The Mental Militia Forums

General Interest => BULLETIN BOARD => Topic started by: MamaLiberty on December 05, 2014, 06:56:24 am

Title: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 05, 2014, 06:56:24 am
http://thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=34608.msg429376#msg429376

From Elias:

Quote
I think, in closing, that this place could recognize that it has a mission inherent in its very name, and the country is ready to look more closely into the whole idea of a Constitutional "Militia of the several States" as required in the Constitution; and I also think that we're in a mental war for the hearts and minds of the American people, and there is no better way to approach that war for the hearts and minds than to develop The Mental Militia and run this place like we at Oath Keepers run that place. Gooch is right -- Oath Keepers was born right here. I recall the private message I got from Stewart The Yalie back in 2008, wanting to talk with me about an idea he had. He told me he thought that idea would "grow legs", and it did. He will tell you today that I was the first guy he came to with the idea, and I'm damn proud of that fact. Visionary people are not like most other folks. I don't mind one bit admitting that I'm visionary in ways which I ascribe to my personal spirituality. I am a Voluntaryist, and a philosophical anarchist -- but I'm willing to come off my exalted high horse about my personal views long enough to share the light with those who are searching for some truth with which to answer the threat of the coming martial law. The question is: Is TMM ready and willing to step down off their libertarian purist high horse to become an effective tool for liberty? Or would TMM prefer to go quietly into that good night as people continue to lose interest in "just talking" on forums?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 05, 2014, 11:48:07 am
It would be refreshing to have someone to argue with again.  Muwahahaha.

Be warned...  I won't tiptoe around about the principles of voluntaryism like I do at the OK forums.  And don't expect me to play nice with JBTs who will surely show up and make excuses for the criminality of their fellow professional bullies.

I don't want to lose my happy home here.  I was invited to the Survival Podcast forums and then banned later because I wouldn't kiss the ass of one of their prominent posters who was a cop / blackwater mercenary.  I stopped speaking my mind about legalized thuggery at Oath Keepers forums because Stewart asked me to.

I want assurance that I can continue to speak my mind freely without worrying about scaring someone away or that their wittow feewings might get huwted.

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: knobster on December 05, 2014, 12:29:31 pm
I want assurance that I can continue to speak my mind freely without worrying about scaring someone away or that their wittow feewings might get huwted.

People come and go all the time from this forum.  If they can't handle the opinionated folks here then they'll leave.  I remember when I was first here and was very much pro-military, pro-cop and got a virtual butt-kicking from many of the fine folks here.  I survived and, looking back, am very appreciative.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 05, 2014, 12:36:49 pm
It would be refreshing to have someone to argue with again.  Muwahahaha.
<snip>
I want assurance that I can continue to speak my mind freely without worrying about scaring someone away or that their wittow feewings might get huwted.

Seems to me that the question is how we argue. This gives a pretty good picture of the possibilities. https://www.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=34621.msg429387#new

While I'm not at all interested in an argument with a thin skinned statist, and have no intention of compromising that, there does seem to be room for civil discussion of things we don't agree with. Much more of the why, documentation, rational and logical analysis... and no "you're stupid," type remarks - from us anyway.

As for "assurances," I can't issue any guarantee that you won't be challenged unpleasantly, upset and maybe have  your own feelings hurt.  If we invite the politically migrant, homeless, seeking for a better world types - especially from an outfit like Oathkeepers, I suspect it's not going to be an easy read, an automatic "sell," or even a peaceful relationship at all with some of them.

Obviously, if they don't want to discuss things and start to trash the "house" here with personal attacks, we simply toss them out. Don't see a problem with that either. But that's what we're asking. Is this what we want to do? Is there something else we could do instead? Let's start out with an open mind anyway. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Who...me? on December 05, 2014, 01:10:20 pm
As ML points out, the trick is not to lose your cool when someone calls you something you don't like.  If someone finds out you have a weakness for a certain word or train of thought they will brandish that weapon every time you disagree with them.  And if a new bunch rolls in, especially from OK, there WILL be disagreements.   The key is not to instantly respond if you are insulted, or better yet DO NOT be insulted in the first place.  Take a moment and cool off a bit the come back with a reasoned response that does not fall prey to name calling.   Point out that you are just having a conversation that includes differing opinions.  Remember that you will never sway someone to your side by calling them names.

And above all remember that there are many ways to say the same thing. Be nice, be civil, be smarter than they are.  You may just win someone to your point of view.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 05, 2014, 01:52:34 pm
I have a different vision for this place.  It isn't mine; I am a guest here and happy to be one.  This is nothing more than my opinion.

Let me start by quoting the first few paragraphs from Elias's Mission Statement (https://thementalmilitia.com/MissionStatement.html)  My selections are made for emphasis and not to disparage anything I have omitted.

Quote

The Mental Militia is not a formal organization, it is an association of conscientious people who value freedom and liberty in the widest context. We like that brand of Liberty which was originally expounded by the authors of the United States Declaration of Independence.

Mentalitians are people who believe that "consciousness works!", and who prefer the art of reason over violence as a solution to international, national, societal, and cultural problems. We see an apparent and lucid truth in the wisdom of dispelling illusions of mass-mentality by first coming to know and to understand the content of one's mind. We feel that a healthy, integrated, well-oriented mind produces a physical rendering in actions and deeds within society and culture which reflect the unity and cohesiveness of peace, love, and happiness.

The Mental Militia presupposes that to achieve a healthy mind in today's "civilized" world, anyone might begin by accumulating a wide and diversified field of truthful knowledge. Therefore, The Mental Militia seeks the gathering of diverse thought, historic fact, philosophical view, intuitive and creative thinking, emotional input, and analysis of public events involving spirituality, psychology, economics, cultural mores, governance, and politics.

There is really nothing to join with TMM except the exploration of ideas and how they effect your inner-most self. We are simply a growing number of people who confer in cyberspace and stimulate intellectual/psychological growth between ourselves as we discuss, argue, debate, and celebrate the spectrum of Liberty-related premises and theories.

In summary:


That is why I am here.  I come to learn.  I share what I know.  I've made hard money and economics my specialty, places where I'm more likely to start a discussion or respond than elsewhere, where I regularly update long-running threads. I find that trying to teach about a subject is a great way to find the limits to my own knowledge.

I participate whenever and wherever I have something  to add that I think might be valuable.  For every post that I make, I read 20 or more; because I come here to learn.

The bullet points above are important to me.  I want to associate with others who value freedom, who eschew violence, seek truth, and know the spectrum of liberty-related theories.

That's not to say that I want everyone to agree with me.  That would be boring and pointless. 

If Elias directs the Oath Keepers here, how many will join?  Paretto's rule suggests that if Elias sends the message, or creates the link, whatever, 20% of the membership may notice.  Of that 20%, 20% might follow the link.  Of that, 20% may explore of the forum.  Of that, 20% might join and participate.  In the end, I would expect 0.16% of the membership to show up, give or take.  If there are 55,000 members, I'm estimating 88 new members.

If I'm right, this won't do so much to help Elias sell tee shirts or coffee mugs, or otherwise get financial rewards.  But 88 new members would certainly change the complexion of this place.

Let's say I'm wrong, it happens often enough.  Lets say instead of 88 new members we get 5 times that number, 440 new members.  Elias might get what he seeks.

But I will leave.  I've made my opinion of Oath Keeper's known here.  Use the search function if you are interested.  My summary: I don't associate with thugs and criminals, with people who use violence to get their way.  See those bullet points again.  I don't care what costumes they wear or what bangles they've been issued. The name on their paycheck does not alter the morality of their actions.  I want nothing to do with them.  When accosted in the street by a costumed thug, I will always attempt to walk away.  The same applies here.

There are some here who used to be in that class, saw the light, and renounced their evil ways.  Elias is one.  Gooch is another.  I count these men as friends, and I admire them. I admire anyone who walks the path of liberty, even if they came here from a path I abhor.

If this place is overrun with jackboots, cops, thugs, soldiers, people whose job is being paid with stolen money to beat, cage, torture, rob, and kill others, I will leave.

This is not a threat.  I am not angry as I write.  I'm trying to express what I find valuable about TMM, why I've poured so many hours into pounding a keyboard and reading others thoughts posted here. 

I suggest that there is a place for a Mental Militia that follows Elias vision as written, and a place for trying to teach active-duty cops, soldiers, inspectors, bureaucrats, and politicians about liberty.  I think those are two different places.

Peace,

Silver



Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 05, 2014, 01:57:29 pm
I don't need coaching on how to argue on the internet.  I just don't want the rest of us to have to tip toe because someone decided that it was important to get new people to come here.  Specifically, I want to know that "cop bashing," something that is prohibited on other sites I frequent, will not be some new sin that is suddenly disallowed here.

If tax-eating parasites who make their living by using their legal privileges to coerce and intimidate others start coming here, I will not hesitate to point out exactly what they are.

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 05, 2014, 02:10:06 pm
My "better idea" for TMM may not be better at all.  I suggest it as more of an experiment.

If we want to change this place, we must change how we conduct ourselves.  If we want to hold true to those bullet points from the Mission Statement, we should take actions that provide evidence of that support.

To be specific:

I don't read the endless series of dreadful stories posted mostly by one individual.  I've put them on "Ignore."  We all know we're in a tight spot, that things are bad and getting worse.  Pouring gasoline on a fire of negativity doesn't advance the reasons for TMM's existence.  It doesn't promote knowledge, or liberty, or theories of freedom.

I'm not saying don't mention the latest street execution, or spying outrage, or tax mulcting.  I'm saying that just posting a link adds no value and is not welcome.  If you have something to add, something insightful, some way to connect it to the themes that occur here over and over, go right ahead and post.  I might read those.  But an endless stream of bad news without thoughtful commentary is not helpful and doesn't belong here.  I can go to Drudge, Google News, FOX, or a million other websites and forums anytime I want a steaming serving of that crap.

If someone takes the time to write something, and you find it interesting, or useful, or thought-provoking, acknowledge them.  Let others know that you found that valuable.  If you can add a bit of new perspective or additional knowledge, by all means do so.  Providing positive feedback to good posts will beget more good posts.

When someone is being a jerk, shun them.  Don't respond.  Don't take the bait. 

The difference in response to thoughtful, informative posts and spittle-spewing rage by a juiced-up jackboot should be obvious to all.  If you don't respond to the jackboot, they will eventually go away.  If you ignore their posts in an otherwise civilized thread, the message will be sent.

But if you also ignore the work of those who make good posts, if you treat them no differently than you treat a troll, then you should expect them to get the same message.

I'm as guilty as anyone for not being free enough with praise.  I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess.*

It doesn't always have to be praise, but a little goes a long way.  A thoughtful comment in response to post is even better than a pure attaboy.  Keystrokes are cheap, thought and time to think is valuable. 

Those are my suggestions, my "other ideas."

Peace,

Silver

*extra points to those who know where I plagiarized that.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 05, 2014, 02:12:57 pm
I don't need coaching on how to argue on the internet.  I just don't want the rest of us to have to tip toe because someone decided that it was important to get new people to come here.  Specifically, I want to know that "cop bashing," something that is prohibited on other sites I frequent, will not be some new sin that is suddenly disallowed here.

If tax-eating parasites who make their living by using their legal privileges to coerce and intimidate others start coming here, I will not hesitate to point out exactly what they are.

I hope that you didn't take my post as suggesting you needed coaching.  Most of us are grown-ups here, certainly you.

Nor do I worry about your ability to speak truth to power.

It's just not a job I want.  Those are not the people I seek.  They have nothing to offer that I value.  That's why I would leave.

Peace,

Silver
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 05, 2014, 02:27:10 pm
ML speaks eloquently about how we can and should conduct ourselves:

Quote
Seems to me that the question is how we argue. This gives a pretty good picture of the possibilities. https://www.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=34621.msg429387#new

While I'm not at all interested in an argument with a thin skinned statist, and have no intention of compromising that, there does seem to be room for civil discussion of things we don't agree with. Much more of the why, documentation, rational and logical analysis... and no "you're stupid," type remarks - from us anyway.

I agree with every word.  I've already tried to explain my concerns.  I'm really not terribly worried about this issue: if it goes as bad as I fear it might, I will simply leave.

But there are people here I care about, even if I don't always agree with them.  For those, let me offer this thought and warning.

If you alert tens of thousands of active-duty thugs, cops, soldiers, narcs, anti-terrorism agents, building code enforcers, policy wonks, reservists, all of whom count themselves active duty and military, law enforcement, and firefighters, some will notice this place. 

They won't like what they find here.  This is not a friendly place for their kind.

But unlike us, people who stomp faces for a paycheck don't place a lot of value on rational discussion.  They don't practice those arts. 

They do know how to make trouble for uppity peons.  We know that they can break our pathetic encryption, track our internet use, get access to our emails, letters, bank accounts, and damn near any other personal information they please.   We know that every one us commits three felonies a day, usually before breakfast.  We know countless stories of people who have harmed no one, and never offered the slightest bit of evidence that they wanted to harm anyone, who were jailed, robbed, and murdered.  By people who are the prime audience for Oath Keepers.

All without a warrant or any articulated theory for reasonable cause.  We also know they will lie, under oath, in court, about how and why they discovered whatever damning information they use to hang you.  Whether the lie is to justify your killing after the fact, or to convince a jury to put you in a cage for life plus cancer, they will lie.  They are trained professionals, testiliars, and they are very, very good at their jobs.

Those are the people that could flood this place.  It takes just one to burn this place down, and take a lot of good people with it.  They will do it.  It is what they are, what they do.  It is all that they know how to do.  And they will probably get paid extra for doing it.

Elias is very brave to associate with these folks.  I don't care to, and I worry about the risks to those who have posted their frank thoughts in this space.

Peace,

Silver
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 05, 2014, 02:32:37 pm
Elias is very brave to associate with these folks.  I don't care to, and I worry about the risks to those who have posted their frank thoughts in this space.

All valid concerns.  I do happen to think that anyone who wants to harm us is already aware of the things we have posted here, however. I'm under no illusion that anything I've written in the past 50 years is not known to my enemy...
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 05, 2014, 02:38:06 pm
Agreed.  I'm not sure that means that alerting 50,000 new ones is a great idea.  Especially if they are likely to come here and get a reception they find unpleasant.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 05, 2014, 02:38:29 pm
It is worth noting that anyone coming here from Oath Keepers (with the exception of possible spies and moles) is already on Fedzilla's "lists" for daring to question the authoritahs and daring to declare their intent to disobey.

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 05, 2014, 03:35:24 pm
There's no doubt that many of the Oath Keepers are or will be under suspicion.  That's the trouble with the Panopticon; it is indiscriminate by design.

It's likely that OK's will be seeking friends and allies.

I don't associate with member of the political class.  Period.  Full Stop as they say in England.

If your pay comes from tax loot, I have nothing to say to you.  I will walk away.  I don't trust you.  I'm not interested in what you have to say.

I'll grant the possibility that a tax parasite might have an honest man inside trying to get out.  Once they've won that internal, personal battle, and provided evidence of that victory by renouncing their evil ways and quitting their stolen-loot paycheck, I'll gladly consider their company.  Not before.

Peace,

Silver
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 05, 2014, 03:47:39 pm
Agreed.  I'm not sure that means that alerting 50,000 new ones is a great idea.  Especially if they are likely to come here and get a reception they find unpleasant.

How many people from Oathkeeprs visit TMM and post in the area already set out for them? They've already been invited, actually, and darn few have bothered. I really don't look for more than a dozen or so new folks to come visit us, no matter what Elias says or does. But we obviously don't have any guarantees... But it could be a very good thing for us, even if it doesn't work out as Elias hopes. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 05, 2014, 04:44:12 pm
I will answer with these questions-
Are we not here to learn from each other?
Are we not here to help each other along on the path to individual liberty and self-ownership?
Shouldn't we WANT to wake up others?
Wouldn't more people=more opinions? More opportunities to learn? More opportunities to share?

Will it be hard at times? Stressful? Yup! Will it be worth it? Double yup!

I'm all for adding to our membership. I don't think that we should rely on just Oath Keepers though. There has to be other avenues to explore. Other sources of people that have decided that they are ready to take the "red pill". Perhaps, we should discuss what and where these other avenues might be. I'm cool on Oath Keepers having a greater presence here, but not JUST Oath Keepers.

Maybe someone could contact Mac Salvo at SHTF Plan or Daisy Luther at the Organic Prepper or other similar websites, and ask them if TMM could become their go-to forum? Get them to give us referrals? Maybe get some free ad space? I'm just spitballing here, but I'm open to anything. Let's discuss it!

One last thing. I don't want to see TMM become a paid subscription forum. It should remain free. I know that I, and a lot of others would pony up a donation if asked. I also want to keep the current format. I like it. :mellow:

 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 05, 2014, 05:23:06 pm
Elias is very brave to associate with these folks.  I don't care to, and I worry about the risks to those who have posted their frank thoughts in this space.

All valid concerns.  I do happen to think that anyone who wants to harm us is already aware of the things we have posted here, however. I'm under no illusion that anything I've written in the past 50 years is not known to my enemy...

Addressing Silver as quoted by ML -- Silver, most folks would not believe the heat some of us at Oath Keepers live with daily, 24/7. We are slapping the idiots running fedgov right in the face and we know from people inside federal agencies, offices, and departments that we're scrutinized, er, rather closely.  The PTB have a quite unsupportive attitude about us, to say the least. ;)

I recall when I closed my store in Georgia and moved to Montana to learn how to write for the liberty movement. I was paranoid to the enth degree. After a couple of years in Montana, with no Feds knocking at my door, it dawned on me that the Feds are too damn busy to worry about a little guy running his mouth on the Internet, so I started relaxing a bit and then I came to my senses well enough to remember that my mental states, and how I apply them, determine my fate after all. Using what some commercialized people call "the power of attraction", I decided to ramp up my daily affirmations about who and what I am, who and what I want to be. I was already doing those affirmations and had seen how they work when I and my partner, who used to frequent these boards using the name LadyLearning, created a very fine retail jewelry business in Georgia, which we enjoyed for nine years until I got online and found out what the heck was going on with our country (that is why I closed the store and moved to Montana). We started that store with nothing but affirmations and her philosophy which ran something like this -- one doesn't need money to accomplish wnat one wants to do; one simply needs to keep one's goal in mind and each day *do something* to add toward the fulfillment of that goal. Time replaces money in such a way. She taught me that, and we built that business with nothing to start with, ending up with a wonderful store at Gainesville, Georgia and a good living (and too much work, ack!). We said our affirmations daily. We learned that "forgiveness" is one's key to escape the past, and we learned many other things which have placed my life in the circumstances I now enjoy. I wanted to learn to write for liberty, and here I am doing just that, and I draw a living for doing it. I am in a square log cabin on 160 acres of Northwest Montana, surrounded by woods, with electricity, cell phone connection, and Internet connection, and grocery money. I'm poor, but all my needs are met. It was not easy to arrive at this, and I did sacrifice a lot to move out here and I've had some really lean times, but suddenly I've got everything an old coot would want -- I'm watching the deer outside my window right now as I type; they're eating hay I put out for them. Here are, now that I think about it, a couple of videos taken from my place here in the north country woods --

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHtux8P-lcw&list=UUnmikWKyF3i5GqmH7vnpZtA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aCI7mMw2_U&index=7&list=UUnmikWKyF3i5GqmH7vnpZtA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bkuIR7pdHA&list=UUnmikWKyF3i5GqmH7vnpZtA&index=8

I've got the perfect old guy's cabin in the woods, surrounded by Nature, an income which lets me stock groceries and keep gasoline in my car, lots of books to read, and plenty of work to keep me busy.

I mention that by way of addressing the mental states I mentioned above. I could have moved to Montana and kept my paranoia, or I could have decided to go beyond my fear and actually try to just live freedom. It occurred to me that each of us has one life to give, and one life to live. I decided I'd rather live freedom than die trying to save it. To live freedom, I had to ditch my fear of "getting caught" by the fedgov. I made that decision because I affirmed what I wanted to be, and life took care of the details for me. I do not take credit for ending up in this wonderful cabin. Life provided that for me once I adjusted my mental states to a level of consciousness which would let it happen -- in other words, once I put my ego-self aside and "let life happen" instead of trying to "make it happen".  I am happy in my old age, and I live without the customary fear so many in the liberty movement have. My friends are all people who are doing things -- it's so cool to talk for an hour on the phone with Edwin Vieira or James Jaeger or Sheriff Mack or Stewart Rhodes or Larry Pratt or any number of others I work with. Once I decided to live for freedom instead of being willing to give my life for freedom, freedom found me and took care of the details.

Why I shared the above with readers here has to do with that same intuition which caused me to name the original group from which this forum has evolved The Mental Militia. It's a mental thing, and it works for me. Maybe it will not work for others, but it's what worked in my life. And now I'm seeing that the message you appreciate in that old mission statement you just quoted comes back to me in the nicest way as I simply try to extend love to my fellow man, especially the ones who are the most in need of it. All cruelty, insensitivity, abusiveness, and other traits of ego consciousness (fear's thought system) is nothing more than a call for love.

I've got a avoirdupois scale, a troy scale, and a carat scale here at my cabin to remind me of my days as a jeweler. Try as I may, I can't get what I just shared in this post to register on either of those scales. The mind will not be weighed in the Newtonian universe, apparently. Invisible and insensible, the mind is the great creator of the material manifestations we call in consensus "reality". The Mental Militia could be a wonderful gift to a lost world, especially if we took the fear out of the works and let this place live for freedom. That is my vision, which I truly cannot defend and which I certainly do not expect anyone else to embrace (though some here do know very well what I've just said and know it in their own lives). Consciousness works. Personal responsibility springs from determining the content of one's mind, because what is permitted to occupy one's mind determines what shall manifest in one's life. That kind of personal responsibility requjires mental vigilance over the incessant chatter of the conscious mind, and only can be achieved by one who attempts it day after day, year after year, as practice being aware makes one more naturally aware in time. I just boot the fear thoughts out of my mind, so such thoughts are not available for my ego to project into my outward reality. I do what I want to do, am where I want to be, and have the spiritual support of wonderful friends who establish for themselves reputations for having done something to help the cause of liberty while opposing the coming tyranny.  The only thing I could want more than that is a danged maid, secretary, and cook, right? ;)

I gotta go for the moment. Thank you for your post Silver. I'll offer you back a good dose of your own peace Silver, and peace to all reading here.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: nurseflo on December 05, 2014, 06:57:40 pm
Silver:  you are quoting that sage of the North, the Canadian answer to Tim the Tool Man Taylor, nemesis of Bob Villa,  Mister Red Green.  Big fan here.

Tmm has evolved a great distance from where it was a few years ago.  So many of the old posters who made the site so valuable have left and been replaced with others who seem more interested in arguing. 
If the goal is to spread liberty, I think we need to expand the membership. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on December 05, 2014, 08:29:12 pm
Commend Pruned.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 06, 2014, 07:39:23 am
Nurseflo,

You nailed it, nice to find a fellow fan.

I agree that we need to expand the membership.  The question is how, and who.  I'm not one to suffer fools gladly, and I won't associate with criminals at all.

Peace,

Silver
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: nurseflo on December 06, 2014, 08:42:10 pm
We used to have a pretty good group around here.  How did the forum attract those folks?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: bennie on December 07, 2014, 03:19:22 am
Well I'm confused (no, say it ain't so joe). I voted to not change the forum and found myself agreeing with almost everything Silver said. I thought he must have voted not to change the forum as well.

Now after further comments from Silver, and by Destin, I seem to have missed the contents of whatever I was thinking.  :laugh:

I don't want to be surrounded by cops, firemen, and soldiers, and other assorted so-called heros. That much I know.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on December 07, 2014, 05:10:34 am
I doubt if that will happen, the last such were driven off. Of course it is different now then the days of  the claire files or early tmm so I am not sure. A lot of the old posters are gone. And I am not talking about the ones who left when the general took over.

I have no problem with Elias making money.  Even if he is a former evil person now accepted by silver.

Gee, if only I and a few others could be so blessed by the mighty and saintly silver.

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: bennie on December 07, 2014, 07:23:40 am
 ^_^ Oh Jamie...I swallowed my gum, started choking and laughing at the same time, and almost woke up my old lady!!

Shhh ... be cool bennie. Settle down, boy. :mellow:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 07, 2014, 08:39:45 am
Well...As I suggested, there is no reason why Oath Keepers should be the ONLY source of new members. Let's start a dialogue on what these other sources might be.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 07, 2014, 08:53:14 am
Well...As I suggested, there is no reason why Oath Keepers should be the ONLY source of new members. Let's start a dialogue on what these other sources might be.

Of course! Any ideas? I confess I can't think of anything right now.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 07, 2014, 09:04:28 am
Well...As I suggested, there is no reason why Oath Keepers should be the ONLY source of new members. Let's start a dialogue on what these other sources might be.

Of course! Any ideas? I confess I can't think of anything right now.
In an earlier post, I suggested that someone could contact people such as Mac Salvo at SHTF Plan or Daisy Luther at the Organic Prepper or other similar websites, and ask them if TMM could become their go-to forum? Get them to give us referrals? Maybe get some free ad space? I could contact them myself, but it wouldn't carry as much weight coming from me. I'm a nobody. :laugh: Mama, you could initiate a new recruitment effort at Price of Liberty. There ARE avenues that we can explore. If we invite them in to look around, tell them about TMM's mission, establish ourselves as allies, and maybe list some of the accomplishments of the forum, it should not be too hard to get some very influential people on board.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: socalserf on December 07, 2014, 09:20:00 am
The forum is Elias' property.
What he does with it is his business.
Nice that he asks our opinion though.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 07, 2014, 09:28:37 am
I could contact them myself, but it wouldn't carry as much weight coming from me. I'm a nobody. :laugh:

I'm not sure any of us has any more standing than you do... :) I'm a nobody too. I can put up something at PoL, and we might manage to recruit all three of my faithful readers. LOL All of my regular co-bloggers are already members at TMM, but none of them have been moved to actually participate. Maybe that's what we need to address first? And, let's face it, most people are very busy just trying to make a living and survive. We have to present something that they see as worth their time and effort for any of them to participate. How do we accomplish that?

I'd love TMM to be open to everyone who wants to discuss freedom, of course, but I don't think "influential people" are the answer to that. They are all VERY busy already, I'm sure. Seems to me that the millions of "little people" are a much more likely source for new and active members. 

And I think we can ALL do something about recruiting them. We don't have to limit our recruiting to on line venues either. There are areas at TMM that address a great many of the interests and concerns of almost everyone living around each of us.  Do you belong to a ham radio club, gun club, prepper's group, quilting group, homeschool... the possibilities are endless.

Why not print out a flyer with information about TMM and hand it out at the next meeting or gathering? I'm thinking there are people in every walk of life - not necessarily a LOT of them, but some - who might be interesed, but might never see an "ad" for TMM, or not even take the time to look at it. But you, handing out the flyer, available to talk to them and share your experience, would present a much better potential for recruitment.

And by "you," I mean everyone, not just DL. :) I'm going to work on a flyer... back later.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 07, 2014, 10:05:13 am
I could contact them myself, but it wouldn't carry as much weight coming from me. I'm a nobody. :laugh:

I'm not sure any of us has any more standing than you do... :) I'm a nobody too.

Trust me, you and others here have more established respect and influence in this realm than I do. I'm just a lowly construction worker. :laugh:

Quote
All of my regular co-bloggers are already members at TMM, but none of them have been moved to actually participate. Maybe that's what we need to address first? And, let's face it, most people are very busy just trying to make a living and survive. We have to present something that they see as worth their time and effort for any of them to participate. How do we accomplish that?

You have a point there. Active participation is more important than lots of new members. Although....the lookieloos are still able to learn without participating. If we can get people to really THINK about things, instead of letting everybody else do the thinking FOR them, we are still implementing the mission, with or without their active participation.

