in my pursuit elsewhere. I knew I shoulda gotten it, but after...reading...clicking...reading...etc...I did forget to go back and look. I'm glad you brought it up.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 20, 2004, 05:31:05 pm
Quote
..."Tragedy and Hope" by Caroll Quigley...
Ex Prez Clinton was a student of Quigley at Georgetown and praised Quigley in his first nomination speech. For whatever that is worth.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 21, 2004, 03:14:26 am
What is conspiracy?

Roster of Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), Trilateral Commission (TC), and Bilderberg (BB) Members (Clinton regime)

David Rockefeller, Chairman Emeritus of the CFR
Paul Volker, North American Chairman of the Trilateral Commission

POTUS (Clinton)-CFR, TC, BB, Asst. Sec. for Administration, United Nations-CFR, National Security Advisor-CFR, Vice POTUS-CFR, SecState-CFR, SecDef-CFR, Chairman Joint Chiefs Of Staff-CFR, Director CIA-CFR, Chairman, Council of Economics Advisors-CFR, TreasSec-Former CFR, BB, SecInterior-CFR, SecHUD-CFR, SecHHS-CFR, TC
JUDICIARY: Sandra Day O'Connor, Assoc. Justice, U.S. Supreme Court-CFR, etc.
U.S. INSTITUTE FOR PEACE: Chairman-CFR, Vice Chairman-CFR, President-CFR, etc.
TREASURY DEPARTMENT: Six various
ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY: Asst. Adm., Enforcement And Compliance-CFR
WHITE HOUSE STAFF: Director, Communications-CFR, Chief Foreign Intelligence Advisory Bd.-CFR, Staff Director, National Secuity Council-CFR, Deputy Advisor, National Security-CFR, Deputy Assistant, National Economic Council-CFR
OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT & BUDGET: Deputy Director-CFR
EXPORT-IMPORT BANK: President & Chairman-CFR, 1st VP & Vice Chairman-CFR. Director-CFR, General Council-CFR
OFFICE OF SCIENCE & TECHNOLOGY: Science Advisor to President & Director-CFR
LIBRARY OF CONGRESS: Librarian, Chmn. Trust Fund Board-CFR, Asst. Librarian National Programs-CFR
NATIONAL SCIENCE FOUNDATION: Frank H. T. Rhodes, Bd. Of Directors-CFR, James B. Holderman, Bd. Of Directors-CFR, D. Allen Bromley, Bd. Of Directors-CFR
U.S. ARMS CONTROL & DISARMAMENT AGENCY: Four various
FEDERAL JUDICIAL CENTER: Director-CFR
DEPARTMENT OF STATE: Madeleine Albright, UN Amabassador-CFR & 18 various
DEPARTMENT OF STATE-AMBASSADORS: 20 various
UNITED STATES CONGRESS-SENATORS: 14 various
UNITED STATES CONGRESS-REPRESENTATIVES: 20 various
FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM (PAST & PRESENT - PARTIAL LIST): Alan Greenspan, ChairmaN-CFR, TC; Bobby R. Inman, Chmn., Dallas Fed. Res. Bank-CFR, TC; Cyrus R. Vance-CFR; Paul Volcker-CFR, TC & various
BANKING INSTITUTIONS: Many various
LABOR UNION LEADERS: Four various
U.S. MILITARY: Secretary of Defense-CFR, Under Secretary for Policy-CFR, Asst. Sec., International Security Affairs-CFR, Dep. Asst. Sec. Nuclear Forces & Arms Control-CFR, Dep. Asst. Sec., Europe & NATO-CFR, Chairman Defense Policy Board-CFR, Dir. Defense Research & Engineering-CFR, Dir., Net Assessment-CFR, Secretary of the Army-CFR, Secretary of the Air Force-CFR, Dep. Asst. Sec. Nuclear Forces & Arms Control-CFR & many other various
MEDIA: CBS: CEO-CFR; NBC/RCA: CEO-CFR; ABC: CEO-CFR & most all news broadcast personalities; Associated Press: 4 various; Reuters:  various; Baltimore Sun:  various; Washington Times:  various; Children's TV Workshop (Sesame Street): Pres.-CFR; CNN: Pres.-TC; U.S. News & World Report:  various; New York Times Co.:
many various; Time, Inc.: many various; Newsweek/Washington Post: many various; Dow Jones & Co (Wall Street Journal):  various; National Review: Wm. F. Buckley, Jr.-CFR; Readers Digest: CEO-CFR Dir.-CFR
ENERGY COMPANIES: Exxon Corporation: Chairman-CFR, President-CFR & TC,  various; Texaco: Chairman-CFR, Dir.-CFR & TC, various; Atlantic Richfield-Arco:  various; Shell Oil Co.: CEO-CFR, Dir.-CFR & TC; Mobil Corp.: Chairman & President-CFR & TC,  various; Tenneco, Inc.: Chairman-CFR,  various
INDUSTRY: General Motors, Ford, GE/NBC, Deere & Co, IBM, Amtrak, AT&T, Chrysler
BUSINESS & INDUSTRY LEADERS: Many various
EDUCATION: University Professors: Many various.
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 21, 2004, 05:01:52 am
http://mega.nu:8080/ampp/, ... ok, visited and no wonder it looked familiar--Pouzzner! He's in my bookmarks. Oh so slowly, I've been trying to read through his site. My last visit had me sidetracked to his Innovism section and I was trying to get back to AMPP. Now I've finished downloading the AMPP section...

Introduction, Defining America, Establishment Organization, Ancient History, The New Age, The Systems Method, CFR and Trilateral, The Banking Scam, Monopolies and Transnationals, National Socialism, Communism, Global Socialism, All the State's Children, Racism and Eugenics, A Century of Genocide, The Disarmament Agenda, The National Emergency, Computer Glitches, Erosion of Military Readiness, Spooks, Nukes and Terror, Engaging Red China, Erosion of Sovereignty, Eco-Psychos, Laws Gone Mad, The Drug War, War Drugs and Bioweapons, Manufacturing Madness, Making Little Monsters, Fracturing the Body Politic, The Media, Enslaving Speech, Erosion of Individual Privacy, The Web of Foundations, Humiliating a Nation, Debauchery, An Unprecedented Stonewall, Murder Inc.
 
...and have read into a couple of the sections. It appears to be the most extensive, reasonable, and complete coverage of the breakdown/destruction of American/western society (including what is here pointed to as conspiracy) that I've yet encountered on the net. Wonderful site. Well worth anybody's time to read and consider what is there.

Thanks, Neoteny, for bringing it up so everyone might see and visit the site.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 21, 2004, 05:26:15 am
As an aside, I found this article over at 9/11 CitizensWatch dot org this evening, with a reply which I'll put onto the end of this article. This is media bias but it is an example of a reporter's letting too much out of the bag without knowing it. I'll try to explain that if anyone needs explanation. Some of the spin is dissolved in the letter written to Zelikow as a response, which follows this; further, Zelikow is obviously now involved in damage control, as is the media which has sat on the evidence about Flight 77 and the Pentagon without ever letting it out to the public. Note the use of the "paranormal" and "aliens" to denote those fools who would dare claim that no Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon. Typical Govlish, but full of leaks for those who can read between the lines. :)

~

By Carol Morello
 Washington Post Staff Writer
 Thursday, October 7, 2004; Page B01
 
 Working from his home office in a small town in England, Darren Williams spent four weeks this summer making a short but startling video that raises novel questions about the 2001 attack on the Pentagon.
 
 The video, "9/11: Pentagon Strike," suggests that it was not American Airlines Flight 77 that slammed into the Pentagon, but a missile or a small plane.
 
 With rock music as a backdrop, the video offers flashes of photographs taken shortly after impact, interspersed with witness accounts. The pictures seem incompatible with damage caused by a jumbo jet, and no one mentions seeing one. Red arrows point to unbroken windows in the burning building. Firefighters stand outside a perfectly round hole in a Pentagon wall where the Boeing 757 punched through; it is less than 20 feet in diameter. Propelled by word of mouth, Internet search engines and e-mail, the video has been downloaded by millions of people around the world.
 
 American history is rife with conspiracy theories. Extremists have fed rumors of secret plots by Masons, bankers, Catholics and Communists. But now urban legends have become cyberlegends, and suspicions speed their way globally not over months and weeks but within days and hours on the Web.
 
 "The dissemination is almost immediate," said Doug Thomas, a University of Southern California communications professor who teaches classes on technology and subgroups. "It's not just one Web site saying, 'Hey, look at this.' It's 10,000 people sending e-mails to 10 friends, and then they send it on."
 
 The Pentagon video could be a case study. Williams created a Web site for the video, www.pentagonstrike.co.uk. Then he e-mailed a copy to Laura Knight-Jadczyk, an American author living in France whose books include one on alien abduction. Williams, 31, a systems analyst, belongs to an online group hosted by Knight-Jadczyk that blends discussions of science, politics and the paranormal.
 
 On Aug. 23, Knight-Jadczyk posted a link to the video on the group's Web site, www.Cassiopaea.org. Within 36 hours, Williams's site collapsed under the crush of tens of thousands of visitors. But there were others to fill the void.
 
 In Texas, a former casino worker who downloaded the video began drawing almost 700,000 visitors a day to his libertarian site. In Louisiana, a young Navy specialist put the video on his personal Web page, usually visited by a few friends and relatives; suddenly, the site was inundated by more than 20,000 hits. In Alberta, traffic to a cabdriver's site shot up more than sixfold after he supplied a link to the video.
 
 Across thousands of sites, demand for the video was so great that some webmasters solicited donations to pay for the extra bandwidth.
 
 "Pentagon Strike" is just the latest and flashiest example of a growing number of Web sites, books and videos contending that something other than a commercial airliner hit the Pentagon.
 
 Most make their case through the selective use of photographs and eyewitness accounts reported during the confusion of the first hours after the attack. They say they don't know what really happened to American Airlines Flight 77 and don't offer other explanations. The doubters say they are just asking questions that have not been answered satisfactorily.
 
 The ready and growing audience for conspiracy theories about the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks has been particularly galling to those who worked on the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States, the bipartisan panel known as the 9/11 commission.
 
 "We discussed the theories," said Philip D. Zelikow, the commission's executive director. "When we wrote the report, we were also careful not to answer all the theories. It's like playing Whack-A-Mole. You're never going to whack them all. They satisfy a deep need in the people who create them. What we tried to do instead was to affirmatively tell what was true and tell it adding a lot of critical details that we knew would help dispel concerns."
 
 Conspiracy theories are common after traumatic events. Michael Barkun, a political scientist at Syracuse University who has written books on the culture of conspiracies, said contradictory and inconclusive eyewitness accounts often leave room for different
 interpretations of events.
 
 "Conspiracy theories are one way to make sense of what happened and regain a sense of control," Barkun said. "Of course, they're usually wrong, but they're psychologically reassuring. Because what they say is that everything is connected, nothing happens by accident, and that there is some kind of order in the world, even if it's produced by evil forces. I think psychologically, it's in a way consoling to a lot of people."
 
 The belief that the government is lying about the Sept. 11 attacks is coming from both the right and the left. Experts say more than suspicion of the Bush administration is at work.
 
 "It seems that since the end of the Cold War, the enemy is the United States government, the enemy is within," said Rick Ross, whose Ross Institute of New Jersey monitors cults and other controversial groups, many of which see manipulative forces working behind the scenes. "Instead of projecting conspiracy theories out, it's become internalized."
 
 Zelikow, for example, lacks credibility with many who question the work of the 9/11 commission because he wrote a book with national security adviser Condoleezza Rice. He believes that it is futile to discuss evidence with people convinced of a conspiracy.
 
 "The hardcore conspiracy theorists are totally committed," Zelikow said. "They'd have to repudiate much of their life identity in order not to accept some of that stuff. That's not our worry. Our worry is when things become infectious, as happened with the [John F. Kennedy] assassination. Then this stuff can be deeply corrosive to public understanding. You can get where the bacteria can sicken the larger body."
 
 David Ray Griffin considers himself an unlikely recruit to what is called the "9/11 Truth Movement." The retired theologian, who taught religion for three decades at Claremont School of Theology, initially dismissed the notion that it was not an airliner that hit the Pentagon. But after visiting several Internet sites raising questions about the attack, he ended up writing a book. "The New Pearl Harbor," published in the spring, argues that a Boeing 757 would have caused far more damage and left more wreckage strewn around the Pentagon.
 
 "There are reasons why people doubt the official story," he said. "There are photographs taken, and there is no Boeing in sight."
 
 Suspicions formed as the Pentagon still smoldered.
 
 For 2 1/2 years, the attack on the Pentagon has been discussed and researched by members of Knight-Jadczyk's online group, the Quantum Future School.
 
 The group's talks formed the basis for articles in which Knight-Jadczyk argues that after the attack on the World Trade Center, eyewitnesses at the Pentagon were predisposed to see a large airliner. She believes that the Pentagon was attacked by a smaller plane and that members of the Bush administration were somehow complicit because it was beneficial for war-profiteers and Israel.
 
 Interviewed by telephone from what she said is a 17-bedroom castle outside Toulouse, where she lives with her Polish physicist husband and five children, Knight-Jadczyk acknowledged that her group is considered "fringe."
 
 Knight-Jadczyk, 52, a Florida native, has been a psychic and a channeler. She is now involved in experiments in what she calls "superluminal communication," which she described as involving "time loops" that would enable people to communicate with their former selves.
 
 Knight-Jadczyk said she never imagined anyone outside her group would ever view "Pentagon Strike."
 
 "The fact everybody's been sending it to his brother and his cousin, almost frenetically, reflects the fact that there is a deep unease," she said. "They don't come out and say it. They don't want to be accused of being with terrorists, anti-American or anti-patriotic. But they still feel something's wrong."
 
 Bret Dean of Fort Worth said he considers it "baloney" to question whether a plane hit the Pentagon. But he also believes that the government ignored warning of the attacks.
 
 After posting a link to the video on his libertarian site, www.freedomunderground.org, Dean recorded more than 8 million hits. At least one came from inside the Defense Department, he said.
 
 "I don't think the video is an instigator," said Dean, 45, a former casino worker. "It's a symptom. A lot of people don't trust the government's explanation because the government's classified all the information."
 
 Asked if there were unreleased photographs of the attack that would convince the doubters, Zelikow, of the 9/11 commission, said,"No."
 
 "The question of whether American 77 hit the Pentagon is indisputable," Zelikow said. "One reason you tend to doubt conspiracy theories when you've worked in government is because you know government is not nearly competent enough to carry off elaborate theories. It's a banal explanation, but imagine how efficient it would need to be."
 
 [snip]
 
 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/artic...ct6.html?sub=AR (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13059-2004Oct6.html?sub=AR)

At 9/11CitizensWatch.org :

http://www.911citizenswatch.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.911citizenswatch.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=409&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

This is the letter to Zelnikow dated October 12, 2004, by By Nicholas Levis,  911Truth.org
 newyorkcity@snafu.de
which is found here:

http://www.911citizenswatch.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.911citizenswatch.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=407&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

~

Commentary: Open Letter to Philip Zelikow and The Washington Post
    


Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 10:52 AM
Posted by: khence


By Nicholas Levis
 911Truth.org
 newyorkcity@snafu.de
 
 NEW YORK, Oct. 7, 2004 --
 
 Philip Zelikow, a high-level national security adviser to both Bush administrations, acknowledges that America faces a new infectious disease: lack of faith in the U.S. government's 9/11 Commission report.
 
 As executive director of the freshly-retired Kean Commission, Zelikow was a principal author of the 567-page document, which purports to explain everything that matters about September 11th, 2001.
 
 Sales of the 9/11 report have far outpaced those of his earlier study in statecraft, "Germany Unified and Europe Transformed." He co-wrote that book in 1999 with one of his closest associates from the original Bush White House, Condoleeza Rice.
 
 Despite blockbuster sales for the 9/11 report, Zelikow tells the Washington Post he is alarmed by the concurrent spread of "conspiracy theories" about the attacks, which he describes as pathogens: "Our worry is when things become infectious, as happened with the [John F. Kennedy] assassination," Zelikow says. "Then this stuff can be deeply corrosive to public understanding. You can get where the bacteria can sicken the larger body." (1)
 
 It's too late, Dr. Zelikow. The "bacteria" are winning, and your own work is to blame.
 
 Perhaps the disease would have slowed if you had showed the courage to step down as executive director last March - when your resignation was demanded by the same Sept. 11 families who had fought the White House for 14 months to gain a 9/11 Commission in the first place.
 
 They saw a grave conflict of interest in your having participated in White House briefings on al-Qaeda in 2000 and 2001. You did so on behalf of the incoming Bush administration, along with Dr. Rice, Richard Clarke and Sandy Berger, all of whom later testified to the Kean Commission.
 
 "It is apparent that Dr. Zelikow should never have been permitted to be Executive Staff Director of the Commission," the Family Steering Committee wrote.
 
 They asked you to resign, and to take your place on the other side of the table, as a witness to be questioned in the investigation, in public and under oath. (2)
 
 Perhaps this might have helped to restore credibility to a Commission that was badly damaged a few months earlier when its most outspoken member, Max Cleland, resigned after condemning it as a whitewash. (3)
 
 But you ignored the families and stayed on, undeterred. You continued to steer the Commission and its agenda. You stayed on, as one of only two staff members or commissioners with relatively unrestricted access to White House documents. (The other was Jamie Gorelick, a former high official in the Clinton administration and close associate of George Tenet. Small world.)
 
 A few weeks later, we were treated to a star turn at the hearings by your co-author, Dr. Rice, as one of the most important witnesses before the Commission, even as you conducted behind the scenes.
 
 And now you worry that people won't buy what you have to say about 9/11.
 
 Guess what? They don't.
 
 A representative poll of eight hundred New York state residents by Zogby International found less than 40 percent of them say they believe the 9/11 Commission report answered all of the important questions about Sept. 11. (4)
 
 Sixty-six percent of New York City residents are therefore calling on the state attorney general to open a new criminal investigation, one based on the 383 questions of the Family Steering Committee, most of which the 9/11 Commission report simply ignores.
 
 The same poll found that 41 percent of state residents believe high officials knew about 9/11 in advance, and "consciously" allowed the attacks to proceed. That view is shared by one-half of New York City residents - the very people who would have the most reason to be well-informed about Sept. 11.
 
 But 41 percent of the good people in upsate New York, a microcosm of Middle America, also believe there was foreknowledge, as do 30 percent of the state's registered Republicans.
 
 What would the same poll questions reveal, if they were posed to residents of the entire United States? Or to a sampling of the world population?
 
 Isn't this big news? Half the people in the city where the attacks occurred don't believe what their government has told them. Why wasn't it in the papers, alongside the Bush-Kerry polling numbers? Shouldn't the papers be examining the unanswered questions that make people think this way?
 
 What have the papers given us instead?
 
 Zelikow's worry about the spread of heretical ideas is apparently shared by the Washington Post, which published his comments yesterday in a pop-psychology piece by Carol Morello, analyzing the souls who have fallen prey to "conspiracy theories" about 9/11.
 
 Morello's first step is to define what "conspiracy theorists" think in the narrowest possible way. She focuses on a single notion - that the crash of a Boeing 767 does not explain the pattern of damage at the Pentagon. Her article pretends that this is the central hypothesis for all who question the official story of 9/11, which is untrue.
 
 Before the Pentagon anomaly first arose as an issue among American researchers (in Nov. 2001), a broad case for doubting the government's claims had already been built, based in ample evidence of foreknowledge on the part of high U.S. officials, contradictions in investigators' statements about the alleged hijackers, and many other indications of complicity in the attacks by elements other than the Bin Ladin networks.
 
 This constantly growing body of evidence caused Sept. 11 families and advocates for disclosure to lobby for an independent investigation, and ultimately became the basis for a vibrant "9/11 truth movement." (5)
 
 But Morello's presumption - that uncertainty about what happened at the Pentagon is the sole issue of concern - allows her to ignore all that.
 
 All that matters now is what makes these conspiracy theorists tick, and whether they can be cured.
 
 As Philadelphia Daily News reporter Will Bunch pointed out, Morello is merely knocking down her own strawman. In a college debate, she would lose the point. (6)
 
 If we must psychologize rather than argue, as Morello does, then I daresay she is in avoidance. Taking on the facts of 9/11 with an open mind would perhaps force her, in Zelikow's words, "to repudiate much of [her] life identity," which relies on rejecting ideas that her society characterizes as outlandish, as "conspiracy theory."
 
 But what is "conspiracy theory"? Morello rounds up the usual suspects among experts who treat disbelief in official stories as a pathology.
 
 Michael Barkun, author of "A Culture of Conspiracy" and much-cited in these matters, wisely informs us that "conspiracy theories are one way to make sense of what happened and regain a sense of control. Of course, they're usually wrong, but they're psychologically reassuring."
 
 "Usually wrong"? Why does Prof. Barkun hedge his bets?
 
 We need to unpack our terms. "Conspiracy theory" describes the official 9/11 report as well as it does the alternative views. The events of Sept. 11 obviously were not the product of a single perpetrator, but of a criminal conspiracy.
 
 Criminal conspiracy is treated in countless volumes of what prosecutors call conspiracy law or racketeering statutes. Another word for it is organized crime. Any attempt to explain a criminal conspiracy constitutes a theory. Prosecutors devise theories based on initial clues, and then try to see which of them best fit the evidence. Convictions often follow.
 
 Morello, and Zelikow, are not concerned about "conspiracy theories" per se. They are applying the term selectively, to include only hypotheses in which elements of the U.S. government were themselves involved in the attacks for political and financial gain.
 
 If Cheney says Saddam Hussein backed the 9/11 attacks, as the vice-president did on many occasions despite his recent protestations to the contrary, this is not called a conspiracy theory, although it obviously involves a theoretical conspiracy. Yet this is the most important 9/11 conspiracy theory to date, because it was used to justify the invasion of Iraq.
 
 If Zelikow tells us that 19 men agreed to hijack four planes and fly them into buildings and succeeded (although those identified as the ringleaders had been under observation by U.S. and allied agencies for years beforehand) this is not labeled conspiracy theory, although it describes a conspiracy.
 
 The only theories branded as "conspiracies," and thus subject to ridicule and dismissal without examination, are those that suspect wrongdoing from a government that did its best to hide and destroy evidence, and then sent out a top adviser to both Bush administrations, Zelikow, to investigate what happened.
 
 In the case of the Pentagon, the government has suppressed videotapes of the attack taken from a nearby hotel, a gas station, highway surveillance cameras, and the Pentagon's own cameras. At a press conference following the Kean Commission hearings of Dec. 8, 2003, the chair and co-chair promised that this evidence would be released, to help dispel speculation.
 
 That evidence has not been released, and Zelikow suggests to the Post that there is no need:
 
 "Asked if there were unreleased photographs of the attack that would convince the doubters, Zelikow, of the 9/11 commission, said, 'No.'"
 
 Is it any wonder that people don't believe Dr. Zelikow? First the government suppresses evidence. Then its chief investigator of 9/11 justifies this by saying it would be pointless to release the evidence, and shifts the blame to the "conspiracy theorists" who are pathologically incapable of believing the truth.
 
 The New Yorkers who are unsatisfied with the 9/11 Commission report are not supposed to get answers; they are remanded to the nearest therapist.
 
 For three years, the Washington Post has joined America's other major press organs in ignoring the unanswered questions that cause so many people to reject the official conspiracy theory of the 9/11 attacks.
 
 You would think the Zogby poll results, which were at least mentioned on washingtonpost.com if not in the newspaper itself, would finally move the Post to file some real stories.
 
 This isn't the place to go into everything the Post has not reported about Sept. 11 - one might start by reading the book mentioned in Morello's article, "The New Pearl Harbor" by David Ray Griffin - but I submit that DC journalists would normally want to explore the following question:
 
 What about the reports that the Pakistani secret service ISI wired $100,000 to Mohamed Atta? The ISI is often credited as the creator of the Taliban, and its operatives have been linked to the Bin Ladin networks. ISI is also linked to CIA, as historically close allies.
 
 The ISI director, Mahmud Ahmed, was on a two-week visit to Washington and met for breakfast at the Capitol on Sept. 11 with the heads of the congressional intelligence committees, Bob Graham and Porter Goss. (7)
 
 After 9/11, Graham and Goss oversaw the 858-page report of the congressional joint inquiry into 9/11, in which the term ISI never occurs, at least not in the 75 percent of the report remaining after "redactions."
 
 In all of the Post's coverage of Goss's recent confirmation hearings as director of the CIA, wasn't the ISI breakfast worth an article?
 
 The 9/11 Commission report fails to mention reports of a Pakistani connection, not even to explain them away, but at least it offers this gem:
 
 "To date, the U.S. government has not been able to determine the origin of the money used for the 9/11 attacks. Ultimately the question is of little practical significance... Similarly, we have seen no evidence that any foreign government - or foreign government official - supplied any funding." (p. 172)
 
 So who financed the attacks is of little significance. Now we know the first rule of the Kean Commission: Don't follow the money!
 
 Does the Washington Post agree?
 
 The Kean Commission "discussed the theories," Zelikow tells the Post. "When we wrote the report, we were also careful not to answer all the theories. It's like playing Whack-A-Mole. You're never going to whack them all."
 
 Now we know the second rule of the Kean Commission: Don't test theories. Just whack them, if you can, and otherwise do your best to ignore them.
 
 We shall conclude with two more of the moles that Zelikow and the Commission refused to whack. Is the Washington Post willing to take a swing?
 
 First: The owner of World Trade Center Building 7, Larry Silverstein, interviewed for a PBS documentary of 2002 ("America Rebuilds"), seems to reveal that this building's little-reported collapse on the afternoon of Sept. 11, 2001 was the result of a decision to intentionally demolish the building. Isn't this worthy of a follow-up call to Mr. Silverstein's offices? Is it possible to wire a 47-story skyscraper for a controlled demolition within a few hours? If not, what does this imply?
 
 Second: The 9/11 Commission report revised the older NORAD and FAA timelines of air defense response on Sept. 11. For more than two years, these two agencies presented a series of conflicting chronologies to explain the failure of standard operating procedure, under which the errant flights of Sept. 11 should have been intercepted by jet fighters as a routine matter of reconnaissance.
 
 Last June, the Kean Commission issued a staff statement that radically contradicted all accounts upheld until then by either NORAD or FAA, establishing an entirely new timeline. This is now Chapter 1 of the 9/11 Commission report.
 
 It exonerates everyone of blame for the failures of 9/11, in keeping with the dictum of Kean's vice-chairman, Lee Hamilton: "We're not interested in trying to assess blame, we do not consider that part of the commission's responsibility."
 
 Given the complexity of this issue, it may be asking too much of the Washington Post to figure out if the new timeline holds water - it most assuredly does not. (8) But if the Commission's version is right, then officials at NORAD and the FAA were issuing false accounts for more than two years. Isn't that, at least, an issue?
 
 Are none of our taxpayer-financed public officials going to be held accountable for what they say and do? Can the official story of 9/11 be changed every few months without consequences?
 
 Sen. Mark Dayton of Minnesota doesn't think so. At hearings on the 9/11 Commission report, Dayton said NORAD officials "lied to the American people, they lied to Congress and they lied to your 9/11 commission to create a false impression of competence, communication and protection of the American people." (9)
 
 This, at least, made the Minneapolis Tribune. But where is the follow-up? Isn't the reality that either NORAD or the 9/11 Commission (or both) must be lying about what happened on Sept. 11 worthy of the newspaper that was once synonymous with investigative reporting?
 
 
 References
 
 (1) Re: "Conspiracy Theories Flourish on the Internet," Carol Morello, Washington Post, Oct. 7, 2004
 http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A...anguage=printer (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A13059-2004Oct6?language=printer)
 
 (2) "Statement of the Family Steering Committee for The 9/11 Independent Commission," March 20, 2004. See http://www.911independentcommission.org/mar202004.html (http://www.911independentcommission.org/mar202004.html)
 
 (3) On the history of the Commission and its conflicts of interest, see my earlier article "The Rice/Zelikow Connection," May 15, 2004 at http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=...040527201054793 (http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20040527201054793)
 
 (4) "Poll: 50% of NYC Says U.S. Govt Knew," press release. See
 http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=...040830120349841 (http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20040830120349841)
 
 (5) "Putting on our tin-foil thiking cap," William Bunch,
 http://www.pnionline.com/dnblog/extra/arch...ves/001002.html (http://www.pnionline.com/dnblog/extra/archives/001002.html)
 
 (6) As portals to the kingdom of 9/11 research and truth movement sites, the author recommends 911Truth.org, the New York activist site ny911truth.org, and his own collection at http://summeroftruth.org (http://summeroftruth.org)
 
 (7) Timeline of reports on allegations that ISI Director Mahmood Ahmed ordered a $100,000 wire transfer to Mohamed Atta in the weeks prior to Sept. 11.
 http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/essay.j...le=mahmoodahmed (http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/essay.jsp?article=mahmoodahmed)
 
 (8) "Analyzing the 9/11 Report, Chapter 1" by Michael Kane
 http://www.williambowles.info/911/911_analysis_1.html (http://www.williambowles.info/911/911_analysis_1.html).
 
 For a series of links that makes clear how the official timelines of air defense response have changed over time, see "The Emperor's New Timelines" at http://summeroftruth.org/#timelines (http://summeroftruth.org/#timelines)
 An article is in the works.
 
 (9) "Senator Dayton: NORAD lied about 9/11," following up on Minneapolis Star-Tribune, July 31, 2004 http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=...040731213239607 (http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20040731213239607)
 See letter to the Editor by John Judge, co-founder of CitizensWatch, also in response to the Washington Post article of October 7th.

end articles from current front page of 9/11 CitizensWatch dot org.

~

Wow. So if we take this in consideration under the light of the previous intel we've collected up on this thread so far, including Mike Ruppert's announcement of the five NORAD wargame "drills" which Cheney and his command was running on the morning of 911, and especially with the input from Dave von Kleist's incredibly-excellent "911 In Plane Site", we're left with more than some simple questions to ask of the Cheney-Bush Junta, wouldn't you say?

Damn!

More laters.....

Elias
 
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on October 21, 2004, 08:55:04 am
Elias, you are an incredible wealth of information.  Thank you for that post.

I happened to be in DC, visiting memorials, outdoors and directly across the Potomac from the Pentagon, when the impact occurred that morning.

And, I have always wondered why the only sound I heard was a soft rumble like very distant thunder.  No screaming or roaring jet noise beforehand.  No huge deafening boom or shaking of the ground.  Mind you, I was a mile away maximum, on a day clear as a bell, with nothing but water and sky in between the building and me.

Something did burn, because the billows of black smoke were still rising a couple of hours later.  What it was, I have no idea.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 21, 2004, 11:52:40 am
Lightning,
I'm grateful that you've read this far into the "conspiracy theory" thread, and am especially glad that this makes sense to you. There are some very grave unanswered questions. Here is the link again for Dave von Kleist's amazing video, "911 In Plane Site".

http://www.policestate21.com/ (http://www.policestate21.com/)

And here is a present for you, a close look at Mahmoud Ahmed, the head of Pakistan's ISI who was meeting with the heads of the House and Senate Intelligence Oversight Committees in Washington DC on the morning of 911 while you were nearby. Mr. Ahmed is involved in the shipment of 100,000 dollars to Mohammed Atta at the Pensacola flight-training facility prior to 911; and Mohammed Atta was the guy that the Government says was in charge of the "19 hijackers". A close read on this one reveals more than enough worms in the woodwork, and also reveals many items which we all should want to keep for future reference.

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/essay.j...le=mahmoodahmed (http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/essay.jsp?article=mahmoodahmed)

From that article, a brief quote:

~

"September 11, 2001 (H): At the time of the attacks, ISI Director Lt. Gen. Mahmood Ahmed is at a breakfast meeting at the Capitol with the chairmen of the House and Senate Intelligence Committees, Senator Bob Graham (D) and Representative Porter Goss ® (Goss is a 10-year veteran of the CIA's clandestine operations wing). The meeting is said to last at least until the second plane hits the WTC. [Washington Post, 5/18/02] Graham and Goss later co-head the joint House-Senate investigation into the 9/11 attacks, which has made headlines for saying there was no "smoking gun" of Bush knowledge before 9/11. [Washington Post, 7/11/02] Note Senator Graham should have been aware of a report made to his staff the previous month that one of Mahmood's subordinates had told a US undercover agent that the WTC would be destroyed (see Early August 2001). Evidence suggests Mahmood ordered that $100,000 be sent to hijacker Mohamed Atta (see Early August 2001 (D)). Also present at the meeting were Senator John Kyl ® and the Pakistani ambassador to the US, Maleeha Lodhi (all or virtually all of the people in this meeting also met in Pakistan a few weeks earlier (see August 28-30, 2001)). Senator Graham says of the meeting: "We were talking about terrorism, specifically terrorism generated from Afghanistan." The New York Times mentions bin Laden specifically was being discussed. [Vero Beach Press Journal, 9/12/01, Salon, 9/14/01, New York Times, 6/3/02] The fact that these people are meeting at the time of the attacks is a strange coincidence at the very least. Was the topic of conversation just more coincidence? FTW"

end quoted passage from above link.

~

Thank you most sincerely for coming forward as one who was nearby on the morning of 911. You verify weather conditions, which is known from many sources, showing your cognizance, but your description of what you heard, and did not hear, is quite important.  :ph34r:

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on October 21, 2004, 01:26:29 pm
Amazing stuff, Elias.  Reassuring to know how many dedicated people are going after the truth of that awful day.

I'm sorry I didn't make clear that the soft rumble I heard was also quick, with no real reverberation as you might get if it were thunder.  It was enough like thunder to draw attention on such a blue-sky morning, but sounded very far off, and there was no echo.  It was as if a rumble of distant thunder suddenly got a catch in its throat.

Of course, I was on the opposite side of the Pentagon from the impact site.  But to my mind, then (puzzled) and now (suspicious), a big-jet crash should have been MUCH louder.

Thanks for your respect, and your deep thinking and investigation on the subject.  Glad if I could help.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 22, 2004, 10:46:31 am
Quote
Please forgive my 'new guy' post. But, to add another source; there is the book "Tragedy and Hope" by Caroll Quigley. I obtained it a few years ago and have yet to read much of it, but it is recommended by sites like AMPP - Architecture of Modern Political Power. By the way, that site is incredibly deep, extensive. Someone has done an awful lot of research. If you have not seen it. The address used to be http://mega.nu:8080/ampp/ (http://mega.nu:8080/ampp/)
neoteny, thank you for an excellent link. I've just spent a couple of hours reading there, and shall read more soon. Welcome aboard!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 22, 2004, 11:02:08 am
Quote
Of course, I was on the opposite side of the Pentagon from the impact site.  But to my mind, then (puzzled) and now (suspicious), a big-jet crash should have been MUCH louder.

Thanks for your respect, and your deep thinking and investigation on the subject.  Glad if I could help.
Yes, much louder, and we might expect that there would have been some wreckage of the 757, if a 757 indeed did hit the Pentagon. Something to consider is that the two planes allegedly hitting the twin towers that morning had most of their fuel and also the plane which allegedly hit the Pentagon would have had most of its fuel. While the government's story says that the un-expended fuel remaining aboard the two jets which hit the towers was ignited and burned so intensely that it brought the two towers down, photographs of the hole created in the Pentagon show, in adjacent rooms which had their proximal walls torn off at impact, an opened book on a stool, and a computer monitor on a file cabinet, neither of which were even singed.

Question: if the two planes which hit the towers, carrying approximately the same load of jet fuel as the plane which allegedly hit the Pentagon,  burned so hot that the fires caused the buildings to collapse into themselves, why did the fuel aboard the alleged Flight 77 not burn that wing of the Pentagon which was struck?

And again, if a Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon, where is it? In photographs taken moments after the impact at the Pentagon, there was no wreckage of a Boeing 757, nor even any significant lawn damage; also, there was no damage on either sides of the 18-feet-wide hole poked into the wall of the Pentagon where the plane's wings would have had to hit the building.

We are being lied to by the Cheney-Bush Junta. No Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon. A bunker-buster missile COULD have made the damage we see in the photos from the morning of 911 at the Pentagon; a 757 could NOT have created that pattern of damage. Fedgov knows this, hence Zelikow's denouncements of "conspiracy theories" in the above article.

Thanks for your interest on this subject. But btw, I'm not an investigator, just a collector of facts. There are, however, some excellent investigative journalists working on this, one of whom is Michael Ruppert. I just read and collect-up the findings of such good men, that I might come to understand what is happening to America.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 23, 2004, 07:12:16 am
http://www.constitution.org/col/cuddy_nwo.txt (http://www.constitution.org/col/cuddy_nwo.txt)

A Chronological History of the New World Order

by D.L. Cuddy, Ph.D.
---
For years, leaders in education, industry, the media, banking, etc., have promoted those with the same Weltanschauung (world view) as theirs. Of course, someone might say that just because individuals promote their friends doesn't constitute a conspiracy. That's true in the usual sense. However, it does represent an "open conspiracy," as described by noted Fabian Socialist H.G. Wells in The Open Conspiracy: Blue Prints for a World Revolution (1928).

In 1913, prior to the passage of the Federal Reserve Act President Wilson's The New Freedom was published, in which he revealed:

"Since I entered politics, I have chiefly had men's views confided to me privately. Some of the biggest men in the U. S., in the field of commerce and manufacturing, are afraid of somebody, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they had better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it."

On November 21, 1933, President Franklin Roosevelt wrote a letter to Col. Edward Mandell House, President Woodrow Wilson's close advisor:

"The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the larger centers has owned the Government ever since the days of Andrew Jackson... "
---

But, no matter really, they...

9-11 Commission Members

Chair - Thomas H. Kean (CFR member)
Vice Chair - Lee H. Hamilton (CFR member)

Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick (CFR member)
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey (CFR member)
John F. Lehman (CFR member)
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson

Commission Staff Executive Director Philip D. Zelikow (CFR member)

...don't have much to do with real things.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 23, 2004, 01:52:48 pm
Most copied from Portland Independent Media Center (http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2004/10/299759.shtml). Visit them for the whole story!
But a start...

S&B Families (http://toddmontanye.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TheFamilies)

TheAllens
TheBrowns
TheCheneys
TheClarks
TheDays
TheDulleses (not exactly S&B, but Yalees allied with the Lord Family)
TheJohnsons
TheJoneses
TheLows
TheMillers
TheRussells
TheSmiths
TheStewarts
TheTafts
TheThompsons
TheWalkers
TheWhites
TheWilliamses
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 23, 2004, 04:12:58 pm
Here is a mini-conspiracy within the greater conspiracy:

One government on earth, and one government only, is poised at present to deprive Americans of their liberty, their Constitution, and their Bill of Rights. It's a sleeper. Like any greedy child caught in the act of stealing, it points its wabbly finger and falsely accuses another.

May 29, 2003
 
 Weapons of Mass Destruction:
 Who Said What When
 
 CounterPunch Wire
 
 Every day Saddam remains in power with chemical weapons, biological weapons, and the development of nuclear weapons is a day of danger for the United States.
 
 Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-CT, September 4, 2002
 
 Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction.
 
 Dick Cheney August 26, 2002
 
 If we wait for the danger to become clear, it could be too late.
 
 Sen. Joseph Biden D-Del., September 4, 2002
 
 Right now, Iraq is expanding and improving facilities that were used for the production of biological weapons.
 
 George W. Bush September 12, 2002
 
 If he declares he has none, then we will know that Saddam Hussein is once again misleading the world.
 
 Ari Fleischer December 2, 2002
 
 We know for a fact that there are weapons there.
 
 Ari Fleischer January 9, 2003
 
 Our intelligence officials estimate that Saddam Hussein had the materials to produce as much as 500 tons of sarin, mustard and VX nerve agent.
 
 George W. Bush January 28, 2003
 
 We know that Saddam Hussein is determined to keep his weapons of mass destruction, is determined to make more.
 
 Colin Powell February 5, 2003
 
 Iraq both poses a continuing threat to the national security of the United States and international peace and security in the Persian Gulf region and remains in material and unacceptable breach of its international obligations by, among other things, continuing to possess and develop a significant chemical and biological weapons capability, actively seeking a nuclear weapons capability, and supporting and harboring terrorist organizations.
 
 Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-NY, February 5, 2003
 
 We have sources that tell us that Saddam Hussein recently authorized Iraqi field commanders to use chemical weapons -- the very weapons the dictator tells us he does not have.
 
 George Bush February 8, 2003
 
 So has the strategic decision been made to disarm Iraq of its weapons of mass destruction by the leadership in Baghdad? I think our judgment has to be clearly not.
 
 Colin Powell March 8, 2003
 
 Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised.
 
 George Bush March 18, 2003
 
 We are asked to accept Saddam decided to destroy those weapons. I say that such a claim is palpably absurd.
 
 Tony Blair, Prime Minister 18 March, 2003
 
 Well, there is no question that we have evidence and information that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction, biological and chemical particularly . . . all this will be made clear in the course of the operation, for whatever duration it takes.
 
 Ari Fleisher March 21, 2003
 
 There is no doubt that the regime of Saddam Hussein possesses weapons of mass destruction. As this operation continues, those weapons will be identified, found, along with the people who have produced them and who guard them.
 
 Gen. Tommy Franks March 22, 2003
 
 I have no doubt we're going to find big stores of weapons of mass destruction.
 
 Kenneth Adelman, Defense Policy Board , March 23, 2003
 
 One of our top objectives is to find and destroy the WMD. There are a number of sites.
 
 Pentagon Spokeswoman Victoria Clark March 22, 2003
 
 We know where they are. They are in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad.
 
 Donald Rumsfeld March 30, 2003
 
 Saddam's removal is necessary to eradicate the threat from his weapons of mass destruction
 
 Jack Straw,
 Foreign Secretary 2 April, 2003
 
 Obviously the administration intends to publicize all the weapons of mass destruction U.S. forces find -- and there will be plenty.
 
 Neocon scholar Robert Kagan April 9, 2003
 
 I think you have always heard, and you continue to hear from officials, a measure of high confidence that, indeed, the weapons of mass destruction will be found.
 
 Ari Fleischer April 10, 2003
 
 We are learning more as we interrogate or have discussions with Iraqi scientists and people within the Iraqi structure, that perhaps he destroyed some, perhaps he dispersed some. And so we will find them.
 
 George Bush April 24, 2003
 
 Before people crow about the absence of weapons of mass destruction, I suggest they wait a bit.
 
 Tony Blair 28 April, 2003
 
 There are people who in large measure have information that we need . . . so that we can track down the weapons of mass destruction in that country. Donald Rumsfeld April 25, 2003
 
 We'll find them. It'll be a matter of time to do so.
 
 George Bush May 3, 2003
 
 I am confident that we will find evidence that makes it clear he had weapons of mass destruction.
 
 Colin Powell May 4, 2003
 
 I never believed that we'd just tumble over weapons of mass destruction in that country.
 
 Donald Rumsfeld May 4, 2003
 
 I'm not surprised if we begin to uncover the weapons program of Saddam Hussein -- because he had a weapons program.
 
 George W. Bush May 6, 2003
 
 U.S. officials never expected that "we were going to open garages and find" weapons of mass destruction.
 
 Condoleeza Rice May 12, 2003
 
 I just don't know whether it was all destroyed years ago -- I mean, there's no question that there were chemical weapons years ago -- whether they were destroyed right before the war, (or) whether they're still hidden.
 
 Maj. Gen. David Petraeus,
 Commander 101st Airborne May 13, 2003
 
 Before the war, there's no doubt in my mind that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, biological and chemical. I expected them to be found. I still expect them to be found.
 
 Gen. Michael Hagee,
 Commandant of the Marine Corps May 21, 2003
 
 Given time, given the number of prisoners now that we're interrogating, I'm confident that we're going to find weapons of mass destruction.
 
 Gen. Richard Myers,
 Chairman Joint Chiefs of Staff May 26, 2003
 
 They may have had time to destroy them, and I don't know the answer.
 
 Donald Rumsfeld May 27, 2003
 
 For bureaucratic reasons, we settled on one issue, weapons of mass destruction (as justification for invading Iraq) because it was the one reason everyone could agree on.
 
 Paul Wolfowitz May 28, 2003
 
 ~ ~ ~
 
 After all, now we only need to know "why" the above was said, when it was, by whom, eh?

Note: The Bush Administration, aka the Cheney-Bush Oil Junta, forgot to mention to Americans that America sold Saddam Hussein those nasty ol' WMDs, then destroyed them with a ground war and a subsequent twelve-year bombing spree prior to our invasion of Iraq. I cannot imagine why Bush and Co. forgot to remind us about "where" Iraq bought those wmds....

Conspiracy!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 24, 2004, 12:34:59 am
Quote
One government on earth, and one government only, is poised at present to deprive Americans of their liberty, their Constitution, and their Bill of Rights. It's a sleeper. Like any greedy child caught in the act of stealing, it points its wabbly finger and falsely accuses another.

Hmmmm, can we guess which government that is? Can you say Federal American Kleptocracy?  Mmmm Hmmm. I thought you could.

Quote
U.S. officials never expected that "we were going to open garages and find" weapons of mass destruction.

Condoleeza Rice May 12, 2003
About these WMDs. If'n they had them, what are they waiting for? Why haven't they unleashed death and destruction all over us because they so hate us for our freedoms? Wouldn't, like now, or even before now have been the ideal time to use them? What the hell are they saving them for, when they really really really really get pissed? When we really truly absolutely without a doubt start killing lots of them?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 24, 2004, 01:09:02 am
LOL, Ragnar,

I did not mean to sidetrack the thread into a discourse on wmds in Iraq, or the absence of them, but since you've hit on this, I'll give you my "theory" on the subject. We know that George H.W. Bush oversaw and assisted with the sale of one and a half BILLION dollars' worth of wmds to Iraq, courtesy (and profits) of 24 US corporations and three US labs including the lab at Los Alamos. So we definitely know Saddam *had* wmds, as we are holding the receipts for those wmds marked "paid in full". However, after Saddam paid for all those wmds, H.W. Bush decided to pitch a little war on Iraq and destroy them, which he mostly did. But to be sure that he did not miss any of them, he then began (and Clinton and the shrub continued) a twelve-years-long bombing mission in Iraq after Desert Storm.

Question: What were US bombers bombing in Iraq for twelve damn years after Desert Storm? I'm gonna guess that they were NOT bombing schools, mosques, and neighborhoods, right? So that means that the bombers must have been bombing military targets, such as the stores of wmds which Saddam had paid us for.

This matter gets even stickier when we realize that April Glaspie, then-Ambassador to Iraq, *told* Saddam the week before he invaded Kuwait that the USA had no concerns about whatever Saddam might do to Kuwait. She told him that! So Saddam smiled and got ready to invade Kuwait, which was all H.W. Bush needed as an excuse to invade Iraq and test out all the Pentagon's newest toys. It's all really sick, y'kno?

But back to "conspiracy theories". Above we see a group of people conspiring to perpetuate a lie regarding the wmds, using that as a pretext for taking this nation to war in Iraq. Powell knew better, Rice knew better, Bush knew better, hell, they all knew better, but they conspired to get the American people to believe that Saddam was capable of nuking us within forty-five minutes, that, as Rice noted, he was capable of putting a mushroom cloud over America. So when we catch a group of people conspiring to perpetuate a lie with grave results, involving traumatic deaths such as more than one thousand of our troops have sustained, it is only proper to call that conspiracy a conspiracy, yes? That was all I was wanting to denote by posting that here at this time. However, there is likely going to arise in the near future a good reason to have that list available to readers here, because some things are gonna surface in coming times which will need to be linked to those statements. Thanks for your comments, and especially thanks for sending me that link on that other thread, the title of which I forget just now; just wanted you to know I got the link and that it was the right link. :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 24, 2004, 08:15:38 am
Off hand I noticed:

S&B 1966 - Smith, Frederick Wallace; founder, CEO, President, Federal Express.

Amazing how they keep cropping up.
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lark on October 25, 2004, 05:54:54 am
I dont think things as widely apart as the Bolsheviks and the emergence of income taxation in the US are directly related, attemtps to relate all that into a single theory of everything distract from what's really going on,

the best explanations are provided by, and I dont think it's been mentioned yet, C Wright Mills and his theories to do with power elites, he rightly asserted that power elites where not a timeless phenomenon either but emerged relatively recently in the US and changed over time,

Also I think the traditional critiques of bureaucracy that concentrate on welfarism alone could be reapplied to the security/police state largeese, people are even more convinced of its necessity than they are of the need for welfare spending,

What's the deal with there's only one government threatening American freedom etc.? Is it only American freedom that we ought to care about or freedom per se, freedom itself, does it not matter that the American government threatens everyone elses freedom aswell or something?

Lark
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lark on October 25, 2004, 05:58:09 am
Is it really a conspiracy if they are just doing their job Elias?

Do trash men conspire each morning to collect the trash cans in a street?

When politicians lie, add to the coercive, intrusive, expensive nature of the state and carry out wars all over the place they are only doing what the public on some level expects of them and pays them for,

Lark
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 25, 2004, 08:46:43 am
Quote
I dont think things as widely apart as the Bolsheviks and the emergence of income taxation in the US are directly related, attemtps to relate all that into a single theory of everything distract from what's really going on,

 
Howdy, Lark; thanks for sharing your thoughts on the thread here.  
 
I think that all things are related, and inter-related, especially when we look at the Global and Universal view of life. I would suggest, or offer to you, that when we notice the wars of the 20th Century, looking back from today's perspective in hindsight, we find now certain patterns which are traceable to banking "interests" at the catalyzing roots of the beginnings of all the wars of the century. For instance, we know that the Rothschilds were involved in the financing of both Napoleon and the Duke of Wellington prior to the battle of Waterloo. Is that not correct?
 
And now we know that British interests were involved in the George Herbert Walker/Averell Harriman/ Prescott Bush conspiracy to bring Hitler to power in Germany, no question about it. The evidence exists for all to see in the corporate records of "Brown Brothers Harriman", which was the merger of Brown and Company from England and the Harriman Corporation of Wall Street, the source ultimately of the Bush family's rise to power in American politics.  We now know that without the help of Wall Street and British banking interests Hitler could never have come to power in Germany; that Hitler's rise to power was directly financed and affected by Bush, Harriman, Walker, and Fritz Thyssen, among others. We know that John Foster Dulles and Allen Dulles, two Wall Street lawyers, did the legal international liaison between Hitler's Nazi movement and its Wall Street financiers. We know of the relationship between J.P. Morgan and British banking interests; the rise of the American railroads, the forest-products industry, the advent of the mass-produced automobile, the spread of electricity and communications enhancements, and all the other post-Industrial Revolution props for social order in today's Western World. And yes, we know of the banking interests which were involved in the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia of the early 1900s, circa 1917-1919. The Rothschilds and Rockefellers and Morgans and Warburgs were involved behind the scenes, as they were with WWI and WWII.
 
So, actually, it is my opinion that in seeking to understand the universal picture of history, where we do find a curious association of persons involved in elitist governance of cumulative financial powers and the political powers which those financial powers spawn, is exactly what is needed at present. You see, humanity now depends upon someone figuring out how this awful mess in which the world finds itself today has come to us, that we might "fix" it. :)
 
Quote
the best explanations are provided by, and I dont think it's been mentioned yet, C Wright Mills and his theories to do with power elites, he rightly asserted that power elites where not a timeless phenomenon either but emerged relatively recently in the US and changed over time,

 
If they who control the power are also at the apex of that controlled totality, then every king of every empire in history can be described as a "power elite" who included his Court in the privileged participation of management of the control of power. I have not read C. Wright Mills, but I beg to differ with his opinion as you've stated it here, reserving of course the option to alter my view of Mills after reading some of his works. Can you suggest a starting place for me, that I might come to know about Mills? Thanks.
 
Quote
Also I think the traditional critiques of bureaucracy that concentrate on welfarism alone could be reapplied to the security/police state largeese, people are even more convinced of its necessity than they are of the need for welfare spending,

 
Since 1913, I would submit for consideration, the powers that be have concentrated on not only welfare spending but also on "Defense" contracting/spending and other notable aspects of governmental growth.
 
You're right to note that "people are convinced", and that leads me back to the source of the problem: who has been doing all that "convincing"? Would it not be true to say that the power-elite, the ones who control the media and the press, are largely responsible for the public mindset which itself has been "convinced" of one thing or another? And is it not true that in "convincing" the public, the elitists have done so on behalf of their goals of Empire? Is there not a global financial conglomerate represented in the body of the IMF/World Bank/Federal Reserve/WTO? Is that conglomerate not designed, organized, structured, administered, and perpetuated by a handful of very powerful and very wealthy men? If not, then we must surprisingly shake our heads and realize that wealth and power mean nothing, right? :)
 
Quote
What's the deal with there's only one government threatening American freedom etc.?

 
'Tis true; only one government threatens today American freedom and the American Republic. Can you imagine that Iraq somehow threatens our freedom? Does India threaten our freedom? Switzerland? Denmark? Mexico? Vietnam? Think about it.... there are simply no powers left on earth which could threaten America's military might, were that might to be concentrated where it belongs here in the United States. Agree? or Disagree?
 
 
Quote
Is it only American freedom that we ought to care about or freedom per se, freedom itself, does it not matter that the American government threatens everyone elses freedom aswell or something?

 
You worry about English freedom, and I'll worry about American freedom, eh? :)  
 
It is my opinion that Zbigniew Brzezinski and Henry Kissinger both work for David Rockefeller, and that all three are in fact Americans. That triad has an agenda which includes world Empire in the name of the United States of America, the Amerikan Empire, Inc. I'm sure you know that they, and their collective political and financial powers, are the greatest threat to world freedom.
 
Oddly enough, were I somehow able to stop the encroachments against American freedom, I think we would find that European freedom would benefit as well. The Elitists who are establishing the Global Empire are using two horses to draw that cart down life's road: The United Nations and the Federal Government of the United States of America. Yes, I know that Blair is on board with the Bush camp, but again, I'm speaking here in universal terms, from a perspective which negates the hype and false pomp normally rendered to "leaders"; for "leaders" are but puppets put forth for the public's amuzement by those who truly control the destinies of the nation-states of the world.
 
Quote
Is it really a conspiracy if they are just doing their job Elias?

 
It is a conspiracy.
 
Quote
Do trash men conspire each morning to collect the trash cans in a street?

 
I do not see trash men as conspiring to collect trash each morning; rather, I see them as doing something useful for the individual families' homes and communities each day. I call it "honest work", which is something about which the Rothschilds, Morgans, Rockefellers and Warburgs would have absolutely no conceptualization. Are you trying to distract me from my duty to expose a conspiracy? Or are you just being curious....
 
Quote
When politicians lie, add to the coercive, intrusive, expensive nature of the state and carry out wars all over the place they are only doing what the public on some level expects of them and pays them for,
 
 
Public is one thing, Lark, private is another thing.  When "the public on some level expects" politicians to "lie, add to the coercive, intrusive, expensive nature of the state", that entire phenomenon can be described as social auto-pathology, can it not? Do you think that expanding governmental powers and promoting war and intruding into the lives of citizens by government is a good thing, or a bad thing? Is it desireable to you, or abhorrent to you? Just asking, of course.
 
Commonly speaking, hardly an individual anywhere wants more governmental coercion, intrusion, or expense to be furnished by his damn government, wouldn't you agree? Yet the trends of the public consciousness, the "collective" if you will, seems to support your premise about this. My efforts are hopefully designed to help the individual within the collective see good motive to question his participation in the collective, whereupon he may conceive some new vision to adopt personally which would cause his withdrawal from that pathology and return to the truth of existence, which is that he who is born of the bone gates of birth is NOT a collective nor a "public", but instead is an individual, an autonomous being, a "private person".  
 
That is a good thing, a very good thing, for all of us to remember now and then, methinketh. :)
 
 Public, as a word, in my way of seeing, denotes a collective of "Privates", who individually, as individuals, comprise the source of "privacy".  In other words, "privacy" is the polar opposite of "public". One of the Statists' most commonly-employed tactics is to distract a private individual's attention with an onslaught of public imagery, suggestions, advertisements, messages, proclamations, commands, and etc, as can be seen to be encased in his thought patterns by such external stimuli, to distract his attention and focus away from its original focus upon himself, and in so doing shift that focus onto the "public", so that in a self-detached way the individual sees himself more and more to be a part of the "public" instead of the totality of his individual "self", or, a "private person".
 
The men who created the United States of America as a legally-forged and lawfully-defined nation arising from a founding legal charter had a very clear perspective about the relationship between the private citizen and the public government, and that perspective is exactly the target of the globalizing socialist bankers with their conspiracy to denude, dissect, and destroy individuality (translates as: Privacy) within the American culture.  
 
Can you agree with that statement, or would you like to disagree about that? Just asking....
 
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Joel on October 25, 2004, 08:48:09 am
Quote
What's the deal with there's only one government threatening American freedom etc.? Is it only American freedom that we ought to care about or freedom per se, freedom itself, does it not matter that the American government threatens everyone elses freedom aswell or something?

The overwhelming majority of people on this board are Americans.  Naturally we're concerned about the freedom of Americans (us).  There's very little we can do about outrages against American freedom, but we can do nothing whatsoever about Parliament.

As to the way America threatens freedom overseas, surely you haven't missed all the bitching here about the attempt to project American hegemony overseas.  Nobody here (as far as I know) is any friend of the Infant Empire.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 25, 2004, 09:00:31 am
Quote
Off hand I noticed:

S&B 1966 - Smith, Frederick Wallace; founder, CEO, President, Federal Express.

Amazing how they keep cropping up.
Jeez, Junker, I did not know Freddie Smith was Skull and Bones! That's a good find. Yup, add him to the list. :)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 25, 2004, 09:03:51 am
Quote
Quote
What's the deal with there's only one government threatening American freedom etc.? Is it only American freedom that we ought to care about or freedom per se, freedom itself, does it not matter that the American government threatens everyone elses freedom aswell or something?

The overwhelming majority of people on this board are Americans.  Naturally we're concerned about the freedom of Americans (us).  There's very little we can do about outrages against American freedom, but we can do nothing whatsoever about Parliament.

As to the way America threatens freedom overseas, surely you haven't missed all the bitching here about the attempt to project American hegemony overseas.  Nobody here (as far as I know) is any friend of the Infant Empire.
Exactly. :)

Consider that post atop this page, the one in which I listed the conspiracy to mislead the American public to support a war in Iraq. That sort of mischief spread all the way across an ocean to torment and violate the Iraqi people. While Blair was on board with the assault, the spearhead of it all came from here. (Well, wait a minute, hehehe; it came from here AND England, as the handiwork of the Rothschild/Morgan/Rockefeller/Warburg dynasty.)

Salute!
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 25, 2004, 11:13:51 am
The conspiracy is composed of an 'open' conspiracy where the actions are not secret
and not illegal within the culture where they are done (CFRs) and a series of
'closed' conspiracies (CCs) where the actions are illegal, immoral, or both. The CCs
are not necessarily related although their results may be helpful to others. One CC
may cooperate with another CC, but which parties are involved changes over time and
with each CC. Then there are also a slough of very small CCs-- bureaucrats trying to
get raises or save their jobs.

The main, largest part of the conspiracy centers on big money-- CFR, the Fed, and
subborning govts everywhere. A smaller conspiracy is Skull and Bones, which being
involved in garnering big money, also carries on trade and cooperation with other big
money families and also tries to subborn govts. However, Skull and Bones is not the
Rothschild families nor the Rockefeller families eventhough it may be a big part of
the Cheneys or Bushes. Note that GWB does not seem to be CFR, although common
cooperation among the big money families still seems to require CFR as the main
source for subordinates.

One could say that the big error in attempting limited govt was still giving the govt
access to big money and rule making (that affects big money making). Thus, it became
the target for control by those big money interests either individually or severally.

Some recent CCs are:

1. WTC Bombing - 1993 (under William Clinton)

2. OKC Bombing - 1995 (under William Clinton)

3. 9-11 Fiasco - 2001 (George W. Bush)

But what might be said about these, their players, and their purposes?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ZooT_aLLures on October 25, 2004, 11:27:17 am
Quote
Do trash men conspire each morning to collect the trash cans in a street?

Trashmen themselves do not conspire to collect trash, yet those employing trashmen are actively working to create a state of universal dependance upon the state itself knowing that those dependant upon the state will go along with and do whatever the state decides to do, if only to continue to receive whatever it is that they're depending on.

We're, at this moment heading into an "election" where supposedly "we're" going to choose who's going to "lead" this country for the next four years.........yet it's funny, that most of what I see being offered by tweedledee and tweedledum is "gimme's" designed to further this universal dependance upon the state, and the rest is based upon the "terror factor" involved in the possibility of "the other guy" getting elected, and the loss of that which whatever group of people are depending upon.....
The fact is, this state of universal dependance is the only thing that government promotes, and we've already reached the point where government cannot continue to honor these commitments and extend this umbrella of dependance, and the only thing folks are deciding is who benefits and who pays this time around.

Quote
Is it really a conspiracy if they are just doing their job Elias?
Does the term "useful idiots" mean anything?

Indeed garbagemen may not be directly involved in some conspiracy, but if the service they provide is one that is provided under threat of force(costs of the service rolled into the costs of other services which prescribe criminal penalties for noncompliance), they ARE involved indirectly in a conspiracy of dependance regardless of whether or not they even have any idea of the existance of a conspiracy of any sort.......
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Misfit on October 25, 2004, 12:14:27 pm
Quote
One government on earth, and one government only, is poised at present to deprive Americans of their liberty, their Constitution, and their Bill of Rights. It's a sleeper. Like any greedy child caught in the act of stealing, it points its wabbly finger and falsely accuses another.

I'll tell you that this is exactly what I was told by someone "in the know" last night. Met a guy who formerly worked in intelligence with the CIA and other groups. He's now in a private business trying to bid on some of that Homeland Security money. I was rolling my eyes in my mind, not externally, but then he started to go on about all this stuff and how it is true. He said that he's worked with a security agency that is over all the other agencies, it's global, it's headquartered in London and it's so secret that even the name of it is classified informantion. He said he's not allowed to tell me the name of it. He also said that every level of our government has Masonic connections. That UFOs are real, but they're not little green men, but those behind it would like you to believe it is.

He knows that this terrorist stuff is intentional planning to enslave us and that we've turned a corner that there's no going back for this country. His organization, though, is taking advantage of the situation to prepare themselves for the fall out. He said they have supplied safe places outside of the US and will get their people out when the time comes.
This guy was definitely not a "nut job". He is obviously highly educated, knows what he's talking about, has serious cash flow and business sense. He's one of those guys who walks into a room and you know he's a CEO before you even introduce yourself. Certainly, I'm still being cautious about him, he could possibly be a plant. It could and is probably most likely a chance encounter, but if someone was looking for me they might think to find me where I was last night. I didn't say much to him, he did most of the talking. I most likely will see this guy again, so I guess we'll see what happens. Maybe I should do some checking into his story...(anybody got any useful resources on that, BTW?)  :ph34r:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on October 25, 2004, 02:47:47 pm
Misfit, that's scary as hell and utterly believable.

I have to wonder why such a man would freely start talking to a stranger about such things.  You don't mention what the situation was or how the conversation began, which is perfectly understandable.  Just occurred to me that it's a bit odd.  You're very wise to remain quiet and watchful.

I have no resources to suggest, but if it were me, I'd hold off trying to check the story for now at least.  That might be exactly what a plant, if plant he was, would hope to see you try.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 25, 2004, 03:31:57 pm
Odd stuff. Europe, England...unfamiliar. MI5 and MI6 are the normal govt intel folks, as CIA & FBI for USA. Here they conspire through CFR and S&B. Perhaps a place to start would be the Brit counterpart to CFR--British Institute of International Affairs (The Royal Institute of International Affairs) at Chatham house.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Misfit on October 25, 2004, 07:03:20 pm
Quote
I have to wonder why such a man would freely start talking to a stranger about such things. You don't mention what the situation was or how the conversation began, which is perfectly understandable. Just occurred to me that it's a bit odd. You're very wise to remain quiet and watchful.

Yeah...both Hubby and I individually thought the conversation was odd afterwards and I mentioned something this morning to him and he said that he was thinking the same thing while he was in the shower. It was actually after a church meeting last night and this guy was visiting. Said he moved here a couple of months ago and was looking for a church. Which is not unusual. And the conversation started off about business, what his business was that caused him to relocate here, what they were doing and how it's a good idea to incorporate to avoid being taxed out the wazoo...then he went on about how high of taxes we now pay, that we're wages slaves...etc, etc. until we arrived at all the fun conspiracy stuff. Most likely it's a chance meeting with a like-minded individual...he reminded me of all my ex-fed instructors from college. If he's legit he may actually be a good resource. I've often wanted to try to contact some of my old profs to see what they'd say about all the current events as they have an inside connection. It just seemed like his attitude was he knows what's going on, it's too big and bad to defeat so if you can't beat him, you might as well join 'em (at least until you can flee the country). Says he's voting for Bush because he thinks the train wreck might be a bit softer with him than Kerry.

The thing that spooked me was the location...because that's probably the easiest place to find me in this town and I've probably divulged enough info on this board to allow someone to find me there. I'm not LDS or Baptist, so that makes the search pretty easy. I was just thinking a few days ago that if someone was trying to find me it would probably be there. Now, I'll just be keeping my Spidey Senses alert for anything odd. If I start bumping into the guy other places or notice other things out of sorts. (Of course, it also occured to me if there is something up with this guy and he snooped me out from TCF that he'll be reading this and know he found me. But to that I can say I'm onto him too and to go bark up another tree. I'm not doing anything illegal, nor will I be coaxed to.)

Quote
Odd stuff. Europe, England...unfamiliar

Yeah, it was a different direction than I expected and he was being coy about it so I didn't get much...not to mention I was called away during that part of the discussion leaving Hubby with him to carry on and me not being there to ask any questions. I'll see what else I can get out of the guy on that if I see him there again. He said he'd be back.
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 26, 2004, 05:12:54 am
Misfit has noted an account with a stranger. What I'm gonna say is not meant to be authoritative in either sense of the word, and is also not meant to be a succession of "demands" or "commands"; in other words, I'm admitting that I was not in on the visit/encounter, and that anything I say must be heard through the understanding that I am in no position to make any statement in the first place. Still, here are my initial musings for Misfit:

Quote
I'll tell you that this is exactly what I was told by someone "in the know" last night. Met a guy who formerly worked in intelligence with the CIA and other groups. He's now in a private business trying to bid on some of that Homeland Security money.

 
Misfit, countless individuals who formerly worked for CIA are running about all over the country. NEVER trust them. The burglars who did Watergate were "ex-employees" of the CIA. CIA has a long history of re-classifying anyone, as need arises, from "employee" to "non-employee", then "re-hiring" them after deniability was established. Anyone who will tell you that he used to work for CIA is an instant problem looking for some life into which to explode. My best suggestion to you is to stay away from anyone who says he used to work for CIA. Anyone claiming to have worked for CIA may be an "agent provocateur", at the least, and may be more than that.
 
 
Quote
I was rolling my eyes in my mind, not externally, but then he started to go on about all this stuff and how it is true. He said that he's worked with a security agency that is over all the other agencies, it's global, it's headquartered in London and it's so secret that even the name of it is classified informantion. He said he's not allowed to tell me the name of it. He also said that every level of our government has Masonic connections. That UFOs are real, but they're not little green men, but those behind it would like you to believe it is.

 
This man is very dangerous. I do not know if you know anything about MKULTRA, or specifically Project Monarch, and I will admit that I do not know much of anything about what those programs evolved into, but I assure you that "mental compartmentalization" as a technique of mind-control is very much alive and well and is being utilized and practiced by CIA all over this nation as well as overseas. CIA has been operating domestically for decades. Since 911 they have achieved open carte-blanche to operate upon American citizens inside the USA. Some aspects of CIA domestic ventures include spreading "disinformation" and "misinformation". Agents who do this domestically have seriously-damaged mentalities which are "compartmentalized". They can speak to you just as this dude did. They are full of shit, and they are dangerous to you. Such people are programmed to lure you. This dude must not know your name or anything else about you. He is not "like-minded", no matter what he told you.
 
Regarding British Intelligence connections, that is true. As you'll recall, the OSS in WWII was trained by British Intelligence. It is another arm of the octopus which has probed into American life, this British connection inside CIA. You will likely find out in coming years that that recent school mass-murder in Russia was the brainchild of British Intelligence, and was likely carried out and/or sponsored by British Intel with the help of the CIA and the KGB. Misfit, these major Intel agencies work together, all of them, from the ISI and Mossad to British Intel and CIA and KGB. They are an effective arm of globalism, and they work together. Historic reference and example is the Gehlen Nazi aparatus brought here under Operation Paperclip after WWII and installed into CIA. Gehlen helped start the Cold War for Moscow and Washington DC. He did it with mis-info and dis-info given straight to the Pentagon and to the White House. He was one of Hitler's most reliable Intel guys, and he became CIA after Hitler lost the war. British Intel helped arrange that.
 
http://www.rense.com/general4/gends.htm (http://www.rense.com/general4/gends.htm)
 
Quote
He knows that this terrorist stuff is intentional planning to enslave us and that we've turned a corner that there's no going back for this country. His organization, though, is taking advantage of the situation to prepare themselves for the fall out. He said they have supplied safe places outside of the US and will get their people out when the time comes.

 
As I said, these sorts of operatives will try to lure you. Anyone who knows, and who has a plan, will *never* speak about that plan, even vaguely, to anyone. They lure you by coming across as a person who fears the power of government, who seeks to escape that power, and who is willing to confide to strangers their "plan". But this leads to "compartmentalization", which is a psychological tool used frequently by CIA. More on that later.
 
Quote
This guy was definitely not a "nut job".

 
Speaking without any authority derived from sharing that visit with him and you and your husband, I would say this: He is worse than a nut-job. I would suggest that you never meet him again. He is definitely dangerous to you.
 
Quote
He is obviously highly educated, knows what he's talking about, has serious cash flow and business sense. He's one of those guys who walks into a room and you know he's a CEO before you even introduce yourself.

 
Things are not always what they seem. Successful CIA men are highly Feducated and deeply entrenched in "the system". They run proprietary businesses. They deal in large amounts of capital and business cash-flows. The agent I interviewed last year works under James Woolsey at Booz-Allen, which is currently over-hauling the NYC police department to bring it in line with duties which CIA feels will be necessary in the coming police state. That man has his PhD and two Masters degrees and a work-history which would stagger you. He is a corporate executive. And somehow, he found a couple of hours to visit with me. Quaint, eh?
 
