The Mental Militia Forums

Location, location, location => 50 states. Which one is for you? => Topic started by: Moonbeam on June 22, 2015, 10:43:50 am

Title: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Moonbeam on June 22, 2015, 10:43:50 am
Of course, all states have their positives and negatives. Hopefully reading some of the experiences of others who are familiar with Wyoming will help you formulate an opinion that is works for you.

For example, Destin has some negative experiences unfortunately. Perhaps he will utilize this specific area to coordinate his thoughts:

I'm doing it specifically to warn potential other movers.  See, most of the other freestate boys and girls I knew who ARE YOUNG (at least as young as I am, or younger) have ALL run off.  Moved out of state, or out of country (I know one personally.)

People burn A LOT OF MONEY moving out here.  Wyoming is cheap rent, but cheap rent plus long travel distances, plus  hostile locals plus low local incomes and businesses unwilling to spend money except with their cousin's cousin's daughter... well, that's a recipe for disaster... financial disaster.

And by all means share your positive experiences, as well! :)
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on June 22, 2015, 10:46:39 am
Hey Moonie

You could do this with every state.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Moonbeam on June 22, 2015, 11:18:58 am
I am sure those who feel inclined will do so. I was hoping to be helpful, for Destin specifically, but for all those who would like to share their personal experiences of Wyoming. [I also happen to be one of those individuals who loves/appreciates/needs strong organization! :laugh: ]
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Moonbeam on June 26, 2015, 02:58:08 pm
From a discussion over here: https://thementalmilitia.com/forums/index.php?topic=35135.30

Wanna buy my house?  You're probably one of those guys who'd LOVE IT here.  After all, you can shoot guns to your heart's content.  I'll sell for the price I paid for it, and land and outbuildings, won't even charge extra for reflooring the place and putting in wood flooring instead of that ratty carpet people put into homes of all shapes and sizes out here (carpets load up fast out here, regardless of how much you steam them... the dirt/dust/mud that drags even if you leave your shoes at the entrance... is atrocious.)  Carpet is the second dumbest thing anyone living outside the big cities can possibly do...  All taxes paid and I'll be out in three months... interested?  They're selling lots out here for 15 to 16 grand, water, sewer, covenants not enforced (because the busiest of our "code enforcement" busy-body neighbors built the wrong kind of building so enforcing anything would have THEM out on their asses first, I would lose a few grand on this and that, they'd lose house and home... hah!) and we ARE out in the county, so at least, none of the city zoning bullshit applies to us.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on June 27, 2015, 06:30:45 pm
I'll give you my take on Wyoming...

I moved to Lander in 2012 and can honestly say that it's the best place I've ever lived.  The taxes are lower than anywhere else I've ever lived.  There are a few more "red blooded Americans" here than anywhere else I've ever lived.  The gun laws are great.  The hunting and fishing is great.  The homeschooling laws are pretty darn good.  The economy is (comparatively) strong.  It is sunny and dry most of the time...

While I do love Wyoming, it is not some libertarian/anarchist paradise.  Most people that I meet are either Democrats or Republicans...with capital letters.  Most Republicans don't hold Republican politicians accountable, so a bunch of country club, federal government-groveling neocons run our state. (The year after I moved here our county sales tax went up by 1% and the state gas tax went up 10 cents.) Lander happens to be a fairly liberal town that seems to get progressively more so each day.  I'm in construction, and the public schools I have worked in are covered in pro-LGBT posters.  The local, county, and state governments are extremely bloated with corporate tax dollars.  The local police force has received dozens of M16s and a couple of humvees from the military.  In many ways, Wyoming is not that different from most other places I've lived.

Since moving here, I've had a feeling that within a few years, Wyoming will look very different.  The younger generation here is the same as the younger generation anywhere else, and, once the older generation fades away, this place will change in a hurry - think Colorado but with a low population much more susceptible to rapid demographic shift.  I sincerely hope that's not the case, but I think it's likely enough that I have begun looking at Alaska and a couple of other countries as serious candidates for relocation in the future.  To be fair, I think that most of my complaints about Wyoming could be leveled anywhere.  The fact that Wyoming still has low taxes and good gun laws is a testament to the state.  If 1990 Wyoming had held sway, the place would be heaven on Earth.  As it is, it's still better than anywhere else I've lived.
...