Quote
I'd love TMM to be open to everyone who wants to discuss freedom, of course, but I don't think "influential people" are the answer to that. They are all VERY busy already, I'm sure. Seems to me that the millions of "little people" are a much more likely source for new and active members.

I think that you may have misunderstood me. I was suggesting that we contact the more influential people and ask them to refer the "little people" to use this forum. Create their own category such as we did for SurvivalBlog, Price of Liberty, and Oath Keepers. While they are checking out their newly minted category, it's inevitable that they will peruse the other areas of the forum.

Quote
And by "you," I mean everyone, not just DL. :) I'm going to work on a flyer... back later.

Cool! :thumbsup: I hope that you can maybe scan it and share it here.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 07, 2014, 11:07:55 am
Probably too verbose, but it's a start. What could be added, removed? I started with the welcome statement from Elias and built around it.  Needs a title, I guess. Graphics?  [edit: Now live at The Price of Liberty http://www.thepriceofliberty.org/?p=6352  with a few small changes. I'll publish any others you want as well.]


Have you ever thought that America, indeed the whole world, is going the wrong direction and that there truly ought to be a better way to live than the rapidly deteriorating economy in a police state? Do you long for a truly free country, a free market, and life without "big brother" trying to control every move you make?

Do you believe people can live together in peace and prosperity, in spite of their differences, or maybe even because of them...  How do you think that could work out, and wouldn't it be worth a lot of time and effort to make it happen?

Do you think people have to be pushed into violent revolution, or can we outlive, out talk and out think those who would control and destroy us?

Do you shoot, reload, homeschool, garden, raise livestock, cook, love to eat, play music or sing, enjoy crafts or old fashioned tools, antique cars... and wish you had someone to talk to about them without the formality of most single interest websites and fora?

Do you have friends and family who share your concerns, or do you wish you had more and different people to talk to about all this?

Come visit The Mental Militia - an online forum for rational people who wish to talk to each other and explore both the questions and possible answers, both as individuals and communities.

I and many others share your concerns about the demise of America, and what's happening in the world as well.

At The Mental Militia, you will encounter a wide range of opinions about many different topics, and some of them, I'm presuming, may cause you to think that some of us are not "getting it". But you'll find that there is a very well-honed intelligence at TMM, contributed to by Christians, atheists, agnostics, Buddhists, "leftists" and "rightists", hesitant Democrats/liberals, bashful Republicans/conservatives, free-thinkers, Constitutionalists, min-archists, anarchists, libertarians, tax-honesty people, oath-keepers from the military and law enforcement, Native Americans, a few foreign citizens, and some who are just interested individuals of many sorts. (Did I leave anyone out? - oh, yes - and there may be lurking or active agents provocateur or other representatives of the Federal Power.)

So what you'll find here is a mix of various perspectives on just about any topic. We here at TMM welcome diverse thought, dissenting ideas, alternate concepts, historic facts, analysis, opinions (especially when they can be backed-up with convincing arguments and facts), "beliefs", etc. I would hope that all voices, including yours, are welcome here.

Visit https://thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php  and see if you might like to join the conversations.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on December 07, 2014, 11:59:31 am
Well, when I came here in 2004, it was because of my looking for more of Claire Wolf's writings
And as I looked around, I found that it was much more than that.
Yes people have come and gone, there has been a few wars here, but the information has always been good.
Yes sometimes it gets hard to get over the bitching of some, but this also what makes this forum great, it is free to express what is on your mind.
And like a family, you need to have thick skin at times. you may not agree with everyone, but OK so what.
I can see why some would not post here, for fear of being attacked for something they see as silly, but the poster did not see as such.
And while it can be entertaining to see a thread get jacked and see where it will go, it does come back to what it started as.
As for how to get more people, not sure on that, but why limit it to just internet groups.
Like I said, I came here from reading a magazine, that had Claire Wolfe in it, and she just threw in a blip about this forum in her writings.
So maybe some of our more better writers, could write something about what's going on around them, and have it placed in a Mag/paper/newsletter, with a plug for the forum, and lets see where it goes from there.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: RVM45 on December 07, 2014, 12:07:54 pm
Why is the number of participating Members so low nowadays?

Anyone?



…..RVM45       :mellow::thumbsup::mellow:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on December 07, 2014, 12:15:29 pm
Why is the number of participating Members so low nowadays?

Anyone?



…..RVM45       :mellow::thumbsup::mellow:

fear of being attacked by a troll for sounding/looking stupid in the trolls eyes.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 07, 2014, 12:23:50 pm
fear of being attacked by a troll for sounding/looking stupid in the trolls eyes.

That may, or may not be one reason, but I'm sure there are many other reasons. People are busy, and the social media of choice has gone to other things being two of them. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 07, 2014, 12:34:29 pm
fear of being attacked by a troll for sounding/looking stupid in the trolls eyes.

That may, or may not be one reason, but I'm sure there are many other reasons. People are busy, and the social media of choice has gone to other things being two of them.
There is also the OPSEC concerns. I have suggested TMM to a few people that I know personally that would benefit greatly from and greatly contribute to this forum, but they have declined the request due to OPSEC.

As for low participation, this poll is proof. Only 17 votes out of over 2500 members?!?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 07, 2014, 12:43:19 pm
Some interesting statistics about TMM and who uses it. http://thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?action=stats
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on December 07, 2014, 12:43:49 pm
fear of being attacked by a troll for sounding/looking stupid in the trolls eyes.

That may, or may not be one reason, but I'm sure there are many other reasons. People are busy, and the social media of choice has gone to other things being two of them.
There is also the OPSEC concerns. I have suggested TMM to a few people that I know personally that would benefit greatly from and greatly contribute to this forum, but they have declined the request due to OPSEC.

As for low participation, this poll is proof. Only 17 votes out of over 2500 members?!?

I agree with you on the OpSec concerns, but there is always a way to post your views without blowing OpSec too.
But Mama has a point too. maybe this is the way of it for now.
I do not use twitter, or any of the others forms. I am on Facebook, but is a small way, trying to reach out to my daughter right now there.
But I am also more comfortable with this form of community, than the others. So here I am.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 07, 2014, 12:45:15 pm
Nurseflo,

You nailed it, nice to find a fellow fan.

I agree that we need to expand the membership.  The question is how, and who.  I'm not one to suffer fools gladly, and I won't associate with criminals at all.

Peace,

Silver
Silver,

I don't think that many Oath Keepers would join us here, regardless of Elias's suggestions towards the group. I was just poking around at the OK site. They already have their own forum over there. Why would they choose to congregate here when they have paid membership dues to use the OK forum? I'm pretty sure that our desire for increased membership and participation will be better realized from other sources.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 07, 2014, 12:51:14 pm

I agree with you on the OpSec concerns, but there is always a way to post your views without blowing OpSec too.
But Mama has a point too. maybe this is the way of it for now.
I do not use twitter, or any of the others forms. I am on Facebook, but is a small way, trying to reach out to my daughter right now there.
But I am also more comfortable with this form of community, than the others. So here I am.
Agreed on all points. Well....Except for Facebook. I understand the benefits of your use of that service, but I would never feel comfortable discussing the topics that we do here on TMM there on Facebook. It would be like walking around a battlefield with a big target painted on your chest and back. I can honestly say that I have never been to that site, and I never will. I have actually gone so far as to BAN Facebook from my entire house. Even VISITORS!! :laugh: I too am much more comfortable with this form of community.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on December 07, 2014, 12:53:45 pm
Some interesting statistics about TMM and who uses it. http://thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?action=stats

LOL, hehehe  :threvil:

mama has more time for this than most of us.

21427 posts
1583 started topics
and 148 days, 12 hours, 34 minutes

WOW the life of a retired person.
Luv ya mama hehehe
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 07, 2014, 01:50:30 pm

mama has more time for this than most of us.

I open TMM in the morning and leave it up all day since I work on line. Don't actually visit unless some notification of a post comes in email, which I check frequently for everything.  Been here a long time, that's all. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 07, 2014, 05:45:30 pm

mama has more time for this than most of us.

I open TMM in the morning and leave it up all day since I work on line. Don't actually visit unless some notification of a post comes in email, which I check frequently for everything.  Been here a long time, that's all. :)

That time online stat was the only one I came up on and for the same reason.  I work from home and often have several tabs open on my browser on my non-work computer while I'm working.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Rarick on December 07, 2014, 09:50:15 pm
I would suggest just including it as a reference link, and also have a warning to leave the badge in the box........   I remember how a lot of threads turned out when a guy got all "proper enforcement procedure" with "The Usual Suspects".......
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: RVM45 on December 07, 2014, 11:46:39 pm
EE…

I crossed all those Rubicons long ago. Reckon I'm on quite enough Lists to get me put away forever once they start the wholesale move to True Socialism.

Tact is just another word for Hypocrisy and much Caution is Simply Cowardice Rationalized.

I joined "Facebook" awhile ago. Its the only large (or any) group of toki pona speakers extant.

I got out of the habit of going.

I was interested in the uses of a Language with only 119 words that could be mastered in well under a fortnight.

EE…
 
First of all, true fluency is far harder to acquire than memorizing the vocabulary and a few rules…
 
And,

Second most users are more interested in studying the language as a Linguistic Curiosity than putting it to use.

So I joined Facebook for Nothing…
 
EE…
 
I hear that the Economy means people have less free time and also that the heyday of Forums has come and gone.

SAD... :shakehead: :dontknow:


…..RVM45      :mellow::thumbsup::mellow:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on December 08, 2014, 01:23:24 am
This is an addendum to my earlier post. I agree with Socal. The forum belongs to Elias. What he does with it is none of my business.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 08, 2014, 02:05:32 am
This is an addendum to my earlier post. I agree with Socal. The forum belongs to Elias. What he does with it is none of my business.

Jamie, there are two answers to your statement. In one sense, I do own it, but that is only for legal purposes. I'm the guy who stuck his neck out and copyrighted the site long ago, so that the fedgov goonies would come for me if the site ran amuck or "terrorized" the community. It's registered to me, and I hold the copyright on it. But that doesn't mean I own it in other ways, in ways which are very important to me psychologically and emotionally and morally. My ownershp of the site is purely a matter of legality so the site can exist on the World Wide Web.

However, on the other hand, when Claire wanted to sell these forums and I queried her about the price she expected, I was told she wanted fifteen hundred dollars for the site.

Let me be clear here: I did not give Claire Wolfe that fifteen hundred bucks. The members here did. I just helped start the project of raising money to pay her for the place. Lots of folks pitched in. And although it took us a while, we got her paid in full some time later.

During that transition from The Claire Files Forums to The Mental Militia, I met with the other Admins here and voluntarily negated any special consideration to myself for any perceived or imagined reason. I told the Admins that I did not want to control this place, but that instead I felt it would be best if the Admins -- as a group -- controlled it. So I relegated myself voluntarily to the holder of "one vote" on any issue which came before the Administration of the site. Any other Admin has as much weight here as I do, and I asked that it be that way.

So, in that light, I really do not prefer to go about saying I "own" this place. And it is certainly not mine to do with as I wish, because I relinquished that right of my own free will back in 2007 when it became TMM. I did not then, nor do I now, wish to take command of what comes of this site, which is why I've merely asked what the members here think of the idea of letting me promote the site. I went down to the Bundy ranch, and I've assimilated much press regarding Oath Keepers in Ferguson, Missouri. I've been around the block a time or two, including a march at Quartzsite, Arizona and criss-crossing trips between North Carolina and Washington State. I met Claire in 2003 and was fortunate enough to meet her again; and she and I still correspond. We are dear friends, as I consider many of the people here and the Admins here also. I note such things because I think Claire and the Admins here would verify what I've said above, that I am not interested in "taking" this place, and am not interested in running it unless an overwhelming majority of the regulars and Admins here voluntarily grant me that permission.

What I would do is use my experience in the liberty movement over the past fourteen years as a mental balance in introducing ideas which would make this place not only more popular but also more pro-active in the MindWar tyranny now being unleashed upon the American people. I'm on the Board of Directors of the organization which has twice this year fielded American patriots on-scene with loaded firearms in the face of government troops and police. I'm an associate producer of the upcoming movie, MIDNIGHT RIDE, so named after Paul Revere's famous April 18, 1775 midnight ride to alert the people to the fact that General Gage had sent out of Boston a formation of British soldiers to arrest Sam Adams and John Hancock, whilst retrieving some, uhm, "liberated" fire power the Colonists had stashed at Concord.  This movie is about the four types of "martial law", and is inspired by Dr. Edwin Vieira's newest book, "By Tyranny Out Of Necessity: The Bastardy of Martial Law". Oath Keepers is helping produce the film, and the film is packed with Oath Keepers officers, including myself I'm proud to say. The knowledge and information contained in this movie is the answer to the coming police state and its "martial law".

My idea for TMM is much bigger than just sending Oath Keepers here to stir up arguments. What some here will be surprised to grok is the fact that I'm the editor for Oath Keepers' national website and I've been for years now sharing libertarian and Voluntaryist philosophy with the cops and soldiers who are in our membership. There are also a lot of retired military and Veterans, and plenty of retired cops, and those folks are ripe for being shown a new light on what the Constitution after all is supposed to protect for we the people, including our privacy, our freedom, and all the things related to those things as listed in the Bill of Rights. The movie MOLON LABE, which came out over a year ago, has in its ending screen credits the name The Mental Militia. As I was an associate producer on that film I proudly inserted this place in the credits because I wanted The Mental Militia to be a part of the record, to be a part in the spreading of the message of the Second Amendment, especially on the first part of that Amendment, the part which talks about a "...well regulated Militia". TMM will also be in the end credits for MIDNIGHT RIDE. The viewers of that film will largely exceed the viewership in Oath Keepers -- it's a really big country out there, and because of Bundy ranch and Ferguson and many other interwoven circumstances and situations, I find myself in a very unique position to spread the word of this place to many more Americans than the membership of Oath Keepers.

More on all this laters. I've got to get back to work here. I hope I have, however, set the record straight about my relationship with The Mental Militia. I'm not going to do one thing with this place without majority approval up front, and without majority approval of the Admins as well. Like I said, I've got other venues available to me. I just would *like* to convert TMM back into what it used to be, and put it to good use in the ongoing fight against tyranny. But that is not my call, just an idea I'm offering here.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 08, 2014, 05:08:35 am
Thanks, Elias. I sincerely hope we will hear from other members. At the end of this poll, I will canvas the admins and come up with an answer for you. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on December 08, 2014, 06:14:23 am
This is an addendum to my earlier post. I agree with Socal. The forum belongs to Elias. What he does with it is none of my business.

Jamie, there are two answers to your statement. In one sense, I do own it, but that is only for legal purposes. I'm the guy who stuck his neck out and copyrighted the site long ago, so that the fedgov goonies would come for me if the site ran amuck or "terrorized" the community. It's registered to me, and I hold the copyright on it. But that doesn't mean I own it in other ways, in ways which are very important to me psychologically and emotionally and morally. My ownershp of the site is purely a matter of legality so the site can exist on the World Wide Web.

However, on the other hand, when Claire wanted to sell these forums and I queried her about the price she expected, I was told she wanted fifteen hundred dollars for the site.

Let me be clear here: I did not give Claire Wolfe that fifteen hundred bucks. The members here did. I just helped start the project of raising money to pay her for the place. Lots of folks pitched in. And although it took us a while, we got her paid in full some time later.

During that transition from The Claire Files Forums to The Mental Militia, I met with the other Admins here and voluntarily negated any special consideration to myself for any perceived or imagined reason. I told the Admins that I did not want to control this place, but that instead I felt it would be best if the Admins -- as a group -- controlled it. So I relegated myself voluntarily to the holder of "one vote" on any issue which came before the Administration of the site. Any other Admin has as much weight here as I do, and I asked that it be that way.

So, in that light, I really do not prefer to go about saying I "own" this place. And it is certainly not mine to do with as I wish, because I relinquished that right of my own free will back in 2007 when it became TMM. I did not then, nor do I now, wish to take command of what comes of this site, which is why I've merely asked what the members here think of the idea of letting me promote the site. I went down to the Bundy ranch, and I've assimilated much press regarding Oath Keepers in Ferguson, Missouri. I've been around the block a time or two, including a march at Quartzsite, Arizona and criss-crossing trips between North Carolina and Washington State. I met Claire in 2003 and was fortunate enough to meet her again; and she and I still correspond. We are dear friends, as I consider many of the people here and the Admins here also. I note such things because I think Claire and the Admins here would verify what I've said above, that I am not interested in "taking" this place, and am not interested in running it unless an overwhelming majority of the regulars and Admins here voluntarily grant me that permission.

What I would do is use my experience in the liberty movement over the past fourteen years as a mental balance in introducing ideas which would make this place not only more popular but also more pro-active in the MindWar tyranny now being unleashed upon the American people. I'm on the Board of Directors of the organization which has twice this year fielded American patriots on-scene with loaded firearms in the face of government troops and police. I'm an associate producer of the upcoming movie, MIDNIGHT RIDE, so named after Paul Revere's famous April 18, 1775 midnight ride to alert the people to the fact that General Gage had sent out of Boston a formation of British soldiers to arrest Sam Adams and John Hancock, whilst retrieving some, uhm, "liberated" fire power the Colonists had stashed at Concord.  This movie is about the four types of "martial law", and is inspired by Dr. Edwin Vieira's newest book, "By Tyranny Out Of Necessity: The Bastardy of Martial Law". Oath Keepers is helping produce the film, and the film is packed with Oath Keepers officers, including myself I'm proud to say. The knowledge and information contained in this movie is the answer to the coming police state and its "martial law".

My idea for TMM is much bigger than just sending Oath Keepers here to stir up arguments. What some here will be surprised to grok is the fact that I'm the editor for Oath Keepers' national website and I've been for years now sharing libertarian and Voluntaryist philosophy with the cops and soldiers who are in our membership. There are also a lot of retired military and Veterans, and plenty of retired cops, and those folks are ripe for being shown a new light on what the Constitution after all is supposed to protect for we the people, including our privacy, our freedom, and all the things related to those things as listed in the Bill of Rights. The movie MOLON LABE, which came out over a year ago, has in its ending screen credits the name The Mental Militia. As I was an associate producer on that film I proudly inserted this place in the credits because I wanted The Mental Militia to be a part of the record, to be a part in the spreading of the message of the Second Amendment, especially on the first part of that Amendment, the part which talks about a "...well regulated Militia". TMM will also be in the end credits for MIDNIGHT RIDE. The viewers of that film will largely exceed the viewership in Oath Keepers -- it's a really big country out there, and because of Bundy ranch and Ferguson and many other interwoven circumstances and situations, I find myself in a very unique position to spread the word of this place to many more Americans than the membership of Oath Keepers.

More on all this laters. I've got to get back to work here. I hope I have, however, set the record straight about my relationship with The Mental Militia. I'm not going to do one thing with this place without majority approval up front, and without majority approval of the Admins as well. Like I said, I've got other venues available to me. I just would *like* to convert TMM back into what it used to be, and put it to good use in the ongoing fight against tyranny. But that is not my call, just an idea I'm offering here.

Salute!
Elias

Elias,

That is a noble stance. I take back everything I said about you assuming the rank of general. Just kidding.

I support the fight against tyranny. I won't wolf here other than to say I am all in.

Any maggots that read this. Make of it what you will.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 08, 2014, 06:16:28 am

 But I am in.  All in.
Me too. 100%
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on December 08, 2014, 07:40:04 am
I run my own blogs working to awaken, enlighten and counter the propaganda monster.  I share here and, what I learn here, I share there. Neither is close to enough, but it is what I can do and a heckuva lot more than what most do. But we all could and should do so much more. 

Waiting to get crushed by the juggernaut isn't clever, nor is hoping to hide from it while the rest of the world goes down.  Kamikaze runs at the wall probably aren't the answer either.

TMM, the way it is today, is not a major contributor to our potential freedom. I learn some here, but not only is it weaker than it was not that long ago, even then it was not enough to make a considerable contribution.

I say "Increase the spark advance, strap on a supercharger, rev 'er up, and see if it blows or goes."
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Scarmiglione' on December 08, 2014, 08:06:58 am
I've been busy, but yes, I think it is time for a different dynamic.  Too much echo chamber.  The world is a different place, and yet it is the same.  There are different people with different ears than a few years ago.  TMM has always reinvented itself every few years or so.  That is the progress of things.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on December 08, 2014, 11:18:28 am
We used to have a pretty good group around here.  How did the forum attract those folks?

Claire Wolfe
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Rarick on December 09, 2014, 05:24:32 am
OPSEC, LoL  we can be found on Bing and Google.........  I think we should get out there more often and gather people in, but offer constructive criticism and solutions to dilemnas based on the principles........not just hacking at someone until they leave.........

If we do not we are the tinfoil hats in mama's basement that we are painted up to be in the MSM.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: heyoka on December 09, 2014, 10:08:14 am
 :lurk:
(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/sick/barfing-smiley-emoticon.gif)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on December 09, 2014, 10:25:33 am
Not exactly enlightening, nor descriptive, H.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 09, 2014, 01:01:33 pm
We used to have a pretty good group around here.  How did the forum attract those folks?

Claire Wolfe

BINGO!

That's it in a nutshell, Silver.

I'm wondering what it would take to get her interest in this place back up to speed, eh?  I think that if we were to outline a plan, a major "psy-op" based on activism (more than just talking/discussing), and present that plan to her, she may be happy to pitch in. I may start a new thread which would outline my thoughts. My central thought has to do with the fact of MindWar, and what TMM could become if we organized a psy-op to counter that MindWar. Am curious if anyone here even knows what "MindWar" is. I can assure you that it is a government-sponsored activity which is ongoing and which can be shown to be at work on the national psyche. There is no better concept to my knowledge than TMM for combating MindWar. I can lay out the basics of what MindWar is, as time permits. Meanwhile, one of the things I've just written for Oath Keepers is here -

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2014/12/08/ron-paul-joins-krisanne-hall-and-sheriff-mack-in-midnight-ride/

Oath Keepers is calling for the Constitutional "Militia of the several States". We feel that the Militia is the answer to the militarization of police and the coming "martial law". The movie, MIDNIGHT RIDE, is all about martial law and what the Constitution says about it, including the fact that the only response against martial law is the Militia of the several States. That is a flank to be arrayed in our fight against MindWar.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 09, 2014, 02:00:37 pm
I'm wondering what it would take to get her interest in this place back up to speed, eh?

It never hurts to ask, of course, but I strongly suspect not... She's been out of the loop for some time and I am pretty sure she likes it that way. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 09, 2014, 03:18:02 pm
I'm wondering what it would take to get her interest in this place back up to speed, eh?

It never hurts to ask, of course, but I strongly suspect not... She's been out of the loop for some time and I am pretty sure she likes it that way.

ML, allow me to ask if you are familiar with the term I used in my previous post -- "MindWar"? Am just curious if TMM people here know about it or not. Thank you.

Regarding Claire, no one can predict what she will or will not do, lol. But it could be that she has not been around here for quite a while because there was nothing new going on here. That could change, yes? Or maybe not -- we'll see. But it's not just her. G. Edward Griffin has a much larger audience than Claire, and plenty of others "out there" could bring larger audiences into the fray if we got busy with activism. Heck, as far as that goes, the little video I shot a year ago has more than 3,600,000 downloads. Three and a half million downloads is remarkable for one year on a youtube video. Maybe even some members here have seen it --

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06VzxxDTnB8

I obtained the judge's permission before filming that in her courtroom. She had asked me why I wanted to video her courtroom that morning, and I replied to her, "Well, M'am, I know this guy and my guess is that your court is about to experience one of the more colorful moments in the court's history."

She smiled and told me to go for it, so I did. Afterward, I gave it to Ernie's mom on a DVD and she gave it to some friend, and next thing I knew it was going all over the place. People either love it or hate it -- but lots of 'em are viewing it. This was the second time Ernie has caused a judge to leave the courtroom. The boy's a bonafide trip as he claims to be Montana's "Natural Man".  If TMM wanted to spike public interest, something novel, like starting a program to institute Militia offices in all State governments, could do the trick.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 09, 2014, 03:30:03 pm
ML, allow me to ask if you are familiar with the term I used in my previous post -- "MindWar"?

Not really. I've read a lot of your stuff, of course, and have an idea where you're coming from, but I've never been much interested in that sort of thing. I like my life simple and local. :) 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 09, 2014, 03:45:29 pm
ML, allow me to ask if you are familiar with the term I used in my previous post -- "MindWar"?

Not really. I've read a lot of your stuff, of course, and have an idea where you're coming from, but I've never been much interested in that sort of thing. I like my life simple and local. :)

Interesting reply. When you say "I like my...", that part of you which is represented by the word "I" includes and suggests as fact that you (the "I") have a mind which can and does register consciously a sense of self, (that which "likes"), wouldn't you agree?

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 09, 2014, 03:56:47 pm
Interesting reply. When you say "I like my...", that part of you which is represented by the word "I" includes and suggests as fact that you (the "I") have a mind which can and does register consciously a sense of self, (that which "likes"), wouldn't you agree?

Probably need to take this discussion to PM, or another thread. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 09, 2014, 04:24:38 pm
Interesting reply. When you say "I like my...", that part of you which is represented by the word "I" includes and suggests as fact that you (the "I") have a mind which can and does register consciously a sense of self, (that which "likes"), wouldn't you agree?

Probably need to take this discussion to PM, or another thread. :)

I disagree, ML. I think that you should answer that question right here on this thread, as so also should everyone else reading here. I'll answer first -- Yes, I have a mind, and I'm aware that there are forces using the powers of government to alter my natural perceptions, which is of course why there should be a Mental Militia, imo.

We're talking about a Mental Militia here, and the root of that has to do with the Mind. I am trying to get you to admit that the very instrument by which you register your existence in this world is called the Mind.

There is a purpose why I'm  wanting to establish that point. A mind which is in willful denial of the fact that a government employs people to shape the perception of minds in the public at large is of course likely to deny that MindWar could possibly affect one's own mind in one's own life. If that happens, one has already lost on the psychological battlefield of MindWar. The docility of the American public right now is evidence that mind control in mass is working for the very people who want to take your guns, regulate your behavior, control social norms, lay down rules and regulations, require permits and licenses, and tax the fruits of everyone's labor.

I would like an answer to my original question, but if you don't want to answer it that is okay. I'm not just speaking with you, but with the whole thread. I would like to learn how many on this thread ever think about thinking, about what a thought is, about how a thought affects one (or does not affect one), and many other things about thought. Isn't that included in what a Mental Militia should, er, keep in mind? ;)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 09, 2014, 04:35:30 pm
Be interesting to see what others think.  Seems to me you've got some serious assumptions...

Elias, this seems to me to be a "have you stopped beating your wife" question, and I'm surprised at you.  But I have no intention of trying to answer it here. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 09, 2014, 04:48:21 pm
Be interesting to see what others think.  Seems to me you've got some serious assumptions...

Elias, this seems to me to be a "have you stopped beating your wife" question, and I'm surprised at you.  But I have no intention of trying to answer it here.

But ML, you just did answer it. Thank you.

And I'll agree -- it will be interesting to see what others think.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 09, 2014, 05:42:53 pm
Be interesting to see what others think.  Seems to me you've got some serious assumptions...

Elias, this seems to me to be a "have you stopped beating your wife" question, and I'm surprised at you.  But I have no intention of trying to answer it here.

But ML, you just did answer it. Thank you.

And I'll agree -- it will be interesting to see what others think.

Salute!
Elias
I'm pretty sure that everybody here knows that "there are forces using the powers of government to alter our natural perceptions". Propaganda, selecting what stories to air or not air in the media, what wording to use whilst describing certain things/events....Hell! Even facial expressions! All designed to get the people to think a certain way. I know that this is a very abridged version, but I'm pretty sure that it's much like any other psy-op.