 
Quote
Certainly, I'm still being cautious about him, he could possibly be a plant. It could and is probably most likely a chance encounter, but if someone was looking for me they might think to find me where I was last night. I didn't say much to him, he did most of the talking. I most likely will see this guy again, so I guess we'll see what happens. Maybe I should do some checking into his story...(anybody got any useful resources on that, BTW?

 
I doubt anyone is "looking" for you. If "they" were looking for you you'd be dead of disappeared already. This was likely chance. It is up to you to see that the chance doesn't come 'round a second time. Your DNA is on the rim of a coffee cup or a spoon. Your car has a license plate parked outside. You may have been anonymously interviewed even if the man did not get your name. These people are psycho-trained and manipulated; they exist in our society at large; they have an agenda; they may not know how many compartments exist in their minds; they are often victims of government-installed hypnosis as part of their "training" prior to being let loose within society. Some part of this man's mental states is on call 24/7 to CIA. Never doubt that.
 
I want you to think more about "compartmentalization". This is used by CIA as part of their domestic psy-ops. The man you met may well have two or more complete and separate personalities, one or more of which may be extremely dangerous to you and to your family. When in public or when talking with strangers, be careful to not divulge your insights into governmental corruption in any specific way. It is permissible to note with strangers that "the government may be lying to us" or "I do not trust the government", but beyond those casual and common sorts of statements, tell strangers nothing about what you think, see, know, or understand about the nature of what Fedgov is today. If you have children, do not mention that to strangers. Some among us are indeed "plants"; they are paid by tax dollars to sift and sort randomly within the population.
 
Now after telling you all that paranoid stuff, I'll remind you to remain in contact with your inner spiritual source of happiness and peace, where you'll find your natural faith in life. Live your life without fear, knowing all the while that forces are afoot who seek to destroy our lives, but never succumbing to abject fear. The main thing is to not run your mouth to strangers, especially about "secret" stuff. And whenever you meet another person like that, do some serious background checking on him before any future visits.
 
And one last thing. Lots of people like to "pretend". Some idiots are also loose out there in the public at large, as I've met examples in Saloons and bars. Some people fantasize about being a part of the cloak and dagger community, the James Bond wannabes and such. This guy is too well-heeled to be one of those, so it's likely he is partially what he said he is. A final thing which causes me to suspect that he is telling you the truth about formerly working for CIA is his mentioning of "aliens". CIA is very big on generating "alien" myths right now, and unfortunately they have a large sector of the population in tow with that bullshit. I've met some of those too. FEMA is building nice places for those people who fall for that CIA disinfo program.
 
Misfit, be careful these days. What you know is what you know. Do not let it become the property of the government through government's psy-ops. This ain't the same America we grew up in. Hasn't been since the National Security Act of 1947 began to show its fruit. CIA murdered Kennedy and got away with it. The Cheney-Bush Junta has attempted to get away with executing 911, and may get away with it after all, even after we've got them caught dead to rights doing that job. Know what that CIA agent told me during my visit with him last year?
 
"Perception is Everything!"
 
Elias
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 26, 2004, 11:08:42 am
The U.S. Intelligence community, featured most-publicly with the CIA but populated by a large collection of non-CIA agencies, is a major tool of the globalizing socialist bankers. There are two faces of CIA; one is the collectors and analysts of raw intelligence data, which is peopled largely by well-meaning and usually-honorable men and women; the other is the clandestine branch of CIA which carries out "operations" of various sorts which cannot be publicly owned by official Governmental agencies. For example, the assassination of foreign Presidents of nations is always done by clandestine services of CIA. That is the part of CIA which I rail against constantly, and that arm of CIA is most evil and wretched. It is the part of CIA which murdered JFK, took this nation into Viet Nam, imports the cocaine and heroin, regulates the media (through the CFR), and other deeds which would earn CIA the death penalty were such deeds to come to public scrutiny.

I'm introducing the below brief piece here as it has bearing on my "conspiracy theory". Loosely defined, my conspiracy theory is that the U.S. government has been stolen from within and has been employed to establish for the globalizing socialist bankers a one-world-government in the form of an American Empire; and that elements within the Federal government conspired, organized, facilitated, and carried out the attacks of 911 (and other major terror events on U.S. soil).

One of the first, earliest, things CIA did after getting itself born in '47 was to subvert the Nuremburg War Crimes trials of numerous Nazis after WWII. They (CIA) did this by sneaking into this country a large number of Nazi scientists and intelligence operatives. I've mentioned above in a previous post this Nazi named Rheinhard Gehlen, who worked directly under Hitler. CIA brought that idiot over here with his entire aparatus of spy networks which had operated under Hitler in the Soviet Union. Nice bunch of guys, eh? Well, they were brought over here and put into our U.S. Intelligence community, namely in the CIA.  Behind that decision to do that, I'm guessing, was the background involvement of Clark Clifford and John Foster Dulles and Allen Dulles --- agents each and all of the globalizing socialist bankers, the Rockefellers, Morgans, Warburgs, and Rothschilds, the powers behind the creation of the "National Security" state in American governance.

Here is an article from four years ago which is good to use as a beginning for achieving an understanding of how the Nazis infiltrated the most secret and powerful agency in our Federal government: (and remember, British banking and Wall Street banking conspired to bring Hitler to power throughout the 1930s.)

~

CIA Admits Long Relationship
 With WWII German
 Gen. Reinhard Gehlen
By Maria Alvarez - The New York Post
9-24-00
 
 

 
COLLEGE PARK, Md. (UPI) - The Central Intelligence Agency has for the first time confirmed that a high-ranking Nazi general placed his anti-Soviet spy ring at the disposal of the United States during the early days of the Cold War.
 
The National Archives said in a release Wednesday that the CIA had filed an affidavit in U.S. District Court "acknowledging an intelligence relationship with German General Reinhard Gehlen that it has kept secret for 50 years."
 
"The CIA's announcement marks the first acknowledgement by that agency that it had any relationship with Gehlen and opens the way for declassification of records about the relationship," the National Archives said.
 
Gehlen was Hitler's senior intelligence officer on the Eastern Front during the war and transferred his expertise and contacts to the U.S. as World War II reached its climax. While Gehlen's relationship with U.S. intelligence during the 1940s and 1950s has been the topic of some five books over the years, the eventual release of CIA documents pertaining to the development of his European spy ring could shed new light on the origins of the Cold War and early U.S. espionage efforts against Moscow.
 
Gehlen's network of agents in Europe - including many with Nazi backgrounds who were bailed out of prisoner of war camps by U.S. intelligence officers - was known as the Gehlen Organization and received millions of dollars in funding from the U.S. until 1956.
 
The CIA's acknowledgement of its dealings with Gehlen came in a response to an appeal of a Freedom of Information Act request by researcher Carl Oglesby, the National Archives said. The agency pledged to release its records on the general in accordance with the Nazi War Crimes Disclosure Act.
 
The Act established the Nazi War Criminal Records Interagency Working Group (IWG), which for more than two years has been declassifying documents related to World War II war crimes and releasing them through the National Archives.
 
"This shows that the law is working," said former Rep. Elizabeth Holtzman, a member of the IWG. "We now must work closely with the Agency to follow through with the release of these records." _____
 
Copyright 2000 by United Press International. All rights reserved.

article found here:

http://www.rense.com/general4/gends.htm (http://www.rense.com/general4/gends.htm)

~

I found that article by Googling "Gehlen, CIA, Intelligence, Nazi". Here is Google's report on that entry:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-...G=Google+Search (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Gehlen%2C+CIA%2C+Intelligence%2C+Nazi&btnG=Google+Search)

Thanks for reading!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Misfit on October 26, 2004, 05:32:37 pm
Elias,

I was hoping and waiting to hear from you on my encounter. Thank you for the information and your advice. I do consider it valuable input into how to deal with this matter and any others that may come my way.

You are right, I think this was a chance encounter. I don't have any reason to suspect that anyone would want to look for me. Certainly, I cause some non-conformity trouble in my little sphere, as we all do here, but I'm sure I'm not even a tiny blip on the radar. Also, I do figure I'm too naive and clumsy to escape the eye of folks like that if they're looking for me (something I wish I could get at least somewhat better at). I guess what I was trying to say was that would be the place I would look as an amateur sleuth looking for me.

My real concern at this point is that this guy might have thought he got a nibble on his fishing expedition. I want to be real careful I don't wind up biting some hook that winds me up as the next "Weaver" case. I don't know that it's feasible to never encounter this guy again as he came to my church, where I'm a member. I can't just leave there and never return because this guy might come back. If he does and there seems to be mounting concern then I will head for the hills, no question. My first inclinations on this guy are probably what I should follow. He mentioned "Homeland Security contract" and I thought "Stay away from this guy." I usually bite my tongue around anyone who has anything to do with the government, whether it be police, military or someone who works the copy machine at the county offices. If this guy does come around again and starts up the same line of conversation I'll just smile, nod occasionally, keep a firm bite...and then run like hell.

Funny thing is that he said exactly what you said about disinformation and agent provocateurs. That the CIA sends out people who are "ex-agents" (who are still really on the pay roll) to spread propaganda, like on radio shows and such. And that 1 in 3 militia members are agents and often militia groups are even started by agents. So, I'm standing there thinking "Is he using reverse psychology on me?" Trying to make me think he can't be one if he's telling me about their tactics.  

Cautiously yours,

Misfit  :blink:  :ph34r:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 27, 2004, 12:52:23 pm
Institutes of International Affairs

Chatham House - Daddy of 'em all (The Royal Institute of International Affairs)

Canadian Institute of International Affairs
Danish Institute of International Affairs
Australian Institute of International Affairs
The Japan Institute of International Affairs
The Finnish Institute of International Affairs
The Swedish Institute of International Affairs
SIIA: Singapore Institute of International Affairs
Norwegian Institute of International Affairs
Armenian Ministry of Foreign Affairs
The South African Institute of International Affairs
Netherlands Institute of International Relations
Stanford Institute for International Studies
National Democratic Institute For International Affairs
(Etc.)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 27, 2004, 01:00:02 pm
Quote
Funny thing is that he said exactly what you said about disinformation and agent provocateurs. That the CIA sends out people who are "ex-agents" (who are still really on the pay roll) to spread propaganda, like on radio shows and such. And that 1 in 3 militia members are agents and often militia groups are even started by agents. So, I'm standing there thinking "Is he using reverse psychology on me?" Trying to make me think he can't be one if he's telling me about their tactics. 

 
Yup. That's how it's done. The wolf dresses up in a sheepskin, grins a friendly grin to take you in, and things go south from there.

CIA and other branches of "Intelligence" operatives are "out there" spreading disinfo and misinfo and baiting people. They are paid to do this. There is also a tier of "snitches", which Homeland Security seeks to expand, people who receive payment for turning in their good neighbors. This government's criminality is presently massively sinful and aggressive in its efforts to eradicate dissent. The bullshit about one in three militia people being CIA is ridiculous, but I'm confident I can say truthfully that every organized militia in the country sports at least one or more agent-provocateurs, plants.

To your advantage, there are far too many people right now who know about the criminality of which I speak. Fedgov hasn't got enough agents, lacks the manpower, to net even a fraction of them. That doesn't worry them, for they own the media (CFR is run by CIA, and CFR dictates the media's agenda).

So just stay cool, know what you know and don't share that knowledge with strangers. Intensify your connections within longstanding circles at your church and in your community. Offer people goodness and hope. Demonstrate your faith. And never take candy from strangers....

You'll be fine. :)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 27, 2004, 01:13:59 pm
Quote
Institutes of International Affairs

Chatham House - Daddy of 'em all (The Royal Institute of International Affairs)

Canadian Institute of International Affairs
Danish Institute of International Affairs
Australian Institute of International Affairs
The Japan Institute of International Affairs
The Finnish Institute of International Affairs
The Swedish Institute of International Affairs
SIIA: Singapore Institute of International Affairs
Norwegian Institute of International Affairs
Armenian Ministry of Foreign Affairs
The South African Institute of International Affairs
Netherlands Institute of International Relations
Stanford Institute for International Studies
National Democratic Institute For International Affairs
(Etc.)
Yup. Married in sin with the CFR, both the Chatham House and the Pratt House are at the core of dispersion for the globalizing socialist bankers.

http://www.riia.org/ (http://www.riia.org/)

I've been writing offline. I'll send some stuff your way this weekend. Meanwhile, good work.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on October 27, 2004, 03:38:17 pm
And big money, but not taxed--

1. Ford Foundation
2. Lilly Foundation
3. Rockefeller Foundation
4. Duke Endowment
5. Kresge Foundation
6. Kellogg Foundation
7. Mott Foundation
8. Pew Mutual Trust
9. Hartford Foundation
10. Alfred P. Sloan Foundation
11. Carnegie Foundation
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 28, 2004, 11:46:39 am
Quote
And big money, but not taxed--

1. Ford Foundation
2. Lilly Foundation
3. Rockefeller Foundation
4. Duke Endowment
5. Kresge Foundation
6. Kellogg Foundation
7. Mott Foundation
8. Pew Mutual Trust
9. Hartford Foundation
10. Alfred P. Sloan Foundation
11. Carnegie Foundation
I think it is just fine to inlcude the "Foundations" in our evolving landscape of conspiracy, for each Foundation is a tool of the globalizing socialist bankers. Here is more ammo with which to support that premise, thanks to Henrietta Bowman and Ragnar:

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=290&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

Also, we now have major insights into the Harvard Endowment's international (and domestic) tampering, thanks to the research of Catherine Austin Fitts and Michael Ruppert. More pieces to the puzzle, eh?

Nice work!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on October 28, 2004, 11:48:31 pm
Must read article (http://www.lewrockwell.com/reynolds/reynolds9.html) by Morgan Reynolds at LRC.
Quote
From the git-go, these armchair warriors claimed that "there was no greater menace in the world than Iraqi President Saddam Hussein" (p. 60). That’s aside from the threat they themselves pose to the world, I guess. Secretary of State Colin Powell, reacting to Donald Rumsfeld’s proposal to attack Iraq immediately after 9/11, said to Army General Hugh Shelton, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, "What the hell, what are these guys thinking about? Can’t you get these guys back in the box?" (p. 61).
Hey, Elias, are you writing under another alias?
Quote
The good news is that they remain fully eligible for indictment and subsequent trial for treason, high crimes and misdemeanors, and then incarceration for life or hanging.
Quote
Think about it: A few smart guys in caves over in Afghanistan and 19 Arab dummies here certainly did not pull this event off. They could never arrange a U.S. Air Force stand down on 9/11, the precise demolition of three steel skyscrapers at World Trade (after hitting only two of them with planes!), a small military drone or cruise missile to fly into and explode at the Pentagon, a shootdown of Flight 93 (or whatever plane it was), the suppression of intelligence from the field prior to 9/11, criminal destruction of evidence post-9/11, resistance to any independent investigation, and incriminating evidence of cover ups and consciousness of guilt by high government officials.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 29, 2004, 12:29:07 pm
Hmmm..... reckon Morgan Reynolds reads over here at times?

LOL!

Thanks for that heads-up, Ragnar.

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on October 31, 2004, 05:33:58 pm
New at TMM: Trick or Treat!

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=306&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

:)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 03, 2004, 03:23:00 am
Basil Fishbone sent me a link about the black boxes which Fedgov says were not found after the attacks on the WTC towers on 911. There is a lot of activity in posts added below that article, and I found myself sitting there reading over all of it. Finally, I left off there a post of my own, and I think that belongs here on this thread as well. Thanks mucho, Basil!

~

911 Black Box post
 
Note to self: This was posted on Nov 03 2004 below the article, found here:
 
http://www.pnionline.com/dnblog/extra/arch...ves/001139.html (http://www.pnionline.com/dnblog/extra/archives/001139.html)
 
I saved that page, after posting this, to a floppy disc named "911 Black Box"
 
~
 
I am one Honorably-discharged U.S. Marine, veteran of the Vietnam war, proud father of grown kids, ex-businessman, successful artist, peace-loving man. I have Mike Ruppert's book "Crossing The Rubicon". I have books by Bob Woodward, Daniel Ellsberg, Terry Reed, G. Edward Griffin, Sterling Seagrave, Alfred W. McCoy, Victor Marchetti, and etc and etc. I am approaching sixty years of age. I have had a wonderful and blessed life.  
 
 
I would like to get on the record here as being one more American who has awakened to the criminality of this berserk, insane governmental mechanism. I have no doubts about this government's involvement in 911. It most certainly was an "inside job". This dude named "wormwood" is a typical disinformation agent of the government.  
 
 
According to wormwood, our Government never took out the government of Iran in 1953; never smuggled cocaine into Mena, Arkansas; never flew the opium and heroin out of SE Asia for the French (Air America); never hid bombs inside the Murrah Building in OK City; never burned down Waco; never lied to us with the Warren Commission report; never lied about Vietnam; never lied about the Bay of Pigs; never lied about the Gary Powers U-2 shootdown over Russia; never lied to us about Iran-Contra; never lied to us about BCCI; never lied to us about creating al Qaeda; never lied to us about Bush's grandfather being one of Hitler's biggest bankers; never lied to us about a gasoline shortage back in the 1970s; never produced the Northwoods Document; and on and on the list could go about how truthful our government has always been with we the people. wormwood is here to reassure everyone that UNcle Sam is on our side, and that our government would never murder us, steal from us, or lie to us, and CERTAINLY would never have engineered a CIA covert "terror" event against us on US soil. wormwood is the worst kind of liar.
 
 
Dick Cheney was in charge of FIVE wargame "drills" on the morning of 911. Why did Mr. Cheney remain silent about that for three damn years? Why did Mr. Cheney forget to mention that some of those five wargame drills involved inserting fake "blips" onto the radar screens of the FAA and NORAD? Why did Mr. Cheney accept in silence the certain knowledge of the incredible odds against al Qaeda's knowing *when* to piggyback four hijackings onto the back of those wargames? I agree with Ruppert: Cheney is the prime suspect in the attacks of 911. I highly suggest getting Ruppert's book, available here: http://www.copvcia.com (http://www.copvcia.com)
 
 
The American CIA created al Qaeda and empowered Osama bin Laden to fight the Russians. Al Qaeda and bin Laden are known CIA assets, just as the Watergate burglars were "non-employee" assets of the CIA. This insanity goes back to the National SecurityAct of 1947, which was written by the man who would later bring BCCI into this nation under fraudulent treachery for the CIA, Clark Clifford; further, Clark Clifford had the services of the two Wall Street lawyers, John Foster Dulles and Alan Dulles, who were Prescott Bush's legal liaison between Hitler's Nazi Germany and the Harriman Company on Wall Street. In other words, the same banking interests which created the Federal Reserve System, Inc., in 1913 were involved in the 1930s in bringing Hitler to power in Germany (George Herbert Walker, Averell Harriman, Prescott Bush, the Rothschilds, the Warburgs, the Rockefellers, the Morgans), and then had the momentum to snow this country's trusting souls into accepting a National Security Act in 1947 which effectively created the CIA and gave the Federal government the "legal right" to LIE to us for our best good. And our best good was too treacherous for us to be entrusted with, so they kept their secrets from us while they pushed for the establishment of a New World Order, a One-World government, which is now conceived as the American Empire thanks to Zbigniew Brzezinski, the PNAC, the CFR, the Trilateral, the Bilderberger Group, and the international banking intrests which owns outright the Federal Reserve. The Federal Reserve owns controlling interest in the IMF/World Bank.  
 
 
If none of that means anything, just help me find out why, forty years after I fought against Communism in Vietnam, Clinton put Vietnam and China into the WTO? I'd like to know whether I was lied to about my service in Vietnam, about *why* I was over there. End of rant. Thanks. Salutes to all who dare stand up against this evil within. I salute all Americans who have the moral strength to question this government's lies. Got rope?
 
 
Elias Alias
 The Mental Militia
 http://www.thementalmilitia.org (http://www.thementalmilitia.org)
 
Posted by: Elias Alias at November 3, 2004 03:29 AM

end post.

~

Consciousness works. America is beginning to wake up. We are all going to have to face what our government has done to us, beginning with 911 and working back to at least the year 1913. It can happen. :)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Roy J. Tellason on November 03, 2004, 10:32:14 am
Quote
Consciousness works. America is beginning to wake up. We are all going to have to face what our government has done to us, beginning with 911 and working back to at least the year 1913. It can happen. :)
 
One hopes that the divisiveness that's apparent in this election is at least an indication that this process is actually beginning to get started...
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ladylearning on November 03, 2004, 10:38:02 am
Quote

Consciousness works. America is beginning to wake up. We are all going to have to face what our government has done to us, beginning with 911 and working back to at least the year 1913. It can happen. :)

Elias
Yeah, but it's a painful thing, this "waking up"... which is why many are still in denial.
I liken it to the process an individual goes through when he/she has been, or is being,  severly traumatized. Finding the strength and balance to remove the source, face the pain and get beyond it is absolutely necessary for quality of life to exist.
America has been traumatized.
But you're right, many many people are stirring and even the most insignificant acceptance of government mis-deed starts a process that can only culminate in total awareness once the enormity of the hoax is revealed.  It's a critical mass thing.
Eventually it will take on it's on momentum and people will rise up against the imposter government.  You're right, consciousness does work, but where we diverge in our thinking is that I do not think it will be bloodless.  

LL
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ZooT_aLLures on November 03, 2004, 11:09:13 am
LL,

Of course it won't be bloodless.

Upon realizing that they've lost their meal ticket government will send it's trolls to instill fear among the people(as it is now) and attempt to force the people to "believe" in government or at least do as government says.

While many "more" voted this time around, they were still more that didn't vote, and while the media portrays these nonvoters as those who "just don't care".........I myself prefer to think of them as the most active of voters.........and they've placed a "no confidence" vote thus denying the facade of legitimacy to this government.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Joel on November 03, 2004, 11:55:46 am
Quote
Consciousness works. America is beginning to wake up. We are all going to have to face what our government has done to us, beginning with 911 and working back to at least the year 1913. It can happen.

It CAN happen, Elias, but I'm not confident that it will.  I was sure back in 1970, after the Kent State shootings, that Americans would wake up to what their government was becoming.  I was serenely confident of it.  I was dead wrong, as Emperor Palpatine said, about a great many things.

Now I'm a grouchy fart in my fifties, and no longer prepared to underestimate the inertia and complaiscency of my fellow man.  But if we can arrange for anything more than a suicidal "lone nut" scenario that'll actually accomplish something, I'll be up there toward the front somewhere.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 03, 2004, 12:12:40 pm
Quote
Quote
Consciousness works. America is beginning to wake up. We are all going to have to face what our government has done to us, beginning with 911 and working back to at least the year 1913. It can happen. :)
 
One hopes that the divisiveness that's apparent in this election is at least an indication that this process is actually beginning to get started...
A thought in a mind is like a wind in the world. The same thought in many minds is like a tornado across the land. Politicians know this and they do their deed with full knowledge of this. The political process is the focused insertion of thought into the mind of the public at large. Politicians know, both by intuition and by learning, how to implant thoughts in the public mind.

The Kerry-Bush tandem has successfully implanted a statist meme into the collective mind of the nation. Yet no one shall hear that meme spelled out in the press or media.

Those among us who think for themselves, the alienated, the outsiders, the moralists, the sane --- the individualistic sovereign and autonomous free moral agent --- are the few who stand amazed by the sleep-states of the masses who follow the political jingles despite every evidence of falseness, and we realize there is no where to run any more, no way to simply move away from the maddening crowds of useless duplicates who bow to every new face of whatever current Leadership is presented. This election did nothing to free truth in the minds and hearts of the American people.

It was 1917 when JP Morgan commissioned his infamous study into how one might become able to influence the national mentality, into how much of the press and media one must dominate in order to influence and control the public mind. His committee returned the finding that Morgan needed only 25 of the largest media outlets to accomplish his goals. That is why JP Morgan put 25 newspaper editors in power, and that is why one of the functions of the CFR is the management of the national media. Since that time, the American public has sustained a constant numbing assault upon the summed consciousness, the public consciousness.

The involvement in this year's selection of a President by voters who have experienced a heightened sense of closure, or personal interest, is mute testament of a darkly-hidden and obfuscated agenda. There was absolutely no choice for any voter other than the choice between fascism and socialism, two strong legs on which stand the statist plans of the New World Order. Yet the voters, almost to the man, were motivated to believe that there was a real choice.

The American Sleeple have chosen in their collective dream-state a future of fascist police-state repression, the Cheney-Bush Junta, thinking all the whlle they were choosing freedom and security. The kicker is that they never realized they had no choice, and shall grow defensive if anyone tries to expose the fraud under which their thought was formed.

But bearing that in mind, I'll agree with you that the participation in this year's election has given grounds to almost half of the voting public to begin the awakening. Emotional disappointment is a stimulus for resultant thought. My wish is to help that awakening occur with as little error as possible. When Cheney is arrested for his role in 911, and Bush's complicity is revealed alongside, the spark of a real awakening shall ignite. At that time there will be a great need for the consciousness which is daily shared by those fore-runners of light here at the Claire Files boards.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 03, 2004, 12:49:53 pm
Quote
Now I'm a grouchy fart in my fifties, and no longer prepared to underestimate the inertia and complaiscency of my fellow man.  But if we can arrange for anything more than a suicidal "lone nut" scenario that'll actually accomplish something, I'll be up there toward the front somewhere.
Well, you sound a lot like me. There has been ample evidence of governmental aggression against its own people, yet the public has been misled time and again to think that it is some fabricated and demonized "enemy" who did the deed. The people did not revolt over the Warren Commission, for example; according to Cynthia McKinney, the people should have revolted then. I agree with her. But at the time the Commission reported its findings, I was as sleep-bound as the rest of the sheeple, buried in my own interests. Now that I've awakened to the acute governmental criminality, I find that I am a member in a very small group of awake individuals who are now at the mercy of the brainwashed public consciousness which itself is in the control of the media and those who own that media. We have a long hard road, at best. But I'll be right there with you, taking our steps uphill one at a time and never losing sight of the importance for preserving individuality under the tyranny of the mass state.

Our consolation? On our last day on earth, we'll be able to look back with a clean conscience and know that once we awakened to the evil within we fought against it with all we had to give. That certain knowledge makes it worth while to me to keep up the good fight every day, with every breath. I'm sure you feel the same way too.

So let's figure out how we can arrest this damned imposter government, eh?

:)
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on November 03, 2004, 04:38:27 pm
Quote
I was sure back in 1970, after the Kent State shootings, that Americans would wake up to what their government was becoming.
I remember saying at one time "the best thing that could happen would be for Jimmee Cahhtuh to be elected. Then things will go downhill so fast, people will be able to see what is going on and wake up and finally put a stop to it." I'm still waiting.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 03, 2004, 06:28:26 pm
I wonder about that. It's obvious that things have gone astray and that some major arresting oughta be done. But, the how is still not forming too well. If you know 4GW (or 5GW per speaker), then that seems like the future rather than any kind of mass action. Though, ya' support what ya' can. Fireflies swoop and flash and might even buzz if you get close enough, but are only a group by accident. I'd say that action is gonna hafta grow in coordination with more traditional groups-- Libs, constitutionalists, old guard repubs, some christians, and so on.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Roy J. Tellason on November 04, 2004, 12:47:10 am
Quote
 
Quote
It was 1917 when JP Morgan commissioned his infamous study into how one might become able to influence the national mentality, into how much of the press and media one must dominate in order to influence and control the public mind. His committee returned the finding that Morgan needed only 25 of the largest media outlets to accomplish his goals. That is why JP Morgan put 25 newspaper editors in power, and that is why one of the functions of the CFR is the management of the national media. Since that time, the American public has sustained a constant numbing assault upon the summed consciousness, the public consciousness.

I don't think I've heard of that one before,  and if you should happen across a link to it somewhere in your travels I'd like to snag a copy to have on hand here...

Quote
But bearing that in mind, I'll agree with you that the participation in this year's election has given grounds to almost half of the voting public to begin the awakening. Emotional disappointment is a stimulus for resultant thought.

Yeah,  it's a start at least.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 04, 2004, 02:12:01 am
Quote
Quote
 
Quote
It was 1917 when JP Morgan commissioned his infamous study into how one might become able to influence the national mentality, into how much of the press and media one must dominate in order to influence and control the public mind. His committee returned the finding that Morgan needed only 25 of the largest media outlets to accomplish his goals. That is why JP Morgan put 25 newspaper editors in power, and that is why one of the functions of the CFR is the management of the national media. Since that time, the American public has sustained a constant numbing assault upon the summed consciousness, the public consciousness.

I don't think I've heard of that one before,  and if you should happen across a link to it somewhere in your travels I'd like to snag a copy to have on hand here...

 
Happy to oblige, good neighbor. I first caught wind of that story while watching a film on the CFR - Media connection. Here is a link which refers to the story's entry into the Congressional record. Is it true? Should be easy enough to look up, since this page gives the page numbers and date of entry into the record.

http://www.iahf.com/media.html (http://www.iahf.com/media.html)

From that link:

THE CONGRESSIONAL RECORD FEBRUARY 9, 1917 -
 PAGE 2947 & PAGE 2948.

 Mr. CALLAWAY. Mr. Chairman, under unanimous consent, I insert in the record at this point a statement showing the newspaper combination, which explains their activity in this war matter, just discussed by the gentleman from Pennsylvania,

[Mr. Moore]: "In March, 1915, the J.P. Morgan interests, the steel, shipbuilding, and powder interests, and their subsidiary organizations, got together 12 men high up in the newspaper world and employed them to select the most influential newspapers in the United States and sufficient number of them to control generally the policy of the daily press of the United States.

"These 12 men worked the problem out by selecting 170 newspapers, and then began, by an elimination process, to retain only those necessary for the purpose of controlling the general policy of the daily press throughout the country. They found it was only necessary to purchase the control of 25 of the greatest newspapers.

"The 25 papers were agreed upon; emissaries were sent to purchase the policy, national and international, of these papers; an agreement was reached; the policy of the papers was bought, to be paid for by the month; an editor was furnished for each paper to properly supervise and edit information regarding the questions of preparedness, militarism, financial policies, and other things of national and international nature considered vital to the interest of the purchasers.

"This contract is in existence at the present time, and it accounts for the news columns of the daily press of the country being filled with all sorts of preparedness argument and misrepresentations as to the present condition of the United States Army and Navy and the possibility and probability of the United States being attacked by foreign foes.

"This policy also included the suppression of everything in opposition to the wishes of the interests served. The effectiveness of this scheme has been conclusively demonstrated by the character of stuff carried in the daily press throughout the country since March, 1915. They have resorted to anything necessary to commercialize public sentiment and sandbag the national congress into making extravagant and wasteful appropriations for the Army and Navy under the false pretense that it was necessary. Their stock argument is that it is "patriotism." They are playing on every prejudice and passion of the American people."

Mr. MOORE of Pennsylvania. Mr. Chairman, I move to strike out the last word. I am in favor of this paragraph in the Navy appropriation bill, because I think the country ought to be fully prepared for any possible invasion; but I think the Congress ought to be careful about encouraging "rumors of war" when war has not actually been declared. Perhaps it would be safe to leave this matter to the President of the United States and to those who have direct knowledge upon the subject. I call attention, however, not only to these false reports of the Housatonic and about the California, but the steamship Philadelphia was reported sunk since the President was here, and yet the next day, after these reports had gone over the country like wildfire and everybody got excited about the Philadelphia, which naturally attracted interest in that great city and in the State of Pennsylvania, we found the Philadelphia had safely arrived in port, so that report was also in error.

Now, whether by design or not I do not know, but it seems that most of these false reports come from London. There seems to be an intense desire there to tell us about German outrages and about American blood shed on foreign ships or to find that some American ship has been shot up.

end pasted section from above link.

~

Here is an extra treat for ya:

"We are grateful to The Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But, the work is now much more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national autodetermination practiced in past centuries."
David Rockefeller, June, 1991

This statement is very likely to be very true. I cannot at this moment give you authentication for the quote, but my memory  suggests to me that the quote is quite valid. Perhaps other readers here know a reputable source for it and will step forward with a link.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 04, 2004, 05:07:34 am
I don't have audio, but this could be the source of the quote.
A different site lists it as the source:

Quote from Con. Ron Paul with audio clip:
http://www.propagandamatrix.com/260903ronpaul.html (http://www.propagandamatrix.com/260903ronpaul.html)
---
Congressman Ron Paul Admits Conspiracy to Create World Government

911Exposed.com

Eric Rainbolt - audience member asking question of Congressman Paul at event near Austin, Texas on August 30th, 2003: "Congressman Paul, I have a question..."

Moderator: "Over here." (pointing to Eric Rainbolt.)

Eric Rainbolt: "Great! If we can take a look at the big picture, could you tell us, the people in this room, any information that you may have of an international and deceptive conspiracy to overthrow the American Republic and its Constitution & Bill Of Rights in order to set up and usher in a totalitarian World Government likely espoused under the UN also.."?

Congressman Paul: " He asked if there was an international conspiracy to overthrow our government. The answer is "Yes". I think there are 25,000 individuals that have used offices of powers, and they are in our Universities and they are in our Congresses, and they believe in One World Government. And if you believe in One World Goverment, then you are talking about undermining National Sovereignty and you are talking about setting up something that you could well call a Dictatorship - and those plans are there!..."
---
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 04, 2004, 07:32:38 am
That is an interesting speech by Ron Paul. Everyone can get it by going here and ordering the tape called "Matrix of Evil".

http://www.infowars.com/videos.html#matrix (http://www.infowars.com/videos.html#matrix)

When asked about the conspiracy, Paul states: "Well, yeah, but not in the way people usually think....."

That quote I just typed in is from memory, which is faulty, so I'll have to play that tape again to get you the exact quote. It's a great speech by Ron Paul, and it's followed by Alex Jones' best-ever speech (imo). Both men spoke to a crowd of constituents in Austin, Texas on the same afternoon, and both gave great speeches. Anyway, yes, Ron Paul's comments were very close to what you've posted above, though not exact. I'll watch the film again and type in his exact words.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on November 05, 2004, 02:14:49 am
I thought about starting a new thread for this, but I might as well just put it here.

Yassar Arafat. - I heard that they don't know what his illness is. My first thought - CIA assasination. Then, while I was at the dentist today they had CNN on and the scrolling news said that Bush and Arafat never have been able to work together for a "mideast peace." It then said something about if Arafat dies, there is a possibility that he would be replaced by someone with whom Bush could work. My second thought - CIA assasination.  :ph34r:

Somethin's scwewy in saint lewey   :blink:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 03:27:56 am
An earlier writin' I did meaning to post:

- - -

The conspiracy is composed of an 'open' conspiracy where the actions are not secret
and not illegal within the culture where they are done (CFRs) and a series of
'closed' conspiracies (CCs) where the actions are illegal, immoral, or both. The CCs
are not necessarily related although their results may be helpful to others. One CC
may cooperate with another CC, but which parties are involved changes over time and
with each CC. Then there are also a slough of very small CCs-- bureaucrats trying to
get raises or save their jobs.

The main, largest part of the conspiracy centers on big money-- CFR, the Fed, and
subborning govts everywhere. A smaller conspiracy is Skull and Bones, which being
involved in garnering big money, also carries on trade and cooperation with other big
money families and also tries to subborn govts. However, Skull and Bones is not the
Rothschild families nor the Rockefeller families eventhough it may be a big part of
the Cheneys or Bushes. Note that GWB does not seem to be CFR, although common
cooperation among the big money families still seems to require CFR as the main
source for subordinates.

One could say that the big error in attempting limited govt was still giving the govt
access to big money and rule making (that affects big money making). Thus, it became
the target for control by those big money interests either individually or severally.

The recent CCs include:

1. WTC Bombing - 1993 (under William Clinton)

2. OKC Bombing - 1995 (under William Clinton)

3. 9-11 Fiasco - 2001 (George W. Bush)

But what might be said about these, their players, and their purposes?

- - -

There I'd also point out that these folk sent lots of money to their agents in Czarist Russia at the time of the revolution, about $20m, that's $2b in today's inflated dollar. The amount of money involved in these groups makes for the possibility of many different ongoing CCs throughout the world. It's almost beyond single people to even track it all.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 07:28:01 am
Elias,

At bankindex.com is

Notes and Quotes: This Is How Our Fine Country Was Destroyed In 1913

August 16, 2002
 
Compiled by Victor Thorn
- - -

Thorn? Already at TMM?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on November 05, 2004, 08:49:35 am
Thanks, Elias and Junker and all, for the facts.  Sheesh, I sure am learning a lot in a short time.

Strange and liberating sensation, to have my vague suspicions of gummint transformed into definite knowledge.   :ph34r:  B)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 05, 2004, 11:05:33 am

Thus spake Junker:
 
Quote
The conspiracy is composed of an 'open' conspiracy where the actions are not secret and not illegal within the culture where they are done (CFRs) and a series of
'closed' conspiracies (CCs) where the actions are illegal, immoral, or both. The CCs
are not necessarily related although their results may be helpful to others. One CC
may cooperate with another CC, but which parties are involved changes over time and
with each CC. Then there are also a slough of very small CCs-- bureaucrats trying to
get raises or save their jobs.

 
I agree with your prognosis of an "open conspiracy" and a series of illegal "closed conspiracies". The changing of players from one closed conspriacy to another is a source of fascinating discoveries. For instance, we can look back to the Phoenix Program in Viet Nam and note with disgust the name of one Felix Rodrigues and another man named John Poindexter.  
 
Phoenix Program is responsible for a known 20,000 or more assassinations executed by CIA using local mercenaries and various US Military special forces such as Green Berets and Force Recons and Seals.  When we move forward in time from Viet Nam's horror, we find Felix Rodrigues and John Poindexter again, this time they are both involved with Ollie North and H.W. Bush in Iran-Contra. And as if that were not tell-tale enough, we now find John Poindexter working at DARPA in the Total Information Awareness program, despite having been convicted of crimes by Congress under John Kerry's cover-up/control Iran-Contra commission.  
 
http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/dod/poindexter.html (http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/dod/poindexter.html)
 
http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB113/ (http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB113/)
 
From that site: "North tells Poindexter that Noriega can assist with sabotage against the Sandinistas, and suggests paying Noriega a million dollars -- from "Project Democracy" funds raised from the sale of U.S. arms to Iran -- for the Panamanian leader's help in destroying Nicaraguan economic installations."  
 
The level of criminality which infests U.S. "foreign policy" as orchestrated by CIA is astounding, but the mainstream media seldom touches upon it. But consider this tidbit of news from Mike Ruppert in his new book, "Crossing The Rubicon":
 
~
 
begin quote from Crossing The Rubicon, pages450 and 451:
 
"Thomas Kean (chairman of the 911 Commission) is a director and shareholder of Amerada Hess Corporation, which is involved in the Hess-Delta joint vtnture with Delta Oil of Saudi Arabia (owned by the Al-Amoudi clans). Delta-Hess 'was established in 1998 for the development and exploration of oil fields in the Caspian region....In Azerbaijan Delta Hess is involved in the Azeri-Chirag-Gunashli PSA [Production Sharing Agreement] ... and the Garabaghli-KKursangi PSA..... It is also an equity holder in the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan (BTC) oil pipeline': An air of mystery hangs over Delta-Hess, which .... is registered in the Cayman Islands. Hess is in no hurry to reveal the terms of the alliance, which itsays are subject to confidentiality clauses. 'There's no reason why this should be public information', a Hess spokesman says'.....
 
"Coincidentally, the former Governor of New Jersey is also a member of the Council on Foreign Relations, together with another  prominent member of the board of directors of Amerada Hess, former Secretary of the Treasury Nicholas Brady.
 
"It is also worth mentioning that Thomas Kean also sits as co-chairman of the Homeland Security Project (HSP) under the auspices of the Century Foundation. In this capacity, Kean has played a key role in the draft recommendations of the Cenruty Foundation, which laid the groundwork of the Office of Homeland Security legislations."
 
end quotation from Crossing The Rubicon
 
~
 
Remember that Bush first appointed Kissinger to head the committee. Kean is a player with invested interests in furthering the hidden agenda of the Bush Administration.
 
 
 
Quote
The main, largest part of the conspiracy centers on big money-- CFR, the Fed, and
subborning govts everywhere. A smaller conspiracy is Skull and Bones, which being
involved in garnering big money, also carries on trade and cooperation with other big
money families and also tries to subborn govts. However, Skull and Bones is not the
Rothschild families nor the Rockefeller families eventhough it may be a big part of
the Cheneys or Bushes. Note that GWB does not seem to be CFR, although common
cooperation among the big money families still seems to require CFR as the main
source for subordinates.

 
I think that Skull and Bones is actually an extension of Rothschild philosophy, and the hint is given in earlier pages of this thread. Banking interests in England have succumbed to Rothschild since the battle of Waterloo, which means that the British banking interests which made the Russell Company (New England Tory Party) wealthy were reflected in interest in the program of Skull and Bones. Just wanted to toss that note in for ya. Concerning GW and the CFR, he likely fulfills CFR needs best by NOT being a known member. But I'll wager 10 to 1 that copies of Foreign Affairs adorn the bookshelves in the White House. :)
 
Quote
One could say that the big error in attempting limited govt was still giving the govt
access to big money and rule making (that affects big money making). Thus, it became
the target for control by those big money interests either individually or severally.

 
BINGO! Salute!
 
Quote
The recent CCs include:
 
1. WTC Bombing - 1993 (under William Clinton)
 
2. OKC Bombing - 1995 (under William Clinton)
 
3. 9-11 Fiasco - 2001 (George W. Bush)
 
But what might be said about these, their players, and their purposes?

 
Each of those three examples of government-sponsored terrorist acts on U.S. soil were engineered to lever America into a police state wherein Federal controls over the population could squash any dissent and resistance to the coming New World Order. That is why Ashcroft's legislations are so horrendous to our liberty. Here, for your reading pleasure, is Alex Jones:
 
~
 
from here on November 04, 2004
 
http://www.bankindex.com/read.asp?ID=1659 (http://www.bankindex.com/read.asp?ID=1659)
 
~
 
SHOCKING EXPOSURE BY ALEX JONES: The Secret Patriot Act II Destroys What Is Left of American Liberty  
 
 
 
Secret Patriot Act II Destroys  
 Remaining US Liberty
 Total Police State Takeover
 The Secret Patriot Act II Destroys What  
 Is Left of American Liberty
 By Alex Jones
 
 
 Congressman Ron Paul (R-Tex) told the Washington Times that no member of Congress was allowed to read the first Patriot Act that was passed by the House on October 27, 2001. The first Patriot Act was universally decried by civil libertarians and Constitutional scholars from across the political spectrum. William Safire, while writing for the New York Times, described the first Patriot Act's powers by saying that President Bush was seizing dictatorial control.  
 
 On February 7, 2003 the Center for Public Integrity, a non-partisan public interest think-tank in DC, revealed the full text of the Domestic Security Enhancement Act of 2003. The classified document had been leaked to them by an unnamed source inside the Federal government. The document consisted of a 33-page section by section analysis of the accompanying 87-page bill.  
 
 *Note: On February 10, 2003 I discovered that not only was there a house version that had been covertly brought to Hastert, but that many provisions of the now public Patriot Act II had already been introduced as pork barrel riders on Senate Bill S. 22. Dozens of subsections and even the titles of the subsections are identical to those in the House version. This is very important because it catches the Justice Department in a bald-faced lie. The Justice Department claimed that the secret legislation brought into the House was only for study, and that at this time there was no intention to try and pass it. Now upon reading S. 22, it is clear that the leadership of the Senate is fully aware of the Patriot Act II, and have passed these riders out of their committees into the full bill. I spent two hours scanning through S. 22 and, let me tell you, it is a nightmare for anyone who loves liberty. It even contains the Our Lady of Peace Act that registers all gun owners. It bans the private sale of all firearms, creates a Federal ballistics database, and much more.  
 
 The bill itself is stamped 'Confidential ö Not for Distribution.' Upon reading the analysis and bill, I was stunned by the scientifically crafted tyranny contained in the legislation. The Justice Department Office of Legislative Affairs admits that they had indeed covertly transmitted a copy of the legislation to Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert, (R-Il) and the Vice President of the United States, Dick Cheney as well as the executive heads of federal law enforcement agencies.  
 
 It is important to note that no member of Congress was allowed to see the first Patriot Act before its passage, and that no debate was tolerate by the House and Senate leadership. The intentions of the White House and Speaker Hastert concerning Patriot Act II appear to be a carbon copy replay of the events that led to the unprecedented passage of the first Patriot Act.  
 
 There are two glaring areas that need to be looked at concerning this new legislation:  
 
 1. The secretive tactics being used by the White House and Speaker Hastert to keep even the existence of this legislation secret would be more at home in Communist China than in the United States. The fact that Dick Cheney publicly managed the steamroller passage of the first Patriot Act, insuring that no one was allowed to read it and publicly threatening members of Congress that if they didn't vote in favor of it that they would be blamed for the next terrorist attack, is by the White House's own definition terrorism. The move to clandestinely craft and then bully passage of any legislation by the Executive Branch is clearly an impeachable offense.  
 
 2. The second Patriot Act is a mirror image of powers that Julius Caesar and Adolf Hitler gave themselves. Whereas the First Patriot Act only gutted the First, Third, Fourth and Fifth Amendments, and seriously damaged the Seventh and the Tenth, the Second Patriot Act reorganizes the entire Federal government as well as many areas of state government under the dictatorial control of the Justice Department, the Office of Homeland Security and the FEMA NORTHCOM military command. The Domestic Security Enhancement Act 2003, also known as the Second Patriot Act is by its very structure the definition of dictatorship.  
 
 I challenge all Americans to study the new Patriot Act and to compare it to the Constitution, Bill of Rights and Declaration of Independence. Ninety percent of the act has nothing to do with terrorism and is instead a giant Federal power-grab with tentacles reaching into every facet of our society. It strips American citizens of all of their rights and grants the government and its private agents total immunity.  
 
 Here is a quick thumbnail sketch of just some of the draconian measures encapsulated within this tyrannical legislation:  
 
 SECTION 501 (Expatriation of Terrorists) expands the Bush administration's "enemy combatant" definition to all American citizens who "may" have violated any provision of Section 802 of the first Patriot Act. (Section 802 is the new definition of domestic terrorism, and the definition is "any action that endangers human life that is a violation of any Federal or State law.") Section 501 of the second Patriot Act directly connects to Section 125 of the same act. The Justice Department boldly claims that the incredibly broad Section 802 of the First USA Patriot Act isn't broad enough and that a new, unlimited definition of terrorism is needed.  
 
 Under Section 501 a US citizen engaging in lawful activities can be grabbed off the street and thrown into a van never to be seen again. The Justice Department states that they can do this because the person "had inferred from conduct" that they were not a US citizen. Remember Section 802 of the First USA Patriot Act states that any violation of Federal or State law can result in the "enemy combatant" terrorist designation.  
 
 SECTION 201 of the second Patriot Act makes it a criminal act for any member of the government or any citizen to release any information concerning the incarceration or whereabouts of detainees. It also states that law enforcement does not even have to tell the press who they have arrested and they never have to release the names.  
 
 SECTION 301 and 306 (Terrorist Identification Database) set up a national database of "suspected terrorists" and radically expand the database to include anyone associated with suspected terrorist groups and anyone involved in crimes or having supported any group designated as "terrorist." These sections also set up a national DNA database for anyone on probation or who has been on probation for any crime, and orders State governments to collect the DNA for the Federal government.  
 
 SECTION 312 gives immunity to law enforcement engaging in spying operations against the American people and would place substantial restrictions on court injunctions against Federal violations of civil rights across the board.  
 
 SECTION 101 will designate individual terrorists as foreign powers and again strip them of all rights under the "enemy combatant" designation.  
 
 SECTION 102 states clearly that any information gathering, regardless of whether or not those activities are illegal, can be considered to be clandestine intelligence activities for a foreign power. This makes news gathering illegal.  
 
 SECTION 103 allows the Federal government to use wartime martial law powers domestically and internationally without Congress declaring that a state of war exists.  
 
 SECTION 106 is bone-chilling in its straightforwardness. It states that broad general warrants by the secret FSIA court (a panel of secret judges set up in a star chamber system that convenes in an undisclosed location) granted under the first Patriot Act are not good enough. It states that government agents must be given immunity for carrying out searches with no prior court approval. This section throws out the entire Fourth Amendment against unreasonable searches and seizures.  
 
 SECTION 109 allows secret star chamber courts to issue contempt charges against any individual or corporation who refuses to incriminate themselves or others. This sections annihilate the last vestiges of the Fifth Amendment.  
 
 SECTION 110 restates that key police state clauses in the first Patriot Act were not sunsetted and removes the five year sunset clause from other subsections of the first Patriot Act. After all, the media has told us: "this is the New America. Get used to it. This is forever."  
 
 SECTION 111 expands the definition of the "enemy combatant" designation.  
 
 SECTION 122 restates the government's newly announced power of "surveillance without a court order."  
 
 SECTION 123 restates that the government no longer needs warrants and that the investigations can be a giant dragnet-style sweep described in press reports about the Total Information Awareness Network. One passage reads, "thus the focus of domestic surveillance may be less precise than that directed against more conventional types of crime."  
 
 *Note: Over and over again, in subsection after subsection, the second Patriot Act states that its new Soviet-type powers will be used to fight international terrorism, domestic terrorism and other types of crimes. Of course the government has already announced in Section 802 of the first USA Patriot act that any crime is considered domestic terrorism.  
 
 SECTION 126 grants the government the right to mine the entire spectrum of public and private sector information from bank records to educational and medical records. This is the enacting law to allow ECHELON and the Total Information Awareness Network to totally break down any and all walls of privacy.  
 
 The government states that they must look at everything to "determine" if individuals or groups might have a connection to terrorist groups. As you can now see, you are guilty until proven innocent.  
 
 SECTION 127 allows the government to takeover coroners' and medical examiners' operations whenever they see fit. See how this is like Bill Clinton's special medical examiner he had in Arkansas that ruled that people had committed suicide when their arms and legs had been cut off.  
 
 SECTION 128 allows the Federal government to place gag orders on Federal and State Grand Juries and to take over the proceedings. It also disallows individuals or organizations to even try to quash a Federal subpoena. So now defending yourself will be a terrorist action.  
 
 SECTION 129 destroys any remaining whistleblower protection for Federal agents.  
 
 SECTION 202 allows corporations to keep secret their activities with toxic biological, chemical or radiological materials.  
 
 SECTION 205 allows top Federal officials to keep all their financial dealings secret, and anyone investigating them can be considered a terrorist. This should be very useful for Dick Cheney to stop anyone investigating Haliburton.  
 
 SECTION 303 sets up national DNA database of suspected terrorists. The database will also be used to "stop other unlawful activities." It will share the information with state, local and foreign agencies for the same purposes.  
 
 SECTION 311 federalizes your local police department in the area of information sharing.  
 
 SECTION 313 provides liability protection for businesses, especially big businesses that spy on their customers for Homeland Security, violating their privacy agreements. It goes on to say that these are all preventative measures ö has anyone seen Minority Report? This is the access hub for the Total Information Awareness Network.  
 
 SECTION 321 authorizes foreign governments to spy on the American people and to share information with foreign governments.  
 
 SECTION 322 removes Congress from the extradition process and allows officers of the Homeland Security complex to extradite American citizens anywhere they wish. It also allows Homeland Security to secretly take individuals out of foreign countries.  
 
 SECTION 402 is titled "Providing Material Support to Terrorism." The section reads that there is no requirement to show that the individual even had the intent to aid terrorists.  
 
 SECTION 403 expands the definition of weapons of mass destruction to include any activity that affects interstate or foreign commerce.  
 
 SECTION 404 makes it a crime for a terrorist or "other criminals" to use encryption in the commission of a crime.  
 
 SECTION 408 creates "lifetime parole" (basically, slavery) for a whole host of crimes.  
 
 SECTION 410 creates no statute of limitations for anyone that engages in terrorist actions or supports terrorists. Remember: any crime is now considered terrorism under the first Patriot Act.  
 
 SECTION 411 expands crimes that are punishable by death. Again, they point to Section 802 of the first Patriot Act and state that any terrorist act or support of terrorist act can result in the death penalty.  
 
 SECTION 421 increases penalties for terrorist financing. This section states that any type of financial activity connected to terrorism will result to time in prison and $10-50,000 fines per violation.  
 
 SECTIONS 427 sets up asset forfeiture provisions for anyone engaging in terrorist activities.  
 
 There are many other sections that I did not cover in the interest of time. The American people were shocked by the despotic nature of the first Patriot Act. The second Patriot Act dwarfs all police state legislation in modern world history.  
 
 Usually, corrupt governments allow their citizens lots of wonderful rights on paper, while carrying out their jackbooted oppression covertly. From snatch and grab operations to warantless searches, Patriot Act II is an Adolf Hitler wish list.  
 
 You can understand why President Bush, Dick Cheney and Dennis Hastert want to keep this legislation secret not just from Congress, but the American people as well. Bill Allison, Managing Editor of the Center for Public Integrity, the group that broke this story, stated on my radio show that it was obvious that they were just waiting for another terrorist attack to opportunistically get this new bill through. He then shocked me with an insightful comment about how the Federal government was crafting this so that they could go after the American people in general. He also agreed that the FBI has been quietly demonizing patriots and Christians and "those who carry around pocket Constitutions."  
 
 I have produced two documentary films and written a book about what really happened on September 11th. The bottom line is this: the military-industrial complex carried the attacks out as a pretext for control. Anyone who doubts this just hasn't looked at the mountains of hard evidence.  
 
 Of course, the current group of white collar criminals in the White House might not care that we're finding out the details of their next phase. Because, after all, when smallpox gets released, or more buildings start blowing up, the President can stand up there at his lectern suppressing a smirk, squeeze out a tear or two, and tell us that "See I was right. I had to take away your rights to keep you safe. And now it's your fault that all of these children are dead." From that point on, anyone who criticizes tyranny will be shouted down by the paid talking head government mouthpieces in the mainstream media.  
 
 You have to admit, it's a beautiful script. Unfortunately, it's being played out in the real world. If we don't get the word out that government is using terror to control our lives while doing nothing to stop the terrorists, we will deserve what we get - tyranny. But our children won't deserve it.
 
 
 CLICK BELOW FOR ADDITIONAL ARTICLES    
 Written by Alex Jones of InfoWars.com--Posted 2/14/2003
 
~
 
Nice thinking, Junker. This thread continues to develop. :)
 
Elias
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 05, 2004, 11:25:08 am
Quote
Elias,

At bankindex.com is

Notes and Quotes: This Is How Our Fine Country Was Destroyed In 1913

August 16, 2002
 
Compiled by Victor Thorn
- - -

Thorn? Already at TMM?
Junker, you'll note that that article by Alex Jones I've just pasted in above was also found at bankindex.com.

What you do not know yet is that I've been in communication with Victor Thorn (and Lisa Guliani) of WING TV, having exchanged several emails. Something is developing on that account, which will end up being posted at TMM under the Victor Thorn vs Michael Ruppert article as a comment.

Also, this week, I have been in communication with another person who has published at bankindex.com. He has sent me several articles, one of which will soon be published at TMM. He has written one article which Victor Thorn published, and has submitted other articles which VT declined to publish.

As you know by reading the Thorn vs Ruppert article at TMM, I am demanding an apology from Thorn to be published by Thorn to Ruppert, and Thorn is so far not willing to make that public apology.  Thorn has also attacked Alex Jones with another article. The Victor Thorn thingy is quite amuzing, and I hope by next week to have a truly marvelous revelation to publish at TMM on this incident. I am investigating Victor Thorn as possibly (note I say at this time: "possibly") being a CIA/USINTEL dis-information specialist. I could be wrong, but I also may be correct in wondering if that is what Victor Thorn is up to. We'll know much more by next week.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 05, 2004, 11:46:42 am
Quote
Thanks, Elias and Junker and all, for the facts.  Sheesh, I sure am learning a lot in a short time.

Strange and liberating sensation, to have my vague suspicions of gummint transformed into definite knowledge.   :ph34r:  B)
You're more than welcome, Lightning. I'm glad to see someone has the interest and willpower to wade through this thread, lol! It is a shame that more Americans do not take time to look into the history which has cumulatively placed this nation in its present pickle.

I am a simple country boy. As I grew up in the South, I'm given of experience to suspect that when there is a symptom, there is a cause. Today's America shows symptoms of Police State degradation. That tells me that there must be a cause, or a "reason", for the symptom of our loss of liberty.  This thread is for the purpose of isolating the infectious cause underlying the symptoms. Thank you very much for your intersest.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 12:30:41 pm
Thank you, Elias. I thought that name was familiar, but I couldn't quite place it. Prolly shoulda done a google pointed at TMM, but sometimes that doesn't really point to what I was lookin' for.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 05, 2004, 01:10:56 pm
Quote
Thank you, Elias. I thought that name was familiar, but I couldn't quite place it. Prolly shoulda done a google pointed at TMM, but sometimes that doesn't really point to what I was lookin' for.
Most welcome, General Junker. :)

Perhaps I should have included that link to the Victor Thorn vs Michael Ruppert thread over at TMM, in case anyone reading here has too much time on their hands, lol.

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=298&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lark on November 05, 2004, 01:51:29 pm
Quote of interest to this Thread from Umberto Eco, Foucault's Pendulum:

"I have come to believe that the world is an enigma, a harmless enigma, made terrible by our own mad attempts to interpret it as though it had some underlying truth"

Lark
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 02:35:22 pm
= The Bar =

What is the bar?
Who controls the bar?
Who owns the bar?
What is the history of the bar?
When did it start?
Who started it?
What is the relationship between the bar and courts?
When was that established? Custom or law?
What does it mean to avoid the bar?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Alton Speers on November 05, 2004, 03:40:41 pm
I get down to the bar occasionally when I need a good stiff drink. It remains legal except on sundays. The owner is a business associate. He controls it but his eldest son runs the place. It's been around for about 15 years now. The owner started it. Previously it was a restaurant. It's been fairly profitable. Few problems with the courts except when they had bands outside on the deck. Can't say when that was established because they seem to have at least a few complaints every year. To avoid the bar means to stay home and do my drinking which saves a few shekels and I don't have to worry about the polizei. Other than that I don't go too often. I have consumed about 4 beers already this year so I might finish a 6 pack by New Year's eve!  :D

Here's some links to a BBC Programme that you might find interesting:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3755686.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3755686.stm)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3951615.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3951615.stm)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3970901.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3970901.stm)
and a bonus commentary from the wilderness
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/zbig.html (http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/zbig.html)

Alton
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 03:50:15 pm
I suppose my humor is skewed, but my appreciation of humor seems still intact. Thank you for the links and more so for your humor.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 04:31:12 pm
Some Early History - Rhodes and Milner

"The Society of the Elect," and an outer circle, to be known as "The Association of Helpers." Within The Society of the Elect, the real power was to be exercised by the leader, and a "Junta of Three." The leader was to be Rhodes, and the Junta was to be Stead, Brett, and Alfred Milner. In accordance with this decision, Milner was added to the society by Stead shortly after the meeting we have described."

Of the Secret Society's goals and methods of operation Quigley writes,

"The goals which Rhodes and Milner sought and the methods by which they hoped to achieve them were so similar by 1902 that the two are almost indistinguishable. Both sought to unite the world, and above all the English-speaking world, in a federal structure around Britain. Both felt that this goal could best be achieved by a secret band of men united to one another by devotion to the common cause and by personal loyalty to one another. Both felt that this band should pursue its goal by secret political and economic influence behind the scenes and by the control of journalistic, educational, and propaganda agencies..."
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Alton Speers on November 05, 2004, 06:56:56 pm
Glad I managed to pique your funny bone! :D  I figured a little levity (very little) was in order for this rather heavy thread. A bit of that Indiana corn is good every now and again.

Alton
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Roy J. Tellason on November 05, 2004, 08:15:16 pm
Quote
Thanks, Elias and Junker and all, for the facts.  Sheesh, I sure am learning a lot in a short time.

Strange and liberating sensation, to have my vague suspicions of gummint transformed into definite knowledge.   :ph34r:  B)
You think this is a lot of stuff?  Check out the stuff that's here (http://www.mega.nu/ampp/) - "The Architecture of Modern Political Power"...

Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 05, 2004, 08:22:31 pm
Good site to recommend-- Pouzzner does well.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on November 08, 2004, 08:45:37 pm
I haven't read the entire article yet, as it has been printed out for readin' in the one hole liberry, but Gary North has an article (http://www.lewrockwell.com/north/north321.html) at LRC The Red/Blue Map vs. Conspiracy Theories which might be worth a read.

Quote
Dan Smoot's 1961 book was a watershed document in the popular conservative movement. It sold over a million copies. With that book, we can mark the move from anti-Communism to anti-conspiracy. (The ever-popular International Jewish Banking Conspiracy – IJBC – had for 80 years found a subterranean market for books printed on cheap paper with typography from the 1890s, plus typewritten mimeographed bulletins, but this had always been a fringe position.)

In 1964, Robert Welch published More Stately Mansions, which marked a turning point for the John Birch Society. With that manifesto, Welch moved the JBS from an anti-Communist organization, founded in 1958, to an anti-conspiracy organization. American Opinion shifted its focus from anti-Communism to anti-banking, a move that persuaded Hans Sennholz to resign as a featured writer. The focus shifted from Soviet Russia and its domestic sympathizers to the Illuminati and its domestic orchestrators.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 09, 2004, 11:08:50 am
Quote
Quote
Thanks, Elias and Junker and all, for the facts.  Sheesh, I sure am learning a lot in a short time.

Strange and liberating sensation, to have my vague suspicions of gummint transformed into definite knowledge.   :ph34r:  B)
You think this is a lot of stuff?  Check out the stuff that's here (http://www.mega.nu/ampp/) - "The Architecture of Modern Political Power"...
LOL, Roy! Yes, that site is a treasure. It's got everything from manuals to Chaitkin and Tarpley's "George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography".  A guy can spend days there. I have had that site bookmarked for a long time, but must confess that I've not read a tenth of the material residing there. For an example of what a reader might discover at the site, here's this:

~

Wall Street-Nazi Collaboration in World War II

 Behind the battle fronts in World War II, through intermediaries in Switzerland and North Africa, the New York financial elite collaborated with the Nazi regime, Captured files after the war yielded a mass of evidence demonstrating that for some elements of Big Business, the period 1941-5 was "business as usual." For instance, correspondence between U.S. firms and their French subsidiaries reveals the aid given to the Axis military machine - while the United States was at war with Germany and Italy. Letters between Ford of France and Ford of the U.S. between 1940 and July 1942 were analyzed by the Foreign Funds Control section of the Treasury Department. Their initial report concluded that until mid-1942:

(1) the business of the Ford subsidiaries in France substantially increased; (2) their production was solely for the benefit of the Germans and the countries under its occupation; (3) the Germans have "shown clearly their wish to protect the Ford interests" because of the attitude of strict neutrality maintained by Henry Ford and the late Edsel Ford; and (4) the increased activity of the French Ford subsidiaries on behalf of the Germans received the commendation of the Ford family in America.1

Similarly, the Rockefeller Chase Bank was accused of collaborating with the Nazis in World War II France, while Nelson Rockefeller had a soft job in Washington D.C.:

Substantially the same pattern of behavior was pursued by the Paris office of the Chase Bank during German occupation, An examination of the correspondence between Chase, New York, and Chase, France, from the date of the fall of France to May, 1942 discloses that: (1) the manager of the Paris office appeased and collaborated with the Germans to place the Chase banks in a "privileged position;" (2) the Germans held the Chase Bank in a very special esteem - owing to the international activities of our (Chase) head office and the pleasant relations which the Paris branch has been maintaining with many of their (German) banks and their (German) local organizations and higher officers; (3)the Paris manager was "very vigorous in enforcing restrictions against Jewish property, even going so far as to refuse to release funds belonging to Jews in anticipation that a decree with retroactive provisions prohibiting such release might be published in the near future by the occupying authorities;" (4)the New York office despite the above information took no direct steps to remove the undesirable manager from the Paris office since it "might react against our (Chase) interests as we are dealing, not with a theory but with a situation."2

An official report to then-Secretary of the Treasury Morgenthau concluded that:

These two situations [i.e., Ford and Chase Bank] convince us that it is imperative to investigate immediately on the spot the activities of subsidiaries of at least some of the larger American firms which were operating in France during German occupation ....3

Treasury officials urged that an investigation be started with the French subsidiaries of several American banks - that is, Chase, Morgan, National City, Guaranty, Bankers Trust, and American Express. Although Chase and Morgan were the only two banks to maintain French  offices throughout the Nazi occupation, in September 1944 all the major New York banks were pressing the U.S. Government for permission to re-open pre-war branches. Subsequent Treasury investigation produced documentary evidence of collaboration between both Chase Bank and J.P. Morgan with the Nazis in World War II. The recommendation for a full investigation is cited in full as follows:


 TREASURY DEPARTMENT
 INTER-OFFICE COMMUNICATION

Date: December 20, 1944
 To: Secretary Morgenthau From: Mr. Saxon
 Examination of the records of the Chase Bank, Paris, and of Morgan and Company, France, have progressed only far enough to permit tentative conclusions and the revelation of a few interesting facts:

CHASE BANK, PARIS

a. Niederman, of Swiss nationality, manager of Chase, Paris, was unquestionably a collaborator;

b. The Chase Head Office in New York was informed of Nieder-man's collaborationist policy but took no steps to remove him. Indeed there is ample evidence to show that the Head Office in New York viewed Niederman's good relations with the Germans as an excellent means of preserving, unimpaired, the position of the Chase Bank in France;

c. The German authorities were anxious to keep the Chase open and indeed took exceptional measures to provide sources of revenue;

d. The German authorities desired "to be friends" with the important American banks because they expected that these banks would be useful after the war as an instrument of German policy in the United States;

e. The Chase, Paris showed itself most anxious to please the German authorities in every possible way. For example, the Chase zealously maintained the account of the German Embassy in Paris, "as every little thing helps" (to maintain the excellent relations between Chase and the German authorities);

f. The whole objective of the Chase policy and operation was to maintain the position of the bank at any cost.

MORGAN AND COMPANY, FRANCE

a. Morgan and Company regarded itself as a French bank, and therefore obligated to observe French banking laws and regulations, whether Nazi-inspired or not; and did actually do so;

b. Morgan and Company was most anxious to preserve the continuity of its house in France, and, in order to achieve this security, worked out a modus vivendi with the German authorities;

c. Morgan and Company had tremendous prestige with the German authorities, and the Germans boasted of the splendid cooperation of Morgan and Company;

d. Morgan continued its prewar relations with the great French industrial and commercial concerns which were working for Germany, including the Renault Works, since confiscated by the French Government, Puegeqt [sic], Citroen, and many others.

e. The power of Morgan and Company in France bears no relation to the small financial resources of the firm, and the enquiry now in progress will be of real value in allowing us for the first time to study the Morgan pattern in Europe and the manner in which Morgan has used its great power;

f. Morgan and Company constantly sought its ends by playing one government against another in the coldest and most unscrupulous manner.

Mr. Jefferson Caffery, U.S. Ambassador to France, has been kept informed of the progress of this investigation and at all times gave me full support and encouragement, in principle and in fact. Indeed, it was Mr. Caffery himself who asked me how the Ford and General Motors subsidiaries in France had acted during the occupation, and expressed the desire that we should look into these companies after the bank investigation was completed.

 RECOMMENDATION

I recommend that this investigation, which, for unavoidable reasons, has progressed slowly up to this time, should now be pressed urgently and that additional needed personnel be sent to Paris as soon as possible.4

The full investigation was never undertaken, and no investigation has been made of this presumably treasonable activity down to the present day.

end

(footnotes at site)

~

Salute, Roy!
Thanks for digging that one up and posting it here. This is the sort of info which helps us see the pattern, the template, in and under which the PTB compose and orchestrate the forces of international war. In coming times I'll be pleased to describe how those same powers-that-be do the trick domestically here in the USA, how they, in Brzezinski's words, "fashion a consensus on matters of US policy".

Elias

 


 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on November 09, 2004, 12:26:04 pm
Quote
LOL, Roy! Yes, that site is a treasure. It's got everything from manuals to Chaitkin and Tarpley's "George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography". A guy can spend days there. I have had that site bookmarked for a long time, but must confess that I've not read a tenth of the material residing there.

I agree 100%.  It's very in-depth.  Thanks for the reminder, Roy.  I need to get back there.   B)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 14, 2004, 06:07:59 pm
No, we have not lost interest in developing our conspiracy theory, lol! Things remain busy for all of us I'm sure, and I know that I'm over-extended in too many arenas right now. America is seething just beneath its exterior bubble since the election, and I've had to withdraw from this thread for a bit while I finished reading Michael Ruppert's bombshell book, "Crossing The Rubicon". Speaking of that book, it's a goldmine for we conspiracy theorists! I urge every reader here to grab your own copy of that book while it's still  available!

But  something else has finally got done by my lazy self, and that is the posting at TMM of another chapter from Anton Chaitkin's and Webster G. Tarpley's wonderfully-researched book, "George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography". Yep, it's a long read, but it is necessary reading, imo, for readers and participants in this thread.

As  y'all know, I think Cheney did the attacks on 911. Why I have posted the article by Tarpley and Chaitkin is simple. George W. Bush, soon after coming to office, broke a law by refusing to release the Reagan Administration papers as provided for by law. Why did G.W. break that law and withhold the Reagan papers? Could it have something to do with his father's immense criminality in drug smuggling and illegal arms shipping to Iran? Yep, it sure could.

We've, hopefully!,  all read about the Skull and Bones secrets in the Bush family's closet. We've all read, hopefully!, about our President's grandfather's role in bankrolling Hitler to power in the 1930s. With those noteworthy views into the criminality of the Bush clan, we now need to add yet another saga to our general understanding of how the Federal government has been stolen by the international bankers and their go-to boys like G.H.W. Bush and G.W. Bush (with Clinton sandwiched in between to give the appearance of popular control over Washington politics, right?). The current saga is "Iran-Contra". Enjoy a long but enlightening read:

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=315&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

The article is in three parts. I've not got them all linked together yet, so if you want, you may just go to TMM's front page to view all three. (I will get them linked in sequence later tonight, I trust.)

As we collect up stuff like this, I'm going to ask the question all over America: Why don't we just go up to Washington DC and arrest all these criminals? :)

But first, we want to make our case air-tight. Keep an eye on this thread in coming times.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 14, 2004, 06:52:48 pm
I don't remember, so here the whole book is, maybe again:

George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography by Webster G. Tarpley & Anton Chaitkin

On-line (http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm) or

You can get the entire book at once, by dowloading the following compressed file: bushbook.zip (http://www.tarpley.net/bushbook.zip)

(The zip file about one Megabyte. It contains all the chapters in HTML format.)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 14, 2004, 09:20:00 pm
Thanks, Junker, for the above links. I've also included the link to the online book in our copy of the chapter at TMM.