Regarding Free State Wyoming, I was an enthusiastic participant on the forum for a while back in 2010.  I soured on the organization for a few reasons in December of that year, and it didn't factor into my decision to move here in 2012.  I have really drifted away from the organization since it became clear that agnostics, atheists, and anarchists weren't particularly welcome on the forum, though I still comment from time to time.  I wouldn't have reservations about living in northeast Wyoming, but I would have reservations about joining Boston's inner circle.  Your mileage may vary...
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 28, 2015, 06:25:17 am
I wouldn't have reservations about living in northeast Wyoming, but I would have reservations about joining Boston's inner circle.  Your mileage may vary...

I live here, and don't know of any "inner circle" for Boston. Seems to me he's alienated just about everyone. Kinda sad, but there it is.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on June 28, 2015, 07:23:21 am
from what I have read, and heard, is that people got upset with Boston when he did not want to be some political leader there in Wyoming.
He had an idea, and others ran with it, but they still wanted him to be the big leader, and that was something he did not want to be.

Is Wyoming prefect?
no.
does Wyoming have something to offer?
Yes. but it is not for everyone.
But what place is?
I know people that can not think of living anywhere outside of a city.
the thought to do so is so alien to them.
OK, that is their choice. Mine is to be as far out in the country as I can get.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 28, 2015, 03:04:53 pm
from what I have read, and heard, is that people got upset with Boston when he did not want to be some political leader there in Wyoming.


Having known Boston for a very long time, I think I can give my opinion with some veracity. He wanted to maintain absolute control of the FSW name, mission, and how people perceived it, but he wanted no real responsibility for making that happen. Unfortunately for him, and the rest of us, that's not even possible.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Chase on June 28, 2015, 08:08:04 pm
Quote
"red blooded Americans"

What does this mean exactly?

Quote
Most Republicans don't hold Republican politicians accountable,

If Republican politicians did what they promised it would be a statist hell

Quote
I'm in construction, and the public schools I have worked in

So you're paid by tax dollars?

 
Quote
covered in pro-LGBT posters.

So?

Quote
I have begun looking at Alaska

Besides the communist permanent fund, Alaska is one of the most heavily subsidized states there is.

What else makes Wyoming good or bad in your book?





Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: heyoka on June 29, 2015, 04:39:32 am
Is the Bostonian "inner circle" Mormon LDS, or an updated, over marketeerd moniker?  :ph34r:
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 29, 2015, 06:49:03 am
Is the Bostonian "inner circle" Mormon LDS, or an updated, over marketeerd moniker?  :ph34r:

The FSW had no religious basis at all. Boston's claim to fame was built entirely on his books, such as Molon Labe and the Gun Bible - which also had nothing to do with religion. Boston is a Christian, as are many FSW members, but many others were not.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: heyoka on June 29, 2015, 08:15:43 am
Molon Labe  - which also had nothing to do with religion.
Did you read Molon Labe? I can't fault you for forgetting the "satanic" motivations/connections of TPIB. It was a very forgettable inference.
Then there's the Playboy interview with Gov Preston (which "happened" this year BTW ^_^). Ref pg 411, et al.
On the forum, any LDS discussion was quite constrained, moderated with a (gold platen encrusted) iron fist.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on June 29, 2015, 08:31:21 am

Did you read Molon Labe? I can't fault you for forgetting the "satanic" motivations/connections of TPIB. It was a very forgettable inference.
On the forum, any LDS discussion was quite constrained, moderated with a (gold platen encrusted) iron fist.

Yes, I've read it. I've read everything Boston ever published. I see no problems with them beyond the obvious need he's always had for an editor. If you see "satanic" stuff, I'm sorry. All of that is pretty much in the eye of the beholder.  I know Boston damped down any religious discussion at the forum, pretty much. Just part of his desire to control. Everyone could take it or leave it... and most of us have just simply left it at this point. No skin off my nose. It was his organization and his forum to do with as he pleased from the start.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on June 30, 2015, 02:54:20 pm
Quote
"red blooded Americans"

What does this mean exactly?
I bet you get the idea.

Quote
Most Republicans don't hold Republican politicians accountable,

If Republican politicians did what they promised it would be a statist hell
I thought it already was.

Quote
I'm in construction, and the public schools I have worked in

So you're paid by tax dollars?
Sometimes, and I drive on public roads, too!

 
Quote
covered in pro-LGBT posters.

So?
My personal opinion is that LGBTQ lifestyles are misguided and harmful to society...not to mention many of the people who embrace those lifestyles.  YMMV.  If so, we'll agree to disagree.