In fact, in an earlier post within this very thread, I stated this in a response to one of ML's comments-

Quote
You have a point there. Active participation is more important than lots of new members. Although....the lookieloos are still able to learn without participating. If we can get people to really THINK about things, instead of letting everybody else do the thinking FOR them, we are still implementing the mission, with or without their active participation.

I don't think I have ever heard the term "MindWar", but I, and I'm sure most if not ALL of the members here, are familiar with the concept.

Where our thoughts might differ, are what/who these "forces" ARE, and what their objective IS.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: nurseflo on December 09, 2014, 06:22:50 pm

    We used to have a pretty good group around here.  How did the forum attract those folks?


Claire Wolfe


Claire did attract her fair share of members, but we also had a little different atmosphere around the place.  While we certainly had our share of debate and arguments, there was also a lot of sharing of great ideas and a feeling of camaraderie.  That doesn't seem to be the case any more.  Where this once was a place for learning and exposure to new ideas, this has changed.   Too often the posts are long winded dumps of bile and cynicism.  How does this improve anything?  Why would new members want to join that?  People looking for ideas addressing how to prepare for the future, or cope with what may come will just pass on by.  People who don't like it are leaving.  Who can blame them?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Rarick on December 09, 2014, 09:22:17 pm
5 pages and growing, a lot of people having a discussion- awesome!  Cynicism/scepticism are often confused, I will live with either since they both question what is.......and yes a lot of the posts are very dogmatic, very long and some time seem like a diatribe.  I have always found the questioning ones basic ethics is always painful or at least painful and sometime one has to take a break from that.  I figured that is what Claire was doing, or finding her tolerance gone she was retiring........

I don't understand where the beating your wife issue came from, he was demanding an answer for the sake of the argument, he respected her refusal after making the request respecting her surprising method of saying it will not be answered........

Things have been boring around here, and I really would like to see more popcorn gallery worthy discussion.

The way I see it is that it is time to make a case to the police that the "Law and Order" they owe loyalty to by their choice is being violated by the very system that once was a epitome of that concept.  It has turned from a lighter-side Adam-12 into a darker-side Gestapo.   I think a lot of the oath-keepers are not realizing that tolerating the order to disarm the guy in KC is very much in color of what the redcoats were doing prior to the war for independence.  If they were thinking and had free unmanipulated minds, the whole department would have gone on strike.  Those scabs willing to stay would most definitely been the bad cops deserving of whatever resistance the oath-keepers chose to put up.  That is the game here, the real evil is hiding behind innocents.  The darkside wants the people disarmed, cooperating in that is most definitely wrong.  An ethical officer would have talked with the other officers and immediately gone on strike in support of the constitution.........the light-side.  The armed citizens would be able to take care of themselves quite adequately, maybe even finalizing a lot of the crime stories...........
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 10, 2014, 05:56:19 am
Just to be clear, Rarick - my answer to Elias had nothing at all to do with Claire.

And Elias, I have no idea how that answers your questions.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 10, 2014, 02:04:43 pm
Just to be clear, Rarick - my answer to Elias had nothing at all to do with Claire.

And Elias, I have no idea how that answers your questions.

Well, Dear Friend,
To begin with, there was only one question. I had posited thusly:

Quote
When you say "I like my...", that part of you which is represented by the word "I" includes and suggests as fact that you (the "I") have a mind which can and does register consciously a sense of self, (that which "likes"), wouldn't you agree?

I asked the question because I wanted to begin at the beginning while considering the general dullness of the forums here. This place is called a "Mental" militia, so of course it strikes me as being necessary that the people here value "mentality", and openly admit that the field of, properties of, nature of, characteristics of, and ultimately effects of "mentality" are central to activity here.  So I was trying to establish the basic fact that individual humans each possess a subjective mind. If we cannot even establish on the record here that each person commenting here has a mind, we may have difficulty approaching more elaborate premises regarding personal responsibility for the content of one's mind, and, yes, how we might defend our minds against psychological assault from outside our individual minds. So all I was asking you was if you could agree that you have a mind -- but perhaps you misunderstood my question, or felt uncomfortable with my question, and instead of confessing that yes, indeed, you do have a mind, you suggested that we take the discussion about "mind" to a private format, to which I disagreed.

So my next question is *why* did you want to avoid admitting you have a mind out here in the public section of this site? Is it because you are not happy to discuss the nature of "mind"? Are you concerned that I might go off on a tangent about mental states, mental manipulation, mind control, group-mind-vs-individual-mind theories? I've no idea. Generally, when an Admin recommends that someone take a conversation to pm, it is an indication that the Admin senses that a disagreement might move toward open flaming etc., yes? So it is a passing curiosity for me -- why would you want my question to be directed to a private discussion?  I am just asking, as it leaves me baffled.

I really can't go forward until TMM is willing to admit that this place is named The Mental Militia, and that the very name itself indicates that members here value mentality, and that ownership of one's mind is a basic prerequisite, and that personal responsibility for the structure, nature, and content of one's individual mind is the door to personal freedom, and that no "militia" ever existed outside the purpose of obtaining and maintaining "freedom".

If we can get that much established, then we can talk about personal responsibility for the content of one's mind, which indeed affects everything from one's perception to one's moods to one's philosophy, and ultimately to one's ability to live free in a control-freak-government-run world. Claire has written a book entitled "Think Free To Live Free". As one of her original Freedom Outlaws, and a long-standing member in The Mental Militia, I feel perfectly qualified, and even authorized, to talk about the mind here on these boards. Your reaction to my request that you admit that you have a mind appeared to be defensive simply because you anticipated that I was going to sneak one in on you in some way. You have notions, as you had stated on this thread, that, having read some of my "stuff" I might get into abstracts and psycho-symbology and start talking about the relationship between spirit, soul, and psyche, or some such vague triviality, and that appears to have made you uncomfortable. ML, you don't need to be uncomfortable speaking with me -- we've been friends since the year 2000, when I drove from Memphis, Tennessee to Lobo's and Sunni's LRT conclave in Utah. I'm assuming that you know that I respect you and your good work in the cause of liberty, and that I love you as a sister in the fight for freedom. I have no interest in harming or attacking you, and never have. If I happened at some time to let you know "your slip is showing", that's only what a brother would do for his sister, is it not? And in fact, it would be a failure on my part if I did not tell my sister her slip was showing before we entered the church, or the movie theater's lobby, or wherever we were going in public. So I would like for you to question yourself about why you suggested that we take the discussion to a private place, when the only topic was whether or not you would agree that each of us has a mind. I don't need an answer to that, just am offering you a chance to examine your personal mind by questioning yourself about what motive existed behind your request that we not discuss it here on this thread.

I know I'm weird. I am not making any demand of anyone here. I am trying to find out if this place wants to die a slow death of disinterest, or if it wants to accept a new challenge to actually become a "Mental" militia, which would not only study the psychology of an individual mind but also of a group mind, for purposes of defending the quite-spiritual concepts surrounding "freedom".  If our general discussion forum operates like a rolling news wire regurgitating incessant streams of headlines which reveal incessant attacks on liberty and freedom, that's all fine and dandy so long as people want it -- but if members here want to rebuild this place so that it's exciting to come here and get involved in projects which are "mental" in nature and which lead to direct "action" in the consensus reality which some call the "real world", then something about this place could stand a change, a move into newer directions which would offer a sense of involvement in something more than mere chit-chat.

That is what I'm trying to find out here. To me, it does not matter either way, although I would like to see the name "The Mental Militia" establish itself in ways which impact the public mentality "out there in the real world". But if people here do not want to do that, so be it. I'll wait until the place dries up due to lack of interest, then shut it down and go build a website by the same name where I can then combat "MindWar". And for all who are reading here, "MindWar" is a reality we'd be wise to admit is out there working diligently to enslave this world. It is a Department of Defense operation which wants proactively to enslave all of us, even those of us who live private lives in rural sanctuaries of seeming security. It is real, it has a name, and it's busy as heck all day every day affecting the perception of human beings. The people behind that program are named across Twentieth Century history, and they control this nation's monetary system, this nation's education and entertainment system, this nation's taxation system, this nation's press and media institutions, this nation's Intelligence and Military systems, and this nation's social and cultural institutions. For all who think that anyone can isolate oneself from the effects of that behemoth, can prep and stock up on food and water and the means to guard such, and have no need to unite as the Constitutional "Militia of the several States", I've got some not-so-good news. MindWar will come to every cabin in every part of rural America unless we muster enough people who still are willing to claim ownership of their minds and stop it. Is this the place to launch that counter-offensive, or not? That is what I'm trying to find out here. If not, I've got my own website where I can launch it. But wherever proves to be the best venue to launch it, I'm going to do so. As you have placed a poll here, we'll soon enough see if this place will rise to the challenge and become once again a "Mental Militia" or a "Mental Malaise".

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 10, 2014, 03:11:32 pm
Just a heads up...  A forum member at Oath Keepers PMed me asking about anarchism.  I gave them a brief answer, but also directed them here.

Please be nice.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on December 10, 2014, 03:33:51 pm
...should answer that question right here on this thread, as so also should everyone else reading here.

Well, since you asked....  :laugh:

Dear Elias,

Oh wow! I am excited that you brought this up as I have had something on my mind (sorry!) for the last few months that I was trying to figure how to broach with the forum. More on that later.

It is often said that “idle hands are the Devil’s play.” I don’t wonder if it would be more apt to say, “An idle mind is the Devil’s playground.” Of course there is the well-known, “garbage in, garbage out” that I think pertains to the physical and mental levels.

Dr. Laura would often tell her female callers to do something nice for their husbands even though the wives didn’t feel like it. [The callers usually complained about their husbands not being “romantic” enough. She would ask them what they were doing to be romantic?!] They would call back and share their experience. Even though they thought their husbands should initiate something “romantic” and they were miffed that he didn’t, when they began to do “romantic things” - even though they didn’t feel like doing so, their attitude began to change from resentment to wanting to be kind and “romantic” themselves. Was it the power of suggestion? Experiencing a different perspective? I don’t know. I just always thought it was interesting that it seemed to be an action changing the heart/mind. Or did it really start in the mind?!

When I was in high school there was a “sex” discussion we attended our senior year. Now mind you I attended a private Southern Baptist Christian school and because I was a bit of a rebellious teen I just assumed I would know more than the guest speaker. He said something I didn’t know, and it has never left my memory: “the most powerful sexual organ you have is your mind.”

I recently read (I apologize that I cannot reference it) how there are frequencies if you will, that the military/government have been working on that e/affect the brain. When someone hears a sound they can usually detect from which direction it came from and how far away the sound originated. This *weapon* they are developing makes the listener believe that the sounds/voices are originating from inside their mind.

The “mind issue” has really been in my thinking on a spiritual level lately. Matthew 22:37 tell us: Jesus replied: "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’…” Some unbelievers think this is so Believers can be turned into mindless zombies to do the bidding of whoever has the bigger bully pulpit. I firmly believe it is to guard our minds from enemies of God.

Where does guilt or resentment or unforgiveness or jealousy take root: the heart or the mind? How about doubt, cynicism or paranoia or selfishness?

This is the topic that has been on my mind that I have wanted to share, but wasn’t sure how to go about it. There is an article posted over at The Vigilant Citizen regarding the TV series True Detective. Here is blurb about the article: “True Detective” is a TV series about the investigation of satanic ritual murders carried out by mysterious men. While the season ended in a rather straight-forward matter, the plethora of symbols and references peppered throughout the episodes send out profound messages about forces subtly influencing society. We’ll look at the deeper meaning of the first season of “True Detective”.

In order to understand my point and in a strange way perhaps this ties into your notion about MindWar, the article needs to be read (there are spoilers about the series). http://vigilantcitizen.com/moviesandtv/deeper-meaning-true-detective-season-one/

My initial reaction after reading the above article – much the same way I react to most evil, was a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. However, things just kind of started making sense to me in regards to those upper elite Masonites, Illuminates and One Worlders, and why God says it’s so important to guard your mind: these evil doers get off on causing ordinary folks fear. And I decided no more! I will not partake of their sick rituals. I will not give evil my fear.

A few weeks ago my twins befriended a little boy about their age. Near the start of my conversation with the Dad, he mentioned he graduated Rhodes college. The way it was brought up, and how quickly raised a red flag for me. I had read stuff in the past about that school being for a certain kind of mindset, shall we say? We had a lively and easy going discussion about all kinds of things, and my kids enjoyed playing with his son. Fast forward to this past weekend when I was out with my eldest son I passed by a jeep that had Rhodes Graduate sprawled across the rear window with a bunch of strange looking triangles underneath that. Further down on the back there were Masonic and Illuminati symbols. It made me flashback to meeting that Dad a few weeks ago. Maybe he mentioned Rhodes the way he did in the hopes I would give him the secret handshake or nod or wink or code word or whatever. The point is, at the time I knew something was “off” and if I hadn’t filled my mind with the truth I would have been none the wiser.

I might be waaaaaaaay off base here in trying to associate my thoughts with where you are coming from, but the bottom line for me is that I believe that there has been a war - and there is still yet more coming warfare, for control of our minds.

I am able to withstand the proverbial poop that is thrown my way - simply because of my faith - because I know what is true and good. And no amount of insults will change my love for God – because I love truth and goodness and He is all those things and so much more to me. I know you are not a Believer youself, but I also know that you have no problems with my holding steadfast to my faith. I mention God because I believe He set me on this path to find truth so I could 1) protect my mind; 2) reinforce my heart with love and compassion; and 3) share my findings with others. He is the One Who stoked the fires of my wanting to learn and grow. He is the One Who helped me weed out the lies from the truth. He is the One Who ultimately led me here, to this very forum.

It used to make me feel like “chopped liver” whenever someone mentioned how the forum used to be, or how much fun it used to be, or how all the good people have left or things along that vein. It doesn’t bother me anymore because I realized that I never had that yardstick and I just accepted this forum for what it is: a motley crew of personalities who share the same desire I have which is to live as free as possible, in any and every capacity! I have no desire to participate in other forums –if only because my role and responsibility as a homeschooling mom precludes it. But, the truth is I am used to the peculiarities and the qualities and the personas that participate here.

I would love to see a certain “group” of people participate here: moms and dads who are in positions to influence and guide their children. If there is indeed warfare for the hearts and minds of people, who do you think the powers that be are aiming for? Exactly.

I apologize for the length – I didn’t fully appreciate how much I needed to share until I sat down to type. Thank you for allowing me a place to go to with my complex thoughts, jumbled emotions and unique perspective. I might get frustrated at times with some posts, but this is still a place that is comfortably familiar –a place I call home.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Bill St. Clair on December 10, 2014, 03:35:35 pm
I'd love to see more Mental Militia and less the-sky-is-falling-bad-news here. I'm not working on my mind much these days. I work WITH it for my work, but I spend my spiritual time working on my heart, quieting my mind as much as possible.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on December 10, 2014, 03:42:57 pm
I'd love to see more Mental Militia and less the-sky-is-falling-bad-news here. I'm not working on my mind much these days. I work WITH it for my work, but I spend my spiritual time working on my heart, quieting my mind as much as possible.

That was great, Bill!

I hope this doesn't induce eye-rolling to the point of injury for you or anyone else... One of my favorite Bible verses to meditate upon that provides me peace is Psalm 46:10: "Be still and know that I am God."
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 10, 2014, 04:12:03 pm


It used to make me feel like “chopped liver” whenever someone mentioned how the forum used to be, or how much fun it used to be, or how all the good people have left or things along that vein. It doesn’t bother me anymore because I realized that I never had that yardstick and I just accepted this forum for what it is: a motley crew of personalities who share the same desire I have which is to live as free as possible, in any and every capacity! I have no desire to participate in other forums –if only because my role and responsibility as a homeschooling mom precludes it. But, the truth is I am used to the peculiarities and the qualities and the personas that participate here.

 I might get frustrated at times with some posts, but this is still a place that is comfortably familiar –a place I call home.
I agree. I did not come here to TMM until 2011. Since then, I have grown tremendously. I too lack the "yardstick". I have no clue what it was like before then. TMM has been roughly the same in my tenure here. Just as MB explained it- "a motley crew of personalities who share the same desire I have which is to live as free as possible, in any and every capacity". The only thing that has changed is less new members, and less member participation. That's why I brought this whole thing up in the first place.

I came here to learn. I do TRY to contribute. Not sure if I have been successful at that, but.....well...I try. :dontknow: I come here at least once/day and read every single new post. I too, consider TMM to be my online home. I don't want to see it die.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: A Patriot on December 10, 2014, 04:29:46 pm
Just a heads up...  A forum member at Oath Keepers PMed me asking about anarchism.  I gave them a brief answer, but also directed them here.

Please be nice.

Well you have one more from "Oath Keepers" come and join up!
I looked around a little and I can see I fit in over here, myself not being a veteran or current serving.
Hello Elias, Shorty and Klapton i do believe you created this place just to get me away from Oath Keepers...

Way back when I was in my senior class in high school, my "Current American Problems" teacher told us the war in Viet Nam was "unconstitutional"...  I looked everywhere for knowledge on this subject and even took classes on the Constitution and on the draft to learn how to get out of having to go there.  I mean everyone was thinking... it is to protect and defend our country from the "domino effect" of communist in Viet Nam, but to go there without congressional approval is in fact breaking the Constitution.
 I think I was an "oath keeper" then too no?  I haven't yet then takin the oath, but I understood I should follow the supreme law of the land and NOT allow myself to be "drafted" to be breaking it...

I figured that out at the age of 17 and have been hot to trot in this movement ever since... Am I the only "conscientious objector" to belong to Oath Keepers?

I am glad this place is called TMM , I totally get it!
When I belonged to Bill Cooper's CAJI ( Civilian Association of Joint Intelligence ) of the second  continental army, ( the Arizona militia ) we never trained in the woods,  we were always out teaching the sheeple about the constitution and about our rights!
I may be wrong, but it believe it was Cooper who made up the term "Sheeple" I never heard it anywhere before, and it has stuck. He was right on many other things to... Dose anyone know about Cooper here?
I know he had his faults, but he was the spearhead of the movement at the time and I wanted to belong!

Well... I wonder who else is around here? I anticipate having a good time learning about this site and all you peoples point of view! I am all ears...
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 10, 2014, 04:45:09 pm
Just a heads up...  A forum member at Oath Keepers PMed me asking about anarchism.  I gave them a brief answer, but also directed them here.

Please be nice.

Well you have one more from "Oath Keepers" come and join up!
I looked around a little and I can see I fit in over here, myself not being a veteran or current serving.

Well...Let me be the first to give you a hearty welcome. I hope that you have a comfy chair. This place can be addictive in the beginning. There's SO.....MUCH.....STUFF....to read!
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 10, 2014, 04:57:01 pm
but perhaps you misunderstood my question,

Yes...

Quote
So my next question is *why* did you want to avoid admitting you have a mind

I didn't see THAT as the question.

Quote
Are you concerned that I might go off on a tangent about mental states, mental manipulation, mind control, group-mind-vs-individual-mind theories?

Yes, and from what else you've written here and elsewhere, that does seem to be your major theme. That's what the "MindWar" shouted to me.  I think discussion of any of that belongs in a different thread. I apologize that I made too large a leap and did not consider everything you wrote here carefully enough.

Quote
why would you want my question to be directed to a private discussion?  I am just asking, as it leaves me baffled.

A prolonged discussion about mind control, etc. did not seem appropriate for this thread. I still think another - or several other threads would be more appropriate. I only suggested the PM in case YOU felt a need for it. I always offer it. 

Quote
that this place is named The Mental Militia, and that the very name itself indicates that members here value mentality, and that ownership of one's mind is a basic prerequisite, and that personal responsibility for the structure, nature, and content of one's individual mind is the door to personal freedom, and that no "militia" ever existed outside the purpose of obtaining and maintaining "freedom".

Of course. I don't think TMM has ever completely lost that focus. There are a few regular members who seem to think this involves endless posting of the "news" and various atrocities, etc. - but I don't know why that should be a problem. Anyone who does not share that focus is perfectly free to ignore it.  I post the "news" or commentaries from outside with the intent to encourage discussion. Sometimes those discussions get heated, and sometimes nobody cares enough to contribute, but I don't see that as a problem either.

I don't want to see some cadre decide that there can only be ONE kind of discussion here, ONE philosophy, ONE method... or even only two or three, and attempt to seize "control" of the forum in some way.  It can happen so easily...

Quote
then we can talk about personal responsibility for the content of one's mind,

Seems to me that anyone who does not take personal responsibility for the content of their mind isn't going to be interested in anything we write. I happen to think that everything is a choice. The fact that some people make choices based on faulty information or motives doesn't change that. But if they are not willing to understand that they DO have a choice, and can find better information if they want it... and that better information is what is worth talking about. As far as I'm concerned, the only rational motive for choices is honest self interest, based on the integrity of non-aggression.

But you can't make that damned horse drink no matter where you try to lead him if he's plain NOT THIRSTY. I spent a good part of the last 60 years trying to lead those horses around and found it was a fat waste of my time and effort. Now I look for THIRSTY horses, and indicate where they might find water if they want it. If others want to trail along out of curiosity, terrific, but it is their CHOICE. If people want to die of thirst, I really can't do a damned thing about it but sigh a little now and again. I have no responsibility to save anyone but myself, and the older I get, the less interested I am in saving the world.

See, I don't believe for a moment that any entity on earth can control the minds of people against their will. They can be seduced, bought, and intimidated, of course... but that's a different thing.  And I don't believe in any kind of supernatural or extra terrestrial entity either.  But I have zero interest in preventing anyone else from discussing any of it, to say the least. None of my business.

Quote
ML, you don't need to be uncomfortable speaking with me --

LOL! You know me better than that, my friend. I've never been shy about speaking my mind... and many here have made it plain that I do too much of it... so I've quit to a great extent. Far too many people seem to be intimidated by someone speaking their mind powerfully, and with conviction. They want everything couched in conciliatory and apologetic terms, and I won't be bothered.

Quote
we've been friends since the year 2000, when I drove from Memphis, Tennessee to Lobo's and Sunni's LRT conclave in Utah.

I remember that week with great fondness, and still have the tiny polished stone you gave me. I keep it handy, and rub it in my fingers at times... savoring so much goodness. :)

Quote
If I happened at some time to let you know "your slip is showing",

And I appreciate it. :) Just realize that I might say to you that "that's the way I wear it." Something one person sees as a problem might not be a problem for someone else... it's a matter of perspective. We usually don't know unless we ask, of course. And it is good to ask...

Quote
I am trying to find out if this place wants to die a slow death of disinterest, or if it wants to accept a new challenge to actually become a "Mental" militia,

But I think this is the crux of the thing... we need to honestly and openly discuss what that means. I don't think it has anything to do with a "group mind" or any "consensus" - Gnu forbid. sigh

I'm an individual sovereign. I very much appreciate voluntary association, cooperation and discussion with those of like mind. I find the idea of a mind meld of any king abhorrent. That's the difference for me.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on December 10, 2014, 06:36:23 pm
 :threvil: Mama speaks her mind? so that is the voices I keep hearing at night.  ;p
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: A Patriot on December 10, 2014, 07:35:18 pm
Just a heads up...  A forum member at Oath Keepers PMed me asking about anarchism.  I gave them a brief answer, but also directed them here.

Please be nice.

Well you have one more from "Oath Keepers" come and join up!
I looked around a little and I can see I fit in over here, myself not being a veteran or current serving.

Well...Let me be the first to give you a hearty welcome. I hope that you have a comfy chair. This place can be addictive in the beginning. There's SO.....MUCH.....STUFF....to read!

Thank you very much. Glad to meet you!
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: casca-503 on December 10, 2014, 09:54:11 pm
pull up a log, get closer to the fire...sit a spell... and welcome to the monkey house...
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: knobster on December 11, 2014, 07:53:24 am
Welcome patriot.  Like others have said, pull up an e-chair and buckle in.  I'd say hang on but sometime the ride here is more fun with your limbs flailing about.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 11, 2014, 08:25:23 am
Just a heads up...  A forum member at Oath Keepers PMed me asking about anarchism.  I gave them a brief answer, but also directed them here.

Please be nice.

Well you have one more from "Oath Keepers" come and join up!
I looked around a little and I can see I fit in over here, myself not being a veteran or current serving.
Hello Elias, Shorty and Klapton i do believe you created this place just to get me away from Oath Keepers...

Way back when I was in my senior class in high school, my "Current American Problems" teacher told us the war in Viet Nam was "unconstitutional"...  I looked everywhere for knowledge on this subject and even took classes on the Constitution and on the draft to learn how to get out of having to go there.  I mean everyone was thinking... it is to protect and defend our country from the "domino effect" of communist in Viet Nam, but to go there without congressional approval is in fact breaking the Constitution.
 I think I was an "oath keeper" then too no?  I haven't yet then takin the oath, but I understood I should follow the supreme law of the land and NOT allow myself to be "drafted" to be breaking it...

I figured that out at the age of 17 and have been hot to trot in this movement ever since... Am I the only "conscientious objector" to belong to Oath Keepers?

I am glad this place is called TMM , I totally get it!
When I belonged to Bill Cooper's CAJI ( Civilian Association of Joint Intelligence ) of the second continual army, ( the Arizona militia ) we never trained in the woods,  we were always out teaching the sheeple about the constitution and about our rights!
I may be wrong, but it believe it was Cooper who made up the term "Sheeple" I never heard it anywhere before, and it has stuck. He was right on many other things to... Dose anyone know about Cooper here?
I know he had his faults, but he was the spearhead of the movement at the time and I wanted to belong!

Well... I wonder who else is around here? I anticipate having a good time learning about this site and all you peoples point of view! I am all ears...

Welcome, A Patriot; and thank you for signing up here.
Yes, I've got Cooper's book and recordings of his on-air stuff. I collect such things.
Regarding the Viet Nam war, I'm a USMC Veteran of that war-crime, and I salute you for seeking ways to avoid complicity in the horror put forth by our stolen federal government. Don't know how long you've been at Oath Keepers, but in case you missed my "take" on that war, here's one I posted there a while back--

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2012/10/01/over-there-and-over-here-a-letter-from-the-editor/

Don't quit Oath Keepers, Bro, just add this place to your daily travels, right? Oath Keepers is doing a wonderful job for this country. I'm trying to get TMM off its ass to do something comparable, which is what this thread is all about. We'll see how it goes with the membership here.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: A Patriot on December 11, 2014, 12:19:38 pm
You know there is a large group of non serving Patriots over there I know who would just love this place. Sometimes I think they frustrate the veterans there more then encourage them?  I know the vets have to learn too as you did,  it has been my mission to encourage everyone to stay the course over there.
Can I recruit people over there to come here ???   I can do it overtly or clandestinely...  I almost think you really want to keep it a secret or something because I have been a member of Oath Keepers since before you posted that article you mentioned and never really got the message of this forum before...   

I want to do all I can in the efforts you have to restore this republic, give me the word, "here am I send me..."
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 11, 2014, 12:36:56 pm

I want to do all I can in the efforts you have to restore this republic, give me the word, "here am I send me..."

Any member here can recruit, encourage or proselytize anyone at any time to come to TMM. Just remind them that this is not a single issue forum, that there is a great diversity of people, philosophies and convictions here... and that there is no automatic acceptance of anyone just because they say they took a "oath."

Please emphasize the importance of reading the members agreement and the welcoming message from Elias.