To the thread, I must confess that I had not heard of "Flight X" until I read Michael Ruppert's new book, Crossing The Rubicon. But as I have now heard of it, I thought perhaps I should tack it onto this thread for later reference. I found this link by Googling "Flight X, Cleveland Airport, 911".

http://www.libertythink.com/2004/06/911-cl...rt-mystery.html (http://www.libertythink.com/2004/06/911-cleveland-airport-mystery.html)

The website, Libertythink, seems to be a fine site.  Comments about Flight X are invited.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 14, 2004, 09:33:55 pm
Yes, there were two of everything. But little Johnny didn't know... was it his mother, or...

Deetle - leetle... deetle - leetle... ooooooh... had he entered the Twilight Zone.

- - -

Amazing how this stuff just mounts and mounts. Thank you, Elias. Another good story to add to the list.




 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 15, 2004, 05:57:33 am
More on Prescott Bush's and the Harriman Brothers' financial leverage which brought Hitler to power and financed the Brown Shirts. It is interesting, to say the least, that the House of Warburg (one of the creators of the Federal Reserve System, Inc.) was involved in establishing the anti-Jew Hitler through the financing of Hitler's private army, the Brown Shirts. The Hamburg-Amerika Steamship lines was used as a conduit for this. From Chaitkin and Tarpley, in their chapter on the Hitler Project:

~

Bert Walker had arranged the credits Harriman needed to take control of the Hamburg-Amerika Line back in 1920. Walker had organized the American Ship and Commerce Corp. as a unit of the W.A. Harriman & Co., with contractual power over Hamburg-Amerika's affairs.
 
 As the Hitler project went into high gear, Harriman-Bush shares in American Ship and Commerce Corp. were held by the Harriman Fifteen Corp., run by Prescott Bush and Bert Walker.@s2@s2
 
 It was a convenient stroll for the well-tanned, athletic, handsome Prescott Bush: From the Brown Brothers Harriman skyscraper at 59 Wall Street--where he was senior managing partner, confidential investments manager and adviser to Averell and his brother `` Bunny ''--he walked across to the Harriman Fifteen Corporation at One Wall Street, otherwise known as G.H. Walker & Co.--and around the corner to his subsidiary offices at 39 Broadway, former home of the old W.A. Harriman & Co., and still the offices for American Ship and Commerce Corp., and of the Union Banking Corporation.
 
 In many ways, Bush's Hamburg-Amerika Line was the pivot for the entire Hitler project.
 
 Averell Harriman and Bert Walker had gained control over the steamship company in 1920 in negotiations with its post-World War I chief executive, Wilhelm Cuno, and with the line's bankers, M.M. Warburg. Cuno was thereafter completely dependent on the Anglo-Americans, and became a member of the Anglo-German Friendship Society. In the 1930-32 drive for a Hitler dictatorship, Wilhelm Cuno contributed important sums to the Nazi Party.@s2@s3
 
 Albert Voegler was chief executive of the Thyssen-Flick German Steel Trust for which Bush's Union Banking Corp. was the New York office. He was a director of the Bush-affiliate BHS Bank in Rotterdam, and a director of the Harriman-Bush Hamburg-Amerika Line. Voegler joined Thyssen and Flick in their heavy 1930-33 Nazi contributions, and helped organize the final Nazi leap into national power.@s2@s4
 
 The Schroeder family of bankers was a linchpin for the Nazi activities of Harriman and Prescott Bush, closely tied to their lawyers Allen and John Foster Dulles.
 
 Baron Kurt von Schroeder was co-director of the massive Thyssen-Hu@autte foundry along with Johann Groeninger, Prescott Bush's New York bank partner. Kurt von Schroeder was treasurer of the support organization for the Nazi Party's private armies, to which Friedrich Flick contributed. Kurt von Schroeder and Montagu Norman's prote@aage@aa Hjalmar Schacht together made the final arrangements for Hitler to enter the government.@s2@s5
 
 Baron Rudolph von Schroeder was vice president and director of the Hamburg-Amerika Line. Long an intimate contact of Averell Harriman's in Germany, Baron Rudolph sent his grandson Baron Johann Rudolph for a tour of Prescott Bush's Brown Brothers Harriman offices in New York City in December 1932--on the eve of their Hitler-triumph.@s2@s6
 
 Certain actions taken directly by the Harriman-Bush shipping line in 1932 must be ranked among the gravest acts of treason in this century.
 
 The U.S. embassy in Berlin reported back to Washington that the `` costly election campaigns '' and `` the cost of maintaining a private army of 300,000 to 400,000 men '' had raised questions as to the Nazis' financial backers. The constitutional government of the German republic moved to defend national freedom by ordering the Nazi Party private armies disbanded. The U.S. embassy reported that the Hamburg-Amerika Line was purchasing and distributing propaganda attacks against the German government, for attempting this last-minute crackdown on Hitler's forces.@s2@s7
 
 Thousands of German opponents of Hitlerism were shot or intimidated by privately armed Nazi Brown Shirts. In this connection we note that the original `` Merchant of Death, '' Samuel Pryor, was a founding director of both the Union Banking Corp. and the American Ship and Commerce Corp. Since Mr. Pryor was executive committee chairman of Remington Arms and a central figure in the world's private arms traffic, his use to the Hitler project was enhanced as the Bush family's partner in Nazi Party banking and trans-Atlantic shipping.
 
 The U.S. Senate arms-traffic investigators probed Remington after it was joined in a cartel agreement on explosives to the Nazi firm I.G. Farben. Looking at the period leading up to Hitler's seizure of power, the Senators found that `` German political associations, like the Nazi and others, are nearly all armed with American ... guns.... Arms of all kinds coming from America are transshipped in the Scheldt to river barges before the vessels arrive in Antwerp. They then can be carried through Holland without police inspection or interference. The Hitlerists and Communists are presumed to get arms in this manner. The principal arms coming from America are Thompson submachine guns and revolvers. The number is great. '\@s2@s8
 
 The beginning of the Hitler regime brought some bizarre changes to the Hamburg-Amerika Line--and more betrayals.
 
 Prescott Bush's American Ship and Commerce Corp. notified Max Warburg of Hamburg, Germany, on March 7, 1933, that Warburg was to be the corporation's official, designated representative on the board of Hamburg-Amerika.@s2@s9
 
 Max Warburg replied on March 27, 1933, assuring his American sponsors that the Hitler government was good for Germany: `` For the last few years business was considerably better than we had anticipated, but a reaction is making itself felt for some months. We are actually suffering also under the very active propaganda against Germany, caused by some unpleasant circumstances. These occurrences were the natural consequence of the very excited election campaign, but were extraordinarily exaggerated in the foreign press. The Government is firmly resolved to maintain public peace and order in Germany, and I feel perfectly convinced in this respect that there is no cause for any alarm whatsoever. '\@s3@s0
 
 This seal of approval for Hitler, coming from a famous Jew, was just what Harriman and Bush required, for they anticipated rather serious `` alarm '' inside the U.S.A. against their Nazi operations.
 
 On March 29, 1933, two days after Max's letter to Harriman, Max's son, Erich Warburg, sent a cable to his cousin Frederick M. Warburg, a director of the Harriman railroad system. He asked Frederick to `` use all your influence '' to stop all anti-Nazi activity in America, including `` atrocity news and unfriendly propaganda in foreign press, mass meetings, etc. '' Frederick cabled back to Erich: `` No responsible groups here [are] urging [a] boycott [of] German goods[,] merely excited individuals. '' Two days after that, On March 31, 1933, the American-Jewish Committee, controlled by the Warburgs, and the B'nai B'rith, heavily influenced by the Sulzbergers (New York Times), issued a formal, official joint statement of the two organizations, counseling `` that no American boycott against Germany be encouraged, '' and advising `` that no further mass meetings be held or similar forms of agitation be employed. '\@s3@s1
 
 The American Jewish Committee and the B'nai B'rith (mother of the `` Anti-Defamation League '') continued with this hardline, no-attack-on-Hitler stance all through the 1930s, blunting the fight mounted by many Jews and other anti-fascists.
 
 Thus the decisive interchange reproduced above, taking place entirely within the orbit of the Harriman/Bush firm, may explain something of the relationship of George Bush to American Jewish and Zionist leaders. Some of them, in close cooperation with his family, played an ugly part in the drama of Naziism. Is this why `` professional Nazi-hunters '' have never discovered how the Bush family made its money?

end quoted passages from "George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography" by Chaitkin and Tarpley. Read the whole chapter here:

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=225&mode=mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 25, 2004, 12:26:48 pm
Today is Thanksgiving Day in America. I had considered calling into a local radio talk-show to express my thankfulness that the federal government had *not* dosed us with yet another 'terrorist' attack, which in my mind is a quite valid reason to be thankful today. Many Americans were fearing that such an attack may have been likely to happen prior to the Nov 2 election, and I was among their numbers. So I am very thankful that "nothing happened".

Having said that, I'll now return to the conspiracy theory here with a couple of additional tidbits which I feel belong on this thread.

First, let us look at a very brave young lady who formerly worked for the FBI. Her name is Sibel Edmonds. Sibel was a translator for the FBI prior to 911, and she has come forward at great personal risk to inform America of some very nasty stuff which she uncovered while working as a translator. Sibel also has filed a report with the Kean "911 Commission", which the commission declined to extend to the public. After sending her report to the 911 Commission, Sibel was placed under a federal gag order and told to keep her mouth shut. She heard the warning, but refused to keep silent. She remains in considerable danger for defying the federal authorities. Since that gag order by the government, Sibel has been involved in activities with a number of "911 Truth" organizations, citizens groups, speaking engagements, and publications. Sibel has been in contact with, and has worked with, Catherine Austin Fitts (who is one of our most favoritest heros).

TMM has re-published a couple of articles by/about Sibel Edmonds. While traveling about the Internet this week I came across an article over at Rense dot com which features a letter to Congress by Sibel Edmonds. This article is very important, imo, to the development of a theory of conspiracy on this thread, so I'd like to invite each of you to read Sibel's letter to Congress before going to the second item I'll be placing in this post, below.

http://www.rense.com/general59/esFBICIAagentsready.htm (http://www.rense.com/general59/esFBICIAagentsready.htm)

From that article:

Congress has been hearing not only from the commissioners but from a bevy of other career politicians, very few of whom have worked in the intelligence community, and from top-layer bureaucrats, many with vested interests in saving face and avoiding accountability. Congress has not included the voices of the people working within the intelligence and broader national security communities who deal with the real issues and problems day-after-day and who possess the needed expertise and experience-in short, those who not only do the job but are conscientious enough to stick their necks out in pointing to the impediments they experience in trying to do it effectively.
 
We the undersigned, who have worked within various government agencies (FBI, CIA, FAA, DIA, Customs) responsible for national security and public safety, call upon you in Congress to include the voices of those with first-hand knowledge and expertise in the important issues at hand. We stand ready to do our part.
 
Respectfully,
 
Costello, Edward J. Jr., Former Special Agent, Counterintelligence, FBI
Cole, John M., Former Veteran Intelligence Operations Specialist, FBI
Conrad, David "Mark," Retired Agent in Charge, Internal Affairs, U.S. Customs
Dew, Rosemary N., Former Supervisory Special
Agent, Counterterrorism & Counterintelligence, FBI
Dzakovic, Bogdan, Former Red Team Leader, FAA
Edmonds, Sibel D., Former Language Specialist, FBI
Elson, Steve, Retired Navy Seal & Former Special Agent, FAA & US Navy
Forbes, David, Aviation, Logistics and Govt.
Security Analysts, BoydForbes, Inc.,
Goodman, Melvin A., Former Senior Analyst/
Division Manager, CIA; Senior Fellow at the
Center for International Policy
Graf, Mark, Former Security Supervisor, Planner,
& Derivative Classifier, Department of Energy
Graham, Gilbert M., Retired Special Agent, Counterintelligence, FBI
Kleiman, Diane, Former Special Agent, US Customs
Kwiatkowski, Karen U., Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Veteran Policy Analyst-DoD
Larkin, Lynne A., Former Operation Officer, CIA
MacMichael, David, Former Senior Estimates Officer, CIA
McGovern, Raymond L., Former Analyst, CIA
Pahle, Theodore J., Retired Senior Intelligence Officer, DIA
Sarshar, Behrooz, Retired Language Specialist, FBI
Sullivan, Brian F., Retired Special Agent & Risk Management Specialist, FAA
Tortorich, Larry J., Retired US Naval Officer, US
Navy & Dept. of Homeland Security/TSA
Turner, Jane A., Retired Special Agent, FBI
Vincent, John B., Retired Special Agent, Counterterrorism, FBI
Whitehurst, Dr. Fred, Retired Supervisory Special
Agent/Laboratory Forensic Examiner, FBI
Wright, Ann, Col. US Army (ret.); and Former Foreign Service officer
Zipoli, Matthew J., Special Response Team (SRT) Officer, DOE

end pasted section from above-linked article.

EA note: I know three other names which should be included on that list. Stanley Hilton, Michael C. Ruppert, and Catherine Austin Fitts. The above-listed names are people who shall gladly and publicly and especially in a court of law refute and challenge the government's version/explanation of the attacks of 911. Considering where those people work(ed), their careers, and their personal profiles as dutiful government employees with conscience, I'd say that this list has much merit. More on that laters.

~

Item number two for today's post:

Some months ago, in fact it was in April of 2004, TMM posted a RICO lawsuit filed on behalf of Ellen Mariani of New York City, who lost her husband in the attacks of 911. Ms Mariani's lawsuit alleges criminal actions against not only various members within the Bush Cabinet, and other governmental position-holders, but also includes charges against the Council on Foreign Relations.

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=259 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=259)

Then in a recent issue of the American Free Press, out of Washington DC, which I buy locally here in Montana at a newstand in Bozeman, came another article regarding another RICO lawsuit filed by a worker at the World Trade Center, and this lawsuit also alleges criminal involvement and other crimes by the Bush Administration in the events of 911. (Can't find my copy of that paper, which is apparently lost in a pile of newspapers which my alter-ego collects-up here; but I'll add the man's name and source as soon as I find the newspaper.)

But, to get to the point here, there is yet another RICO lawsuit which is accusing George W. Bush and Dick Cheney and a host of Administration officials of direct complicity in the planning and execution of the attacks of 911. This particular lawsuit was filed, iirc, in March of 2003 by one Mr. Stanley Hilton.  Mr. Hilton is representing more than four hundred family-members of people who died in the attacks of 911. Mr. Hilton is being currently harrassed by elements within this government, including the judge in who's court the lawsuit is filed and the FBI.

So who is Mr. Stanley Hilton? Well, he's not your run-of-the-mill tin-foil-hat-wearing "conspiracy theorist". He happens to be the former campaign manager for Bob Dole's run for the Presidential nomination. He is a staunch Republican, an "insider", an attorney with thirty years' experience, and a gentleman who is quite red hot over his discoveries regarding Bush's and Cheney's involvement in the events of 911.

Let that sink in for a moment. Stanley Hilton is Bob Dole's former chief of staff. Are we to call the man insane for filing a lawsuit which charges Bush and Cheney with responsibility for the 911 attacks? I think not. (But then, I'm a self-confessed believer that this current White House and its Administration is most certainly responsible for the attacks of 911.) What do you think about Mr. Hilton? Can we believe him? Want to know more?

Here is a transcript of a telephone interview conducted by Alex Jones with Stanley Hilton for Jones' radio show in Austin, Texas.

http://www.rense.com/general57/aale.htm (http://www.rense.com/general57/aale.htm)

From that interview:

Stanley Hilton: "Our case is alleging that Bush and his puppets Rice and Cheney and Mueller and Rumsfeld and so forth, Tenet, were all involved not only in aiding and abetting and allowing 9/11 to happen but in actually ordering it to happen. Bush personally ordered it to happen. We have some very incriminating documents as well as eye-witnesses, that Bush personally ordered this event to happen in order to gain political advantage, to pursue a bogus political agenda on behalf of the neocons and their deluded thinking in the Middle East. I also wanted to point out that, just quickly, I went to school with some of these neocons. At the University of Chicago, in the late 60s with Wolfowitz and Feith and several of the others and so I know these people personally. And we used to talk about this stuff all of the time. And I did my senior thesis on this very subject - how to turn the U.S. into a presidential dictatorship by manufacturing a bogus Pearl Harbor event. So, technically this has been in the planning at least 35 years."

end quote from above-linked interview between Hilton and Alex Jones.

~

Well now... the "conspiracy theory" momentum mounts.  I have carefully read that interview a couple of times, and have compared its content with what I've learned in Michael Ruppert's bombshell book, "Crossing The Rubicon", in which Ruppert charges Cheney with being the mastermind of the attacks on 911. Hilton's RICO suit reveals the five wargame "drills" going on during the morning of 911, and also Mike Ruppert elucidates much information about those five drills, including the fact that Cheney was in charge of those "drills". Comparing Ruppert's version and what I found in the Hilton interview, it appears to me that neither version would damage the other's version, although Ruppert, in his book, goes into much-finer descriptive detail.

So, on this Thanksgiving Day in 2004, there is valid reason for me to feel thankful that this government has not followed the attacks of 911 with yet another "terrorist" event on US soil. I am truly thankful for that. I hope all of us are. :)

Salute!
Elias

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on November 30, 2004, 03:31:14 am
Council of Foreign Relations
International Advisory Board

ARL BILDT (Sweden), former Prime Minister of Sweden
AHMED E. BISHARA (Kuwait), Secretary-General, National Democratic Movement
JOHN BROWNE (United Kingdom), Group Chief Executive, British Petroleum
MARK C. CHONA (Zambia), former Political Adviser to the President of Zambia
ABDEL RAOUF EL REEDY (Egypt), Chairman of the Board, Mubarak Public Library; former Ambassador to the United States
NIALL W.A. FITZGERALD (Ireland), Chairman, Reuters
JACOB A. FRENKEL (Israel), former Governor, Bank of Israel
MIKHAIL FRIDMAN (Russia), Chairman, Alfa Bank
TOYOO GYOHTEN (Japan), President, Institute for International Monetary Affairs; former Vice Minister of Finance, Japan
YOTARO KOBAYASHI (Japan), Chairman, Fuji Xerox Company, Ltd.
OTTO LAMBSDORFF (Germany), Partner, Taylor Wessing; former Minister of Economics, Germany
BRIAN MULRONEY (Canada), Senior Partner, Ogilvy Renault; former Prime Minister of Canada
MOEEN A. QURESHI (Pakistan), former Prime Minister of Pakistan
MICHEL ROCARD (France), former Prime Minister of France
PRANNOY ROY (India), President, New Delhi Television Ltd.
JACOB WALLENBERG (Sweden), Chairman, Skaninaviska Enskilda Banken (SEB)
JUSUF WANANDI (Indonesia), Member, Board of Directors, Centre for Strategic and International Studies (Jakarta)
YUAN MING (China), Director, Institute for International Relations, Beijing University
MUHAMMAD YUNUS (Bangladesh), Managing Director, Chief Executive Officer, and Founder, Grameen Bank
ERNESTO ZEDILLO PONCE de LEÓN (Mexico), former President of Mexico; Director, Center for the Study of Globalization, Yale University

Among others
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 30, 2004, 04:43:20 am
Thanks for the above, Junker. The CFR is quite the busy bunch, are they not? My my my. And of course, they enjoy including everyone from everywhere. Jolly good fun, and all that.

But here is something which is also going to come into play when we get around to summing up our own conspiracy theory. As you know, the National Security Act of 1947 was likely the largest blow to the American way of life to be delivered upon us by conspirators within our government. The only other action(s) which could  come close in significance would be the twin topedos of 1913, the Federal Reserve System, Incorporated, and the Internal Revenue Service. My thinking is that while the latter tandem of assaults on the American way of life, the treasons of 1913, were damning enough, it was the 1947 National Security Act which facilitated the takeover from within to a degree which shall prove to be the death-blow to our Republic and our way of life, as symptoms today reveal.

Relative to that National Security Act of 1947 is the following. Please note that states of emergency were declared long prior to 1947. But prior to 1947, there was no CIA. Without further ado, this....

~

SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON THE
 TERMINATION OF THE NATIONAL EMERGENCY

FRANK CHURCH, Idaho Co-Chairman
 PHILIP A. HART, Michigan
 CLAIBORNE PELL, Rhode Island
 ADLAI E. STEVENSON III, Illinois

CHARLES McC MATHIAS, Jr., Maryland
 CLIFFORD P. CASE, New Jersey
 JAMES B. PEARSON, Kansas
 CLIFFORD P. HANSEN, Wyoming

WILLIAM G. MILLER, Staff Director
 THOMAS A. DINE, Professional Staff


II

Foreword

Since March 9, 1933, the United States has been in a state of declared national emergency. In fact, there are now in effect four presidentially-proclaimed states of national emergency: In addition to the national emergency declared by President Roosevelt in 1933, there are also the national emergency proclaimed by President Truman on December 16, 1950, during the Korean conflict, and the states of national emergency declared by President Nixon on March 23, 1970, and August 15, 1971.

These proclamations give force to 470 provisions of Federal law. These hundreds of statutes delegate to the President extraordinary powers, ordinarily exercised by the Congress, which affect the lives of American citizens in a host of all-encompassing manners. This vast range of powers, taken together, confer enough authority to rule the country without reference to normal Constitutional processes.

Under the powers delegated by these statutes, the President may:
 seize property; organize and control the means of production; seize commodities; assign military forces abroad; institute martial law; seize and control all transportation and communication; regulate the operation of private enterprise; restrict travel; and, in a plethora of particular ways, control the lives of all American citizens.
With the melting of the cold war--the developing detente with the Soviet Union and China, the stable truce of over 20 years duration between North and South Korea, and the end of U.S. involvement in the war in Indochina-there is no present need for the United States Government to continue to function under emergency conditions.

The Special Committee on the Termination of the National Emergency was created1 to examine the consequences of terminating the declared states of national emergency that now prevail; to recommend what steps the Congress should take to ensure that the termination can be accomplished without adverse effect upon the necessary tasks of governing; and, also, to recommend ways in which the United States can meet future emergency situations with speed and effectiveness but without relinquishment of congressional oversight and control.

In accordance with this mandate, the Special Committee-in conjunction with the Executive branch, expert constitutional authorities, as well as former high officials of this Government-is now engaged in a detailed study to determine the most reasonable ways to restore normalcy to the operations of our Government.

A first and necessary step was to bring together the body of statutes, which have been passed by Congress, conferring extraordinary powers upon the Executive branch in times of national emergency.

This has been a most difficult task. Nowhere in the Government, in either the Executive or Legislative branches, did there exist a complete catalog of all emergency statutes. Many were aware that there had been a delegation of an enormous amount of power but, of how much power, no one knew. In order to correct this situation, the Special Committee staff was instructed to work with the Executive branch, the Library of Congress, and knowledgeable legal authorities to compile an authoritative list of delegated emergency powers.

This Special Committee study, which contains a list of all provisions of Federal law, except the most trivial, conferring extraordinary powers in time of national emergency, was compiled by the staff under the direction of Staff Director William G. Miller, and Mr. Thomas A. Dine; utilizing the help of the General Accounting Office, the American Law Division of the Library of Congress, the Department of Justice, the Department of Defense, and the Office of Emergency Planning.

The Special Committee is grateful for the assistance provided by Jack. Goldklang of the Office of Legal Counsel, Department of Justice; Lester S. Jayson, the director of the Congressional Research Service of the Library of Congress; Joseph E. Ross, head of the American Law Division of CRS; and especially Raymond Celada of the Ameri- can Law Division and his able assistants, Charles V. Dale and Grover S. Williams; Paul Armstrong of the General Accounting Office; Linda Lee, Patrick Norton, Roland Moore, William K. Sawyer, Audrey Hatry, Martha Mecham, and David J. Kyte.

The Special Committee will also publish a list of Executive Orders, issued pursuant to statutes brought into force by declared states of emergency, at a later date.

CHARLES McC. MATHIAS, JR.
 FRANK CHURCH,
 Co-Chairmen.

 
 EMERGENCY POWERS STATUTES:
 PROVISIONS OF FEDERAL LAW
 NOW IN EFFECT DELEGATING TO THE
 EXECUTIVE EXTRAORDINARY AUTHORITY
 IN TIME OF NATIONAL EMERGENCY
 
 November 19, 1973. - Ordered to be printed

Mr. MATHIAS (for Mr. CHURCH) as co-chairman of the Special Committee on the Termination of the National Emergency, submitted the following
 

REPORT
 [Pursuant to S. Res. 9, 93d Cong.]
 INTRODUCTION

A - A BRIEF HISTORICAL SKETCH OF THE ORIGINS
 OF EMERGENCY POWERS NOW IN FORCE

A majority of the people of the United States have lived all of their lives under emergency rule. For 40 years, freedoms and governmental procedures guaranteed by the Constitution have, in varying degrees, been abridged by laws brought into force by states of national emergency. The problem of how a constitutional democracy reacts to great crises, however, far antedates the Great Depression. As a philosophical issue, its origins reach back to the Greek city-states and the Roman Republic. And, in the United States, actions taken by the Government in times of great crises have-from, at least, the Civil War-in important ways, shaped the present phenomenon of a permanent state of national emergency.

American political theory of emergency government was derived and enlarged from John Locke, the English political-philosopher whose thought influenced the authors of the Constitution. Locke argued that the threat of national crisis-unforeseen, sudden, and potentially catastrophic-required the creation of broad executive
emergency powers to be exercised by the Chief Executive in situations where the legislative authority had not provided a means or procedure of remedy. Referring to emergency power in the 14th chapter of his Second Treatise on Civil Government as "prerogative"; Locke suggested that it:
 
...should be left to the discretion of him that has the executive power...since in some governments the lawmaking power is not always in being and is usually too numerous, and so too slow for the dispatch requisite to executions, and because, also it is impossible to foresee and so by laws to provide for all accidents and necessities that may concern the public, or make such laws as will do no harm, if they are executed with an inflexible rigour on all occasions and upon all persons that may come in their way, therefore there is a latitude left to the executive power to do many things of choice; which the laws do not prescribe.

To what extent the Founding Fathers adhered to this view of the executive role in emergencies is a much disputed issue. Whatever their conceptions of this role, its development in practice has been based largely on the manner in which individual President's have viewed their office and its functions. Presidents Theodore Roosevelt and William Howard Taft argued the proper role of the President and, perhaps, their debate best expounds diametrically-opposed philosophies of the presidency. In his autobiography, Roosevelt asserted his "stewardship theory."
 
My view was that every Executive officer...was a steward of the people bound actively and affirmatively to do all he could for the people and not to content himself with the negative merit of keeping his talents undamaged in a napkin...My belief was that it was not only [the President's] right but his duty to do any thing that the needs of the Nation demanded unless such action was forbidden by the Constitution or by the laws. Under this interpretation of executive power I did and caused to be done many things not previously done by the President and the heads of departments. I did not usurp power but I did greatly broaden the use of executive power. In other words, I acted for the common well being of all our people whenever and whatever measure was necessary, unless prevented by direct constitutional or legislative prohibition.

Roosevelt compared this principle of "stewardship" to what he called the Jackson-Lincoln theory, and contrasted it to the theory ascribed to William Howard Taft.

Roosevelt's ideas on the limit of presidential authority and responsibility were vigorously disputed by Taft. In lectures on the presidency--delivered at Columbia University in 1915-1916-Taft responded that: ". . . the wide field of action that this would give to the Executive one can hardly limit. A President can exercise no power which cannot fairly and reasonably be traced to some specific grant of power." And he cautioned that: ". . . such specific grants must be either in the Federal Constitution, or in any act of Congress passed in pursuance thereof. There is no undefined residuum of power which he can exercise because it seems to him to be in the public interest."

In recent years, most scholars have interpreted the Roosevelt-Taft dispute in Roosevelt's favor. In the prevailing academic view, Roosevelt is described as "active", "expansionist", and "strong." The historical reality, in fact, does not afford such a sharp distinction either between the actions of these two Presidents, or between their analysis of the problem of emergency powers. Taft, in his concluding remarks to his Columbia lectures, said : "Executive power is limited, so far as it is possible to limit such a power consistent with that discretion and promptness of action that are essential to preserve the interests of the public in times of emergency or legislative neglect or inaction." Thus, even Taft was disposed to employ emergency power when the need arose, but, he did not wish to go beyond his own narrower, conservative conception of what was meant by constitutional and legal bounds. Thus, the dispute was over where those bounds lay, rather than the nature of the office itself.  

Taft's successor, Woodrow Wilson, was no less zealous in observing what he thought the Constitution demanded. Faced with the exigencies of World War I, Wilson found it necessary to expand executive emergency powers enormously. In many respects, this expansion ofpowers in wartime was based on precedents set by Lincoln decades earlier. Unlike Lincoln, however, Wilson relied heavily on Congress for official delegations of authority no matter how broadly these might be.

Wilson's exercise of power in the First World War provided a model for future Presidents and their advisors. During the preparedeness period of 1915-1916, the submarine crisis in the opening months of 1917, and the period of direct involvement of U.S. armed forces from April 1917 to November 1918, Wilson utilized powers as sweeping as Lincoln's. Because governmental agencies were more highly organized and their jurisdictions wider, presidential powers were considerably more effective than ever before. Yet, perhaps, because of Wilson's scrupulous attention to obtaining prior congressional concurrence there was only one significant congressional challenge to Wilson's wartime measures.

That challenge came in February-March 1917, following the severance of diplomatic relations with Germany. A group of Senators successfully filibustered a bill authorizing the arming of American merchant ships. In response--records American historian Frank Freidel in his book Roosevelt: the Apprenticeship - Assistant Secretary of the Navy Franklin D. Roosevelt found an old statute under which the President could proceed without fresh authorization from Congress. Roosevelt, impatient for action, was irritated because Wilson waited a few days before implementing the statute.

Lincoln had drawn most heavily upon his power as Commander-in-Chief; Wilson exercised emergency power on the basis of old statutes and sweeping new legislation--thus drawing on congressional delegation as a source of authority: The most significant Wilsonian innovations were economic, including a wide array of defense and war agencies, modeled to some extent upon British wartime precedents. In August 1916 just prior to the United States entry into the war, Congress at Wilson's behest established a Council of National Defense-primarily advisory. In 1917, a War Industries Board, also relatively weak, began operating. The ineffectiveness of the economic mobilization led Republicans in Congress - in the winter of 1917-1918 to demand a coalition War Cabinet similar to that in England. Wilson forestalled Congress by proposing legislation delegating him almost total economic power and, even before legislative approval, authorized the War Industries Board to exercise extensive powers. Subsequently Congress enacted Wilson's measure, the Overman Act, in April 1918. Other legislation extended the economic authority of the Government in numerous directions.

Following the allied victory, Wilson relinquished his wartime authority and asked Congress to repeal the emergency statutes, enacted to fight more effectively the war. Only a food-control measure and the 1917 Trading With the Enemy Act were retained. This procedure of terminating emergency powers when the particular emergency itself has, in fact, ended has not been consistently followed by his successors.

The next major development in the use of executive emergency powers came under Franklin D. RooseveIt. The Great Depression had already overtaken the country by the time of Roosevelt's inauguration and confronted him with a totally different crisis. This emergency, unlike those of the past, presented a nonmilitary threat. The Roosevelt administration, however, conceived the economic crisis to be a calamity equally as great as a war and employed the metaphor of war to emphasize the depression's severity. In his inaugural address, Roosevelt said: "I shall ask the Congress for the one remaining instrument to meet the crisis--broad executive power to wage a war against the emergency, as great as the power that would be given me if we were in fact invaded by a foreign foe."

Many of the members of the Roosevelt administration, including F.D.R. himself, were veterans of the economic mobilization of World War I and drew upon their experiences to combat the new situation. The first New Deal agencies, indeed, bore strong resemblance to wartime agencies and many had the term "emergency" in their titles-such as the Federal Emergency Relief Administration and the National Emergency Council.

In his first important official act, Roosevelt proclaimed a National Bank Holiday on the basis of the 1917 Trading With the Enemy Act - itself a wartime delegation of power. New Deal historian William E. Leuchtenburg writes:
 
When he sent his banking bill to Congress, the House received it with much the same ardor as it had greeted Woodrow Wilson's war legislation. Speaker Rainey said the situation reminded him of the late war when "on both sides of this Chamber the great war measures suggested by the administration were supported with practical unanimity....Today we are engaged in another war, more serious even in its character and presenting greater dangers to the Republic." After only 38 minutes debate, the House passed the administration's banking bill, sight unseen.

The Trading With the Enemy Act had, however, been specifically designed by its originators to meet only wartime exigencies. By employing it to meet the demands of the depression, Roosevelt greatly extended the concept of "emergencies" to which expansion of executive powers might be applied. And in so doing, he established a pattern that was followed frequently: In time of crisis the President should utilize any statutory authority readily at hand, regardless of its original purposes, with the firm expectation of ex post facto congressional concurrence.

Beginning with F.D.R., then, extensive use of delegated powers exercised under an aura of crisis has become a dominant aspect of the presidency. Concomitant with this development has been a demeaning of the significance of "emergency." It became a term used to evoke public and congressional approbation, often bearing little actual relation to events. Roosevelt brain-truster, Rexford G. Tugwell, has described the manner in which Roosevelt used declarations of diferent degrees of emergency:
 
The "limited emergency" was a creature of Roosevelt's imagination, used to make it seem that he was doing less than he was. He did not want to create any more furor than was necessary. The qualifying adjective had no limiting force. It was purely for public effect. But the finding that an emergency existed opened a whole armory of powers to the Commander-in-Chief, far more than Wilson had had.

Roosevelt and his successor, Harry S. Truman, invoked formal states of emergency to justify extensive delegations of authority during actual times of war. The Korean war, however, by the fact of its never having been officially declared a "war" as such by Congress, further diluted the concept of what constituted circumstances sufficiently critical to warrant the delegation of extraordinary authority to the President.

At the end of the Korean war, moreover, the official state of emergency was not terminated. It is not yet terminated. This may be primarily attributed to the continuance of the Cold War atmosphere which, until recent years, made the imminent threat of hostilities an accepted fact of everyday life, with "emergency" the normal state of affairs. In this, what is for all practical purposes, permanent state of emergency, Presidents have exercised numerous powers - most notably under the Trading With the Enemy Act - legitimated by that ongoing state of national emergency. Hundreds of others have lain fallow, there to be exercised at any time, requiring only an order from the President.

Besides the 1933 1 and Korean war emergencies,2 two other states of declared national emergency remain in existence. On March 23, 1970, confronted by a strike of Postal Service employees, President Nixon declared a national emergency.3 The following year, on August 15, 1971, Nixon proclaimed another emergency,1 under which he imposed stringent import controls in order to meet an international monetary crisis. Because of its general language, however, that proclamation could serve as sufficient authority to use a substantial proportion of all the emergency statutes now on the books.

Over the course of at least the last 40 years, then, Presidents have had available an enormous - seemingly expanding and never-ending - range of emergency powers. Indeed, at their fullest extent and during the height of a crisis, these "prerogative" powers appear to be virtually unlimited, confirming Locke's perceptions. Because Congress and the public are unaware of the extent of emergency powers, there has never been any notable congressional or public objection made to this state of affairs. Nor have the courts imposed significant limitations.

During the New Deal, the Supreme Court initially struck down much of Roosevelt's emergency economic legislation (Schecter v. United States, 295 U.S. 495). However, political pressures, a change in personnel, and presidential threats of court-packing, soon altered this course of decisions (NLRB v. Jones & Lauqhlin Steel Corp., 301 U.S. 1). Since 1987, the Court has been extremely reluctant to invalidate any congressional delegation of economic powers to the President. It appears that this will not change in the foreseeable future.

In a significant case directly confronting the issue of wartime emergency powers, Youngstown Sheet & Tube Co. v. Sawyer (343 U.S. 579), the Court refused to allow the President to rely upon implied constitutional powers during a crisis. The action at issue involved presidential seizure of steel plants in a manner apparently directly at odds with congressional policy, Justice Black's plurality opinion specifically acknowledges that if Congress delegates powers to the President for use during an emergency those powers are absolutely valid within constitutional restraints on Congress' own power to do so. Concurring opinions appear to agree on this point. It should be noted, therefore, that all statutes in this compilation are precisely these kinds of specific congressional delegations of power.

The 2,000-year-old problem of how a legislative body in a democratic republic may extend extraordinary powers for use by the executive during times of great crisis and dire emergency - but do so in ways assuring both that such necessary powers will be terminated immediately when the emergency has ended and that normal processes will be resumed - has not yet been resolved in this country. Too few are aware of the existence of emergency powers and their extent, and the problem has never been squarely faced.

 B - SUMMARY VIEWS OF THE PRESENT STATUS
 OF EMERGENCY POWERS STATUTES

Read the whole thang here:

http://www.theawaregroup.com/waremergencypower.htm (http://www.theawaregroup.com/waremergencypower.htm)

[note: I think, iirc, I found this link off a link provided elsewhere by Alton Speers.]

Note the 2nd: We'll recall that President Taft was Skull and Bones. We'll recall some other stuff later, as the thread evolves.

Note the 3rd: Present focus here at TMM headquarters in Montana is squarely upon Michael Ruppert's incredible book, "Crossing The Rubicon", which I'm now re-reading.  The reality of a conspiracy within a greater Conspiracy is taking shape in my mind, but my mind is still boggled by the scope and horror of what is presently sitting in the people's White House.  I would like, at this point, to once again get on record as believing that Dick Cheney masterminded the events of 911.  We shall wish to look soon at those five wargame "drills" which were being operated by Cheney on the morning of 911. Stay tuned.....

:)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Delos on November 30, 2004, 12:59:21 pm
I have read nothing between the first and now the last page on this thread. This is the first I have heard of the X Flight (where did the pentagon jet go?)! WOW! It looks like I'm in for a few hours of catching up!

The only thing about this whole mess that makes me uneasy is that I don't believe the sheeple are ever going to be able to wrap their stunted brains around this one.

Elias, I am curious to know why you believe this info will ever become mainstream common knowledge.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 30, 2004, 02:23:37 pm
Quote
I have read nothing between the first and now the last page on this thread. This is the first I have heard of the X Flight (where did the pentagon jet go?)! WOW! It looks like I'm in for a few hours of catching up!

The only thing about this whole mess that makes me uneasy is that I don't believe the sheeple are ever going to be able to wrap their stunted brains around this one.

Elias, I am curious to know why you believe this info will ever become mainstream common knowledge.
Delos,
The public-at-large has been programmed to deny the obvious. The information which has been unearthed by a handful of researchers and investigators is as solid as is our knowledge today that the US military had broken the Japanese code well prior to the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. As Ruppert notes on his film, "Truth and Lies of 911" regarding Pearl Harbor, "We knew it was coming and we let it happen." Today, many more Americans know that Roosevelt knew exactly which morning the Japanese would attack, and that the attack would come at Pearl Harbor. But that knowledge has never been spelled-out for the public, not in a direct and unambiguous way; the media certainly did publish all the info necessary for anyone to see that Roosevelt pushed the Japanese into attacking and that he knew aforehand of the coming travesty. But John Q. Public does not ask himself questions unless a question pertains to his entertainment, profitability, or health. When Americans get online, the overwhelming majority of them are hanging out at E-bay or porn sites or shopping for cheap airfares and such. Very few indeed get online to verify the news which came into their minds through the mainstream media. And worse, percentage-wise, very few Americans *read*.  (Here I'm speaking of "reading" in the same way I just spoke of Internet use. They'll read a mystery if they think for sure that it's fiction. They'll read romance novels and crossword puzzles. But they won't, by and large, read reports and analyses and etc.).

Therefore, my answer to your question regarding "how long" it may take for this body of truth to be accepted by the masses is that it may never be "mainstream".  And it is exactly upon that premise that the criminals of 911 depend.

Consider: We were an isolationist nation (for the most part) until the 1898 Spanish American War; despite the ravings of Mark Twain and high-up Democrat critics, hidden "forces" led America into a grab for the Philippines and other Spanish colonial holdings. William Jennings Bryan's acceptance speech of 1900 for the Democratic nomination says it all. But nobody reads it.

Then we let them give us the Federal Reserve System, inc., and the IRS in 1913, and hardly anyone felt he should question it or read into the matter; they just took it, figuring that their government knew what it was doing and that there must be a necessity involved in the reason. When just a few years later our nation was tricked into WWI, nobody looked behind the scenes to see how and why that happened.  When the League of Nations came out of WWI, nobody cared. When the Crash of Wall Street hit them hard in 1929, nobody asked the questions which would have revealed international banking's mischiefs.  Throughout the 1930s' Great Depression, everyone presumed that "depression" just happened, and no one questioned whether it had been a result of very bad Wall Street policy and US policy abroad. Then we were dragged into WWII, and the nation bought the deception yet again. Then came the UN and the National Security Act of 1947 and everyone let 'em do those deeds to us, never questioning hidden motives from within the power-elite's innermost circles. Then came the Cold War, Korea, Viet Nam, and a whole list of foreign sins, and the public has always been quite certain that if the fedgov says we must go there and do that, then we must, for after all, fedgov has our interests at heart and we've paid government tons of tax money to make itself strong and to widen fedgov's knowledge of everything imaginable, and it would be insane to think "I" know more than those dedicated men in positions of high power, who should therefore know more and better than "lowly me", so I must trust in Government and God and do what they say.

But here's another abstract and vague "coincidence": After America won WWII and vanquished all enemies and became then the strongest superpower on the planet, (and despite all the myths to the contrary, regarding the 'communist threat' and etc.), somehow the habit of pitching a World War every now and then could not find willing players anymore and guess what popped up --- damn! Terrorism popped up as a world-wide problem. To deal with the new War on Terror, the public has been prepared for years prior. Our government has created the offices inside our own halls of governance which create the terrorism and which oversee the dispersion of the press imagery with which to program the mass mind. (Think on this: "Mass media" consists of what we unconsciously but verbally refer to as "programs". They call 'em "programs" for a reason, but do you think that most Americans stop long enough to realize the sordid truth behind that one? LOL! hell no they don't. Their issues are about which program they like and why, never about the phenomenon itself.)

We who will question the mentality of the mass mind, who will search for answers, who care, are always the few, the rare individuals. We must not let this newest round of hidden knowledge destroy our happiness as we uncover it and come to realize that it is world government acting through our own government which has done this to us. Being wise, we must find our individual ways to cope with what's coming now. Just be glad that we know as much as we know, and use that knowledge to become either a Mole, an Agitator, or a Ghost, and survive. Make good use of "understanding". Pass the vision along to those who can receive it. Survive. Keep the faith.

Never expect the masses to understand. Go see "The Passion" and note how gladly the Roman cops of that day took delight in beating some worthless Jew. Notice how the crowds called for his suffering and death. Nothing has changed within mass consciousness and mass behavior. Nothing.

Howsome-ever, I'm gonna keep on running my mouth here, and coming entries on this thread ought to prove to be quite interesting for our couple of readers who *do* read, and who *do* care. Stay tuned....

Salute!
Elias

PS: Oh, and, regarding the Pentagon flight: my guess is that it could be in the Atlantic ocean. All I know so far is that not a trace of a 757 was found at the Pentagon crash site. Like Dave von Kleist noted, "I did not say a 757 hit the Pentagon; that was CNN, CBS, NBC, ABC, Fox News, and etc. The question should be: if Flight 77 hit the Pentagon, where is it?"  The film "911 In Plane Site" shall burn its way into the consciousness of anyone who watches it objectively about three times. Look for secret government smear tactics to pop up soon enough in the media, seeking to discredit what is quite obvious on that film.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on November 30, 2004, 02:59:35 pm
I'm not going to say anything about this just now, as I'm late (again!) for work, but this one is also huge. Cheney's energy task force has also been investigated by Mike Ruppert, and considerable info on that is in his new book. This is hugely important in our developing "cons-piracy" theory. Just into my mailbox this morning....

~

rom: Jamie Noguchi <jamihn@HIS.COM>   Save Address | Headers
 To: NSARCHIVE@hermes.gwu.eduX-Virus-Scanned: by Barracuda Spam Firewall at dns77.com
 CC:
 Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 10:12:43 -0500
 Subject: National Security Archive joins library and public interestgroups supporting public access to special interestsparticipating in Cheney's energy task force

 National Security Archive joins library and public interest groups supporting
public access to special interests participating in Cheney's energy task force
 
For more information contact:
Meredith Fuchs, 202-994-7059
Thomas Blanton, 202-994-7068
 
Washington, DC November 29, 2004 - The National Security Archive along with
concerned library, journalist, and public interest organizations today filed an
amici curiae brief with the United States Court of Appeals for the District of
Columbia Circuit supporting public access to information about the energy task
force convened by Vice President Cheney in 2001. The case is vital to preserving
public access to government information under the Federal Advisory Committee Act
(FACA).
 
The case seeking to determine whether special oil industry interests influenced
the National Energy Policy Development Group (NEPDG) was brought by the Sierra
Club and Judicial Watch and heard at the United States Supreme Court in March
2004. It is now scheduled for en banc review during its second appearance in the
D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals. Archive Executive Director Thomas Blanton
described the background: "In an effort to rebuild a zone of secrecy around the
actions of the Executive Branch that Vice President Cheney believes was
compromised away over the last 30-35 years, he has litigated up and down the
court system to hide the fact that the energy task force apparently met with
representatives of the oil industry."
 
The Supreme Court suggested that the lower court consider options for
reconciling the competing constitutional and statutory concerns raised in the
case. The amici argue that the lower court should accept the Supreme Court's
invitation to develop a procedure for accommodating the competing interests
asserted in this case. Archive counsel Meredith Fuchs explained, "The amici
recommend creating a `Cheney Log' that identifies certain basic information that
may be provided by the government without undue burden or compromise of
confidentiality." That information ordinarily will provide sufficient basis to
evaluate whether non-government persons participated in meetings of the NEPDG or
its sub-groups, thereby triggering FACA requirements that protect against the
improper influence of special interests on government decisionmaking.
 
The brief states that, "when important constitutional principles are on a
collision course, as in this case, courts should be wary of any winner-take-all
resolution. The judicial goal in this case should be accommodation of the
competing principles, not the exaltation of one and the obliteration of the
other. Requiring the Cheney Log, based on the successful example of the Vaughn
Index, promises such an effective accommodation."
 
The amici are the American Association of Law Libraries, the American Library
Association, the Association of Research Libraries, the Center for American
Progress, the National Security Archive, the Society of American Archivists, the
American Booksellers Foundation for Free Expression, the Liberty Project, OMB
Watch, and the Society of Professional Journalists. Amici are represented by
David O. Stewart, Thomas M. Susman, and Stacy J. Dawson of Ropes & Gray LLP.
 
A copy of the amici curiae brief is available at http://www.nsarchive.org (http://www.nsarchive.org)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on November 30, 2004, 03:35:41 pm
Hey, all.  Glad to see this thread continuing...and Elias teasing us along as well!   ;)   Bring it on, I say!

A couple of items:
I clicked on that LibertyThink link, and saw this mentioned:
Quote
Flight X = United Airlines Flight?

White said the plane had been moved to a secure area of the airport, and was evacuated. United identified the plane as Flight 93. The airline did say how many people were aboard the flight.
I am confused, then.  United Flight 93 was not the flight that allegedly hit the Pentagon - that was American #77.  United #93 was the flight that allegedly crashed near Shanksville, PA, the one on board which, we're told, several passengers including Todd Beamer decided to fight the hijackers.

Did I misunderstand your meaning?  I thought you were attempting to explain how the suspected Pentagon aircraft substitution was handled.  But I don't see how this information answers that question.  In fact, I'm left with a new question: how could United #93 be in two places at once?

The Pentagon was hit by (supposedly) American #77 at about 9:43 a.m. Eastern time (this I know from the evidence of my own senses), and Flight X reportedly didn't land in Cleveland until 10:10 (same time zone as DC).  Flight X could conceivably be United #93, if we went strictly by what planes were still in the air after the Pentagon was hit, but then how did United #93 make it to PA with passengers and hijackers still on board?

Just below that excerpt was a link to the story about United identifying the flight that landed in Cleveland - but when I clicked on it, I found this:
Quote
Plane Lands In Cleveland; Bomb Feared Aboard

Reported by: 9News Staff
Web produced by: Liz Foreman
9/11/01 11:43:57 AM

This story has been removed from WCPO.com.

It was a preliminary AP story, and was factually incorrect.

Intriguing?   :ph34r:   Or merely a correction as new information became available?  IIRC, on 9/11/01, there was still a renegade plane unaccounted for around 11:30 that morning, which corresponds to the time stamp on this story.

But then, if this was a mere factual correction, and United realized later that Flight 93 actually crashed in PA, what flight WAS this Flight X that reportedly emergency-landed in Cleveland?  Or, if United #93 really did land in Cleveland and was evacuated two hours later, then what flight crashed in PA?

And by the way, if it's true that a suspected bomb aboard caused the emergency landing, then why in hell did the gummint wait over 2 hours to get the people off the damn plane?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: mercedesrules on December 01, 2004, 09:44:00 am
Hi. I thought I would contribute the work of a (cyberspace) friend of mine on this subject.

The Truth About the 9/11 Attacks (http://geocities.com/vonchloride/)

 
 MR

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 01, 2004, 12:14:59 pm
Quote
Hi. I thought I would contribute the work of a (cyberspace) friend of mine on this subject.

The Truth About the 9/11 Attacks (http://geocities.com/vonchloride/)

 
 MR
Hi, mercedesrules, thanks for sending that site, and welcome to TCF boards! Your friend seems to be tracking on track with his site, and you're welcome to invite him over here too. I've just raised his site and glanced down the page, but am unable at this time to look into it deeper, as I have to leave here for work today. I'll check it out better tonight. Salute!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 01, 2004, 12:20:47 pm
Quote
Hey, all.  Glad to see this thread continuing...and Elias teasing us along as well!   ;)   Bring it on, I say!

 
LOL, Lightning,
I tried to get a reply for you composed last night, but couldn't get past all the stuff in my email which had to be dealt with.  I'll try again tonight. Thanks for being patient with my old ass! You ask good questions. I never heard of Flight X until I got Ruppert's book, so don't expect a lot from me on that one subject. Also remember, I'm looking at all this from an over-view perspective, and place little significance on any one element by itself; e.g., the 18' hole at the Pentagon and etc and etc. There is a lot of smoke and mirrors type stuff floating around "out there", some of it deliberate and some innocent confusion, I'm sure. I'll try to get this thread moving at a faster rate, but right now I'm pretty maxed-out with stuff locally, so it won't happen as fast as I'd like. Thanks, with salutes!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Plinker-MS on December 01, 2004, 01:11:05 pm
Government is incapable of giving a straight answer about anything, no matter how trivial.  

Most government "answers" will have been "staffed" through various levels of the bureaucracy, with each layer "shading" the truth to make themselves look less incompetent to their bosses.  Anything inconvenient will be redacted, destroyed, doctored, etc...   After all this mangling, the resulting "answer" will likely contradict itself as well as any information that can be independently verified.

Oh, yeah...  that and the fact that the ones in charge are all Lying Sons o' Bitches.


Doesn't matter what you ask about:

Are there really flying saucers?
Why did TWA800 fall out of the sky?
Why did a big plane make only a small hole in the Pentagon?
What was the GNP last year?

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 01, 2004, 06:16:49 pm
Quote
...
These proclamations give force to 470 provisions of Federal law. These hundreds of statutes delegate to the President extraordinary powers, ordinarily exercised by the Congress, which affect the lives of American citizens in a host of all-encompassing manners. This vast range of powers, taken together, confer enough authority to rule the country without reference to normal Constitutional processes.
...
The problem of how a constitutional democracy reacts to great crises, however, far antedates the Great Depression. As a philosophical issue, its origins reach back to the Greek city-states and the Roman Republic. And, in the United States, actions taken by the Government in times of great crises have-from, at least, the Civil War-in important ways, shaped the present phenomenon of a permanent state of national emergency.

American political theory of emergency government was derived and enlarged from John Locke, the English political-philosopher whose thought influenced the authors of the Constitution. Locke argued that the threat of national crisis-unforeseen, sudden, and potentially catastrophic-required the creation of broad executive
emergency powers to be exercised by the Chief Executive in situations where the legislative authority had not provided a means or procedure of remedy. Referring to emergency power in the 14th chapter of his Second Treatise on Civil Government as "prerogative"; Locke suggested that it:
 
...should be left to the discretion of him that has the executive power...since in some governments the lawmaking power is not always in being and is usually too numerous, and so too slow for the dispatch requisite to executions, and because, also it is impossible to foresee and so by laws to provide for all accidents and necessities that may concern the public, or make such laws as will do no harm, if they are executed with an inflexible rigour on all occasions and upon all persons that may come in their way, therefore there is a latitude left to the executive power to do many things of choice; which the laws do not prescribe.
...

To what extent the Founding Fathers adhered to this view of the executive role in emergencies is a much disputed issue.
And, if anyone with at least 2 brain cells to rub together to create a spark of intelligence can't figure out how it is supposed to work, how can those who get elected to public office, since they don't exhibit the aforementioned trait, be expected to understand it? And this is why even a constitutional republic will not work. As Spooner said, the constitution was either written intending what we now have or was helpless to prevent it.

From said document:
Quote
Article I. - The Legislative Branch
Section 9 - Limits on Congress
The Migration or Importation of such Persons as any of the States now existing shall think proper to admit, shall not be prohibited by the Congress prior to the Year one thousand eight hundred and eight, but a tax or duty may be imposed on such Importation, not exceeding ten dollars for each Person.

The privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it.

No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.

(No capitation, or other direct, Tax shall be laid, unless in Proportion to the Census or Enumeration herein before directed to be taken.) (Section in parentheses modified by Amendment XVI.)

No Tax or Duty shall be laid on Articles exported from any State.

No Preference shall be given by any Regulation of Commerce or Revenue to the Ports of one State over those of another: nor shall Vessels bound to, or from, one State, be obliged to enter, clear, or pay Duties in another.

No Money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in Consequence of Appropriations made by Law; and a regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time.

No Title of Nobility shall be granted by the United States: And no Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under them, shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince or foreign State.
Quote
Article II. - The Executive Branch
Section 1 - The President

[nothing of note in section 1, although nowhere do I see it stated, "Is to be the ruler of the free world,"]
It does stipulate:
Before he enter on the Execution of his Office, he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation:

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

Section 2 - Civilian Power over Military, Cabinet, Pardon Power, Appointments
The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States; he may require the Opinion, in writing, of the principal Officer in each of the executive Departments, upon any subject relating to the Duties of their respective Offices, and he shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.

He shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur; and he shall nominate, and by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, shall appoint Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, Judges of the supreme Court, and all other Officers of the United States, whose Appointments are not herein otherwise provided for, and which shall be established by Law: but the Congress may by Law vest the Appointment of such inferior Officers, as they think proper, in the President alone, in the Courts of Law, or in the Heads of Departments.

The President shall have Power to fill up all Vacancies that may happen during the Recess of the Senate, by granting Commissions which shall expire at the End of their next Session.

Section 3 - State of the Union, Convening Congress

He shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient; he may, on extraordinary Occasions, convene both Houses, or either of them, and in Case of Disagreement between them, with Respect to the Time of Adjournment, he may adjourn them to such Time as he shall think proper; he shall receive Ambassadors and other public Ministers; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, and shall Commission all the Officers of the United States.

Section 4 - Disqualification

The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.
Quote
Treason
treason n the offense of attempting to overthrow the government of one's country or of assisting its enemies in war

I see it stated nowhere that congress may delegate any of its authority to the executive branch. Nor do I see it stated that the executive branch may accept any authority delegated to it by the legislative branch.

To me it is very simple and any efforts to complicate it are attempts to subvert the constitutional republic. Simply stated:
The executive branch is not permitted by the constitution the authority to legislate, nor is it permitted to receive a delegated authority to legislate by the legislative branch even for an emergency. Any attempt to do so is an attempt to "overthrow the government of one's country " see above for the impact of that concept
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 02, 2004, 08:53:35 am
Quote
I see it stated nowhere that congress may delegate any of its authority to the executive branch. Nor do I see it stated that the executive branch may accept any authority delegated to it by the legislative branch.

To me it is very simple and any efforts to complicate it are attempts to subvert the constitutional republic. Simply stated:
The executive branch is not permitted by the constitution the authority to legislate, nor is it permitted to receive a delegated authority to legislate by the legislative branch even for an emergency. Any attempt to do so is an attempt to "overthrow the government of one's country " see above for the impact of that concept
Excellent posting, Ragnar. Most excellent indeed. I think it plays to the core of many problems which we find in today's federal administration of itself upon the people. The cherry in that entire listing of sections of the constitution you provided is the part about "...preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution...."

I noted with great happiness that word: "preserve" is in the oath. (So much for Henry Hyde, eh?)

On the basis of that alone, we have impeachable offenses by nearly the entire US Congress as well as the Bush Administration's cabinet and others.  As Schulz keeps saying, "we either have a constitution or we don't." My thinking is that if the bastards who are using "government" to oppress us do so through the legitimacy provided to government by its founding legal document, then we the people have every right and duty to hold their damned feet to the fire of that document, or agree among ourselves that by the acts of Congress and all other forms of the government, it's legal charter no longer exists, in which case.....

Well, that's getting ahead of the thread to go there, eh? First, I'd like to continue to develop the setting in which the great conspiracy has taken root and grown forth upon us. Then we'll look into just what every American might want to think about doing about it. I'm kinda like Ruppert --- I want an air-tight case layed in first, here on this thread, after which we'll all know what our options are as a free people under an imposter tyranny.

Thanks for posting!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Alton Speers on December 02, 2004, 09:40:48 am
Quote
Quote
I see it stated nowhere that congress may delegate any of its authority to the executive branch. Nor do I see it stated that the executive branch may accept any authority delegated to it by the legislative branch.

To me it is very simple and any efforts to complicate it are attempts to subvert the constitutional republic. Simply stated:
The executive branch is not permitted by the constitution the authority to legislate, nor is it permitted to receive a delegated authority to legislate by the legislative branch even for an emergency. Any attempt to do so is an attempt to "overthrow the government of one's country " see above for the impact of that concept
...I think it plays to the core of many problems which we find in today's federal administration of itself upon the people...
 
Not to be contradictory but, the above is the real cherry of the entire basis of US federal government. Checks and balances are a bad joke played on the people of this land. Congress takes care of the executive and judiciary branches, the executive takes care of the legislative and judiciary, the judiciary takes care of the legislative and executive branches because it is ALL government. They only appear to act against one another so as to not appear too obvious in their support of one another.

Furthermore, do notice that there is no way that these people can be held accountable to the electorate for their actions. Congress can handle itself according to Art. 1 Sec. 5, US Constitution:
Quote
Section. 5. Each House shall be the Judge of the Elections, Returns and
Qualifications of its own Members, and a Majority of each shall constitute
a Quorum to do Business; but a smaller Number may adjourn from day to day,
and may be authorized to compel the Attendance of absent Members, in such
Manner, and under such Penalties as each House may provide.

Each House may determine the Rules of its Proceedings, punish its Members
for disorderly Behaviour, and, with the Concurrence of two thirds, expel a
Member.

The House of Representatives has the sole power of Impeachment according to Art.1, Sec. 2, cls 5,  US Constitution:
Quote
The House of Representatives shall chuse their Speaker and other Officers;
and shall have the sole Power of Impeachment

The Senate has the sole power of trying the impeachment according to Art. 1 Sec. 3, cls 6, US Constitution:
Quote
The Senate shall have the sole Power to try all Impeachments. When sitting
for that Purpose, they shall be on Oath or Affirmation. When the President
of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside: And no
Person shall be convicted without the Concurrence of two thirds of the
Members present.

Furthermore, this power of impeachment is severely limited in the clause following:
Quote
Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal
from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor,

This is further established by repetition and extension in Art.2, Sec. 4,:
Quote
Section. 4. The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the
United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and
Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors

The only standard applicable to those persons sitting on the bench in the judiciary is Art. 3, Sec. 1.:
Quote
Section. 1. The judicial Power of the United States shall be vested in one
supreme Court, and in such inferior Courts as the Congress may from time to
time ordain and establish. The Judges, both of the supreme and inferior
Courts, shall hold their Offices during good Behaviour, and shall, at
stated Times, receive for their Services a Compensation, which shall not be
diminished during their Continuance in Office.
[emphasis added]

The vote or suit at law are the only methods of redress and recourse available to the citizenry and sanctioned by the US Constitution. In short, constitutionally, government is ONLY accountable to itself. Even then, the only constutional punishment is removal from office. Further punishments must be sought under the law in courts of the proper jurisdiction. The government is virtually at liberty to do as it will being shielded by the buffers of both law and time. In effect, there is no real accountability for persons holding government offices.

Alton
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Delos on December 02, 2004, 10:05:18 am

Alton,

You seem to be forgetting the 2nd Amendment! (in support of this observation, it may be necessary to delve into the chronicles of the intent of the founder's re: the 2nd)

Also, do not forget the sine qua non of the whole Constitution, The Declaration of Independence!

(not that anyone pays any attention to these archaic documents, of course)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Alton Speers on December 02, 2004, 11:54:00 am
Quote
Alton,

You seem to be forgetting the 2nd Amendment! (in support of this observation, it may be necessary to delve into the chronicles of the intent of the founder's re: the 2nd)

Also, do not forget the sine qua non of the whole Constitution, The Declaration of Independence!

(not that anyone pays any attention to these archaic documents, of course)
Delos, thanks.

By any measure of LAW the Declaration of Independence is an illegal document. Note, I am not saying that it is wrong, immoral or in anyway in dischord with the rights of man. Merely that it is an illegal document according to British law extant at the time.

The same applies to the second amendment. There is NO right of final revolution stated or implied except, perhaps, in the phrase " A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State,...". Security of a free state being the prime consideration. This phrase, if it does indeed include a final right of revolution, limits the exercise of that right to the states and NOT to the people or any individuals. This interpretation throws the union of the northern states into serious jeopardy over the war to prevent Southern Independence. If this interpretation is incorrect it automatically places the second amendment in conflict with the tenth amendment. In fact, Article 1, Sec 8 of the constitution clearly states in clause 15:
Quote
15) To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union,
suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;
unless, the sitting government defines the action in such a way so as to give credence to it's actions such as it did in the war to prevent Southern Independence.
Insurrections are armed actions of the citizens against the lawffully established government. In fact, that is precisely how the union defined the secession of the confederated states. In Ex Parte Milligan (USSC 1866) the war was consistently referred to as the Rebellion.
Of course, this on top of all the powers of congress to control the land and naval forces. This is further established in Art. 1, Sec. 10, cls 3,:
Quote
No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any Duty of Tonnage,
keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or
Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War,
unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of
delay.

With the passage (under duress) of the 14th amendment, section 4 of the amendment included a repudiation of debts incurred during rebellion (the war to prevent Southern Independence). By extension of this thinking if the debts are repudiated and claimed to be illegal then the acts which incurred those debts are inferred to be illegal though not stated directly as such.

Quote
Section. 4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized
by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for
services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned.
But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or
obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United
States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such
debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Section. 5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate
legislation, the provisions of this article.

Do not misconstrue this as support for the government or it's constitution. I am merely pointing out how the constitution was both written AND interpreted to support always the cases and causes of the government. There exists a threefold disagreement on the constitution:
1) What people think it means
2) What the rules of language say it means
3) What the government and the USSC tells us it means
and none of these agree consistently in any way to make sense of it or to use it as a basis in support of liberty and freedom. Wipe with it. Burn it. Roll it and blow snow with it. BUT, do not use it as a basis for government or political society or a wand with which to attempt to divine the law.

Alton
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on December 02, 2004, 04:11:28 pm
I think it's getting clearer that the constitution was a con-job from the get-go. Even the law system is quite unordered. Pre-then (and to now), there were two hierarchical systems of control that intertwined going back into the darks of history-- govt & church. When did the universtiy system come about? Seems I recall ~1100 A.D. Italy during their renaissance. The U was quickly brought into close connection to the power centers-- govt, church, and big money. Since then those power centers have been distorting the development and teaching of all areas of knowledge including law. Take for instance the ideas of (political-) economics and how they'd been distorted over all those years. Finally, 1851 and Menger, and it almost disappeared again. What Menger did with econ, I think could well be done with law. Even the base concepts remain mangled. I think something similar happened with law-govt around 1776, but it did disappear like Menger almost did. The US constitution helped that disappearance along. Not only can we see the effect in the document itself, but also the history around it points to the con. Most all at the con congress were long-time feeders-at-the trough, politicians, who each had spent most of his life getting paid by colonial govt, then state govt. Also one can connect various activities to big money in New York (and if NYC then Boston).

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 07, 2004, 07:59:04 pm
This article (http://www.strike-the-root.com/4/gregory/gregory27.html) in today's STR by Anthony Gregory is a good read for this thread.
Quote
Sixty-three years ago, on December 7, 1941 , more than three hundred Japanese planes descended upon Pearl Harbor in a horrendous surprise attack. Or, at least it was a surprise for the American servicemen and civilians who resided at the base, some 2,400 of whom perished in the terrible onslaught.   

Despite the difficulties confronted by historians and others who attempted to reveal that Franklin Roosevelt likely had foreknowledge of these attacks, the case is fairly solid now. Robert Stinnett’s groundbreaking book, Day of Deceit: The Truth About FDR and Pearl Harbor, contains the best argument and evidence, so far. The US government had broken the codes necessary to learn of an imminent threat, and FDR had pursued a deliberate policy of provoking the Japanese – cutting off their oil supply, assisting their enemies in China, ignoring their diplomatic attempts to ensure peace with the United States, and placing US military personnel in harm’s way near Japan – in order to get them to fire the first shot and open a backdoor into a war against Germany. Others have compellingly argued that the US government also wanted to exert US global dominance in the Pacific, which it feared would be undercut by the Japanese.   
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on December 08, 2004, 02:25:26 pm
Let's see...senior year, high school...1969-70, I brought that up in US History class. I was given strike two by the instructor...one more and I would be out. Odd, I thought, a strike just for bringing up history in history class?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 09, 2004, 12:33:51 am
Ya'll just have to get over to Henrietta's saloon and read up on this (http://www.sierratimes.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard//topic.cgi?forum=2&topic=702). Definitely requires a prinout. She links to an article by Steven Yates, Ph.D., which I could link to here, but I think she deserves a visit from as many of us as want to visit her.
from her spotlight post
Quote
In today's Saloon spotlight post, Dr. Yates has assembled the many interlocking puzzle pieces for you in a seven-part article, all of which is available from the linked article below, "'Taking the red pill': the REAL Matrix." My long-term readers will find much in the Yates article familiar to them from my attempts to educate them as to why certain things are happening, and have happened, in America and the world -- events that are power plays by the elites in the long march to a socialistic world government.
from Dr. Yates article
Quote
Let us conduct a thought experiment. Let us remove the obviously evil artificial intelligence and its minions—“agents” and “sentinels”—and substitute a power system controlled by a few hundred extremely wealthy and well-placed individuals—a super-elite, I will call it. I use this term to distinguish it from visible, national elites. This super-elite operates at an international level, outside all national loyalties. Its only loyalties are to money and power. It exercises control by controlling not just much of the Western world’s finances but much of the information released to the public. It controls the mainstream mass media (television networks and newspapers mostly owned by six or so megaconglomerates) and most education through top-down policies permeating the prevailing form of education in this land: government (“public”) schools. So-called higher education is part of this system. The super-elite bent academic disciplines such as history and psychology in the direction it wanted them to go by generously supplying foundation and grant money to compliant graduate students who then become compliant professors and administrators. Through the endowment system it gained control over Ivy League universities. The latter, via their enormous prestige and control of flagship organizations within academic disciplines (such as the American Historical Association or the American Psychological Association), set the course for those disciplines that others can be expected to follow automatically.
and
Quote
Quigley identified shadowy organizations such as the Council on Foreign Relations based in New York and the Royal Institute of International Affairs based in London as front organizations for the Round Table Groups he mentioned—sometimes specific individuals such as J.P. Morgan, the banking titan. He claimed to have studied the super-elite’s secret records for twenty years, and to identify with its goals and most of its policies. His only major disagreement was with its desire to “remain unknown.” This disagreement got Tragedy and Hope into trouble. Its publisher, Macmillan, allowed the book to disappear despite thousands of back orders. Inquirers were told it had gone out of print. In addition to the disappearance of nearly every copy, the original plates were destroyed, making new printings impossible given the technology of the time. There can be no doubt of an attempt to suppress the book. Quigley lost control of his own work, as pirated editions began to appear. He wrote near the end of his life that the book “has brought me many headaches as it apparently says something that powerful people don’t want known.” A smaller companion volume, The Anglo-American Establishment, failed to find a publisher during his lifetime.
and
Quote
We know that a man named John Ruskin came to Oxford University to teach fine arts in 1870, and that he had a social philosophy of reform that took English upper-class youth by storm. Ruskin taught that English upper-class values needed to be extended to the masses and spread worldwide. The English upper classes would need to redistribute at least some of their wealth, or face the overwhelming of English civilization by an uncontrollable “rabble.” Karl Marx had preached that the violent overthrowing of capitalism was historically inevitable. Ruskin’s response: Marxian upheavals were preventable, but only by undertaking the immense project of extending English upper-class wealth and values as a means of remaining in control. In other words, create a global empire with Great Britain at its helm.

Ruskin’s most famous pupil was Cecil Rhodes. Rhodes kept the notes he’d taken on certain of Ruskin’s lectures with him the rest of his life. Other students of Ruskin’s were Alfred Milner and Arnold Toynbee. Rhodes became a multibillionaire mining gold and diamonds in South Africa (he received support, interestingly, from Lord Rothschild and later from Alfred Beit, an immensely wealthy German-born financier who became his partner in De Beers Consolidated Mines). We know that prior to his death, Rhodes willed a substantial portion of his fortune to the creation of the Rhodes Scholarship program mentioned above. Less well known is that in five previous wills he wrote of setting up a secret society the long-term goal of which was to create world government: “the extension of British rule throughout the world” including “the ultimate recovery of the United States of America as an integral part of the British Empire …”
and
Quote
Here (courtesy of G. Edward Griffin’s exhaustive research for Freedom Force International) is a list of past presidents who have been members of the CFR: Herbert Hoover, Dwight Eisenhower, Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, George H.W. Bush, and Bill Clinton. Here is a list of Secretaries of State who were CFR members: Dean Rusk, Robert Lansing, Frank Kellogg, Henry Stimpson, Cordell Hull, E.R. Stittinius, George Marshall, Dean Acheson, John Foster Dulles, Christian Herter, William Rogers, Henry Kissinger, Cyrus Vance, Edmund Muskie, Alexander Haig, George Schulz, James Baker, Lawrence Eagelberger, Warren Christopher, William Richardson, Madeleine Albright, Colin Powell, and now Condoleezza Rice (President Bush’s new replacement for the recently departed Powell). Here is a list of Secretaries of Defense who were CFR members: James Forrestal, George Marshall, Charles Wilson, Neil McElroy, Robert McNamara, Melvin Laird, Elliot Richardson, James Schlesinger, Harold Brown, Casper Weinberger, Frank Carlucci, Richard Cheney, Les Aspin, William Perry, William Cohen and Donald Rumsfeld. Here is a list of Central Intelligence Agency directors who were CFR members: Walter Smith, William Colby, Richard Helms, Allen Dulles, John McCone, James Schlesinger, George H.W. Bush, Stansfield Turner, William Casey, William Webster, Robert Gates, James Woolsey, John Deutch, William Studeman and George Tenet.

CFR influence permeates the mainstream media. Leading media personalities who are or were CFR members include David Brinkley, Tom Brokaw, William Buckley, Dan Rather, Diane Sawyer and Barbara Walters. Members of the CFR hold controlling management positions at major newspapers, leading news services, publications, and publishing houses. A sampling: The Army Times, American Publishers, American Spectator, Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Associated Press, Association of American Publishers, Boston Globe, BusinessWeek, Christian Science Monitor, Dallas Morning News, Detroit Free Press, Detroit News, Forbes, Foreign Affairs, Foreign Policy, Dow Jones News Service, USA Today, The Wall Street Journal, Los Angeles Times, New York Post, New York Times, San Diego Union-Tribune, Times Mirror, Random House, W.W. Norton & Co., Warner Books, Atlantic, Harper’s, Industry Week, Naval War College Review, Farm Journal, Financial World, Insight, Washington Times, Medical Tribune, National Geographic, National Review, The New Republic, The New Yorker, New York Review of Books, Newsday, NewsMax, Newsweek, Political Science Quarterly, The Progressive, Public Interest, Reader’s Digest, Rolling Stone, Scientific American, Time-Warner, Time, U.S. News & World Report, Washington Post, The Washingtonian, Weekly Standard, World Policy Journal, Worldwatch, ABC, CBS, CNN, Fox News, NBC, PBS, RCA, and Walt Disney.

Tax-exempt foundations and think tanks with CFR members in controlling positions include: The Sloan and Kettering Foundations, Aspen Institute, Atlantic Council, Bilderburg Group, Brookings Institute, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, Carnegie Foundation, Ford Foundation, Guggenheim Foundation, Hudson Institute, John D. & Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, Mellon Foundation, RAND Corp., Rhodes Scholarship Selection Committee, Rockefeller Foundation and Rockefeller Brothers Trust Fund, the Trilateral Commission, and the UN Association.

The number of past or present university presidents, administrators, professors and departmental chairs, or members of boards of trustees who are or were CFR members is around 563. This is greater than the number of CFR members in financial institutions including banks, the Federal Reserve system, stock exchanges and brokerage houses: around 284. Many corporations, finally, have been controlled by past or present CFR members: Atlantic Richfield, AT&T, Avon, Bechtel, Boeing, Bristol-Myers Squibb, Chevron, Coca Cola, Consolidated Edison, Exxon, Dow Chemical, du Pont, Eastman Kodak, Enron, Estee Lauder, Ford Motor, General Electric, General Foods, Hewlett-Packard, Hughes Aircraft, IBM, International Paper, Johnson & Johnson, Levi Strauss & Co., Lockheed, Lucent Technologies, Mobil Oil, Monsanto, Northrup, Pacific Gas & Electric, Phillips Petroleum, Proctor & Gamble, Quaker Oats, Yahoo, Shell Oil, Smith Kline Beecham (a pharmaceutical giant), Sprint, Texaco, Santa Fe Southern Pacific Railroad, Teledyne, TRW, Southern California Edison, Unocal, United Technologies, Verizon Communications, Warner-Lambert, Weyerhauser, Xerox.

okay, enough teasers - get thee to the saloon - shouting here Elias, check in at the saloon
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 09, 2004, 06:43:03 am
General Ragnar,
Thanks for the heads-up. I went over there and read that thread, and read a few pages in the article she linked. Excellent writing, and spot on info. Then I made a post to Henrietta, but as you know I'm on a new computer without my old files, so I can't look up my password for the Sagebrush Saloon. Therefore, I clicked on "lost password" and have still not received a message containing my pw. Therefore, you may do with this as you think best:

~

Quote
The Sagebrush Saloon Barkeep noted while wiping a wine glass: "As my regular Sierra Times and Sagebrush Saloon readers know, I often stress the importance of taking pieces of the puzzle, doing your own personal research to discover more inter-connecting pieces and then to put the pieces together to form what I call "the big picture." Only by this means can we see what is being debliberately hidden from our view. To focus on only certain isolated pieces of the puzzle is, in effect, tunnel vision -- thus making it impossible to see "the big picture."

 
Howdy and Salute, Henrietta.  I don't usually follow orders, (since I usually am the one giving orders), but one of TMM's ocifers, General Ragnar, has literally ordered me to drop by here and have another drink with my favoritest barkeep. So here I am, and I'm glad to be in your good company once again.  
 
Make mine Johnny Walker Black, with ice cubes and water, please. An' get yourself whatever your tastes require, on me. $$$  
 
As you know, I ride hard and stop seldom. Got a danged consciousness revolution to manage, right? Keeps a mental revolutionary General hopping. We got blazing psycho-firefights going on all over the country! The enemy is hitting us on all fronts, all the time. And they got all the brute force, while all we got is our danged worn-out frustrated frightened fragmented programmed conditioned mesmerized minds, most of which are wounded from decades of assault by the evil forces of fedgov's secret owners. It's a challenge, at best, and a damned nation if we're not victorious. An' we're hugely outnumbered. But you know all that. :)
 
Me'n some of the troops over at the Claire Files message boards have been doing just what you have suggested, takin' pieces of the puzzle and groping for a bigger picture as the pieces dovetail together. Of course, I've known well for quite some time that you've got your trigger finger right on the problem which today threatens the destruction of America and all she stands for.  The CFR/Tri-lateral gangs, the power-elite and such. But we ain't dead yet. From G. Edward Griffin to Quigley, from Marchetti to Ruppert, from McCoy to Seagrave, from Ellsberg to Reed, with all sorts of heavy-fire ammo in between, we've got good defenses, psychologically speaking, and mucho ammo for the mental fray. But of course, people who *read* are the only people who'll have a chance to see what you're talking about, and what TMM is talking about. Thankfully, you've got some regular readers, some individual thinkers, some observers, some good folks who care. There are a few over at the Claire Files boards too, and I'm formally inviting you over there next time you think you've got two seconds to spare.  
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/clairefile...f=4&t=2347&st=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/clairefiles/index.php?act=ST&f=4&t=2347&st=0)
 
While I'm at it, I'm also formally inviting you to be a General in The Mental Militia, if you want the honor. You won't have to "do" anything other than just what you're already doing, which is a powerful lot. But I'd consider it a blessing if I could count you in my collective of mental warriors, 'cause you're one of the finest in the land.  You'd be joining some good ladies of liberty, such as Claire Wolfe, Sunni Maravillosa, Wendy McElroy, Lady Liberty, Iloilo Jones, ladylearning, Catherine Austin Fitts, Debra Ricketts, and a lot more. And heck, I'll buy ye another round just to celebrate your joining, k? :)
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org (http://www.thementalmilitia.org)
 
Now down to business. On November 26, 2004 I sent the following to the Western Alliance for Liberty (WAL) email list. It is just something I dashed off the cuff while replying to an email from that list. Naturally, some self-aggrandized and self-proclaimed "Libertarian" couldn't see why people who are planning on migrating to the triad of Idaho, Wyoming, and Montana would want to bother themselves reading this kind of history, so I was a bit taken aback. But then I started getting personal emails, off list, from people who wanted to know more. Some people could see the "Matrix" parallel. Maybe some of your readers here can also make the connection. Let's see.
 
~
 
Concerning the Kennedy assassination, just a few points, which I may not be able at this time to validate with sources, owing to my computer being in for repairs, leaving me without my files and bookmarks. Hopefully I can get all that restored! Ack! Perish any doubt!!!!
 
Kennedy inherited an Eisenhower plan to arm a private army through the CIA, a private army which would largely consist of Cubans, to invade Cuba. CIA advised Kennedy on this plan when he took office. Kennedy issued the necessary new "finding" so that CIA could carry the operation forward, but Kennedy asked CIA about details of the plan. Allen Dulles and Richard Bissell, respectively the number one and number three at CIA, told Kennedy that they expected US air support for the invasion, and Kennedy told them flat out that this was a damn "clandestine" operation and no US aircraft would be used, so what could they provide for air support which would *not* be US aircraft? Bissell and Dulles put their heads together and came up with some story about using Guatemalan Air Force planes, perhaps with some disguising applied. Kennedy agreed to the alternative plan to use foreign aircraft, and told Dulles and Bissell to carry on with their plan, but to keep him advised. They agreed, then conspired on him behind his back because ?  they *wanted* it known after the invasion that it was a US-backed militation, exactly what Kennedy did *not* want to be known. Truth is, Bissell and Dulles never set up any plan for alternate aircraft, thinking that at the last moment they could force Kennedy to provide US aircraft, and that is just what the bastards did. On the morning of the invasion 1500 CIA-trained troops embarked on the invasion, and in the wee hours Bissell and Dulles called up Kennedy on the phone and alerted him that, dang the luck!, the Guatemalan airplanes were after all not available, so please let us have some US air support. Kennedy told them he would not be forced into this sort of thing, and that they'd have to resurrect their plan for foreign aircraft, which of course they could not do, so the whole invasion turned into a fiasco.  
 
Now one of the major elements in any CIA clandestine operation is "plausible deniability", a factor the CIA has to insure for the President so he can get away with lying about it to the world and to the American people, as was done embarrassingly during the Gary Powers U-2 shootdown over Russia. But Dulles and Bissell, head strong into their own psycho games, failed to keep Kennedy's butt covered, and the whole world found out joltingly that the damned US government under Kennedy had authorized an illegal invasion by a secret CIA army of a sovereign nation-state. Kennedy was rightly furious, and to appease the public he held a little investigation into the Bay of Pigs, which resulted in his publicly firing Dulles and Bissell, and a third one who's name escapes me, from the CIA.
 
Bad move. Who was Allen Dulles? At the time Kennedy fired him, Dulles was DCI of the CIA. How had Dulles got to be the Director of Central Intelligence? Simple. He and his brother, John Foster Dulles, both Wall Street lawyers at the law firm of Sullivan and Cromwell, had helped Clark Clifford in the drafting of the National Security Act of 1947, which was signed into law by President Truman. How did they come to be asked to help write the bill which would create the CIA and give the US Intelligence community and the Pentagon carte blanch to bilk billions of dollars out of 22 Federal agencies, such as HUD? Simple too: both of them had been lawyers in the service of Union Banking Corporation of Wall Street, and the Harriman Brothers firm on Wall Street. What was so special about that? Union Banking Corporation was confiscated by the US Congress in October of 1942 under the Trading With The Enemy Act; and elements of Harriman Brothers also were seized by the Congress for the same reason, trading with the enemy, which at that time was Nazi Germany and Hitler. What's the connection? Both firms were "umbrella firms" (like Carlyle Group of present times) which shielded one hundred and fifty Nazi corporate partnerships on Wall Street in financial arrangements which brought Hitler to power in the early 1930s. John Foster Dulles and his brother, Allen Dulles, were the Wall Street lawyers who did the international "law" exercises which permitted the Nazi-Wall Street trading to occur. The ownership of both Union Banking Corporation and Harriman Brothers included Averell Harriman and his partner and confidant, George Herbert Walker. A Skull and Bones man named Prescott Bush married George Herbert Walker's daughter and was taken on board at Harriman Brothers, from which they launched Union Banking Corporation within walking distance from their offices. These men financed Hitler's rise to power and arranged the openings legally for I.G. Farben, General Electric, and other American corporations to outfit Nazi Germany. For instance, under the umbrella of Union Banking Corp, Hamburg-Amerika Steamship lines facilitated the financing of Hitler's Brown Shirts at a time when the German people were trying to get rid of Hitler's rising private army. Prescott Bush was our current President's grandpa and the father of George Herbert Walker Bush, our President's colorful father, the first Bush President and a former head of the CIA, in fact, he was one of the key figures in the creation of al Qaeda and was also way-guilty while Reagan's Vice President in the drug-smuggling ops at Mena, Arkansas, (and elsewhere inside the US borders), a clandestine venture in support of the illegal Iran-Contra scheme headed up by Oliver North, Felix Rodgigues, and George H.W. Bush, as shown but kept quiet in the Senate hearings, some of which I have here on tape also, but which are available online through Google. One last thing about Clark Clifford: not only did he pen the National Security Act of 1947 with the Dulles brothers, it was Clark Clifford who fraudulently engineered the entry into America of the BCCI system, which became a global arm of CIA for drug-smuggling, illegal arms shipping, and money laundering on Wall Street. Allen Dulles and John foster Dulles were the Wall Street lawyers who negotiated the international law for Harriman Brothers and Union Banking Corporation, thusly allowing American Wall Street firms to arm Hitler's Germany throughout the 1930s and into WWII. Allen Dulles, instrumental in writing the National Security Act of 1947, ended up being Director of Central Intelligence at CIA, while his erstwhile brother, John Foster, later became Secretary of State.
 
So all that was behind the scenes when Kennedy fired Dulles and Bissell. Strike one.
 
Strike two was his desire to pull out of southeast Asia, while CIA wanted to establish a puppet government in Saigon so they could manage the French connection through their proprietary, Air America, among other goals. That is where Shackley, Rodriguez, and Frank Hand met up with Oliver North and some other, uhm, "interesting" characters, including the operators of Project Phoenix and other ops. I think John Poindexter was in that scene too. He is now at DARPA after having received official pardon for his criminal convictions in the Iran-Contra fiasco. Nice dude, eh? He's over at what used to be called the "Total Information Agency". Another friend of H.W. Bush and Ollie North. Anyway, Dulles wasn't about to let the southeast Asia "policy" of CIA get canned by some young upstart President, so Kennedy had friction there.
 
Strike three was Executive Order 11110 by Kennedy. That EO took the printing of five-dollar bills out from under the Federal Reserve System's control and put it back under the US Treasury where it (and all other currency printing) belonged in the first place. They actually printed up some runs of the five-dollar bill, and you can see them at coin-collectors' shops to this day. But that was a huge hit on the Federal Reserve System, inc., which threatened the Fed's control over this new President and threatened the ultimate demise of the Fed, which is interesting because the same god-be-damned conspirators who brought Hitler to power through Wall Street portals were the conspirators who were represented at Jekyll Island, Georgia in 1910, where the Federal Reserve System, Inc., was created. What is truly interesting in all this is the connections which run back to 1832/33 at Yale University when Tory Party anti-American interest-extensions of British banking established, through the Russell Trust which to this day owns it, the secret society called Skull and Bones. This crap, the crap which assassinated Kennedy through the facilitation of the CIA, began when the Tory Party loyalists were fighting against George Washington's revolutionary army and supporting the King of England's attempt to keep control over this land and his colonies. Upon the victory of the American Revolution, the Tory Party's wealthier families, such as the Edwards and Russells and Delanos and Pierponts and Lows and etc and etc, swore publicly to infiltrate the American University system, Wall Street, and the American seats of governmental power, which they've largely done. The CFR runs the national media and works in tandem with CIA through Wall Street, all the while Skull and Bones politicians like Prescott Bush, G.H.W. Bush, and G.W. Bush clog the seats of Congress and the White House to seal the British control over US Federal "policy". The men who empowered Hitler created the CIA. Firing Dulles was huge, and the American public to this day has little idea about what is going down behind the scenes, about *why* the Warren Commission knew that under no circumstances could it dare expose the guilty parties in the assassination of Kennedy. (And wasn't that commission chaired by a member of the CFR?)
 
That's sorta "it" in a nutshell. But there is so much more. Sorry to be so skimpy in my sketch. This is how the inside movements of the New World Order, which is a plan by the Rockefellers and Morgans of America, the Rothschilds of England and Germany, and the Warburgs of Germany and Holland, seek total control over this world in a one-world government which H.W. Bush, on September 11, 1991 (ten years to the day before September 11, 2001) first issued his infamous words about the New World Order in a public and filmed speech. His father was one of Hitler's biggest bankers, and his son is carrying on the famliy work. Kennedy got in the way, and insulted this elite's power.  
 
end partial paste from emailed message of Nov 26, 2004.

~

Henrietta, thank you so much for all you do, and for never giving up on the fight for liberty. I salute you!


Gotta run!
Elias
http://www.thementalmilitia.org (http://www.thementalmilitia.org)
 
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 09, 2004, 05:40:58 pm
Elias, in addition to all that Kennedy stuff you have there, there's this:

Quote
General Charles Cabell and Brother Earle, Mayor of Dallas
General Charles Cabell was a key figure in the assassination. His brother, Earle Cabell, was mayor of Dallas when Kennedy was killed. This fact was uncovered by Jim Garrison. The Cabell brothers were likely enlisted in the Israeli-born coup during or shortly after the Cuban Missile Crisis. General Charles Cabell had been fired by President Kennedy after the Bay of Pigs Invasion in 1961.

A key contribution to the coup—apparently made by the aforementioned Cabell brothers—was to change the motorcade route on the day of the assassination. The motorcade was apparently changed in order to pass by the Texas School Book Depository, thereby implicating Oswald as the assassin because he worked there. The following is Garrison’s description—from his book, On the Trail of the Assassins—of how he discovered the Cabell brothers:

Quote
One morning I was in my office reading and rereading a newspaper. I did not hear Frank [Klein] enter.
"I have never seen you so preoccupied," said Frank.

"It's not just any paper, son," I said. "This is the front page of the Dallas Morning News for November 22, 1963."

"Well, what's got you so hypnotized?"

I gestured to the large diagram on the paper's front page, indicating the route of the presidential parade. "Have I ever shown you this before?" I asked.

He shook his head.

I turned the paper around facing his way so that he could read the diagram of the motorcade. It covered almost five-sixths of the front page.

"Frank," I said, "I want you to follow the parade route with me. Let's pick it up right here as it comes down Main approaching Dealey Plaza. Are you with me?"

"Yes," he said, his finger following the thick line indicating the motorcade. "And here is where it reaches Dealey Plaza. . ." He stopped.

"What's the matter?" I asked.

"This diagram indicates that the President's parade was supposed to continue on Main Street through the center of Dealey Plaza-without even leaving Main." He stared at it in disbelief.

"So what's wrong with that?" I asked.

His finger was moving off of Main, inches downward to Elm until he found the Depository area where the President had been shot. "if that was the presidential parade route up there on Main . . ."

I finished the question for him. "How did he get way down here on Elm?"

Frank looked up at me with a slight frown, then looked back at the diagram. He moved his finger back along Main Street to where it reached Houston. "The motorcade turned right on Houston and went down onto Elm," he said.

"Where the motorcade made that sweeping 120-degree left turn you are looking at, which had to slow the President's car down to about ten miles an hour."

Frank looked up again at the thick line indicating the motorcade route continuing on Main through the center of Dealey Plaza as it headed for the Stemmons Freeway.

"Here on Main street, continuing through the open meadow," he said, "they couldn't have hit him. Are you telling me that at the last moment they just moved the President of the United States off of his scheduled route to here where the Depository is?" He pushed back his chair and stood up. "Hell, I haven't read a damned word about that anywhere. How can they keep something like that a secret for three years?"

I leaned back in my chair. "Now you see why I didn't hear you knock when you came in."

"Where the hell were the Dallas police when they made that last-minute change in the route?" he asked.

"Where indeed?" I asked. "And the Secret Service. And the FBI"

"And the city administration of Dallas," he added. "Don't they have a mayor over there in that damned place?"

"Yes, they do. The mayor when this happened was Earle Cabell."

I buzzed the intercom and my secretary, Sharon Herkes, came in. I asked her to take a cab to the public library and find the latest volume of Who's Who in the Southwest. "I'm sure you'll find Earle Cabell in there. See if his article indicates any connections with Washington."

"With Washington?" Frank asked.

"Of course," I replied. "You can't tell me it's possible to hijack the President—with the whole world watching—unless there's some kind of cooperation between the city administration and the federal government."

Frank grabbed the front page of the Dallas Morning News and pointed to the diagram. "Hell," he said, "was the Warren Commission blind? Didn't they see this?"

"Oh," I said. "Would you like to see the front page that was introduced to the Warren Commission?"

I pulled open my middle desk drawer and took out a copy of the Dallas Morning News front page that had been introduced as a Commission exhibit. I handed it to Frank and lit my pipe. I had hardly taken the first puff on it when he yelled.

"Those bastards! They just removed the entire motorcade route from the front page."

That was true. On five-sixths of the Dallas Morning News page where the diagram of the motorcade route was supposed to be was nothing but a large square of solid gray. "And this has been printed as an official, exhibit by the Warren Commission?" he asked.

I nodded.

"And just what in the hell are we supposed to call this?" he asked, waving the nearly blank exhibit.

I took a puff or two on my pipe. "This is what you call," I replied, "a coup d'etat."

An hour or so later Sharon walked in the door with a large photostat in her hand. "They, didn't have anything about Mayor Cabell in the Who's Who," she said. "But there's a lot of stuff here about a General Charles Cabell."

I glanced down at the article. Right away it jumped out at me from the page that this Charles Cabell had been the deputy director of the Central Intelligence Agency. Now I found myself looking at that last name with real fascination. It took one phone call to an attorney friend in Dallas to determine that General Charles Cabell was the brother of Earle Cabell, former mayor of Dallas.

Now the eleventh-hour change in the President's motorcade route was even more intriguing to me, and I immediately headed for the public library. Before sunset I had become the leading expert in New Orleans on General Charles Cabell, who, it turned out, had been fired as the CIA's number two man by President Kennedy. General Cabell had been in charge of the Agency's disastrous Bay of Pigs invasion. In the final hours, while Castro's small air force was tearing the landing effort apart, Cabell had managed to get through a call to President Kennedy in an attempt to halt the disaster. Just over the horizon, by something less than happenstance, lay aircraft carriers with fighter planes on their decks, engines warming up. General Cabell informed the President that these fighters could reverse the course of disaster in minutes and secure the success of the invasion. All that was needed was the President's authorization.

On the preceding day Kennedy had assured the assembled media that if anyone invaded Cuba (and the air had become rife with invasion rumors) there certainly would be no help from the US armed forces. He flatly turned Cabell down. With that the invasion's chances sank, as did the general's intelligence career. President Kennedy asked for Cabell's resignation and the general was subsequently replaced on February 1, 1962, as the CIA's deputy director. General Cabell's subsequent hatred of John Kennedy became an open secret in Washington.

In most countries, a powerful individual who had been in open conflict with a national leader who was later assassinated would receive at least a modicum of attention in the course of the posthumous inquiry. A major espionage organization with a highly sophisticated capability for accomplishing murder might receive even more. Certainly a powerful individual who also held a top position in a major espionage apparatus and had been at odds with the departed leader would be high on the list of suspects.

However, General Cabell, who fit that description perfectly, was never even called as a witness before the Warren Commission. One reason may have been that Allen Dulles, the former CIA director (also fired by President Kennedy), was a member of the Commission and handled all leads relating to the Agency. During the nine years that Dulles had been the CIA's chief, General Charles Cabell had been his deputy.
(Jim Garrison, On the Trail of the Assassins, pp. 117 - 121)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 10, 2004, 03:40:28 am
Quote
Quote
Quote
I see it stated nowhere that congress may delegate any of its authority to the executive branch. Nor do I see it stated that the executive branch may accept any authority delegated to it by the legislative branch.

To me it is very simple and any efforts to complicate it are attempts to subvert the constitutional republic. Simply stated:
The executive branch is not permitted by the constitution the authority to legislate, nor is it permitted to receive a delegated authority to legislate by the legislative branch even for an emergency. Any attempt to do so is an attempt to "overthrow the government of one's country " see above for the impact of that concept
...I think it plays to the core of many problems which we find in today's federal administration of itself upon the people...
 
Not to be contradictory but, the above is the real cherry of the entire basis of US federal government. Checks and balances are a bad joke played on the people of this land. Congress takes care of the executive and judiciary branches, the executive takes care of the legislative and judiciary, the judiciary takes care of the legislative and executive branches because it is ALL government. They only appear to act against one another so as to not appear too obvious in their support of one another.

Furthermore, do notice that there is no way that these people can be held accountable to the electorate for their actions.
Alton,
Just to hit on one point from your above post, I would like to offer a short-cut around the built-in protections of government office-holders. I think that you've made a good and strong case which would show that the bastards cannot be held accountable according to the structuring of the founding document, but I think there are at least two ways around that apparent problem. I would like to leave out here, at this time, one of the two ways around the problem, bearing in mind that top-down fifth-generational ops has already been mentioned elsewhere on these very boards. I'm not prepared, nor motivated at this time, to "go there".

But the second alternative is more attractive to me. That would be to simply arrest the bastards. Never mind "impeaching" them, since as you've shown, that won't work. But let's for just one moment assume that no man is above the law, at least not in the public mind, even as that public mind is presently configured. Foregoing impeachment, let's consider that, as an example, we discover that Cheney proactively involved himself in the planning and execution of the attacks on 911, which amounts to mass murder. I think that a large-enough posse of concerned citizens could march on Washington DC and simply arrest his ass, charge him with murder, put him in the clinker, and bring him to public trial on charges of mass murder. Impeachment would not even need to come into play.

So I ask you: can't we arrest a murderer when we find one, even if he happens to be sitting in the chair of the Vice President? Seems to me that we can, if we have enough Americans who are concerned and aware. What say ye?

Salute!
Elias

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 10, 2004, 04:10:37 am
Quote
Ya'll just have to get over to Henrietta's saloon and read up on this (http://www.sierratimes.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard//topic.cgi?forum=2&topic=702). Definitely requires a prinout. She links to an article by Steven Yates, Ph.D., which I could link to here, but I think she deserves a visit from as many of us as want to visit her.
r]
Jeez, Ragnar.
Tonight I've taken time to read the whole article by Yates. It's concise and nicely arranged as he presents the various arenas of endeavor in the NWO agenda. I am very pleased to note that the contributors to this thread have produced basically the same information, and have done so well before Yates got his article published. That's coolness personified. :)

We've covered Quigley, and also Antony Sutton and also G. Edward Griffin, each of whom Yates has used heavily in his presentation. What Yates has not mentioned, but something which I would be willing to bet a six-pack upon, is the unspoken source which already has all this info well-documented on video cassettes -- ready for this? -- The John Birch Society. Yep, the John Birchers have dug all this up and have put it into some truly excellent presentations which are available on tapes for viewing. A rancher out here has given me three John Birch Society tapes, and I've watched them all. Good stuff. They show David Rockefeller talking to Dick Cheney at a CFR meeting in Chicago where he admits that he kept his involvement in the CFR from his Wyoming constituency last time he campaigned for office in his home state, for instance.  Aside from Quigley and Sutton, I do not know of anyone else who has put it all together so nicely as the John Birch Society, and of course, watching newsclips on video has an extra impact as the info is rendered to the viewer.

Another example of why I would guess that Yates has seen The John Birch Society's tapes has to do with a short video entitled "Trespassing Allowed", which treats of the upcoming FTAA movement. The "Free Trade of the Americas Area" is an over-cooked extension of NAFTA and is totally fatal to our national sovereignty. The John Birth Society has researched the CFR and Trilateral Commission extensively, and has an amazing library of film clips with which to work.

I've always thought that the John Birch Society was some sort of radical racist outfit, but after seeing their work on film, I'm very favorable about including their work in my case-building against the NWO. The JBS is very protective of the Constitution and the Republican form of government, and they promote the belief in "God", but aside from those two obvious planks they hammer relentlessly against the criminality of the "conspirators" of the NWO. I'll be hunting up their website shortly and taking a look at their online presence. You may wish to do the same, but if not, I'll prolly be posting some of their stuff here anyway. (I know you're way too busy, same as me, lol!)

Anyway, I still can't get in over at Sierra Times; the page tells me I'm logged in, but when I try to post I get an error message relating to my password, which I have no way at present to retrieve. So if you see Henrietta, please tell her I said thanks for that article. It's really one of the best I've seen, and a valuable tool.

So now that we *know*, I guess we could start discussing what could be done about it, eh? :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: rick on December 10, 2004, 04:37:41 am
All "law" we really need is contained in three of the Ten Commandments: "Don't steal", Don't lie", "Don't murder". Everything more is bureaucracy.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on December 10, 2004, 08:06:11 am
We can do without a few of those, too.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on December 10, 2004, 11:07:47 am
More to look at from http://www.ctrl.org/CTRLresources.htm (http://www.ctrl.org/CTRLresources.htm)

The following sites are recommended as conspiracy theory resources by the members and editors of the CTRL list. If there's a conspiracy site you would like to suggest for this page, send an email with the URL to ctrl@ctrl.org.

Antony Sutton http://www.antonysutton.com (http://www.antonysutton.com) - Bare Bones beginning

A Case File: CIA and Drugs http://www.copvcia.com/ (http://www.copvcia.com/) - Former LAPD narcotics detective Michael Ruppert's web site on CIA complicity in the drug trade.

Bibliography - http://www.ctrl.org/bibliography (http://www.ctrl.org/bibliography)

CIA_Drugs Symposiums http://www.cia-drugs.com (http://www.cia-drugs.com)

Cocaine Importing Agency http://www.csun.edu/~hfspc002/news/cia.drug.html (http://www.csun.edu/~hfspc002/news/cia.drug.html) - An excellent site on the CIA/contra/cocaine scandal.

Conspiracy Nation Archive http://www.shout.net/~bigred/cn.html (http://www.shout.net/~bigred/cn.html) - Complete 1995-1998 archive of this venerable font of conspiracy knowledge.

et cetera
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on December 11, 2004, 11:24:34 am
Thoughts, ideas, and questions--

Three lines:

1. European banking - Rothschild
2. Skull & Bones - Russell, et al.
3. South Africa - Cecil Rhodes

The connector on 1 & 2 appears to be Russell's trip to Germany and his return with a charter to open a 'branch' (of what is unknown) in the US. Where did Russell go in Germany? Some say that the defrocked priest of Bavaria who started the Illuminati was picked up and financed by Rothschild. Then the story is that Russell started a branch of the Illuminati at Yale. But all that is surmise as far as I read.

In any case though, there is the confluence of banking/business interests from at least JP Morgan (or his father Junius) onwards.

Now 2 & 3. Rhodes was both a secret society creator and proponent of Anglo-Saxon (or British) world domination & govt. If 2 is new England Tory then it fits right in with Rhodes. But is/was it, rather than just money-power hungry? Then as well, Rothschild was supposedly a top member of Rhodes' secret society. But, evidence?
- - -

And as well, who were the twenty historians of Yates' article chosen by CFR? And then in general who are the Rhodes scholars, where do they go, etc.?
- - -
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 11, 2004, 11:44:00 am
Wow, all of history is a conspiracy.  I just keep to what I see and know.  What to do, what to do.  Wish I had a one of those things that freezes time so I could go and inspect it all myself.

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on December 11, 2004, 02:36:07 pm
Quote
Wish I had a one of those things that freezes time
Wow, that would be cool.  But wouldn't you always be tempted to help yourself to the jewelry stores and ogle the ladies?  Maybe that's just me.  But as long as we're dreaming, I wish I had the ability to like teleport myself and objects.  Wouldn't that be cool?  Imagine how much easier that would make yard chores like raking the leaves or shoveling snow!
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 12, 2004, 05:48:14 pm
Some assistance needed please:

I've been trying to find a text copy of the National Security Act of 1947, signed by President Truman and written by Clark Clifford, Allen Dulles, and John Foster Dulles.

Can't find it anywhere. It may be "secret", is my guess. Question: Can anyone here help me find that bill?

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 12, 2004, 05:59:44 pm
This should work Elias:
George Washington University usually has some goodies too.

http://assembler.law.cornell.edu/uscode/ht...1_50_10_15.html (http://assembler.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sup_01_50_10_15.html)

Peace and Good Day
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 12, 2004, 06:45:51 pm
Thanks for the effort, Unstructured, but that is not the bill we need. What we need is the text for the original "National Security Act of 1947".

I enjoyed looking around while I was there, however, and I appreciate your providing us with that source.

I should have warned you --- it's going to be very difficult for any American citizen to get a copy of that Act in his hot little hands.

That brings up the question regarding governmental secrecy. Apparently, the bastards in DC think they should be entitled to pass laws which we mere citizens cannot be shown. I hope I'm wrong about that, but as extensively fruitful as the Internet is today, I still cannot find a copy of that bill. If it is a law which cannot be revealed to the citizens of America, then we'll have quite a problem about that, for I'm told by reliable sources that included in that bill are the laws which allow the American Intelligence community to take money secretly from more than 20 Federal agencies. I'd kinda like to see that for myself, kno' what I mean? :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 12, 2004, 06:53:13 pm
Not sure if this fits but:    
Emergence of the Intelligence Establishment

    Department of State
    Washington, DC

    National Security Council Intelligence Directives, 1947-1950

                               

    422. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 4

    Washington, December 12, 1947.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 148, Dulles-Jackson-Correa Report, Annex 10. Confidential.

    NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE OBJECTIVES

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102(d)(5) of the National Security Act of 1947 and for the purpose of providing intelligence support for the preparation of studies required by the National Security Council in the fulfillment of its duties, it is directed that:

    1. The Director of Central Intelligence, in collaboration with the other agencies concerned, shall prepare a comprehensive outline of national intelligence objectives applicable to foreign countries and areas to serve as a guide for the coordinated collection and production of National Intelligence.

    2. The Director of Central Intelligence, in collaboration with the other agencies concerned, and under the guidance of the NSC Staff/1/ shall select from time to time and on a current basis sections and items of such outline which have a priority interest. These selections will be issued by the Director of Central Intelligence to supply the desired priority guidance for the production of National Intelligence by the Central Intelligence Agency and for the contributions to such production by other agencies concerned.

    /1/For this purpose, the NSC Staff shall consist of the Executive Secretary and the Departmental representatives designated by Council members to advise and assist the Executive Secretary. Any cases of disagreement within this group will be referred to the National Security Council for decision. [Footnote in the source text.]

    423. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 5

    Washington, December 12, 1947.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 95, NSCIDs. Top Secret.

    ESPIONAGE AND COUNTERESPIONAGE OPERATIONS

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102(d) of the National Security Act of 1947, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that:

    1. The Director of Central Intelligence shall conduct all organized Federal espionage operations outside the United States and its possessions for the collection of foreign intelligence information required to meet the needs of all Departments and Agencies concerned, in connection with the national security, except for certain agreed activities by other Departments and Agencies.

    2. The Director of Central Intelligence shall conduct all organized Federal counter-espionage operations outside the United States and its possessions and in occupied areas, provided that this authority shall not be construed to preclude the counter-intelligence activities of any army, navy or air command or installation and certain agreed activities by Departments and Agencies necessary for the security of such organizations.

    3. The Director of Central Intelligence shall be responsible for coordinating covert and overt intelligence collection activities.

    4. When casual agents are employed or otherwise utilized by an IAC Department or Agency in other than an overt capacity, the Director of Central Intelligence shall coordinate their activities with the organized covert activities.

    5. The Director of Central Intelligence shall disseminate such intelligence information to the various Departments and Agencies which have an authorized interest therein.

    6. All other National Security Council Intelligence Directives or implementing supplements shall be construed to apply solely to overt intelligence activities unless otherwise specified.

    424. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 6

    Washington, December 12, 1947.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 148, Dulles-Jackson-Correa Report, Annex 12. Secret.

    FOREIGN WIRELESS AND RADIO MONITORING

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, and for the purposes enunciated in paragraphs (d) and (e) thereof, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that:

    1. The Director of Central Intelligence shall conduct all Federal monitoring of foreign propaganda and press broadcasts required for the collection of intelligence information to meet the needs of all Departments and Agencies in connection with the National Security.

    2. The Director of Central Intelligence shall disseminate such intelligence information to the various Departments and Agencies which have an authorized interest therein.

    425. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 2

    Washington, January 13, 1948.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 148, Dulles-Jackson-Correa Report, Annex 8. Confidential.

    COORDINATION OF COLLECTION ACTIVITIES ABROAD

    The following over-all policies and objectives are established by the National Security Council for the interdepartmental coordination of foreign intelligence collection activities, so that measures may be taken promptly to effect sound and efficient utilization of the various departmental collecting and reporting facilities abroad:

    1. There shall be an allocation within certain broad categories of agency responsibility for collection abroad, as follows:

    Political
       

    Department of State

    Cultural
       

    Department of State

    Sociological
       

    Department of State

    Military
       

    Department of the Army

    Naval
       

    Department of the Navy

    Air
       

    Department of the Air Force
         

    Economic
    Scientific
    Technological
       

    Each agency in
    accordance with
    its respective needs

    2. All available intelligence information, no matter by whom collected, shall, wherever possible, be transmitted immediately to the field representative of the agency most concerned. However, the collector may also send copies to or otherwise inform his own agency.

    3. The senior US representative in each foreign area where the United States maintains a foreign post shall, within the spirit of the principles enunciated herein, be responsible for the coordination of all normal collection activities in his area.

    4. The collecting and reporting facilities of each of the agencies shall be utilized so as to avoid unproductive duplication and uncoordinated overlap and to insure within budgetary limitations that full flow of intelligence information which is the major need of all departments and agencies for the accomplishment of their respective missions.

    5. Full utilization shall be made of the individual initiative and favorable contacts of agency representatives.

    6. No interpretation of these established over-all policies and objectives shall negate the basic principle that all departmental representatives abroad are individually responsible for the collection and for the appropriate transmission to their departments of all intelligence information pertinent to their departmental missions.

    7. There shall be free and unrestricted interdepartmental exchange of intelligence information to meet the recognized secondary needs of each department and agency for intelligence usually obtained or prepared by other departments or agencies.

    426. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 3

    Washington, January 13, 1948.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 148, Dulles-Jackson-Correa Report, Annex 9. Secret.

    COORDINATION OF INTELLIGENCE PRODUCTION

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, and for the purposes enunciated in paragraphs (d) and (e) thereof, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that the following over-all policies and objectives are established for the coordination of the production of intelligence:

    1. In order that all facilities of the Government may be utilized to their capacity and the responsibilities of each agency may be clearly defined in accordance with its mission, dominant interest, and capabilities, the whole field of intelligence production is divided into the following categories, and responsibilities are allocated as indicated:

    a. Basic Intelligence

    (1) Basic intelligence is that factual intelligence which results from the collation of encyclopedic information of a more or less permanent or static nature and general interest which, as a result of evaluation and interpretation, is determined to be the best available.

    (2) An outline of all basic intelligence required by the Government shall be prepared by the CIA in collaboration with the appropriate agencies. This outline shall be broken down into chapters, sections, and sub-sections which shall be allocated as production and maintenance responsibilities to CIA and those agencies of the Government which are best qualified by reason of their intelligence requirements, production capabilities, and dominant interest to assume the production and maintenance responsibility.

    (3) When completed, this outline and tentative allocations of production and maintenance responsibilities shall be submitted for NSC approval and issued as an implementation of this Directive. It is expected that as the result of constant consultation with the agencies by the Director of Central Intelligence, both the outline and the allocations will be revised from time to time to insure the production of the basic intelligence required by the agencies and the fullest possible use of current agency capabilities. Changes in the outline or allocations shall be effected by agreement between the Director of Central Intelligence and the agencies concerned.

    (4) This basic intelligence shall be compiled and continuously maintained in National Intelligence Surveys to cover foreign countries, areas, or broad special subjects as appropriate. The National Intelligence Surveys will be disseminated in such form as shall be determined by the Director of Central Intelligence and the agencies concerned.

    (5) The Director of Central Intelligence shall be responsible for coordinating production and maintenance and for accomplishing the editing, publication, and dissemination of these National Intelligence Surveys and shall make such requests on the agencies as are necessary for their proper development and maintenance.

    (6) Departments or agencies to be called on for contributions to this undertaking may include agencies other than those represented permanently in the IAC.

    b. Current Intelligence

    (1) Current intelligence is that spot information or intelligence of all types and forms of immediate interest and value to operating or policy staffs, which is used by them usually without the delays incident to complete evaluation or interpretation.

    (2) The CIA and the several agencies shall produce and disseminate such current intelligence as may be necessary to meet their own internal requirements or external responsibilities.

    (3) Interagency dissemination of current intelligence shall be based on interagency agreement including NSC Intelligence Directive No. 1 and the principle of informing all who need to know.

    c. Staff Intelligence

    (1) Staff intelligence is that intelligence prepared by any department or agency through the correlation and interpretation of all intelligence materials available to it in order to meet its specific requirements and responsibilities.

    (2) Each intelligence agency has the ultimate responsibility for the preparation of such staff intelligence as its own department shall require. It is recognized that the staff intelligence of each of the departments must be broader in scope than any allocation of collection responsibility or recognition of dominant interest might indicate. In fact, the full foreign intelligence picture is of interest in varying degrees at different times to each of the departments.

    (3) Any intelligence agency, either through the Director of Central Intelligence or directly, may call upon other appropriate agencies for intelligence which does not fall within its own field of dominant interest. Such requests shall be made upon the agencies in accordance with their production capabilities and dominant interest.

    (4) As a part of the coordination program, the Director of Central Intelligence will seek the assistance of the IAC intelligence agencies in minimizing the necessity for any agency to develop intelligence in fields outside its dominant interests.

    (5) The CIA and the agencies shall, for purposes of coordination, exchange information on projects and plans for the production of staff intelligence.

    (6) It shall be normal practice that staff intelligence of one agency is available to the other intelligence agencies permanently represented on the IAC.

    d. Departmental Intelligence

    (1) Departmental intelligence is that intelligence including basic, current, and staff intelligence needed by a Department or independent Agency of the Federal Government, and the subordinate units thereof, to execute its mission and to discharge its lawful responsibilities.

    e. National Intelligence

    (1) National intelligence is integrated departmental intelligence that covers the broad aspects of national policy and national security, is of concern to more than one Department or Agency, and transcends the exclusive competence of a single Department or Agency or the Military Establishment.

    (2) The Director of Central Intelligence shall produce and disseminate national intelligence.

    (3) The Director of Central Intelligence shall plan and develop the production of national intelligence in coordination with the IAC Agencies in order that he may obtain from them within the limits of their capabilities the departmental intelligence which will assist him in the production of national intelligence.

    (4) The Director of Central Intelligence shall, by agreement with the pertinent Agency or Agencies, request and receive such special estimates, reports, and periodic briefs or summaries prepared by the individual Departments or Agencies in their fields of dominant interest or in accordance with their production capabilities as may be necessary in the production of intelligence reports or estimates undertaken mutually.

    2. The research facilities required by any agency to process its own current and staff intelligence shall be adequate to satisfy its individual needs after taking full cognizance of the facilities of the other agencies. Each agency shall endeavor to maintain adequate research facilities, not only to accomplish the intelligence production tasks allocated to it directly under the foregoing provisions but also to provide such additional intelligence reports or estimates within its field of dominant interest as may be necessary to satisfy the requirements of the other agencies under such allocations.

    3. For the purposes of intelligence production, the following division of interests, subject to refinement through a continuous program of coordination by the Director of Central Intelligence, shall serve as a general delineation of dominant interests:

    Political, Cultural, Sociological Intelligence
       

    Department of State

    Military Intelligence
       

    Department of the Army

    Naval Intelligence
       

    Department of the Navy

    Air Intelligence
       

    Department of the Air Force
         

    Economic, Scientific, and Technological Intelligence
       

    Each agency in accordance
    with its respective needs

    427. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 7

    Washington, February 12, 1948.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 95, Box 1799, NSCIDs. Secret. Also reproduced in CIA Cold War Records: The CIA under Harry Truman, pp. 177-179.

    DOMESTIC EXPLOITATION

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, and for the purpose enunciated in paragraphs (d) and (e) thereof, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that:

    1. The Central Intelligence Agency shall be responsible for the exploitation, on a highly selective basis, within the United States of business concerns, other non-governmental organizations and individuals as sources of foreign intelligence information.

    2. To implement this undertaking, the Central Intelligence Agency shall:

    a. Determine the foreign intelligence potential of sources so that the best available may be selected expeditiously for exploitation upon the receipt of collection requests from the intelligence agencies. For this purpose, CIA will maintain a central index of non-governmental sources in the United States.

    b. Establish uniform procedures and standards for security clearance of all contacts in this field, and arrange such clearances.

    c. Establish uniform procedures to insure that the interests of organizations and individuals contacted will not be jeopardized.

    d. Collect through the establishment of field offices within the United States, foreign intelligence information required in the interests of the national security or by the individual intelligence agencies.

    e. Arrange for direct contact between intelligence agency representatives and non-governmental sources within the United States whenever conditions require such action or upon the request of a member agency to secure technical or other foreign intelligence information.

    f. Obtain the agreement of responsible policymaking officials of American organizations having a foreign intelligence potential before establishing and maintaining contacts within that organization.

    g. Inform the intelligence agencies of the prospective departure from or return to the United States of selected American citizens having a high foreign intelligence potential, so that the agencies may furnish requirements or provide specialists for briefing or interrogation.

    h. Disseminate to the appropriate agencies all foreign intelligence information obtained through this program. Reports produced by the agencies shall be identified as such, unless the originating agency stipulates to the contrary.

    3. Further to implement this undertaking, the intelligence agencies shall:

    a. Assign to duty in the Central Intelligence Agency field offices, if they so desire and within their capabilities, representatives to serve their interests under the direction of the CIA managers. Member agencies may, at their discretion, establish active working liaison between their Regional Offices and CIA Field Offices.

    b. Send directly to the Central Intelligence Agency for collection all their requests for foreign intelligence information to be obtained from non-governmental sources within the United States.

    c. Transmit to the Central Intelligence Agency for appropriate dissemination full information and reports resulting from approved direct contacts by agency representatives with non-governmental sources, identifying such sources by CIA code number.

    d. Obtain, to the maximum extent possible, from their departments and agencies the foreign intelligence information which the departments and agencies have received as a by-product of the normal relationship with business concerns and other non-governmental organizations and individuals in the United States in connection with non-intelligence activities, and transmit to the maximum extent possible, the information to the Central Intelligence Agency for editing for source security and for appropriate dissemination.

    e. Obtain, in so far as is practicable and within existing security regulations, from their departments and agencies information concerning business concerns and other non-governmental organizations and individuals in the United States having foreign intelligence potential, which the department or agency possesses or subsequently acquires, and make the information available to the Central Intelligence Agency.

    f. Nominate representatives to serve on a committee, under the chairmanship of the Central Intelligence Agency, to meet periodically to consider mutual problems and interests in connection with this program.

    4. Further to implement this undertaking, the National Security Resources Board and the components of the Military Establishment, other than the components represented on the IAC, shall furnish directly to the CIA, to the maximum extent possible, all foreign intelligence information which is received as a by-product of their normal relationship with business concerns and other non-governmental organizations and individuals in the United States, in connection with non-intelligence activities.

    5. Nothing in this program shall be interpreted to affect the established relationship of the Departments and Agencies with business concerns, other non-governmental organizations, and individuals in the United States for purposes other than the procurement of foreign intelligence information. Nor shall it affect the normal interchange of documents between libraries of the departments and other libraries, or the development of research projects with individuals or non-governmental institutions.

    428. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 8

    Washington, May 25, 1948.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 148, Dulles-Jackson-Correa Report, Annex 14. Secret.

    BIOGRAPHICAL DATA ON FOREIGN SCIENTIFIC
    AND TECHNOLOGICAL PERSONALITIES

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947 and for the purpose enunciated in paragraph d(4) thereof, the primary responsibility for the maintenance of Biographical Data on Foreign Scientific and Technological Personalities is assigned to the Central Intelligence Agency.

    1. To implement this undertaking, the following procedures are established:

    a. Departmental intelligence agencies shall continue to collect, analyze, and abstract biographical data on foreign scientific and technological personalities in accordance with their needs.

    b. Departmental intelligence agencies shall forward to the Central Intelligence Agency, in the manner most satisfactory to the Department concerned, all biographical data originating within their respective Departments, or complete documentary references thereto, on foreign scientific and technological personalities.

    c. The Central Intelligence Agency shall codify and index all such data received, including such data as may be received from all sources, and shall incorporate the actual material received in its files.

    d. All biographical data on foreign scientific and technological personalities maintained by the Central Intelligence Agency shall be readily available to the participating Departments and Agencies.

    429. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 10

    Washington, January 18, 1949.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 195, NSCIDs. Secret.

    COLLECTION OF FOREIGN SCIENTIFIC
    AND TECHNOLOGICAL DATA

    1. Since previous directives made no specific provision for supplying "scientific" and "technological" information other than that required by each IAC agency for its own use, it is, accordingly, determined that, in furtherance of the cooperative policies and procedures enunciated in NSCID No. 2 and any supplements thereto, and pursuant to the provisions of Section 102(d) of the National Security Act of 1947 and for the purpose of providing the U.S. Government and its agencies with the scientific and technological information required from foreign areas in the interests of national security:

    a. The Department of State shall have primary responsibility for the collection abroad for all government agencies of information in the basic sciences. The Department of State will also collect information in such additional scientific and technical fields as is necessary to meet the requirements of government agencies other than the National Military Establishment and, when requested, requirements of the National Military Establishment. The Departments of Army, Navy, and Air Force will collect scientific and technological information including basic research when necessary to meet the requirements of the National Military Establishment, utilizing whenever practicable the facilities of the Department of State for collection in the basic sciences. Close collaboration and consultation will be maintained between all scientific representatives at U.S. missions abroad so that all scientific requirements can be satisfied with minimum duplication and maximum utilization of personnel. The scientific representatives of the Department of State shall be available to serve as scientific consultants to the military representatives.

    b. The Director of Central Intelligence, in collaboration with pertinent agencies, shall determine those countries which have informational potential in fields of basic and applied sciences, as related to the national security.

    c. For the purpose of inducing exchanges with foreign countries, the National Military Establishment shall provide the Department of State with available unclassified information pertaining to the basic sciences.

    d. In order to provide for the collection of the data which is the responsibility of the Department of State, the Department of State shall take appropriate measures to obtain the necessary funds from the Congress or from the agencies served, other than the National Military Establishment, and will appoint, as practicable, specially qualified scientific and technical personnel to selected United States Missions for this collection responsibility.

    e. In order to provide for the collection of the data which is the responsibility of the National Military Establishment, the Departments of the Army, the Navy and the Air Force shall take appropriate measures to obtain the necessary funds from the Congress and will assign as practicable, specially qualified scientific and technical personnel to the staffs of their respective attaches at such United States Missions as may be required for this collection responsibility.

    f. The Department of State shall call upon agencies of the government which require scientific or technological information for advice and assistance as may be necessary in connection with the requirements of this directive.

    430. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 11

    Washington, January 6, 1950.

    //Source: Truman Library, Papers of Harry S. Truman, President's Secretary's Files, Subject File, Current Policies of the Government of the United States of America Relating to the National Security. Top Secret.

    SECURITY OF INFORMATION ON INTELLIGENCE
    SOURCES AND METHODS

    Pursuant to the provisions of Sections 101 (B)(2) and 102 (d)(3) of the National Security Act of 1947, as amended, providing that the National Security Council shall consider policy on matters of common interest to the departments and agencies of the Government concerned with national security and shall make recommendations to the President in connection therewith, and that the Director of Central Intelligence shall be responsible for protecting intelligence sources and methods from unauthorized disclosure, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that:

    1. The departments and agencies of the Government engaged in intelligence activities shall take steps to prevent unauthorized disclosure of information on United States intelligence sources and methods. Each agency will determine its own channel for authorization to release any such information. The delimiting phrase "intelligence sources and methods" includes information ostensibly overt which requires security protection because of its specific means of procurement or specific place of procurement, revelation of which would endanger intelligence sources and methods, but the phrase does not include intelligence as such, the dissemination of which is already covered by appropriate departmental and agency security regulations.

    2. The Director of Central Intelligence shall coordinate policies concerning the protection of intelligence sources and methods, within the limits established by Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, except where provision has already been made by the National Security Council.

    3. In protecting intelligence sources and methods, the Director of Central Intelligence and the other intelligence directors shall be guided by the principle that covert or sensitive information, either unevaluated or as an intelligence product, shall go only to those whose official duties require such knowledge.

    4. In order to protect intelligence sources and methods further, any reference to the Central Intelligence Agency should emphasize its duties as the coordinator of intelligence, rather than its secret intelligence activities. No reference will be made to this agency whatsoever unless it is unavoidable, of course.

    431. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 12

    Washington, January 6, 1950.

    //Source: Truman Library, Papers of Harry S. Truman, President's Secretary's Files, Subject File, Current Policies of the Government of the United States of America Relating to the National Security. Top Secret.

    AVOIDANCE OF PUBLICITY CONCERNING THE INTELLIGENCE
    AGENCIES OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT

    Pursuant to the provisions of Sections 101 and 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, as amended, and in accordance with Section 7 of NSC 50,/1/ the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that the following policy be established, since any publicity, factual or fictional, concerning intelligence is potentially detrimental to the effectiveness of an intelligence activity and to the national security:

    /1/Not reproduced herein. [Footnote in the source text; Document 384.]

    1. All departments and agencies represented by membership on the Intelligence Advisory Committee shall take steps to prevent the unauthorized disclosure for written or oral publication of any information concerning intelligence or intelligence activities. The head of each department or agency will determine his channel for granting such authorization as may be necessary.

    2. The sense of the above directive shall be communicated to all other executive departments and agencies as an expression of policy of the National Security Council./2/

    /2/See communication which follows. [Footnote in the source text. Attached to NSCID No. 12 (and apparently approved at the same time) was a memorandum dated January 6 signed by Souers and addressed "To the Heads of Executive Departments and Establishments," conveying the substance of the directive. Not printed.]

    3. In cases where the disclosure of classified information is sought from the Director of Central Intelligence, and he has doubt as to whether he should comply, the question will be referred to the National Security Council.

    432. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 1

    Washington, January 19, 1950.

    //Source: Truman Library, Papers of Harry S. Truman, President's Secretary's Files, Subject File. Secret. This revision of NSCID 1 was approved by NSC Action No. 275 on January 19 (National Archives and Records Administration, RG 273, Records of the National Security Council, Record of Actions, Box 55), which added paragraph 6 (on intelligence in crisis situations) to the existing NSCID 1, which had been approved by the NSC on July 7, 1949; see Document 385. In all other respects, the 1949 and 1950 versions are identical except for a renumbering of paragraphs. The July 1949 text of NSCID 1 superseded the original NSCID 1, approved by the NSC on December 12, 1947; see Document 335. The December 12, 1947, text is reproduced in CIA Cold War Records: The CIA under Harry Truman, pp. 169-171. The 1949 revision, which resulted from NSC approval of the NSC 50 (McNarney Report) recommendations on implementation of the Dulles Survey proposals, introduced three changes in the 1947 text. It formally designated the Director of Central Intelligence as Chairman of the Intelligence Advisory Committee and made the FBI a member of the IAC (both provisions in paragraph 1). In the last sentence of paragraph 5, the 1949 version altered the formulation on dissents in national intelligence. (In the December 1947 text, this sentence read: "Intelligence so disseminated shall be officially concurred in by the Intelligence Agencies or shall carry an agreed statement of substantial dissent.")

    DUTIES AND RESPONSIBILITIES

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, and for the purposes enunciated in paragraphs (d) and (e) thereof, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that:

    1. To maintain the relationship essential to coordination between the Central Intelligence Agency and the intelligence organizations, an Intelligence Advisory Committee consisting of the Director of Central Intelligence, who shall be Chairman thereof, the Director, Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the respective intelligence chiefs from the Departments of State, Army, Navy, and Air Force, and from the Joint Staff (JCS), and the Atomic Energy Commission, or their representatives, shall be established to advise the Director of Central Intelligence. The Director of Central Intelligence will invite the chief, or his representative, of any other intelligence Agency having functions related to the national security to sit with the Intelligence Advisory Committee whenever matters within the purview of his Agency are to be discussed.

    2. To the extent authorized by Section 102 (e) of the National Security Act of 1947, the Director of Central Intelligence, or representatives designated by him, by arrangement with the head of the department or agency concerned, shall make such surveys and inspections of departmental intelligence material of the various Federal Departments and Agencies relating to the national security as he may deem necessary in connection with his duty to advise the NSC and to make recommendations for the coordination of intelligence activities.

    3. Coordination of intelligence activities should be designed primarily to strengthen the over-all governmental intelligence structure. Primary departmental requirements shall be recognized and shall receive the cooperation and support of the Central Intelligence Agency.

    a. The Director of Central Intelligence shall, in making recommendations or giving advice to the National Security Council pertaining to the intelligence activities of the various Departments and Agencies, transmit therewith a statement indicating the concurrence of non-concurrence of the members of the Intelligence Advisory Committee; provided that, when unanimity is not obtained among the Department heads of the National Military Establishment, the Director of Central Intelligence shall refer the problem to the Secretary of Defense before presenting it to the National Security Council.

    b. Recommendations of the Director of Central Intelligence shall, when approved by the National Security Council, issue as Council Directives to the Director of Central Intelligence. The respective intelligence chiefs shall be responsible for insuring that such orders or directives, when applicable, are implemented within their intelligence organizations.

    c. The Director of Central Intelligence shall act for the National Security Council to insure full and proper implementation of Council directives by issuing such supplementary DCI directives as may be required. Such implementing directives in which the Intelligence Advisory Committee concurs unanimously shall be issued by the Director of Central Intelligence, and shall be implemented within the Departments and Agencies as provided in paragraph b. Where disagreement arises between the Director of Central Intelligence and one or more members of the Intelligence Advisory Committee over such directives, the proposed directive, together with statements of non-concurrence, shall be forwarded to the NSC for decision as provided in paragraph a.

    4. The Director of Central Intelligence shall produce intelligence relating to the national security, hereafter referred to as national intelligence. In so far as practicable, he shall not duplicate the intelligence activities and research of the various Departments and Agencies but shall make use of existing intelligence facilities and shall utilize departmental intelligence for such production purposes. For definitions see NSCID No. 3.

    5. The Director of Central Intelligence shall disseminate National Intelligence to the President, to members of the National Security Council, to the Intelligence Chiefs of the IAC Agencies, and to such Governmental Departments and Agencies as the National Security Council from time to time may designate. Intelligence so disseminated shall be officially concurred in by the Intelligence Agencies or shall carry a statement of substantially differing opinions.

    6. Whenever any member of the Intelligence Advisory Committee obtains information that indicates an impending crisis situation, such as the outbreak of hostilities involving the United States, or a condition which affects the security of the United States to such an extent that immediate action or decision on the part of the President or the National Security Council seems to be required, he shall immediately furnish the information to the other members of the Intelligence Advisory Committee as well as to other officials or agencies as may be indicated by the circumstances. The Director of Central Intelligence shall immediately convene the Intelligence Advisory Committee. After receiving the views of the Intelligence Advisory Committee members, the Director of Central Intelligence shall promptly prepare and disseminate the national intelligence estimate in accordance with paragraphs 4 and 5 above.

    7. When Security Regulations of the originating Agency permit, the Director of Central Intelligence shall disseminate to the Federal Bureau of Investigation and other Departments or Agencies intelligence or intelligence information which he may possess when he deems such dissemination appropriate to their functions relating to the national security.

    8. The Director of Central Intelligence shall perform for the benefit of the existing intelligence Agencies such services of common concern to these Agencies as the National Security Council determines can be more efficiently accomplished centrally.

    9. The intelligence organizations in each of the Departments and Agencies shall maintain with the Central Intelligence Agency and with each other, as appropriate to their respective responsibilities, a continuing interchange of intelligence information and intelligence available to them.

    10. The intelligence files in each intelligence organization, including the CIA, shall be made available under security regulations of the Department or Agency concerned to the others for consultation.

    11. The intelligence organizations within the limits of their capabilities shall provide, or procure, such intelligence as may be requested by the Director of Central Intelligence or by one of the other Departments or Agencies.

    12. The Director of Central Intelligence shall make arrangements with the respective Departments and Agencies to assign to the Central Intelligence Agency such experienced and qualified officers and members as may be of advantage for advisory, operational, or other purposes, in addition to such personnel as the Director of Central Intelligence may directly employ. In each case, such departmental personnel will be subject to the necessary personnel procedures of each Department.

    433. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 13

    Washington, January 19, 1950.

    [Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 95, Box 1799--NSCIDs. Top Secret. 3 pages of source text not declassified.]

    434. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 14

    Washington, March 3, 1950.

    [Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 95, Box 1799--NSCIDs. Top Secret. 4 pages of source text not declassified.]

    435. National Security Council Intelligence Directive No. 9

    Washington, March 10, 1950.

    //Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Records of the Department of State, Records of the Executive Secretariat, NSC Files: Lot 66 D 195, NSCIDs. Confidential. This is the second version of this NSCID. The first was dated July 1, 1948. (Ibid.) See the Supplement. The only substantive difference between the two texts is the addition of the Federal Bureau of Investigation to the list of agencies enumerated in paragraph 2.

    COMMUNICATIONS INTELLIGENCE

    Pursuant to the provisions of Section 101 and Section 102 of the National Security Act of 1947, as amended, the National Security Council hereby authorizes and directs that:

    1. There is hereby established under the National Security Council the United States Communications Intelligence Board (hereinafter referred to as the "Board") to effect the authoritative coordination of Communications Intelligence activities of the Government and to advise the Director of Central Intelligence in those matters in the field of Communications Intelligence for which he is responsible.

    2. The Board will be composed of not to exceed two members from each of the following departments or agencies: The Departments of State, the Army, the Navy, and the Air Force, and the Central Intelligence Agency, and the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Only those departments or agencies designated by the President are authorized to engage in Communications Intelligence activities.

    3. The Board members will be vested with authority to represent their respective departments or agencies in the field of Communications Intelligence and each member department or agency will be represented at each meeting by at least one member, or alternate, with the necessary powers to act.

    4. Decisions of the Board will be based on the principle of unanimity, which shall be a prerequisite for matters within the purview of the Board, except that the Chairman shall be elected by majority vote. When decision cannot be reached, the Board will promptly refer the matter for resolution to the National Security Council; provided that, when unanimity is not obtained among the military department heads of the Department of Defense, the Board shall present the problem to the Secretary of Defense before presenting it to the National Security Council.

    5. Decisions and policies promulgated by the Board within the scope of its jurisdiction shall be applicable to all departments and agencies represented on or subordinate to the National Security Council and any others designated by the President, and shall be implemented by those departments and agencies of which action is required.

    6. The special nature of Communications Intelligence activities requires that they be treated in all respects as being outside the framework of other or general intelligence activities. Orders, directives, policies, or recommendations of any authority of the Executive Branch relating to the collection, production, security, handling, dissemination, or utilization of intelligence, and/or classified material, shall not be applicable to Communications Intelligence activities, unless specifically so stated and issued by competent departmental or agency authority represented on the Board.

    7. The Board shall act for the National Security Council to insure proper and full implementation of Council directives by issuing such supplementary directives as may be required. Such implementing directives in which the Board concurs unanimously shall be issued to and implemented by the member departments and agencies. When disagreement arises in the Board upon such directive, the proposed directive, together with statement of non-concurrence, shall be forwarded to the National Security Council for decision as provided in paragraph 4.

    8. Other National Security Council Intelligence Directives to the Director of Central Intelligence and related implementing directives issued by the Director of Central Intelligence shall be construed as non-applicable to Communications Intelligence activities under the authority of paragraph 6 above, unless the National Security Council has made its directive specifically applicable to Communications Intelligence.

    9. The Board will perform such functions as may be required to accomplish its objective set forth in paragraph 1 above, and in the exercise of responsibilities and authority delegated to it by the National Security Council in this directive.

    10. The Board shall leave the internal administration and operation of Communications Intelligence activities to the member departments or agencies.

    11. All currently effective decisions, policies, and operating arrangements of the Board and its predecessors, the Army-Navy Communications Intelligence Board, and the State-Army-Navy Communications Intelligence Board, as previously constituted, which are not in conflict with this directive, will remain in full force and effect unless changed by subsequent decisions of the Board.

    12. Definitions. For purposes of this directive the following definitions apply:

    a. "Foreign communications" include all telecommunications and related materials (except Foreign Press and Propaganda Broadcasts) of the government and/or their nationals or of any military, air, or naval force, faction, party, department, agency, or bureau of a foreign country, or of any person or persons acting or purporting to act therefor; they shall include all other telecommunications and related material of, to, and from a foreign country which may contain information of military, political, scientific or economic value.

    b. "Communications Intelligence" is intelligence produced by the study of foreign communications. Intelligence based in whole or in part on Communications Intelligence sources shall be considered Communications Intelligence as pertains to the authority and responsibility of the United States Communications Intelligence Board.

    c. "Communications Intelligence Activities" comprise all processes involved in the collection, for intelligence purposes, of foreign communications, the production of information from such communications, the dissemination of that information, and the control of the protection of that information and the security of its sources. [end of document]  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 12, 2004, 06:54:48 pm
Indeed, I've been trying to find the thing for months in its entirety.  It seems as if they've broken it down into small pieces.  Looks like the only recourse is to FOIA them, and do you think they'll hand it over?  Tell us some more detail about the act and what the above does not cover.  Seems strange that it wouldn't be available at all.  Check the library, perhaps it is there for those interested.   I've noticed even the newer bills and laws are extremely hard to cobble together.  If you do find it, be sure to let us know and a source where you found it ok?  I for one understand its importance.

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 12, 2004, 07:15:50 pm
Here may be some interesting links to persue:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/MAR402B.html (http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/MAR402B.html)
http://hcl.harvard.edu/govdocs/guides/decl...docs_index.html (http://hcl.harvard.edu/govdocs/guides/declass_docs_index.html)

Remember, if you search, it seems as if you should be searching for "declassified documents".   Pretty messed up for such an important piece of control law.  Much of it changed in the 1970's through executive order.

See also:  http://www.state.gov/www/about_state/histo...tel/intro6.html (http://www.state.gov/www/about_state/history/intel/intro6.html)
        and:  http://www.archives.gov/research_room/fede...ncil_rg273.html (http://www.archives.gov/research_room/federal_records_guide/national_security_council_rg273.html)

that's about it as far as internet searching.  I say again, the only way to get the original doc is to FOIA them.  Unless someone somewhere can find it.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 12, 2004, 07:22:47 pm
Well, Unstructured, again you bring some very interesting stuff to the thread. I especially enjoyed reading the material under this heading: "AVOIDANCE OF PUBLICITY CONCERNING THE INTELLIGENCE  AGENCIES OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT".

But like you, I lament that we cannot find a copy of the "National Security Act of 1947", signed by Truman. Somehow, somewhere, we must come up with a "Mole" who can get us a copy of the damned thing, for as already noted on this thread, that Act was one of the two largest assaults on America from within our own government during the entire 20th Century.  We simply must get our hands on a copy of the damned thing. Thanks to Bush II, the FOIA has special provisions now which protect CIA to the hilt. Yet it is through that National Security Act of 1947 that our enemy is bilking our domestic gross product and funneling it to the bankers who own the Federal Reserve System, inc.  And much more.  We must get a copy of the bill and publish it. I think millions of Americans would be surprised to see what is hidden in that bill. :)

Salute!
And thanks,
Elias
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 12, 2004, 07:27:53 pm
Indeed you are right, I've edited and added some things to the above post.  Where is the damn thing!?  Gonna have to dig out some old books, but knowing those, only briefs will be included yet the importance is unbelievably great.  I'm still on the trail, and I'll let you know.  You do the same.

Peace and Good Day

PS also found a few things from the Truman Library:
http://www.trumanlibrary.org/hstpaper/nsc.htm (http://www.trumanlibrary.org/hstpaper/nsc.htm)

and finally, this may help in a search:
Establishment of the National Security Council

The National Security Council was established by the National Security Act of 1947 (PL 235 - 61 Stat. 496; U.S.C. 402), amended by the National Security Act Amendments of 1949 (63 Stat. 579; 50 U.S.C. 401 et seq.). Later in 1949, as part of the Reorganization Plan, the Council was placed in the Executive Office of the President.  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 12, 2004, 09:10:11 pm
I found some volumes through OCLC and will be making an interlibrary loan request tomorrow (back on the list I go  :lol: )
I have a friend whose wife worked at the library and she told him that checking out certain books gets you on "the list" immediately - one of those is Behold a Pale Horse - so, I have been on the list for years and more than once - oh well, nice to know it.  :ph34r:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Delos on December 12, 2004, 10:39:57 pm

Let's not be generating any new suicides, boys, especially the kind committed by several gunshots to the head!

Y'all be careful, now!

:o  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 12, 2004, 10:42:32 pm
ahhh, they're just conspiracies Delos.  The real reality is in the individual mind.  Thanks for looking out though  :)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 13, 2004, 12:52:48 am
Quote
I found some volumes through OCLC and will be making an interlibrary loan request tomorrow (back on the list I go  :lol: )
I have a friend whose wife worked at the library and she told him that checking out certain books gets you on "the list" immediately - one of those is Behold a Pale Horse - so, I have been on the list for years and more than once - oh well, nice to know it.  :ph34r:
Well, at least you ain't listless! Me too neither, lol. But you know what Steve Earle says...

http://www.steveearle.com/ (http://www.steveearle.com/)

(From his new album, 'The Revolution Starts...Now!': "Fuck the FBI! Fuck the CIA!") Gladly, I can report that Montana Rose, who covers Steve Earle, came by TMM headquarters last night and kidnapped my old ass and drug me off to a Willow Creek stockade in which the Boozehounds were playin' for a private party in a really cool enclosed generous grounds surrounded by good folks'  buildings, studios, and houses. There was a great bonfire and a great crowd of native Montanans and local artists, and the spirits were high and the music powerful, and damned if the Boozehounds didn't play the "Fuck the CIA!" song and brought the barn down. People were hootin' and whistlin' and the dancers were throwin' up their heels and everyone was beaming and bobbing in the pale dim lights around the band. Even old Elias was hoppin' on the floor with a fist raised up to heaven and a raging grin on my face, hehehe. Great song.