They'll need a thick skin, and the ability to discuss sensitive things without taking personal umbrage or engaging in personal attacks. If they can accept those conditions, let 'er rip.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on December 11, 2014, 03:03:29 pm
Elias, not to nitpick but:

Quote
Welcome, A Patriot; and thank you for signing up here.
Yes, I've got Cooper's book and recordings of his on-air stuff. I collect such things.
Regarding the Viet Nam war, I'm a USMC Veteran of that war-crime, and I salute you for seeking ways to avoid complicity in the horror put forth by our stolen federal government. Don't know how long you've been at Oath Keepers, but in case you missed my "take" on that war, here's one I posted there a while back--

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2012/10/01/over-there-and-over-here-a-letter-from-the-editor/

Don't quit Oath Keepers, Bro, just add this place to your daily travels, right? Oath Keepers is doing a wonderful job for this country. I'm trying to get TMM off its ass to do something comparable, which is what this thread is all about. We'll see how it goes with the membership here.

Salute!
Elias

Nobody ever "stole" what so many call "our" government, no more than the guys in Mainland Europe paid Dane-geld tribute to what they considered "their" Vikings, either. 

It wasn't "ours" to begin with, and it wasn't, therefore, stolen.  Stealing implies ownership.  You cannot own those who demand tribute from you.  Unless you think all the occupied territories owned the Huns and Attila instead of the way it actually was.

The Constitution was a brilliant coup de'etat by a brilliant bunch of lawyers and their sycophants.  The rabbit hole goes very deep, and I don't feel like wasting my excellent and very expensive keyboard's lifespan to type a "tl;dr" comment which will neither be read, nor comprehended, nor replied to, in any intelligent format, not even on this most subversive of forum media.  So, I'll leave it at that.  Those who've read enough, know that the government was never meant to belong to the submitizens any more than the farm belongs to the chickens or the ranch belongs to the cows.  But bleating about it certainly expends energy they could spend living their lives or actually effecting change where it can be done.

Good luck "fixing" the evil people.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 11, 2014, 03:15:07 pm
You know there is a large group of non serving Patriots over there I know who would just love this place. Sometimes I think they frustrate the veterans there more then encourage them?  I know the vets have to learn too as you did,  it has been my mission to encourage everyone to stay the course over there.
Can I recruit people over there to come here ???   I can do it overtly or clandestinely...  I almost think you really want to keep it a secret or something because I have been a member of Oath Keepers since before you posted that article you mentioned and never really got the message of this forum before...   

I want to do all I can in the efforts you have to restore this republic, give me the word, "here am I send me..."

A Patriot, yes, there are a lot of folks over there who would like this place. And for the record, this is the place where I met Stewart Rhodes, and we used this place as the first Oath Keepers forum while we were getting Oath Keepers started. Scroll down the topics page and you'll see it.
However, this place has faded noticeably over the years, as Stewart and myself and others are kept quite busy dealing with Oath Keepers business "over there" at the dot org and dot net sites and with all the activity. Some folks here prefer quality over quantity and are hesitant to open the floodgates of the Internet to pump new life into the place, which is a concern I respect. I have posed the question that maybe it's time TMM got off the couch, put down the beer and snacks, and actually "do" something, which would mean bringing in lots of new folks and having a sense of direction in developing new projects, such as a major drive to reinstitute the Constitutionally-required "Militia of the several States". I see a need for that in this country, as demonstrated by this coming Saturday's mass crime wave planned in Olympia, Washington, where thousands of "Freedom Outlaws" will gather at the Capitol and openly violate Washington's new anti-gun law. Sheriff Mack, Mike Vanderboegh, and Ammon Bundy will speak with others. They are expecting thousands.

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2014/12/11/we-will-not-comply-call-to-action-saturday-at-olympia-washingtonat-olympia/

So I've got ideas, and have proposed that I use my connectivity with national leaders in various organizations to advertise this place and draw in many new people and get them excited to do things. But I want it to be acceptable to the members and Admins here before I do that, which is why this particular thread is here.

As MamaLiberty said, it's cool to bring in people you know, and that would be appreciated if you let them know up front that glass toes are easily shattered here, and that this is not a typical "conservative" place. The mission statement which you might want to have friends read first and to which MamaLiberty alluded is here:

http://www.thementalmilitia.com/MissionStatement.html

If they can read that and still want to participate here, they would be welcome. Over the years since this board went online in 2003 a lot of folks, many thousands, have honed in one way or another their perceptions about various things. And there are literally tons of information sitting around on old threads here -- including some of my comments which I hope no one ever sees, lol. ;)

Anyway, welcome again. Enjoy. And thank you for joining.
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on December 12, 2014, 10:04:20 am
You know there is a large group of non serving Patriots over there I know who would just love this place. Sometimes I think they frustrate the veterans there more then encourage them?  I know the vets have to learn too as you did,  it has been my mission to encourage everyone to stay the course over there.
Can I recruit people over there to come here ???   I can do it overtly or clandestinely...  I almost think you really want to keep it a secret or something because I have been a member of Oath Keepers since before you posted that article you mentioned and never really got the message of this forum before...   

I want to do all I can in the efforts you have to restore this republic, give me the word, "here am I send me..."

A Patriot, yes, there are a lot of folks over there who would like this place. And for the record, this is the place where I met Stewart Rhodes, and we used this place as the first Oath Keepers forum while we were getting Oath Keepers started. Scroll down the topics page and you'll see it.
However, this place has faded noticeably over the years, as Stewart and myself and others are kept quite busy dealing with Oath Keepers business "over there" at the dot org and dot net sites and with all the activity. Some folks here prefer quality over quantity and are hesitant to open the floodgates of the Internet to pump new life into the place, which is a concern I respect. I have posed the question that maybe it's time TMM got off the couch, put down the beer and snacks, and actually "do" something, which would mean bringing in lots of new folks and having a sense of direction in developing new projects, such as a major drive to reinstitute the Constitutionally-required "Militia of the several States". I see a need for that in this country, as demonstrated by this coming Saturday's mass crime wave planned in Olympia, Washington, where thousands of "Freedom Outlaws" will gather at the Capitol and openly violate Washington's new anti-gun law. Sheriff Mack, Mike Vanderboegh, and Ammon Bundy will speak with others. They are expecting thousands.

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2014/12/11/we-will-not-comply-call-to-action-saturday-at-olympia-washingtonat-olympia/

So I've got ideas, and have proposed that I use my connectivity with national leaders in various organizations to advertise this place and draw in many new people and get them excited to do things. But I want it to be acceptable to the members and Admins here before I do that, which is why this particular thread is here.

As MamaLiberty said, it's cool to bring in people you know, and that would be appreciated if you let them know up front that glass toes are easily shattered here, and that this is not a typical "conservative" place. The mission statement which you might want to have friends read first and to which MamaLiberty alluded is here:

http://www.thementalmilitia.com/MissionStatement.html

If they can read that and still want to participate here, they would be welcome. Over the years since this board went online in 2003 a lot of folks, many thousands, have honed in one way or another their perceptions about various things. And there are literally tons of information sitting around on old threads here -- including some of my comments which I hope no one ever sees, lol. ;)

Anyway, welcome again. Enjoy. And thank you for joining.
Salute!
Elias

Good luck with the protest.

More importantly, I'm with you on the "militia of the several states" thing, but it has to NOT be under the control of the government.  Remember Shay's and the Whiskey Rebellion.  That was militiamen used by Washington (the guy, not the town) to put down protesters.  That was America's version of Tianamen Square.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on December 12, 2014, 12:16:50 pm
...I just accepted this forum for what it is: a motley crew of personalities ... this is still a place that is comfortably familiar –a place I call home.

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 12, 2014, 01:35:11 pm
Elias, not to nitpick but:

Quote
Welcome, A Patriot; and thank you for signing up here.
Yes, I've got Cooper's book and recordings of his on-air stuff. I collect such things.
Regarding the Viet Nam war, I'm a USMC Veteran of that war-crime, and I salute you for seeking ways to avoid complicity in the horror put forth by our stolen federal government. Don't know how long you've been at Oath Keepers, but in case you missed my "take" on that war, here's one I posted there a while back--

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2012/10/01/over-there-and-over-here-a-letter-from-the-editor/

Don't quit Oath Keepers, Bro, just add this place to your daily travels, right? Oath Keepers is doing a wonderful job for this country. I'm trying to get TMM off its ass to do something comparable, which is what this thread is all about. We'll see how it goes with the membership here.

Salute!
Elias

Nobody ever "stole" what so many call "our" government, no more than the guys in Mainland Europe paid Dane-geld tribute to what they considered "their" Vikings, either. 

It wasn't "ours" to begin with, and it wasn't, therefore, stolen.  Stealing implies ownership.  You cannot own those who demand tribute from you.  Unless you think all the occupied territories owned the Huns and Attila instead of the way it actually was.

The Constitution was a brilliant coup de'etat by a brilliant bunch of lawyers and their sycophants.  The rabbit hole goes very deep, and I don't feel like wasting my excellent and very expensive keyboard's lifespan to type a "tl;dr" comment which will neither be read, nor comprehended, nor replied to, in any intelligent format, not even on this most subversive of forum media.  So, I'll leave it at that.  Those who've read enough, know that the government was never meant to belong to the submitizens any more than the farm belongs to the chickens or the ranch belongs to the cows.  But bleating about it certainly expends energy they could spend living their lives or actually effecting change where it can be done.

Good luck "fixing" the evil people.

Totally grok the brilliant lawyers' role in creating the Constitution.

I should remind you that I speak on many different "levels". There is the choir, each member of which knows what you've just said, and there is the congregation, most members of which haven't a clue about what you said. My interest is in reaching the congregation and helping them get up to speed on what's going on with their government. The first thing I do not usually do when approaching the congregation is hit them over the head with an iron skillet by telling them this government ain't what they think it is, and that they are being dumb-assed sheople. That doesn't help them, usually. So instead, I offer them some pancakes with butter and honey which was cooked up in that skillet. They can digest the concept of a Constitution, and by reminding them of the unalienable rights that Constitution is built to protect, they can be motivated to want to demand that the federal government operate within its limitations as laid out in Article I, Section 8 and in the Bill of Rights.

That much right there would be a huge step in the direction of diminishing the centralized power of today's behemoth-like out-of-control General government. On the level of perception in which most people think these days, telling them that the Constitution is a fraud before they're ready to fully understand how it came to be merely causes a defensive reaction which prompts them to erect that old mental barrier and the conversation just drys up in futility.  What we have out there for a national consciousness right now is, as T. S. Eliot dubbed it, a Wasteland. My approach is to offer tiny little baby-steps in the direction of helping them *want* to learn more about their individual sovereignty, their worth as individual sous enmeshed in flesh.  On the level of perception held by the congregation, out government was stolen a century ago when Wall Street got Woodrow Wilson (a willing dupe) into office. And in their perception, the General government is largely outside its lawful boundaries -- so I speak with them in that perspective. I can also speak with you in your perspective. My mind is not bound up by belief, and I am comfortable on many different levels. My objective in communicating with people on any level is to get the goddam government off my back and out of my personal life. Helping people see the threats arrayed against what little freedom we may have left requires that I soften the message to terms which do not throw them into shock and thereby cause them to erect the ever-ready barriers to learning the bitter truth.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: RVM45 on December 12, 2014, 02:22:29 pm
If you see the Constitution as an attempt to Codify a Limited Representative Republic…

And I mean sure, a lot of folks here don't believe in any republic or state whatsoever…

And some believe that the Constitution was crafted by Cynical Manipulators…

But View it—at least momentarily—as an attempt to establish a rather limited government.

The main problem is that Statists have had over 200 years to plink away at it.

Which underlies my point, that Any attempt to limit the power of the State through Any sort of Charter seems a Futile Endeavor.

The Constitution was a fair attempt, but even it was powerless to halt its own undermining.

Why is it always far easier to undermine something like the Constitution than it is to defend it?

I really don't know. Entropy? I am convinced that it is.

I don't even think that if the Constitution had a magic "Reboot" button that could be used Once—and all our state, federal and local laws would be reinterpreted rigidly by the Constitution as it was the day after the Bill of Rights was added that it would do a whole lot of good.

O, I'd be all for it. Maybe—just maybe—I could live out my last years in some Peace…
 
But the Undermining would proceed far faster in the Modern World—partly because of electronics and partly because they have many prior examples to learn from.

But the Point is:

If the Constitution exists to protect our Freedom—and it can't protect itself from Cynical Manipulation and Undermining…

Then what good is it?




…..RVM45     :mellow::thumbsup::mellow:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 12, 2014, 02:44:31 pm
Insert Spooner quote here.

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: A Patriot on December 12, 2014, 03:08:41 pm
What do they say today... "Throwing the baby out with the bath water?"

I have to agree with Elias... Right on man!  let's try to keep what little Freedoms we have,  before we lose those too!
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 12, 2014, 03:54:32 pm
...I just accepted this forum for what it is: a motley crew of personalities ... this is still a place that is comfortably familiar –a place I call home.
Love it!

(http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/uncyclopedia/images/3/33/Octopus_face.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width/800?cb=20060503201910)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 12, 2014, 04:02:25 pm
What do they say today... "Throwing the baby out with the bath water?"

I have to agree with Elias... Right on man!  let's try to keep what little Freedoms we have,  before we lose those too!
I agree too, but only in the sense of- "You gotta start somewhere". If that means trying to get back to the true meaning and enforcement of the US Constitution, then so be it. It's a start. Not an end though. That said, true enforcement of the 10th amendment is the beginning. Get back to THESE United States, rather than THE United States.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on December 12, 2014, 07:03:21 pm
23  voted in the poll. 23
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 12, 2014, 08:14:34 pm
23  voted in the poll. 23
And that's why we need to revitalize TMM. It's dying. There's still quite a few lookieloos, but not much participation.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on December 12, 2014, 08:31:41 pm
23  voted in the poll. 23
And that's why we need to revitalize TMM. It's dying. There's still quite a few lookieloos, but not much participation.

The stats that used to be visible to all are no longer. Personally I liked them a little, but not enough to complain even to the fly on the wall about their absence.  However, that leaves me guessing as to the membership and readership here in a form known as WAG... a favorite of many professed statisticians.

With that disclaimer out of the way, I feel it is safe to say that 16 of those with opinions are FOR while 5 who are concerned are AGAINST.  The rest, whatever that number is, are along for the ride.

If vitality of TMM is of interest or somehow in the charter, the riders are not a consideration.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 12, 2014, 08:36:04 pm
23  voted in the poll. 23
And that's why we need to revitalize TMM. It's dying. There's still quite a few lookieloos, but not much participation.

The stats that used to be visible to all are no longer. Personally I liked them a little, but not enough to complain even to the fly on the wall about their absence.  However, that leaves me guessing as to the membership and readership here in a form known as WAG... a favorite of many professed statisticians.

With that disclaimer out of the way, I feel it is safe to say that 16 of those with opinions are FOR while 5 who are concerned are AGAINST.  The rest, whatever that number is, are along for the ride.

If vitality of TMM is of interest or somehow in the charter, the riders are not a consideration.
Certain stats are still available. http://thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?action=stats

The yearly summary is the most telling stat.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on December 12, 2014, 09:03:41 pm
Wow. Nice link to stats.

Very telling that in the 2006 to 2009 time frame that many of us think as the prime of its life, the number of posts were 5-6 times what they are in 2014.   The numbers tend to agree with that curmudgeon who is, paraphrasing his words, watching it die.

Can I vote a second time for advancing the distributor, increasing the boost to see if it blows or goes?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on December 12, 2014, 09:20:17 pm

Can I vote a second time for advancing the distributor, increasing the boost to see if it blows or goes?
Ditto! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on December 12, 2014, 10:04:20 pm
I don't know what to say, because I've got far too much of my crap going on.  I also don't feel like arguing with slideman, who apparently considers non attacks to be so, and personal attacks aimed at everyone by certain self professed "ubermenschen" to be nothing of the sort.

Elias, do as you please, I just don't know if I can help.  I'll make sure to prune what remarks I can so they're "helpful" if the people who start coming are actually interested in that.

I was about to hit the sack, and thought of something you said.  Ever notice that some of us who get totally burned out on the never ending struggle tend to get bitter and burned out about it?  I'm pretty sure I've been there for the last 8 years or so.  Especially since every apparent promise turns out to be a lie.

I sure hope what you're doing turns out right.  I really do.  Its about time for something to go right.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Bill St. Clair on December 13, 2014, 03:23:32 am
Wow. Nice link to stats.

That stats link is available on the forum home page in the "Forum Stats" section near the bottom of the page from a link titled "[More Stats]". Were there other stats that you used to see that are no more?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on December 13, 2014, 09:11:43 am
Wow. Nice link to stats.

That stats link is available on the forum home page in the "Forum Stats" section near the bottom of the page from a link titled "[More Stats]". Were there other stats that you used to see that are no more?

My entry point to TMM is "unread posts" where I peruse headlines and read threads that tickle my fancy. I then hit "new replies" catching anything of interest before I count my TMM time allowance spent.  The Forum Stats have thus eluded me.  It is good to break with patterns from time to time. New things can be experienced that may have value. ;)

I did like the activity markers next to poster's names, but others apparently don't.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Mr. Bill on December 14, 2014, 06:00:47 pm
I haven't been participating much here for a while, but I've been a member for a little over 10 years, so I'll declare myself entitled to offer a few comments. :thrbiggrin:

On the basic question, I don't think Elias (or any other member) needs other members' approval to invite newbies.

Yes, the forum will change if new members join.

It will also change if old members leave.  It will change if NO members come or go, just because time passes, and we change, and the world changes.

One big problem that ALL online forums are facing: we're running software designed 10-15 years ago for people using desktop computers, but smartphones and small tablets are now the dominant tool for internet access.  I don't even own one of the things, but I'm told that forums are not easy to use on the tiny screen.  Eventually, forums will have to adapt, or they'll fade away like dialup BBSes.

As for the forum's culture and political philosophy...  I appreciate what ML wrote somewhere way above, about how all sorts are welcome here, but...  We're a "big tent" that spans the entire range from anarchist libertarian to minarchist libertarian.

Sure, others are technically welcome here, but (as ML also said) they need to have a thick skin.

So, even if we do acquire some Oath Keepers members who are closer to Tea Party Republican, I think there's a good chance that, no matter how thick their skins, they'd find it unpleasant to participate here.

This would also be true if we courted (say) members of the LGBTQ community, or blacks angry about Ferguson-style policing, or progressive Muslims fleeing persecution, or polygamous Mormons, etc.  All of the above are primed to hear the message of liberty.

Whether they would actually participate on this forum depends largely on personalities, both ours and theirs.

As it stands now, newbies who choose to stay and participate on this forum must either:
I'm not saying this is a good or bad thing, it's just a fact.  Unless the current members agree to welcome dissenters and have a big tent, it'll be a small tent.  Small tents are useful things too, but you've got to accept that membership will then be small.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on December 14, 2014, 06:33:26 pm
    Have a giant ego and stick around just to argue with us.

dgg9 where are you?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 14, 2014, 09:55:21 pm
What if I agree AND have a giant ego?

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Mr. Bill on December 14, 2014, 10:13:42 pm
What if I agree AND have a giant ego?

...no, I think I'd pee on an electric fence before I'd answer that. :wub:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Tahn L. on December 21, 2014, 04:40:22 pm
I am coming late to this thread, indeed I have not participated in any discussion here of late. I was off the entire net for almost a year but I remember my entry to this forum and wow, what an experience. I was excited and thrilled to learn I was not alone and crazy but that a lot of people thought just like I did. Well, almost like I did. Claire was the reason I came here but others were the reason I stayed. Too many to list.

I remember when we tried to engage in discussion and debate with both Peace Officers and Law Enforcement Officers and I draw a distinct difference between them. It ain't the badge, it's the attitude. Sometimes it worked and sometimes we were met with angry words, sometimes with astute questions and sometimes with silence. I remember starting a thread asking both types to state their oaths they took and what they meant to each. No takers but later Stewart started Oath Keepers and I contributed a small amount to the organization, although I certainly claim no part in creating the idea. I so admire what he and others have done.

In reviewing a few of my early posts, which I recommend we all do, (not mine but yours) I still feel that a dialog with them is critically important. Ideas can change more minds than ballots or bullets, so count me in. They cannot change my views about freedom but perhaps we can change their views on what a free society should be. Lets rock and roll with words, concepts and most importantly with the philosophy of a free people.

 Peace, Love and Brotherhood Through Equal Rights and Firepower.
Tahn
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 21, 2014, 11:43:58 pm
I am coming late to this thread, indeed I have not participated in any discussion here of late. I was off the entire net for almost a year but I remember my entry to this forum and wow, what an experience. I was excited and thrilled to learn I was not alone and crazy but that a lot of people thought just like I did. Well, almost like I did. Claire was the reason I came here but others were the reason I stayed. Too many to list.

I remember when we tried to engage in discussion and debate with both Peace Officers and Law Enforcement Officers and I draw a distinct difference between them. It ain't the badge, it's the attitude. Sometimes it worked and sometimes we were met with angry words, sometimes with astute questions and sometimes with silence. I remember starting a thread asking both types to state their oaths they took and what they meant to each. No takers but later Stewart started Oath Keepers and I contributed a small amount to the organization, although I certainly claim no part in creating the idea. I so admire what he and others have done.

In reviewing a few of my early posts, which I recommend we all do, (not mine but yours) I still feel that a dialog with them is critically important. Ideas can change more minds than ballots or bullets, so count me in. They cannot change my views about freedom but perhaps we can change their views on what a free society should be. Lets rock and roll with words, concepts and most importantly with the philosophy of a free people.

 Peace, Love and Brotherhood Through Equal Rights and Firepower.
Tahn

It's great to see you Tahn. I have not been around here much myself in recent years -- Oath Keepers keeps me very busy, and so do the two cats I live with. ;)

Thank you for a strong good post on the topic. Merry Christmas to you and yours, btw.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on December 22, 2014, 01:40:01 am
Lets rock and roll with words, concepts and most importantly with the philosophy of a free people.

Peace, Love and Brotherhood Through Equal Rights and Firepower.
Tahn


If you came up with that, I'm so putting that to use, that's perfect!  (Unless you mind?

Reminds me of the Doom 3 Plasma Rifle commercial.   "UAC, making safer worlds through suuuu-perior firepower."
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Tahn L. on December 22, 2014, 01:13:13 pm
Elias, Thank you for your positive thoughts and actions. Best wishes to you and yours.

Destin Faruda,

 I am so old I can no longer remember what is original and what I nave read or heard before. I can however give you my quit claim on anything I say that can be used to promote freedom. Feel free.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 03, 2015, 04:11:15 pm
Are we done with this discussion? It would seem that everyone at TMM who is actually interested in participation is good with Elias going ahead with his plans.

If there are serious objections, speak now or hold your peace.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: da gooch on January 03, 2015, 06:19:43 pm
First day back after nearly a month without any connection. (long story)

Quote
Don't quit Oath Keepers, Bro, just add this place to your daily travels, right? Oath Keepers is doing a wonderful job for this country. I'm trying to get TMM off its ass to do something comparable, which is what this thread is all about. We'll see how it goes with the membership here.

And yet Elias has also said that what we wanted to do here either way was no big deal to him because he already had an alternate website ready to go. ? ?

So ... Whatever the rest of you want to do I will go along until I am not interested any longer.
In My Humble Opinion ... Living Free is task enough for me.
Oh, I'll help educate any that ask but I don't envision myself as any kind of "savior" unless it's to haul out someone drowning nearby.
I tried being a National Figure (attempting to save the Constitution) and all it did was spend my money. (and other peoples money as well)

stay safe




Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on January 09, 2015, 04:06:42 am
Are we done with this discussion? It would seem that everyone at TMM who is actually interested in participation is good with Elias going ahead with his plans.

If there are serious objections, speak now or hold your peace.

Well, ML, there have been five votes against opening this place up for more traffic and participation, so for that reason and others, I'm not sure if we should close this discussion. In fact, I'm not sure why the idea came up to give this discussion a time limit. But maybe I'm not seeing everything peripheral, or am missing something.

I think that at the heart of my discussion recently here at TMM is my lament that the very name "The Mental Militia" has so much inherent potential, yet this place is not doing much to utilize that potential. I am working with James Jaeger and Edwin Vieira to produce a new documentary on "martial law". It is based on Dr. Vieira's newest book, "By Tyranny Out Of Necessity: The Bastardy of Martial Law". The book lays out the four types of martial law, including martial governance, and reports on what the Constitution has to say about each sort of martial law. He says, and shows clearly, that the remedy for the coming tyranny we're facing in America today is the revitalization of the Constitutional "Militia of the several States". And here sits a "Mental Militia" which is bleeding members ever since Claire renamed this place and found other fields in which to play (and work). I think that was in 2007. 

We could be doing so much more with the name. While this place is still operational I can't very well start up another operation elsewhere and name it The Mental Militia, right? But I'm stuck with the knowledge that The Mental Militia is exactly what I'm fired up to promote as the vehicle in which to drive this nation's freedom movement into the concepts of Dr. Vieira's books.  Everything starts in the mind, does it not? We are in a mental war, what our dear government calls "MindWar", and our survival as free people (what's left of it) now depends on our outsmarting the most powerful conglomerates on the planet, a tandem which includes not only the pigs who've stolen our Constitutional government inside that beltway but also the money whores of the international banking cartel who sponsor the United Nations. The American people, to have a chance at all, must be alerted to the Constitutional requirements that they exercise their duty to be armed individually and as Militia, in each State in compact.

Right now, Oath Keepers is the only organization calling for the revitalization of the Constitutional Militia. My idea for this place is to turn it into an intellectual hub where freedom rings and where the process of reclaiming our lost freedom can begin lawfully, legally, and legitimately with a movement which will totally piss the powers that be, but which they cannot argue against with any validity. Right here at TMM is where the groundwork could be laid-in for all States to resurrect their long-lost Militia. The very name of this place guarantees that it could provoke interest nationally. We could initiate programs, activities, and projects to drive us closer to fulfillment of such goals. The potential is huge.

That is another glimpse of what my "plans" might entail. This place loves guns, loves freedom, loves philosophical anarchy, Voluntaryism, unobstructed free speech, freedom of/from religion, (in fact, if we ask L. Neil Smith, our kind of folks love the full Bill of Rights and even those rights which are not enumerated), and the blessings of liberty. The Bill of Rights is part of the Constitution. The Constitution clearly mandates that the Federal government FUND the Militia of the several States to ensure that the States have their Militia.  But nobody outside of Vieira's circles seems to notice that. He points out that Article I, Section 8, clauses 15 and 16 are in the main body of the Constitution,  and so also is Article II, Section 2, clause 1. That is all before we get to the Bill of Rights and its Second Amendment. It is the highest uncontested law of the land, and the whole goddamned government is totally ignoring it -- because, as we've proved here a hundred times over, our government has been stolen by powers which use our elected and representative offices for their own wicked goals, which include controlling us, which includes getting our guns, period. That is the battle which only the Militia, well organized, well trained, well funded, and widely in place, can win. Talk about a challenge for We The People! Jeez!

And now here comes Edwin Vieira and James Jaeger with a movie named to commemorate Paul Revere's "Midnight Ride" while exposing the martial law hoax for what it is, and it's got Ron Paul, G. Edward Griffin, Stewart Rhodes, KrisAnne Hall, Chuck Baldwin, Larry Pratt and others on board, and their movie is damn straight a blast at the heart of tyranny, and it's all about why America must revitalize the Militia within the States. It may be synchronicity, or whatever, but it's happening right now and here we sit twiddling our thumbs whilst going over twenty thousand tons of valuable free-thinking info which packs the archives of this place, but "doing" nothing. Remember Sunni Maravillosa? She was an Admin here when Claire had this place. She built an "E-Magazine" named "Doing Freedom". I'm sure some here remember that. But where is it today? What's happening with Don Lobo Tiggre and the Liberty Round Table? Or any of a hundred other ventures? This place will either adapt as changing years drift by, or it will wilt and blow away like a dead leaf in autumn. Unless we "do" something with it.