So let's begin to put this thread into focus. We're looking at the idea of 911 being an "inside job". That is a quote by Gary Busey, as featured on an Alex Jones film and also on Anthony Hilder's newest film. Yep, you get to see Gary Busey standing right in front of you with his eyes locked in on yours as he says this 911 thing could be an "inside job". Cat's getting out of the bag. How much proof have we brought forward on just this thread alone, which don't touch a tenth of what's out there right now, available to anyone with the minutes to track it down, eh? We now have a good notion about *who* is behind our present-day woes, and we now know what social and cultural institutions they've taken over in order to do this to us, to the American people. We know their stated and quoted plans to dominate all mankind for the one-world government of the New World Order. We know they'll violate every law that stands in their way. We know now that they'll deal tons of coke, sell tons of guns, launder tons of illegal money, do what they have to domestically to assure the continuity of government, murder those who seriously jeopardize their agenda. And we know a lot more than just that about their overall game, their concentrations of power into the hands of the few, and their abuses of that power. We know that every president since Wilson has blatantly lied to us while stabbing our Republic and its Constitution in the back.

But have we "proved" anything? That is the question. I think I'm gonna go back over this whole thread and take notes from one post to the next, down through all the pages, and see what we might condense from the thread thus far. Maybe the thread ain't ripe for plucking just yet, but I think, or feel, that we may be coming closer, and we ought to check to see what we've learned so far. Soon as we document enough, I'm for arresting the Cheney-Bush Junta, as Vidal calls it. Never mind impeaching the bastards; just arrest 'em for murder and try 'em in public. We only need a couple of million to do it all in one fell swoop, because on Wall Street and at Langley and in Washington DC and a few other places there ain't but so many thousand of the bastards who're doing all this terror stuff to us. Bringing Cheney's involvement in the facilitation of the "terror" events of 911 to clear light of day will do my old heart good, and if we can get that established with this thread, I'll be among the first to jump. Y'all know what this ol' Southern boy means?  :ph34r:

So let's start addin' it all up, from Skull and Bones to the New World Order's attacks of '93, '95, and 911. I'll try to get that done this week. We'll pow-wow on it and find a consensus, and then we'll work from there, eh?

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 14, 2004, 10:59:18 am
Elias,

Wandering around the library, I asked about four librarians about the act each giving me that wierd loook like I'd just come in from Mars or at least Ohio :) .  Anyway one nice librarian said she knew what I was talking about and gave me a book called "important documents in American History" plus or minus a word.  I opened it up and it seemed to be there along with some after thoughts written by Truman.  I photcopied it, but I still want to verify it's the real thing.  It was a really old book and the Act was rather short- 2 and one half small print pages.

What do you think?  Scan it and send it to you for your expert opinion, or keep looking?

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 14, 2004, 02:44:51 pm
Here it is everybody as passed by the 80th Congress.  Keep in mind many newer acts change some of the words contained in it.
   
   
   
UNCLASSIFIED  

NATIONAL SECURITY ACT OF 1947
ACT OF JULY 26, 1947
(As Amended)

AN ACT To promote the national security by providing for a Secretary of Defense; for a National Military Establishment; for a Department of the Army, a Department of the Navy, and a Department of the Air Force; and for the coordination of the activities of the National Military Establishment with other departments and agencies of the Government concerned with the national security.

    Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SHORT TITLE

    That [50 U.S..C. 401 note] this Act may be cited as the "National Security Act of 1947".

TABLE OF CONTENTS

Sec. 2. Declaration of policy.

Sec. 3. Definitions.[1]

TITLE I - COORDINATION FOR NATIONAL SECURITY

Sec. 101. National Security Council.

Sec. 102. Office of the Director of Central Intelligence.

Sec. 102A. Central Intelligence Agency.

Sec. 103. Responsibilities of the Director of Central Intelligence.

Sec. 104. Authorities of the Director of Central Intelligence.

Sec. 105. Responsibilities of the Secretary of Defense pertaining to the National Foreign Intelligence Program.

Sec. 105A. Assistance to United States law enforcement agencies.

Sec. 105B. Disclosure of foreign intelligence acquired in criminal investigations; notice of criminal investigations of foreign intelligence sources.

Sec. 105C. Protection of operational files of the National Imagery and Mapping Agency

Sec. 105D. Protection of operational files of the National Reconnaissance Office.

Sec. 106. Appointment of officials responsible for intelligence-related activities.

Sec. 107. National Security Resources Board.

Sec. 108. Annual National Security Strategy Report.

Sec. 104. Annual national security strategy report.[2]

Sec. 109. Annual report on intelligence.

Sec. 110. National mission of National Imagery and Mapping Agency.

Sec. 111. Collection tasking authority.

Sec. 112. Restrictions on intelligence sharing with the United Nations.

Sec. 113. Detail of intelligence community personnel-intelligence community assignment program.

Sec. 114. Additional annual reports from the Director of Central Intelligence.

Sec. 114A. Annual report on improvement of financial statements for auditing purposes.

Sec. 115. Limitation on establishment or operation of diplomatic intelligence support centers.

Sec. 116. Travel on any common carrier for certain intelligence collection personel.

Sec. 117. POW/MIA analytic capability.

Sec. 118. Semiannual report on financial intelligence on terrorist assets.

TITLE II - THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE

Sec. 201. Department of Defense.

Sec. 202. Secretary of Defense.[3]

Sec. 203. Military Assistants to the Secretary.[3]

Sec. 204. Civilian personnel.[3]

Sec. 205. Department of the Army.

Sec. 206. Department of the Navy.

Sec. 207. Department of the Air Force.

Sec. 208. United States Air Force.[3]

Sec. 209. Effective date of transfers.[3]

Sec. 210. War Council.[3]

Sec. 211. Joint Chiefs of Staff.[3]

Sec. 212. Joint Staff.[3]

Sec. 213. Munitions Board.[3]

Sec. 214. Research and Development Board.[3]

TITLE   III - MISCELLANEOUS

Sec. 301. National Security Agency voluntary separation.

Sec. 302. Under Secretaries and Assistant Secretaries.[3]

Sec. 303. Advisory committees and personnel.

Sec. 304. Status of transferred civilian personnel.[3]

Sec. 305. Saving provisions.[3]

Sec. 306. Transfer of funds.[3]

Sec. 307. Authorization for appropriations.

Sec. 308. Definitions.

Sec. 309. Separability.

Sec. 310. Effective date.

Sec. 311. Succession to the Presidency.

Sec. 411. Repealing and saving provisions.[1]

TITLE V - ACCOUNTABILITY FOR INTELLIGENCE ACTIVITIES

Sec. 501. General congressional oversight provisions.

Sec. 502. Reporting of intelligence activities other than covert actions.

Sec. 503. Presidential approval and reporting of covert actions.

Sec. 504. Funding of intelligence activities.

Sec. 505. Notice to Congress of certain transfers of defense articles and defense services.

Sec. 506. Specificity of National Foreign Intelligence Program budget amounts for counterterrorism, counterproliferation, counternarcotics, and counterintelligence.

Sec. 507. Dates for submittal of various annual and semiannual reports to the congressional intelligence committees.

TITLE VI - PROTECTION OF CERTAIN NATIONAL SECURITY INFORMATION

Sec. 601. Protection of identities of certain United States undercover intelligence officers, agents informants, and sources.

Sec. 602. Defenses and exceptions.

Sec. 603. Report.

Sec. 604. Extraterritorial jurisdiction.

Sec. 605. Providing information to Congress.

Sec. 606. Definitions.

TITLE VII - PROTECTION OF OPERATIONAL FILES OF THE CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY

Sec. 701. Exemption of certain operational files from search, review, publication, or disclosure.

Sec. 702. Decennial review of exempted operational files.

TITLE VIII - ACCESS TO CLASSIFIED INFORMATION

Sec. 801. Procedures.

Sec. 802. Requests by authorized investigative agencies.

Sec. 803. Exceptions.

Sec. 804. Definitions.

TITLE IX - APPLICATION OF SANCTIONS LAWS TO INTELLIGENCE ACTIVITIES

Sec. 901. Stay of sanctions.

Sec. 902. Extension of stay.

Sec. 903. Reports.

Sec. 904. Laws subject to stay.

Sec. 905. Application.

TITLE X - EDUCATION IN SUPPORT OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE

Sec. 1001. Scholarships and work-study for pursuit of graduate degrees in science and technology.

TITLE XI - OTHER PROVISIONS

Sec. 1101. Applicability to United States intelligence activities of Federal laws implementing international treaties and agreements.

 

 

DECLARATION OF POLICY

SEC. 2. [50 U.S.C. 401] In enacting this legislation, it is the intent of Congress to provide a comprehensive program for the future security of the United States; to provide for the establishment of integrated policies and procedures for the departments, agencies, and functions of the Government relating to the national security; to provide a Department of Defense, including the three military Departments of the Army, the Navy (including naval aviation and the United States Marine Corps), and the Air Force under the direction, authority, and control of the Secretary of Defense; to provide that each military department shall be separately organized under its own Secretary and shall function under the direction, authority, and control of the Secretary of Defense; to provide for their unified direction under civilian control of the Secretary of Defense but not to merge these departments or services; to provide for the establishment of unified or specified combatant commands, and a clear and direct line of command to such commands; to eliminate unnecessary duplication in the Department of Defense, and particularly in the field of research and engineering by vesting its overall direction and control in the Secretary of Defense; to provide more effective, efficient, and economical administration in the Department of Defense; to provide for the unified strategic direction of the combatant forces, for their operation under unified command, and for their integration into an efficient team of land, naval, and air forces but not to establish a single Chief of Staff over the armed forces nor an overall armed forces general staff.

DEFINITIONS

SEC. 3. [50 U.S.C. 401a] As used in this Act:

       (1) The term "intelligence" includes foreign intelligence and counterintelligence.

       (2) The term "foreign intelligence" means information relating to the capabilities, intentions, or activities of foreign governments or elements thereof, foreign organizations, or foreign persons, or international terrorist activities.

       (3) The term "counterintelligence" means information gathered, and activities conducted to protect against espionage, other intelligence activities, sabotage, or assassinations conducted by or on behalf of foreign governments or elements thereof, foreign organizations, or foreign persons, or inter national terrorist activities.

       (4) The term "intelligence community" includes -

               (A) the Office of the Director of Central Intelligence, which shall include the Office of the Deputy Director of Central Intelligence, the National Intelligence Council (as provided for in section 105(b)(3)), and such other offices as the Director may designate;

               (B) the Central Intelligence Agency;

               © the National Security Agency;

               (D) the Defense Intelligence Agency;

               (F) the National Reconnaissance Office;

               (G) other offices within the Department of Defense for the collection of specialized national intelligence through reconnaissance programs;

               (H) the intelligence elements of the Army, the Navy, the Air Force, the Marine Corps, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the Department of the Treasury, the Department of Energy, and the Coast Guard;

               (I) the Bureau of Intelligence and Research of the Department of State;

               (J) the elements of the Department of Homeland Security concerned with the analyses of foreign intelligence information; and

               (K) such other elements of any other department or agency as may be designated by the President, or designated jointly by the Director of Central Intelligence and the head of the department or agency concerned, as an element of the intelligence community.

       (5) The terms "national intelligence" and "intelligence-related to the national security" -

               (A) each refer to intelligence which pertains to the interests of more than one department or agency of the Government; and

               (B) do not refer to counterintelligence or law enforcement activities conducted by the Federal Bureau of Investigation except to the extent provided for in procedures agreed to by the Director of Central Intelligence and the Attorney General, or otherwise as expressly provided for in this title.

       (6) The term "National Foreign Intelligence Program" refers to all programs, projects, and activities of the intelligence community, as well as any other programs of the intelligence community designated jointly by the Director of Central Intelligence and the head of a United States department or agency or by the President. Such term does not include programs, projects, or activities of the military departments to acquire intelligence solely for the planning and conduct of tactical military operations by United States Armed Forces.

        (7) The term `congressional intelligence committees' means--

            (A) the Select Committee on Intelligence of the Senate; and

            (B) the Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence of the House of Representatives.

TITLE I - COORDINATION FOR NATIONAL SECURITY

NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL

Sec. 101. [U.S.C. 402] (a) There is hereby established a council to be known as the National Security Council (thereinafter in this section referred to as the "Council").

       The President of the United States shall preside over meetings of the Council: Provided, That in his absence he may designate a member of the Council to preside in his place.

       The function of the Council shall be to advise the President with respect to the integration of domestic, foreign, and military policies relating to the national security so as to enable the military services and the other departments and agencies of the Government to cooperate more effectively in matters involving the national security.

       The Council shall be composed of [4] -

               (1) the President;

               (2) the Vice President;

               (3) the Secretary of State;

               (4) the Secretary of Defense;

               (5) the Director for Mutual Security;

               (6) the Chairman of the National Security Resources Board; and

               (7) the Secretaries and Under Secretaries of other executive departments and the military departments, the Chairman of the Munitions Board, and the Chairman of the Research and Development Board, when appointed by the President by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, to serve at his pleasure.

       (b) In addition to performing such other functions as the President may direct, for the purpose of more effectively coordinating the policies and functions of the departments and agencies of the Government relating to the national security, it shall, subject to the direction of the President, be the duty of the Council -

               (1) to assess and appraise the objectives, commitments, and risks of the United States in relation to our actual and potential military power, in the interest of national security, for the purpose of making recommendations to the President in connection therewith; and

               (2) to consider policies on matters of common interest to the departments and agencies of the Government concerned with the national security, and to make recommendations to the President in connection therewith.

       © The Council shall have a staff to be headed by a civilian executive secretary who shall be appointed by the President, and who shall receive compensation at the rate of $10,000 a year.[5] The executive secretary, subject to the direction of the Council, is hereby authorized, subject to the civil-service laws and the Classification Act of 1923, as amended,[6] to appoint and fix the compensation of such personnel as may be necessary to perform such duties as may be prescribed by the Council in connection with the performance of its functions.

       (d) The Council shall, from time to time, make such recommendations, and such other reports to the President as it deems appropriate or as the President may require.

       (e) The Chairman (or in his absence the Vice Chairman) of the Joint Chiefs of Staff may, in his role as principal military adviser to the National Security Council and subject to the direction of the President, attend and participate in meetings of the National Security Council.

       (f) The Director of National Drug Control Policy may, in his role as principal adviser to the National Security Council on national drug control policy, and subject to the direction of the President, attend and participate in meetings of the National Security Council.[7]

       (g) The President shall establish with the National Security Council a board to be known as the "Board for Low Intensity Conflict".

The principal function of the board shall be to coordinate the policies of the United States for low intensity conflict.

       (h)(1) There is established within the National Security Council a committee to be known as the Committee on Foreign Intelligence (in this subsection referred to as the "Committee").

       (2) The Committee shall be composed of the following:

               (A) The Director of Central Intelligence.

               (B) The Secretary of State.

               © The Secretary of Defense.

               (D) The Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs, who shall serve as the chairperson of the Committee.

               (E) Such other members as the President may designate.

       (3) The function of the Committee shall be to assist the Council in its activities by -

               (A) identifying the intelligence required to address the national security interests of the United States as specified by the President;

               (B) establishing priorities (including funding priorities) among the programs, projects, and activities that address such interests and requirements; and

               © establishing policies relating to the conduct of intelligence activities of the United States, including appropriate roles and missions for the elements of the intelligence community and appropriate targets of intelligence collection activities.

       (4) In carrying out its function, the Committee shall -

               (A) conduct an annual review of the national security interests of the United States;

               (B) identify on an annual basis, and at such other times as the Council may require, the intelligence required to meet such interests and establish an order of priority for the collection and analysis of such intelligence; and

               © conduct an annual review of the elements of the intelligence community in order to determine the success of such elements in collecting, analyzing, and disseminating the intelligence identified under subparagraph (B).

       (5) The Committee shall submit each year to the Council and to the Director of Central Intelligence a comprehensive report on its activities during the preceding year, including its activities under paragraphs (3) and (4).

       (i)(1) There is established within the National Security Council a committee to be known as the Committee on Transnational Threats (in this subsection referred to as the "Committee").

       (2) The Committee shall include the following members:

               (A) The Director of Central Intelligence.

               (B) The Secretary of State.

               © The Secretary of Defense.

               (D) The Attorney General.

               (E) The Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs, who shall serve as the chairperson of the Committee.

               (F) Such other members as the President may designate.

       (3) The function of the Committee shall be to coordinate and direct the activities of the United States Government relating to combating transnational threats.

       (4) In carrying out its function, the Committee shall

               (A) identify transnational threats;

               (B) develop strategies to enable the United States Government to respond to transnational threats identified under subparagraph (A);

               © monitor implementation of such strategies;

               (D) make recommendations as to appropriate responses to specific transnational threats;

               (E) assist in the resolution of operational and policy differences among Federal departments and agencies in their responses to transnational threats;

               (F) develop policies and procedures to ensure the effective sharing of information about transnational threats among Federal departments and agencies, including law enforcement agencies and the elements of the intelligence community; and

               (G) develop guidelines to enhance and improve the coordination of activities of Federal law enforcement agencies and elements of the intelligence community outside the United States with respect to transnational threats.

       (5) For purposes of this subsection, the term "transnational threat" means the following:

               (A) Any transnational activity (including international terrorism, narcotics trafficking, the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and the delivery systems for such weapons, and organized crime) that threatens the national security of the United States.

               (B) Any individual or group that engages in an activity referred to in subparagraph (A).

       (j) The Director of Central Intelligence (or, in the Director's absence, the Deputy Director of Central Intelligence) may, in the performance of the Director's duties under this Act and subject to the direction of the President, attend and participate in meetings of the National Security Council.

OFFICE OF THE DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE

SEC. 102. [50 U.S.C. 403] (a) DIRECTOR of CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE. - There is a Director of Central Intelligence who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate. The Director shall -

               (1) serve as head of the United States intelligence community;

               (2) act as the principal adviser to the President for intelligence matters related to the national security; and

               (3) serve as head of the Central Intelligence Agency.

       (b) DEPUTY DIRECTORS OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE. - (1) There is a Deputy Director of Central Intelligence who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate.

       (2) There is a Deputy Director of Central Intelligence for Community Management who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate.

       (3) Each Deputy Director of Central Intelligence shall have extensive national security expertise.

       © MILITARY STATUS OF DIRECTOR AND DEPUTY DIRECTORS. -(1)(A) Not more than one of the individuals serving in the positions specified in subparagraph (B) may be a commissioned officer of the Armed Forces, whether in active or retired status.

       (B) The positions referred to in subparagraph (A) are the following:

               (i) The Director of Central Intelligence.

               (ii) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence.

               (iii) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence for Community Management.

       (2) It is the sense of Congress that, under ordinary circumstances, it is desirable that one of the individuals serving in the positions specified in paragraph (1)(B) -

               (A) be a commissioned officer of the Armed Forces, whether in active or retired status; or

               (B) have, by training or experience, an appreciation of military intelligence activities and requirements.

       (3) A commissioned officer of the Armed Forces, while serving in a position specified in paragraph (1)(B) -

               (A) shall not be subject to supervision or control by the Secretary of Defense or by any officer or employee of the Department of Defense;

               (B) shall not exercise, by reason of the officer's status as a commissioned officer, any supervision or control with respect  to any of the military or civilian personnel of the Department of Defense except as otherwise authorized by law; and

               © shall not be counted against the numbers and percent ages of commissioned officers of the rank and grade of such officer authorized for the military department of that officer.

       (4) Except as provided in subparagraph (A) or (B) of paragraph (3), the appointment of an officer of the Armed Forces to a position specified in paragraph (1)(B) shall not affect the status, position, rank, or grade of such officer in the Armed Forces, or any emolument, perquisite, right, privilege, or benefit incident to or arising out of any such status, position, rank, or grade.

       (5) A commissioned officer of the Armed Forces on active duty who is appointed to a position specified in paragraph (1)(B), while serving in such position and while remaining on active duty, shall continue to receive military pay and allowances and shall not receive the pay prescribed for such position. Funds from which such pay and allowances are paid shall be reimbursed from funds available to the Director of Central Intelligence.

       (d) DUTIES OF DEPUTY DIRECTORS. - (1)(A) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence shall assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the Director's responsibilities under this Act.

       (B) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence shall act for, and exercise the powers of, the Director of Central Intelligence during the Director's absence or disability or during a vacancy in the position of the Director of Central Intelligence.

       (2) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence for Community Management shall, subject to the direction of the Director of Central Intelligence, be responsible for the following:

               (A) Directing the operations of the Community Management Staff.

               (B) Through the Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Collection, ensuring the efficient and effective collection of national intelligence using technical means and human sources.

               © Through the Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Analysis and Production, conducting oversight of the analysis and production of intelligence by elements of the intelligence community.

               (D) Through the Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Administration, performing community-wide management functions of the intelligence community, including the management of personnel and resources.

       (3)(A) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence takes precedence in the Office of the Director of Central Intelligence immediately after the Director of Central Intelligence.

       (B) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence for Community Management takes precedence in the Office of the Director of Central Intelligence immediately after the Deputy Director of Central Intelligence.

       (e) OFFICE OF THE DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE. - (1) There is an Office of the Director of Central Intelligence. The function of the Office is to assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the duties and responsibilities of the Director under this Act and to carry out such other duties as may be prescribed by law.

       (2) The Office of the Director of Central Intelligence is composed of the following:

               (A) The Director of Central Intelligence.

               (B) The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence.

               © The Deputy Director of Central Intelligence for Community Management.

               (D) The National Intelligence Council.

               (E) The Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Collection.

               (F) The Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Analysis and Production.

               (G) The Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Administration.

               (H) Such other offices and officials as may be established by law or the Director of Central Intelligence may establish or designate in the Office.

       (3) To assist the Director in fulfilling the responsibilities of the Director as head of the intelligence community, the Director shall employ and utilize in the Office of the Director of Central Intelligence a professional staff having an expertise in matters relating to such responsibilities and may establish permanent positions and appropriate rates of pay with respect to that staff.

       (4) The Office of the Director of Central Intelligence shall, for administrative purposes, be within the Central Intelligence Agency.

       (f) ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE FOR COLLECTION. - (1) To assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the Director's responsibilities under this Act, there shall be an Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Collection who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate.

       (2) The Assistant Director for Collection shall assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the Director's collection responsibilities in order to ensure the efficient and effective collection of national intelligence.

       (g) ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE FOR ANALYSIS AND PRODUCTION. - (1) To assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the Director's responsibilities under this Act, there shall be an Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Analysis and Production who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate.

       (2) The Assistant Director for Analysis and Production shall -

               (A) oversee the analysis and production of intelligence by the elements of the intelligence community;

               (B) establish standards and priorities relating to such analysis and production;

               © monitor the allocation of resources for the analysis and production of intelligence in order to identify unnecessary duplication in the analysis and production of intelligence;

               (D) direct competitive analysis od analytical products having National importance.

               (E) identify intelligence to be collected for purposes of the Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Collection; and

               (F) provide such additional analysis and production of intelligence as the President and the National Security Council may require.

       (h) ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE FOR ADMINISTRATION. - (1) To assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the Director's responsibilities under this Act, there shall be an Assistant Director of Central Intelligence for Administration who shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate.

       (2) The Assistant Director for Administration shall manage such activities relating to the administration of the intelligence community as the Director of Central Intelligence shall require.

CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY

SEC. 102A.. [50 U.S.C. 403-1] There is a Central Intelligence Agency. The function of the Agency shall be to assist the Director of Central Intelligence in carrying out the responsibilities referred to in paragraphs (1) through (5) of section 103(d) of this Act.

RESPONSIBILITIES OF THE DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE

SEC. 103. (50 U.S.C. 403-3] (a) PROVISION OF INTELLIGENCE. (1) Under the direction of the National Security Council, the Director of Central Intelligence shall be responsible for providing national intelligence -

               (A) to the President;

               (B) to the heads of departments and agencies of the executive branch;

               © to the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and senior military commanders; and

               (D) where appropriate, to the Senate and House of Representatives and the committees thereof.

       (2) Such national intelligence should be timely, objective, independent of political considerations, and based upon all sources available to the intelligence community.

       (b) NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE COUNCIL. - (1)(A) There is established within the Office of the Director of Central Intelligence the National Intelligence Council (hereafter in this section referred to as the Council"). The Council shall be composed of senior analysts within the intelligence community and substantive experts from the public and private sector, who shall be appointed by, report to, and serve at the pleasure of, the Director of Central Intelligence.

       (B) The Director shall prescribe appropriate security requirements for personnel appointed from the private sector as a condition of service on the Council, or as contractors of the Council or employees of such contractors, to ensure the protection of intelligence sources and methods while avoiding, wherever possible, unduly intrusive requirements which the Director considers to be unnecessary for this purpose.

       (2) The Council shall -

               (A) produce national intelligence estimates for the Government, including, whenever the Council considers appropriate, alternative views held by elements of the intelligence community;

               (B) evaluate community-wide collection and production of intelligence by the intelligence community and the requirements and resources of such collection and production; and

               © otherwise assist the Director in carrying out the responsibilities described in subsection (a).

       (3) Within their respective areas of expertise and under the direction of the Director, the members of the Council shall constitute the senior intelligence advisers of the intelligence community for purposes of representing the views of the intelligence community within the Government.

       (4) Subject to the direction and control of the Director of Central Intelligence, the Council may carry out its responsibilities under this subsection by contract, including contracts for substantive experts necessary to assist the Council with particular assessments under this subsection.

       (5) The Director shall make available to the Council such staff as may be necessary to permit the Council to carry out its responsibilities under this subsection and shall take appropriate measures to ensure that the Council and its staff satisfy the needs of policymaking officials and other consumers of intelligence. The Council shall also be readily accessible to policymaking officials and other appropriate individuals not otherwise associated with the intelligence community.

       (6) The heads of elements within the intelligence community shall, as appropriate, furnish such support to the Council, including the preparation of intelligence analyses, as may be required by the Director.

       © HEAD OF THE INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY. - In the Director's capacity as head of the intelligence community, the Director shall -

       (1) facilitate the development of an annual budget for intelligence and intelligence-related activities of the United States by

               (A) developing and presenting to the President an annual budget for the National Foreign Intelligence Program; and

               (B) participating in the development by the Secretary of Defense of the annual budgets for the Joint Military Intelligence Program and the Tactical Intelligence and Related Activities Program;

       (2) establish the requirements and priorities to govern the collection of national intelligence by elements of the intelligence community;

       (3) approve collection requirements, determine collection priorities, and resolve conflicts in collection priorities levied on national collection assets, except as otherwise agreed with the Secretary of Defense pursuant to the direction of the President;

       (4) promote and evaluate the utility of national intelligence to consumers within the Government;

       (5) eliminate waste and unnecessary duplication within the intelligence community;

       (6) establish requirements and priorities for foreign intelligence information to be collected under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C.. 1801 et seq.), and provide assistance to the Attorney General to ensure that information derived from electronic surveillance or physical searches under that Act is disseminated so it may be used efficiently and effectively for foreign intelligence purposes, except that the Director shall have no authority to direct, manage, or undertake electronic surveillance or physical search operations pursuant to that Act unless otherwise authorized by statute or Executive Order;

       (7) protect intelligence sources and methods from unauthorized disclosure; and

       (8) perform such other functions as the President or the National Security Council may direct.

       (d) HEAD OF THE CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY. - In the Director's capacity as head of the Central Intelligence Agency, the Director shall -

       (1) collect intelligence through human sources and by other appropriate means, except that the Agency shall have no police, subpoena, or law enforcement powers or internal security functions;

       (2) provide overall direction for the collection of national intelligence through human sources by elements of the intelligence community authorized to undertake such collection and, in coordination with other agencies of the Government which are authorized to undertake such collection, ensure that the most effective use is made of resources and that the risks to the United States and those involved in such collection are minimized;

       (3) correlate and evaluate intelligence-related to the national security and provide appropriate dissemination of such intelligence;

       (4) perform such additional services as are of common concern to the elements of the intelligence community, which services the Director of Central Intelligence determines can be more efficiently accomplished centrally; and

       (5) perform such other functions and duties related to intelligence affecting the national security as the President or the National Security Council may direct.

AUTHORITIES OF THE DIRECTOR OF CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE

SEC. 104. [50 U.S.C. 403-4] (a) ACCESS TO INTELLIGENCE. - To the extent recommended by the National Security Council and approved by the President, the Director of Central Intelligence shall have access to all intelligence-related to the national security which is collected by any department, agency, or other entity of the United States.

       (b) APPROVAL OF BUDGETS. - The Director of Central Intelligence shall provide guidance to elements of the intelligence community for the preparation of their annual budgets and shall approve such budgets before their incorporation in the National Foreign Intelligence Program.

       © ROLE OF DCI IN REPROGRAMMING. - No funds made available under the National Foreign Intelligence Program may be reprogrammed by any element of the intelligence community without the prior approval of the Director of Central Intelligence except in accordance with procedures issued by the Director. The Secretary of Defense shall consult with the Director of Central Intelligence before reprogramming funds made available under the Joint Military Intelligence Program.

       (d) TRANSFER OF FUNDS OR PERSONNEL WITHIN THE NATIONAL FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE PROGRAM. (1)(A) In addition to any other authorities available under law for such purposes, the Director of Central Intelligence, with the approval of the Director of the Office of Management and Budget, may transfer funds appropriated for a program within the National Foreign Intelligence Program to another such program and, in accordance with procedures to be developed by the Director and the heads of affected departments and agencies, may transfer personnel authorized for an element of the intelligence community to another such element for periods up to a year.

            (B) The Director may only delegate any duty or authority given the Director under this subsection to the Director of Central Intelligence for Community Management..

       (2)(A) A transfer of funds or personnel may be made under this subsection only if -

               (i) the funds or personnel are being transferred to an activity that is a higher priority intelligence activity;

               (ii) the need for funds or personnel for such activity is based on unforeseen requirements;

               (iii) the transfer does not involve a transfer of funds to the Reserve for Contingencies of the Central Intelligence Agency;

               (iv) the transfer does not involve a transfer of funds or personnel from the Federal Bureau of Investigation; and

               (v) subject to subparagraph (B), the Secretary or head of the department which contains the affected element or elements of the intelligence community does not object to such transfer.

            (B)(i) Except as provided in clause (ii), the authority to object to a transfer under subparagraph (A)(v) may not be delegated by the Secretary or head of the department involved.

                (ii) With respect to the Department of Defense, the authority to object to such a transfer may be delegated by the Secretary of Defense, but only to the Deputy Secretary of Defense.

                (iii) An objection to a transfer under subparagraph (A)(v) shall have no effect unless submitted to the Director of Central Intelligence in writing.

       (3) Funds transferred under this subsection shall remain available for the same period as the appropriations account to which transferred.

       (4) Any transfer of funds under this subsection shall be carried out in accordance with existing procedures applicable to reprogramming notifications for the appropriate congressional committees. Any proposed transfer for which notice is given to the appropriate congressional committees shall be accompanied by a report explaining the nature of the proposed transfer and how it satisfies the requirements of this subsection. In addition, the congressional intelligence committees shall be promptly notified of any transfer of funds made pursuant to this subsection in any case in which the transfer would not have otherwise required reprogramming notification under procedures in effect as of the date of the enactment of this section.

       (5) The Director shall promptly submit to the congressional intelligence committees and, in the case of the transfer of personnel to or from the Department of Defense, the Committee on Armed Services of the Senate and the Committee on Armed Services of the House of Representatives, a report on any transfer of personnel made pursuant to this subsection. The Director shall include in any such report an explanation of the nature of the transfer and how it satisfies the requirements of this subsection.

       (e) COORDINATION WITH FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS. - Under direction of the National Security Council and in a manner consistent with section 207 of the Foreign Service Act of 1980 (22 U.S.C. 3927), the Director shall coordinate the relationships between elements of the intelligence community and the intelligence or security services of foreign governments on all matters involving intelligence-related to the national security or involving intelligence acquired through clandestine means.

       (f) USE OF PERSONNEL. - The Director shall, in coordination with the heads of departments and agencies with elements in intelligence community, institute policies and programs within the intelligence community -

       (1) to provide for the rotation of personnel between the elements of the intelligence community, where appropriate, and to make such rotated service a factor for promotion to senior positions; and

       (2) to consolidate, wherever possible, personnel, administrative, and security programs to reduce the overall costs of these activities within the intelligence community.

       (g) STANDARDS AND QUALIFICATIONS FOR PERFORMANCE OF INTELLIGENCE ACTIVITIES- The Director, acting as the head of the intelligence community, shall, in consultation with the heads of effected agencies, develop standards and qualifications for persons engaged in the performance of intelligence activities within the intelligence community.

       (h) TERMINATION OF EMPLOYMENT OF CIA EMPLOYEES. - Notwithstanding THE PROVISIONS OF ANY OTHER LAW, THE director may, in the Director's discretion, terminate employment of any officer or employee of the Central Intelligence Agency whenever the Director shall deem such termination necessary or advisable in the interests of the United States. Any such termination shall not affect the right of the officer or employee terminated to seek or accept employment in any other department or agency of the Government if declared eligible for such employment by the Office of Personnel Management.

RESPONSIBILITIES OF THE SECRETARY OF DEFENSE PERTAINING TO THE NATIONAL FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE PROGRAM

Sec. 105. [50 U.S.C. 403-5] (a) IN GENERAL. - The Secretary of Defense, in consultation with the Director of Central Intelligence, shall -

       (1) ensure that the budgets of the elements on the intelligence community within the Department of Defense are adequate to satisfy the overall intelligence needs of the Department of Defense, including the needs of the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the commanders of the unified and specified commands and, wherever such elements are performing governmentwide functions, the needs of other departments and agencies;

       (2) ensure appropriate implementation of the policies and resource decisions of the Director of Central Intelligence by elements of the Department of Defense within the National Foreign Intelligence Program;

       (3) ensure that the tactical intelligence activities of the Department of Defense complement and are compatible with intelligence activities under the National Foreign Intelligence Program;

       (4) ensure that the elements of the intelligence community within the Department of Defense are responsive and timely with respect to satisfying the needs of operational military forces;

       (5) eliminate waste and unnecessary duplication among the intelligence activities of the Department of Defense; and

       (6) ensure that intelligence activities of the Department of Defense are conducted jointly where appropriate.

       (b) RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE PERFORMANCE OF SPECIFIC FUNCTIONS. - Consistent with sections 103 and 104 of this Act, the Secretary of Defense shall ensure -

       (1) through the National Security Agency (except as otherwise directed by the President or the National Security Council), the continued operation of an effective unified organization for the conduct of signals intelligence activities and shall ensure that the product is disseminated in a timely manner to authorized recipients;

       (2) through the National Imagery and Mapping Agency (except as otherwise directed by the President or the National Security Council), with appropriate representation from the intelligence community, the continued operation of an effective unified organization within the Department of Defense -

               (A) for carrying out tasking of imagery collection;

               (B) for the coordination of imagery processing and exploitation activities;

               © for ensuring the dissemination of imagery in a timely manner to authorized recipients; and

               (D) notwithstanding any other provision of law, for prescribing technical architecture and standards related to imagery intelligence and geospatial information and ensuring compliance with such architecture and standards; and

       (ii) developing and fielding systems of common concern related to imagery intelligence and geospatial information;

       (3) through the National Reconnaissance Office (except as otherwise directed by the President or the National Security Council), the continued operation of an effective unified organization for the research and development, acquisition, and operation of overhead reconnaissance systems necessary to satisfy the requirements of all elements of the intelligence community;

       (4) through the Defense Intelligence Agency (except as otherwise directed by the President or the National Security Council), the continued operation of an effective unified system within the Department of Defense for the production of timely, objective military and military-related intelligence, based upon all sources available to the intelligence community, and shall ensure the appropriate dissemination of such intelligence to authorized recipients;

       (5) through the Defense Intelligence Agency (except as otherwise directed by the President or the National Security Council), effective management of Department of Defense human intelligence activities, including defense attaches; and

       (6) that the military departments maintain sufficient capabilities to collect and produce intelligence to meet

               (A) the requirements of the Director of Central Intelligence;

               (B) the requirements of the Secretary of Defense or the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff;

               © the requirements of the unified and specified combatant commands and of joint operations; and

               (D) the specialized requirements of the military departments for intelligence necessary to support tactical commanders, military planners, the research and development process, the acquisition of military equipment, and training and doctrine.

       © USE OF ELEMENTS OF DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE. - The Secretary of Defense, in carrying out the functions described in this section, may use such elements of the Department of Defense as may be appropriate for the execution of those functions, in addition to, or in lieu of, the elements identified in this section.

       (d) ANNUAL EVALUATION OF PERFORMANCE AND RESPONSIVENESS OF CERTAIN ELEMENTS OF INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY- (1) Not later each year than the date provided in section 507, the Director shall submit to the congressional intelligence committees the evaluation described in paragraph (3).

        (2) The Director shall submit each year to the Committee on Foreign Intelligence of the National Security Council, and to the Committees on Armed Services and Appropriations of the Senate and House of Representatives, the evaluation described in paragraph (3).

        (3) An evaluation described in this paragraph is an evaluation of the performance and responsiveness of the National Security Agency, the National Reconnaissance Office, and the National Imagery and Mapping Agency in meeting their respective national missions.

        (4) The Director shall submit each evaluation under this subsection in consultation with the Secretary of Defense and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

ASSISTANCE TO UNITED STATES LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES

SEC. 105A.. [50 U.S.C. 403-5a] (a) AUTHORITY TO PROVIDE ASSISTANCE. - Subject to subsection (b), elements of the intelligence community may, upon the request of a United States law enforcement agency, collect information outside the United States about individuals who are not United States persons. Such elements may collect such information notwithstanding that the law enforcement agency intends to use the information collected for purposes of a law enforcement investigation or counterintelligence investigation.

       (b) LIMITATION ON ASSISTANCE BY ELEMENTS OF DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE. - (1) With respect to elements within the Department of Defense, the authority in subsection (a) applies only to the following:

               (A) The National Security Agency.

               (B) The National Reconnaissance Office.

               © The National Imagery and Mapping Agency.

               (D) The Defense Intelligence Agency,

       (2) Assistance provided under this section by elements of the Department of Defense may not include the direct participation of a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps in an arrest or similar activity.

       (3) Assistance may not be provided under this section by an element of the Department of Defense if the provision of such assistance will adversely affect the military preparedness of the United States.

       (4) The Secretary of Defense shall prescribe regulations governing the exercise of authority under this section by elements of the Department of Defense, including regulations relating to the protection of sources and methods in the exercise of such authority.

       © DEFINITIONS. - For purposes of subsection (a):

       (1) The term "United States law enforcement agency" means any department or agency of the Federal Government that the Attorney General designates as law enforcement agency for purposes of this section.

       (2) The term "United States person" means the following:

               (A) A United States citizen.

               (B) An alien known by the intelligence agency concerned to be a permanent resident alien.

               © An unincorporated association substantially composed of United States citizens or permanent resident aliens.

               (D) A corporation incorporated in the United States, except for a corporation directed and controlled by a foreign government or governments.

DISCLOSURE OF FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE ACQUIRED IN CRIMINAL INVESTIGATIONS;
NOTICE OF CRIMINAL INVESTIGATIONS OF FOREIGN SOURCES

Sec. 105B. [50 USC 403-5b] (a) Disclosure of Foreign Intelligence.--(1) Except as otherwise provided by law and subject to paragraph (2), the Attorney General, or the head of any other department or agency of the Federal Government with law enforcement responsibilities, shall expeditiously disclose to the Director of Central Intelligence, pursuant to guidelines developed by the Attorney General in consultation with the Director, foreign intelligence acquired by an element of the Department of Justice or an element of such department or agency, as the case may be, in the course of a criminal investigation.

        (2) The Attorney General by regulation and in consultation with the Director of Central Intelligence may provide for exceptions to the applicability of paragraph (1) for one or more classes of foreign intelligence, or foreign intelligence with respect to one or more targets or matters, if the Attorney General determines that disclosure of such foreign intelligence under that paragraph would jeopardize an ongoing law enforcement investigation or impair other significant law enforcement interests.

    (b) Procedures for Notice of Criminal Investigations.--Not later than 180 days after the date of enactment of this section, the Attorney General, in consultation with the Director of Central Intelligence, shall develop guidelines to ensure that after receipt of a report from an element of the intelligence community of activity of a foreign intelligence source or potential foreign intelligence source that may warrant investigation as criminal activity, the Attorney General provides notice to the Director of Central Intelligence, within a reasonable period of time, of his intention to commence, or decline to commence, a criminal investigation of such activity.

    © Procedures.--The Attorney General shall develop procedures for the administration of this section, including the disclosure of foreign intelligence by elements of the Department of Justice, and elements of other departments and agencies of the Federal Government, under subsection (a) and the provision of notice with respect to criminal investigations under subsection (b).''.

PROTECTION OF OPERATIONAL FILES OF THE NATIONAL IMAGERY AND MAPPING AGENCY

SEC. 105C. [50 U.S.C. 403-5c] (a) Exemption of Certain Operational Files From Search, Review, Publication, or Disclosure.--(1) The Director of the National Imagery and Mapping Agency, with the coordination of the Director of Central Intelligence, may exempt operational files of the National Imagery and Mapping Agency from the provisions of section 552 of title 5, United States Code, which require publication, disclosure, search, or review in connection therewith.

       (2)(A) Subject to subparagraph (B), for the purposes of this section, the term `operational files' means files of the National Imagery and Mapping Agency (hereafter in this section referred to as `NIMA') concerning the activities of NIMA that before the establishment of NIMA were performed by the National Photographic Interpretation Center of the Central Intelligence Agency (NPIC), that document the means by which foreign intelligence or counterintelligence is collected through scientific and technical systems.

           (B) Files which are the sole repository of disseminated intelligence are not operational files.

       (3) Notwithstanding paragraph (1), exempted operational files shall continue to be subject to search and review for information concerning--

            (A) United States citizens or aliens lawfully admitted for permanent residence who have requested information on themselves pursuant to the provisions of section 552 or 552a of title 5, United States Code;

            (B) any special activity the existence of which is not exempt from disclosure under the provisions of section 552 of title 5, United States Code; or

            © the specific subject matter of an investigation by any of the following for any impropriety, or violation of law, Executive order, or Presidential directive, in the conduct of an intelligence activity:

                    (i) The congressional intelligence committees.

               (ii) The Intelligence Oversight Board.

                    (iiv) The Department of Justice.

                    (iv) The Office of General Counsel of NIMA.

                    (v) The Office of the Director of NIMA.

       (4)(A) Files that are not exempted under paragraph (1) which contain information derived or disseminated from exempted operational files shall be subject to search and review.

           (B) The inclusion of information from exempted operational files in files that are not exempted under paragraph (1) shall not affect the exemption under paragraph (1) of the originating operational files from search, review, publication, or disclosure.

            © Records from exempted operational files which have been disseminated to and referenced in files that are not exempted under paragraph (1) and which have been returned to exempted operational files for sole retention shall be subject to search and review.

       (5) The provisions of paragraph (1) may not be superseded except by a provision of law which is enacted after the date of the enactment of this section, and which specifically cites and repeals or modifies its provisions.

       (6)(A) Except as provided in subparagraph (B), whenever any person who has requested agency records under section 552 of title 5, United States Code, alleges that NIMA has withheld records improperly because of failure to comply with any provision of this section, judicial review shall be available under the terms set forth in section 552(a)(4)(B) of title 5, United States Code.

            (B) Judicial review shall not be available in the manner provided for under subparagraph (A) as follows:

               (i) In any case in which information specifically authorized under criteria established by an Executive order to be kept secret in the interests of national defense or foreign relations is filed with, or produced for, the court by NIMA, such information shall be examined ex parte, in camera by the court.

               (ii) <<NOTE: Courts.>>  The court shall, to the fullest extent practicable, determine the issues of fact based on sworn written submissions of the parties.

               (iii) When a complainant alleges that requested records are improperly withheld because of improper placement solely in exempted operational files, the complainant shall support such allegation with a sworn written submission based upon personal knowledge or otherwise admissible evidence.

               (iv)(I) When a complainant alleges that requested records were improperly withheld because of improper exemption of operational files, NIMA shall meet its burden under section 552(a)(4)(B) of title 5, United States Code, by demonstrating to the court by sworn written submission that exempted operational files likely to contain responsible records currently perform the functions set forth in paragraph (2).

                    (II) The court may not order NIMA to review the content of any exempted operational file or files in order to make the demonstration required under subclause (I), unless the complainant disputes NIMA's showing with a sworn written submission based on personal knowledge or otherwise admissible evidence.

               (v) In proceedings under clauses (iii) and (iv), the parties may not obtain discovery pursuant to rules 26 through 36 of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, except that requests for admissions may be made pursuant to rules 26 and 36.

               (vi) If the court finds under this paragraph that NIMA has improperly withheld requested records because of failure to comply with any provision of this subsection, the court shall order NIMA to search and review the appropriate exempted operational file or files for the requested records and make such records, or portions thereof, available in accordance with the provisions of section 552 of title 5, United States Code, and such order shall be the exclusive remedy for failure to comply with this subsection.

               (vii) If at any time following the filing of a complaint pursuant to this paragraph NIMA agrees to search the appropriate exempted operational file or files for the requested records, the court shall dismiss the claim based upon such complaint.

               (viii) Any information filed with, or produced for the court pursuant to clauses (i) and (iv) shall be coordinated with the Director of Central Intelligence prior to submission to the court.

   (b) Decennial Review of Exempted Operational Files.--(1) Not less than once every 10 years, the Director of the National Imagery and Mapping Agency and the Director of Central Intelligence shall review the exemptions in force under subsection (a)(1) to determine whether such exemptions may be removed from the category of exempted files or any portion thereof. The Director of Central Intelligence must approve any determination to remove such exemptions.

       (2) The review required by paragraph (1) shall include consideration of the historical value or other public interest in the subject matter of the particular category of files or portions thereof and the potential for declassifying a significant part of the information contained therein.

       (3) A complainant that alleges that NIMA has improperly withheld records because of failure to comply with this subsection may seek judicial review in the district court of the United S
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 14, 2004, 02:48:41 pm
Is that what you're after Elias, I wouldn't think you could find anything else relating to it that wasn't made up.  I have some notes and responses from Truman too, if you want me to post.  Ohh, and if that's the right Act you speak of, I'll post it in its entirety, right now it only goes through sec. 105©.

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 15, 2004, 01:11:31 am
Quote
Is that what you're after Elias, I wouldn't think you could find anything else relating to it that wasn't made up.  I have some notes and responses from Truman too, if you want me to post.  Ohh, and if that's the right Act you speak of, I'll post it in its entirety, right now it only goes through sec. 105©.

Peace and Good Day
Okay, USR, so you just earned a promotion..... a danged star, of course. I know you worked your butt off to come up with this, so now you're a General at TMM. The pay ain't so hot. In fact, the pay don't even exist. Worse, bein' a General in TMM even costs in terms of money and time and energy-invested. So join the club of other TMM Generals and quit yer bitchin' a'ready, lol! :)

That is the bill alright. How sweet it is! Now we just need the rest of it. And dang, General Unstructured, don't be so stingy with that url, eh? Let's get it into the hands of all readers so they can get on over to that site and save it as html files as is. The sooner, the better. Also, after you figure out how long the danged thing is, let's talk about puttin' 'er up over at TMM's boards; let's see how many posts it would take to carry the whole thang. I'm thinking about even running it as an article.........well, maybe not; too long. But if we had it in a thread in the boards there, we could link to parts of it from elsewhere. I'm very happy about this. Guess I'll calm down and sleep on it before deciding what to do with it next.

While scanning over it just now, I saw some things which are pregnant for future discourse. I'm excited to read the whole thing. One of my biggest priorties shall quickly be to find out the roots of the Black Budget, which should exist in this bill as it was written and amended between '47 and '49. You're right that the bill has undergone many changes and alterations via EOs and other acts subsequent to 1947. I think 1949 played a large role in changing the act in basic ways.  But we can get to those changes as need arises. The main objective, however, is just what you've dragged up here. Can't believe you found it! :)

I notice that it's marked "Declassified". Got any idea when they declassified it?

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 15, 2004, 01:55:42 am
Quote
That is the bill alright. How sweet it is! Now we just need the rest of it.
Try here (http://www.state.gov/www/about_state/history/intel/201_214.html)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 15, 2004, 02:16:07 am
http://www.intelligence.gov/0-natsecact_1947.shtml (http://www.intelligence.gov/0-natsecact_1947.shtml)

There you are fellas in the flesh.  It's a dot gov thing but gets the job done.  That's why I only posted a bit because I know some are hesitant to visit a dot gov site.  I have the whole act unclassified in txt format.  Holler if you want that, rather than linking to the dot gov's of the world.  Remember too, the changes made until the late 70's and the changes of recent legislation that reorganizes a lot of what is in there.   Still a great primer and extremely hard to find.  You know, I found it in a book, and the only way I found a website for it was by taking obscure phrases and googling them.  Even then it took me down the page a bit.  Wow what a document.  I hope you put it up over at Mental Militia for your archives.

Well my friends, there it is.  You might want to copy the link and paste to avoid direct linkage.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 15, 2004, 02:19:55 am
Well again, you know Misfit didn't seem to mind when I sent the full text version over to her. I've got it wrapped up nicely for anyone who wants a neat txt copy.   Anything else you guys want to find, I have sources  :)

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 15, 2004, 02:51:44 am
Hey Hey Elias, I have the doc in txt format, clean and smooth.  Let me know how to get it over at TMM like that or tell me where to post  it there.  Glad we found it anyhow!

Peace and Good Day

Good Night
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on December 16, 2004, 06:13:50 am
Quote
Hey Hey Elias, I have the doc in txt format, clean and smooth.  Let me know how to get it over at TMM like that or tell me where to post  it there.  Glad we found it anyhow!

Peace and Good Day

Good Night
Unstructured,

I've saved it to text file and also as an html Internet page on removeable disc. I'm thinking it may take me a while to figure the best way to save it at TMM.  Might not be until after Christmas. There seems to be a lot going on right now, and I'd kinda like to get familiar with it before dividing it up in sections.

But it is a treasure, and I thank ye for fetching it up for all of us here. You done good.

But what is this paranoia about going to government websites? Sheeit, Mon! I do that every day. The government's websites are great sources for documented governmental criminality. Heck, they brag about stuff.  I've found FEMA's twentieth anniversary celebration speech, for instance, and DARPA's first report to Congress, which is a bonafide bombshell.

So your paranoia causes me to wonder, do we the people have something to fear from our own damned representative government? Could that be? Sheesh, if that's true, we need to go up there and clean our house, right? Hell, that government is ours; it is us; it derives its just legitimacy from the consent of the governed. If fedgov has forgotten that, it's only because we let a criminal syndicate take over our seats of governmental powers, and if we've done that then it is we who must correct the error. (There's only a few thousand of 'em; I recommend going up there and arresting 'em. But you already know that, hehehe.) The main point is that when we the people fear our government, we're really only fearing ourselves, for that government only reflects what we the people permit. Fuck 'em. Go to their damned websites and learn to see how and what they think, how they speak, how they proclaim their agenda, how they reinvent daily the tenets of Govlish. Go over to the CFR's website and read their own history-book. It's there and its free to read or save to disc. Know thy enemy. While we still are allowed to possess an Internet, use the damn thing, eh? Knowledge is power. And as a CIA high-up from Langley told me last year, "Perception is everything".

Thanks again for finding the National Security Act of 1947. I envy you your youthful energy and inspiration. :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on December 16, 2004, 07:56:16 am
Hey, Unstructured,
CONGRATS on your promotion to General!  :D  B)  :ph34r:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on December 16, 2004, 07:58:41 am
And to the rest of you information gurus on this thread,
THANKS for continuing to dig and to share your knowledge.   B)

If you ever decide to make that trip to the nation's capital, let me know beforehand, OK?   ;)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on December 18, 2004, 02:31:59 pm
What causes the paranoia going to gov websites you ask Elias?  Well this is the conspiracy thread no?  :)   I just mentioned that because I've read other posts where people would say linking to a .gov sight is a no no.  Takes all kinds.  Hell, Elias I'm on .gov sites all the time, there are some real goodies on them.

Also, you mentioned starting a discussion at TMM on conspiracies, well, why not start with the NSA of 1947 and the changes to it since, all leading up to the just signed 911 intel bill?

Peace and Good Day
salute to you to, and wow, I'm a general now!  Best be a good example from here on in.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on December 18, 2004, 02:48:38 pm
Exactly, Un. Wait till you go to the senior officers' mess--best behavior is the first rule. 'Course it's hard to find any rule followers. And who knows where that rule list has gotten itself to.

 :lol:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on December 19, 2004, 03:26:06 am
Quote
And who knows where that rule list has gotten itself to.

 :lol:
Hell, cookie served that up as an appetizer a long time ago.  :lol:  Rules Schmules.  :rolleyes:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on December 19, 2004, 08:05:10 am
Forgive me if this has already been covered, but...
why the World Trade Center?  If it was a conspiracy by the government to carry out the attacks, or at least look the other way, why risk the one building in the world that is home to the main Federal Reserve where they keep all that gold?  Seems like an awful big and unnecessary risk if I were them.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on December 21, 2004, 10:44:48 am
At LRC:

Why They Hated Gary Webb

Alexander Cockburn on the CIA and drugs.


...charges have included the Agency's recruitment of Nazi scientists and SS officers; experiments on unwitting American citizens; efforts to assassinate Fidel Castro; alliances with opium lords in Burma, Thailand and Laos; an assassination program in Vietnam; complicity in the toppling of Salvador Allende in Chile; the arming of opium traffickers and religious fanatics in Afghanistan; the training of murderous police in Guatemala and El Salvador; and involvement in drugs-and-arms shuttles between Latin America and the US.
...
The second volume of CIA Inspector General Fred Hitz's investigation released in the fall of 1998 buttressed Webb's case even more tightly,....

So why did the top-tier press savage Webb, and parrot the CIA's denials.
...

And via St. Clair to Grabbe at
http://billstclair.com/blog/041220.html#cockburn (http://billstclair.com/blog/041220.html#cockburn)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on January 19, 2005, 02:04:36 am
Bob Wallace  (http://www.strike-the-root.com/51/wallace/wallace3.html)thinks we're nuts. We are hurting his brain.
Quote
One of the funniest I've heard recently is that George Bush was behind 9-11.  That one makes me chuckle.  Here's a guy who's failed at every job given to him (on a silver platter yet), who spent his college career as a drunken fratboy, but deep inside is an Evil Genius who planned and executed 9-11?  So he and his oil buddies could get to all that Black Gold in the Mideast ? Naw, I don't think so.   
I guess he can't take the time to read Crossing the Rubicon
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on January 19, 2005, 02:51:56 am
Quote
Bob Wallace  (http://www.strike-the-root.com/51/wallace/wallace3.html)thinks we're nuts. We are hurting his brain.
Quote
One of the funniest I've heard recently is that George Bush was behind 9-11.  That one makes me chuckle.  Here's a guy who's failed at every job given to him (on a silver platter yet), who spent his college career as a drunken fratboy, but deep inside is an Evil Genius who planned and executed 9-11?  So he and his oil buddies could get to all that Black Gold in the Mideast ? Naw, I don't think so.   
I guess he can't take the time to read Crossing the Rubicon
Came over here to post another addition to this thead, a link I've found, but I got sidetracked by a message from Claire, who is looking for a band. Sending her a post, I then got to this thread and notice that you've just beat me here, lol! :) I haven't hit that link you included in the above post, but will shortly. Meanwhile, here is my first thought on your post:

Well, think about it, Ragnar; Bush is just the front man. The real planner of 911 was Dick Cheney, as you'll see by the time you finish reading Ruppert's book. (And of course Cheney made those plans for the big boys who run the CFR.) However, Bush has his service to render to the NWO, and despite the fact that he would never be entrusted with the actual planning of 911, he was the guy who put Cheney into position so Cheney could do it. The White House press release of May 08, 2001, indicates that Bush put Cheney in charge of those wargame drills which Cheney was running on the morning of 911.

I'm gonna hush-up at this point, and finish a piece I've been working on for this thread since before the holidays. Also, I do have a new link to share with the thread, which I think I'll do now, in the next post below this one.  It's a doozy! :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on January 19, 2005, 03:11:15 am
Hey, Junker! Here's another one which I think you in particular will want to add to our collection. This is a long one, but it's chock full of names and historic value. This stuff just keeps getting more lucid and transparent the deeper we look into it. Can't wait to hear what you think about this article. :)

http://watch.pair.com/FreedomHouse.html#ips (http://watch.pair.com/FreedomHouse.html#ips)

From that article:

~

The Council on Foreign Relations is the U.S. branch of the Illuminati, its British counterpart being the Royal Institute of International Affairs. Both are outgrowths of the Round Table conceived by Cecil Rhodes for the establishment of a future world government dominated by Britain and the U.S. The CFR is composed of both right and left political persuasions, as noted by Joseph Kraft in Harper's Magazine:

[T]he Council [on Foreign Relations] plays a special part in helping to bridge the gap between the two parties, affording unofficially a measure of continuity when the guard changes in Washington. In theory at least, the Council comes close to being an organ of what C. Wright Mills has called the Power Elite -- a group of men, similar in interest and outlook, shaping events from INVULNERABLE positions behind the scenes...It has been called a government in exile. 1.

 This dichotomy is also mentioned by Michael Howard in The Occult Conspiracy:
Initially the CFR was regarded by its critics as an elitist, right-wing power group and it was even accused of helping finance Hitler's rise to power... Following the Second World war however, the CFR has been labeled a promoter of international socialism through the United Nations. Conspiracy theorists claim it was the CFR who supported Henry Wallace's plan to have the Illuminist symbol of the eye in the triangle on the one dollar note [1945]. The CFR's apparent contradictory political ideals are said to be typical of modern Illuminati front groups which allegedly use both right and left ideologies to further their cause which transcends conventional politics.
 
In the eyes of their opponents, the CFR is currently dedicated to destroying the sovereignty of the United States, reversing the democratic process which instigated the 1776 American Revolution, promoting internationalism and the foundation of a world super state embracing both capitalism and communism in a new political order. The evidence for this seems to be largely based on the neutral stance adopted by the CFR in American politics. It has recruited its membership from both the Democratic and Republican parties, and leading members of the CFR have included Adlai Stevenson, Robert and Edward Kennedy, Hubert Humphrey, John Foster Dulles, Robert McNamara, Henry Kissinger and Nelson Rockefeller. Several men who later became Presidents of the United States were CFR members earlier in their political careers such as Eisenhower, John Kennedy, Richard Nixon and Jimmy Carter. 2.

 Dr. Carroll Quigley, CFR member, college mentor of President Clinton and author of Tragedy and Hope, identified the Council on Foreign Relations as a joint venture of the private sector with the objective of controlling government:
... the powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences.
 In "The Shadow Government of the United States and The Decline of America," (11/94) Richard D. Eastman stated that CFR domination of the last three Administrations reveals 347 under Reagan, 382 under Bush, and 387 under Clinton (over 1 in 8 of their total membership).

The Occult Conspiracyalso described the Internationalist Bilderberg Group and the Trilateral Commission:

Both the Bilderbergs and the Trilateralists act as shadow governments promoting internationalist policies of European unity and world government. They act as a form of political Freemasonry offering world leaders and national insiders the chance to meet in secret to exchange information and discuss undisclosed social changes which can be put into practice in their respective countries. 3.
 The Trilateral Commission was created by David Rockefeller and CFR member Zbigniew Brezinski with the goal of economic linkage between Japan, Europe, and the United States, and: "...managing the world economy...a smooth and peaceful evolution of the global system." Brezenski, National Security Advisor to President Carter, CFR member and first Director of the Trilateral Commission wrote of a society controlled by a Power Elite in his 1970 book, Between Two Ages: America's Role in the Technetronic Era:
The technotronic era involves the gradual appearance of a more controlled society. Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen and maintain up-to-date complete files containing even the most personal information about the citizen. These files will be subject to instantaneous retrieval by the authorities.
 
Today we are again witnessing the emergence of transnational elites...[whose] ties cut across national boundaries... It is likely that before long the social elites of most of the more advanced countries will be highly internationalist or globalist in spirit and outlook....
 
Within a few years the rebels in the more advanced countries who today have the most visibility will be joined by a new generation making its claim to power in government and business... accepting as routine managerial processes current innovations such as planning-programming-budgeting systems (PPBS) ... A national information grid that will integrate existing electronic data banks is already being developed.... The projected world information grid, for which Japan, Western Europe, and the United States are most suited, could create the basis for a common educational program, for the adoption of common academic standards....
 
The nation-state is gradually yielding its sovereignty. ... In the economic-technological field, some international cooperation has already been achieved, but further progress will require greater American sacrifices. More intensive efforts to shape a new world monetary structure will have to be undertaken, with some consequent risk to the present relatively favorable American position.
 The previous report on Hudson Institute documented that the crafters of the Freedom from Religious Persecution Act (HR2431) are the very Power Elites who gave us GOALS 2000, the federal government's plan to radically restructure American education and society.

Knowing this and having Mr. Brezinski's assurance that said elites would be unrestrained by traditional values, we are not surprised that Hudson Institute is directed by members of the Council on Foreign Relations, Trilateral Commission and the Bilderberg Group:

Freedom House

According to We Hold These Truths, in 1996 Hudson Scholar, Michael Horowitz, teamed up with Nina Shea, head of the Freedom House Puebla Institute for Religious Freedom, to launch a high-priced campaign for promotion of the federal religious monitoring bill:

At least $2 million dollars was spent entertaining leaders of the Christian right in order to condition them to accept, and even demand, the... WOLF-SPECTER BILL, HR2431. This figure is the author's estimate of the Warmaker's investment, based upon a conservative guess of cost of the promotion detailed by Nina Shea in her book [IN THE LION'S DEN], more money than Trotsky carried in his brief case when he was shipped to Russia in 1917 to buy a government!

 Freedom House, which aspires to monitor democracy and human rights worldwide, presents itself as apolitical and humanitarian:
Non-partisan and broad-based, Freedom House is led by a Board of Trustees composed of leading Democrats, Republicans, and independents; business and labor leaders; former senior government officials; scholars; writers; and journalists.

Freedom House's Center for Religious Freedom, which was established in 1986 as the Puebla Institute, reports on the persecution of religious believers around the world and undertakes advocacy on their behalf. It is now at the forefront of the widely-publicized national campaign to defend those suffering severe oppression for their faith. The Center documents and publicizes the repression, torture, imprisonment, and exile of groups and individuals for religious reasons.

 Omitted is the fact (revealed by WHTT) that the founders of Freedom House also established the United Nations and that the Freedom House board is dominated by a majority of CFR members:
FREEDOM HOUSE was founded in 1943 by Wendell Wilkey (sic) and Eleanor Roosevelt to promote world government, and specifically for the creation of the United Nations, which was accomplished three years later. Nineteen members of the inter-nationalist COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS dominate its Board.
 Our own research identified twenty-five (25) CFR members on the board of Freedom House. Most are heavyweights in the international scene.

Freedom House Board of Trustees
Freedom House Free Cuba Center
National Forum Foundation

[NFF merged with Freedom House in 1997]

BOARD OF DIRECTORS

Bette Bao Lord, Chairman of the Board (CFR, Bilderberg)

(Husband Winston Lord was Chairman of CFR, Trilateral, Bilderberg, Skull & Bones)
 Max M. Kampelman, Chair Emeritus (CFR; Vice Pres., United States Institute of Peace)

Leo Cherne, Chair Emeritus (CFR, Founding member Hudson Institute, Founder International Rescue Committee [CIA conduit for neo-Bukharinite {fascist} operations]; B'nai B'rith)

Mark Palmer, Vice Chairman (CFR; President and CEO Television Development Partners, Inc.; U.S.Ambassador to Hungary from 1986-90; Deputy Assistant Secretary of State in 1982-86)

Kenneth L. Adelman, Secretary (CFR; Former Dir. U.S. Arms Control and Disarmament Agency; Nat. Editor, The Washingtonian)

Adrian Karatnycky, President (CFR, Publisher Freedom Review Publisher; Conservative author, American Spectator)

TRUSTEES

Morton Abramowitz (CFR; President of Carnegie Endowment for International Peace; former U.S. Ambassador to Turkey and Assistant Secretary of State for Intelligence and Research)

Zbigniew Brzezinski (CFR; First Director of Trilateral Commission/former National Security Adviser)

William C. Doherty, Jr. (CFR; President, American Institute for Free Labor Development)

Richard Gardner (CFR, TC, Former Ambassador to Spain, Italy, Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for International Organization Affairs under Presidents Kennedy and Johnson)

Theodore J. Forstmann (CFR, Director, International Rescue Committee, Director, Nelson Mandela Children's Fund)

Samuel P. Huntington (CFR, Formerly on National Security Council, Professor of Government, Harvard, Chairman, Olin Center for Strategic Studies. Author, The Third Wave: Democratization in the Late Twentieth Century, Clash Of Civilizations)

John T. Joyce (CFR, Pres. Bricklayers and Allied Craftworkers, Vice Chair, Center for National Policy)

Lane Kirkland (Former President of CFR, TC, Former Pres. AFL-CIO)

Jeanne J. Kirkpatrick (Former Director of CFR; Ambassador to UN; TC; Co-Director, Empower America; Board Member, American Spectator)

Morton Kondracke (CFR; Executive Editor, Roll Call; PBS TV McLaughlin Group Panelist)

Anthony Lake (CFR; Director, CIA/IPS)

Jay Mazur (CFR, TC; UNITE President-Elect; President, International Ladies' Garment Workers' Union; Vice President, Executive Council AFL-CIO.

John Norton Moore (CFR; Chairman, U.S. Institute for Peace)

Susan Kaufmann Purcell (CFR)

Richard Ravitch (CFR; Treasurer and Trustee, Twentieth Century Fund)

Peter Rodman (CFR; Senior Editor, National Review)

Wendell L. Wilkie II (Chairman of Board, Twentieth Century Fox) [Wendell Wilkie I was CFR and founder of Freedom House]

Jacques D. Wimpfheimer (CFR; Trustee Emeritus, Thoroughbred Breeders & Owners Assoc.)

Paul Wolfowitz (CFR, Bilderberg; Dean, Nitze School of Advanced International Studies (SAIS), Johns Hopkins University; Former Ambassador to Republic of Indonesia; Under Secretary of Defense for Policy, U.S. Department of Defense; Visiting Distinguished Fellow, National Defense University; Assistant Secretary of State for East Asian and Pacific Affairs; Director of Policy, U.S. Department of State)

Andrew Young (CFR, TC, Mason; Former civil rights leader; UN ambassador; President, National Council of Churches)

end excerpt

~

Wow. The above paste is just a teaser. You'll enjoy reading the whole thang at the link. I have saved that page in html on disc just in case it disappears off the net.  I suggest interested people also save links such as this one onto removeable discs.

And a note for Ragnar: Dude, I've got a new film clip of Dick Cheney addressing the CFR. On this film clip he talks about having been a Director at the CFR and speaks of how he kept that information from the citizenry of Wyoming during his last campaign there. Awesome clip!

Salute!
Elias


 
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on January 19, 2005, 05:38:51 am
Oooh yeah. Right on it.[/size]

(http://rlmcom.com/xr/yahsuh.jpg) I love conspiracies.[/size]

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on January 24, 2005, 05:50:42 am
Interesting article (http://www.lewrockwell.com/north/north340.html) at LewRockwell by Gary North that fits right into this thread with links to online books by Anthony Sutton.
Quote
His book on Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution, available free on-line, received no academic attention, nor did Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler, also available free on-line. He was the first historian to publish a detailed history of Skull & Bones, the Yale University secret society that has produced three presidents (Taft and the two Bushes). That book, too, went down the academic memory hole.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on January 24, 2005, 09:03:36 am
And the others too...

http://billstclair.com/blog/050123.html#north (http://billstclair.com/blog/050123.html#north)

# Gary North at LewRockwell.com - My Fellow Americans... - an interesting history lesson, in the light of yet another unremarkable inauguration speech. Includes links to a four books by Anthony Sutton that will likely illuminate some of the long history of criminal Amerikan presidents

(links are to free on-line copies):

Wall Street and FDR,
The Best Enemy Money Can Buy,
Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution, and
Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler.

And all four books tarred at all.tar (http://toddmontanye.com/all.tar) containing each book tarred & gzipped. For your convenience (740k).
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 02, 2005, 12:39:31 am
Quote
Forgive me if this has already been covered, but...
why the World Trade Center?  If it was a conspiracy by the government to carry out the attacks, or at least look the other way, why risk the one building in the world that is home to the main Federal Reserve where they keep all that gold?  Seems like an awful big and unnecessary risk if I were them.
penguines, I've thought quite a bit about your excellent question. I'm just writing to let you know that I am only about half-way through writing up my attempt to answer that question for you.  Your question has been hanging here for so long, I just figured I should let you know I was working on an answer for you.

Meanwhile, let's just note one other thing (among many) which was included in the WTC buildings which went down that day: a whole lot of damning Enron records. Of course, that is not the reason they did it, but it certainly did not hurt their coup when those records were destroyed. Anyway, soon as I can get an answer for you I'll bring it here. Thanks for a great question.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 02, 2005, 12:51:57 am
Updating this tired old thread just a bit here.  What I'm about to paste here may be too long for one text-box, so we'll see if I have to break it down or what.

I've been working on a lengthy version of this thread. It is like a process of discovery, provided by a pack of fireflies high on twinkies, darting about over stilled waters and lily-pads, errantly flying in a million directions all at once. So what I've done thus far is manage a rough outline, and I'd like to share part 5 with y'all to see if it makes any sense on its own. I'm wanting to see how well it might stand on its own. Y'all let me know if I'm crazy, okay? :)

As it starts with an allusion to "above", I note for you that that word denotes the preceding four parts which are not included here.

~

V: Two Holy Grail
 
Above, as Mike Ruppert was the first to exclaim, the "Holy Grail of 911" looks more and more like five separate War Game Drills which were being executed that morning under Dick Cheney's command, and the mainstream media's refusal to investigate or publish the related phenomena. That is one of the Holy Grail.
 
I think that another Holy Grail exists. I was clued-in about it simply by watching some of my favorite "conspiracy theory" tapes.  
 
On three different video cassette tapes I find various film clips of Larry Silverstein speaking before cameras making his now famous public speech about "Pulling Number Seven".  
 
Mr. Silverstein is somebody. He is the lease-holder for the World Trade Center. He is the man who made sure that the World Trade Center was insured. Larry Silverstein is the man who publicly declared why the heads of World Trade Center administration decided on 911 to *"Pull"* building No. 7.  He was involved in the decision to "Pull" building No. 7. That makes him somebody.
 
And in deed he is somebody, one Mr. Larry Silverstein leaseholder of the World Trade Center, somebody into whom we may wish to look more closely.  
 