That is some of my thinking. There is support across America right now for what I'm thinking. So I want to see TMM play out its proper role in destiny. I do not know why every member here would not want to be a part of that. For that reason, I do think it bears more discussion.

Love ya, MamaLiberty!

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on January 09, 2015, 04:50:17 am
First day back after nearly a month without any connection. (long story)

Quote
Don't quit Oath Keepers, Bro, just add this place to your daily travels, right? Oath Keepers is doing a wonderful job for this country. I'm trying to get TMM off its ass to do something comparable, which is what this thread is all about. We'll see how it goes with the membership here.

And yet Elias has also said that what we wanted to do here either way was no big deal to him because he already had an alternate website ready to go. ? ?

So ... Whatever the rest of you want to do I will go along until I am not interested any longer.
In My Humble Opinion ... Living Free is task enough for me.
Oh, I'll help educate any that ask but I don't envision myself as any kind of "savior" unless it's to haul out someone drowning nearby.
I tried being a National Figure (attempting to save the Constitution) and all it did was spend my money. (and other peoples money as well)

stay safe

Hey Gooch,
I've just laid out a bit more of my thinking in the previous post which I just now made to ML. Please read that if you would. For the record, I'd rather use TMM here and share the fun with our good friends here, but I was trying to not put undue pressure about it on the regular members here.

And yes, I do have a website, thanks to Rags and Bill. I just don't have time to load it, lol.

Sample page by our newest member here at TMM, Cyrellys:
https://eliasalias.com/2014/11/17/cyrellys-old-world-celt/

It would be much easier to build a mother-site for these forums and already have TMM's forums up and running with all these years' worth of intelligence, human egoism, knowledge and history, at our fingertips, y'kno?

Sorry you shot your wad on Oath Keepers and now regret it. Hate to hear that, Bro. I'm very proud of the work Oath Keepers does, such as helping sponsor this film:

http://www.midnightride.us/trailer/

(Am also sorry you cannot view that movie trailer. Here's hoping this year brings you some financial relief. If you want to make that happen, or to let it happen, perhaps helping TMM launch the Militia of the several States to combat the militarization of our police which will usher in martial law.

Maybe everything is hopeless, but as long as I draw breath, I will do all I can to oppose tyranny. I think that same fire is buried somewhere inside you too. ;)

Salute!
Elias

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 09, 2015, 05:41:55 am
Elias, I'm curious just how you envision the US government "funding" any militia without theft and coercion? Should it not rather be funded voluntarily?

Anyway, there is no actual time limit, but when people stop even making comments it would indicate all have spoken their mind on the subject and are waiting for "us" to do something. Far as I'm concerned, the ball is in your court. Bring in all these new members you speak of and let's see what happens. You can't really expect agreement with your proposal to be unanimous here, and I think that 21 out of the thirty or so actually active members is not too bad.

Go for it...
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on January 09, 2015, 06:49:00 am
Elias, I'm curious just how you envision the US government "funding" any militia without theft and coercion? Should it not rather be funded voluntarily?

Anyway, there is no actual time limit, but when people stop even making comments it would indicate all have spoken their mind on the subject and are waiting for "us" to do something. Far as I'm concerned, the ball is in your court. Bring in all these new members you speak of and let's see what happens. You can't really expect agreement with your proposal to be unanimous here, and I think that 21 out of the thirty or so actually active members is not too bad.

Go for it...

MamaLiberty, I'll be glad to go into the "funding" aspect of the government's responsibility to the States, but I can't go there at this moment -- will come back to that shortly.

Regarding your observations that about seventy-plus percent of the votes are in favor of livening up this place and that the thread has ceased to attract new readers, I'll accept your call on that. I see that you have created a sub-forum for MindWar, so that will be a good place for me to start up the Resistance movement, lol! Thanks ML.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: cowardly lion on January 11, 2015, 09:17:40 pm
Well, I've just plowed through 8 pages of discussion that I just now found.  Sorry about being such an inactive member.

As was alluded to, when Claire left the tenor here changed (or so I thought) and since I was not contributing much anyway my visits got fewer and fewer.  I ended up on Facebook in order to keep up with nieces and nephews, and I read/learn and re-post info from a 2nd Amendment group, the Zelman partisans, USCCA and a few others, but I'm not really *doing* anything.

Elias, as others have stated, without previous knowledge of the actual term MindWar, I am certainly aware that these kinds of activities are in full engagement throughout society, and I try to recognize it when I can.

All that being said, I now will 'vote' to open the fora to one and all, with the caveats (mutual respect, thick skins, etc) mentioned, and there are some people on FB and locally to whom I will extend invitations, probably with ML's nicely written flyer.

And after voting I will move to the new (whatever you call it) for your MindWar threads.

cl
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on January 11, 2015, 09:43:16 pm
Well, I've just plowed through 8 pages of discussion that I just now found.  Sorry about being such an inactive member.

As was alluded to, when Claire left the tenor here changed (or so I thought) and since I was not contributing much anyway my visits got fewer and fewer.  I ended up on Facebook in order to keep up with nieces and nephews, and I read/learn and re-post info from a 2nd Amendment group, the Zelman partisans, USCCA and a few others, but I'm not really *doing* anything.

Elias, as others have stated, without previous knowledge of the actual term MindWar, I am certainly aware that these kinds of activities are in full engagement throughout society, and I try to recognize it when I can.

All that being said, I now will 'vote' to open the fora to one and all, with the caveats (mutual respect, thick skins, etc) mentioned, and there are some people on FB and locally to whom I will extend invitations, probably with ML's nicely written flyer.

And after voting I will move to the new (whatever you call it) for your MindWar threads.

cl

Wow, CL -- it's nice to see you. Thank you for keeping the candle burning...
Hope you enjoy that MindWar thread. I also hope you'll chip in with a comment or two, eh?  ;)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: penguinsscareme on January 13, 2015, 06:18:57 pm
Silver's and Mr. Bill's responses really resonated with me. This little community of ours has gone through a few transformations and upheavals over the years. Backwoods Home Magazine was my point of entry. I had been a reader of Dave Duffy's, Massad Ayoob's, and John Silveira's columns for a few years, and then started reading Claire's. Through her, I found out about the free state project, and upon checking it out, I knew I had to either sign up or stop complaining. So I signed up. I came here to explore deeper into this new thing I had found...and promptly got my ass kicked. It turns out, I was still very much a statist, even though at the time I didn't even know the word statist.

But I was fast friends with many of the people here, and I was a sponge for knowledge. The bridge dancing incident, the Red Button Event, the twinkie thread, the silly stuff thread, along with all the chat about current events- it was always easy to find something interesting to talk about. If anything, there was more than I could participate in.

This community, as constituted at that time, came through in the most overwhelming of ways at a time when we were on the brink of financial ruin (long story- short version: medical bills). This community literally saved my house. In the time before gofundme or kickstarter was a thing, dozens of people, many anonymously, many strangers to us, gave us so much money that in one fell swoop it got us current on all our financial obligations. It wasn't the end of lean times for us, but since that day, we never again fell behind on any bills.

But now it's been 11 years since I first came here. I was in my late twenties, renting in Massachusetts with a toddler at home. Now, in my early forties, both hardened and softened by experience and years and wear, everything has changed. Most of my favorite people here have gone on to other things in other places. The world has changed. I have changed.

Social media has happened. I understand the objections to social media, and they are totally legit. But social media is a much richer, more customizable, more fun, broader experience for me. Mr. Bill is right, this format is outdated now. If the mission of this place is to be a small community that doesn't see much turnover as the years go by, then that's fine. But if the mission is to reach new people and expose them to new ideas, or to network, frankly, social media does it better. By the way, if anyone here has a facebook account and doesn't already know me, look me up. My real name is Andrew Wiegand. I'd love to know you.

I think a couple people referenced it obliquely, but I'll say it right out. Mouse sucks. It's not just mouse, but mouse in particular really degrades the user experience.

In my experience with online discussion groups, bad participation drives out good participation. It's kind of like Gresham's law. I've seen it here, and at a couple other groups.

Can TMM recover? Honestly, I doubt it. I'm happy to be wrong about that, of course. I still poke my head in from time to time. I'll continue to do so as long as there remains at least a core of the people I stop in hoping to see.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on January 13, 2015, 08:20:56 pm
Wow, PSM.
While it's good to see you in here, I'm wondering why you felt you should attack mouse? I thought we did not want personal attacks here. I wish you would not do that, but since you did, can you explain why you said that mouse "sucks"? Is it too many posts, in your opinion? Just curious.

Thanks,
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: penguinsscareme on January 13, 2015, 10:23:50 pm
Mouse is emblematic of the reason why I don't participate here hardly at all anymore, and in fact a larger overall problem I have seen at this and other discussion groups. Mouse posts more than any other member ever. The only content I ever see from mouse is news feed type, sky-is-falling, simplistic, us-vs-them, bunker mentality, dichromatic, you-won't-believe-this, uninteresting, shallow, at times hyperbolic, under-researched, hasty, unreliable, poorly sourced, sensationalistic, tabloid-esque garbage. It's clickbait. Mouse is undaunted by lack of edifying discussion generated by his posts, he seems to feel that if you throw a hundred posts on the wall, one of them is bound to spark some discussion, and if not discussion, then at least attention.

The content mouse posts is worse than useless- it's disempowering, because what can be done about it? For instance: "Massachusetts law enforcement agencies claim they corporations, exempt from FOIA," is a recent post. I'm not interested in this kind of content. And, at least in General Discussion, that seems to be the de rigeur. It's not just mouse, but he is by far the worst offender, in my opinion. For all the posts he throws up, I have never felt like there was any personal connection made. And based on some of the things I see him link, I don't think I want one anyway.

And where is Joel, and Thunder and Lightning, and debeez, and coloradohermit, and the others whom I have cherished in one way or another? They're either gone or silent, or nearly so. TMM has changed, and I have changed as well, but we have not changed in similar ways or directions. To the extent that I come here at all anymore, it's to interact with the people I already have connections with who haven't transitioned over to social media.

You go back about 7 years or more and you look at the General Discussion page topics and you see a lot more actual discussion. I mean, there was always some newsfeed type content, but now and in the past few years, it has become almost given over to that. It's not fair to compare what exists now to what existed several years ago. I get that. But nevertheless, I liked it a lot better when it was a discussion forum, not a news feed. The one place I get that at all anymore is the Economics board. And that's mostly where you'll find me.

I don't think I personally attacked mouse, because I don't know mouse as a person. I think I might have known that he is from New Zealand, but I'm not even really sure I'm right about that. I'm not even sure I'm referring to him (her?) in the correct pronoun. I'm talking strictly about content. On that score, I'll stand by what I said. I know I could have said it more delicately or with more circumspection, but in the previous 8 pages of this thread there was talk of having to have a thick skin to participate here, so I took it as license.

In any case, I'll refrain from using blunt verbiage going forward. That said, I remain steadfast in my substantive observations.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: RVM45 on January 14, 2015, 11:58:56 am
Isn't Mouse a "She"?

I used to be daunted by the sheer volume of stuff on TMM and posted little because I despaired of keeping up with even a small fraction of it.

What I should have done was to focus on a couple or three sub-forums...

Now, Honestly I make a few "Drive-By" Posts just trying to spark some participation.

Not everything--just maybe 30%...

Maybe that isn't the thing to do--judging by PSM's comment, maybe that's not like a Helpful thing to like do.


.....RVM45              :mellow: :thumbsup: :mellow:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on January 14, 2015, 12:26:53 pm
Sounds like a personal problem PSM.  There is nothing wrong with what Mouse posts. Don't like it?  Don't read it.

And if you were paying attention and reading some of her personal posts you would know she lives in New Zealand.

"Kind of like Greshams law" applies to one or two other posters but not Mouse.

You have also personally attacked the one person who is least likely to reply in that extraordinarily vicious manner that some people here have.

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on January 14, 2015, 02:51:40 pm
Mouse is emblematic of the reason why I don't participate here hardly at all anymore, and in fact a larger overall problem I have seen at this and other discussion groups. Mouse posts more than any other member ever. The only content I ever see from mouse is news feed type, sky-is-falling, simplistic, us-vs-them, bunker mentality, dichromatic, you-won't-believe-this, uninteresting, shallow, at times hyperbolic, under-researched, hasty, unreliable, poorly sourced, sensationalistic, tabloid-esque garbage. It's clickbait. Mouse is undaunted by lack of edifying discussion generated by his posts, he seems to feel that if you throw a hundred posts on the wall, one of them is bound to spark some discussion, and if not discussion, then at least attention.

The content mouse posts is worse than useless- it's disempowering, because what can be done about it? For instance: "Massachusetts law enforcement agencies claim they corporations, exempt from FOIA," is a recent post. I'm not interested in this kind of content. And, at least in General Discussion, that seems to be the de rigeur. It's not just mouse, but he is by far the worst offender, in my opinion. For all the posts he throws up, I have never felt like there was any personal connection made. And based on some of the things I see him link, I don't think I want one anyway.

And where is Joel, and Thunder and Lightning, and debeez, and coloradohermit, and the others whom I have cherished in one way or another? They're either gone or silent, or nearly so. TMM has changed, and I have changed as well, but we have not changed in similar ways or directions. To the extent that I come here at all anymore, it's to interact with the people I already have connections with who haven't transitioned over to social media.

You go back about 7 years or more and you look at the General Discussion page topics and you see a lot more actual discussion. I mean, there was always some newsfeed type content, but now and in the past few years, it has become almost given over to that. It's not fair to compare what exists now to what existed several years ago. I get that. But nevertheless, I liked it a lot better when it was a discussion forum, not a news feed. The one place I get that at all anymore is the Economics board. And that's mostly where you'll find me.

I don't think I personally attacked mouse, because I don't know mouse as a person. I think I might have known that he is from New Zealand, but I'm not even really sure I'm right about that. I'm not even sure I'm referring to him (her?) in the correct pronoun. I'm talking strictly about content. On that score, I'll stand by what I said. I know I could have said it more delicately or with more circumspection, but in the previous 8 pages of this thread there was talk of having to have a thick skin to participate here, so I took it as license.

In any case, I'll refrain from using blunt verbiage going forward. That said, I remain steadfast in my substantive observations.

Damn. Aren't you just a blessing to the whole God damned world! Thank you so much for sharing. Right after you apologize to mouse, why don't you tell me why you're even here? Since I do not appreciate crudeness, insensitivity, and people who violate their terms of service agreement regarding personal attacks, I'd like to let you know I'll not be missing you when you stop sharing your rude brilliance with we mere peons here at TMM. Thanks, but no thanks. Happy trails.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on January 14, 2015, 03:11:15 pm
Mouse is emblematic of the reason why I don't participate here hardly at all anymore, and in fact a larger overall problem I have seen at this and other discussion groups. Mouse posts more than any other member ever. The only content I ever see from mouse is news feed type, sky-is-falling, simplistic, us-vs-them, bunker mentality, dichromatic, you-won't-believe-this, uninteresting, shallow, at times hyperbolic, under-researched, hasty, unreliable, poorly sourced, sensationalistic, tabloid-esque garbage. It's clickbait. Mouse is undaunted by lack of edifying discussion generated by his posts, he seems to feel that if you throw a hundred posts on the wall, one of them is bound to spark some discussion, and if not discussion, then at least attention.

The content mouse posts is worse than useless- it's disempowering, because what can be done about it? For instance: "Massachusetts law enforcement agencies claim they corporations, exempt from FOIA," is a recent post. I'm not interested in this kind of content. And, at least in General Discussion, that seems to be the de rigeur. It's not just mouse, but he is by far the worst offender, in my opinion. For all the posts he throws up, I have never felt like there was any personal connection made. And based on some of the things I see him link, I don't think I want one anyway.

And where is Joel, and Thunder and Lightning, and debeez, and coloradohermit, and the others whom I have cherished in one way or another? They're either gone or silent, or nearly so. TMM has changed, and I have changed as well, but we have not changed in similar ways or directions. To the extent that I come here at all anymore, it's to interact with the people I already have connections with who haven't transitioned over to social media.

You go back about 7 years or more and you look at the General Discussion page topics and you see a lot more actual discussion. I mean, there was always some newsfeed type content, but now and in the past few years, it has become almost given over to that. It's not fair to compare what exists now to what existed several years ago. I get that. But nevertheless, I liked it a lot better when it was a discussion forum, not a news feed. The one place I get that at all anymore is the Economics board. And that's mostly where you'll find me.

I don't think I personally attacked mouse, because I don't know mouse as a person. I think I might have known that he is from New Zealand, but I'm not even really sure I'm right about that. I'm not even sure I'm referring to him (her?) in the correct pronoun. I'm talking strictly about content. On that score, I'll stand by what I said. I know I could have said it more delicately or with more circumspection, but in the previous 8 pages of this thread there was talk of having to have a thick skin to participate here, so I took it as license.

In any case, I'll refrain from using blunt verbiage going forward. That said, I remain steadfast in my substantive observations.

Damn. Aren't you just a blessing to the whole God damned world! Thank you so much for sharing. Right after you apologize to mouse, why don't you tell me why you're even here? Since I do not appreciate crudeness, insensitivity, and people who violate their terms of service agreement regarding personal attacks, I'd like to let you know I'll not be missing you when you stop sharing your rude brilliance with we mere peons here at TMM. Thanks, but no thanks. Happy trails.

Salute!
Elias

Ellias

Sir, While I do agree with some of what PSM has said, there are parts that I do not, but How does that make what you just posted any different that what he posted?

Did you not just attack him for what he said, after you asked him for his opinion?

And how does this sit with you and the 1st amendment, does he not have a right to share whats on his mind too?
Again did you not ask for opinions about this site? 
And why come down on him when others here have done far worst to others?

By your statement here, you have sent a message that we are not free to share our opinions, and therefore people do not share.

good day sir

Dawg
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on January 14, 2015, 03:51:09 pm
Wow PSM… Your post really triggered an absolute avalanche of thoughts for me last night! Seriously, I didn’t finally drift off to sleep until sometime after 1:30 AM this morning…

I have long feared that my posts have contributed nothing but gibberish noise. I admit it’s hard not to be paranoid as I read your post (and others for that matter) who have voiced concern about the lack of quality in this forum that they mean to include my posts in that statement. I am not digging for compliments because I have never fancied myself a teacher among such intellectuals. However, I did come here to learn.

Like you, I didn’t even know what a statist was and that I was one! Claire is a mysterious woman to me though based on such glowing commentary regarding her I have formed a picture, rightly or wrongly (though respectfully) of Cate Blanchett’s portrayal of Galadriel. She was very kind to me and all my newbiness. When I was trying to make sense of the whole California Prop 8 debate, Scarmig and Silver patiently endured my questions. Since they never patronized me I was able to learn something new and here’s the key, apply it. Lenny wrote some sharp insight about ZAP that imprinted my mind. I loved reading Mutti’s updates about homeschooling and goats and God bless her, she did try to start a thread that was devoted to sharing encouraging and uplifting news and personal stories. I can’t help but think if fine folks like those leave or post less and less, then what opportunities will be missed? I don’t for a minute think they are responsible for changing the hearts and minds of others. But darn it, they changed mine!

I am truly sorry that this place has become the dust bowl I am now imagining it to be. I tried to reach out to others way more advanced than I and have fallen flat on my face. I have tried to be kind and patient under seemingly excruciating moments of testing that resolve to be so. But what the heck are you (a general you) gonna do about some personalities, and the determination of someone who might be looking for greener pastures? Nothing.

Elias is right. The Mental Militia is a brilliant name and an accurate description. It really seems to transcend many levels. He cannot exactly highjack the name – nor does he seem inclined to do so being the kind of gentleman he is. Mr. Bill is right about technology and the demands of people changing. Hmm, I guess I am one of those people along for the ride. At least I don’t feel qualified enough to jump into the driver’s seat.

I guess what I’m saying is that I am still here because I learned so much over the last five years that, even for nostalgia’s sake, I don’t want to give up hope that not all is lost with this forum. I hold onto the belief that there is much more to learn. But, if everyone who once contributed greatly and tremendously to this site leave then how will folks like me be equipped for the battles –mental or otherwise, ahead? Sink or swim you (a general you) say? Well, I don’t do Facebook, I have no interest in Instagram or Twitter or whatever is popular at the moment. I don’t have the desire (or energy!) to canvas multiple sites. I put some roots down here and I while I didn’t think this would be a “forever” kind of relationship, I certainly didn’t expect it to turn so melancholy.

I do appreciate the contributions of so many here and wish I could reciprocate. I hope so very much that despite your (a general your) misgivings, your disappointments, and your frustrations that you (a general you) would reconsider posting here. Sure, real life comes first. There are bills to be paid, children to raise, relationships to nurture, homes to repair. Even so, setting aside some time to post some deep thinking, or even quirky posts might change the tide again. If you (a general you) feel that this forum has been highjacked by a wave of hollowness that leaves a bad taste in your mouth, then why not reclaim this place for something a little more worthy?

Please be generous with me: I wear my heart on my sleeve…

:)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on January 14, 2015, 03:54:10 pm
I don't see the personal attack either? Just a sincere, but general concern voiced?... :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 14, 2015, 03:58:29 pm
Quote
If you (a general you) feel that this forum has been highjacked by a wave of hollowness that leaves a bad taste in your mouth, then why not reclaim this place for something a little more worthy?

This... and just don't bother to read anything you (general you) consider unworthy. We all have our own criteria for that.

Seems simple enough to me. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on January 14, 2015, 04:01:07 pm
Quote
If you (a general you) feel that this forum has been highjacked by a wave of hollowness that leaves a bad taste in your mouth, then why not reclaim this place for something a little more worthy?

This... and just don't bother to read anything you (general you) consider unworthy. We all have our own criteria for that.

Seems simple enough to me. :)

Yep! Hiya Mama, Happy New Year!
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: coloradohermit on January 14, 2015, 05:34:01 pm
Hiya PSM. So glad to see you're still out there. Nice coincidence to catch you on a rare visit.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: penguinsscareme on January 14, 2015, 07:05:23 pm
Sounds like a personal problem PSM.  There is nothing wrong with what Mouse posts. Don't like it?  Don't read it.

Well, that's just it, jamie. I don't read it. I don't find it edifying, therefore I do not read it. I almost never spend any time on General Discussion ever because I find no value in the content there anymore.

Quote
And if you were paying attention and reading some of her personal posts you would know she lives in New Zealand.

See, I thought I was right about that, but again, I don't read mouse's posts.

Elias:
Quote
Damn. Aren't you just a blessing to the whole God damned world! Thank you so much for sharing.

You asked me to explain myself. I did that. I'm sorry you don't like my explanation. All it is is my perception, no need to put any more stock in it than that. I tried to be honest and candid with you.

Quote
Right after you apologize to mouse

For saying mouse sucks? Very well, mouse, I apologize for saying that you suck. That was not classy of me.

Quote
why don't you tell me why you're even here?

I'm not sure I feel that I owe you an explanation. Nevertheless: I'm mostly not here. I come in once in a while to check out the economics board, and I usually stop in to the guns and gear board while I'm here. That's about it.

Quote
Since I do not appreciate crudeness, insensitivity, and people who violate their terms of service agreement regarding personal attacks, I'd like to let you know I'll not be missing you when you stop sharing your rude brilliance with we mere peons here at TMM. Thanks, but no thanks. Happy trails.

I'm just a bad person, I guess.

Julio:
Quote
And how does this sit with you and the 1st amendment, does he not have a right to share whats on his mind too?

It's private property. End of story.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on January 14, 2015, 07:18:22 pm
Well HOT DANG!  We got ourselves a gen-u-ine discussion.

As part of my sheriff campaign I joined facebook, linkedin and twitter. It also connected my to my children in ways I had been missing... and, as it turns out, to a lot of people and information I would otherwise have missed.

None of them replace The Mental Militia. This place has a greater quality of community and is much more a peer group to me than any social media I have seen.

True some of the comments and posts are not valuable to me.  Gee it turns out I don't have to read every thread.  Heck, I've even exercised the ignore feature a few times.  Still, no contest in metaspace or in meatspace for the percentage of my contemporaries.  If I ever come to trial, this is the only place I can imagine trusting as a jury of my peers in a completely random selection.

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: penguinsscareme on January 14, 2015, 08:14:23 pm
Also, Elias, I want to be clear that I have no problem with you. I don't quite know what it was that I said that triggered your response, but I wasn't directing any ill will toward you.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: penguinsscareme on January 14, 2015, 08:31:01 pm
Hiya PSM. So glad to see you're still out there. Nice coincidence to catch you on a rare visit.

It's great to see you as well, ch. It really is.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on January 15, 2015, 06:45:35 pm
Well HOT DANG!  We got ourselves a gen-u-ine discussion.

I am not being a wise-guy, I am sincerely curious when I ask, what exactly is the genuine discussion in your estimate? :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on January 15, 2015, 07:11:14 pm
I have always treasured the honesty, clarity, and humility of PSM's posts.  I miss him, and am always happy to see him return.

I share his opinion of mouse.  I tried to be tactful with my words, with limited success.  Tact is not my long suit.  She's been on ignore a very long time.  I have no doubt that she means well, but I don't enjoy the unending torrent of context-free bad news.

Recently I started a thread about some outrage or other, and it was merged with mouse's post on the same subject.  I didn't see it because I don't read those threads.  I've decided not to respond to them.  But now it seems that I have.  I don't blame the mods, merging threads is one of the many little tasks they do to keep this place sane and useful.

So now I won't offer any more commentary on topical outrages, because I don't care to lend my voice to a river of garbage.

That's chilling of speech in action.  Not free speech; this is private property, and the dynamics of this place leads me to place a rather broad swath of topics off limits.  It's no different than keeping away from certain topics with business associates, or in-laws, or family.  But it is a change here, and a loss for me.

I'm not the first to experience this, and mouse is not the first or only voice to drive people who actually contributed thoughts written down for discussion away from this place.

I think PSM's points about social media are also spot on.  Like Moonbeam, I find services tailored to short attention spans uninteresting.  One of things I value about this place is the old threads and the knowledge within them.  I find it educational and entertaining to see how some of those mini essays have stood the test of time.  That's is so difficult as to be nearly impossible on Facebook, and mining twits for wisdom is a fool's errands.  Our society has elevated snark to an art form, and forsaken thought and knowledge.

I've been coming here less of late, and I rather expect that trend to continue.  I'm not going to stomp off in a huff, but rather fade away.

It's too bad, but all good things must come to an end.  My life is rich, and the good things I learned here, the friends I made, the fun I had will always be with me.  Like PSM I'm older than when I joined, both harder and softer, and letting go is one of the lessons of old age.

Peace,

Silver
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on January 15, 2015, 08:35:00 pm
Sad.  It is all so inconsequential.  I don't think mouse has driven anyone away. Where is the proof for this assertion?

 The people with giant egos have driven people away if blame has to be assigned.  The people who write what they no doubt perceive to be elegant thought pieces and then sit back to bask in the praise.  They also brook no disagreement and are more than a little condescending.


Whatever anyone says, when you name someone and write a highly critical piece on that person, that is a personal attack. 

 The first "tactful" objection didn't work.  Then  someone else makes a  personal attack for the same reason, so now it is safe and good to  pile on. Typical.

So what I am getting here is that mouse must immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" and then "chilling of speech"  will  end.

That is funny.

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Silver on January 15, 2015, 09:04:14 pm
Don't put words in my mouth.

I wrote that I don't enjoy mouse's posts and have her on ignore.  I wrote that I will change my behavior.

You wrote that "mouse should immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" ."  I didn't write that. You did.

No one has attacked mouse as a person.  No one has said that she is awful, or has bad intentions.  Saying that you don't enjoy what someone posts is not a personal attack.

I don't like jamie's putting words in my mouth.

Jamie is a butthurt moron who will never understand the difference between discussion of personal preferences and attacks on others.

That last sentence is a personal attack.  The one before it is not.  See the difference?

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on January 15, 2015, 09:30:46 pm
 :lurk: :rolleyes: :shakehead:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on January 15, 2015, 10:24:57 pm
I don't think that either PSM or Silver's criticisms were mean-spirited.  I think they were honest.  Could that have hurt her feelings?  Probably.  That's unfortunate.  But when I think of "personal attacks" on a forum like this, I usually think of someone resorting to name calling when they are losing an argument.  Clearly that is not what has happened here.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 16, 2015, 06:31:26 am
Very interesting... Of the poll options above, one stands empty... zero votes.  The one that says "Yes! I'd like to help" ---

Wonder why that is.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on January 16, 2015, 07:48:23 am
Very interesting... Of the poll options above, one stands empty... zero votes.  The one that says "Yes! I'd like to help" ---

Wonder why that is.

Maybe because no one feels that what they have to say will be listen to, or they have any control over what is done here.

As was pointed out earlier, this is a open but private forum. So it is up to the forum owner to do as they want with it.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on January 16, 2015, 09:54:13 am
Help how?

There are plenty of people here who would help TMM if needs were apparent and within their abilities. The open-ended question had no hints as to what form that might take.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: RVM45 on January 16, 2015, 10:45:41 am
That's me!

I'm a Lightweight presence on TMM and couldn't imagine anything that I could contribute to help--short of an occasional post and a rare referral...

{Just not that many folks looking for a New Forum to Join--at least among my Acquaintances...}


.....RVM45       :mellow: :thumbsup: :mellow:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 16, 2015, 11:13:17 am
Help how?

There are plenty of people here who would help TMM if needs were apparent and within their abilities. The open-ended question had no hints as to what form that might take.

I don't think anyone has _the_ answer to that. Don't think anyone should, really. We can each answer it for ourselves. But it helps sometimes if the question is asked, don't you think? Sort of easy for folks to sit around waiting for someone else to "do something," or worse, then complain about it when someone does do something. "Help" doesn't mean just financial help either. The world is full of things to talk about. It seems sad that the prepping, gulching, food and so many other areas at TMM are virtually ignored by everyone these days. Why is that, do you suppose? It might "help" TMM a great deal if some of those areas were revitalized.

I've noticed a great deal more activity here at TMM since Elias asked the first question. Seems to me TMM needs more questions, and let the answers speak for themselves. And all questions do not have to relate to politics or mindwar current events.

Not to mention that a lot of questions don't HAVE good answers, or at least not yet. Doesn't make it something that shouldn't be discussed. How else do we arrive at answers? Will mankind be able to colonize the moon or Mars in another hundred years? Beats me, but I like to talk about it. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on January 16, 2015, 02:33:00 pm
Don't put words in my mouth.

I wrote that I don't enjoy mouse's posts and have her on ignore.  I wrote that I will change my behavior.

You wrote that "mouse should immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" ."  I didn't write that. You did.

No one has attacked mouse as a person.  No one has said that she is awful, or has bad intentions.  Saying that you don't enjoy what someone posts is not a personal attack.

I don't like jamie's putting words in my mouth.

Jamie is a butthurt moron who will never understand the difference between discussion of personal preferences and attacks on others.

That last sentence is a personal attack.  The one before it is not.  See the difference?

Well silver holier than thou and smarter than thou people are a dime a dozen.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: jamie on January 16, 2015, 02:52:02 pm
Don't put words in my mouth.

I wrote that I don't enjoy mouse's posts and have her on ignore.  I wrote that I will change my behavior.

You wrote that "mouse should immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" ."  I didn't write that. You did.

No one has attacked mouse as a person.  No one has said that she is awful, or has bad intentions.  Saying that you don't enjoy what someone posts is not a personal attack.

I don't like jamie's putting words in my mouth.

Jamie is a butthurt moron who will never understand the difference between discussion of personal preferences and attacks on others.

That last sentence is a personal attack.  The one before it is not.  See the difference?


You wrote that "mouse should immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" ."  I didn't write that. You did.

No, this is what I wrote, you took the quote out of context.

So what I am getting here is that mouse must immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" and then "chilling of speech"  will  end.


See the difference?

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on January 16, 2015, 02:59:18 pm
Very interesting... Of the poll options above, one stands empty... zero votes.  The one that says "Yes! I'd like to help" ---

Wonder why that is.

I don't want to make promises I can't keep.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 16, 2015, 03:17:00 pm
I don't want to make promises I can't keep.

Excellent idea. :) I make that my own policy too. Changed my vote to reflect the greater reality. I am trying to help. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Mr. Bill on January 16, 2015, 03:42:24 pm
Very interesting... Of the poll options above, one stands empty... zero votes.  The one that says "Yes! I'd like to help" ---

Wonder why that is.

Well, probably because the poll question is "Does the membership of TMM want to turn Elias loose to recruit new members?" and if that specifically means recruiting Oath Keepers members for TMM (my interpretation), then nobody wants to assist with that.  Personaly, I gave up on Oath Keepers last summer when they decided to align themselves with the anti-immigrant movement (http://oathkeepers.org/oktester/oath-keepers-joins-coalition-supporting-hundreds-of-protests-against-illegal-immigration-on-july-18-19-members-encouraged-to-participate-2/).

As for helping TMM Forum, I count 28 different people who are trying to help by posting their thoughts in this thread.

I have to say I am extremely annoyed by Elias's response to PSM.  Yes, it was rude for PSM to say "Mouse sucks", and he has since apologized for that.  But several people have indicated they are turned off by the large number of doom-and-gloom posts here.  PSM spelled out in detail exactly what the problem is.  And no, it's not mouse specifically, but the overwhelming number of threads relating to how terrible everything is.  Please don't shoot the messenger just because he was blunt with his language.

Yes, as has been pointed out repeatedly, we can ignore threads that don't interest us, and we can even use the "Ignore" function on specific members.

But guess what happens when a member realizes he's ignoring the majority of what gets posted here?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 16, 2015, 04:03:03 pm
Well, probably because the poll question is "Does the membership of TMM want to turn Elias loose to recruit new members?"

Of course. I just found it interesting that so many said "yes," but nobody seemed to entertain any notion to help bring it about. Just a question, with no thought of censure or blame. It just struck me as curious, that's all.

Quote
and if that specifically means recruiting Oath Keepers members for TMM (my interpretation), then nobody wants to assist with that.

Ok... but I can't recall anyone else voting yes saying that they don't want to assist with that. Did I miss something?

Quote
Personaly, I gave up on Oath Keepers 

I think I've made it clear that I don't hold out any hope of the "Oathkeepers" doing much to solve the problems in this country, but I don't have any problems with some of them coming to TMM and learning what people here think. Again, I really don't expect to see very many, and I don't expect but a very few to stick around. What harm could it do?

Quote
As for helping TMM Forum, I count 28 different people who are trying to help by posting their thoughts in this thread.

Yes, and that's terrific. I wasn't saying nobody was helping... :) Just asked a simple question that seems to have struck a nerve. Wonder why?

Quote
I have to say I am extremely annoyed by Elias's response to PSM.  Yes, it was rude for PSM to say "Mouse sucks", and he has since apologized for that.

Have to say I was surprised by both of those responses. I think we're all on edge these days. I know I'm not at my optimistic best.

Quote
But several people have indicated they are turned off by the large number of doom-and-gloom posts here.  PSM spelled out in detail exactly what the problem is.  And no, it's not mouse specifically, but the overwhelming number of threads relating to how terrible everything is.

Yes... it is hard to see how terrible everything is constantly. We talked about this, specifically with mouse, some time ago. Remember "outrage fatigue?" But I wonder if you think that ignoring all of it is a better thing? Seems to me that a lot of it sparks discussion - whether some individuals think it worthy or not somehow. But it also gives people a safe (should be) to vent and share their frustrations with things they can't control. I can only imagine myself being stuck in a country where most people do not share my views or respect my right to be armed, etc. And if mouse or anyone gets carried away, we have plenty of opportunity to discuss that and redirect them.

Quote
But guess what happens when a member realizes he's ignoring the majority of what gets posted here?

What happens? I'd assume they might be motivated to start new threads that reflect what they thought important. Wouldn't that be a better response than just going away... I mean, if they really thought TMM should be relevant and healthy?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on January 16, 2015, 05:12:31 pm
Quote
But guess what happens when a member realizes he's ignoring the majority of what gets posted here?

What happens? I'd assume they might be motivated to start new threads that reflect what they thought important. Wouldn't that be a better response than just going away... I mean, if they really thought TMM should be relevant and healthy?

I think you missed the point of this particular question.  When someone realizes they are ignoring most of what is posted somewhere, they stop wasting their time going there.

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: penguinsscareme on January 17, 2015, 01:32:00 am
What's worse, my rude reply, or the hundreds and hundreds of people whose reply has been their silence, if not absence? Christ, at least I'm still here trying to give a damn.

I rest my case.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 17, 2015, 05:17:04 am
I think you missed the point of this particular question.  When someone realizes they are ignoring most of what is posted somewhere, they stop wasting their time going there.

No, I didn't miss it. Of course that's an option, and perfectly valid. I would have to assume that the people who go away, however, don't care that much about TMM then. And that's a perfectly valid thing too. Just hard to understand people who want it both ways...
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: bennie on January 17, 2015, 06:02:00 am
Don't put words in my mouth.

I wrote that I don't enjoy mouse's posts and have her on ignore.  I wrote that I will change my behavior.

You wrote that "mouse should immediately cease posting what silver considers "the unending torrent of bad news" ."  I didn't write that. You did.

No one has attacked mouse as a person.  No one has said that she is awful, or has bad intentions.  Saying that you don't enjoy what someone posts is not a personal attack.

I don't like jamie's putting words in my mouth.

Jamie is a butthurt moron who will never understand the difference between discussion of personal preferences and attacks on others.

That last sentence is a personal attack.  The one before it is not.  See the difference?

This is how Silver gets away with calling another's wife a prostitute. This how Silver gets away with being the biggest troll on this board. This is how Silver blames one like mouse and then hides behind ZAP.

Silver is a phony (that is a personal attack of truth). Fade away already like you keep saying you will.

What's worse, my rude reply, or the hundreds and hundreds of people whose reply has been their silence, if not absence? Christ, at least I'm still here trying to give a damn.

I rest my case.

I'm sorry that you are so sad and angry that you pick on mouse who hasn't done anything to you.

_______________________________________________________________________________________
Elias,

TMM belongs to you. Quit the charade and do with it what you want. THE MENTAL MILITIA is a great name! If I were you I'd want to use it just like you do. There are so few posters anymore you ought to re-birth it while there is time for CPR to be effective. I mean this with tender sincerity for a place I have liked a very long time.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on January 17, 2015, 06:42:12 am
Ok. I guess that I will chime in now. I feel that the infighting about this is silly, so I'll offer a solution. TMM and it's members should not try to exclude or demonize it's allies. While I understand those with that are critical of the constant tidal wave of posts from Mouse, (have you ever visited AnCaps Super-Forum? :rolleyes:) I do not feel the need to exclude or impede her efforts, so here is my attempt at suggesting a solution- Area X. I'm not suggesting that George's posts be deleted or anything, but there is an area of TMM that gets NO use. There have been no new posts there in 6 YEARS! Surely we could revamp that area for mouse. I don't know. Maybe I'm being an idiot, but to me it makes sense.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: bennie on January 17, 2015, 06:47:04 am
Diablo, I think that just might be a good idea.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 17, 2015, 07:02:42 am
Area X. I'm not suggesting that George's posts be deleted or anything, but there is an area of TMM that gets NO use. There have been no new posts there in 6 YEARS! Surely we could revamp that area for mouse. I don't know. Maybe I'm being an idiot, but to me it makes sense.

Mouse isn't the only one who posts "scare story" news items. How about a new section just for "Scare Story News?" :) I can do that.

The thing that bothers me is that there are vast areas at TMM going unused. How many posts lately in gulching, or almost any other category? The things mouse posts would hardly be remarkable if the TMM community was still eagerly talking about all those other things.  Why don't we concentrate on making the place more viable and active in a lot of areas, rather than picking on someone who is at least trying to contribute?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Who...me? on January 17, 2015, 11:30:01 am
I personally do not see the problem.  Like mouse or do not,  read her posts or do not, read ANY post here or do not.  I do not feel that she needs a special place to post.  George had a special George place for a reason, mouse does not IMHO.  If you do not like what she, or anyone here, posts then simply do not read them.

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on January 17, 2015, 11:41:33 am
I personally do not see the problem.  Like mouse or do not,  read her posts or do not, read ANY post here or do not.  I do not feel that she needs a special place to post.  George had a special George place for a reason, mouse does not IMHO.  If you do not like what she, or anyone here, posts then simply do not read them.
I was just trying to offer a solution to quell the infighting. It's silly, and detrimental to our agenda. I don't want mouse to feel put-out or alienated, but I don't want to lose the members that produce original thought provoking posts either. There has to be a balance somewhere. My offering for a solution may not be the best option, but it is the only one that I could think of right now. :dontknow: It's little arguments like this that chase away quality current members, potential members, and keeps lookieloos from participating.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 17, 2015, 11:58:20 am
It's little arguments like this that chase away quality current members, potential members, and keeps lookieloos from participating.

I'd say anyone who is put off by honest discussion like this is pretty superficial and has little to offer anyway. Original writing has to come from somewhere, and current events are most certainly a very good place to start. I think mouse generally offers a great deal of original thinking when she posts things. She's questioning, as well as ranting and venting. How is that less worthy?

What would you consider worthy "original" material?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Tahn L. on January 17, 2015, 02:25:59 pm
I guess I will weigh in since I don’t want to be thought of as not caring or unwilling to participate.

I was off the entire web for about 9 months last year but I felt the need to return and somehow help in the fight for freedom. I came back here and to Claire’s blog and a few others but mostly here. I still can only get on for a few hours a day because of limited solar capacity.

I was on TCF before it switched. I missed the old forum but came to love and respect the new TMM. I have watched several major tiffs between many different folk and it always seems to come down to civility and tact as being the missing components. I think that is a large part of what is missing in this discussion. If I don’t like someone’s opinions I will often ignore them, not with a button but with my mind.

I believe that data acquisition is a vital part in correct analysis. While the number of stories gathered in the “bad guy” section is often depressing, it is still necessary to be aware. I am thankful that Mouse has the time and ability to search out and post this data.

I am going to leave the same thought here today that I did years ago.

May the Long Time Sun Shine Upon Us,
All Love Surround us and
The Pure Light Within Us Guide Our Way On.


Peace, Love and Brotherhood.
Tahn
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on January 17, 2015, 10:44:04 pm
I think DL has a good idea. Not because of Mouse per se, but because there appears to be a *need* to separate the "sky is falling" kind of news. It would be interesting to see if this might encourage some folks - who stay away because of such posts, to return. I don't have a problem with the content that is posted, however I agree with some of PSM's points. I think the original poster can lose credibility when the linked stories do not reconcile with the title in the post. I share the frustration of feeling like my time could have been better spent. As mentioned earlier I don't do a lot of tootling around other sites so it's just fine by me to read some current events, if you will.

I have long been curious exactly what it is that is missing from this site that some of the veterans seem to long for? Maybe it's not entirely about the content but the personalities that used to frequent this place? 

MOUSE - if you have stumbled over to this section, please take heart that you are liked by many here so chin up! I hope you consider doing what Mama Liberty has encouraged you (and others) to do which is to include why the story is important to you. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: cowardly lion on January 18, 2015, 07:28:22 pm
Well, I'm back on here and trying to keep up.  I believe Silver was in the right, I believe he spoke his mind seriously and dispassionately and was not insulting to Mouse.  I'm a little dismayed by the attacks I've seen on him for speaking his mind.

That said, in response to remarks made about lack of participation in the threads here, I've just gotten tired.  I'm working harder at a job that pays half as much as I used to make, at the same time trying to prep for what I see as more difficult times in the very near future.  At the same time, there *is* outrage fatigue that cannot be avoided unless all contact with the outside world is denied.

Today I see PM Cameron comparing himself and Obama to Reagan and Thatcher.  While Reagan and Maggie had their faults, it's statements like this that make me want to spew  Today I trust neither party to do anything other than what their handlers allow.  It makes me feel like a very very small, insignificant speck of sand compared to the behemoth around me.  And that's what they want.

While I agree with Elias's remarks on MindWar, his monologues on how it all came about lose my attention.  I DON'T CARE about all of the .gov documents laying out the plan.  I'm looking for something *I* can do, with my meager resources, that will not distract too much from my primary responsibilities to my family.  The suggestions made about comedy routines going viral sounds great, really - but I don't write comedy.  I'm trying to come up with ways to throw sand in the gears, but I'm coming up dry.

I'm beginning to sound to myself like I'm bitchin' and moanin', and I don't want that, but I've gotten all of the homesteading/firearm/other info I can handle at present - the trick is putting it into practice - but that's why I'm not visiting all of the great threads here.  I've learned a boatload from all of the great ideas put out here, but in my personal space I'm past most of that.  Not that I can't learn more, mind you, but my plate is pretty full.

My point, and I do have one, (stolen from Ellen Degeneres), is that "Mole" activities to counterattack the MindWar are what I'm looking for.  I've been absent from these threads for a while, and I'm looking for ideas while trying to come up with ideas of my own.

ML, I don't know if this is the kind of response you were looking for, but it's what I've got.  For now.

cl
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 19, 2015, 05:32:57 am
ML, I don't know if this is the kind of response you were looking for, but it's what I've got.  For now.

Thanks, CL.... I was not looking for any particular response at all... just wondering if there was any more discussion.  I am pretty much of your mind here myself. Outrage fatigue, and doing about all I can already to prepare for the coming disaster.

I do appreciate having a community of people here to talk to, a place to vent and ask questions... but I don't expect anyone else to come up with answers to my particular problems. It's just nice not to be alone. :)

Glad to see you here again!
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 19, 2015, 09:20:04 am
Ok, let's try this. A new board has been created for "General bad news."  https://www.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?board=74.0

If the title is not what you folks want, let me know. I couldn't think of anything else. :) I request that mouse and others post their "scare stories" and other such stuff here. We'll see if that makes people happier.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on January 19, 2015, 09:25:22 am
Ok, let's try this. A new board has been created for "General bad news."  https://www.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?board=74.0

If the title is not what you folks want, let me know. I couldn't think of anything else. :) I request that mouse and others post their "scare stories" and other such stuff here. We'll see if that makes people happier.
How about naming it "SNAFU"? Situation normal, all f'd up.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on January 19, 2015, 09:41:50 am
How about naming it "SNAFU"? Situation normal, all f'd up.

See new poll in that section. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Felinenation on January 19, 2015, 02:24:03 pm
I just want to add my 2 cents worth:  I think what Mouse posts is valuable.  It's important, IMO, to see what the enemy is doing and how they can get you.  If people don't like those kinds of posts, then don't read them.

I think these "outrage" posts can be educational in leading someone to thinking about liberty.  For someone who thinks we need the police, have them read the Police Abuses section, and ask them if we need cops to throw flash-bangs into a baby's crib, or to kill people for the most trivial of offenses, which wouldn't even  be offenses in a free country.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: RagnarDanneskjold on January 19, 2015, 07:09:29 pm
Quote
If you (a general you) feel that this forum has been highjacked by a wave of hollowness that leaves a bad taste in your mouth, then why not reclaim this place for something a little more worthy?

This... and just don't bother to read anything you (general you) consider unworthy. We all have our own criteria for that.

Seems simple enough to me. :)

Succinct!!!
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: da gooch on January 22, 2015, 02:50:02 pm
First day back after nearly a month without any connection. (long story)

Quote
Don't quit Oath Keepers, Bro, just add this place to your daily travels, right? Oath Keepers is doing a wonderful job for this country. I'm trying to get TMM off its ass to do something comparable, which is what this thread is all about. We'll see how it goes with the membership here.

And yet Elias has also said that what we wanted to do here either way was no big deal to him because he already had an alternate website ready to go. ? ?

So ... Whatever the rest of you want to do I will go along until I am not interested any longer.
In My Humble Opinion ... Living Free is task enough for me.
Oh, I'll help educate any that ask but I don't envision myself as any kind of "savior" unless it's to haul out someone drowning nearby.
I tried being a National Figure (attempting to save the Constitution) and all it did was spend my money. (and other peoples money as well)

stay safe

Hey Gooch,
I've just laid out a bit more of my thinking in the previous post which I just now made to ML. Please read that if you would. For the record, I'd rather use TMM here and share the fun with our good friends here, but I was trying to not put undue pressure about it on the regular members here.

And yes, I do have a website, thanks to Rags and Bill. I just don't have time to load it, lol.

Sample page by our newest member here at TMM, Cyrellys:
https://eliasalias.com/2014/11/17/cyrellys-old-world-celt/

It would be much easier to build a mother-site for these forums and already have TMM's forums up and running with all these years' worth of intelligence, human egoism, knowledge and history, at our fingertips, y'kno?

Sorry you shot your wad on Oath Keepers and now regret it. Hate to hear that, Bro. I'm very proud of the work Oath Keepers does, such as helping sponsor this film:

http://www.midnightride.us/trailer/

(Am also sorry you cannot view that movie trailer. Here's hoping this year brings you some financial relief. If you want to make that happen, or to let it happen, perhaps helping TMM launch the Militia of the several States to combat the militarization of our police which will usher in martial law.

Maybe everything is hopeless, but as long as I draw breath, I will do all I can to oppose tyranny. I think that same fire is buried somewhere inside you too. ;)

Salute!
Elias

I don't remember saying that Elias.

Do I regret what I was able to do to be helpful in getting OK started? No I do not.
Do I want to see the "Government" we have revert to the original founders outline and design?
(The Articles of Confederation.)
Yes and No. Yes as it is miles better than the fascist regime currently in power. No as it is still a system of central government rather than a republic of individual sovereigns.

Do I regret what I was able to do to be helpful in getting OK started? No I do not.
I do begin to wonder about the "goal" of the organization that was to be "an educational organization" but has removed the "What We Are Not" statement from the About page. (Did it -like me- get dropped from the program?)
Where are the billboards outside of the military installations? Besides making headlines and face time for a select few where are the educational efforts? (Keeping in mind I cannot view much of the OK site due to the bandwidth hurdle.)
It would seem that more effort is being placed on gaining National Attention than on actually educating the serving GI's.
I fear that the predominance of the members of the "Thin Blue Line" are already committed to the Police State in all of its Death(Glory) and Destruction(Power). Or am I missing something due to my internet liabilities? Has my being more concerned with daily survival become more important than OK? It seems so as only one of those options is putting beans in my pot and covering the gas to heat them.

Quote
Here's hoping this year brings you some financial relief. If you want to make that happen, or to let it happen, perhaps helping TMM launch the Militia of the several States to combat the militarization of our police which will usher in martial law.
Say what?  How is my "helping TMM launch the Militia of the several States" going to change my financial status?
Is there going to be some kind of "Profit Sharing Plan"? Or is this some of that Obamamagic applied to the several Militias? Will there be free phones and cars like those campaign promises in 2008?


Do as you wish with TMM ... I will continue to contribute or not as I can with the caveat that ....
Living Free is task enough for me.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: da gooch on January 22, 2015, 03:12:01 pm
Mouse is emblematic of the reason why I don't participate here hardly at all anymore, and in fact a larger overall problem I have seen at this and other discussion groups. Mouse posts more than any other member ever. The only content I ever see from mouse is news feed type, sky-is-falling, simplistic, us-vs-them, bunker mentality, dichromatic, you-won't-believe-this, uninteresting, shallow, at times hyperbolic, under-researched, hasty, unreliable, poorly sourced, sensationalistic, tabloid-esque garbage. It's clickbait. Mouse is undaunted by lack of edifying discussion generated by his posts, he seems to feel that if you throw a hundred posts on the wall, one of them is bound to spark some discussion, and if not discussion, then at least attention.

The content mouse posts is worse than useless- it's disempowering, because what can be done about it? For instance: "Massachusetts law enforcement agencies claim they corporations, exempt from FOIA," is a recent post. I'm not interested in this kind of content. And, at least in General Discussion, that seems to be the de rigeur. It's not just mouse, but he is by far the worst offender, in my opinion. For all the posts he throws up, I have never felt like there was any personal connection made. And based on some of the things I see him link, I don't think I want one anyway.

And where is Joel, and Thunder and Lightning, and debeez, and coloradohermit, and the others whom I have cherished in one way or another? They're either gone or silent, or nearly so. TMM has changed, and I have changed as well, but we have not changed in similar ways or directions. To the extent that I come here at all anymore, it's to interact with the people I already have connections with who haven't transitioned over to social media.

You go back about 7 years or more and you look at the General Discussion page topics and you see a lot more actual discussion. I mean, there was always some newsfeed type content, but now and in the past few years, it has become almost given over to that. It's not fair to compare what exists now to what existed several years ago. I get that. But nevertheless, I liked it a lot better when it was a discussion forum, not a news feed. The one place I get that at all anymore is the Economics board. And that's mostly where you'll find me.

I don't think I personally attacked mouse, because I don't know mouse as a person. I think I might have known that he is from New Zealand, but I'm not even really sure I'm right about that. I'm not even sure I'm referring to him (her?) in the correct pronoun. I'm talking strictly about content. On that score, I'll stand by what I said. I know I could have said it more delicately or with more circumspection, but in the previous 8 pages of this thread there was talk of having to have a thick skin to participate here, so I took it as license.

In any case, I'll refrain from using blunt verbiage going forward. That said, I remain steadfast in my substantive observations.

Damn. Aren't you just a blessing to the whole God damned world! Thank you so much for sharing. Right after you apologize to mouse, why don't you tell me why you're even here? Since I do not appreciate crudeness, insensitivity, and people who violate their terms of service agreement regarding personal attacks, I'd like to let you know I'll not be missing you when you stop sharing your rude brilliance with we mere peons here at TMM. Thanks, but no thanks. Happy trails.

Salute!
Elias

Ellias

Sir, While I do agree with some of what PSM has said, there are parts that I do not, but How does that make what you just posted any different that what he posted?

Did you not just attack him for what he said, after you asked him for his opinion?

And how does this sit with you and the 1st amendment, does he not have a right to share whats on his mind too?
Again did you not ask for opinions about this site? 
And why come down on him when others here have done far worst to others?

By your statement here, you have sent a message that we are not free to share our opinions, and therefore people do not share.

good day sir

Dawg

Hear hear

Why ask someone to be open and honest just to stomp on their reply?
Why would anyone want seconds of that sort of behavior?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: da gooch on January 22, 2015, 03:41:27 pm
To Whom it may concern:

Any response to my posts will be responded to BUT it may take an exorbitant amount of time as I am experiencing a "downturn" in my financial situation as well as a corresponding need to devote more time to the acquisition of frns.
This should not be construed as my not caring about responding.

It is what it is but you are free to interpret it as you see fit.

stay safe
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: kirgi07 on January 28, 2015, 11:09:44 pm
Just wow. Ought 7.   :popcorn:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: yorick on May 05, 2015, 07:39:03 pm
I quit posting when I was chastised for mocking the "vapor trail" nut-jobs.

If we're going to be serious we need to be real about things that matter.  Giving credence to idiotic fantasies is a quick path to irrelevance and forum death.

I'm happy to re-engage if reality is a part of the program  ;-)

- tim

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on May 06, 2015, 06:00:05 am
I quit posting when I was chastised for mocking the "vapor trail" nut-jobs.

If we're going to be serious we need to be real about things that matter.  Giving credence to idiotic fantasies is a quick path to irrelevance and forum death.

I'm happy to re-engage if reality is a part of the program  ;-)

- tim

Good heavens, that must have been a long time ago! :)  Welcome home.