His speech is now a matter of record. As I noted, there are clips of it on three different films of which I'm aware, three films which I possess, copies of three films which thousands of Americans also possess.
 
The building was "Pulled" around five-thirty p.m. on the afternoon of 911. There are a number of film clips showing the building going down. There are several different angles of perspective as different news crew cameras filmed the event from different positions. It was on television.  Millions of Americans saw it.
 
It went down so straight and perfect, with even the gracenote perfection of an implosion of the maintenance roof-top structure atop the building before the lower explosions would have reached it, going down in its own series of implosions as the roof-line of the building sank straight down to the earth below. It is an astonishing moment of American history. That exterior roof-top structure imploded into itself even as the building was imploding below it, but while the roofline was sinking though still intact. It's caught on tape, and it is being shown in homes all across America, and it is now a fact of American history.  
 
So let us look at something very curious regarding this "pulling" of building number 7 at the World Trade Center on the afternoon of 911. First, let us ask ourselves what might be involved in "pulling" a building. The building demolition industry speaks of taking down a building within the confines of other buildings which should not be damaged by the targeted building falling down sideways, as "pulling" a building. Since in downtowns all around the world we find buildings crowded closely together on each block, the fine art of "pulling" a building includes the ability to guarantee that neighboring buildings will not be damaged during the implosion of the targeted building. We can all see the logic in that.  
 
To "pull" a building, as Larry Silverstein stated it in his speech, several things must be done. First, someone who owns the building or the building lease-holder needs to sign the proper paperwork and get the proper City permits to have a building "pulled".  I mean, no one simply goes to a building and blows it in on itself, bringing it down precisely into a neatly controlled pile of rubble within its own original perimeters, without first talking to the government downtown. And building demolition companies have figured out long ago that they need various waivers and permissions and work orders and etc before they will accept a contract to "pull" a building. They do not want to be sued.  
 
On that point, let us return to the morning of 911 and notice that the first airplane hit the first tower just before 9:00 a.m., and the second hit some minutes later but before 10:00 a.m. We also note that no airplane hit building number 7, but as we all saw on tv for ourselves that day, building number 7 sustained some fires which were on-going for several hours. Those fires may have been started by falling and burning debris from the twin towers, which went down themselves about an hour after the first strike on the north tower. So the two towers began to fall before noon on 911, and it was during their fall that, presumably, the flying debris caused the fires inside building number 7 next door. After all, no jetliner had hit the building. Objects must have protruded into building number 7 from resultant debris flying hot from the attack-spots in the twin towers. Again: this is the government's story on the origin of the fires in building number 7, that shocks and concussions and flying debris pierced the building and caused several fires. The fires were heavily filmed, and are also a known fact of American history.
 
We must note at this point that since no jet hit building number 7, there was no pool of hot-burning jet fuel to create the intense heat which the government declares weakened the twin towers and caused their ultimate falling within themselves to earth. Building number 7 simply had some reactive fires on several floors, which we attribute to debris from the towers.  
 
So that would put the timing of Larry Silverstein's thinking processes as being shortly before noon when he began the consultative deliberations which led to the decision to "pull" building number 7. Why was Larry Silverstein involved in that pow-wow? Because he was the lease-holder for the entire World Trace Center's properties, the whole shooting match. He owned the lease on all seven buildings. He was responsible for the electronic security systems which protected the seven bulidings of the WTC. He was responsible for many things, including insuring those buildings. He was the man on the bottom line of the lease. The buildings were in his custody and keeping.  
 
We are going to look at the insurance for the WTC buildings. And we are going to look at the security company which was contracted to be responsible for the safe maintenance and functionality of the seven buildings, and we are going to look at who was on the board of that company, even if it turns out that that one of the recent owners of that security company is related by blood to President George W. Bush. Even if it is one of G.W. Bush's brothers. Which it is.
 
Here is why we're going to look into the security of the buildings: the very security company which would have done the electronic wiring for security purposes on all seven buildings would have had to have in their possession what? What? Of course! The blueprints, the plans, the stacked pages of engineer renderings of the infrastructures by which the buildings stood and functioned. This security company would have known every fire-retardant wall, every sprinkler system, every electrical outlet, every key steel beam, every characteristic of each of the seven WTC buildings. Surveillance cameras, communications systems, electronics, all sorts of very confidential knowledge was in that company's hands from the day that the company contracted to handle security for the WTC complex.  Correct me please if I'm wrong about this; but cannot we all agree that this is a reasonable situation to expect when a private company wins a bid to provide security for public buildings downtown in a major world/American city? At least that company is going to have the blueprints for each floor and the steel structural complex, the water supplies, the electronics, ventillation system, all piping, all walls, all the video gear, and more: all things which constitute the inter-building communications nerve center of a major engineered complex.  The World Trade Center.  Seven tall New York buildings including the twin towers. Quite a responsibility on the shoulders of whichever security company assumes it, and upon whichever insurance company insures it all.
 
So, if Larry Silverstein began discussing the pulling of building number 7 shortly before noon, or perhaps just after noon, with others with whom he would have conferred, (he said in his speech, "_we_ decided to pull it"), I'm guessing that one of the first things he needed to do after that decision had been made was to contact the people at whichever company was in charge of security, unless they were already there and involved in the decision-making process by which Silverstein committed to pulling building number 7. Why?

Because to "pull" a building, one must wire that building from the inside, floor by floor, fires or no fires, and one must attach to that elaborate network of wiring a series of bombs which would be affixed to key points on the steel infrastructure of the building. The wiring has to be designed floor by floor to accommodate the decided-upon locations of the appropriate steel beams onto which the bombs and detonators would be placed. Doing things like that are naturally a huge safety liability, because some human beings have to carry the explosives to each floor inside the building and place them; some human people have to physically put the bombs and explosives in each place required by an analysis of the building's internal infrastructure. And whoever is telling those people where to carry and place the bombs needs intel such as blueprints by which to create the wiring network, the bomb network, the detonator network, the tying-in together of all of those inter-relating points to a command and control operation which will finally push a button and "pull" the building.

(Note: I have been advised that I need to research "how" a building is set-up for demolition. It has just been brought to my attention that wire may now be replaced by some kind of electronic proxy such as transponders. I will leave the references to wires and wiring in this article until I get time to learn about that. EA)
 
I do not claim to know much about pulling buildings. But I can possibly guess that the blueprints would be vitally necessary to any company which would be contracted on short notice to pull a building. And I would guess that the property's security company would have an "emergency" set of blueprints. I'll accept corrections on this.
 
So let's see. Thus far, after the twin towers came down, Larry Silverstein met with other dignitaries and or partners, perhaps representatives from the property's insuror and the security company and the City of New York government, and "they" decided to "pull" building number 7. That meeting should have taken some minutes, and I confess that I have no idea how many minutes those giants conferred on the fate of building number 7 before reaching the decision to pull it. So let's just say that they spent *some* minutes around noon figuring out that they should pull the building.  
 
After that, they would have had to call some demolition company and offer them a deal that the demolition company could not refuse. "Come over here and pull this building for us, and do it today, do it quickly." Something like that, eh? After all, the building is known to have been brought down at about five thirty p.m. on 911. (5:32p.m.?) That means that from the time they decided to pull it, around noontime or thereabouts, only five and a half hours, at *most*, expired before the building came down.  
 
So let's look at that for a moment. Uhmm, first, let's see how tall was that building? What? Forty-seven stories tall? Check.  I am not at all sure, since I was not with Larry Silverstein that morning, but I doubt that the lease-holder of the WTC buildings kept on retainer and within premises a demolition company, which, if it is the case in truth, would mean that such a company would have to be contacted *after* the decision to pull the building.  Are you beginning to see where this is going? Silverstein therefore had to sell the idea of pulling a 47-story building, with some fires ongoing inside it, adjacent to the wreckage of the twin towers which had themselves fallen only hours earlier. 47 floors is a pretty sizeable building.
 
So let's see: decision made to pull building around noon; building security serice company was likely involved in the decision-making process with Larry Silverstein, or was called in immediately after that decision was made, so it would not have taken very long for security to show up with the blueprints of building number 7. But next, a demolition company had to have been called and a deal struck very quickly, and those blueprints had to be put into the hands of the company that Silverstein and pals hired to pull the building. Let's say that all that was done by one o'clock p.m., although we all know it would have taken longer than that. But even so we still have a window of "work time" of four and a half hours, max.  They had to work fast. They had to unload trucks, carry inside the incredible tonnage of explosives and necessary materials, locate from blueprints the correct columns and beams on each floor, then they had to place each of the demolition charges on the proper steel beams, then get all those demolition charges coordinated into a system of control and command, from where the button would be pushed to detonate each and every demolition charge placed carefully into the building. Then, and only then, would building number 7 implode into itself and go straight down, like the twin towers did, as we all saw on tv. Four and a half hours.  
 
To plant that many detonators and bombs into a forty-seven story building, wire them all together, and then get out of the building, cannot, in my understanding, be done in four and a half hours. In fact, I doubt it could be done in four and a half days. What do you think about this? Can we agree on this? Or do you wish to disagree with me? I'm open; correct me about this.

Okay, for the sake of being generous, let us say that the company which received the call from Silverstein's office around noon was close by and happened to have some men on duty and they jumped right on it.  Let's say that it took virtually no time at all for the demolition company's officers to read over the contract between the WTC lease-holder's office and themselves, sign the written order to pull the building, and that they sent in their men well before one o'clock p.m., and that those men just chanced to have the proper tonnage of explosives already loaded into trucks for fast delivery, and that they unloaded those trucks and took all those explosives and detonaters and wiring spools and tools and other gear into the building before two o'clock p.m., and began to work.  Amazing enough, but let's give Silverstein every benefit of the doubt, even if we have to stretch far to do so.
 
Question: If we grant all that, how *many* men do you think it would have taken to put carefully-placed detonators and bombs on key steel girders and beams on, say, the first floor? And the second floor? And the third floor? And all the way up to the, or near to the, top of the building, all forty-seven floors up?  But wait; it may be possible that they could do one floor and skip a few floors and then do another floor, then skip some more, then do another, and etc. and etc. Maybe they did not have to walk every floor, but were able to set the building up to implode as neatly as we all saw it do on television, by simply placing charges on a mere ten or twelve floors between the foundation and the top of the building. I'm willing to look at that possibility on Silverstein's behalf. Still...
 
How many men would be necessary to do that much work on that many floors in less than three and a half hours? My guess is that it would take several hundred men to do it at least, and even with that many people it would still be quite a task, because we not only have to think in terms of how "high" the building stood, but also we must consider how wide and how deep the building, (and therefore each floor), was. In other words, each floor of the building was extensive and was relative to various key steel beams which would have to be located from blueprints and then tapped and planted with bombs and detonators in an orderly manner so that the explosions could be orchestrated and sequentiated in the designed order of blasts. We know that all of this had to have been done, because we have all witnessed on our television screens the incredibly perfect manner in which building number 7 came down, and because Larry Silverstein said so. The demolition of building number 7 was covered live on national tv and we've all seen the footage from several different perspectives, from several different news-service cameras which had been placed in several different locations. The building came down perfectly straight, a demolition company's pride and joy. Whoever did it deserves a bonus.
 
Question: What company (or companies) was called to "pull" building number 7 at the World Trade Center on 911?  
 
Question: How many employees does that company maintain normally; and how many were on duty or otherwise available for work on that day, or were called to duty that day?
 
Question: Who are those employees? Where can we get a list of the employees used by the demolition company which pulled building number 7 on 911? How many employees were involved in the planting of the charges on all the key steel beams, in affixing the appropriate detonators? How many truck loads of ordnance and logistical supplies such as spools of wire, cable, tubing, and etc were involved in moving that much demolition capacity into the building?
 
Question: Where is the contract signed by Larry Silverstein or his proxy or by his insuror, or by his security company, that day for the purpose of commissioning a demolition company to pull building number 7? (We do understand that no company is going to dash into a building and bomb it to smitherines in downtown New York City without a contract strictly and specifically requesting such be done, right? There has to be a contract somewhere authorizing some demolition company from somewhere to "pull" building number 7.) Where is it? Did the Mayor of New York City also sign that contract? Who, in all, did sign that contract?  A legal contract would be dated. Where is it? I want to see it. So do you!
 
That contract, and the names of the employees of whichever company "pulled" building number 7, and all affixed City of New York papers such as might deal with the Fire Department and the Police Department and etc., and representatives of the insurance company, and representatives of the security company, and perhaps some FEMA and Secret Service and CIA and Pentagon  people, as well as some people from Dick Cheney's command hierarchy who would have been involved in his five high-tech "live-fly" pilotless drone-using military and national-security wargame "drills" that morning..... all of that and all of those people, plus a lot I've left out at this point.... would be wonderful to assemble into one place at one time. Publicly and transparently, with full news coverage and world-wide broadcasts. Oh, and as an add-on idea, what say we also collect up for that gathering one bashful but devoted Mr. Marvin P. Bush, the current President's youngest brother? He would be fun to talk with, and besides, on his account, there's this:
 
~

http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0204-06.htm (http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0204-06.htm)

Published on Tuesday, February 4, 2003 by the Prince George's Journal (Maryland)  
 
Bush-Linked Company Handled Security for the WTC, Dulles and United  
 
by Margie Burns
 
 
George W. Bush's brother was on the board of directors of a company providing electronic security for the World Trade Center, Dulles International Airport and United Airlines, according to public records. The company was backed by an investment firm, the Kuwait-American Corp., also linked for years to the Bush family.  
 
The security company, formerly named Securacom and now named Stratesec, is in Sterling, Va.. Its CEO, Barry McDaniel, said the company had a ``completion contract" to handle some of the security at the World Trade Center ``up to the day the buildings fell down."  
 
It also had a three-year contract to maintain electronic security systems at Dulles Airport, according to a Dulles contracting official. Securacom/Stratesec also handled some security for United Airlines in the 1990s, according to McDaniel, but it had been completed before his arriving on the board in 1998.  
 
McDaniel confirmed that the company has security contracts with the Department of Defense, including the U.S. Army, but did not detail the nature of the work, citing security concerns. It has an ongoing line with the General Services Administration - meaning that its bids for contracts are noncompetitive - and also did security work for the Los Alamos laboratory before 1998.  
 
Marvin P. Bush, the president's youngest brother, was a director at Stratesec from 1993 to fiscal year 2000. But the White House has not publicly disclosed Bush connections in any of its responses to 9/11, nor has it mentioned that another Bush-linked business had done security work for the facilities attacked.  
 
Marvin Bush joined Securacom when it was capitalized by the Kuwait-American Corporation, a private investment firm in D.C. that was the security company's major investor, sometimes holding a controlling interest. Marvin Bush has not responded to telephone calls and e-mails for comment.  
 
KuwAm has been linked to the Bush family financially since the Gulf War. One of its principals and a member of the Kuwaiti royal family, Mishal Yousef Saud al Sabah, served on the board of Stratesec.  
 
The managing director at KuwAm, Wirt D. Walker III, was also a principal at Stratesec, and Walker, Marvin Bush and al Sabah are listed in SEC filings as significant shareholders in both companies during that period.  
 
Marvin Bush's last year on the board at Stratesec coincided with his first year on the board of HCC Insurance, formerly Houston Casualty Co., one of the insurance carriers for the WTC. He left the HCC board in November 2002.  
 
But none of these connections has been looked at during the extensive investigations since 9/11. McDaniel says principals and other personnel at Stratesec have not been questioned or debriefed by the FBI or other investigators. Walker declined to answer the same question regarding KuwAm, referring to the public record.  
 
Walker is also chairman and CEO of Aviation General, a Tulsa, Okla.-based aviation company with two subsidiaries. SEC filings also show al Sabah as a principal and shareholder in Aviation General, which was recently delisted by the Nasdaq. Stratesec was delisted by the American Stock Exchange in October 2002.  
 
The suite in which Marvin Bush was annually re-elected, according to public records, is located in the Watergate in space leased to the Saudi government. The company now holds shareholder meetings in space leased by the Kuwaiti government there. The White House has not responded to various requests for comment.  
 
Speaking of the Watergate, Riggs National Bank, where Saudi Princess Al-Faisal had her ``Saudi money trail" bank account, has as one of its executives Jonathan Bush, an uncle of the president. The public has not learned whether Riggs - which services 95 percent of Washington's foreign embassies - will be turning over records relating to Saudi finance.  
 
Meanwhile, Bush has nominated William H. Donaldson to head the Securities and Exchange Commission. Donaldson, a longtime Bush family friend, was a Yale classmate of Jonathan Bush.  
 
On the very day of the tragic space shuttle crash, the government appointed an independent investigative panel, and rightly so. Why didn't it do the same on Sept. 12, 2001?  
 
 
Margie Burns, a teacher and writer, lives in Cheverly, Maryland.
 
http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0204-06.htm (http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0204-06.htm)

~
 
Well, that bit is fairly interesting. Yet another Bush family anomaly. Small world, eh?

Question: Could anyone possibly have arranged for and executed the "pulling" of WTC building number 7 in less than five and one half hours?

Question: Is it not coming clear to us all that the bombs were inside that building long before the planes hit the twin towers that morning?

Question: Do we dare speak aloud what this must mean?

 :ph34r:  Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 02, 2005, 03:10:54 am
As LL has googled about a bit and then pm'd me, I followed her lead and found this interesting article.

http://www.wtc7.net/pullit.html (http://www.wtc7.net/pullit.html)

From that link:

"Pulling" Building 7


A PBS documentary about the 9/11/01 attack, America Rebuilds, features an interview with the leaseholder of the destroyed WTC complex, Larry Silverstein. In it, the elderly developer makes the following statement:

"I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, "We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it." And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse."

This statement seems to suggest that the FDNY decided to demolish the building in accordance with Silverstein's suggestion, since the phrase "pull it" in this context apparently means to demolish the building. This interpretation is supported by a statement by a Ground Zero worker in the same documentary:

"... we're getting ready to pull the building six."

Building 6 was one of the badly damaged low-rise buildings in the WTC complex that had to be demolished as part of the cleanup operation.

An alternative interpretation of Silverstein's statement is that "pull it" refers to withdrawing firefighters from the building. However, according to FEMA's report there were no manual firefighting operations in Building 7, so there would not have been any firefighters to "pull".

That Silverstein would admit that officials intentionally demolished Building 7 is bizarre for a number of reasons. Silverstein Properties Inc. had already won an $861 million claim for the loss of the building in a terrorist incident. FEMA's report states that the cause of building's collapse was fires. Presumably FEMA and the insurance company would be interested in knowing if the building was instead demolished by the FDNY. Moreover, the logistics of rigging a skyscraper for demolition in the space of a few hours would be daunting to say the least, particularly given that demolition teams would have to work around fires and smoke.

A third explanation is less obvious but makes sense of the non-sequiturs in the above explanations: perhaps Silverstein's statement was calculated to confuse the issue of what actually happened to Building 7. By suggesting that it was demolished by the FDNY as a safety measure, it provides an alternative to the only logical explanation -- that it was rigged for demolition before the attack. The absurdity of the FDNY implementing a plan to "pull" Building 7 on the afternoon of 9/11/01 will escape most people, who neither grasp the technical complexity of engineering the controlled demolition of a skyscraper, nor its contradiction with FEMA's account of the collapse, nor the thorough illlegality of such an operation. Thus the idea that officials decided to "pull" Building 7 after the attack serves as a distraction from the inescapable logic that the building's demolition was planned in advance of the attack, and was therefore part of an inside job to destroy the entire WTC complex.

~

Also of interest, a glimpse into what might be required before, during and after the demolition of a building. Again, was there time to do this between noon and five-thirty-two p.m. on 911, with fires in the building and ground-zero gases, smokes, smogs, vapors, fumes, and other contaminants in the air?

http://www.osh.dol.govt.nz/order/catalogue/11.shtml (http://www.osh.dol.govt.nz/order/catalogue/11.shtml)

~
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ladylearning on February 02, 2005, 10:41:29 am
and then there's this:
http://www.rense.com/general47/pulled.htm (http://www.rense.com/general47/pulled.htm)

Quote
There's also disturbing correlations between the collapse of WTC 7 and the bombing of the Murrah building in Oklahoma City. Both buildings were constructed using the same bridge beam system that, in WTC 7's case, allegedly contributed to its demise. But more importantly WTC 7, like the Murrah building, housed high-level government offices including the FBI, CIA and the Secret Service. WTC 7 was also the storage facility for millions of files pertaining to active cases involving international drug dealing, organized crime, terrorism and money laundering.

elias, I know you have, somewhere, a compiled accounting of what was housed in building 7.  Might that not be an interesting addition to your post?

LL
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 02, 2005, 11:34:32 am
That show where the big man admits to pulling the tower was great.  Also great were the interviews with the surviving firemen recalling "boom, boom, boom" and eluded to a controlled demolition on the two main towers.  I beilieve the SS and FEMA as well as other agencies had "offices" in building 7.

Interesting
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 02, 2005, 12:59:02 pm
Well, LL, if I have such a list, it would be on my old hard-drive, which as you know I no longer possess. But in truth, I do not recall even having compiled such a list. (Of course, having no memory, I tend to believe you instead of me.)  What I do remember is a comment by Mike Ruppert in his "Truth and Lies of 911" film, in which he states that the Enron records, or much of them, were in the WTC.

It would be of huge interest to learn just what exactly was destroyed along with the WTC buildings. Perhaps I can persuade my three secretaries and my four good women to help dig up that information, ya think? :)

I've read that link you gave us above. Very interesting. I'd like confirmation from elsewhere that the building owners knew, prior to 911, that the buildings needed to be "de-constructed" and re-built. If that turns out to be true, then it would go far toward answering penguines' question about "why" the globalists chose to destroy their own symbolic properties. (That answer in itself is multi-faceted, of course. More on that laters.)

Thus far, as you've seen for yourself on Dave von Kleist's film, "911 In Plane Site", we know that there is no way a Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon. Now we also know that building 7 was imploded supposedly after a decision was reached on the day of 911, an act which could not have been facilitated or implemented in five and a half hours, which is what Mr. Silverstein would have us believe. And now we also know that Cheney was in charge of five wargame 'drills' being conducted on the morning of (and in conjunction with other events of) 911. We know that some of those "drills" involved inserting "fake hijacking blips" onto the radar screens at FAA and NORAD, and that at least one of those drills involved the use of ground-to-plane guidance systems (remote control) for directing pilotless aircraft. And we know that there was a mysterious flash just prior to impact as each of the planes hit the two twin towers. And we know that there was some tubular anomaly visible under the fuselage of flight 175, (or what we've been told was flight 175), which hit the south tower.

On the heels of this knowledge, we sadly must also note that since 911 the Cheney-Bush Junta has launched a world-wide war on terror and a police state here in America. Bush said: "You're either with us, or you're with the terrorists." He was speaking to the community of world governments as well as to individuals, to every nation-state on earth and to every individual on earth. The war on terror is now spread all over the globe. The objectives of P2OG shine brightly now as Iraq has been made the center for "insurgents" from throughout the Islamic world.

Then we also have the stigma, which won't go away, of the serious pack of lies from the Cheney-Bush Junta regarding excuses to invade Iraq.

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=164 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=164)

Then we have the incredible mountain of Ashcroft's handiwork over at the Department of Justice, the USA PATRIOT ACT of 2001; the Homeland Security Act of 2002; the Domestic Security Enhancement Act of 2003; the two VICTORY Acts of 2004; and the Intelligence Reform Act of 2005. Add to those the hidden horrors contained within the Model States Health Emergency Powers Act. All of these create the domestic police state. At the same time, the Cheney-Bush Junta's reinterpretation of the U.S. Constitution injects the U.S. military into the police state, (as we were told in advance by DARPA's first annual report, which gave us the new term "OOTW" -- Operations Other Than War -- which is a polite way of telling us that the U.S. military was preparing to police America internally), so we're now looking at the proverbial "military-police state".

None of that would have been possible without the existence of three things:

1) The 1993 World Trade Center bombing
2) The 1995 Oklahoma City bombing
3) 911

None of those three things would have been possible without the existence of three things:

1) The Federal Reserve Act of 1913
2) The National Security Act of 1947 (and its subsequent 1949 CIA Act)
3) The FEMA Act of 1979

Incidental to the logistics of it all are these focus points:

Collusion between the CIA and Wall Street and the American Shadow Government, (Continuity of Government); CIA drug-money laundering; CIA-directed foreign policy; a debt-based, fractional-reserve, Fiat Money system; Feducation throughout our educational system nationwide; the CFR, Trilateral Commission and the Bilderberger Group; domination of the national media; the Interstate Commerce clause; and widespread internal governmental corruption, to which we may refer as "greed".

Therefore, any chance we may have of undoing the iron-clad totalitarian corporate global dictatorship comes through the successful debunking of the official government stories regarding 'who' committed the acts of terror on U.S. soil. It is imperative that we establish the guilt of parties inside our own seats of government in order to stop this quest for global Empire and its twinned quest for a police state here in America.

So I ask any and every reader here: is it a waste of time to investigate the official government stories on these three so-called "terrorist events"? If it is finally shown conclusively that the government has lied to us, and that elements within our own damned government have used governmental powers and governmental secrecy to commit those three acts of terrorism on U.S. soil, can we say that it would be worth taking some time out of our busy lives to educate our neighbors about the truth of 911? Do any of us still think we're not involved in a mental war for our very lives?

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 02, 2005, 01:03:21 pm
Quote
That show where the big man admits to pulling the tower was great.  Also great were the interviews with the surviving firemen recalling "boom, boom, boom" and eluded to a controlled demolition on the two main towers.  I beilieve the SS and FEMA as well as other agencies had "offices" in building 7.

Interesting

The "big man" was Larry Silverstein.

There are numerous personal accounts on record by firemen and police on the scene at ground zero that day which substantiate explosions inside the towers; some witnesses used the words "detonators".

We do know that prior to 911 Mayor Guillani and the Feds had spent some extra millions of dollars fortifying the 23rd floor of building number 7.

On the 23rd floor was a command and control bunker in which operated the Secret Service and the CIA and FEMA and various security operations of New York City and the Port Authority, all of whom were subservient to Cheney's May 08, 2001 directive from Bush to run the wargames and do "exercises" in damage control.

It is my guess that the planes which were flown into the twin towers were directed there via Cheney's wargame drills from that 23rd floor CC&C bunker.

It is also my guess that the plane they had to shoot down in Pennsylvania was destined for building number 7; that when the plane was taken out of the exercise by two military missiles fired by a pilot from the "Happy Hooligans" squadron, was when Silverstein and pals knew they would have to demolish the building without any apparent cause, without it having been first struck by a plane;  it is my guess that building number 7 and both twin towers were loaded with bombs for demolition long before the morning of 911. It is also my guess that the command, control, and communications bunker on the 23rd floor of building number 7 contained the evidence of governmental complicity in directing the aircraft into the twin towers, and that it was planned long before-hand to be destroyed in the attacks.

 :ph34r:
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 02, 2005, 01:14:40 pm
Did you see that video of the firefighters?  There's other accounts of the twin towers pancaking after a series of what sounded like demolition explosions from them.  Thanks Elias for putting it into one thread and thanks to everyone else for consolidating it all.

Peace and Good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 02, 2005, 01:38:25 pm
Here's one about the police state I thought was kind of interesting.  Perhaps not quite a "conspiracy" but one might want to browse around.  Some texts from it include:
"Means, motive and opportunity: The military-industrial complex international coup d'etat is fully documented here. Read the case for the prosecution of the global crime syndicate which is taking away everything you've got. Here are some examples >>"

Find it here:
http://www.policestateplanning.com/ (http://www.policestateplanning.com/)

Includes roadmaps and everything, something else to ponder along with everything else.  There's also a free ebook to download.  It goes through the basics.

Peace and Good Day

PS, if you don't like pdf's this should get you the entire book "The Police State Roadmap" in html:
http://www.policestateplanning.com/id19.htm (http://www.policestateplanning.com/id19.htm)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 02, 2005, 08:40:55 pm
Quote
Did you see that video of the firefighters?  There's other accounts of the twin towers pancaking after a series of what sounded like demolition explosions from them.  Thanks Elias for putting it into one thread and thanks to everyone else for consolidating it all.

Peace and Good Day

Consider this: It took that "big man", Larry Silverstein,  just over a full year to make that announcement.

Glad you've seen those clips of the FDNY firemen talking excitedly about what they had just seen. Some really good clips are on "911 In Plane Site" by Dave von Kleist, as noted previously here. But there are others.

Anthony Hilder's film, "The Greatest Lie Ever Sold", has clips of the firefighters describing the demolition of the twin towers. One of them uses the word "detonators".  Another one says: "Boom boom boom boom boom; it started popping out floor by floor". This would be the clip you've seen.

Eric Hufschmid's film, "Painful Deceptions" has great film-clips of the twin towers going down and the explosions popping off on lower floors.

George Humphrey's film, "The Great Illusion", shows the towers going down also, and on his film you can see the explosion-bulges in the floors below the in-caving top of the buildings as they come down floor by floor, and the debris being exploded outward as the building crunched into itself floor by floor. No question about it, there were explosives going off inside the twin towers.

The cleanest film clip of building number 7 going down is at the end of Alex Jones' "Police State III". But various other shots are on some of the films I've just listed above.

What I've found is that each film-maker includes pieces of the puzzle, but not the whole collection of damning evidence, because it would take too long to see it all on one film I guess. However, I've got nearly two dozen different "conspiracy theory" films here and have watched them each numerous times, and I'm saying that the evidence is overwhelming once you get past the shock of what's on the films. There is a lot of available material out there which I have not been able to afford yet; many more films, books. Some of the featured clips are available online for those who have strong computer connects. This stuff is coming out all over the place! (That is a GOOD thing, lol!)

There are also printed and published statements by firefighters. There is a recorded statement by a firefighter saying he was going up inside one of the twin towers and was hearing "bombs going off". And there are a lot of other very incriminating incidentals. But the three main "smoking guns" are, imo, 1) the five war games going on that morning under Cheney's command, 2) the impossible demolition in five and a half hours of building number 7, and 3) von Kleist's film which shows clearly that no Boeing 757 could have hit the Pentagon. Those three very obvious and very-criminal lies issued to the world by the government are the smoking guns of 911; so far.  But there is much more, and it will be finding its way to this thread also.

In Mike Ruppert's book, "Crossing The Rubicon", the focus moves on to the white-washing and government coverup. He also takes a close inspection of Thomas Kean's "911 Commission" and blows holes in it broadside. Ruppert also gets into Cheney's motive. And he's done a fine job on portraying the individual backgrounds of each member of the 911 Commission, including into his portraits such things as previous business ties to criminals on the international scene and etc. The whole Kean 911 Commission is dirty as hell, full of compromised people who had conflicts of interest, each one of them except for Senator Max Cleland, who resigned in disgust and called the investigation a "whitewash" and other choice words.

But we're not in a big hurry here. Although this thread is somewhat longish, I've got two or three times this much stuff sitting around  here trying to get itself organized. My purpose includes taking this criminal syndicate all the way back to George Washington's Revolutionary Army and the war for our Independence from England, which was won militarily, but which was lost in the invisible workings behind the scenes of history. That old Tory Party plot to reclaim for Britain what Washington's army ripped in violence from the Throne is still with us today, is alive and well many generations after our Revolution. *That* is part of what I want documented through this thread, among other less-discussed matters.

So stick around, order yourself the films and books which have been and shall be mentioned on this thread, as you can, and continue to keep an eye on developments here. I've bitten off one of the biggest projects of my life in trying to put together a reasonable history of the conspiracy which stole America. As Alex Jones has said, "you couldn't write a science fiction novel this good!"

:)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 02, 2005, 08:56:30 pm
Elias,
If you wouldn't mind, I've started a thread about good videos to watch to get a good grasp on what's going on.  Everyone can give their ideas, but maybe you can just write some of the good ones you've seen there.  How does that sound.  I'm always hungry for more.  You know me :)

Peace and Good Day and I'm still eager to go over the act of 1947, and perhaps the new 911 bill along with the Homeland Security Act.

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on February 03, 2005, 02:30:11 pm
Thank you, UnstructuredAgain. Very good summary and intro to the whole system at your link:

http://www.policestateplanning.com/ (http://www.policestateplanning.com/)

It refs both:

http://www.infowars.com (http://www.infowars.com)
http://www.propagandamatrix.com (http://www.propagandamatrix.com)

as the sites for continued tracking and opposition.

In being able to read a fairly short run of the whole problem, it just reinforces my intent to drop that system out-- as little as I can of fiat money and corporate products while insulating myself from their predations. It makes gulching that much more needed and trading in my birth name and SSN for a host of free identities more enjoyable in anticipation than ever. Sometimes I have wonder that more people aren't jumping overboard. Oh well. Good luck, I guess to all.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on February 04, 2005, 05:16:48 am
Some Conspiratrivia from a book I am reading:

Aaron Burr's maternal grandparents were the famous anti-rationalist theologian, Jonathan Edwards, and Sarah Pierrepont, whose family intermarried with the (J.P.) Morgans...

Aaron Burr, Jr., was born in Newark, New Jersey, in 1756, His parents both died in his infancy, and the orphan boy was taken to live with family friends who were prominent merchants, the Shippens of Philadelphia. His step-sister in this household, Margaret "Peggy" Shippen, became the wife and instigator of Benedict Arnold.
...
Among those who must have taken an interest in [Burr] was the highest-ranking British military officer in New Jersey, James Mark Prevost.
...
The Prevost family in Geneva were hereditary members of the ruling council of 200. Abraham Prevost was principal of the University of Geneva during the American Revolution. In England and in Switzerland, the Prevosts were intermarried with the Mallets; the Mallet-Prevosts, who lived as a single extended family, will form the most important link in this story of assassins sent against America. And it was the Prevost family, as we shall see, who finally gave the orphan, Aaron Burr a home and identity.

[end of exerpt. More as intrigue (and time) dictates]
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 05, 2005, 07:45:23 pm
Got a minute? :)

~

I:
 
As we expect to be true of all politicians, even Vice Presidents, Mr. Dick Cheney has his two faces; one for the public and one for his private life. However, it is very rare for politicians, even Vice Presidents, to speak so candidly about using two faces as Mr. Cheney was filmed in a recent speech to the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), where he talked about the upcoming FTAA (Free Trade Agreement of the Americas).
 
~
Quoting Vice President Dick Cheney from C-Span coverage:
 
"It's good to be back at the Council on Foreign Relations; as Pete mentioned, I've been a member for a long time and was actually a Director for some period of time. I never mentioned that when I was campaigning for election back in Wyoming." ? Vice President Dick Cheney. In the audience: David Rockefeller. Source: C-Span
~
 
One would do well to ask why Mr. Cheney would seek to hide his past involvement with the CFR from his constituents in Wyoming, and then smilingly speak of that deception to an insiders' meeting at the CFR, in which was seated one David Rockefeller. Perhaps that is simply a political slip-up, a personality flaw, a slight error into which Mr. Cheney slipped while basking in the warm welcome at the CFR meeting at which he spoke. But the fact of his confession about keeping his CFR membership away from public scrutiny while campaigning in Wyoming is irreversibly saved for history on film by C-Span. His side-of-the-mouth smile as he spoke that confession is priceless.  It shows clearly that Mr. Cheney was aware that there are certain objections held in the minds of Wyoming citizens [and other Americans] regarding the CFR, and it also shows that he is cunning enough to hide something from the very public which he needed to support his bid for election.
 
I mention this observation about the two faces of politicians, and about Mr. Cheney's confession of deception to the CFR, for a greater reason. There is something else we may wish to ask ourselves about the deportment of Vice President Cheney. We might want to take a closer look at Mr. Cheney's actions on the morning of 911, and, more specifically, look at his comments immediately after the events of 911.  And most certainly we shall want to examine something about which Mr. Cheney has, to my knowledge, made no comment whatsoever. In fact, while we look at Vice President Cheney's actions immediately following the attacks of 911, let us note that a grave anomaly in Mr. Cheney's behavior continues unabated to this day, more than three years after the attacks of 911.  
 
I mean to ask why Mr. Cheney has never uttered any startled exclamation regarding the incredible 'coincidence' through which Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda allegedly picked that particular morning to hijack four commercial airliners and allegedly managed to fly three of them into architectural symbols of American power. Why did Mr. Cheney not say to Tim Russert in his first public appearance after 911 anything about what he had been doing on the morning of 911, or, and this is the real kicker, why did Mr. Cheney never exclaim, not even once, about the incredible, well-nigh impossible, stroke of luck in which Osama bin Laden allegedly had picked the very one morning in U.S. history on which the entire northeast air defense system would have been deliberately and effectively shut down via Dick Cheney's wargame "drills"? Could we not have expected Mr. Cheney to have at least exclaimed just once about this? I think so; yet Mr. Cheney has remained silent about this for over three years.
 
But why should we ask that question, you may wonder. Here's why.  Throughout the history of American military aviation there has been a constant effort to make sure that the airspace over our nation remained safe from air-borne threat. The American government created a most-amazing agency named NORAD (North American Air Defense system) to make sure that America was not ever attacked from our friendly skies by any enemy anywhere. Untold billions upon billions of dollars have been spent on that project and it has always been a deterrent; it has always worked; until the morning of 911. Most of us have asked ourselves "why" that defense system failed on the morning of 911. Now, three years afterward, and with absolutely no explanation by Mr. Cheney, we know why it failed.
 
What we do not know is why - why - Vice President Dick Cheney has never uttered one word about the failure of NORAD and the FAA and the U.S. Department of Defense on the morning of 911. The question is awful and it is pregnant with astonishing implications, as we shall see. Mr. Cheney, mute for over three years since that fateful morning, remains mute even as I write this. That, I suggest, is a problem for Mr. Cheney, now that you and I know more about what, exactly, Mr. Cheney was doing on the morning of September 11, 2001.
 
Now we know that Mr. Cheney was in charge of five separate national defense wargame "drills" which were being conducted during the morning hours of September 11, 2001.  Exactly what Mr. Cheney was doing was this: he was effectively shutting down the NEADS over this nation's Capital and over New York City. As fate would have it, those two geo-locations were precisely where an attack from the air occurred. The Pentagon was hit from the air, and the two Twin Towers of the WTC were hit from the air. And these "hits" were made possible by what Dick Cheney was up to in a Secret Service command and control and communications bunker on that awful morning. Mr. Cheney was running five wargame "drills", which effectively disabled NORAD, the FAA, the Pentagon, and other institutions involveing national security.
 
Five separate wargame "drills"-- think about that for a moment.  
 
Now, after we let that news sink in for a moment, let's think about this: Mr. Cheney has not published one peep about being in charge of those five wargame "drills" on the morning of 911.  
 
That one fact bears some serious and grave news, and it should be meditated upon most seriously by every American. It is the one thing which made the hijackings possible, and made the air-to-building "hits" a certainty. And the man who was in charge of all that has had nothing to say to America regarding his role in the events of 911.
 
We were told, much later, and not very loudly, that there was *one* wargame drill being conducted that morning. But we have not been told, until Michael C. Ruppert published his damning and amazing book, "Crossing The Rubicon: The Fall of the American Empire at the End of the Age of Oil". (1), by our government that those five wargame "drills" were happening as the commercial jetliners were hijacked and driven into buildings. Not even the whitewashing 911 Commission under Thomas Kean bothered to mention those five drills, despite the fact that those drills were the reason the entire northeast air defense system had been disabled.  
 
Mr. Cheney has not seen fit to announce that untidy fact to the American people for more than three years since that fateful morning. It is not difficult for anyone to imagine that, were he in Mr. Cheney's shoes and running five wargame drills which had to shut down the air defenses over this nation's most vital areas on the morning of 911, that he would immediately have made an exclamation in horror and shock about the amazing, even impossible, coincidence by which four airliners were hijacked and, in Mike Ruppert's term for it, "piggy-backed" upon those wargame drills. Had it been me, I would have uttered instantly my stunning shock over seeing what had happened, that anyone would have possibly picked *that time* to attack America by air. Wouldn't you have done the same? In fact, could you have *not* made such an exclamation?  
 
But it gets worse. When we look at what was involved in those drills, we may be surprised and shocked to our wits' very limit.
 
You see, on that morning, Cheney's five wargame drills effectively disabled the entire northeast coast's air defense system, (NEADS ? Northeast Air Defense System), exposing the nation's heart, its capital and its war-center, the Pentagon, and the financial center, the World Trade Center's skyscrapers, to attack. And somehow, we are to now believe, Osama bin Laden just picked that date out of his turban in plenty of time to arrange for the hijackings to coincide with the one moment in American history in which the NEADS was effectively disabled by the Vice President's wargames.  
 
Let us pause just one more time now to think about that....
 
On the morning of 911 the entire east coast air defense system had been effectively shut down, and bin Laden had been the luckiest terrorist in the history of the world in picking that very morning to attack.  
 
See any problems in this knowledge? This is absolutely staggering, and is pregnant with grave and serious questions which demand answers.
 
We now know that it is true. Or do we? We are told by our government that al Qaeda, under Osama bin Laden's leadership, attacked us on 911. That part of it is now under question. The part of the government's story that we do feel is true is that *somebody* attacked us on the morning of 911.  We can all agree that we were attacked, but now, with absolutely no thanks to the Vice President, there arises serious doubt about "who" attacked us on that most-damned morning or mornings.
 
~
 
II:
 
But let us not move in haste here. Let us consider this matter from the given government explanation for 911, like any loyal American citizen might, and like any loyal American has been instructed to do by our concerned government. Let us, as reasonable women and men, try to believe what the government has said.  
 
Let us believe, tentatively at least, that Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda attacked us on 911; that Osama used the infrastructure of his world-wide al Qaeda network to coordinate an ambitious and grandiose mass hijacking and turn four planes into missiles; that the hijackers overpowered the secruity of each plane as small groups of terrorists with box cutters; that the training which the hijackers had received at multiple secure government air-training facilities including the Naval Air Sation at Pennsacola, Florida, had enabled those hijackers to not only overtake the pilot's cabin and physically overpower the crew while passengers looked on, but to then take control over the flight of each plane, turn off each plane's transponder, and pilot three of those planes into the Pentagon and World Trade Center Towers, losing only the fourth hijacked airplane, which was shot down over Pennslyvania.
 
If we give the government the benefit of the doubt, however, and assume tentatively that al Qaeda and bin Laden attacked us, of course the first question would be, "why"? For in asking "why?" we approach the genesis of Osama's motive. Every great crime has a motive; by great crime we mean any crime which requires extensive planning, logistics oversight, structural sequencing, training and practice-runs or "drills", a system for personnel discipline and for orders, expert and timely execution, versatile and adequate communications, an entact chain of command, and other similar characteristic elements of any major crime.
 
Osama must have truly inspired the nineteen hijackers, we shall think at first. When considering what personal "motive" each of the 19 hijackers held, we may only guess. But before we complete our musings on the motivation of Osama, the al Qaeda, and the chosen hijackers, let me please note aside that the hijackers had been likely sent to flight schools and the US Military's language school at Monterey, California, where they were students receiving training from US government and government-recognized private facilities, and were told that they may be called upon to hijack commercial airliners ?- but perhaps, just perhaps, those hijackers in training may have been denied the truer intent of mastermind Osama bad Laden. Of course this is sheer speculation, admittedly, but it could be that neither of them became aware throughout the months or years of training and preparations that their missions would be suicidal for themselves. We may wish to keep that possibility in mind as we review the possibilities, for as we shall see, it is now highly questionable whether the "hijackers" piloted those airplanes into buildings.  
 
So we are told by our government that the nineteen terrorists, al Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden did 911, and that they did it because they hate us and want us dead. It's global Jihad against the Infidels, and this time "we're" the Infidels, at least in al Qaeda's view. Remember, there can be no glorious deaths unless there is an Infidel enemy or its equivalent. They hate us because we're free and because we send over the Internet our great stores of pornography, credit-card debt, statist propaganda, decadence of any and all sorts, and bum money deals. They hate us because we keep a greedy hand in their oil fields. (How did our oil get under their sand!?) Pretty frightening stuff, on the surface of it. In fact, this touted philosophy being given Americans by the Federal government, this "widely-perceived direct external threat" as Zbigniew Brzezinski has called it, has frightened America right out of her mind, literally.  
 
Because of the attacks of 911, America has blythely rolled over and offered her government the license to oppress her founding document and her Bill of Rights with the USA PATRIOT ACT of 2001, the Homeland Security Act of 2002, the Domestic Security Enhancement Act of 2003, the VICTORY Acts of 2004. and the just-passed (2004) "Intelligence bill".  All the while, there are massive Executive Orders, many of which are classified as "top secret" under "National Security", which stand now in readiness for the complete takeover by a militarized government operating through FEMA's and the NSA's secret government powers and funded by the Black Budget which was created in the National Security Act of 1947 and the subsequent CIA Act of 1949.  
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=283 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=283)
 
from that link:
 
"At the time of the attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon in September 2001 according to the Government Accounting Office (GAO), Pentagon had incurred $3.4 trillion of "undocumentable transactions," that is to say that there were $3.4 trillion worth of financial transactions for which there was no discernible purpose. The day before the attack, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld warned that the lack of control over its budget was a greater danger to the national security of the United States than terrorism. After the attacks, the government stopped publicly disclosing information about "undocumentable transactions".  
 
"The problem is not restricted to the Pentagon but affects the entire spectrum of government agencies and departments from the Bureau of Indian Affairs to the Defense Department. For a number of years the GAO has compiled a parallel set of books for the Federal Government called the Financial Report of the United States. This report attempts to impose "Generally Accepted Accounting Principles" to the government's financial reporting process in order to give a clearer picture of the government's actual assets and liabilities and thereby enable better planning. Neither the Pentagon nor the Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD), to name just two, have ever been able to pass a GAO audit on this basis.  
 
end excerpt from above link on the Black Budget by Catherine Austin Fitts and Chris Sanders
 
~
The Executive Orders I just mentioned above are signed into law by Presidents. Among the secret ones are FEMA directives and NSA directives and Pentagon directives as well as directives to most major Federal agencies, such as the Department of Education, the Department of Housing and Urban Development, the Department of Transportation, the FCC, the FDA, and etc. HUD, for example, has been tasked by FEMA to commence studies for the realignment of neighborhoods of major cities so that teachers will live in one part of town, garbage collectors in another, factory workers in another section of town, executives and administrators in another, law enforcement personnel in another, and etc and etc.  
 
Here are some examples of Executive Orders, graciously given to us by George Humphrey's pamphlet entitled, "Uncommon Sense: Your Choice: The Blue Pill or the Red Pill", pages 20 and 21:
 
"With the War Powers Proclamation, Roosevelt and all following Presidents have been issuing numerous Executive Orders [EOs]. EOs are ordinances written by the President of his staff that become the de facto law of the land. There is no public debate, the House and the Senate are totally left out of the proceedings, and the Constitutional process is nothing but a memory.
 
"Some of the more dangerous EOs to our personal freedoms are:  
EO 10995, the right to seize all media outlets in the U.S.
EO 10998, the right to seize all agricultural resources and food supplies, both public and private;
EO 10999, the right to seize all personal automobiles and trucks;  
EO 11004, the right to seize your home, designate areas "unsafe" and relocate citizens;
EO 11501, gives FEMA the right to take complete authorization to enact the above orders and more in times of international tension or financial crisis."
 
end excerpt from George Humphrey's "Uncommon Sense". Booklet available here:
 
Common Sense / George Humphrey
P.O. Box 5772
Austin, TX, 78763-5772
 
~
 
Those Executive Orders mandate government takeover of all communications, all travel, all transportation, all manufacturing, all schooling, all housing, all food distribution and many other areas of interest,  under a state of martial law which will be reinforced by curfews and your local militarized police-soldiers, and of course the troops of the Department of Homeland Security, which shall in large part be drafted, as plans are revealed in the defeated US House of Representative draft bill.
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=263&mode=mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)
 
http://www.congress.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?...z?d108:HR00163: (http://www.congress.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:HR00163:)

http://www.congress.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?...z?d108:SN00089: (http://www.congress.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:SN00089:)

From intro to those twin bills:

 H.R.163
Title: To provide for the common defense by requiring that all young persons in the United States, including women, perform a period of military service or a period of civilian service in furtherance of the national defense and homeland security, and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Rep Rangel, Charles B. [NY-15] (introduced 1/7/2003)      Cosponsors (14)
Related Bills: S.89
Latest Major Action: 10/5/2004 Failed of passage/not agreed to in House. Status: On motion to suspend the rules and pass the bill Failed by the Yeas and Nays: (2/3 required): 2 - 402 (Roll no. 494).

~
 
Internal passports and bio-metric ID is coming right around the next bend.  The foundations for those are in the new Intelligence bill which has been passed and signed into law. The studies are done, the science has been industrialized and readied, the public preparation and programming has been reasonably completed, or at least is visibly established and underway as we speak, especially since 911 and the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing and the 1993 WTC bombing. Americans are motivated to resist the terrorists, the Jihadists, the fanatical Arab or Islamic or Muslim, and we are also programmed and conditioned to expect our government to handle that for us, with our fullest support both financially and allegiantly. Heil, BUSH!
 
So Americans dash about in their horseless chariots at great speeds, spending, hedging, insuring, paying all along their way, reporting to the time-clock dutifully and deducting large portions of their earnings under threat of IRS force. As, and America tightens her belt and girds for the coming lean times, the coming hard times, the willful sacrifice of American liberties and freedoms, American dignity as it were, to a governmental oppression which they hope shall suffice for their defense.... their defense against Osama bin Laden and the al Qaeda and a gang of suicide-mad extremists which were created by the CIA.  
 
(That is part of what few American citizens today know, thanks to the media's black-out on the subject. Only those of us who have already gotten out of our "right minds" can seem to see it. I'll admit that had I not already been out of my mind prior to seeing this, it would have certainly knocked me out of my mind at first sight. The CIA created al Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden is a known CIA asset. Some of his staff were trained here in America. He himself was trained by the CIA. But I digress and also get ahead of myself here. Forgive please. We shall get to all that, but first, let's get back to the subject.)
 
After that question, we would want to know everything about how it came to be that Osama managed somehow to know "when" the entire east coast's air defense systems would be shut down or disabled. To look at that, and see it clearly, we in part may wish to note that here we had a great will on the part of Osama to pick a date on which to attack the Pentagon and New York City. The operation was planned for years; if not totally from its inception, at least through the natural evolution of preparatory measures taken over a period of years.  The FBI admits that it followed a number of the hijackers for years prior to 911, "surveilling" them.  
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=280 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=280)
 
For instance, it required that some among the nineteen hijackers take flight lessons at US installations. We'll see later here another view on why that was an integral part of the plan, but for the moment let us realize that at least a number of months, and generally more than one year of attendance and performance, may have been required of the hijacker students at those training facilities. So we know that the attacks were at least planned some months, and likely years, before delivery on 911. I would think that the final date was not planned years prior to the attacks, but the general plan to train hijackers for flight was several years old, as we see in Patrick B. Briley's report to the 911 Commission, linked above. Osama is said to be behind that, and I think he was, though I've yet to have a chance to exchange emails with Osama and therefore do not really know much except by conjecture.  But that may be merely an interesting "aside" to the greater matter of what actually happened on the morning of 911.
 
But it seems to me that if Osama is the undisputed leader of the al Qaeda, which is another item our government insists that we believe, then he would be in control over launching major terror events. As we're given to see about Osama, he takes delight in doing just that. He's the real boogy-man, the worst criminal in human history, rivaled only by Hitler. Isn't that the take on Osama that our government is pushing? Isn't that why suddenly the Intelligence community and the Pentagon and the Justice Department are miraculously mobilized and quantumly expanding? The government statements sound something like this: "This Osama dude is bad news, Jake and Jane! Give us more funding, more powers over your lives, give up more of your liberties and freedoms and 'rights', and we'll protect you better; and by the way, we're real sorry about Waco, and Ruby Ridge, and Oklahoma City, and the '93 WTC, and 911. We were just under-staffed, and we didn't have good communication skills between governmental agencies; so give us more power, greater concentration of those powers, centralized databases which can be shared all across the government's spectrum, tighter laws, greater reach into the American citizen's life, his home, his finances, his family, his bookstore and library habits, his credit history, his medical history, his general autonomy and freedom as an American; give us all that, and a national ID card system, such as uniform Federal regulations on the States' drivers' licenses, and we'll do much better in protecting you."  
 
I think that is a classic template for what used to be called in oppressed city neighborhoods and business districts, "a protection racket".  
 
But of course there are no elements within our government which would consciously attempt such a thing as I'm herein hinting, right? Of course not. As noted previously, we're looking at this question right now from an objective and tentative perspective which the government gives us as fact. We are trying to believe the official government version of 911. We will look at opposing views later.
 
So let us continue without so much sarcasm. Let us recall that the government understands, and acts upon the understanding, that Osama is the head of al Qaeda and is the most dangerous terrorist to ever haunt the hillsides of far away lands. Osama did 911. Thus spake the White House, the CIA, the FBI, the State Department, the Pentagon, the Department of Justice, and all their echoing and rippling extensions outward, including CNN, CBS, NBC, Fox News, ABC et al, into the Wall Street community, the banking community, the congressional bodies, the supreme court, the hybrid agencies like the NSC and USAID and DARPA and National Reconnaisance Office, ad infinitum, all merging together in the secret and silent chambers of the CFR and the Trilateral Commission, the media heads, the metals manipulators, the devils of diplomacy, the bread-and-circus smoke-and-mirrors disseminations and dispersions of the hierarchy of power and power's metaphoric translation: a government taken silently, from within, in less than two hundred years.  
 
How did bin Laden know that his plan could work on that particular morning? We would ask that question because it is simply unbelievable to think that Osama's timing, or anyone's timing, could be that lucky. So, if Osama chanced to *know* that that particular morning was the proper window of time in which to pull off four hijackings, *how* did he know it unless someone involved with it told him? That is one pretty good question.
 
We really do not want to believe that he somehow had broken the Secret Service's and CIA's top secret super-incrypted special codes, right? I mean, even a bearded millionaire living in caves, with paid super-hacker  computer-crunching Islamo-geeks by the dozens and unlimited expense accounts could not crack *that* code. Never, ever. But of course, *they* could crack his codes, and did. Or so we're told by our government and its obedient media.  
 
Of course, we have not established that inside the mind of Osama bin Laden existed the certain knowledge that Cheney's wargame "drills" would shut down, as in "totally disable",  American air defenses that morning. And of course, anyone who has ever won a national lottery will readily admit that sometimes the long-shot does pay off, can pay off. It is possible that bin Laden did not know that the morning of 911 would be his best-ever window of opportunity to launch four hijackings. But whatever we each may think on other matters, we'll all agree I'm sure that if he chose that date and time without advance knowledge of Cheney's games, we'll have to truly say that he is the luckiest terrorist in the history of the world. 911 was the one morning in America's history which was so configured as to provide success for multiple airliner hijackings; and it was all because of those five wargame "drills" which Cheney was running on the morning of 911. Osama's good luck was Cheney's bad luck. Quaint, eh?
 
But for the moment, let us leave luck out of this.
 
That one question right there, that Osama sent his men to do the deed based on more than a lucky pick of his operation's target date and time, would indicate that at best, at the very most imaginable and dream-worthy best, there was at least one al Qaeda spy inside Cheney's command and control center.  
 
That one hypothetical spy, if he did exist, would have had to know about the exercises, and what those exercises would entail, well before the morning of 911, so as to give the info to Osama ahead of time, so that Osama would have the time necessary to gather his alleged 19 hijackers at boarding terminals for their respective flights.  Since the 19 alleged hijackers would have had to come from various parts of the country, at least a bit of prior knowledge would certainly have been given to Osama.  And *that* info would have had to come from someone on the "inside", someone who knew about the five wargames under Cheney's control. That would, of course, be someone who was involved in the wargame "drills". It would have to be one of Cheney's people.  
 
So a new question would then need to be asked, and that is, "Who, inside Cheney's command and control system, had Osama bin Laden's phone number?"  
 
Who worked for Cheney that morning, and during the months which preceded that morning, and also had inside ties to al Qaeda? Of course, the question is important only if Osama actually knew about those wargames prior to their execution on the morning of 911. But we have to admit that it sorta looks like he did. I doubt Osama built his terror empire while counting on luck, for after all, Osama bin Laden was trained and empowered and even financed by the CIA. And that belief of mine, that belief in Osama's grand and organized and nation-intimidating powers, is exactly what my government wants me to believe about Osama bin Laden. The official government "story" on 911 requires us to believe that Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda literally had the power to commandeer four commercial airliners and fly them toward pre-arranged targets. So I am following the government's suggestion by believing it, if only to give the government's story a chance to become believable. Osama is some sort of devilish Diva of Destruction, and we need the Patriot Acts and the National Security police state to protect us from his world-wide and terrible threat. See? I believe.
 
But now I'm going to admit that pursuing that question is likely to be a grand waste of our time. That sort of reasoning, based on a question which has no logical premise, is exactly what governmental apologists shall soon be telling the public through the media. Watch and see, and remember, you heard it first here, and when you heard it first here, you also heard *why* it is a shill, a "dis-information" project of the CIA. When I recently spoke of these matters on the radio in Bozeman, Montana, immediately after my call into the talk-radio show came another call into the show by a man who assured the listening audience that perhaps some "traitor" was inside the Pentagon or the White House, and that that traitor had sneaked the info to Osama bin Laden. I knew at that time that a Fedgov agent was monitoring the show, and that his call was to make sure that everyone listening that day knew that it did not have to be Dick Cheney who had orchestrated the events of 911, in spite of everything I had just spoken over the air.
 
~
 
III:
 
The reason I am not interested in that question is two-fold. First, we already know that the FBI and CIA and other Federal agencies had been following (surveilling) some of those hijackers and al Qaeda cells for years before 911, and that one of the planners of 911 had been under FBI surveillance since before 1993, and that he was known to have been involved in the 1993 WTC bombing, but was not taken off the street, and that he was also known by the FBI to be involved in the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing, but was not taken off the street. A busy guy, he was also, we lately learn, involved in the planning of 911. The FBI finally took him off the street in 2003, in a move which I'd guess was to keep him from speaking with the press and/or Congressional committees. His name is Ali Mohammed. (Refer to the link above on Patrick B. Briley's report to the 911 Commission)
 
There are other interesting things about Mr. Ali Mohammed. For one thing, the man was at one time a member in the Green Berets. Yes, I mean the US Army's Special Forces. He got a bunch of training with the Special Forces, paid for by your and my tax dollars. But that is not all. He also was a CIA asset, having taken pay from both the FBI and the CIA during his years of insanity as an undercover double-agent whom the FBI was "surveilling" for more than ten years before 911 and all along, right up through 911. The FBI and the CIA had at times even transported the guy, all the better to "surveill" the man. At Field Agent levels, the FBI "knew" that this man was involved in previous terror events on US soil, and their superiors in FBI's administration prevented them from shutting down the terrorist cells they had been surveilling. (See Sibel Edmonds' letter to the 911 Commission)  
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=282 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=282)
 
That has been FBI policy, as Patrick B. Briley notes, and it has been presented to the Kean 911 Commission, formally, prior to the Commission's conclusion. It was not mentioned in the Commission's published report. But there is more. Much more.
 
Another thing about Mr. Ali Mohammed: He was involved in the writing of the CIA's infamous "Manual for Jihad", which the CIA used to train the anti-Russian guerrillas in those Afghan guerrilla-training camps which Clinton later nuked with Monica missiles. Those would be the same guerrilla training camps which CIA paid Saudi Bin Laden Construction company [Osama's father's business) to build in Afghanistan in the early 1980s, while teaching their black-sheep son, Osama, how to beat the Ruskies. The anti-Russian Afghani-CIA secret guerrilla army became the great tool of Osama bin Laden, their consensus leader-of-sorts. CIA paid Saudi Bin Laden Construction company to build the training camps, and in those camps the CIA taught Osama's troops, and Osama himself, the art of Jihad ?- from the CIA's own manual, written in part by one of their double-agents operating inside the United States on behalf of the al Qaeda and the CIA at one and the same time, Ali Mohammed.  
 
We, the American taxpayer, blew a pretty penny on that silliness, and the Saudi bin Ladens profited as one of their sons rose to high power as a CIA asset being used against the Russians. Later, in nuking the training camps with Monica missiles, Clinton thusly dispersed yet more of your and my tax dollars whilst violating international law and the sovereign borders of Afghanistan and the Sudan. Millions of tax dollars. I cannot imagine why the press has not mentioned this with emphasis, although I must commend them for overlooking, and thereby permitting to be published after all, a handful of reporters' stories which do corroborate the facts. I am guessing they can't control all the journalists all the time; some things do manage to get published before they can be censored; the ghost of JP Morgan has to be rolling over in his grave.  
 
But the point is: Ali Mohammed helped write the Jihad training manual which CIA used to teach the fine arts of guerrilla warfare to about thirty-thousand of Osama's buddies in Afghanistan. At that time, Osama was what is called a "CIA Asset". That's part of your American history which will likely be skipped over lightly once today's history books are written for the government's public schools.  
 
So Mr. Ali Mohammed is quite a guy, but now he's in the pokey under careful government guard. That is something about which we may all be thankful, I'm sure! However, before 911, Mr. Mohammed was not in prison, but instead was being "surveilled" by the FBI and the CIA, and at that time, (since the FBI was surveilling him because of his al Qaeda terrorist ties, of course), Mr. Mohammed may well have had Mr. bin Laden's phone number. Maybe even his mailing address. And here's the catch: if FBI and CIA were "surveilling" a number of al Qaeda operatives and "cells" here in the United States, for years, of course the heads of the FBI and CIA would likely know something about those "surveillance" operations, shouldn't we presume?  
 
And since it is known that once the Russians had pulled out of Afghanistan the CIA moved outside of those guerrilla training camps and waited in the shadows to see who would move into them and put them back into the business; I would put forward the notion that the same CIA which had trained the al Qaeda membership would have countless al Qaeda contacts within the hills of Afghanistan. I do not know this to be true, but it seems likely to me that many al Qaeda operatives in Afghanistan and Pakistan would have been, and yet still are, under surveillance by the CIA, because for years the CIA trained them, helped transport them, helped secure their financing, and gave them their marching orders against the Russians. That could explain the government's story about our having broken one of Osama's secret codes.
 
So another question should be quickly asked and then filed away for future reference, and that question is: "Who does the head of the CIA talk to?" Answer: The President of the United States of America, among others. In the "among others" category, we can certainly include Vice President Dick Cheney.
 
From former CIA analyst Ray McGovern we learn that Dick Cheney made numerous visits to Langley, Virginia prior to the US invasion of Iraq, and that during those visits Cheney actually went into the analysis rooms amid the raw data, a trick which McGovern says he'd never seen before, never in 27 years of serving as a CIA analyst under seven Presidents. Cheney was the only Vice President who has ever sat in on CIA analysis sessions where the raw data was analyzed.  
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=208 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=208)
 
I mention that because part of our answer to several very serious questions is that the CIA and Dick Cheney have a fairly open relationship, with known avenues for privileged communication back and forth. So someone in FBI and/or CIA who knew about Osama's grand plan - and who knew about the wargame "drills" -  managed somehow to obscure the line in America's sand. Very secretly, very clandestinely, in a very deadly way, and with precision accuracy and skill. And the one central nexus point between Osama bin Laden and the US Intelligence community which monitored al Qaeda here at home and abroad and the events of 911 was none other than Vice President Dick Cheney.  
 
~
 
IV:
 
So, bringing us back full circle to where we were prior to my digression, we're talking about how Osama bin Laden could have known to pick the one morning in which America's most-treasured edifices would be defenseless, exposed, vulnerable, and we're wondering who worked for Cheney so closely as to have been able to get that information to al Qaeda and/or bin Laden.  
 
But what we should be asking is not whether someone on the inside leaked the info to Osama, but whether Osama even knew that the air defense system would be effectively disabled that morning. That is a better question. Did Osama even know? Would he have had to know? If the FBI was overseeing the hijackers as they trained in supposedly-secure U.S. military air bases and related air-training centers, and if the landlord of the three hijackers at the Pensacola facility was an FBI informant/double-agent, could not someone who *did* know about the five wargame "drills" to be executed that morning have given the hijackers a fake command from bin Laden, ordering them to their respective flights on the morning of 911, without bin Laden even knowing it? To ponder that question, it is helpful to recall the current rendition of the movie, "The Manchurian Candidate", and if you've not seen that movie, do so quickly.
 
Did Cheney think Osama had a "need to know"? If there was a mastermind of the attacks of 911, and if he knew that Osama had been deceived into allowing 19 of his terrorists to train for multiple hijackings but did not know that those airliners which his men would hijack would be commandeered by remote control from Secret Service command and control bunkers on the morning of 911, would he find it necessary to lay out his complete plan to Osama? Of course not, and that is why the hapless hijackers, even after they had commandeered the four airliners, had no idea that they were going to fly them into the Twin Towers and the Pentagon. (Or to wherever those planes may have been disposed. Be aware that evidence now indicates that those airliners may not have been the planes which struck the twin towers and the Pentagon that morning. We'll get to that below.)  
 
Same as the hijackers' motivational training in Jihad, which overlooked telling them that the airplanes they were to hijack would subsequently be taken over by ground controls coming from Cheney's Secret Service/ CIA command, control, and communications bunker with its over-riding communications system which was planting fake hijacking "blips" on the FAA's and NORAD's radar screens that morning, Osama may not have had any perceived "need to know" that the wargame drills would have taken down the east coast air defenses. So someone inside Cheney's command hierarchy once again made maximum use of Osama bin Laden as an asset of certain elements within the U.S. government. We may imagine that 'someone' to be inside, or peripheral to: the CIA, the agency which created al Qaeda and trained Osama and brought him to power, and the agency which CFR-member Dick Cheney has a close working relationship.
 
My guess is that Osama bin Laden did not even know what Cheney was up to with the five separate wargame "drills". My guess is that Cheney did not think Osama needed to know that little detail. My guess is that Cheney did know that Osama would like to hijack airliners. My guess is that Cheney knew just how to use Osama's al Qaeda, its willing terrorists who were functioning here in America under FBI surveillance.  
 
A really far-reaching question may concern just what was going on with those five "drills". I think we should look at that next.
 
If so, then I must invite you to also join Michael C. Ruppert, for it was from Michael C. Ruppert's new book that I learned of these five wargames, and who was in command of them. The name of the book is: "Crossing The Rubicon: The Decline Of The American Empire At The End Of The Age Of Oil". You may buy the book at his website, if you've not already got your copy. I'd suggest you get a copy quickly, because they're going fast. No American who cares to know the fuller truth of 911 can afford to miss this book, in my opinion.
 
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/store/index.shtml (http://www.fromthewilderness.com/store/index.shtml)
 
In the book, we find the following quoted phrases from a May 08, 2001 address by the Honorable George Walker Bush, President of the United States of America:
 
Cheney to Oversee Domestic Counterintelligence Efforts
President announces nwew homeland defense initiative
President Bush May 8 directed Vice President Dick Cheney to coordinate development of US government initiatives to combat terrorist attacks on the United States... - White House Press Release, May 8, 2001
 
"Therefore, I have asked Vice President Cheney to oversee the development of a coordinated national effort so that we may do the very best possible job of protecting our people from catastrophic harm. I have also asked Joe Allbaugh, the Director of the Federal Emergency Management Agency, to create an Office of National Preparedness. This office will be responsible for implementing the results of those parts of the national effort overseen by Vice President Cheney that deal with consequence management. Specifically it will coordinate all federal programs dealing with weapons of mass destruction consequence management within the Departments of Defense, Health and Human Services, Justice, and Energy, the Environmental Protection Agency, and other federal agencies..." Official Statement of President George W. Bush, May 8, 2001
Office of the Press Secretary, The White House (page 333 of "Crossing The Rubicon" by Michael C. Ruppert [1])
 
 
In the book we learn the names of the five wargame "drills" which were under Dick Cheney's command and control on the morning of 911. Let's look at them as Mr. Ruppert describes them for us:
 
1) OPERATION NORTHERN VIGILANCE
2) BIOWARFARE EXERCISE TRIPOD II
3) OPERATION VIGILANT GUARDIAN
4) OPERATION NORTHERN GUARDIAN
5) OPERATION VIGILANT WARRIOR
 
According to Ruppert, Vigilant Guardian was referred to or named in news stories including Aviation Week, Newhouse News Service, and two official websites. He says that a NJ.com newstory reported this: "Investigators at the September 11 commission confirm they are investigating whether NORAD's attention was drawn in one direction - toward the North Pole - while the hijackings came from an entirely different dirction."
 
Reading further, on page 338 we learn that "Vigilant Warrior was specifically mentioned by former White House counter-terrorism advisor Richard Clarke in his 2004 bestseller 'Against All Enemies'. At the beginning of the book Clarke describes a series of conversations with key officials that occurred after the second tower had been hit as he chaired the White House's Crisis Strategy Group (CSG) during the first minutes of the attacks."  
 
*begin excerpt:
 
"[FAA Administrator] Jane [Garvey] where's Norm?" I asked. They were frantically looking for Norman Mineta, the Secretary of Transportation, and, like me, a rare holdover from the Clinton administration. At first FAA could not find him. "Well, Jane, can you order aircraft down? We're going to have to clear the airspace around Washington and New York."
"We may have to do a lot more than that, Dick. I already put a hold on all take-offs and landings in New York and Washington, but we have reports of eleven aircraft off course of out of communications, maybe jijacked."
I turned to the radar screen. "JCS, JCS, I assume NORAD has scrambled fighters and AWACS. How many? Where?"
"Not a pretty picture Dick." Dick Myers, himself a fighter pilot, knew that the days when we had scores of fighters on strip alert had ended with the cold war. "We are in the middle of Vigilant Warrior, a NORAD exercise, but ... Otis has launched two birds toward New York. Langley [Air Force Base] is trying to get two up now..."
It was now 9:28[a.m.]
 
*end excerpt from page 338 in Crossing The Rubicon. On page 339 we read this excerpt:
 
"But if Clarke's account is accurate, the name was confirmed directly to him by the acting chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. Military exercises are often linked and according to several sources, when names are partially shared during simultaneous exercises this indicates a connection between them.  The juxtaposition of the words "Guardian" and "Warrior" suggest opposing forces in a wargame exercise with one side playing the aggressor and another side playing the defender.
 
"The fact that Jane Garvey indicated that as many as 11 aircraft were out of radio contact or off course was the most startling revelation. Was it an indication that one or more of them could be connected with the war games?
 
"Northern Vigilance was an exercise being conducted on September 11th as reported only by Canada's Toronto Star in a story dated December 9, 2001. The story had a great deal to say about how 911 unfolded.
 
begin quote from Toronto Star article as found on page 339 in Crossing The Rubicon:
 
"Northern Vigilance, planned months in advance, involves deploying fighter jets to locations in Alaska and northern Canada. Part of the exercise is pure simulation, but part is real world. NORAD is keeping a close eye on the Russians, who have dispatched long-range bombers to their own high north on a similar exercise...
"The Federal Aviation Administration has evidence of a hijacking and is asking for NORAD support. This is not part of the exercise.  
"In a flash, Operation Northern Vigilance is called off. Any simulated information, what's known as an 'inject' is purged from the screens...
"Lots of other reports were starting to come in," [Major General Rick] Findley [Director of NORAD operations] recalls. "And now you're not too sure. If they're that clever to co-ordinate that kind of attack, what else is taking place across North America?"...
 
end excerpt from Toronto Star article of December 9, 2001.
 
Ruppert then continues: "The reference to 'injects' was chilling. No other mainstream press (especially in the US) had mentioned that false radar blips had been inserted onto radar screens on September 11th. But on whose screens? Where? A major anomaly in official 9/11 accounts had been officially ignored."
 
According to Mike Ruppert, operation "Vigilant Guardian was a jijacking drill, not a Cold War exercise." He adds in his book that General Arnold was quoted by ABC news as saying: "The first thing that went through my mind [after receiving the highjacking alert for Flight 11] was, *is this part of the exercise? Is this some kind of screw-up?"* [emphasis added]
 
~
 
Suddenly, we're looking at something so significant that it threatens to undo the whole government story about what was done to us on 911.  You see, had these wargame "drills" not been in process on the morning of 911, there would have been no attacks on America which succeeded, for the NORAD, FAA, and Pentagon's normal defense systems would have activated as a matter of standard procedure.
 
But Cheney has never, not once to my knowledge, offered any amazed exclamation about Osama's incredibly lucky sense of timing in choosing the morning of 911 to launch his attacks upon us. Has the CFR-controlled media said anything to you about this? Have you heard Cheney talk of this? Have you heard Bush the Younger mention it? Has anyone heard Ms Rice speak of it? How about Rumsfeld? Powell? Tenet? Wolfowitz? Libby? Mayor Guilani? While we are asking this question, let us, as an aside, also ask 'where' Condoleeza Rice chanced to be on the morning of 911. Was she with Dick Cheney in the Secret Service command and control and communications bunker?
 
Actually, as we find to our consternation, none of the Bush Administration's chieftains have made any squawk about that at all. One of the most glaring and obvious "coincidences" of all time has been completely  overlooked by our fearless leadership as well as by the media. But the leadership has of course had much to say about everything else under the sun. They have had much to say about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, and Iran's nuclear wishlist, and North Korea's muscle-building moans and groans, and the staggering, overnight-blooming of some mysterious international "axis" of terror which is out to get us all - because we're free.  
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=164 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=164)
 
The Cheney-Bush Junta has had much to say about why we must accept a batch of Ashcroft-engineered totalitarian legislations which successfully shred our Constitution and our Bill of Rights, and why we *need* a Department of Homeland Security. They have said why we need to allow illegal immigrants work jobs here and pay into Social Security while they're at it. They have said much about why we needed to invade Afghanistan and Iraq, and about why we have no interest in invading Saudi Arabia where most of the hijackers came from. They have said much about the Model States Emergency Health Powers Act, which will give the government the right to force every citizen in America to take whichever vaccinations the Fedgov declares we must, and the Psychiatric testing for all American school children, and many other related items of interest, such as the military's latest bend in our road to the future, "OOTW": "Operations Other Than War". (That means "keeping the peace", such as we all saw at Waco, inside U.S. borders, no matter what the Posse Comitatus Act of 1887 might say to the contrary.)
 
They've said much about many things, but they have not said anything about Osama's luck on the morning of 911. Nor has the mainstream media uttered any notation of the supreme luck which was involved in Osama's picking that morning for his attacks.  
 
Condeleeza Rice made a comment just after the attacks. She said that, and here I'm paraphrasing, "we have information which leads us to believe that Osama bin Laden did these attacks, and that information will be forthcoming soon".  She said that over three years ago. She still has not brought it forth. To date, not one shred of "proof" or "information" has been brought forward by our dutiful government which would indicate that Osama bin Laden executed the attacks of 911. It's been three years since she said that. But let's pass over that trivial detail in quest of larger game.

~

Okay; that is the first four sections and the fifth section has already been posted here, I think on the previous page, and it deals with the implosion, the controlled demolition of building number 7, which is what I refer to as "larger game" in my closing comment above. Thank you all for reading. More laters...

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Delos on February 05, 2005, 09:42:33 pm

Kickass thread!

Salutes to the General!

One thing is for sure. When the control freaks declare martial law and all their other fucked up nazi shit, this guy will not go down without a fight.

Any speculation on what kind of manufactured bullshiat "terrorist attack" they are concocting for their big push?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Ralph the Ganger on February 05, 2005, 10:56:15 pm
You jokers are lost. Who here has heard of Oil for Food? Before long you will all have heard of Oil for Food. In fact you might give Food for Oil before it is all over. You guys are all pussies here on the haire and nails files I am shocked. I did not realize that the USA that I Love is so full of wannebe WARRIORS. Here is some conspiracy for you and bear with me this will take awhile, and I am sure I will take some shots but that is ok, haire and nails is very passified and pc. Lets start here. The legacy of Maurice Strong

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: August 24, 2002
1:00 a.m. Eastern


By Joan Veon
© 2002 WorldNetDaily.com


JOHANNESBURG, South Africa – Ten years ago, as I was reading a very small article in the Washington Post on the Rio Earth Summit, I laughed and told my husband, "Those crazy environmentalists who don't know their right foot from their left foot are having this huge meeting in Rio and it won't go anywhere."

On their own, their movement would never amount to a hill of beans. However, given the environmental mandate of "The Report from Iron Mountain," a secret report commissioned by the Kennedy administration in 1961 to find political and economic alternatives for a time in which the world would have no more wars, I was very naive and wrong.

Maurice Strong who was the secretary-general of the 1972 and 1992 environmental conferences made the following comments 10 years ago at the closing meeting:

Nothing less than the future of our planet as the home for our species and others has been the object of our work. The world will not be the same after this conference. The prospects for our Earth cannot, must not, be the same. We came here to alter those prospects and change to a more promising and sustainable future.

Each of the conventions on climate change and biodiversity has been signed by more than 150 nations. "Agenda 21" still stands as the most comprehensive, most far-reaching and if implemented, the most effective program of international action. It is not a final and complete action program, but one, which must continue to evolve.

On finance – we are a long way from meeting the needs for "Agenda 21." We have established a new global partnership. We should consider new taxes, user charges, emission permits, citizen funding – all based on the polluter-pays principle.

Using what has been put in place in the last 10 years and the current program of action let me update you with his legacy.

The earth is not the same. We have been turned upside down and inside out. The reordering of God's balance for earth and the demotion of man to being equal to a plant or animal is the first understanding. You and I are no longer valued the same as we were when God's rules reigned in the hearts of government. We are now a species, or a class, instead of a human as in being, soul, individual, person or creature. We are more expendable now and, as you will see, can be herded like cows.

With regard to climate change – which basically says cows, human and plants give off too much carbon dioxide or greenhouse gases – it maintains that pollution and the burning of forests and coal must be reduced. Because we all share the atmosphere, climate warming became the "first global problem" that individual firms and countries could not solve on their own. The major transnational corporations have been working on a scheme of trading carbon permits as a way for us to transfer part of our carbon to lesser-developed countries that have less pollution.

At a World Bank Conference on sustainable development several years ago, when economist Joseph Stiglitz presented this concept, I asked him if he was basically "bringing a new company public or a stock to market" in creating this permit-trading system. He answered, "Yes," and with a very large grin said, "And we will do very well!" Within the last year, a carbon-trading market was established in Chicago.

Interestingly enough, Maurice Strong is one of its directors. Furthermore, it has been suggested that if the price of energy went up, it would encourage people to change to more efficient technologies, thus reducing carbon in the air. Can you imagine the profit insiders and interested parties would make on another oil embargo, let alone the money they will make bartering the carbon trading permits?

"Agenda 21" is now the earth's new gospel. I believe that in the future it just may replace "The Communist Manifesto." Ever read it? Your children are being taught it in their elementary schools through college. Furthermore there are high school environmental clubs that are being taught how to protest.

The follow-up to "Agenda 21" is being put forth at this summit. It calls for a number of actions – specifically in the areas of biodiversity, health, energy, water and agriculture. The more than 150 action items create a web of control, management and expense that will bring unbelievable hardship for each of us. Furthermore, "Agenda 21" is changing and evolving. These geniuses are learning by trial and error. You and I and all of God's Creation have become a global laboratory.

Because the kings, princes, presidents and prime ministers agreed to "Agenda 21," they need money to implement it. And with this summit, they even need more money. There are numerous proposals on the table which include establishing a world solidarity fund to eradicate poverty, "[significant] increases in the flow of foreign direct investment to developing countries," and "develop ways of generating new public and private innovative sources of finance through the use of special drawing rights for development purposes through the IMF."

Those agreed to include: "adopt and implement polices and measures aimed at promoting sustainable patterns of production and consumption applying the polluter-pays principle and internationally agreed development goals will require significant increases in the flow of financial resources [including through new and additional financial resources] in particular to developing countries."

Currently the countries of the world give about 0.3 percent of GNP to developing countries. At the March Financing for Development Conference, a number of countries committed more money toward the ideal goal of 0.7 percent of GNP goal for Overseas Development Assistance. This is not enough. Now the World Bank estimates that they will need double the amount annually to meet the Millennium Summit Development Goals incorporated into the program of action.

Here in Johannesburg, the masters of the universe have upped the ante. They have proposed "0.15 to 0.20 percent of GNP of developed countries to least developed countries" in addition to the current goal of 0.7 percent of GNP for developing countries! When is enough enough?

The world is not the same. We have been hijacked by a group of rogue kings, princes, presidents and prime ministers – not to mention corporate CEOs, insiders and international bankers. "Agenda 21" basically pits the proletariat against the serfs. The more I hear, the more I read, I believe that making the 21st century sustainable is nothing more than a time of 21st-century "feudalism." This is Maurice Strong's legacy to us.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Joan Veon is a certified financial planner and is president of Veon Financial Services, Inc., an investment advisory firm. Visit her website, WomensGroup.org.





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Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 06, 2005, 01:48:40 am
You jokers are lost. Who here has heard of Oil for Food? Before long you will all have heard of Oil for Food. In fact you might give Food for Oil before it is all over. You guys are all pussies here on the haire and nails files I am shocked. I did not realize that the USA that I Love is so full of wannebe WARRIORS. Here is some conspiracy for you and bear with me this will take awhile, and I am sure I will take some shots but that is ok, haire and nails is very passified and pc. Lets start here. The legacy of Maurice Strong


Jokers?  the fact that you woud write such a statemeetn would suggest the joker.  Please come again.   I don't think you knwo it yet but think deepy and you'll see the joker within yourself.

Peac and good Day
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 06, 2005, 03:00:25 am
Quote
You jokers are lost. Who here has heard of Oil for Food? Before long you will all have heard of Oil for Food. In fact you might give Food for Oil before it is all over. You guys are all pussies here on the haire and nails files I am shocked. I did not realize that the USA that I Love is so full of wannebe WARRIORS. Here is some conspiracy for you and bear with me this will take awhile, and I am sure I will take some shots but that is ok, haire and nails is very passified and pc. Lets start here. The legacy of Maurice Strong

----------------------------------------------
Wow, Dude. You calling me a pussy? I'd prefer you said "wuss" or something less vernacular. It's not my way of being politically correct, it's a matter of taste about the words I use in mixed company. Can you honor that request? Thanks.
 
So you come in here all prancing and dancing at the paltry, shallow consciousness you find here and you feel compelled to give us a hand up. You want to inspire us to be "WARRIORS".  
 
Maybe I've got some news for you.
 
Had you bothered to read this thread before you popped off with your pronouncements of my mental inadequacies, you'd have already known that this thread has advanced far past the level of interaction on which the Strong story below focuses. Strong works for higher "Houses". World Bank? IMF? Dang, Mon! Joan Veon failed to note for WND readers that the Federal Reserve System, Inc., owns controlling interest in both.  Were you aware of that? It's embedded somewhere in this thread, for those who prefer to educate themselves about whichever topics they wish to judge. Strong and his ilk work for someone, just as the Cheney-Bush Junta, the World Court, the WTO, any number of NGOs like the Rockefeller Foundation and others do, and it is that someone I'm after with this thread. If you were to peek real closely into the contents of this thread, and follow provided links, you'd see that I've got a copy of the Stiglitz - Greg Palast interview. I'm telling you that it goes deeper than Stiglitz and the level on which he played. I'm of course very appreciative of the fact that Stiglitz fessed up to Palast publicly. That was huge for "our side", to be sure.  But the IMF/World Bank is but one of their tools, an instrument, a global infrastructure implementing the New World Order. If you want to see how they ride atop a pyramid of international banking just scroll down this old article to the links for development banks and then note the date on which I posted that article, after which you can come back here and apologize for calling me a pussy, okay?
 
http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...order=0&thold=0 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=68&mode=mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)
 
I really would suggest that you read the entire thread before making judgements. Follow the links and spend some time reading; there's more hidden in this thread than meets the casual eye. For instance, you should already know that we've covered in part the Report From Iron Mountain quite some time back.

http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.ph...article&sid=295 (http://www.thementalmilitia.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=295)
 
Now about The Claire Files being "pc". The owner of these boards is a nice lady who does a lot of wonderful things for liberty-minded people, including running Claire Wolfe's website. She has got archived at her site a bunch of Claire's older articles which were published at WND. I unsubscribed from WND quite some time ago, preferring Strike The Root, this place, TMM and all our friends who run sites and blogs. WND is a bit behind on their perspectives regarding the source of our problems in today's world.  I'm not knocking it, just saying that there are sharper, more poignant sources. As I am with the LP, however, I'm favorably-disposed about WND because I think it addresses a certain segment or level within mainstream American cultures, and that can only be a good thing; but WND has culled a lot of the sting they used to publish before they narrowed their intended readership. (That's my personal opinion only.) WND is much more "pc" than The Claire Files, imo. But the main reason we keep things to polite levels of interaction here is the simple fact that Debra is a lady, Claire is a lady, and lots of other wonderful women here are also ladies, and they're all ladies of liberty in their own individual ways, and it suits me to see that their ladyhood remains honored.  
 
If I'm a bit too tame for you, you'll enjoy investing your time over at Strike The Root or Antiwar dot com. We're more of the Lew Rockwell / Ron Paul / middle-class traditional American philosophical sorts, having mostly all already swam upstream of the excitements of discovering that there is a problem in American governance today. "WARRIORS"? Here? We ain't into doing illegal things here, and making WAR is against most of our members' principles, so we tend to restrict our activities to what *is* legal: that is: the honing of our mentalities and fighting the Mechanism with our minds instead of getting our asses bloodied in the streets. How was it that you see yourself as a "WARRIOR"?
 
I ain't knocking you. I'm just sayin' that there is a place for everyone, and if you're not impressed with the levels of consciousness here, well, why are you here? Personally, I kinda like the noise that goes on in this place, so I stick around. If you don't like our way of thinking and seeing things, why stick around? There are much more exciting sites. Of course, they're still just "sites", so there's no war going on with them either, just words and pics and such. Maybe if you want to do what "WARRIORS" do, you'll back away from that keypad and get out in the streets, or something. :)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on February 07, 2005, 12:47:36 am
Quote
You jokers are lost. Who here has heard of Oil for Food? Before long you will all have heard of Oil for Food.
Not that this troll deserves a response, he has been answered pretty well by others in this thread. Off topic - isn't it obvious that he is a warrior by the ganger in his name? He is so my hero - a gang banger (when I was a sprout, gang banger had a very different meaning).

And, as has been noted, he obviously didn't read anything here or he would have known that we had all heard of Oil for Food. I wonder what the point was there about Oil for Food.

Anyway, here (http://www.fff.org/comment/com0502d.asp) is what Jacob Hornberger had to say about oil for food. Food for thought. Oil for food for thought. Oil for thought. Aaagghgghghghgh  stop me.

Quote
...
Pardon me for asking what might be uncomfortable questions, but why are the “waste, fraud, and abuse” under both regimes in Iraq — the Saddam regime and the U.S. government regime — not equally corrupt? Why aren’t U.S. neoconservatives as outraged and upset over the disappearance of large sums of money under the control of U.S. officials as they are with those under Saddam? Isn’t corruption corruption?
...
Moreover, when Saddam did disarm in the early 1990s and when it became clear that the use of sanctions to achieve “regime change” had failed, U.S. officials and UN officials should have immediately lifted the sanctions that were continuing to squeeze the life out of Iraqi children rather than implement a socialist oil-for-food program that placed U.S. government trust and oil-for-food money in the hands of someone everyone knew was a brutal and untrustworthy dictator.

The truth, albeit painful, is that all the hullabalooh about the “waste, fraud, and abuse” in the infamous oil-for-food program is nothing more than a smokescreen to avoid focusing on the moral culpability for the massive number of deaths of the Iraqi children arising out of the brutal sanctions that the U.S. government and the UN enforced against the Iraqi people for more than 10 years and the horrible “blowback” arising from a brutal and morally corrupt U.S. foreign policy.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 09, 2005, 08:01:51 pm
This one starts off a bit slowly, but contains some most-interesting data for our conspiracy theory, especially about the part which notes that Flight 77 (a Boeing 757) never struck the Pentagon. I've seen a couple of these photos elsewhere, and think they're legit. Y'all may want to check this one out for yourselves.....

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Repor...205schwarz.html (http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/020205Schwarz/020205schwarz.html)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: CandyColored on February 09, 2005, 09:20:12 pm
I can't figure that one out, all the tapes are "gone".
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on February 09, 2005, 11:01:43 pm
Here (http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard67.html)'s some interesting perspective from Murray Rothbard that was posted at LRC.
Quote
(Hmmm. Another sudden death that replaced a Rockefeller person with a Morgan man?!)
I never noticed that connection before reading Rothbard's article.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 10, 2005, 12:12:29 am
Candy, have you seen any of the footage?  Do you believe they "pulled" buildings 7 1 and 2?   Just curious since we never talked about it.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on February 10, 2005, 05:36:14 pm
Talked to a fellow today, a colleague, who has a relative living very close to the 9/11 crash site in Shanksville, PA.

His relative says that a memorial center has been built there, but that visitors are confined to the building.

As for the actual crash site, it is still, 3 years and 5 months later, being guarded 24-7 by armed police (sheriff's deputies, my friend thought).  No one is allowed to approach the quarry where the plane allegedly went down.

I wonder why.   :angry:  :ph34r:  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 10, 2005, 09:51:31 pm
Quote
Some Conspiratrivia from a book I am reading:

Aaron Burr's maternal grandparents were the famous anti-rationalist theologian, Jonathan Edwards, and Sarah Pierrepont, whose family intermarried with the (J.P.) Morgans...

Aaron Burr, Jr., was born in Newark, New Jersey, in 1756, His parents both died in his infancy, and the orphan boy was taken to live with family friends who were prominent merchants, the Shippens of Philadelphia. His step-sister in this household, Margaret "Peggy" Shippen, became the wife and instigator of Benedict Arnold.
...
Among those who must have taken an interest in [Burr] was the highest-ranking British military officer in New Jersey, James Mark Prevost.
...
The Prevost family in Geneva were hereditary members of the ruling council of 200. Abraham Prevost was principal of the University of Geneva during the American Revolution. In England and in Switzerland, the Prevosts were intermarried with the Mallets; the Mallet-Prevosts, who lived as a single extended family, will form the most important link in this story of assassins sent against America. And it was the Prevost family, as we shall see, who finally gave the orphan, Aaron Burr a home and identity.

[end of exerpt. More as intrigue (and time) dictates]
Excellent find, Ragnar! Excellent indeed! :)

I was aware of the Shippens connection with Benedict Arnold, as it's given in Gore Vidal's book, "Burr", which I'm currently reading in snatches and spells as I can. Great book.  All this history holds the secrets which I long to see unravelled, for in our history are the seeds of the conspiracy to take this nation from within. The Federal Reserve System, Inc., did not happen by accident, nor did the IRS/16th Amendment. In fact, the Spanish War of 1898 was a part of all this, methinks, and that war marks the beginning of overt U.S. imperialism, the beginning of the quest for world Empire. Most exciting to finally be getting a look at the forces and powers and Houses/families who were behind all that.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 10, 2005, 10:16:28 pm
Quote
Kickass thread!

Salutes to the General!

One thing is for sure. When the control freaks declare martial law and all their other fucked up nazi shit, this guy will not go down without a fight.

Any speculation on what kind of manufactured bullshiat "terrorist attack" they are concocting for their big push?
Thanks, Delos;
No, I've no idea what kind of travesty these idiots will do to us next, but I'm certain that when they do, they'll drop that dreaded iron net of totalitarianism and martial law upon this nation, and methinks that will mark the beginning of the revolution. Millions of Americans already know that these bastards want to do this, so it will spark violence when they do it. 5GW, 4GW, and local activity all over the nation will result from the intended curfews and rations the NWO boys want to enforce upon us - that's my prediction. But as to "how" they'll do the next "terror" event on U.S. soil, I've no clue.

Here is something to ponder, however. Fedgov now knows that millions of Americans are aware that bombs were planted inside the Fed building in OK City prior to McVeigh's yellow truck, (a thing which could only have been done by agents within the government), and many more Americans are becoming aware that elements within Fedgov assisted (at the least) in the events of 911. Everyone is watching like hawks, peering into everything Fedgov does. Whatever Fedgov tries next would have to be so masterfully planned and executed that it is not very likely that they'll be able to pull it off at all. But remember - this conspiracy is global; they are only using our Federal government in ways in which they can't get the UN to operate. That is a key point to remember at all times. From that perspective, we see the possibility that they will forego the risk of getting caught red handed pulling yet a fourth "terrorist" event here, in favor of simply pitching a hot little war against North Korea, whom they've been priming for years. If they go to war against North Korea, and if North Korea (or the CIA, impersonating North Korean Intel groups) hits back with nukes, that will be all they need to drop the net of totalitarianism here. In other words, they don't even need a "terror" event here to do what they want to do with this nation.

So we have many fronts on which to be ever vigilant. There are many possibilities to anticipate. But at least now we know who is behind all this, and what their goals are, so we have some outside chance of apprehending them when they try their next move. Stay tuned! :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: UnstructuredAgain on February 10, 2005, 10:35:18 pm
When is the grandaddy of all books authored by you comin'  out Elias?  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 11, 2005, 12:29:34 am
Quote
When is the grandaddy of all books authored by you comin'  out Elias?
Soon as I quit hanging out on message boards, lol!

:)
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 11, 2005, 12:46:40 am
Just got this in tonight. These people keep the heat on the "security" segments of Fedgov. And of course, that's not surprising, considering Barbara's last name, lol! Anyway,  This is our NSA, and they're a great site to watch weekly. I'm figuring that this belongs on this thread.

~

From: NSARCHIVE <mevans@GWU.EDU>   Save Address | Headers
 To: NSARCHIVE@hermes.gwu.edu
 CC:
 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 23:31:55 -0500
 Subject: 9/11 Commission Staff Report on FAA Failings Published on Web

 National Security Archive Update, February 10, 2005
 
9/11 COMMISSION STAFF REPORT ON FAA FAILINGS PUBLISHED ON WEB
 
Document Updates Previous Archive Posting on
Censorship of Aviation Warnings Leading up to 9/11
 
For more information contact:
Barbara Elias - 202/994-7045
 
http://www.nsarchive.org (http://www.nsarchive.org)
 
Washington D.C., February 10, 2005 - As a result of a Freedom of Information Act appeal filed by the National Security Archive, the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) corrected its October 2004 blunder of withholding the names and numbers of aviation warnings known as Information Circulars that were widely cited and quoted in the best-selling 9/11 Commission Report. In spite of this additional material, the released TSA documents continue to withhold details that were declassified in the recently released 9/11 Commission Staff Report on the pre-9/11 failings of the FAA that was the subject of a front page New York Times article by Eric Lichtblau today.
 
The release of documents on appeal has resulted in the disclosure of only one sentence of substance, a comment in the June 22, 2001 Information Circular, that states, "such an airline hijacking to free terrorists incarcerated in the United States, remains a concern." The sentence was released by TSA on appeal because it can be found in Chapter 8 of the 9/11 Commission Report on page 256.
 
The TSA continues to affirm its decision to withhold all other material in the Information Circulars as Sensitive Security Information (SSI), despite additional citations of the requested documents in the 9/11 Commission Staff Report, which is highly critical of the Federal Aviation Administration for failing to establish better security practices in response to incoming terrorism warnings.
 
"These Information Circulars continue to qualify as dubious secrets," said Barbara Elias, the FOIA coordinator at the National Security Archive. "It seems clear that the Transportation Security Administration did not review these documents on the basis of the information they contain, they simply redacted everything they could legally redact."
 
"The government is still ducking the real question, which is whether the secrecy about these warnings actually makes us safer," said Thomas Blanton, the National Security Archive director.
 
The National Security Archive has posted these released TSA documents on its Web site together with the 9/11 Commission Staff Report.
 
http://www.nsarchive.org (http://www.nsarchive.org)
 
_________________________________________________________
 
THE NATIONAL SECURITY ARCHIVE is an independent non-governmental research institute and library located at The George Washington University in Washington, D.C. The Archive collects and publishes declassified documents acquired through the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA). A tax-exempt public charity, the Archive receives no U.S. government funding; its budget is supported by publication royalties and donations from foundations and individuals.  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Delos on February 11, 2005, 08:47:20 am

Good point, Elias. It (fabricated terror incident) wouldn't even need to be on U.S. soil to facilitate their plans for implimenting martial law.

I agree that it must needs be something nuclear to impress the sheeple sufficiently and to eclipse the 911 showpiece.

 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 12, 2005, 09:04:00 pm
Quote
Good point, Elias. It (fabricated terror incident) wouldn't even need to be on U.S. soil to facilitate their plans for implimenting martial law.

I agree that it must needs be something nuclear to impress the sheeple sufficiently and to eclipse the 911 showpiece.
Well, in my opinion, the mass media has programmed the mass consciousness to the point that all the NWO boys need to do is pitch one more on-going little war, with either Syria or Iran or North Korea or anyone like either of them, and they can lay in the police state here with rations, curfews, reassignments of housing and employment and etc, and claim that anyone who doesn't cooperate with and support such programs is "anti-American" and has no team spirit, and remove him at their discretion. FEMA camps come to mind, but it will likely be much more subtle for the bigger segments of society here which they will seek to manage. Travel restrictions, internal passports, gasoline rationing, and etc will be forced upon the population as a whole. The War on Terrorism will be in full swing, Homeland Security will be drafting young men and women by the hundreds of thousands to serve as extensions of Federal will in our own neighborhoods and communities. Lots of potential scenarios are available for our guess-work, but that is all it is at this point: guesswork. Don't misunderstand me. The secret government (shadow government) could easily poison Atlanta's water supply, or drop the plague from chemtrails over a region of the country, either of which they would blame on bin Laden and al Qaeda. Hundreds of thousands of us could die in such events. Since the NWO boys who believe in the one-world government already are on record in calling for about a four-billion person reduction in global population, it is obvious that they will not hesitate over a mere few hundred thousand deaths. They've proved that they will attack their own symbols and render thousands of dead Americans in order to implement their agendas. Once you get into the occult mysticism, the Babylonian human-sacrifice rituals which they play out each year at Bohemian Grove in California, you realize that to these idiots all is fair game in the overall quest for a one-world government.

But yes, it is as you said, they do not actually need another terrorist event here to enact their police state, as it can be augmented by simply continuing to engage U.S. troops in wars all over the planet. Of course this idea makes our Joint Chiefs of Staff and their neo-con counterparts in DC have long and enduring wet dreams at night, and Wall Street sings mightily the wisdom in perpetual war for perpetual peace. The Pentagon has been trying, coyly, to clue in the American public for several years now to the fact that the U.S. military is embarking on a newly-defined global mission. It is sold to the public as a process by which we can topple governments abroad in the name of giving those nations' people "democracy".

Howsomever, we're hot on the trail of not only resolving the existence of the conspiracy behind these sorts of world events, but we're also on a program for providing alternate way out of the abyss into which these ego-maniacs have plunged us. Wait until you see my next post, which is coming right up after this one. :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 12, 2005, 10:15:18 pm
Well, this thread has been all over the place in both time and in geography. I recall beginning this thread some months ago by putting forth a premise, unproven of course, that the British were behind the conspiracy to take this nation of ours from within. I linked us back to the Tory families of New England and their opposition to George Washington's revolutionary army, to the British role in the Opium wars of the early 1800s, to New England Tory family businesses which ran the opium into China for England, to the creation of Skull and Bones by the Russell Trust in 1832, and other points of interest.

But this thread has not remained focused upon antique history, as it has also looked into the complicity of some elements within the U.S. Federal government in the "terror" events of 1993, 1995, and 911. As I and various contributing post-makers on this thread have continued to discover and post-up here whatever pieces of the puzzle we chanced to find, the thread has moved back and forth in time.  Now I'd like to take us back in time just a few years to 1992.

I found this speech about the statue of Albert Pike several days ago, and have been pondering just what might happen to this thread if I post this here. I can't imagine what this might engender as reactions from various readers here, but I'm an oblivious fool in some ways, so I'm gonna post it here anyway, just to find out what we shall find out in responses which may pop up.  The speaker is a man who has a most-interesting personal history, and part of the reason he was set-up and imprisoned by Fedgov (1989, iirc) has to do with his own knowledge of American history. Of particular appeal to me are numerous factors in the following speech by Lyndon LaRouche of 1992, given while still in prison by the wishes of one George H.W. Bush and his lackey, Oliver North, and the media which serves the Shadow Government. Both H.W. Bush and Oliver North were key players in the Shadow Government's secret games under Reagan, which included massive cocaine importing into America for marketing, massive Wall Street money-laundering of the profits from those CIA drug shipments, and massive illegal arms shipments to both Iran and to the Contras. During the middle 1980s, while H.W. Bush and Oliver North had carte blanche out of the White House's back door, they attacked Lyndon LaRouche and framed him because he was aware of what they were doing and also because he had a viable alternative to foreign policy and economic policy, and those alternatives would spell doom for the old British plan to own America from within. Be it known that H.W. Bush and Oliver North both worked for those British bankers who are behind the push for a one-world government.

So now comes to our little conspiracy theory thread some most interesting pieces to the mid-1800s portion of our puzzle. When you read this, please feel free to make any commentary, pro or con, on not only LaRouche's version of history, but also on LaRouche himself and especially, if you're aware of it, LaRouche's alternate plan for the world economy, which is being totally repressed by the insiders in Washington DC despite wide-spread world acceptance of it by many leading financial advisors and some heads of State.  I would like to state here and now, on a personal note, that I did receive a tape by Anthony Hilder a couple of months ago, and on that tape is a segment of an interview with Lyndon LaRouche. At the time I saw that, I did not have any idea who LaRouche is. Somehow, I had never even heard of this man, despite his having been a candidate for the White House. Today I have spend quite a bit of time researching into LaRouche's personal history, his system of economic rejuvenation for the world's economy, his legal troubles at the hands of Bush I and Oliver North, his knowledge of little-known aspects of American history, and, most significantly of all, his philosophy which so direly threatens the NWO, for whom Bush I and Oliver North were working under Reagan. LaRouche has come up with a plan which would have allowed American foreign policy to forego this entire "War on Terror", build up the Eurasian energy fields for everyone's best gains, and would have prevented any need for the globalists to use the U.S. military to occupy Afghanistan and Iraq. In my opinion at this time, the following speech is absolutely huge. So without further ado, Lyndon LaRouche, speaking from prison in 1992:

(PS: if the first few paragraphs tax your ability to maintain interest, please continue to read; this thing gets very pertinent to our thread here before it's ending. Thanks!)
~

from here:
 
http://www.etext.org/Politics/LaRouche/102592.tv (http://www.etext.org/Politics/LaRouche/102592.tv)
 
~
 
 
                  LAROUCHE FOR PRESIDENT
               ABC-TV NATIONWIDE BROADCAST
                    October 25, 1992
 
   The following program is authorized and paid for by:
                 LaRouche for President
            Independents for Economic Recovery
 
TITLE:       "...principalities and powers..."
                                               
                   An Address by
             Independent Presidential
                     Candidate
 
                 Lyndon H. LaRouche
 
LAROUCHE (Speaking from Federal Prison, Rochester, MN):
The World is now entering into the worst crisis of the
20th century, a crisis more deadly than that which built
up around World War I and its aftermath, a crisis more
deadly than that around World War II, its build-up and
aftermath, and a crisis more deadly in some ways, than the
longterm threat of nuclear war between the two superpower
blocs, prior to the end of 1989.  
   On the 16th of September, for example, we had a
financial crisis, with repercussions since, which show
that we've entered a new phase of a worldwide depression,
which in physical terms, is far worse than the depression
of the 1930s.  
   In the meantime, we have the spread of war. You might
say that World War III has already begun. We have a
spreading war in the Balkans; we have a war in
Transcaucuses, involving the Turkish population against
the Armenians, and the Georgians against the Abkhazians,
and so forth and so on; we have a war in Central Asia. We
can say, in general, World War III is spreading rapidly in
the form of these local wars. It's like a forest fire,
threatening to engulf whole continents, and perhaps the
world as a whole.  
   The U.S. misery is beyond belief. The physical
misery, the homelessness of a type which has not exisisted
in the United States in this century, prevails. We have,
coming out of the mouths of people like Clinton and Perot,
proposals for so-called emergency action, which are almost
identical to the austerity proposals of Benito Mussolini
and his backer, Volpe di Misuratta, in Italy during the
1920s. Fascism is being presented as a remedy for the
social unrest caused by depression.  
   We have unjustice in this country beyond belief. We
are now talking, at the Supreme Court level, about the need
to execute death row prisoners, even if it is known that
they are innocent of the crimes for which they are
convicted -- murdering people for the sake of procedure --
that's the philosophy. This is no longer America.  
   How did this happen?
   Look at this statue for a moment. Let's go back to
the time of the man this statue depicts: General Albert
Pike. To understand why the United States is in such a
mess today -- why we not only have these troubles within
our nation, but in our relations with the world at large;
why the people in Washington seem to be incapable either
of recognizing the problem, or proposing effective
solutions; why Clinton and Perot, as well as Bush, show
not the slightest comprehension of what our problem is --
we have to go back to the time of the Civil War, to the
time of the man depicted by this statue, General Albert
Pike: racist, traitor, and Satanic degenerate. The fact
that that statue has stood in Washington, DC near the
Supreme Court, beside the Labor Department building,
maintained on public land at public expense, shows that
there is a pervasive corruption and ignorance inside our
government, which is the cause for the continuation of our
present problems.  
   Let's go back to those events of the Civil War, and
trace it up to the present, to see what the problem is,
and what we have to understand, to solve the problem
before us.  
 
                       "Treason"
 
   What is called the U.S. Civil War, the most
devastating war in our history, was NOT a war between the
states. It was a civil war in the sense that a faction,
including Bostonians such as Albert Pike, New Yorkers such
as John Slidell, and so forth, were all part of a British
conspiracy, run through the Southern Jurisdiction of the
Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, which took over control of
the states, with the aid of a traitor at the head of the
Democratic Party, August Belmont, a confessed traitor, in
order to destroy the United States, by dividing it into
several parts, so that the British might control it.  
 
VOICE:  "New York would...cut loose from the Puritanical
East.... She would open her magnificent port to the commerce
of the world...as an independent city-state...." (August
Belmont)
 
LAROUCHE:  This was not a Southern conspiracy; it was a
consipiracy by British-controlled traitors to the
United States, to take over the southern states, the
slave-owning states, as a way of dividing the United
States into several parts, which might be kept in
perpetual conflict with each other, to eliminate the
United Staes as both a factor in world politics, and also
to weaken it to the point that the image of the United
States, of the American Revolution, might be erased from
the memory and hopes of people around the world.  
   For example, Albert Pike, the traitor whose statue
we've seen, was from Boston; Louisiana's John Slidell
was an in-law of August Belmont, the traitor from New
York City; one of the worse of the traitors, Captain James
Bulloch, was the uncle, and, for a considerable period of
time, the political mentor of a President of the United
States, his nephew, Teddy Roosevelt, the man who was
President in 1901, at the time when this statue was
consecrated.  
   In the 1830s, Pike, a Bostonian, was sent down to
the South by his fellow Bostonian, Caleb Cushing, also a
member of the plot. By 1859, Pike had risen to the
position of Supreme Commander of the Southern Jurisdiction
of the Scottish Rite, and thus the supreme commander of
the forces of the Confederate conspiracy, which had now
moved to take over the relevant states against the
opposition of such patriots as Texas's Sam Houston, who was
opposed to this conspiracy.  
   Pike, as head of the Southern Freemasons, was not
only the racist who later formed the Ku Kux Klan at the
Nashville, Tennessee Maxwell House Hotel in 1867, Pike was
also a Satanist. In his own words, as Pike said in Paris
in 1889, Pike explained the religion of his Freemasonic
cult, as follows:  
 
VOICE:  "The true philosophical religion, is the belief in
Lucifer, the equal of Adonai...." (Albert Pike)  
 
LAROUCHE:  Pike's Freemasonic plot had two subordinate
arms.  The first, founded in 1843, was the B'nai B'rith.
Now, the B'nai B'rith was not the representation of Jewish
organizations in the United States. Quite the contrary,
the majority of Jews in the United States were violently
opposed to slavery, in the tradition of the Passover
seder, and during the Civil War fought, or otherwise aided
the Union, in the cause of crushing slavery and
maintaining the Union. The B'nai B'rith was founded as the
pro-slavery racist faction among Jews. The B'nai B'rith of
Freemasonry became the Confederate spy organiation, later
headed by Judah Benjamin, who was involved in the plot to
kill Lincoln, among other things, and who worked very
closely with Pike. In fact, Judah Benjamin played a key
role, together with Pike, in founding the Ku Kux Klan in
Tennessee in 1867.  
   The second subordinate organization of relevance of
the Southern Jurisdiction of Freemasonry was what was the
fighting arm of Freemasonry, which was known originally as
the Knights of the Golden Circle, the precursor of the Ku
Kux Klan.  
   These three elements -- Pike's Freemasonic Lucifer
worshipping cult; B'nai B'rith; and the Ku Kux Klan --
have been continuously interconnected from 1867 down
through the present day.  
 
                  "Friends and Enemies"
 
LAROUCHE:  At the time that Lincoln was inaugurated, the
Confederacy went into open secession, open revolt. At that
time, the leading enemies of the United States were
Britain, under the leadership of Lord Palmerston, who was
otherwise known as the author of the Second and Third
Opium Wars against China; and Palmerston's political
catamite -- the man that Palmerston, in fact, put into
power in France, Napoleon III.  
   The friends of the United States were Russia, the
Russia of Czar Alexander II more specifically; and also
the Meiji Restoration forces in Japan; friends in Germany;
and (you might not know it, but it's significant) the King
of Thailand.  
   This alignment of friends and enemies became crucial
in the course of the 20th century.  
   By 1862, it became clear, that once Lincoln had
replaced more or less treasonous generals like General
McClelland, the protege of August Belmont who refused to
win the battle of Antietam, that the United States was
organized in such a fashion that, by its own means, the
Union would win the battle against the Confederacy, unless
outside military interference occurred, to prevent that
from occurring.  
   At that time, Lord Palmerston's Britain and France's
Napoleon III agreed to deploy British and French naval
forces to attempt to break the Union blockade of the
Confederacy, and thus enable France and Britain to
reinforce the Confederacy, perhaps not to win the Civil
War, but to make it so costly that the United States would
bend to the will of the British government and accept a
separate peace with the British Confederate puppet.  
   At that point, Alexander II, the Czar of Russia,
intervened. He prepared to send naval forces, which he did
in 1863, to aid the United States. The Russian Navy
arrived in New York City and San Francisco on friendship
visits; and the commanders of these Russian flotillas, had
sealed orders. In the event that Napoleon III or Britain,
or both, should intervene against the Union, to attempt to
break the Union blockade or other actions, these sealed
orders would be opened, and Russia would go to war against
Britian and France, in aid of its ally, the Union.  
   At that point, Britain backed down, and the United
States was able to settle its internal affairs by its own
means.  
   That began a worldwide movement, under which the
United States was implicitly the ally or the friend of
Alexander II's Russia, and of Germany, against our deadly
enemies Britain and Napoleon III's France, until about the
end of the century when things began to change.  
   During that period, despite the assassination of
Alexander II by forces friendly to Britain inside Russia,
the policy of Alexander II was continued. A small group of
the Russian nobility and others continued this admiration
of the American System policy. At the same time, Count
Sergei Witte, the leader of various governments of the
Czar, reached out to Germany and to France, in an effort
to get Continental cooperation for a general economic
development of all Eurasia, based on cooperation initially
in building railway lines which would extend from Brest on
the coast of France, through Paris, to Vladivostok. And,
of course, the Germans had a related policy of moving a
rail line to from Berlin to Baghdad.  
   The British reacted with violence to this, because
they saw that the economic development of the continent
of Eurasia meant an end to their dream of a worldwide,
single one-world British empire. The idea that the United
States, which had been traditionally (since Lincoln, at
least) allied with Russia (or at least, that
faction in Russia which Witte represented) and with the
more positive forces in Germany, and forces around the
Meiji Restoration in Japan (which in the 19th century were
very close to the United States) and forces for
independence, anti-British forces such as those of Sun Yat
Sen, for example in China -- that these forces united,
would mean an end to the British Empire, and the British
had to break up that coalition.  
   And, thus we had in the 20th century this upsurge of
wars and revolutions, including World War I, which were
entirely orchestrated by the British.  
 
                     "The Change"
 
LAROUCHE:  The shooting, the execution, of President
William McKinley by admirers of Teddy Roosevelt from the
Henry Street Settlement House, not only brought Teddy
Roosevelt to power, but effected fundamental changes in
the internal and foreign policy of the United States.  
   Instead of having as our friends and allies, Germany,
the faction of Alexander II and Witte in Russia, the Meiji
Restoration forces in Japan, these became our enemies.
And, our former enemies in London and within France, the
faction of Napoleon III, became our new allies. Against
Russia -- although we allied with Russia against Germany
later -- Teddy Roosevelt's friends in the grain cartel and
elsewhere, were active not only in suporting radical
groups for the overthrow of the Czar, but in collaborating
with the government of Lenin and Trotsky in the earliest
period, to help build up the institutions of Bolshevik
power, and to enter into partnerships with the new
Bolshevik powers.  
   That was a big change!
   The domestic changes included the following. TR
wanted to crack political opposition in the United States,
and for this purpose, he wanted to create a national
police force like that of France's Napoleon III. He
retained as his Attorney General, Charles Bonaparte, who
was a nephew of Napoleon III, and he created a national
police force called the National Bureau of Investigation,
the predecessor of the FBI.  
   Later on, Roosevelt was crucial, in collaboration
with the backers of Woodrow Wilson (who was a like-minded
scoundrel), in giving us two other institutions: the
Federal Reserve System, and the Federal income tax system.
Without the collaboration between Teddy Roosevelt and
Wilson, these would never have occurred. And thus, the
United States was placed under the control of a debt
system in which our national finance and banking was at
the mercy of private interests, to loot us almost as they
will.  
   This arrangement, or rearrangement, of the political
map brought the United States into World War I, a war
whose purpose was to further Britain's fear of Continental
economic development, by playing one nation of the
Continent against one another in bloddy war (even with a
lot of British sacrifice thrown in to facilitate that);
and to allow Britain to go on, with the collaboration of
its new junior partner, the United States, to establish a
new, one-world empire in the image of the Roman Empire.
For that purpose, the victorious Allies, the
Anglo-Americans and their French political catamite
partners, established the Treaty of Versailles and its
institutions at the end of World War I -- including the
League of Nations, which was supposed to gradually put
into place this new, one-world empire.  
   Well, that didn't work out too well. The Great
Depression, and other events, intervened.  
 
GRAPHIC:  George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography,
          by Webster Griffin Tarpley and Anton Chaitkin
         
LAROUCHE:  As this carefully researched book documents the
facts, in 1932-1933, this British group and its friends in
New York City, put Adolf Hitler into power in Germany.
Let's emphasize: Adolf Hitler did not come to power
because the German people put him into power, but because
the Anglo-American occupying powers which controlled
Germany's finances, put him into power.  
   In point of fact, in 1932, an international
conference on eugenics was held, sponsored by the mother
of Averill Harriman, and others, at the American Museum of
Natural History in New York City. This conference was
addressed by Hitler's personal race theorist, Ernst Rudin.
At the end of that conference, Ernst Rudin was elected
unanimously president of the International Federation of
Eugenics Societies, and Mrs. Harriman and others stated,
that they admired the Nazi Party because of those racial
purification dogmas presented by Ernst Rudin.  
 
GRAPHIC:  "It is unfortunate that the anti-Nazi propaganda
with which all countries have been flooded has gone far to
obscure the correct understanding and the great importance
of the German racial policy." (from an article titled "The
German Racial Policy" by Dr. C.G. Campbell, Honorary
President of the Eugenics Research Association, in the
March-April, 1936 issue of Eugenical News)  
 
   So, they knew what they were doing.  
   This led to war, World War II. There's no need to go
into the details of that. The point is: during the last
years of World War II, the Allies -- Britain, the United
States, and Moscow -- set up a series of institutions,
constituting a new set of Versailles agreements.  
   Throughout the postwar peiod following World War II,
the United States and Britain operated on the basis of
what were called, generically, the Yalta agreements. That
is, despite the conflicts, including the threat of
thermonuclear war, between the Soviet Empire and the
Anglo-Americans throughout most of this period, at all
times, there was a back-channel relationship, to such
effect (as Henry Kissinger, for example emphasized a
number of times) that whenever Moscow, together with
London and Washington, would come to an agreement on world
policy, the rest of the world had to obey. So, there was a
kind of condominium in effect, all through this period.  
   That process came to an end, beginning late November,
1989, when a sequence of events was unleased which led to
the crumbling of the Berlin Wall, and led to the crumbling
of what Winston Churchill had called, the Iron Curtain.  
 
                 "After the Wall Fell"
 
LAROUCHE:  The policy fight had begun even before the Wall
collapsed, or even before most people around the world
knew it was going to collapse. The policy fight began with
my address at the Kempinski Hotel on Columbus Day, October
12, 1988:  
 
   "Under proper conditions, many today will agree
the time has come for early steps toward the
re-unification of Germany, with the obvious prospect
that Berlin might resume its role as the nation's capitol."
 
   A year later, the Wall came down, at which time, I
introduced a program for a world-wide economic recovery, a
program based on using the economic potential of Central
Europe, the so-called "economic productive triangle," to
regenerate economic growth in Eurasia -- very much along
the lines which Count Witte had desired at the end of the
last century and the early part of this century.  
 
GRAPHIC:  "The Paris-Berlin-Vienna Triangle:
           Locomotive of the World Economy
           -- Lyndon LaRouche's Program for
           Reversing the World Depression" (pamphlet)
 
LAROUCHE:  Had that program been adopted, as many
sympathized with it and were working to have it adopted,
we would be in an economic recovery, not a depression,
today.  
   Around Margart Thatcher madmen, like Connor Cruise
O'Brien and Nicholas Ridley, we began to hear the words,
"a Fourth Reich," and how Germany must be stopped from
engaging in ventures in which German economic power, with
or without France, might play a large role in Eastern
Europe and the former Soviet Union.  
   In order to assist in stopping programs like the
Triangle program, which I had proposed, from being
implemented, friends of Kissinger, such as Britain's Lord
Carrington, or the State Department's Lawrence
Eagleburger, unleashed their Serbian military puppets to
enact genocide and other war crimes on other sections of
the population of the former nation of Yugoslavia, thus
creating a Balkan ulcer of war, which threatens to destroy
Central Europe and much more within.  
   For the same reason, the same geopolitical reason,
that the British had orchestrated the creation of World
War I, and that Anglo-Americans, by putting Hitler into
power in Germany, had created the preconditions for World
War II, these madmen, typified by Kissinger cronies
Carrington and Eagleburger, with their Balkan adventures,
were back to World War I drafting boards, starting another
world war -- of little wars in the Transcaucusus, the
Balkans, Central Asia, and elsewhere, with potential
nuclear implications, spreading and spreading throughout
the world, until the whole world itself, under conditions
of depression, might be engulfed in war.  
 
   The worst depression of this century is in full
swing. We having spreading wars in the Balkans,
Transcaucusus, Central Asia. And, we're at the verge of
movement to a change of government which might be a
hard-line development around Moscow in the very near
future. This all is the result of the horrible
mismanagment of the post-1989 period, by the U.S. and
British governments, chiefly.  
   Thus, the legacy of this statue of racist,
treasonous, Satanic Albert Pike, still influences the
domestic and foreign policy shaping of Washington, DC. If
we do not root out of our republic, the treason, the
corruption, the degeneracy which Albert Pike and his
collaborators and followers represent, there is no chance
that the United States will prevail as a nation, either in
its domestic affairs, or its foreign affairs.  
   Unless we act now, to reject all lesser evils which
compromise with what this statue symbolizes, there is no
hope that the United States will escape the kind of Hell
which world famine, world disease, spreading war, and
economic depression generally, portend.  
 
GRAPHIC:  "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood,
but against principalities, against powers, against
the rulers of the darkness of this world, against
spiritual wickedness in high places" (Ephesians 6:12)
 
        Lyndon H. LaRouche is on the ballot in  
 
Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, District of Columbia, Iowa,
Louisiana, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Jersey, North
Dakota, Ohio, Rhode Island, Tennessee, Utah, Vermont,
Virginia, Washington, and Wisconsin  
 
   All other States, write in LaRouche and Bevel
 
            For more information, write
               LaRouche for President  
                    P.O. Box 266
                 Leesburg, VA  22075
 
  The preceding program was authorized and paid for by:  
 
                  LaRouche for President
    Independents for Economic Recovery
                             
 
 
 
 
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Delos on February 13, 2005, 08:40:42 am

Interesting comments by LaRouche.

LaRouche was someone I knew of on the periphery of the freedom/dissident movement back in the 80's, but he was so thoroughly smeared and discredited by all and sundry that I never really took him seriously or read his stuff.

I recall his big thing was decrying the Queen of England as a drug dealer, which I didn't really find too compelling at the time, I guess.

It strikes me that folks who don't believe there are guys in smoky backrooms influencing world events is akin to subscribing to the theory that the universe was created by an incredible and spontaneous "big bang."

Also, . . . interesting post on the Pa. 911 crash site, don't you all  think?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: byron on February 13, 2005, 10:30:13 am
Elias, I am really enjoying this thread. I get off work in the morning and this is the one I look to see if anything new has been added. Thank you for the hard work, effort in conveying the material,  and keep it coming.

I remember LaRouche, and it seems like forever he has been around. Every 4 years he would run for prez. He would have a few stale looking TV commercials. But he also just about always would buy 30 minutes of evening TV time just before the election, and make his case. When his name was mentioned people would look disgusted and say "effin commie".

I USED to wish that the LP would try and follow his example, and just once, buy 30 min of prime time (in front of Monday Night Football) just before the election and try to make their case.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 14, 2005, 12:23:55 pm
Quote
Elias, I am really enjoying this thread. I get off work in the morning and this is the one I look to see if anything new has been added. Thank you for the hard work, effort in conveying the material,  and keep it coming.

I remember LaRouche, and it seems like forever he has been around. Every 4 years he would run for prez. He would have a few stale looking TV commercials. But he also just about always would buy 30 minutes of evening TV time just before the election, and make his case. When his name was mentioned people would look disgusted and say "effin commie".

I USED to wish that the LP would try and follow his example, and just once, buy 30 min of prime time (in front of Monday Night Football) just before the election and try to make their case.
byron, thank you for letting me know that you enjoy reading this, er, "unusual" thread. I appreciate your having let me know.  :)

Since I have only very recently discovered about LaRouche's existence, I have mentioned his name to several people. They all have cautioned me about him, noting to me that he has a mysterious murky reputation and that if I use his work and his name I'll be ridiculed, be written off, will even cast doubt on my own reputation. I have been told to consider using LaRouche's information but to refrain from associating his name with the historical facts which I learn by reading LaRouche's work.

All of this air of intrigue which surrounds LaRouche is, imo, the work of the CFR-controlled media, who has publicly hung LaRouche out to dry at the request of the insiders and elitists inside high levels of U.S. government.  What I've done so far (and this work is only beginning) is to verify the details of history as presented by LaRouche. I do this by looking into other sources. To my satisfaction, LaRouche's accounting of history holds up under inspection.

I never care whether someone is popular with the mainstream press or with the ruling Junta in power at the White House. In fact, if someone opposes the status quo in American politics, I tend to appreciate him. :)

So here is a fairly-decent article on behalf of LaRouche:

~

found here:

http://www.schillerinstitute.org/exon/exon.html (http://www.schillerinstitute.org/exon/exon.html)

~

If you are one of the tens of thousands of Americans who understand the fact that the legal proceedings against Lyndon LaRouche and his associates were the result of one of the most corrupt judicial frameups in U.S. history, you have probably had the following experience. You have given a friend, or neighbor, a copy of the ``Summary of Relevant Evidence Demonstrating the Innocence of Lyndon LaRouche and Co-Defendants,'' a pamphlet put out by LaRouche's 1996 presidential election campaign in the millions of copies, or brought up LaRouche's views on the economic crisis, or other political developments, in a political discussion. In response, you've gotten a reaction of the following sort: ``Don't talk to me about LaRouche; he's a crook.''
 
 You may have been immediately intimidated, but many of you have not. Instead, you've answered your friend or neighbor:
 
 ``No, LaRouche and his associates were the targets of a secret government witchhunt, put together by Henry Kissinger, Ollie North, and George Bush.''
 
 ``Oh, no,'' says your neighbor. ``You don't believe that, do you? He was convicted of a crime. I know. I read it in the press and saw it on TV.''
 
 You may have replied: ``Do you know anything about LaRouche directly, or his writings?'' ``I don't have to,'' your neighbor might say. ``I rely on the new media.''
 
 That seals the case. What you are dealing with in this situation, is a victim of mass-brainwashing by the U.S. media, an individual who has taken his ``opinion'' from a mass media which, itself, participated in the deliberate campaign of defamation against LaRouche and his associates. Someone who retails such opinions about LaRouche, is probably stupid enough to have money in the stock market as well.
 
 Millions of Americans have been the victims of what amounts to a brainwashing campaign against LaRouche, carried out between 1984 and 1988, in the USA and internationally, with more intensity, duration, and scope, than against any personality not a major figure of government. As a result, even still today, there are millions of U.S. citizens who have been so thoroughly brainwashed by a mass-media campaign coordinated through Henry Kissinger, George Bush, et al., that those duped persons react with knee-jerk outbrusts of baseless, irrational rage, at the mere mention of the name ``LaRouche.'' It's past time this brainwashing was broken. Not only do 5 LaRouche associates sit in prison in the Commonwealth of Virginia, despite their innocence, after years of incarceration. But also LaRouche himself remains under the cloud of his conviction, at a time when his ideas of economic development and social justice are urgently needed, to prevent the ongoing financial disintegration and impending blowout from leading to a collapse of civilization into a New Dark Age. Destruction by defamation
 
 When the first phases of the attack on Lyndon LaRouche and his organization began, there is no question but that certain Establishment figures wished to see him dead. As early as 1973, the FBI was collaborating with its agents in the Communist Party-USA in discussion of ``eliminating'' LaRouche. When the para-military raid against the offices of publishing companies associated with LaRouche occurred in 1986, there was clearly a live option to stage a shoot-out in which LaRouche would end up dead. There are other instances as well, of assassination attempts.
 
 Eventually, however, the chosen method to destroy LaRouche and his movement was by prosecution and defamation. The defamation itself was critical to the success of the legal cases. And in the wake of the prosecutions, the process of defamation is even easier.
 
 As is documented in the sections of this pamphlet devoted to the Train salon, there was nothing accidental about the rash of negative propaganda which was circulated about LaRouche in the 1983 to 1988 period. While the Anti-Defamation League of B'nai B'rith (ADL), the New York Times, and the drug mob-linked High Times and Our Town had launched their own attacks on LaRouche prior to 1983, these had not dimmed his influence. After all, the headline of the High Times article, by pot-head Dennis King, was ``They want to take your drugs away,'' a blatant appeal to the drug-using minority of the U.S. population at that point. But in 1983, the Secret Government apparatus which Ronald Reagan had set up through Executive Order 12333, in December 1981, and which was headed by George Bush, took a more top-down approach. They pulled together a meeting of representatives of nearly every major news outlet, along with others, to coordinate a ``public diplomacy'' campaign against LaRouche. As a result of this conspiracy, the most popular media outlets came to feature lies and slanders against LaRouche. These included Readers Digest, NBC-TV, and the Wall Street Journal.
 
 In addition, after two associates of LaRouche won the Democratic Party primary in Illinois in March 1986, a new wave of defamation took off. This wave was characterized by the input of the ADL, itself a close ally of dirty factions in the intelligence community, and the ADL's report on LaRouche as a ``political extremist.'' From that time forward, in virtually every news wire and news report--thousands and thousands--the name Lyndon LaRouche virtually never appeared without the prefatory negative nonsense phrase ``political extremist.''
 
 Anyone who simply relied on the corrupt news media, now found it impossible to find out what LaRouche stood for. No substantive act or policy statement of his was ever covered; he simply received the characterization of ``political extremist.'' And corrupt federal prosecutors shut down the two mass publications of the LaRouche movement, through an illegal forced bankruptcy, cutting off an in-depth counterattack.
 
 To the average member of the American public, who is ``other-directed'' enough to care about public opinion, this did the trick. Even those who thought they had supported LaRouche programs against drugs and for economic development, now believed that there was something wrong with him, because the media said so. As LaRouche's attorneys pointed out in the appeal of his conviction, the density of hostile propaganda, particularly in the northern Virginia area where his second trial occurred, created a steamroller of prejudice against him and his co-defendants. And after the railroaded conviction of LaRouche and his six associates in 1988, the blanket of defamation was even more effective, combined as it was with fear that truth could not win out against the secret government apparatus.

Progress toward justice

A lot has changed since LaRouche and his associates were sent off to prison in January of 1989. In particular, the realization has grown that the Reagan-Bush Justice Department was among the most corrupt political institutions around. This perception has spread through the Black community, the labor movement, and a large section of Middle America, that was shocked to the core by the atrocities of the Waco and Ruby Ridge massacres by the FBI. It has been increasingly clear to millions of Americans, that, while LaRouche and his movement were singled out for particularly brutal treatment, we were not alone in being the targets of judicial witchhunts and suppression.
 
 Outside the United States, LaRouche's wife, Helga Zepp LaRouche, led the fight to make an international scandal out of the treatment given her husband by the U.S. Justice system. Thousands of dignitaries signed an appeal to the U.S. President for LaRouche's freedom, thus contributing to the political climate in which LaRouche himself was released on parole January 26, 1994.
 
 Soon after that, LaRouche began a campaign for exoneration of himself and his associates. This campaign has brought forward hundreds of state legislators, and hundreds of other dignitaries, to urge that justice finally be done. One highlight of this campaign was the convening of an Independent Committee of lawyers and international dignitaries, in September 1994, who reviewed the 6 volumes of evidence which the courts had never heard, and concluded that there had been ``gross, even conspiratorial, misuse of prosecutionarial and investigative powers by officials and agents of the U.S. Government.'' The other, even more dramatic, were a set of hearings carried out by a panel of state legislators in September 1995. This panel heard testimony on the LaRouche case, and three others -- the series of infamous Frühmenschen prosecutions of African-American elected officials, the legal witchhunt against the falsely accused Ukrainian autoworker John Demjanjuk, and the case against former Austrian President Kurt Waldheim. In the LaRouche case, it was established that there is a corrupt, permanent bureaucracy in the Justice Department, which was responsive to the Kissinger-Bush order to ``get LaRouche.'' In the late fall of 1995, the National Black Caucus of State Legislators called for Congressional investigations of all the above cases, including that of LaRouche.
 
 Through the course of the exoneration campaign, it has become common knowledge within national political circles, and state legislators, that LaRouche and his associates were subject to political targetting, particularly by the Bush political apparatus. Yet the fear of taking on the ``official line'' set by the mass media, still prevails. It is backed up by the fact that that media reflects the power of the heavily British-influenced Eastern Establishment.

LaRouche vs. Bush

One major break in the campaign to exonerate LaRouche came in the fall of 1996, when the {San Jose Mercury News} published its investigation of the introduction of crack cocaine into the Los Angeles ghetto, as a result of the Contra operation. This expose once again opened up the file of one of the most filthy political operatives in the U.S., Sir George Bush.
 
 As the LaRouche movement had exposed back in the late 1980s, and again in its campaign against Ollie North in 1994, George Bush was the individual in charge of the dirty operations which ran the Contras, and Iran-Contra. He was in charge of an international gun and drug-running network which resulted in the creation of the Afghansi terror network, and the importation of tons of cocaine into the U.S., through Ollie North's ``freedom fighters.'' In this capacity, he came head to head against the LaRouche movement, and did his best to destroy it. Bush's political machine, even now that he is out of office, is very much alive. The most visible operative is none other than Kenneth Starr, Bush's Solicitor General, and a blatant political operative in the witchhunt against President Clinton. But, never assume that Bush's activities are all out in the open; his business networks, including those of Rev. Sun Myung Moon, are engaged in filthy business all over the world, especially as Bush seeks to install his son, George Jr., as the next President of the United States.
 
 But, Bush's troubles are not over -- not by a long shot. The effects of his crimes are still with us, including the persecution of the LaRouche movement. It is Bush who should be in jail, not LaRouche and his associates.
 

schiller@schillerinstitute.org

The Schiller Institute
 PO BOX 20244
 Washington, DC 20041-0244
 703-771-8390 or 888-347-3258
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 15, 2005, 01:23:28 pm
Quote
Interesting comments by LaRouche.

LaRouche was someone I knew of on the periphery of the freedom/dissident movement back in the 80's, but he was so thoroughly smeared and discredited by all and sundry that I never really took him seriously or read his stuff.

I recall his big thing was decrying the Queen of England as a drug dealer, which I didn't really find too compelling at the time, I guess.

It strikes me that folks who don't believe there are guys in smoky backrooms influencing world events is akin to subscribing to the theory that the universe was created by an incredible and spontaneous "big bang."

Also, . . . interesting post on the Pa. 911 crash site, don't you all  think?
Delos, you've known of LaRouche much longer than have I. I really only learned about the man just this past week, although I have seen, a couple of months ago, an interview with him which is on Anthony Hilder's film, "911: The Greatest Lie Ever Sold", a conspiracy-theory film which has some interesting news-clips.  So, having seen that interview, which is just a brief segment in the film, I recognized the name when I stumbled across this stuff on Albert Pike.  To test whether I would want to look further into the LaRouche message, (his statement to the world), I have looked at Albert Pike a bit on my computer.

This is Anton Chaitkin's speech on Albert Pike's statue in Washington DC. One thing which earmarks Anton Chaitkin is his passion for meticulous detail in his sourcing. He is an excellent researcher of obscure facts of American history, and I've yet to hear anyone dare question (successfully) Chaitkin's take on the shadow government's early history. Personally, I owe a great debt to Anton Chaitkin for his work on the Bush Dynasty, which stands strong despite everything the Bush family has tried to do to kill it. So, as a yardstick by which to measure LaRouche's theories, and since LaRouche's speech on Albert Pike is already on this thread, I'm now placing Chaitkin's speech into this thread in hopes that it verifies LaRouche's perspective. But aside from that personal wish to verify LaRouche, this speech is full of historic pieces to our puzzle. Enjoy:
 
 ~
 
(I do not have a link to this speech; but I will soon post the article in which I found this link, and you'll be able to click the link from that article.)
 
Why Albert Pike's Statue Must Fall  
 
The Scottish Rite's KKK Project  
 
by Anton Chaitkin  
 
{The following is the edited
text of the speech delivered by Mr. Chaitkin to
the Labor Day weekend conference
of the Schiller Institute in suburban
Washington, D.C.}
 
In the heart of Washington, D.C.,
there is a large statue and monument
honoring the most important founder of
the Ku Klux Klan.  
   Inscribed on the base of the
statue are the words, ``poet''--the
terrorist anthem of the KKK was his
most famous literary work--and
``jurist''--he was called the KKK's
chief judiciary officer, and reputedly
wrote the organization manual for the
terrorist anti-black movement after the
U.S. Civil War.  
   The immense, bearded figure of
Confederate General Albert Pike is
looming over a public square in the
nation's capital. Why has it never been
pulled down in that predominantly black
city?  
   The statue is a tribute to the
influence of Pike's organization. It
has power in the Executive Branch, and
the Congress, and it is decisive in the
courts. It has great power in all
branches of law enforcement and the
military.  
   Do I mean that the Ku Klux Klan
has such sway over the government? No,
I'm speaking here of the ``Scottish
Rite of Freemasonry Southern
Jurisdiction,'' of which Pike was the
chief, or ``Sovereign Grand
Commander.''  
   The Ku Klux Klan, the Southern
Confederacy, and the pre-Civil War
secession movement were a single,
continuous project, with Pike's
``Scottish Rite'' at its center. Though
the Confederacy was defeated, this
project lives on today, and now
dominates U.S. political life.  
   Look at Baker & Botts, the Houston
family firm and power base of Secretary
of State James A. Baker III. This law
firm was formed after the Civil War by
die-hard Confederate and Masonic
officials in Albert Pike's Scottish
Rite and military clique. With their
British imperial racial notions, Baker
& Botts and Scottish Rite freemasonry
have dominated the Texas power
structure ever since.  
   Secretary Baker's grandfather,
Captain James A. Baker, brought English
race scientist Julian Huxley in to
supervise the ``race purification'' study
program for Texas, at Rice University.
Secretary Baker's family wealth and
power came from their representing
Harriman, the international oil
companies and George Bush's Zapata
Petroleum, all sponsors of the
population control, or ban-dark-babies
movement. This movement is synonymous
with the Scottish Rite.  
   Bill Clinton is governor of
Arkansas, a state infested by the
tradition of Albert Pike, who was the
Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan in
Arkansas. Look closely at the mind-set.
Bill Clinton supports and carries out
the death penalty, which in practice
means executions of black people and
poor people; and Clinton supports
abortion. Clinton sat down, and worked
out his views on these issues with his
Baptist minister, the late Rev. W.O.
Vaught, who was Clinton's spiritual
guide and virtual foster father.  
   As Vaught's son recently told me,
Clinton and his pastor agreed that
their religion permits the killing of
prisoners and unborn children. The
authority for this version of
Christianity is derived from a
peculiar, neo-pagan reading of the Old
Testament. And the New Testament, with
its ban on revenge and requirement to
love, is considered irrelevant: They
say that Christ was primarily concerned
with fulfilling the Old Law of the
Hebrews (as interpreted by this
faction), and when Christ said love
your enemy and turn the other cheek, he
was really trying to reenforce and
impose the authority of the Roman
Empire.  
   But whose religion is this?  
   Well, the Reverend W.O. Vaught was
a 32nd Degree Mason, a {Sublime
Prince of the Royal Secret} within the
Scottish Rite hierarchy.
 
   What Is the Scottish
Rite?
 
   What, then, is the Scottish Rite?  
   Freemasonry was founded in the
early 1700s in England by the so-called
Venetian Party. This clique of
British philosophical liberals had a
few other experiments in human misery,
for example: the East India Company,
the royal African Company of slavers,
and the slave colony of South Carolina.  
   The Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
in particular, has a feudalist lore and
legend, that is rooted in the black
slave trade through the Caribbean
Islands. In those islands, the pagan
cults of slavers in ancient Rome, and
Venice, were reused as
anti-Judeo-Christian or Satanic cults
and rituals for the amusement and
gratification of the slave-traders, the
British, Dutch, Bostonian, and
Jewish-ethnic slave runners.  
   The Scottish Rite was formally
organized in the U.S.A. in 1801, as a
group of Tory partisans on the losing
side of the American Revolution. The
Scottish Rite came to rule over
American Freemasonry during the
nineteenth century.  
   American colonial leaders had used
the British Empire's Freemasonic lodges
as political clubs, and had turned them
against the British Crown in the
American Revolution. But in the 1820s
and 1830s, Masonry had been widely
condemned and virtually run out of the
U.S.A. as a would-be dictatorial
grouping, an unwanted ``British
underground'' intrusion into America.  
   With British assistance, the
Masonic lodges were reintroduced, under
the control of the Scottish Rite based
in Charleston, South Carolina, as a
force for Southern secession. Since the
1840s, the U.S. Freemasonic structure
has been strictly dominated by the
Scottish Rite. The Scottish Rite
dispenses the 4th and higher Masonic
``degrees'' of initiation, up to the
33rd. The Scottish Rite was divided
into a Southern Jurisdiction, and a
Northern Jurisdiction based in Boston,
that is politically subordinate.  
   As for Bill Clinton: A spokesman
for the Freemasonic Grand Lodge of
Arkansas told me that although Clinton
was a member of Freemasonry's Order of
DeMolay as a young man, he is not now a
Mason. I have been informed, however,
that DeMolay membership is in fact a
life membership.  
   The influence of Scottish
Rite-dominated Freemasonry is
shockingly pervasive in American
government and culture, particularly
in the South. But it has come under
attack from some surprising quarters.  
   The Southern Baptist Convention
recently voted to conduct an
investigation of Freemasonry in all
forms, and to prepare a report on
whether Masonry is compatible with
Christianity.  
   The Southern Baptist Convention,
predominantly white, is the largest
U.S. Protestant denomination, with 18
million church-goers. Freemasons make up
a sizable proportion of this church's
male membership, perhaps 20 percent.
So this is a dramatic, emotional issue,
a strongly factional issue within
Protestant Christianity.  
   At their annual meeting last June
in Indianapolis, the Baptists also
adopted a resolution against secret
societies, which reads in part: ``we
... call upon all Christians to ...
[avoid] any association which conflicts
with clear Biblical ... teachings
concerning the taking of oaths, the
secrecy of activities, mystical
knowledge, or racial
discrimination....''  
   A leader of this initiative, Dr.
James Holly of Beaumont, Texas, told me
this was aimed at the known fact that
white Freemasonry is affiliated with
the Ku Klux Klan.  
   The 2.5 million member Lutheran
Church-Missouri Synod says in its
official Handbook: ``The Synod has
declared itself firmly opposed to all
societies, lodges and organizations of
an un-Christian or anti-Christian
character.'' The Lutheran Missouri Synod
has also printed an attack on
Freemasonry, which attacks its
racialism and quotes from an absurd
Masonic explanation of why blacks are
excluded from from white lodges:  
   ``There are excellent reasons for
this apparent race discrimination which
only a Mason can fully
understand ... [racial integration] would
endanger the harmony of the lodge....
Secondly, although Negroes today may
technically fulfill the Masonic
requirement of being `free,' their
subordinate economic, educational, and
cultural position is such that they
hardly fulfill the spirit of that
prerequisite to initiation.''  
 