Just for reference, however, please note that challenging other people's ideas won't cause problems as long as you don't use personal attacks, silly name calling, or other violations of the user's agreement. Everyone has a perfect right to believe what they want, idiotic fantasies and all, and changing their idea of reality isn't anyone else's job. Discuss, to your heart's content, but just keep it civil. :)

You would no doubt enjoy discussing things with StillaGhost and Dustin, among others. I look forward to seeing your posts.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Bill St. Clair on May 06, 2015, 07:07:34 am
I'm happy to re-engage if reality is a part of the program  ;-)

I like to think of myself as a seeker of reality, but I expect that many more times I'll find myself thinking that the ear is the whole elephant.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: da gooch on May 07, 2015, 08:29:51 am
I'm happy to re-engage if reality is a part of the program  ;-)

I like to think of myself as a seeker of reality, but I expect that many more times I'll find myself thinking that the ear is the whole elephant.
No, no, no it is a long thin snake-like animal with a tuft of coarse hair on the end everyone who has touched one can feel that ...   :laugh: :laugh:  :thrbiggrin:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Bill St. Clair on May 07, 2015, 09:48:32 am
No, no, no it is a long thin snake-like animal with a tuft of coarse hair on the end everyone who has touched one can feel that ...   :laugh: :laugh:  :thrbiggrin:

Glad my reference was not too obtuse.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jake on April 07, 2016, 11:30:37 pm
I see a bunch of senior membership here.  I don't see anything that scares me.  I would like to see the strategies formed that would help to guarantee liberty and freedom.  Of course, I probably responded to a think tank instead of proper thread.  . . . and yes, I am from Oath Keepers.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 07, 2016, 11:45:27 pm
I see a bunch of senior membership here.  I don't see anything that scares me.  I would like to see the strategies formed that would help to guarantee liberty and freedom.  Of course, I probably responded to a think tank instead of proper thread.  . . . and yes, I am from Oath Keepers.

Hi Jake!
Thank you for dropping by. No, we don't "bite", but we are a much more diversified group than our pals over at Oath Keepers. However, this is the place where Stewart Rhodes met me, back in 2006, and he and I have both been much to busy to be very active here until just lately. The first forum for Oath Keepers was right here on our forums, which you can see here:

https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?board=60.0

A number of our older members here also went to help Stewart launch Oath Keepers. Gooch was an original Board member at OK, as was I, (I'm still the editor for Oath Keepers' national site), and Klapton is a Moderator at the Oath Keepers forums. They, and others here, are members in Oath Keepers. But we also have anarchists, Voluntaryists, free-thinkers, Christians, Jews, Buddhists, 2nd Amendment advocates, Constitutionalists, philosophers and thinkers, etc etc. So just be prepared to run into any kind of commentary, but be strong and offer your own views right back, eh? ;)

Thanks again for registering. And for a quick history of The Mental Militia, please go here -- 

https://thementalmilitia.net/2015/12/12/history-of-the-mental-militia/

Salute!
Elias Alias, editor for Oath Keepers and The Mental Militia


Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: A Patriot on April 08, 2016, 01:16:10 am
Glad to see you two connect up. Great!!   :laugh:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 08, 2016, 02:29:28 am
Roger.
And I've got a feeling there's gonna be a lot of connecting up here.
That could only be a good thing.
And it could be, maybe possibly prolly -- that we're all already connected anyway.  ;)
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Baked at 420 on April 08, 2016, 03:11:51 pm
This Antifascist Action Organizer doesn't dance around the subject of pigs. I say bring on the LEOs.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 08, 2016, 03:49:00 pm
This Antifascist Action Organizer doesn't dance around the subject of pigs. I say bring on the LEOs.

Ah, so.
And this Antifascist / AntiCollectivist / AntiTyranny activist understands that we don't paint groups with broad brushes. There are some outstanding Sheriffs and Cops who are inside the belly of the Beast but are on the side of freedom. I know several of those good men and women, and they do not deserve the term "pigs" anymore than do you or I. There are, however, many more who do deserve that title, and I've met some of those too. And I am totally "Anti-Police State", like, as in, totally!
So I recommend we deal with individuals as individuals, and shy away from classifying every member in any group as representative of the whole group, right?
One other thing for everyone's general baking sessions at 4:20 -- we want to encourage everyone to see a difference between "Peace Officers" and "LEOs". Law enforcement is what pigs do. Being a Peace Officer is what good cops do.

Thanks Bro.
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on April 08, 2016, 04:05:28 pm
So I recommend we deal with individuals as individuals, and shy away from classifying every member in any group as representative of the whole group, right?

Yes indeed, and I'm just the gal to see that your recommendation is followed. Those who start flame wars and indulge in personal attackes and name calling will not be tolerated...

It's easy to do, and I've done it myself at times, but for here and now especially we need to toss out the old, broad brushes and get ready to cooperate as much as possible. :) Let's concentrate on where we agree, what we need to further the cause of liberty instead of indulging in negatives and stereotypes. Of course we can disagree, but we really need to do so in a rational and positive way.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 08, 2016, 04:20:49 pm
tossing out the old broad?  you leaving Mama?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Baked at 420 on April 08, 2016, 05:50:04 pm
This Antifascist Action Organizer doesn't dance around the subject of pigs. I say bring on the LEOs.

Ah, so.
And this Antifascist / AntiCollectivist / AntiTyranny activist understands that we don't paint groups with broad brushes. There are some outstanding Sheriffs and Cops who are inside the belly of the Beast but are on the side of freedom. I know several of those good men and women, and they do not deserve the term "pigs" anymore than do you or I. There are, however, many more who do deserve that title, and I've met some of those too. And I am totally "Anti-Police State", like, as in, totally!
So I recommend we deal with individuals as individuals, and shy away from classifying every member in any group as representative of the whole group, right?
One other thing for everyone's general baking sessions at 4:20 -- we want to encourage everyone to see a difference between "Peace Officers" and "LEOs". Law enforcement is what pigs do. Being a Peace Officer is what good cops do.

Thanks Bro.
Salute!
Elias

Never heard of a good one. Of all the stories out there about cops, I've never seen a good one.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 08, 2016, 06:31:41 pm
It's a big country, and no one can claim to have met every body out there. I *do* know some good ones. We can view the good ones as one of Claire's three operators -- the Mole. More on all that laters. First, I'd like to say this --

Some people here figured (jumped to conclusions based on pre-conceived notions about Oath Keepers) that all the new folks I am inviting to come here would be cops and soldiers and Veterans. That ain't even close. My goodness! I'm inviting followers of Patrick Wood, G. Edward Griffin, Edwin Vieira, Mike Adams, and the list goes on and on -- none of which are involved with Oath Keepers. As I noted, it's a big country out there, and there are lots of people awakening right now. The handful of newbies who may show up here from Oath Keepers are people who have a desire for more open communications about where the country is heading right now, and that is fine. But most of the newbies who will be coming here are from many other organizations or email lists. I hope that allays some fears here about the perception that I'm only drawing from Oath Keepers.

The Mental Militia began as an open forum for diverse thought. That has not changed. The more diversity, the better, imo. It is a mistake to categorize all members of any group by any means, as being the "same". Example: I am a Veteran, and was hired after leaving the Marines by the Los Angeles Sheriff's Department. I quit quickly when they showed their desire for militarizing the Deputies. I suggest strongly that we here look at people coming in here as individuals, and try not to project "group" cubby-hole standard imagery onto them. We are talking to individuals here, not to groups, right?

Thanks,
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 08, 2016, 06:36:47 pm
So I recommend we deal with individuals as individuals, and shy away from classifying every member in any group as representative of the whole group, right?

Yes indeed, and I'm just the gal to see that your recommendation is followed. Those who start flame wars and indulge in personal attackes and name calling will not be tolerated...

It's easy to do, and I've done it myself at times, but for here and now especially we need to toss out the old, broad brushes and get ready to cooperate as much as possible. :) Let's concentrate on where we agree, what we need to further the cause of liberty instead of indulging in negatives and stereotypes. Of course we can disagree, but we really need to do so in a rational and positive way.

Amen!
Thank you, Sistah!
Carry on. ;)
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on April 09, 2016, 06:40:13 am

Never heard of a good one. Of all the stories out there about cops, I've never seen a good one.

I guess that's because you are closing your eyes to that. I've posted a number of times about the "good ones" here where I live. The sheriff and his deputies here are definitely "peace officers," and the tiny group of city police here don't indulge in aggression either. Are they perfect? Of course not. Are they going to learn better if they are hated and ridiculed? Not likely.

Choose your enemies carefully, and wisely - just as you choose your friends.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 09, 2016, 06:59:48 am
Well said, ML.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jake on April 09, 2016, 10:44:13 am
Hi guys,

I am from OK and glad for the invite.  There is nothing like changing from stew 24/7 to sumtin different like coming here.  I had only been in OK since the first of the year, during the OR standoff.  I had move 500 miles after loosing my job and spending all my retirement to build my last home in a location that matched my dreams.

I am in a small valley that has less than 20 homes.  My setback is a two mile driveway and loving not having utility bills.  Once here and in light of the demise of the union, I found like minded people that wanted to stay in touch and then moving to form a team to respond to different happenings in our little valley.  For about a year we talked about political grumblings and reached consensus on our responses.

Then I found OK.  They were doing the same; forming teams, educating of what may come, and how to respond to it collectively.  It was a natural fit for me.

What I have read above does not fit the characteristics of the OK members.  Those mannerisms you folks mentioned about the jack boot attitude associated with LEO's, I believe belong to LEO's that would not like to join OK and more of the progressive action attitudes.  They are not constitutionally, behaving individuals.  If you had problems with LEO's before, then the broad brush action you take, is based upon just your experiences and not of the collective.  I think your position is probably isolated to your surroundings and not of the union as a whole.

It encourages me to say, "get out of the cities".
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Cherokee on April 09, 2016, 04:43:52 pm
I read the first five pages of this thread and decided to skip ahead and post.

I came here from Oath Keepers. Still with Oath Keepers by the way.

Over there, I was challenged at times for being a cop basher/hater. I made my best attempts to explain that bad cops do bad things and that is why Oath Keepers exists,....to remind bad cops to be good,....to honor their oath and not blindly follow illegal orders.

Many Oath Keepers over there agreed with me. Many did not.

Dividing into two different camps over whether cops are good or bad seems a little silly to me.

If a cop honors his oath and does the right things (Frank Serpico), he is a good cop.

If a cop dishonors his oath and does dishonorable things, he is a bad cop.

I was often called onto the carpet during my twenty year military career for challenging my chain of command while others worked hard at not being noticed while they skated their way to retirement.

I retired with my integrity intact and I sleep good.

I am an Oath Keeper. I have been down the rabbit hole....very, very deep down the rabbit hole.

I have seen a few comments that suggests Oath Keepers are mindless thugs on the take. The very purpose of Oath Keepers is to prevent the mindless thugs from being so. Would it not stand to reason that most Oath Keepers members are the ones who get it?

I took the time to read the history of The Mental Militia. I was quite impressed. I believed that here is a long running endeavor that has evolved to exactly where it should be because good people with great minds have made it so. Then I got to the not so pleasant comments about Oath Keepers and wondered how can this forum be as enlightened as it's membership claims? I have read some absolutely brilliant stuff on the Oath Keepers forums.

I don't say these things to start a flame war. I say them because I am a person who spends many hours every day researching, reading, learning, and working to share ideas....and then I nearly quit this forum as fast as I found it.

But I will not leave this forum until I have given it a fair chance to show me why it has survived for so long. There is either something substantial here, or there are a handful of nut jobs who just don't know when to quit. No, I doubt that a bunch of loonies could pull this off for so long, so you all are stuck with me...at least for awhile.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 09, 2016, 05:46:43 pm
I read the first five pages of this thread and decided to skip ahead and post.

I came here from Oath Keepers. Still with Oath Keepers by the way.

Over there, I was challenged at times for being a cop basher/hater. I made my best attempts to explain that bad cops do bad things and that is why Oath Keepers exists,....to remind bad cops to be good,....to honor their oath and not blindly follow illegal orders.

Many Oath Keepers over there agreed with me. Many did not.

Dividing into two different camps over whether cops are good or bad seems a little silly to me.

If a cop honors his oath and does the right things (Frank Serpico), he is a good cop.

If a cop dishonors his oath and does dishonorable things, he is a bad cop.

I was often called onto the carpet during my twenty year military career for challenging my chain of command while others worked hard at not being noticed while they skated their way to retirement.

I retired with my integrity intact and I sleep good.

I am an Oath Keeper. I have been down the rabbit hole....very, very deep down the rabbit hole.

I have seen a few comments that suggests Oath Keepers are mindless thugs on the take. The very purpose of Oath Keepers is to prevent the mindless thugs from being so. Would it not stand to reason that most Oath Keepers members are the ones who get it?

I took the time to read the history of The Mental Militia. I was quite impressed. I believed that here is a long running endeavor that has evolved to exactly where it should be because good people with great minds have made it so. Then I got to the not so pleasant comments about Oath Keepers and wondered how can this forum be as enlightened as it's membership claims? I have read some absolutely brilliant stuff on the Oath Keepers forums.

I don't say these things to start a flame war. I say them because I am a person who spends many hours every day researching, reading, learning, and working to share ideas....and then I nearly quit this forum as fast as I found it.

But I will not leave this forum until I have given it a fair chance to show me why it has survived for so long. There is either something substantial here, or there are a handful of nut jobs who just don't know when to quit. No, I doubt that a bunch of loonies could pull this off for so long, so you all are stuck with me...at least for awhile.

From what I have learned from a long life so far is no matter what group you are involved in, there is always 10% that mess things up.

so take that into consideration, even here.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: da gooch on April 09, 2016, 05:54:49 pm
Welcome aboard Cherokee.

Have you discovered that Oath Keepers was created right here on this forum?

Stewart (the Yalie) and a large handful of us founded the organization in March of 09 right here at TMM.
Have you found our Partner site here for Oath Keepers? CLICK HERE (https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?board=60.0)

Please read the ROE called the Registration Agreement and Moderation Policy hereabouts. HERE (https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=20010.0)
Basically Play Nice and Learn all you want or can stand. Share what you know but don't serve it with an entrenching tool. It's pretty simple and man oh man there is a lot to learn here.

There are many exmilitarys here and a goodly percentage are the original core of the OK movement. (Myself included)
Elias (the owner of the title to this forum) is the same Elias the Editor over at the OK Website.
Stewart (the Yalie) is none other than Stewart from OK.

One of the main reasons that many here are not overt Oath Keepers is that a large percentage have developed a strong anarchist political bent. NOT No Rules - No Rulers. In the original Greek it would have translated to = No Kings.

Welcome aboard.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 09, 2016, 06:28:50 pm
Hi guys,

I am from OK and glad for the invite.  There is nothing like changing from stew 24/7 to sumtin different like coming here.  I had only been in OK since the first of the year, during the OR standoff.  I had move 500 miles after loosing my job and spending all my retirement to build my last home in a location that matched my dreams.

I am in a small valley that has less than 20 homes.  My setback is a two mile driveway and loving not having utility bills.  Once here and in light of the demise of the union, I found like minded people that wanted to stay in touch and then moving to form a team to respond to different happenings in our little valley.  For about a year we talked about political grumblings and reached consensus on our responses.

Then I found OK.  They were doing the same; forming teams, educating of what may come, and how to respond to it collectively.  It was a natural fit for me.

What I have read above does not fit the characteristics of the OK members.  Those mannerisms you folks mentioned about the jack boot attitude associated with LEO's, I believe belong to LEO's that would not like to join OK and more of the progressive action attitudes.  They are not constitutionally, behaving individuals.  If you had problems with LEO's before, then the broad brush action you take, is based upon just your experiences and not of the collective.  I think your position is probably isolated to your surroundings and not of the union as a whole.

It encourages me to say, "get out of the cities".

I hear you loud and clear, Jake.  I knew in  1999 that it's time to move to the country, so I closed my store in Georgia and headed out to Montana to get away from the teeming masses. I've never regretted it for a minute. Once I got here I realized that the police/sheriffs here are for the most part good Montana people who are still of the mindset to "protect and serve".

But I see that changing now in some of the cities here. Note: when we in Montana say "city", we're talking usually about less than fifty thousand residents, with Billings having around a hundred thousand. But in those cities, in the fifteen years since I moved here, I'm noticing the militarization of police forces and a short-tempered attitude in cops which was not here when I first arrived. I hate to see this erosion of humanity by our cops in the cities here, and it matches in micro the drift of the country as a whole over the past forty to fifty years as cultural Marxism and corporate fascism have taken root in the cities. Almost two years ago I moved away from Bozeman and settled in a square log cabin in the middle of nowhere up by the Canadian border. I am totally rural, but have electricity and hot-running water and internet connection -- and NO PEOPLE! It's awesome for this old guy, and I feel truly blessed.  But the UN's Agenda 21 is very active in Montana, and their twisted government-vs-the people operations are activities which are beginning to wake up the ranchers and farmers and miners and loggers in Montana. More and more, the message of liberty and freedom is attracting people who previously were not inclined to think about it.

So I agree with you -- it's time for all good people to get out of the Cities of Man. John Prine said it in the 1960s, and so did Neil Young. ;)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 09, 2016, 08:39:37 pm
It is funny Elias you talk about agenda 21.
I first heard about it in ILL. I used to live just north of Chicago and it was from a tea partier that told me about it.

Well thank God I am out of that mess now, but the police here, Casper, are not much better than the JBT's I left behind in ILL, sorry to say.
But I too am working at getting away from this.

There are others here that are bitter about Wyoming, but I guess it all depends on where you are from and what you had to deal with.
I for one like it here. Is it prefect? no, but it is a far sight better than ILL.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 09, 2016, 09:49:30 pm
My number one favorite source for Agenda 21, and as far as I know the true pioneer fighting it, is Michael Shaw over at Freedom Advocates --  http://www.freedomadvocates.org/

I've got a bit of a start on his landing page at the new The Mental Militia national site.

https://thementalmilitia.net/readers-regiment/1864-2/

Wyoming is a sparsely-populated State for the most part. I think it holds much good for people who are interested in getting away fro the cities, but anyone moving to the country in any State have much to get accustomed to.  A lot depends on an individual's mindset and character. Personally, I grew up reading Thoreau and Emerson, and had the good fortune to have good forest/river areas handy for playing as a boy. All my grown years found me longing to get back to a more natural way of relating to Nature, and I strongly question the benefits of "modern civilization", preferring to take the electricity and pickup trucks and leave the rest to the city boys, lol.

A really good take on this is in an old piece by our dear Friend, Claire Wolfe. I am building her landing page at The Mental Militia right now, and in my travels last night whilst working on her page I came across the first post I ever made here at this particular forum, way back in June of 2003. In that post I duplicated her article called "Moving To Hardyville", which I had found at WorldNet Daiy. (Yes, Claire used to write for WND.) Anyway, here is that link, and I'd certainly hope many reading here go read her essay on moving to Hardyville. It's a short, but excellent prose piece of fiction about just what we're talking about here. Enjoy.

https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=9.0

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Cherokee on April 10, 2016, 01:21:34 am
My number one favorite source for Agenda 21, and as far as I know the true pioneer fighting it, is Michael Shaw over at Freedom Advocates --  http://www.freedomadvocates.org/

I've got a bit of a start on his landing page at the new The Mental Militia national site.

https://thementalmilitia.net/readers-regiment/1864-2/

Wyoming is a sparsely-populated State for the most part. I think it holds much good for people who are interested in getting away fro the cities, but anyone moving to the country in any State have much to get accustomed to.  A lot depends on an individual's mindset and character. Personally, I grew up reading Thoreau and Emerson, and had the good fortune to have good forest/river areas handy for playing as a boy. All my grown years found me longing to get back to a more natural way of relating to Nature, and I strongly question the benefits of "modern civilization", preferring to take the electricity and pickup trucks and leave the rest to the city boys, lol.

A really good take on this is in an old piece by our dear Friend, Claire Wolfe. I am building her landing page at The Mental Militia right now, and in my travels last night whilst working on her page I came across the first post I ever made here at this particular forum, way back in June of 2003. In that post I duplicated her article called "Moving To Hardyville", which I had found at WorldNet Daiy. (Yes, Claire used to write for WND.) Anyway, here is that link, and I'd certainly hope many reading here go read her essay on moving to Hardyville. It's a short, but excellent prose piece of fiction about just what we're talking about here. Enjoy.

https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=9.0

Salute!
Elias

Slowly making my way to Hardyville,...dragging my wife along. It will just take longer this way. Someday, she'll ask, "why didn't we move here sooner? "
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Bill St. Clair on April 10, 2016, 06:21:43 am
A really good take on this is in an old piece by our dear Friend, Claire Wolfe. I am building her landing page at The Mental Militia right now, and in my travels last night whilst working on her page I came across the first post I ever made here at this particular forum, way back in June of 2003. In that post I duplicated her article called "Moving To Hardyville", which I had found at WorldNet Daiy. (Yes, Claire used to write for WND.) Anyway, here is that link, and I'd certainly hope many reading here go read her essay on moving to Hardyville. It's a short, but excellent prose piece of fiction about just what we're talking about here. Enjoy.

https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=9.0

Claire's article is still up at WorldNetDaily (WND), without her byline. I remember when WND was young, before Joseph Farrah morphed into a neocon. It was a daily visit for me back then.

The entire Hardyville series is at Backwoods Home: http://www.backwoodshome.com/features/author-index/#hardyville

I'm glad that Claire will be writing for TheMentalMilitia.net
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 10, 2016, 08:39:39 am
Good link, Bill. I'll add that to her landing page at the site later today. Thank you.

And I fully agree with your prognosis regarding Farah going neo-con. Back in the day, like you, I visited there often because they were more interested in telling the truth than they are today.

Reckon they got bit by the Republican bug or something? ;)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Eagle Eye on April 12, 2016, 02:13:20 pm
I read the first five pages of this thread and decided to skip ahead and post.

I came here from Oath Keepers. Still with Oath Keepers by the way.

Over there, I was challenged at times for being a cop basher/hater. I made my best attempts to explain that bad cops do bad things and that is why Oath Keepers exists,....to remind bad cops to be good,....to honor their oath and not blindly follow illegal orders.

Many Oath Keepers over there agreed with me. Many did not.

Dividing into two different camps over whether cops are good or bad seems a little silly to me.

If a cop honors his oath and does the right things (Frank Serpico), he is a good cop.

If a cop dishonors his oath and does dishonorable things, he is a bad cop.

I was often called onto the carpet during my twenty year military career for challenging my chain of command while others worked hard at not being noticed while they skated their way to retirement.

I retired with my integrity intact and I sleep good.

I am an Oath Keeper. I have been down the rabbit hole....very, very deep down the rabbit hole.

I have seen a few comments that suggests Oath Keepers are mindless thugs on the take. The very purpose of Oath Keepers is to prevent the mindless thugs from being so. Would it not stand to reason that most Oath Keepers members are the ones who get it?

I took the time to read the history of The Mental Militia. I was quite impressed. I believed that here is a long running endeavor that has evolved to exactly where it should be because good people with great minds have made it so. Then I got to the not so pleasant comments about Oath Keepers and wondered how can this forum be as enlightened as it's membership claims? I have read some absolutely brilliant stuff on the Oath Keepers forums.

I don't say these things to start a flame war. I say them because I am a person who spends many hours every day researching, reading, learning, and working to share ideas....and then I nearly quit this forum as fast as I found it.

But I will not leave this forum until I have given it a fair chance to show me why it has survived for so long. There is either something substantial here, or there are a handful of nut jobs who just don't know when to quit. No, I doubt that a bunch of loonies could pull this off for so long, so you all are stuck with me...at least for awhile.

Same here Cherokee. Though I've never been a cop, I almost pulled out after reading some of the comments on this site. Yep, there are bad cops and I can appreciate each of us has our own reasons for believing as we do. I have even faced off with one or two in my life and was fortunate enough a good one was nearby. Still, At the age of 65, I refuse to put all of a certain race or occupation into some all encompassing statement. Even though I disagree with those types of statements, I fought for the right for the writer to say whatever they want. Whether they like it or not. So, here I am. A free man willing to listen.

My hope is to learn and share ideas. Wisdom is gained though patient, civil discourse. It's too easy to go off the rails of misunderstanding on a 2 dimentional format like this. I don't bite much. I chew.  ;p
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Eagle Eye on April 12, 2016, 03:35:45 pm
Post deleted.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 12, 2016, 03:46:05 pm
I concur wholeheartedly, about Oath Keepers. The good cops want to help other cops be good cops, and Oath Keepers facilitates that nicely. I think Oath Keepers is a very important part of the liberty movement. Wise is he who does not paint with a broad brush. I personally assess people only as individuals. I *have* met some very fine cops, and I'm glad they're out there.
Thank you for being here.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jake on April 12, 2016, 07:16:51 pm
I concur wholeheartedly, about Oath Keepers. The good cops want to help other cops be good cops, and Oath Keepers facilitates that nicely. I think Oath Keepers is a very important part of the liberty movement. Wise is he who does not paint with a broad brush. I personally assess people only as individuals. I *have* met some very fine cops, and I'm glad they're out there.
Thank you for being here.

Salute!
Elias

The Oath Keepers were new to me at the first of the year.  Fits my niche perfectly I thot.  Now I am coming to the conclusion that this makes up the rest of the flavor to make the dish complete.  Thank you for inviting.
Salute! back at ya
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jake on April 12, 2016, 07:34:50 pm
It would be refreshing to have someone to argue with again.  Muwahahaha.

Be warned...  I won't tiptoe around about the principles of voluntaryism like I do at the OK forums.  And don't expect me to play nice with JBTs who will surely show up and make excuses for the criminality of their fellow professional bullies.

I don't want to lose my happy home here.  I was invited to the Survival Podcast forums and then banned later because I wouldn't kiss the ass of one of their prominent posters who was a cop / blackwater mercenary.  I stopped speaking my mind about legalized thuggery at Oath Keepers forums because Stewart asked me to.

I want assurance that I can continue to speak my mind freely without worrying about scaring someone away or that their wittow feewings might get huwted.

.

I enjoy a good discussion with differing opinions  . . . . . . now I am wondering "How much air does an over weight leaping gnome get on a leap?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 12, 2016, 07:36:05 pm
I concur wholeheartedly, about Oath Keepers. The good cops want to help other cops be good cops, and Oath Keepers facilitates that nicely. I think Oath Keepers is a very important part of the liberty movement. Wise is he who does not paint with a broad brush. I personally assess people only as individuals. I *have* met some very fine cops, and I'm glad they're out there.
Thank you for being here.

Salute!
Elias

The Oath Keepers were new to me at the first of the year.  Fits my niche perfectly I thot.  Now I am coming to the conclusion that this makes up the rest of the flavor to make the dish complete.  Thank you for inviting.
Salute! back at ya



Like the way you put that, Jake. Totally agree. The Liberty movement is a wide variety of well-intentioned good Americans, and there is room for all of us. What The Mental Militia has always been about is open-minded intelligence and communications of same with other open-minded folks. We're glad you're here, Bro.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Moonbeam on April 14, 2016, 03:49:54 pm
Cherokee, Eagle Eye, other new members, Elias - Not everyone is hostile to OK or police in general. I know some very fine folks who are in that line of work -homicide detectives and sheriffs specifically. I have heard some of their experiences with folks, and they have seen (see) the really ugly side of humanity. The things they have had to deal with... well, I don't know that I would have the stomach to face what they have. I think we all agree that there are some rotten officers who have no business in this line of work -possibly not many options for them outside this either. If it makes you feel any better, I have been accused of all kinds of *nifty* things on these boards (even murder) just because I follow Jesus. I'm not sure why some folks feel the overwhelming need to hold onto their little paint brushes. Not every officer -and certainly not every Christian, deserves a derogatory/slang word thrown at them. Although in general I'm wary of cops and feel it wise to avoid them, I reserve judgment on a individual basis. Of course, I apply this to everyone in any walk of life.