   `The True Religion of Masonry'
 
   But let us ask, does Mr. Pike's
organization have an ``un-Christian or
anti-Christian character''? Albert Pike
responded in 1861 to a Mason who tried
to claim the Scottish Rite was somehow
Christian. Pike said that if the
Scottish Rite ``had a Christian basis,
how did it chance that most of those
who had possession of it in this
country from 1763 to 1800 were
Hebrews?''  
   In fact, Pike and the Scottish
Rite borrowed a good deal of numerology
and other superstition from the Jewish
cabala, a neo-pagan tradition in
direct opposition to the Mosaic law
underlying the Jewish religion. We
shall deal later on with the
relationship of Jews to the Scottish
Rite.  
   But if the Rite is not
specificially Christian, is it
anti-Christian?  
   We may judge this from Sovereign
Grand Commander Pike's words, on his
{method}, and on the {true religion}.  
   In Pike's book, {Morals and Dogma,}
the Scottish Rite's main guide to the
universe, he explains his method:  
   ``Magic is the science of the
ancient magi....  
   ``Magic unites in one and the same
science, whatsoever Philosophy can
possess that is most certain, and
Religion of the Infallible and the
Eternal. It perfectly ... reconciles
these two terms ... faith and reason
... those who accept [magic] as a rule may
give their will a sovereign power that
will make them the masters of all
inferior beings and of all errant
spirits; that is to say, will make them
the Arbiters and Kings of the
World....''  
   Pike wrote this particular section
to instruct ``Sublime Princes of the
Royal Secret'' gentlemen of the 32nd
Degree, such as was Bill Clinton's
preacher.  
   Thus, Pike is an illusionist, a
conjurer, teaching his priesthood the
means of controlling their squads of
initiates. But what is the underlying
belief? In France in 1889, Pike said:  
   ``That which we must say to the
crowd is, we worship a God, but it is
the God one adores without
superstition.... The Masonic religion
should be, by all of us initiates of
the high degrees, maintained in the
purity of the Luciferian Doctrine. If
Lucifer were not God, would Adonay (the
God of the Christians) whose deeds
prove his cruelty, perfidy and hatred
of man, barbarism and repulsion to
science, would Adonay and his priests
calumniate him?  
   ``Yes, Lucifer is God, and
unfortunately Adonay is also God. For
the eternal law is that there is no
light without shade, no beauty without
ugliness, no white without black, for
the absolute can only exist as two
Gods.... Thus, the doctrine of Satanism
is a heresy; and the true and pure
philosophical religion is the belief in
Lucifer, the equal of Adonay; but
Lucifer, God of Light and God of Good,
is struggling for humanity against
Adonay, the God of Darkness and Evil.''  
   This quote, by the way, is
available in French and English in the
Albert Pike vertical file at the
library of the Scottish Rite Southern
Jurisdiction at 1733 16th St. NW,
Washington D.C.  
 
   The Terror Project
 
   The Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
an instrument of British Empire
strategy, directed a continuous
offensive of murder and racist
terrorism against the U.S.A. and
neighboring countries, during the
middle decades of the last century. We
shall trace this endeavor, from the
U.S. occupation of Mexico in the
Mexican War (1846-48), to the
slaveowners' rebellion or U.S. Civil
War (1861-65), through the Ku Klux
Klan's war against Reconstruction of
the South (1867-1870s).  
   A few individuals will come into
view repeatedly as gang leaders and
project directors: Boston's {Albert
Pike}, boss of Arkansas; New York's
{John A. Quitman}, boss of
Mississippi; New York's {John
Slidell}, boss of Louisiana;
Slidell's nephew and partner, British
banker{ August Belmont, }boss
of the Democratic Party; Slidell's
trainee and partner, Britain's
{Judah Benjamin}, boss of the
Confederate secret service.  
   Patriots such as then-Congressman
Abraham Lincoln saw the 1846 U.S.
invasion of Mexico as a crime and
folly, pushed by strategists of slavery
who also aimed at the destruction of
the U.S.A. Transplanted Southern
Democrat John Slidell, and Whig leader
Caleb Cushing, spokeman for Boston's
opium and slave-running fortunes, had
both planned and promoted the attack on
Mexico.  
   As that first U.S. war of
aggression drew to a close, volunteer
General John A. Quitman became the
military governor and dictator over
Mexico City. The U.S.A. prepared to seize
Mexico's northern territory, the area
from California to Texas. Yet Quitman
proposed to President Polk a plan for
the forcible annexation of all Mexico,
to be an area for negro slave
plantations.  
   During the peace negotiations,
Quitman travelled as a conquering hero
to Charleston, South Carolina. He was
crowned a Sovereign Grand Inspector
General of the Scottish Rite, and
became the most powerful and prominent
member of the Rite's Supreme Council.  
   John Quitman's grandfather was
governor of the island of Curacao, the
Dutch West India Company's slave
concentration camp; his parents had
fled the Caribbean slave revolts,
taking their slaves with them to New
York where John was born. In 1830,
young Quitman had been formally
commissioned by the Scottish Rite,
leaders of the secession movement, to
establish their organization in the
state of Mississippi.  
   In the autumn of 1849, General
Quitman held a meeting of anti-Union
operatives from throughout the South.
They resolved to call a formal
convention of the Southern states for
the following June, to begin the
breakup of the United States.  
   Quitman became governor of
Mississippi in January 1850, and his
Nashville secession convention met from
June 3 to 12. Delegates from nine
states proclaimed the rights of
slaveholders. Quitman and his clique
meanwhile moved to provoke immediate
civil war. He proposed to lead a
private army from Texas, to conquer the
new U.S. territory of New Mexico on
behalf of slavery.  
   President Zachary Taylor faced
Quitman down. President Taylor was
determined to bring the new southwest
into the Union as free states. On June
21, 1850, nine days after the secession
convention, Governor Quitman was
indicted by a federal grand jury for
violating the U.S. Neutrality Laws!  
   The charge was based on Quitman's
leadership of a well-financed
conspiracy to invade and ``liberate''
Cuba from Spanish rule. Then two weeks
later, on July 3, President Taylor
threatened to hang those ``taken in
rebellion against the Union.'' The next
day the President fell ill, vomited
blackish material, and died soon after.
The Quitman prosecution was delayed.
(You may recall that Taylor's body was
recently dug up by Kentucky
authorities, looking for evidence of
arsenic poisoning.)  
   The following summer, 1851,
Quitman brought fellow Mississippian
Jefferson Davis to Massachusetts to
meet with Caleb Cushing. They picked
the man to be nominated by the
Democrats for the U.S. presidency:
volunteer General Franklin Pierce, a
member of their clique in the Mexican
War. Pierce surprised everyone by
taking the nomination at the
convention. Then, August Belmont, the
U.S. representative of Britain's
Rothschild banks, paid for Pierce's
1852 election campaign.  
   Though this blatant foreign
intrusion caused a flareup of
resentment among the voters, Pierce was
elected the 14th President, and his
foreign and domestic backers took
over. Caleb Cushing became U.S.
attorney general. Jefferson Davis
became secretary of war. Banker August
Belmont became ambassador to Holland.  
   Scottish Rite chief John Quitman
was now ready for serious business.
Some months earlier, when he had
finally gone to trial, he was fortunate
that Louisiana private attorney Judah
Benjamin had been specially hired by
the federal government to run the
prosecution against Quitman. The jury
was hung (rather than Quitman), and the
charges were dropped. This outcome
should not be too surprising to us,
given prosecutor Benjamin's own growing
role in the faction of which Gen.
Quitman was then the shining star.
Benjamin joined Slidell as a U.S.
senator from Louisiana at the next
election, and was a top leader of the
slaveowners' insurrectionary
government.  
   Let's look for a minute at the
trio of Slidell, Belmont, and
Benjamin. Slidell had a master's degree
in political dirty tricks, learned as a
member of Aaron Burr's machine in New
York and Louisiana. Slidell had
politically schooled Belmont and had
brought him into the Democratic Party,
and Belmont married Slidell's niece.
Slidell had also virtually adopted,
taught and brought into politics the
young Judah Benjamin, a British West
Indian Jew living in Louisiana. Both
Belmont, and his banking client
Benjamin, were passionate backers of
the expansion of slavery into Latin
America.  
   When he was a young private
secretary for the Rothschild family,
Belmont had toured continental Europe
doing financial and political
intelligence work for the Rothschild
bank, a pillar of the British royal
family. With Britain meddling in
Spain's civil war, the Rothschilds had
sent Belmont off to the Spanish colony
of Cuba in 1837 to ``take charge of
Rothschild interests'' in Cuba.
Belmont's ship stopped over in New York
and he never went on to Cuba, but his
subsequent U.S. banking and political
career was often focused on Cuba's
wealth and strategic location.  
   Following the 1853 presidential
inauguration of their candidate Pierce,
Scottish Rite chief John Quitman and
his New York financiers signed a formal
agreement making Quitman the ``civil and
military chief of the revolution'' which
they would impose on Cuba. Once he had
seized the island, Quitman was due to
receive $1 million from the proceeds of
the revolutionary bonds the financiers
were floating.  
   Quitman's criminal enterprise
recruited as many as 50,000 U.S.
mercenaries for the intended invasion.
But the Spanish authorities brought
these plans to grief. They emancipated
most of Cuba's slaves, encouraged
racial intermarriage, armed the freed
blacks and recruited them into a
militia through which they could defend
their own freedom from the gringo
attackers. The Spanish governor
arrested Quitman's intriguer, Captain
James D. Bulloch, when Bulloch brought
his ship, the {Black Warrior}, into
Havana.  
   Senator John Slidell of Louisiana
demanded the U.S. neutrality laws be
repealed. Attorney General Caleb
Cushing called for a naval blockade
around Cuba. But given the military
realities, saner heads prevailed, and
Quitman was placed under legal
restraint.  
   After the {Black Warrior} affair,
the Quitman mercenary force was
absorbed into a new, more aggressive
movement with enlarged aims. The
{Knights of the Golden Circle} appeared
first in Cincinnati, under the
supervision of the Scottish Rite's
midwest organizer Killian Van
Rensselaer, a longtime underground
military operative for Britain in North
America. So Cincinnati was the northern
capital of the pro-slavery, Masonic
terrorist underground. From there the
Knights spread throughout Ohio, Indiana
and Illinois, down the Mississippi to
the Gulf south, and into Maryland and
Virginia to surround the national
capital.  
   The Golden Circle was to be a new
slave empire centered in Cuba. It would
break up the U.S.A. and conquer Mexico,
Central America and the Caribbean. The
Knights armed and drilled up to 100,000
would-be emigrants, raiders, rapists,
and slaveholders. They were organized
into lodges called ``castles,'' with
Masonic signs, grips, and passwords.
They were to kill the hated Catholic
Hispanics, and fill their places with
black slaves brought fresh from Africa.
This is the first ``North American Free
Trade Agreement''!  
   (The Masonic imperialism of the
Franklin Pierce administration lives on
as the romantic, elite legend of the
Eastern Establishment. They celebrate
that legend in the marriage of
President Pierce's blood relative
Barbara Pierce to George Bush, whose
imperial ideas are rooted in the events
of the 1850s.)  
   Led by Quitman and his allies in
the lower South, the Knights of the
Golden Circle formed the heart of the
secession military machine as the
crisis of the Union deepened.  
   But John Quitman died in July
1858. The Scottish Rite leadership was
then totally reorganized. Albert Pike
was brought into the Supreme Council
and, in 1859, Pike was elevated to
Commander of the Southern Jurisdiction.
While the Knights of the Golden Circle
intensified their terrorist activities
in Texas, and their ``filibuster'' raids
into Mexico and Central America, Albert
Pike pulled together the inner core of
a revolutionary government for the U.S.
southern states.  
   As Albert Pike said himself, Pike
had not even heard of the Scottish Rite
until 1853. Sponsored by his fellow
Bostonian, Attorney General Caleb
Cushing, who inserted Pike's croneys
into office for him in the 1840s, Pike
had become the boss of Arkansas
politics. He had proven his
``Southernness'' by running racial
hysteria campaigns against Arkansas's
handful of freed blacks and against
America's Catholic immigrants.  
   Joining Pike's new Scottish Rite
Supreme Council in 1859 was the U.S.
vice president, John C. Breckinridge of
Kentucky. He would soon run for
President on a secession platform, his
campaign managed by Caleb Cushing.  
   In March 1860, the U.S. treasury
secretary, Howell Cobb, joined Pike's
Supreme Council. (Cobb was a ruler of
the Georgia Masonic mafia with Robert
Toombs and James Bulloch.) If you are
going to lead a revolt against a
government, it is handy to have the
head of that government's treasury take
charge of your finances, as Cobb did
for his Masonic boss Albert Pike.  
   Cobb resigned his treasury post in
December 1860, following Abraham
Lincoln's election to the U.S.
presidency. Two months later, Cobb was
president of the convention in Alabama,
which created the Confederate
government and broke up the United
States. Cobb's name appears at the top
of signers of the Confederate
Constitution, a document which Cobb and
Albert Pike are supposed to have
drafted together.  
 
   The Lost Cause  
 
   The rebellion of the Southern
slaveowners, which brought on the Civil
War, was a British Empire-sponsored
insurrection. The British supplied the
arms used by the anti-U.S. insurgents,
and coordinated the Confederate secret
service activities in North America and
Europe. These expanded efforts
continued the political and irregular
military operations of the Scottish
Rite which had been led by Quitman, and
by Pike after Quitman's death.  
   For the final three years of the
four-year Civil War, Judah P. Benjamin
served as Confederate secretary of
state. Benjamin supervised the
financial and supply relations to the
British Empire and its ally, Napoleon
III of France, and ran the
Confederacy's international network of
spies and saboteurs.  
   Benjamin's secret service liaison
man in England and the Confederacy's
chief arms procurer there was James
Bulloch. We remember Bulloch as the man
who had been arrested in Cuba during
Quitman's 1854 fiasco.  
   John Slidell became the famous
Confederate commissioner to France,
where he married off his daughter
Mathilde to Baron Emil Erlanger. The
baron was an eminent German-French
Jewish banker, closely tied to the
British government and the highest
levels of British freemsonry. Slidell
and Benjamin negotiated the famous
Erlanger Loan, the series of
Confederate war bonds floated by this
banker. They sold the bonds primarily
to British oligarchs who felt poisonous
hatred for the American republic. The
collateral for the Erlanger loan was
Southern slave cotton, that was
smuggled out past the Union blockade.  
   John Slidell handled relations
between the French Empire and the
Masonic ``filibusters,'' the raiders of
Latin America. Slidell promoted the
joint European/Confederate invasion of
Mexico in the 1860s.  
   The Confederate secret service,
meanwhile, attempted to weaken the
resolve of the Union to carry on the
war. The key to their strategy was the
old Knights of the Golden Circle, still
in place in the north, midwest and
southwest, involving pro-slavery
whites--and American Indians.  
   Sioux Indians, strangely organized
into military Masonic lodges, wiped out
700 citizens of New Ulm, Minnesota and
the surrounding area, while the town's
young men were off in the Union Army.
Albert Pike was at the time the
Confederate general officially in
charge of arranging Indian attacks
against the Union; Minnesota was also
part of Commander Pike's Masonic
Southern Jurisdiction.  
   Judah Benjamin based his main
secret service group in Montreal, a
safe haven since Canada was then still
British territory. They coordinated
across the border with Golden Circle
networks in Illinois, Indiana, Ohio, and
Wisconsin, and with the August Belmont
Democratic Party machine in New York.
Agents led by Jacob Thompson planned
prison breaks, tried to burn down
northern cities, and instigated
anti-draft riots in which drunken mobs
lynched black people and burned
orphanages.  
   This ugliness was in vain. But
just when Lincoln's nationalist money
policies and our industrial strength
overwhelmed the rebellion, President
Lincoln was murdered. A dragnet went
out for the Confederate secret service
operators, accused of participation in
the assassination. Albert Pike escaped
and joined Jacob Thompson in Canada.
Judah Benjamin fled to England, joining
the exiled Robert Toombs and James
Bulloch. John Slidell stayed
permanently in France.  
   Confederate secret service agent
John Surratt made it to Italy and hid
in the Vatican, while Surratt's mother
was convicted and hanged on the charge
of plotting with John Wilkes Booth to
kill Lincoln. John Surratt was
discovered and returned for trial. He
was acquitted. But in 1870, Surratt
admitted publicly that he had plotted
with Booth to ``abduct'' Lincoln. He told
of the days preceding the murder, of
his trip to Montreal carrying money and
messages from Judah Benjamin. The
secret service bank in Montreal, where
gold from Britain was deposited for
Benjamin's crew, was the same bank in
which Lincoln's assassin John Wilkes
Booth had made his deposits six months
before the killing.  
   The war was over. But the defeated
Confederacy was transformed into the
romantic {Lost Cause}, an object of
cultish reverence.  
 
   During Reconstruction
 
   Anti-slavery congressmen pressed
ahead with plans for Reconstruction,
designed to break up the power of what
was called the ``chivalry,'' the
feudalist lords of the prewar South. In
Tennessee, the pro-Union faction tried
to increase its political strength by
putting through a law, granting the
right to vote to the newly freed
blacks.  
   The Knights of the Ku Klux Klan
was a terrorist counterattack,
beginning in Tennessee, designed to
block Reconstruction and reverse the
outcome of the Civil War. The Klan and
the Scottish Rite were one and the same
enterprise, continuing the imperial
effort behind the slaveowners'
rebellion.  
   Pike, Benjamin, Slidell, Toombs,
Bulloch, and Thompson were all in exile
at war's end. Though Judah Benjamin had
quickly become a wealthy lawyer for the
British merchant oligarchs, his
continuing preoccupation with defeating
Reconstruction is indicated in letters
he wrote back to the U.S.A. with
complaints such as these:  
   ``I have always looked with the
utmost dread and distrust on the
experiment of emancipation so suddenly
enforced on the South by the event of
the war. God knows how it will all
end!''; and: ``the South is kept crushed
under negro rule''; and: ``I can never
consent to go to New Orleans and break
my heart witnessing the rule of negroes
and carpetbaggers''; and: ``nothing is so
abhorrent to me as Radicalism which
seeks to elevate the populace into the
governing class.''  
   From Albert Pike's British
sanctuary in Canada, on July 15, 1865,
Pike issued a summons to the Supreme
Council, to resume the operations of
the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry,
Southern Jurisdiction. Six weeks later,
``under pressure from Masonic officials
in the government,'' the new President
Andrew Johnson permitted Pike to
re-enter the U.S.A. The Rite was reborn
over the next few years, as money and
messengers went back and forth between
Pike and the Confederacy's sponsors in
England.  
   In April 1866, a year after the
murder of Abraham Lincoln, Albert
Pike's Supreme Council met in full
costume inside the White House. There
Lincoln's successor President Andrew
Johnson granted a pardon to Pike. The
following year, the awed and grateful
Johnson was granted advanced degrees 4
through 32 by the Scottish Rite. The
Masons claim that Johnson's Freemasonic
involvement was an important reason why
the pro-Reconstruction congressmen
tried to impeach Johnson.  
   Albert Pike could not go home to
Arkansas, however. He was still
under indictment for treason by state
authorities there, for inciting the
Indians to break laws or treaties. So
he settled in Memphis, Tennessee, just
across the Mississippi River from
Arkansas, becoming a newspaper
publisher, lawyer--and president of the
Tennessee Bar Association.  
   Tennessee blacks got the right to
vote in February 1867. Beginning that
spring, Albert Pike and a small group
of Confederate generals held several
meetings in Nashville, at the Maxwell
House Hotel, to form the Knights of the
Ku Klux Klan.  
   The name was taken from the Greek,
{kyklos}, meaning ``circle.'' It was no
mystery to the pro-Unionists: The
Knights of the [Golden] Circle had
reappeared.  
   Pike was appointed chief judicial
officer of the Invisible Empire. He is
said to have written the Klan's
military manual and ritual, and was the
Klan's expert on secrecy of
organization--its secret grips, signs,
and passwords. At one of the later
Nashville meetings, General Nathan
Bedford Forrest was chosen Imperial
Wizard of the Klan. Albert Pike
organized the Ku Klux Klan in Arkansas
after General Forrest appointed Pike
the Grand Dragon of that Realm.  
   The Tennessee leaders of the Klan
at the time of its founding were
prominent Masons subordinate to Grand
Commander Pike.  
   Pike's old comrade and financial
backer Robert Toombs returned from
England in 1868. Toombs was appointed
dictator of Scottish Rite activities
inside Georgia, and Toombs and his
family ran all aspects of the Klan
within Georgia.  
   President Ulysses Grant said that
the Klan worked ``by force and terror to
prevent all political action not in
accord with the views of the members;
to deprive colored citizens of the
right to bear arms and of the right to
a free ballot; to suppress [i.e. burn]
schools in which colored children were
taught and to reduce the colored people
to a condition akin to that of
slavery.''  
   In his newspaper {The Memphis
Daily Appeal{ for April 16, 1868,
publisher Albert Pike wrote: ``With
negroes for witnesses and jurors, the
administration of justice becomes a
blasphemous mockery. A Loyal League of
negroes can cause any white man to be
arrested, and can prove any charges it
chooses to have made against him.  
   ``The disenfranchised people of the
South ... can find no protection for
property, liberty or life, except in
secret association.... We would unite
every white man in the South, who is
opposed to negro suffrage, into one
great Order of Southern Brotherhood,
with an organization complete, active,
vigorous, in which a few should execute
the concentrated will of all, and whose
very existence should be concealed from
all but its members.''  
   In the latter decades of the nineteenth
century, British-centered finance
gained supremacy over American industry
and U.S. policy-making. Under British
sponsorship, Pike's Scottish Rite,
Southern Jurisdiction, came to rule
over much of the world's Freemasonry.
At length its headquarters moved from
South Carolina to Washington, D.C.  
   Theodore Roosevelt, a racialist
Anglophile and passionate Freemason,
became U.S. President September 14,
1901, upon the shooting death of
William McKinley. Teddy Roosevelt's
reign was the Lost Cause triumphant:
Roosevelt's revered exiled uncle, James
Bulloch, Judah Benjamin's secret
service chief in England, had
ghostwritten young Teddy's book on
naval history; and Teddy's clique had
finally conquered Cuba in the 1898 U.S.
War with Spain.  
   The Washington, D.C. statue
honoring Klan founder Albert Pike was
dedicated 39 days after Teddy
Roosevelt's inauguration.  
 
    The B'nai B'rith and `Egyptian
Principles'
 
   In his admiring biography of Judah
Benjamin, Eli Evans quotes the famous
attack against Benjamin's pro-slavery
fanaticism by Ohio's Senator Ben Wade:
``when old Moses, under the immediate
inspiration of God Almighty, enticed a
whole nation of slaves, and ran
away ... to old Canaan, I suppose that
Pharaoh and all the chivalry of old
Egypt denounced him as a most furious
abolitionist.... There were those who
loved Egypt better than they loved
liberty.... They were `Israelites with
Egyptian principles.'|''  
   Senator Wade's barb hit its mark.
Judah Benjamin had deserted the
religion of Moses. He had spat on the
law of freedom, the gift that Jews
celebrate in the Passover seder (which
was also Christ's last supper).  
   Since then, other ``Israelites with
Egyptian principles,'' those Jews who
like Benjamin attached their destinies
to the British Empire and its
racialism, have become a vital
component of the Anglo-American Eastern
Establishment; ``honorary Anglo-Saxons,''
they have helped transform the United
States into an essentially mindless British
model imperium. And the racialism they
coauthored has brought tragedy to Jews
as well as to others outside the racial
pale.  
   In the Civil War, twice as many
Jews fought for the Union as for the
Confederacy. Northern Jews, many of
them recent German immigrants, were
strongly pro-republican and
anti-slavery.  
   The predominant Jewish tradition
in the South was not only pro-slavery,
but overwhelmingly Freemasonic.  
   The Independent Order of B'nai
B'rith formed in 1843 as a Jewish
community sub-project in the
restoration of Masonry by the Scottish
Rite and the British foreign office.
Though most of its lodges were in the
North, B'nai B'rith was openly
pro-Confederate. Though it claimed to
be neutral in the war, many of the
Order's Northern spokesmen were
stridently pro-slavery. B'nai B'rith's
post-Civil War leaders were
pro-Confederate operatives, including
later president Simon Wolf, who had
been arrested by the War Department in
Washington, D.C. as the lawyer for a
Confederate spy ring.  
   Rabbi Isaac Wise established B'nai
B'rith's center for the
``liberalizing'' of Judaism in
Cincinnati, Ohio--coinciding with
Cincinnati's other great Scottish Rite
scheme, the launching of the Knights of
the Golden Circle. Wise was officially
neutral in the Civil War.  
   Core leaders of the B'nai B'rith
from then on have been Scottish Rite
Masons. The political establishment
associated with the Order has always
had its headquarters in London.  
   In Richmond, the Confederate
capital, Gustavus A. Myers was
Secretary of State Judah Benjamin's
closest friend and Benjamin's channel
to banker August Belmont. The former
president of the Richmond City Council,
and the undisputed head of Richmond's
Jewish community, Myers was Freemasonry
Incarnate.  
   Myers's maternal grandfather, Moses
Michael Hays, had brought the original
``patent'' and rituals from England to
found the Scottish Rite in the American
colonies. A tory and financial partner
of Boston's slave trade millionaires,
Hays passed his fortune and his Masonic
and British underground connections to
his daughter's husband and sons, the
Richmond Myers clan.  
   Moses Myers, merchant partner of
the Richmond family, was head of
Norfolk's Jewish community. His house
is now a public museum, located on
Norfolk's Freemason Street. Inside is a
large wooden plaque given to the family
by Queen Victoria, in recognition of
the family's long service to the
British crown and cause. Several
generations, living in that same Moses
Myers house, were British consuls.  
   All of Virginia's Jewish leaders
then were Masons, one of them
Rothschilds' official Virginia agent
who was grand master of Virginia Masons
during the war of 1812.  
   After the Civil War, the
Belmont/Rothschild faction took
absolute control over the Jewish
leadership within New York and
trans-Atlantic finance. Joseph
Seligman, who had been pro-Union like
most American Jews, joined the British
banking syndicate of Rothschild and
J.P. Morgan, which ran U.S. government
finance from the 1870s onward.  
   London's Anglo-Saxon and Jewish
employees, banking partners of the
Confederates against Lincoln's
nationalist money policies, were now
merged as the Eastern Liberal
Establishment.  
   While Alabama cotton broker
Emanuel Lehman lived in Civil War New
York, he sailed back and forth to
England raising money for the
Confederate war machine. Continuing the
family tradition, his Lehman Brothers
firm supported the racialist eugenics
movement, and tenaciously defended
their investments in Nazi Germany.  
   But the bigshot was Jacob Schiff
of Kuhn Loeb private bank. Schiff's
power was entirely trans-Atlantic:
Travelling back and forth between
London and New York, Schiff was Sir
Ernst Cassel's U.S. partner and
representative; Cassel--the personal
banker and the most intimate friend of
Prince Edward VII, the grand master of
British freesmasonry. (Edward's son
Albert Victor was supposed to be the
subject of the Jack the Ripper story:
His unapproved marriage was broken and
covered up by the Freemasonic murders
of witnesses.)  
   On behalf of the royal family,
Ernst Cassel managed the finances of
the British Fabian Society leaders, and
the British Round Table in its
outrageous African racialist endeavors
such as {apartheid}.  
   At Kuhn Loeb in the 1890s, partner
Otto Kahn (a British subject) directly
supervised Schiff and Cassel's project
to build up a certain snarling little
railroad man who was a favorite of the
old Belmont Confederate machine, Mr.
E.H. Harriman. At that same time, the
Warburg family joined Kuhn Loeb; the
Warburgs' preoccupations were anchored
in their Masonic Occult Institute in
Hamburg and London.  
   Look at the first years of this
century: Teddy Roosevelt is President,
Edward VII is King, and the racist
cult-master Lord Arthur Balfour is his
Prime Minister. The British Masonic
clique at Kuhn Loeb founded the
American Jewish Committee, and made its
president, Louis Marshall, the official
legal advisor to the Harriman eugenics
laboratory--mother of this century's
nightmare race theories. It was Kuhn
Loeb and the Warburgs who officially
brokered New York's banking ties to
Hitler's Nazis, as well as Harriman's
entree to the Soviet dictatorship.  
   A striking instance of the
Confederate ``Lost Cause,'' persisting
and haunting the present century, is to
be seen in the attic of {The New York
Times.}  
   Iphigenie Ochs married Arthur Hays
Sulzberger in 1917. He succeeded her
father Adolphe Ochs as publisher of {The
Times}, which Mr. Ochs had bought in the
1890s.  
   Adolphe Ochs and his father
founded the ``Baroness Erlanger''
Hospital in Chattanooga, Tennessee. The
hospital was named for John Slidell's
daughter who married the Confederacy's
chief financier Baron Emil Erlanger.
The Baron had bought up the main
railways between the bankrupt South and
Cincinnati. Adolphe Ochs had married
Iphigenie Wise, the daughter of B'nai
B'rith's Cincinnati leader Isaac Wise.
When the Ochs family had lived in
Cincinnati during the war, Adolphe's
mother Bertha had been arrested for
smuggling drugs to the Confederate
army.  
   In 1991, Arthur Sulzberger's
daughter Ruth sponsored the visit to
America of British banker Rodolphe
d'Erlanger, John Slidell's great-great
grandson. At a reception for Erlanger
hospital, he said that his great
grandfather, Baron Emil, was the
partner of Cecil Rhodes in his
nightmare race projects in Africa, and
that Emil and his wife Mathilde Slidell
had introduced Wagner's {Tannhauser} to
the stage in Paris--which was booed off
the stage.  
   Arthur Sulzberger's Philadelphia
Uncle David Sulzberger joined the
Confederate army in Arkansas. Cousin
Cyrus Adler, born on the Sulzbergers'
Arkansas slave plantation, became the
occult, psychic, Masonic, and gnostic
expert for the New York Jewish
establishment and for London and
Cambridge Freemasonic strategists. At
the same time, under the Teddy
Roosevelt regime, cousin Mayer
Sulzberger was president of B'nai
B'rith International and president of
the American Jewish Committee. At that
time, B'nai B'rith leaders (such as the
Sulzberger's partners the Morgenthaus)
directly represented British crown
interests in the Middle East, and
worked as a bridge for Scottish Rite
Masonry between the Middle East and
Washington.  
   In the 1930s, Cyrus Adler,
president of the American Jewish
Committee, coordinated with the
family's B'nai B'rith, and the family's
{New York Times}, to crush all U.S.
political action against Adolf Hitler
in Germany. The B'nai B'rith was the
one Jewish organization that Hitler
deliberately {left open }and functioning
under Nazi rule from 1933 on.  
   In 1939, Britain made a dramatic
change in its policy toward
Hitler--after teaching Hitler his race
theories, after forcefully backing his
takeover of Germany, after financing
and equipping his armies, Britain now
changed publicly to opposing Hitler.
Only at that point, in 1939, about a
year after Hitler finally closed B'nai
B'rith's Nazi-authorized German
operations, B'nai B'rith decided to
``approve'' an international boycott
against the Nazi regime.  
   B'nai B'rith's Anti-Defamation
League recently opened a vicious
campaign to label American black
leaders as anti-Semites, aiming at a
racial conflict, and stomping on the
memory of the young Jews who fought for
civil rights in the 1960s. It is
essential that the religious, national,
and historical character of this
racialism be precisely understood.  
   Now a surprising breakthrough has
occurred. Leaders of U.S. black
Freemasonry have attacked white
Masonry, particularly the Scottish
Rite, as a center of racialism. The
attack is contained in the latest issue
of the {News Quarterly}, official
publication of the [``Supreme Council,
Scottish Rite, Southern Jurisdiction,'']
Prince Hall affiliation, in an article
by Joseph A. Walkes, editor of the
{Quarterly.}  
   Walkes exposes Albert Pike as the
national Chief Justice of the Invisible
Empire of the Ku Klux Klan, and the
organizer and Grand Dragon of the Klan
in Arkansas. Walkes describes Albert
Pike as a ``traitor to his country.'' The
article carries a photograph of the
Washington memorial statue to the KKK
founder. Walkes calls the statue ``an
affront'' to the residents of the
nation's capital, a majority of whom
are black.  
   With this and similar initiatives,
a strong potential now exists for
members of all faiths and ethnic groups
to think about and to solve a central
problem of our era:  
   Fanatical Zionists are urged on by
Anglo-American backers, to brutalize
and displace Arab residents and Muslim
religious institutions from Israeli
occupied territory. Among the
Anglo-Saxons cheering them on in their
blind racialism are many known as
``fundamentalist Christians.'' They have
seen a vision of Semitic warfare in the
Holy Land, ending in mankind's
annihilation, which they cheer as
``God's will'' and ``Bible Prophesy.''  
   This madness has been called the
British balance-of-power strategy. But
its familiar name is, British
Freemasonry.
 
end
~    
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 15, 2005, 02:30:46 pm
Junker, you may wish to keep this passage from the above speech by Chaitkin in the back of your mind:

"At Kuhn Loeb in the 1890s, partner Otto Kahn (a British subject) directly supervised Schiff and Cassel's project
to build up a certain snarling little railroad man who was a favorite of the old Belmont Confederate machine, Mr.
E.H. Harriman. At that same time, the Warburg family joined Kuhn Loeb; the Warburgs' preoccupations were anchored in their Masonic Occult Institute in Hamburg and London."

As we recall, the Russell Trust, Inc. founded Skull and Bones in 1832 after someone in the Russell circles had been in Europe, Germany to be precise, absorbing "secret society" insights which were transferred to Skull and Bones. I'm figuring now that we'll find out which "secret society" in Germany was involved, and it appears it would be  traceable through records at the Masonic Occult Institute in Hamburg. Perhaps we shall see, eh? :)

One other note: Prescott Bush ran (for Averell Harriman and George Herbert Walker) the subsidiary of Harriman Brothers, the Union Banking Corporation, which was seized under the Trading With The Enemy Act in October, 1942. We now know that under Prescott Bush's leadership, the Hamburg-Amerika Steamship Line was the conduit for the funding by Wall Street of Hitler's Brown Shirts.  In other words, the cash to pay Hitler's private army prior to Hitler's becoming Germany's chief of state, came through Hamburg-Amerika Steamship Line's Wall Street banking enterprises headed up by our sitting President's grandfather. Can we even imagine what Americans who lived through WWII shall think once they know this? Damn, but this stuff is interesting!

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on February 16, 2005, 04:06:33 am
This quote is taken totally out of context, but I think it has some relevance. This is from an article (http://www.lewrockwell.com/suprynowicz/suprynowicz17.html) by Vin from LRC.
Quote
"You do not have to accept that there is an organized conspiracy to keep our kids ignorant to get the picture. As long as you realize that things are exactly as they would be if there were such a conspiracy, that will suffice."
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on February 16, 2005, 08:28:33 am
Nice find, Ragnar!   B)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ladylearning on February 16, 2005, 09:23:56 am
Quote
"You do not have to accept that there is an organized conspiracy to keep our kids ignorant to get the picture. As long as you realize that things are exactly as they would be if there were such a conspiracy, that will suffice."

Yes, I agree with Lightning, it was a good find. It's brilliant in it's simplicity. Many people shy away from the truths which are shrouded by the media's cloud of "Conspiricy Theory"!  But the facts are there if once chooses to look.
There can be no effect without cause but too many, too often, choose not to investigate the cause.

LL
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Speaker on February 16, 2005, 06:22:46 pm
Post removed.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Pitchfork on February 16, 2005, 07:01:54 pm
Quote
This quote is taken totally out of context, but I think it has some relevance. This is from an article (http://) by Vin from LRC.
Quote
"You do not have to accept that there is an organized conspiracy to keep our kids ignorant to get the picture. As long as you realize that things are exactly as they would be if there were such a conspiracy, that will suffice."
And to that I would add, that the most dangerous conspiracies, are those not considered conspiracies at all.

But I repeat myself.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on February 16, 2005, 07:56:24 pm
Quote
Quote
This quote is taken totally out of context, but I think it has some relevance. This is from an article (http://) by Vin from LRC.
Quote
"You do not have to accept that there is an organized conspiracy to keep our kids ignorant to get the picture. As long as you realize that things are exactly as they would be if there were such a conspiracy, that will suffice."
The broken link in Ranger’s post is < http://www.lewrockwell.com/suprynowicz/sup...rynowicz17.html (http://www.lewrockwell.com/suprynowicz/suprynowicz17.html) >.

Speaker
Thanks for catching that. I corrected it in my post. Don't know how that happened, 'cause I always preview my posts and test the links before hitting the  Add Reply button. My younger daughter was looking over my shoulder and asked me to use a smiley - so I did - and she picked out which one.  B)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Roy J. Tellason on February 16, 2005, 08:58:26 pm
Quote
Quote
This quote is taken totally out of context, but I think it has some relevance. This is from an article (http://) by Vin from LRC.
Quote
"You do not have to accept that there is an organized conspiracy to keep our kids ignorant to get the picture. As long as you realize that things are exactly as they would be if there were such a conspiracy, that will suffice."
The broken link in Ranger’s post is < http://www.lewrockwell.com/suprynowicz/sup...rynowicz17.html (http://www.lewrockwell.com/suprynowicz/suprynowicz17.html) >.

Speaker
Dang,  I didn't know he had stuff over there...     <snagged!>

Too bad so many of those links on his "archives" page don't work.  :-(
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 20, 2005, 11:37:04 pm
Roy, just a side-note to you about that link you emailed to me so many days ago. I want to tell you that I've read that link, days ago, and a number of times since, and another article's link which was embedded in that article, and have spent quite a number of hours dealing with that, so far, and I'm not done dealing with it yet.  I think it is a goldmine for our thread here. I have written a number of pages in response to that article, and when I let a bit more of the dust settle and get enough of a feeling of completion about what I've got written down, I'll bring that article here as well as publishing my rebuttal at TMM. A most amazing piece of work by Popular Mechanics that was!

What I may do for right now is post up here some of what I've presently got, and add to it in subsequent postings. In fact, now that I'm thinking about that, perhaps I should post one part of it here right now. It's an open letter I'm trying to write to the editors and publishers of Popular Mechanics magazine. Let me go see how it stacks up so far... oh, yeah, here it is:

~

Open letter to the Editor, Popular Mechanics Magazine, regarding two articles by Mr. James Meigs published in the Popular Mechanics Magazine.
 
Dear Sirs;
 
One Mr. James Meigs has published some erroneous information in your magazine, and I'm writing to inform you of the problem. I'm afraid that your magazine may be liable in some way for the promotion of falsehoods in Mr. Meigs' articles.  The truth of 911, which runs contrary in numerous ways to what you've allowed Mr. Meigs to publish in your magazine, shall come out sooner or later, and you'll find yourself in the hotseat with other media giants who've helped the Federal government deceive the American public.  
 
The reason I say this is because Mr. Meigs' articles, if left to stand in your publication, shall imply your magazine's complicity in a concerted cover-up of the facts of 911, and that complicity shall be seen by the American public, in near-coming times, as participation by your magazine in the cover-up of the truth of 911. That unfortunate situation shall involve your magazine indirectly in the guilt for the crimes of 911.  As we all now understand, the World Trade Center, on the morning of 911, became a "crime scene". The perpetrators of those attacks at the WTC and the Pentagon committed a massive crime, were criminals, mass murderers. Any publication which knowingly covers up for those guilty for the execution of those attacks of 911 shall have a very uncomfortable time of it, as I'm sure you can imagine.
 
That is one consideration which I feel compelled to bring to your attention.  Mr. Meigs' articles promote in your readers' minds a mis-perception regarding 911, and that misperception is that Osama bin Laden attacked America on 911. The truth is that elements within the U.S. Federal government planned, orchestrated, carried out, and executed the attacks of 911.  
 
I hold those elements to be criminal, and I'm declaring now that more than one person was involved, making it thus a conspiracy to do great harm to the United States of America; in a word: "treason". I feel sure that your magazine would not knowingly wish to become involved in an official cover-up of the truth of the events of 911, and it is from that assumption that I'm asking you to review a bit of counter-intelligence from one little common man who has a computer at his home, myself. Like Mr. Meigs, I have an interest in approaching the public with some information, but, unlike Mr. Meigs' information, which would ridicule me because of my perceptions, my information points the finger of guilt directly at some namable individuals within the Bush Administration and various agencies of the U.S. Federal government and some civilian organizations and/or companies.
 
As Mr. Meigs uses the term, I myself am a "conspiracy theorist".  I am an American who does not believe what the Federal government has declared to be the true accounting of the events of 911. But contrary to Mr. Meigs' reference to people who know what I know about 911, and therefore to me personally, I am not an "extremist", and I am not given to flights of fantasy in my interpretation of life and reality. Instead, I am a fifty-nine years-old father of grown kids, an ex-businessman, an honorably-discharged U.S. Marine and veteran of the Viet Nam war, a successful artist, and a happy individual who has loved living his life amid the best blessings which America offers to anyone. I have had three small businesses, which were more akin to self-employment than corporatized businesses, yet I've had numerous employees and have paid the taxes, the attorney fees, the accountant fees, the costs-of-business, the payroll taxes, the suppliers' fees, and in general have endured three different times in business the whole American self-employed pattern of honest endeavor. I see myself as a contributing member of my community, an aging man who only had a bit of college but who also has a lot of experience in life, and I hardly wish to be classified as an "extremist" simply because I do not believe what my government is telling me about the events of 911.  
 
On that point, we'll recall the Gary Powers U-2 shootdown over Russia, the Bay of Pigs invasion, the Gulf of Tonkin incident, the BCCI testimony before the U.S. Senate, and many other similar fiascos in which the Federal government, even sitting Presidents, have been caught publicly lying to America. I think that every American knows that our government and/or our government's leaders have regurlarly lied to the American people. "The United States did not have a flight over Russian soil"; "The United States was not involved in the attempted invasion of Cuba called the Bay of Pigs"; "The North Vietnamese communists have attacked the USS Maddox in the Gulf of Tonkin"; "I am not a crook"; "The United States did not trade arms for hostages with Iran";  "I did not have sex with that woman". "Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda attacked us on 911". Indeed, there is nothing new under the sun. Excepting that last lie listed here, all of those lies are now a matter of public record, of American history, as I'm sure you'll agree. It is my duty as a loyal American to reveal what I can about the government's lies regarding 911.
 
To show you my good faith about this, I'm going to now include a section from Mr. Meigs' article entitled "911: Debunking The Myths", and follow that with my comment. Unfortunately for Mr. Meigs, I can do the same thing with almost every one of Mr. Meigs' 16 points of contention. I am not happy to have to do this, so I hope that we can resolve the matter creatively after you read what I have to say below. Thank you for your assistance in getting Mr. Meigs' mis-information and dis-information programs purged from the public consciousness.  
 
Here is Mr. Meigs' section which deals with specifically the World Trade Center's building number 7.
 
~
 
begin excerpt:
 
WTC 7 Collapse
 Mr. Meigs speaking: "[conspiracy theorists] CLAIM: Seven hours after the two towers fell, the 47-story WTC 7 collapsed. According to 911review.org: "The video clearly shows that it was not a collapse subsequent to a fire, but rather a controlled demolition: amongst the Internet investigators, the jury is in on this one."
 
FACT: Many conspiracy theorists point to FEMA's preliminary report, which said there was relatively light damage to WTC 7 prior to its collapse. With the benefit of more time and resources, NIST researchers now support the working hypothesis that WTC 7 was far more compromised by falling debris than the FEMA report indicated. "The most important thing we found was that there was, in fact, physical damage to the south face of building 7," NIST's Sunder tells PM. "On about a third of the face to the center and to the bottom--approximately 10 stories--about 25 percent of the depth of the building was scooped out." NIST also discovered previously undocumented damage to WTC 7's upper stories and its southwest corner.
 
NIST investigators believe a combination of intense fire and severe structural damage contributed to the collapse, though assigning the exact proportion requires more research. But NIST's analysis suggests the fall of WTC 7 was an example of "progressive collapse," a process in which the failure of parts of a structure ultimately creates strains that cause the entire building to come down. Videos of the fall of WTC 7 show cracks, or "kinks," in the building's facade just before the two penthouses disappeared into the structure, one after the other. The entire building fell in on itself, with the slumping east side of the structure pulling down the west side in a diagonal collapse.
 
According to NIST, there was one primary reason for the building's failure: In an unusual design, the columns near the visible kinks were carrying exceptionally large loads, roughly 2000 sq. ft. of floor area for each floor. "What our preliminary analysis has shown is that if you take out just one column on one of the lower floors," Sunder notes, "it could cause a vertical progression of collapse so that the entire section comes down."
 
There are two other possible contributing factors still under investigation: First, trusses on the fifth and seventh floors were designed to transfer loads from one set of columns to another. With columns on the south face apparently damaged, high stresses would likely have been communicated to columns on the building's other faces, thereby exceeding their load-bearing capacities.
 
Second, a fifth-floor fire burned for up to 7 hours. "There was no firefighting in WTC 7," Sunder says. Investigators believe the fire was fed by tanks of diesel fuel that many tenants used to run emergency generators. Most tanks throughout the building were fairly small, but a generator on the fifth floor was connected to a large tank in the basement via a pressurized line. Says Sunder: "Our current working hypothesis is that this pressurized line was supplying fuel [to the fire] for a long period of time."
 
WTC 7 might have withstood the physical damage it received, or the fire that burned for hours, but those combined factors--along with the building's unusual construction--were enough to set off the chain-reaction collapse.
 
end excerpt from Popular Mechanics Magazine's article, "911:Debunking The Myths" by James Meigs.
 
~
 
Now, Gentlemen, let's talk about all that for a moment. Mr. Meigs begins by stating what in his understanding is one of the 16 "myths" needing to be debunked by himself and his battery of experts, scientists, engineers, and etc. He notes that: "According to 911review.org: "The video clearly shows that it was not a collapse subsequent to a fire, but rather a controlled demolition: amongst the Internet investigators, the jury is in on this one."  
 
Then Mr. Meigs proceeds to debunk that statement, which, however, is current knowledge, using NIST geniuses in his attempt to disprove what 911review.org has stated very clearly, that the building was imploded from within, was "pulled", was demolished professionally. I can certainly understand why it would seem important to Mr. Meigs to debunk that notion quickly and efficiently, because if it were to come to light that bombs had been planted into building number 7 prior to the plane attacks of that morning, somebody inside our government would be in quite a stew, don't you agree?  
 
The government story, for up to a full year after 911, did not include any possibility of building number 7 having been professionally demolished by internal explosions, and in fact, the government derided anyone who disagreed with their accounting of how building number 7 came down that afternoon. Our "representative" government has accused anyone who claimed that building number 7 was deliberately demolished of being a "conspiracy theorist". George W. Bush and John Ashcroft are both on record with public statements that such conspiracy theorists who would dare question the government's statements about 911 are in effect a danger to American interests, by virtue of the undermining of reality in the minds of any who would listen to their alternate theories regarding building number 7.
 
Let us look more closely at what Mr. Meigs is asking your readership to believe:
 
According to Mr. Meigs, NIST's conclusions over-ride FEMA's reports on building number 7. To my way of seeing the problem, both NIST and FEMA were flat-out wrong, as we shall see herein. But first, let us collect-up the findings of NIST as summarized by Mr. Meigs:
1) Building number 7 was far more compromised by falling debris than initially thought.
2) A combination of fierce fire and structural damage "contributed to"  building number 7's collapse.
3) Building number 7 collapsed in what NIST says was a "progressive collapse".
4) Fifth- and Seventh-floor trusses may have contributed to the building's collapse.
5) South face damages produced stresses which affected columns on the other faces.
 
Mr. Meigs then notes:
 
6)  that a fifth-floor fire raged for seven hours;
7)  there was no fire-fighting in building number 7;
8) the fire was fueled by a pressurized fuel line which ran from the basement upward to the fifth floor, feeding that fire "for a long period of time".
 
And there we have the official findings by the government regarding how building number 7 came down that awful day. But, Dear Gentlemen, nothing in Mr. Meigs' article alludes to  what was on the 23rd floor of that building.  
 
It is vitally important to note that on that 23rd floor of building number 7 was a Secret Service/FEMA/CIA/Port Authority command and control center behind fortified external and internal engineering. The 23rd floor had recently received several million dollars worth of fortifications, the best government could buy, and the bunker 23 stories above the street was installed. Mr. Meigs' team of experts shall wish to make certain notes about that little fact which they overlooked in Mr. Meigs' report.
 
Nothing in Mr. Meigs' article alludes to Mr. Larry Silverstein. Had Mr. Meigs done his homework with an open mind, it might have dawned on him to interview Mayor Guiliani, the Secret Service, the CIA, and Mr. Larry Silverstein.  
 
You see, Mr. Silverstein was, prior to and during the time of 911, the lease-holder on all seven buildings and properties of the World Trade Center. Only a few months prior to 911, Mr. Silverstein had signed a ninety-nine year lease.  
 
Mr. Silverstein would have thereby been in charge of everything involved in the WTC-complex daily functions, as well as in the complex's security contracts, communications contracts, energy contracts, legal arrangements, engineering contracts, maintenance contracts, insurance networks, and other aspects of ownership's responsibility. And, not withstanding the NIST report furnished to Mr. Meigs by FEMA and scientific experts on buildings as noted above, Mr. Silverstein has had the nerve, about one year after 911, to come right out and admit that building number 7 was demolished professionally.  He says building number 7 was brought down by professionally-executed controlled demolition.
 
Yes, Mr. Silverstein made a little speech about that. C-Span chanced to film his public statement live, and many thousands of Americans have video copies of his statement in their homes as you read this. I personally have three different films by three different producers who've included that footage for distribution. Here is what Mr. Silverstein confessed, approximately one year after 911:
 
"I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse."  
 
Now, Sirs, in light of Mr. Silverstein's public and filmed documented statement of approximately one year after 911, in which he says the FDNY and himself decided to "pull" building number 7 and then "we watched the building collapse", I'm wondering how much gravity your readers might put into Mr. Meig's "debunking" of the conspiracy theorists' claim that that building was professionally demolished?  
 
Sirs, FEMA is a part of the group of conspirators inside our own government which assisted in the attacks of 911. I will leave you with that thought. It is hardly fruitful to consult the guilty for explanations when trying to investigate a crime such as 911. I will be glad to forward to you and Mr. Meigs a copy of Larry Silverstein on tape saying he and FDNY "pulled" number 7, the footage from C-Span's filming of his public statement.  
 
Sincerely,
Elias Alias
The Mental Militia
http://www.thementalmilitia.org (http://www.thementalmilitia.org)

end

~

I'm hoping you and other readers here will tell me if I'm being too crazy, or not, lol!

Salute!
Elias
 
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ladylearning on February 20, 2005, 11:55:59 pm
Quote

I'm hoping you and other readers here will tell me if I'm being too crazy, or not, lol!

 
Nope. Excellent job, nicely written.

LL
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Junker on February 21, 2005, 03:48:24 am
Oh yes, on the ball, Elias.

And,

http://www.rense.com/general62/ppop.htm (http://www.rense.com/general62/ppop.htm)
- - -
'Popular Mechanics' & Other CIA Front Organizations

I have just read Mr Jim Hoffman's response at http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/pm/index.html (http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/pm/index.html)
to the recent article in 'Popular Mechanics' at
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/de...html?page=1&c=y (http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1227842.html?page=1&c=y)
that tries to debunk the truth about 9/11 by the use of the 'straw man' tactic. Although everything in his response is quite correct and exposes the straw man for what it is, I feel Mr Hoffman was dealing with this particular issue at the wrong level. Approached from a different angle the article tells us who really was behind 9/11 and who is still desperately trying to cover it up.

'Popular Mechanics' is published by the Hearst Corporation,...
- - -

With the usual cast of NYC players.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Lightning on February 21, 2005, 07:47:43 am
Quote
Quote

I'm hoping you and other readers here will tell me if I'm being too crazy, or not, lol!

 
Nope. Excellent job, nicely written.

LL
Indeed, Elias, and LL.  You come across as quite reasonable and credible.

As you say, General...Salute!   B)  
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on February 21, 2005, 08:26:55 am
It's very, um, thorough, there, Elias.  You have to shorten it way down or it'll never even get read.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: ladylearning on February 21, 2005, 12:32:42 pm
Quote
It's very, um, thorough, there, Elias.  You have to shorten it way down or it'll never even get read.
It will eventually, by someone.  When it is, it's thoroughness will do justice to it.
I imagine many have written with more brevity and in hindsight wished it were more thorough. But once it's out there, it's out there.

LL
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 21, 2005, 01:18:26 pm
Quote
It's very, um, thorough, there, Elias.  You have to shorten it way down or it'll never even get read.
Thanks for bringing up that observation, penguines.  I'll bet it's length will probably get it tossed aside before it gets read. I can clean it up a little, but it's going to have to be fairly long. Whether Mr. Meigs reads it or not, other people will. I think I'll publish it at TMM where it will be dated, and where it can be referenced later.

I have a lot of stuff already written about this PM article, as Roy sent it to me about a week ago, giving me time to work up something. This "letter to the editor" piece above is just one of the efforts I've done in recent days. The whole PM article is so astonishingly a propaganda project that I spent most of my weekend looking into it.

But although I will take your clue and will try to cut this one to the bone before sending to Mr. Meigs and his pals at PM, I'm also keeping an eye on LL's comment, feeling that just about everything which is in my initial attempt at a letter above is really sorta necessary.  Thank you for your suggestion. :)

Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: penguinsscareme on February 21, 2005, 01:56:37 pm
Elias, here's all you need to say:
The article published in your magazine, written by James Meigs, goes to some great length in trying to explain that WTC 7 went down as the result of fire damage, not a controlled demolition.  Unfortunately for his premise, Mr. Larry Silverstein, a principle lease holder on all three WTC buildings, was quoted for the record as having said in reference to WTC7:
"I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse."

Even if you want to say more, say the above part first.  I think the way you have it is much longer than it needs to be, but if you really feel that you don't want to shorten it, then at least make your point early and then say whatever else.  Don't bury your lead, as they say in journalism.
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 21, 2005, 11:42:43 pm
Okay, penguines, we'll work this out. I think there must be a fine solution since both of us know reasons to support our differing positions on this.  I think you're totally right about keeping it short and sweet, and the length into which you compacted the rebuttal to Meig's premise actually does make its point so quickly that anyone screening Meig's emails at PM will at least read all of it. I like that, for effectiveness.

But I also like to put more than just the indifferent facts (Silverstein) into the fray. I want the editor to know that some people out here in the public at large may view the willful cover-up of governmental complicity in 911 as a liability for PM once the truth gets out. I think a similar fate awaits all the CFR-controlled media giants, and I want to show editors like those at PM that the stakes are likely now to be higher than ever in the history of the press.  In other words, I want the bastards who're helping Cheney and Bush cover up their roles in 911 to pay with the full wrath of the consuming public once this truth comes out. And I want to offer the editors of PM the early option of fessing up. I want them to retract that article or face the judgment of the people. And I want them to know that is what I'm revealing for them as their choices: either comply with the government's coverup, or support the truth for the American people. I'll be interested to see how PM's editorship reflects on that.

Having said that, I'm now willing to listen rationally to your critique regarding length of the letter. And now I think I've found a way to have my cake and eat it too, thanks to your genuine concern and sharing spirit. :)

I'll post to TMM the version I've already put here. And I'll compose a letter to them along your given model, keeping it about that short and concise. I'll add the link to the longer version at TMM, as an addendum below the letter. I'll be back tomorrow with my take on your suggested version of the letter, and we can hash out the final polishing of the thing right here.

Meanwhile, I'm off to find a file of something REALLY long to post up here next, lol! :)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Roy J. Tellason on February 22, 2005, 01:55:17 am
Quote
I want the editor to know that some people out here in the public at large may view the willful cover-up of governmental complicity in 911 as a liability for PM once the truth gets out. I think a similar fate awaits all the CFR-controlled media giants, and I want to show editors like those at PM that the stakes are likely now to be higher than ever in the history of the press.  In other words, I want the bastards who're helping Cheney and Bush cover up their roles in 911 to pay with the full wrath of the consuming public once this truth comes out.
 
Maybe I'm just not looking at the right stuff or something,  or maybe I'm just being overly pessimistic,  but where is there any indication whatsoever that Joe Sixpack and the rest of the public at large gives a crap whatsoever about any of this stuff?

I read The Black Arrow in the past few days (helluva good book,  there),  and people in that were getting pushed a *lot* further than people are getting pushed in our society now.  And it took a whole lot of stuff to go down before things changed,  though they eventually did,  around the end of the book.  I've read a few other similarly oriented novels, and they all seem to read similarly in some respects -- that given some momentum,  people _will_ wake up,  and do what needs to be done.

But looking outside of these circles we move in,  I Just don't see it.

Am I being overly pessimistic here?  Missing something that I should be seeing?  Not seeing trends of some sort?
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 22, 2005, 12:43:27 pm
Quote
Maybe I'm just not looking at the right stuff or something,  or maybe I'm just being overly pessimistic,  but where is there any indication whatsoever that Joe Sixpack and the rest of the public at large gives a crap whatsoever about any of this stuff?

(snip)

Am I being overly pessimistic here?  Missing something that I should be seeing?  Not seeing trends of some sort?
Unless I'm wrong, more than one thousand and four hundred U.S. families have dead sons/daughters from the Iraq thing at this time.  They, and their friends and neighbors, and their co-workers and church-members, all have to question what America is doing in Iraq. Ultimately, they invariably must realize that we're in Iraq as a direct result of what happened on 911. That's pretty huge, when we pause to think on it.

The language in the House and Senate versions of the Draft bills, which are still sitting there on our Congressional books despite the House having voted its version down prior to the recent elections, has got many more thousands of Americans edgy, especially since that language includes their daughters as well as their sons. (Most, however, are unaware that the bills would also permit government to draft their children into service under the Homeland Security Department.)

Then there are the sensitive Americans who oppose U.S. foreign policy as being conducted by the neo-con powers behind the White House at present, the Iraqi war being their center of focus.

Then there is the general air of fear regarding Social Security, and that is affecting our elder generation to some degree. There is also the uncertainty about the U.S. dollar, and the tightening grip of the Stock Market upon all who invest therein, and that is a tension in the public mind.

Then there are the church-going set who are beginning to hear from their pulpits that a New World Order thrust may be threatening freedom of religion in this nation.

And there is also the small segment of American society called loosely, "Civil Libertarians", who know full well that this nation is in the hands of a criminal syndicate working for the New World Order and its goal of a one-world government.

And then there is you and me, and whatever you and I may choose to speak about with those other citizens with whom we come into contact today while making our rounds.

All the above have a vested interest in discovering the sick hidden truth behind 911, and the globalizing socialist bankers have an even larger vested interest in keeping that sick hidden truth from surfacing in the public consciousness.

Popular Mechanics has gone to great trouble to compile this report and publish it for their readers. Why did PM go to so much trouble? To find that answer, let us look at the "background" piece which Meigs wrote to accompany his article. Here it is in its entirety:

~

begin Meigs' intro piece to PM's article entitled "911: Debunking The Myths"

The Lies Are Out There
 
 
BY JIM MEIGS
 
 
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion," the great Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan of New York was fond of saying. "He is not entitled to his own facts."  
 
 
It has been 3-1/2 years since the September 11 attacks. In that time, the American people have questioned why we were caught off guard and have demanded to know the whole story behind the events of that terrible day. But as a society we accept the basic premise that a group of Islamist terrorists hijacked four airplanes and turned them into weapons against us.  
 
Sadly, the noble search for truth is now being hijacked by a growing army of conspiracy theorists. A few of these skeptics make a responsible effort to sift through the mountain of information, but most ignore all but a few stray details they think support their theories. In fact, many conspiracy advocates demonstrate a maddening double standard. They distrust every bit of the mainstream account of 9/11, yet happily embrace the flimsiest evidence to promote their wildest notions: that Osama bin Laden attacked the United States with help from the CIA; that the hijacked planes weren't commercial jets, but military aircraft, cruise missiles or remote-control drones; that the World Trade Center buildings were professionally demolished.  
 
These 9/11 conspiracy theories, long popular abroad, are gradually--though more quietly--seeping into mainstream America. Allegations of U.S. complicity in the attacks have become standard fare on talk radio and among activists on both the extreme left and the extreme right of the political spectrum.  
 
[Caption under a photo on that page:
"ASSAULT ON THE TRUTH: Three and a half years after 9/11, conspiracy theorists are trying to rewrite history."]
 
Don't get me wrong: Healthy skepticism is a good thing. Nobody should take everything they hear--from the government, the media or anybody else--at face value. But in a culture shaped by Oliver Stone movies and "X-Files" episodes, it is apparently getting harder for simple, hard facts to hold their own against elaborate, shadowy theorizing.  
 
Fortunately, facts can be checked. For our special report, PM compiled a list of the 16 most common claims made by conspiracy theorists, assertions that are at the root of virtually every 9/11 alternative scenario. These claims all involve fields that are part of PM's core expertise--structural engineering, aviation, military technology and science.
 
 We assembled a team of reporters and researchers, including professional fact checkers and the editors of PM, and methodically analyzed all 16 conspiracy claims. We interviewed scores of engineers, aviation experts, military officials, eyewitnesses and members of the investigative teams who have held the wreckage of the attacks in their own hands. We pored over photography, maps, blueprints, aviation logs and transcripts. In every single instance, we found that the facts used by conspiracy theorists to support their fantasies were mistaken, misunderstood or deliberately falsified.  
 
Reasonable people are entitled to wish that our government had been better prepared and more alert. But those who peddle fantasies that this country encouraged, permitted or actually carried out the attacks are libeling the truth--and disgracing the memories of the thousands who died that day.

end Meigs' intro article from above link

~

Roy, the key words in Meigs' intro are these: "Sadly, the noble search for truth is now being hijacked by a growing army of conspiracy theorists."

I submit that there is a reason why PM decided to research, write, and publish this article, and I further submit that that reason has to do with that "growing army of conspiracy theorists" who continue, as am I doing, to point out the obvious flaws in the government's official story of what happened to us on 911.

The mass media is not letting on like this grassroots movement is happening across America, but that should not surprise us. The media is controlled so that it can control the public consciousness, program us. It is not likely to help us disprove the government's lies, so it will certainly not laud grassroots efforts to unite people in demanding an open investigation into 911. But I'm saying that there are many more Americans right now who are aware that the government has some explaining to do regarding 911, and as just one little example, I'll tell you about a newspaper someone out here recently gave me.

President Bush's hometown (now) is Crawford, Texas. I've just been given a copy of the Crawford, Texas newspaper. The front page features in headlines an interview by that paper with Dave von Kleist, of the Power Hour radio show. Dave von Kleist is the dude who made the film, "911 In Plane Site", which is taking the country by storm. His picture is large on the front page of George Bush's hometown newspaper! And that interview runs about three and a half pages of the newspaper! It's a positive, warming interview, and it flat-out challenges the government's story about 911, including the myth that Osama bin Laden did the attacks.

I mention that as an example. But as another example, I'll add this. Locally here in Bozeman, Montana, on the talk-radio show "Open Range" at KMMS 1450 AM,  in just the past week and a half, I've called in twice and been allowed to speak for several minutes each time. Not only am I now allowed time on that broadcast, but others in this area are also allowed time to speak their thoughts and observations. There are a number of people here who know what we know and who know *who* and *what* is behind 911, and they're talking fast out there among the local citizenry. We've presently got two Montana State Representatives introducing legislations which would prevent Montana's sovereign government from being used by the Federal government to harass Montanans about their guns and use the Montana drivers' license as part of the national ID card, and these locally-elected Representatives were voted into office by people like us. They are gaining support, as evidenced by the Honorable Diane Rice's HB304 passing the Montana House of Representatives already. That lady, the Honorable Diane Rice, has had one in-person conversation with me and several email exchanges with me, and she has invited me to fill her in on my "theories", which I'm doing swiftly here on my keypad. She is the Chair of the House Judiciary for the Montana State House of Representatives, and now she's a new friend of mine who *WANTS* to know what I'm telling her.

Examples like that, Roy, are what encourages me to hope that the damned truth of 911 will finally "out". And when that does happen (if it does) any news media which was deliberately censoring the news and working to obscure the facts of 911, in other words, any media organ which helped government cover up its guilt and persuade the public to believe a lie, is going to have to answer to the American people in a court of law. I'll personally see to that, lol! :)

Let us *envision* our victory, and repeat that vision daily in our minds, fortifying thereby ourselves for the coming struggle for freedom.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Conspiracy Theory
Post by: Elias Alias on February 22, 2005, 01:38:33 pm
Ronald Reagan was an actor. He was a Hollywood actor with a lengthy career.  He was no Paul Neuman or Steve McQueen or Jimmy Stewart, but he kept himself busy doing roles in movies. Acting. He was a known actor.  And he was a family man, a popular man, a real man, a friendly man and a neighborly man.  
 
Ronald Reagan was all those things and more, so it is easy to see why and how the American people loved the man. Perhaps it was because he was not a Steve McQueen, or perhaps it was simply his fate, but for whatever reason one wishes to ascribe, Ronald Reagan ended up with the one role which Hollywood can never give an actor, the Office of the White House of the United States of America, the role of "The President". Ronald Reagan blew the roof off of a paltry fantasy framed by Hollywood but never achieved by Hollywood, rising along his way to a power Hollywood can only envy and befriend. The President. The Role of Roles in the 20th Century of Man.
 
And for me that is the rub. Not that he gained the White House; for that may have been an honorable and good thing by which to crown his life; but for playing the Role of The President while he was in the White House.  
 
We hear so much about how he overhauled the economy, Reaganomics, about how he told Mr. Gorbachev to "tear down that wall", how he fearlessly fought the War on Drugs, how he empowered the CIA after the Carter Administration had finally got some slight control over that agency's escapades, how he handled the Iranians, the Nicaraguans, the middle-east, the moral majority here at home, and countless aspects of legacy which adorn his memory today. What we do not hear about is how he played the part, followed a script, did the acting, fulfilled the Role as Actor in Chief, the singular starring Role for "The President".
 
But Reagan, after telling the American public a total mis-truth regarding his Administration's role in the Iran-Contra scandal, was forced to come back to the television in a national address which is now famous. He intimated that in his heart he did not believe there had been any arms deals with Iran, but that in his mind the facts said the opposite.

Quoting former U.S. President Ronald Reagan:

 
The following statements by Ronald Reagan were recorded on film as they were broadcast live by president Reagan in speeches to the American public.
 
"Our government has a firm policy not to capitulate to terrorist demands. That 'no concessions' policy remains in force. In spite of the wildly speculative and false stories about arms for hostages and alleged ransom payments, we did not, repeat, did not trade weapons or anything else, for hostages, nor will we." Nov 13, 1986
 
 *
 
"A few months ago I told the American people I did not trade arms for hostages. My heart and my best intentions still tell me that's true; but the facts and the evidence tell me it is not."   March 4, 1987.
 
(His face is as sincere as any great actor's face in his most important scene of a lifetime as we view Reagan telling that pack of lies on television clips now. Amazing. But do you know what? I think Reagan was obviously duped by H.W. Bush and the Skull and Bones NWO boys, and I think that he really did not know what Oliver North and H.W. and Bill Clinton were doing behind his back. Another very curious point from the Reagan era is the fact that he survived an assassination attempt, which prevented H.W. Bush from ascending to the highest seat in American governance at that time, forcing him to get there via the election scam later.)
 
What those quotes by Reagan are all about is the fact that somebody inside Reagan's Administration, somebody very powerful and very close to him, had deceived him, fooled him, tricked him. That somebody was George H.W. Bush, Reagan's Vice President.  The way I see it, either Reagan was fooled by H.W. Bush and really did not know about the evil Bush was exporting from the White House, or Reagan fooled the world by convincing us that he had no knowledge of what H.W. Bush was doing out the back door of the White House. I prefer to think that H.W. Bush had fooled Reagan, that Reagan really did not know about many items of interest inside his own Administration, items such as the October Surprise or H.W. Bush's and Oliver North's cocaine business, items such as the mining of Nicaragua's harbors and the arms for hostages deals.
 
The pertinent subject behind that statement by Reagan, the great crimespree of elements within his government to which he was alluding, was the scandal which we call briefly: "Iran-Contra".  It is a scandal which has never been fully plumbed for crime inside high seats of government. Many of those criminals who were subsequently convicted by the U.S. Senate and courts were pardoned quickly and released to take new positions today in the G.W. Bush Administration. John Poindexter, for example, who joined DARPA's insanity under Bush the 2nd, is a pardoned Iran-Contra scandal convict.  He was also a pardoned convict in the Phoenix Program in Viet Nam, responsible for thousands of tortures and deaths of civilians in southeast Asia.  Iran-Contra is a scandal which involves the CIA flying, on government aircraft, into this country many tons of cocaine from Central America, providing massive amounts of Wall Street money-laundering, murders, minor conspiracies, thefts, fraud, criminal banking enterprises, criminal proprietaries, blackmail, intra-agency power struggles and conflicts, and more. The boys on the tracks at Little Rock, the plane-loads of cocaine at Mena, Arkansas, law enforcement officers guilty of murder, illegal gun shipments, DEA complicity and corruption, Justice Department paperwork justifying the CIA in not reporting its agents' drug dealing enterprises, Oliver North arranging the infrastructure for all that out of the NSC in the White House, George H.W. Bush's liaison with Felix Rodriguez, ex-Phoenix Program assassination specialist in Viet Nam and southeast Asia, the Arkansas state medical examiner's perjury and cover-ups, the Rose Law Firm, the Clinton-created office of .....elias, get that name and insert it here...... , the whoring of Barry Seals to the DEA, FBI, INS, and CIA while he masterminded the flights of cocaine into the United States on CIA aircraft, the crimes of John Poindexter who was convicted in the Senate Hearings on Iran-Contra, the connections to BCCI, the money-laundering drug-smuggling arms-shipment-facilitating CIA bank with offices in over 70 nations around the world, the criminal bank BCCI which Clark Clifford brought under fraudulent activi