Well, thanks for letting me share! I'm in the thick of things here in Toddler Land so I tend to get a little excited when talking, er, typing to other adults!  :laugh: Welcome aboard, hang in there, share your thoughts, know you will encounter some mental resistance, know you will have some closet supporters and know there are others who are, um, less hostile... ;)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 14, 2016, 04:04:01 pm
Thank you Moonbeam.

Ahhh... Civility! ;)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Tahn L. on April 14, 2016, 06:50:12 pm
What Moonbeam and Elias said goes for me and WELCOME to all the new folk.

 I see the major difference between good guys and bad guys (cops, politicians and others) are those that believe in persecuting those that violate mala prohibita, (rules made up to control others who have harmed no one). There are several interesting threads concerning that on this wonderful but sometimes rambunctious forum.

Here is one I started but there are many others. Sometimes it goes sideways but that is freedom of expression, which we excel at here. Again WELCOME!

 https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=34664.0
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 14, 2016, 07:09:08 pm
Awesome, Tahn.
Thank you!

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jorn on April 15, 2016, 10:48:11 am
I am a noob, yet not a stranger to Elias.  YouTube and other media is draining people away from these kinds of forums.  I am sick of YouTube and have no interest in the OathKeepers or Rhodes.  Suggest putting one video on YouTube directing folks to this forum.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 15, 2016, 11:23:08 am
I am a noob, yet not a stranger to Elias.  YouTube and other media is draining people away from these kinds of forums.  I am sick of YouTube and have no interest in the OathKeepers or Rhodes.  Suggest putting one video on YouTube directing folks to this forum.

Welcome Jorn. Thank you for registering.
Everything nowadays seems to be in flux. The country at large is not where it was in 2009, and the customary apathy of the past Century has now been buried under an even darker quilt, so that many folks now are just hunkering down and prepping for whatever fate comes to this land we call America. The voice of freedom is muffled more now than it was in 2009. Forums are not as popular as they were then. Social media and YouTube are huge detractors, but also the general stress of a failing economy and political uncertainty is taking its toll on the "voice" of many who were much more vocal just six short years ago. The country seems to be sensing "futility" on every hand, and with pretty good reason to sense that futility.
One of my dear friends just this morning brought up a term I instantly liked -- "intellectual explorer". That, I think, is central to what TMM was created to endorse for everyone back when we formed this online discussion group sixteen years ago. Exploring mentality, exploring psyche, getting familiar with how one's mind works, or, as I used to put it -- "thinking about thinking" -- is probably the best service we here at TMM can offer a crazed and wobbling world.
Enjoy yourself here, Friend.
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jake on April 15, 2016, 11:27:31 am
I am sick of YouTube and have no interest in the OathKeepers or Rhodes.
YouTube, I understand a little.  I don't go there unless it fits my needs at the moment.  As far as the OathKeepers, it had become a natural fit for me logically for the sign-of-the-times today and in what I was doing prior to knowing the OathKeepers.  In other words the true essence of what OathKeepers were doing is what I had been doing for years.

As for Rhodes, I don't really know him except of what he is trying to do with the development of OathKeepers, which I feel is necessary for The People.

What causes your axe grinding with the OathKeepers?  If you don't mind explaining.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 15, 2016, 11:55:16 am


What causes your axe grinding with the OathKeepers?  If you don't mind explaining.

He did not grind on an axe, he just said he's not interested, right?
Thanks,
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jorn on April 15, 2016, 12:16:02 pm
There is a new batch of folks waking up.  The abnormal Guns sales tells all what we need to know.  Everyone is on a list and the more lists you are on, the higher you score on a Threat Matrix.  Only ' radical', or more accurately, traditional American types end up here.  What could we image is our Threat Matrix Score?  I assume everything I say is available to the Feds and soon they will be hunting us.  Better to educate new patriots now so we can better turn the tables on them later... should they be stooopid enough to hunt us...
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Rarick on April 15, 2016, 08:21:30 pm
I read the first five pages of this thread and decided to skip ahead and post.

I came here from Oath Keepers. Still with Oath Keepers by the way.

Over there, I was challenged at times for being a cop basher/hater. I made my best attempts to explain that bad cops do bad things and that is why Oath Keepers exists,....to remind bad cops to be good,....to honor their oath and not blindly follow illegal orders.

Many Oath Keepers over there agreed with me. Many did not.

Dividing into two different camps over whether cops are good or bad seems a little silly to me.

If a cop honors his oath and does the right things (Frank Serpico), he is a good cop.

If a cop dishonors his oath and does dishonorable things, he is a bad cop.

I was often called onto the carpet during my twenty year military career for challenging my chain of command while others worked hard at not being noticed while they skated their way to retirement.

I retired with my integrity intact and I sleep good.

I am an Oath Keeper. I have been down the rabbit hole....very, very deep down the rabbit hole.

I have seen a few comments that suggests Oath Keepers are mindless thugs on the take. The very purpose of Oath Keepers is to prevent the mindless thugs from being so. Would it not stand to reason that most Oath Keepers members are the ones who get it?

I took the time to read the history of The Mental Militia. I was quite impressed. I believed that here is a long running endeavor that has evolved to exactly where it should be because good people with great minds have made it so. Then I got to the not so pleasant comments about Oath Keepers and wondered how can this forum be as enlightened as it's membership claims? I have read some absolutely brilliant stuff on the Oath Keepers forums.

I don't say these things to start a flame war. I say them because I am a person who spends many hours every day researching, reading, learning, and working to share ideas....and then I nearly quit this forum as fast as I found it.

But I will not leave this forum until I have given it a fair chance to show me why it has survived for so long. There is either something substantial here, or there are a handful of nut jobs who just don't know when to quit. No, I doubt that a bunch of loonies could pull this off for so long, so you all are stuck with me...at least for awhile.

Same here Cherokee. Though I've never been a cop, I almost pulled out after reading some of the comments on this site. Yep, there are bad cops and I can appreciate each of us has our own reasons for believing as we do. I have even faced off with one or two in my life and was fortunate enough a good one was nearby. Still, At the age of 65, I refuse to put all of a certain race or occupation into some all encompassing statement. Even though I disagree with those types of statements, I fought for the right for the writer to say whatever they want. Whether they like it or not. So, here I am. A free man willing to listen.

My hope is to learn and share ideas. Wisdom is gained though patient, civil discourse. It's too easy to go off the rails of misunderstanding on a 2 dimentional format like this. I don't bite much. I chew.  ;p

What often gets overlooked is that the BAD subset often gets focused on more than the good subset.  Bad cops are what gets the generic reference as cops.  If you do not remember that detail, it can seem like some people and a majority here, have a psychosis-like issue when it comes to them and cops. 

I can count on the fingers of both hands the number of times I have had to deal with cops, and only 3 of those times ended in any kind of professionalism.  I am one of those that regards them as a sad necessity and I honestly believe that if we eliminated the "Bottom 25%" we would not need them at all. 
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 15, 2016, 08:52:47 pm
Sorry but I do not see the need for any police.

if every person took responsibly for their own safety and actions, then there would be less crime every where.

but that is my .02   
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Scarmiglione' on April 15, 2016, 09:29:56 pm
Sorry but I do not see the need for any police.

if every person took responsibly for their own safety and actions, then there would be less crime every where.

but that is my .02

I would suggest that if even 50% did, we wouldn't need cops.

But they don't.  So we do.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on April 16, 2016, 10:26:40 am
Open-minded thinkers are a threat to totalitarian rulers.
The Mental Militia is a threat to totalitarian rulers.

To think there are not some full-time employees of the ruling elite here on this site would be naive.  They are going to try to pit us against each other, entice us to wander far afield and other mischief.

Couple that with an incredible variety of real threats and mischief pouring over society and it is easy to sow confusion and discord via honorable and dishonorable participants in this forum.

The Mental Militia will have some negativity and unpleasantness in it. That is unavoidable.  Put on your big boy pants and deal with the real world here. There are a lot of good people sharing some fine thinking.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: kirgi07 on April 16, 2016, 11:11:23 am
 :nailonhead:   Ought 7.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 16, 2016, 04:33:38 pm
Boy, that nail will not stay down. will it
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: DiabloLoco on April 16, 2016, 05:15:23 pm
Boy, that nail will not stay down. will it
Next time use a "ring-shank". :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 18, 2016, 03:12:04 pm
Since the thread talking about this is locked, I will ask this here.

May I know the reason for the PM part being done away with?

I am sure there was a reason, I would like to know why?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on April 18, 2016, 03:18:03 pm
Since the thread talking about this is locked, I will ask this here.

May I know the reason for the PM part being done away with?

I am sure there was a reason, I would like to know why?

Some people were using it to harass others. We're trying various things, so please be patient.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: FDD on April 18, 2016, 03:28:02 pm
Since the thread talking about this is locked, I will ask this here.

May I know the reason for the PM part being done away with?

I am sure there was a reason, I would like to know why?

Some people were using it to harass others. We're trying various things, so please be patient.

OK, no problem
thank you
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Mr. Bill on April 18, 2016, 09:56:22 pm
[deleted because my comments have already been dealt with here: Registration agreement updated, and Private Messaging going away. (https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=35641.0)  Duh.]
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Rarick on April 24, 2016, 01:46:10 pm
Boy, that nail will not stay down. will it
Next time use a "ring-shank". :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

A hacksaw used in a couple of places to "Make a dent"  moght rough up the shaft enough to fix that.   OOps, referring to the gif?  Oh well.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Jake on April 24, 2016, 03:14:35 pm
Some people were using it to harass others. We're trying various things, so please be patient.
Thank you, I was wondering also
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on April 24, 2016, 04:15:38 pm
Some people were using it to harass others. We're trying various things, so please be patient.
Thank you, I was wondering also

Thanks Jake.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: UncleMorgan on November 05, 2016, 08:15:56 am
Hell, I just got here and I'm liking this place already!

Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on November 05, 2016, 08:17:37 am
Hell, I just got here and I'm liking this place already!

That's great! And welcome. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on November 05, 2016, 08:51:27 am
Hell, I just got here and I'm liking this place already!

Yup. I second ML's welcome. Thanks for signing up.
I've read a couple of your other posts, and I'm confident that you've found the right place.  (I don't use those silly bulbs either, lol!)

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on December 07, 2016, 07:38:48 am
My number one favorite source for Agenda 21, and as far as I know the true pioneer fighting it, is Michael Shaw over at Freedom Advocates --  http://www.freedomadvocates.org/

I've got a bit of a start on his landing page at the new The Mental Militia national site.

https://thementalmilitia.net/readers-regiment/1864-2/

Wyoming is a sparsely-populated State for the most part. I think it holds much good for people who are interested in getting away fro the cities, but anyone moving to the country in any State have much to get accustomed to.  A lot depends on an individual's mindset and character. Personally, I grew up reading Thoreau and Emerson, and had the good fortune to have good forest/river areas handy for playing as a boy. All my grown years found me longing to get back to a more natural way of relating to Nature, and I strongly question the benefits of "modern civilization", preferring to take the electricity and pickup trucks and leave the rest to the city boys, lol.

A really good take on this is in an old piece by our dear Friend, Claire Wolfe. I am building her landing page at The Mental Militia right now, and in my travels last night whilst working on her page I came across the first post I ever made here at this particular forum, way back in June of 2003. In that post I duplicated her article called "Moving To Hardyville", which I had found at WorldNet Daiy. (Yes, Claire used to write for WND.) Anyway, here is that link, and I'd certainly hope many reading here go read her essay on moving to Hardyville. It's a short, but excellent prose piece of fiction about just what we're talking about here. Enjoy.

https://secure.thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=9.0

Salute!
Elias

Slowly making my way to Hardyville,...dragging my wife along. It will just take longer this way. Someday, she'll ask, "why didn't we move here sooner? "

Welcome to the new folks (yes, yes, I know, i'm still on here occasionally enough to be noticed.)  I'm one of those hardasses who used to be a nice softass until the day I got beat up and falsely arrested by some cops for having the audacity to not kiss a cop's ass and having an expired registration.  I even had a detective ask me if I was a sovereign citizen during booking.  (During which process they insulted me in ways I'm sure jews who survived concentration camps might recall.)  I despise that system and see NO necessity to it.  Bad guys should die, not be coddled, and cops have no business except the racket of extortion and intimidation when it comes to enforcing non crimes (aka victimless mala prohibita "offenses.")  The fact that I've been around during the bad old soviet union, and I lived in one of the satellites, in fact the one with the bloodiest revolution, might have something to do with how poorly I view cops.  They've never proven to be useful to me in any way.  They didn't destroy the dogs who bit my mom, for the most part they've been benevolently useless at best... at worst... well lets not go there again.  So all in all I see cops as people taking a paycheck to do what mafia enforcers are declared criminals for doing.  (After all, the mafia keep order among their controlled areas too... and they collect taxes too.)

As for "why did we move here"... hah, we were watching the retards on youtube (the Trump salty SJW "special snowflakes") threatening suicide because they lost the election.  Watched the social justice warriors claim that a man looking at a nice hot woman's body was RAPE... idiots who declared a new term "PIV" (penis in vagina sex) as always rape... watched the protesters going apeshit and flinging molotovs on wide angle video because Trump won (stuff the lamestream news won't touch with a ten foot pole.)  And my mom who now officially lives with me after my dad died this year, says... "what happened to the world?  How did we miss this?"  I said: "It has been happening.  I just didn't show you at first.  We've been insulated in Redneckia.  We left the world to its much deserved fate... let it burn.  We can only rebuild after they have been allowed to burn themselves to ashes."  In truth, I love technology, I love science, but the men and women (who do not deserve that title) who now pervert it for government use, have defiled science in ways the soviets and all the other monsters of history WISH they could have done.  Entire branches destroyed based on "feels" rather than knowledge and application and testing.  Entire branches falsely invented and foisted on the people on false premises (women's studies, keynesian economics, and don't forget the false belief that populations must continue to increase at rabbit levels... despite the visible mechanism switch between r and K reproductive strategies in all wealthy societies, regardless of tyranny level, which Molyneux did a shockingly good job of (I used to hate him in his early days... supremely so.))

Rest assured that even here, north of Mama Liberty's place, we have a sheriff who worships government, who thinks we need a SWAT bus and SWAT team (1200 people in town, if you count the invalids, miner migrants and all the children who aren't old enough to run away and become democrats.)  He also declared to me one day that "people have a RIGHT to FEEL safe."  The poison is spreading.  People here are simply insulated and will not realize what that poison brings with it until the side effects of the final stage of infection become visible.

Anyways, I've said my piece.  I wish you luck kids, and I may chime in with TL;DR bits that will only help those who can read for comprehension.  The rest will find something to knee jerk about, much like Democrat Socialists do.  But yeah, the Trump election's SJW side effects have shown us WHY we moved.  Until my chickens or the cows in the field start fist pumping for marxism, we should be okay out here.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Klapton Isgod on December 07, 2016, 10:49:59 am

Never heard of a good one. Of all the stories out there about cops, I've never seen a good one.

I guess that's because you are closing your eyes to that. I've posted a number of times about the "good ones" here where I live. The sheriff and his deputies here are definitely "peace officers," and the tiny group of city police here don't indulge in aggression either. Are they perfect? Of course not. Are they going to learn better if they are hated and ridiculed? Not likely.

Choose your enemies carefully, and wisely - just as you choose your friends.

I see "good cop" stories all the time on facebook.  Local news stations share them all the time.  I usually comment something like, "Wow!  Cops acting like normal humans!  Get a camera!"

.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: skjamth on February 18, 2017, 06:48:59 am
OK, got it.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on November 24, 2017, 09:13:09 am
If you alert tens of thousands of active-duty thugs, cops, soldiers, narcs, anti-terrorism agents, building code enforcers, policy wonks, reservists, all of whom count themselves active duty and military, law enforcement, and firefighters, some will notice this place. 

They won't like what they find here.  This is not a friendly place for their kind.

Doesn't seem to be any danger of that. The word went out... and nobody came. Good enough. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 18, 2017, 07:41:34 am
If you alert tens of thousands of active-duty thugs, cops, soldiers, narcs, anti-terrorism agents, building code enforcers, policy wonks, reservists, all of whom count themselves active duty and military, law enforcement, and firefighters, some will notice this place. 

They won't like what they find here.  This is not a friendly place for their kind.

Doesn't seem to be any danger of that. The word went out... and nobody came. Good enough. :)

Actually, ML, the word didn't really "go out". I mean, I really did not try to advertise this place.

Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 18, 2017, 10:54:01 am
Actually, ML, the word didn't really "go out". I mean, I really did not try to advertise this place.

Oh. OK. Why not? That's what you said you were going to do. I'm confused. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 18, 2017, 05:34:20 pm
Actually, ML, the word didn't really "go out". I mean, I really did not try to advertise this place.

Oh. OK. Why not? That's what you said you were going to do. I'm confused. :)

ML, I did intend to do that, but in the end I decided to let this place mature somewhat. There are some outstanding minds here, and the caliber of consciousness I've been seeing here lately is impressing me in a very good way. I like what I'm seeing here these days. It could be that this place could end up being what it was supposed to be at the start. This thread is three years old this month. Improvements in the general tone of conversation and ideation are looking much better. But but there have been some voices herein which I would be embarrassed for some of our friens to see, and especially I would not want their own views attacked mercilessly by insensitive remarks from self-appointed geniuses who hit newbies over the head with the iron skillet of judgment because said newbies were not already full-blown anarchists.

And I'll confess that that has been mostly my fault, because I've been too busy myself for the past eight years, and have not been here nearly enough to nurture a sense of civility in the general flow of conversations.  I over-extended myself, and I also tied my hands a bit back in 2007 when I tried to set up the Admin policies along a more "democratic" style of administering the forums. For some number of years my hands were tied in some ways. That has now changed and I'm no longer bound by  the Admins, and in my absence a higher quality of folks have weathered the years of change here and contributed meaningful posts. That is a good sign, and it's not something I did -- it's just a sign that some of the sorts of folks I'd want to see here have indeed stayed the course and continue to make this a quality place. But three years ago it was not really ready. I did, however, invite in some friends, who have mostly given up and gone their separate ways.

Because the nice folks I did invite in here got attacked by the know-it-all snotty club who just knew that if anyone came here from Oath Keepers they were sub-human robots of statist ilk.

Let me be frank with you. You can go over to the Allied Camps section of the national website and take a look at the caliber of liberty fighters listed there. Just scroll this page --

https://thementalmilitia.net/allied-camps/

Do you think I'm going to invite Edwin Vieira or Pat Wood or even Wendy McElroy to come over here and get dumped on by a group of would-be-ninja know-it-alls who love to strut their superior wisdom around the place like, what's his name, Diablo Loco -- who sees himself as more brilliant than a peacock's fully-spread fan. I am not saying that the good people here now are like that. In fact, I really appreciate the ones I've known by their posts. The place is much more "user-friendly" now than it's been in the past, and I'm pleased. But three years ago there was some turbulence. For example, there was Silver, who jumped immediately to a conclusion (as did others) which was far from correct. He presumed that I only know "Oath Keepers", and therefore I would only be bringing in those damned cops and militarized thugs. I do not know how he could presume that G. Edward Griffin or Richard Gage or Edwin Vieira, or even I myself, must be lumped into his vision of "Bad Cop!" and his theory that all cops are bad cops and since bad cops infest Oath Keepers then anyone I brought in here must be a bad cop. It's like Silver totally overlooked the fact that this discussion group got started in 1999 and stayed online ever since, and that Stewart Rhodes only joined here in 2006 and that Oath Keepers was not created here until March of 2009.  Oh no! If I'm working for Oath Keepers, then that means anyone I bring in here must be a Bad Cop.

Are you getting my drift? Go look at Silver's post on page one of this thread and tell me if he jumped to conclusions or not. He presumed that because I worked for Oath Keepers the only people I would know must be "Bad Cops". It did not dawn upon him that a lot of liberty-loving free thinkers had joined Oath Keepers to help convert those "bad cops" into being decent human beings. So he was not pleased with my bright idea about upgrading the levels of intelligence here. Just read his well-written post on page one of this thread.

Here is another example. Basil Fishbone has been in TMM since 2003. He is the co-founder of the Fully Informed Jury Association, (FIJA), a national-level top shelf organization that has done huge strides in fighting for liberty. Do you ever see him taking valuable time away from his work to shoot the breeze over here? Do you ever wonder why he does not "hang out" here?   The reason he is not present here is the same reason I am hesitant to invite other nationally-known names in here.

Here is another example -- Claire Wolfe. As you know, she ran this place for four years, until it finally drove her crazy and she handed it back to The Mental Militia. Why is she not posting here? There are many dear friends who I'd love to see posting here, but I won't subject them to pious egoism as displayed by that Diablo Loco character or the long-gone "Get Your Hands Dirty" crowd.

But maybe that sort of consciousness is finally gone, and maybe we can build a renewed interest in open-minded free-thinking consciousness, the sort of consciousness I'd be proud to introduce to the power players in the American liberty movement. But as I noted above -- all of this is mostly my fault, because I've not been around to help keep the conversational streams focused on building up a worth-while instrument for mental development while at the same time providing a cultural center for freedom loving people of all walks. Thankfully, you've been on duty here and have kept the place glued together. I'm deeply grateful to you for that. I'm also grateful for many others here who I'd be proud to call my friends.

So I'd invite all readers here to go to the national website and click on "Articles and Information", or any of the other pages, and notice that there is no "infighting" there. Egoism is totally absent. That site is being packed with information. It is not a "rolling news wire", and it is not a place for debates and arguments. It is on mission, which is to collect knowledge. When these forums rise to that level, I won't have to invite people here -- they'll come on their own. Any word of good things moves swiftly through the national consciousness.

So I've got much work to do, but I also have to survive and build that national site and put some groceries on the table here, and it's more than this old guy can do to be here every day. I will apologize to you for that. But I'll also be on record for saying to you that I do believe that this place will become much stronger in the new year coming.

Merry Christmas!
Salute!
Elias



Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 19, 2017, 04:26:39 am
Thanks, Elias. This forum seems to be in a better place these days, I agree. I talk to Claire often, and her new forum has gone through much the same growing pains. She fixed that by making membership in the Cabal very selective, and it's doing better.

Unfortunately, there is really no way to control an open, public forum like TMM. If more "control" is what you want, we will have to narrow the criteria for membership seriously and stick to it. There is no way that spontaneous good-will and serious discussion "without ego" can be expected when anyone at all can register and post. Not going to happen, and the current lull can't last.

People are human, warts and all, and if you invite the general public to your party, some will get drunk and disorderly and some will start fist fights... which is why the bouncers need to see the invitations at the door, and stand ready to keep the peace anyway... since even the elect and invited may not always mind their manners.

Don't know if you've looked at Claire's forum yet, but you might want to do that. Look at how she limits the membership and see if you want to do something similar. Let me know. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 23, 2017, 02:08:06 am
Thanks, Elias. This forum seems to be in a better place these days, I agree. I talk to Claire often, and her new forum has gone through much the same growing pains. She fixed that by making membership in the Cabal very selective, and it's doing better.

Unfortunately, there is really no way to control an open, public forum like TMM. If more "control" is what you want, we will have to narrow the criteria for membership seriously and stick to it. There is no way that spontaneous good-will and serious discussion "without ego" can be expected when anyone at all can register and post. Not going to happen, and the current lull can't last.

People are human, warts and all, and if you invite the general public to your party, some will get drunk and disorderly and some will start fist fights... which is why the bouncers need to see the invitations at the door, and stand ready to keep the peace anyway... since even the elect and invited may not always mind their manners.

Don't know if you've looked at Claire's forum yet, but you might want to do that. Look at how she limits the membership and see if you want to do something similar. Let me know. :)

Sorry for the delay, ML, in getting back to you on this.
About Claire's forum, I do not blame her for wanting to keep a tight control over the members there. However, I do not want to do that here. I would prefer to leave it open, and simply boot one out of here now and then as need arises. 
Back when Claire opened her new site I did go over there and click around.  I've been there several times since then, but I have not talked with her in quite some time.  The reason I did not join her forum has to do with old grudges between myself and some of her regular members, and I just don't want to make waves with anyone over there.  It's all good, anyway, because the last thing I need to be doing is running my mouth on any forum other than this one, right? I mean, if I don't have time to talk here, what makes me think I would have time to talk at some other forum, yes? ;)

Anyway, ML, as you know I am trying to do too much, still, and my work with the jewelry studio is pulling me away from a lot of Internet stuff that I've been addicted to for years.  I've been hoping to make a difference in the direction our country is going, and after seventeen years of trying, I have to realize that the mass mind is totally disinterested, couldn't care less, and is in fact beyond help, imo. I'm also old now, with less energy, and I've just come through a year with no job, no paycheck, and it's been one tough year for me.  I've simply got to cut back on my computer time and put in more time making jewelry.  Because of that,  you'll probably see more of me here at the forums, because instead of cruising all over the world online, I'll limit myself to mostly posting at TMM and these forums.  But I digress ---

Let's leave things as they are, and encourage intelligent and mature posting by all members here, and that kind of standard should produce the membership we want here. Does that sound okay with you?

Merry Christmas,  MamaLiberty! Thank you for all you've done here for so many years. You're awesome!
Salute!
Elias Alias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 23, 2017, 05:14:26 am
Let's leave things as they are, and encourage intelligent and mature posting by all members here, and that kind of standard should produce the membership we want here. Does that sound okay with you?

As you wish, dear heart. We'll do our best to keep the ugly down to a dull roar. :) And I hear you about limiting how much I look at on line, been cutting back for some time now and doing more writing of my own. I've finished three books, so far, and I'll bet you'll get a kick out of the short one I'm sending you.  I'll send you my full book, if you like, and the sequel once I get it done. It is my vision for what a truly free country/world would look like, how individuals and their voluntary associations might interact and how peace and prosperity would grow in the absence of the "government" that basically committed suicide - as we've so often speculated.  The first of those is called "Consequences" and the second has a working title of "It's A Free Country." This sequel takes many of the same characters and their children into subsequent periods of adjustment and effort, some of it fighting a new wave of would-be rulers who want to control, as such people always have. The key is what these second and third generation folks do about it.

Anyway, I'll send you a sample chapter of "Consequences." See what you think of it. :)
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: kirgi07 on December 23, 2017, 12:17:46 pm
"Claires forum". Ought 7.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 23, 2017, 12:40:13 pm
"Claires forum". Ought 7.

What does that mean, kirgi07?
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: kirgi07 on December 24, 2017, 10:48:11 am
I do apologize,I can't recall the reason I posted my reply. Ought 7.   :huh:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: slidemansailor on December 24, 2017, 07:53:04 pm
I do apologize,I can't recall the reason I posted my reply. Ought 7.   :huh:

I have been in that headspace myself.  I do try to not post public messages in those times, though.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: kirgi07 on December 25, 2017, 10:11:12 am
SMS,I normally don't do that.I "" to get my point across. Ought 7.  :huh:
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 30, 2017, 07:27:26 am
SMS,I normally don't do that.I "" to get my point across. Ought 7.  :huh:

kirgi07, can you recall what your point was now?

Happy New Year 2018!
Salute!
Elias
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: kirgi07 on December 30, 2017, 09:09:36 am
No Elias,I've looked back thru the thread and I'm stuck.Sorry. Ought 7.
Title: Re: Revitalizing TMM (Poll)
Post by: Elias Alias on December 30, 2017, 09:12:23 am
No Elias,I've looked back thru the thread and I'm stuck.Sorry. Ought 7.

Okey-dokey, kirgi07. Good answer. ;)

Salute!
Elias