Quote
I have begun looking at Alaska

Besides the communist permanent fund, Alaska is one of the most heavily subsidized states there is.
No doubt about it.  It's also the most remote, the most undeveloped, and the least densely populated.  I have come to believe that the farther one gets from other people, the easier it is to live one's life unmolested.

What else makes Wyoming good or bad in your book?
I've covered the big points for me.




Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: StillaGhost on June 30, 2015, 09:38:38 pm

My personal opinion is that LGBTQ lifestyles are misguided and harmful to society...not to mention many of the people who embrace those lifestyles.  YMMV.  If so, we'll agree to disagree.



 
   So you'd mandate a specific lifestyle for others?
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on June 30, 2015, 10:00:54 pm
Did I say that?

I don't want anything to do with heroin addicts, but I still think they should be able to use it without harassment.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: StillaGhost on July 01, 2015, 07:46:11 am
Did I say that?

I don't want anything to do with heroin addicts, but I still think they should be able to use it without harassment.

 
 
   You didn't answer the simple question. Now I'll be more direct , do you extend the same freedom to those of the sexual orientation you don't approve of that you did to junkies and tweakers?
 
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on July 01, 2015, 08:57:23 am
]My personal opinion is that LGBTQ lifestyles are misguided and harmful to society...not to mention many of the people who embrace those lifestyles.  YMMV.  If so, we'll agree to disagree.

How does anything that is non-aggressive harm "society?"  What do you see as "society?" It is a gathering of individuals, not an entity in itself.  Only individuals can actually do harm or be harmed. When individual homosexuals engage in aggression, as so many seem to do now, using the force of government to impose on others - not only acceptance but forced "approval" or even participation (cakes, etc.) THEN we are getting into real problems, of course. But it isn't "society" that is being harmed, but individuals by individuals. That some of these individuals form groups, both homosexual and other, is beside the point. It is the aggression that is the problem, not the "lifestyle."  And it is people being hurt, not "society."
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Bill St. Clair on July 01, 2015, 09:25:00 am
"Every sperm is sacred. Every sperm is great. If a sperm is wasted, God will be irate." -- Monty Python, The Meaning of Life
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: heyoka on July 01, 2015, 09:26:12 am
Novak,
If I wuz u, I'd refuse to answer on the grounds that it might tend to incinerate me.  :violent5:
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: StillaGhost on July 01, 2015, 11:43:31 am
Novak,
If I wuz u, I'd refuse to answer on the grounds that it might tend to incinerate me.  :violent5:

 
 
  Really? Is this yet another "stir the pot" comment?
 
    Look ML pretty much hit the nail on the head as regards the general sense , however though Novak is free to associate with only those he chooses to ( just as everyone else) what is attempting to be established is whether or not he's willing to.....
 
 
  Live and let Live.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Chase on July 01, 2015, 02:51:00 pm
I'm not sure how requiring the government tfor o treat you like they treat everyone else is aggression, but whatevers on that.

My "So?" to his complaint about posters had nothing to do with the content of said posters, it was meant to ask why is it any of his business what's on someone else's wall, he's hired to do a job at that location, it would be no different than if he was hire to remodel a home and then had a hissy about them having guns.

Someone is already writing a rebuttal saying "but this is a public school paid for by tax dollars" yes, and yes too that public schools shouldn't exist, but they do and when Novak lined up at the trough for taxpayers money he loses any credibility in complaining about the very entity that's paying him
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Baked at 420 on July 01, 2015, 07:52:09 pm
I'm rooting for Chase. Other than that, I don't have much to add other than that I'm currently dating a dude.

 :popcorn:
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: StillaGhost on July 01, 2015, 08:02:40 pm
I'm rooting for Chase. Other than that, I don't have much to add other than that I'm currently dating a dude.

 :popcorn:

 
 
   Yeah I'm pretty much in agreement with him. And I personally could give two shits who someone sleeps with , it's none of my business.
 
  It's become customary for some folks to apply arbitrary labels that are inherently divisive rather than just judge people on their actions.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on July 01, 2015, 11:25:55 pm
[quote aillaGhost link=topic=35145.msg436569#msg436569 date=1435754771]
Did I say that?

I don't want anything to do with heroin addicts, but I still think they should be able to use it without harassment.

 
 
   You didn't answer the simple question. Now I'll be more direct , do you extend the same freedom to those of the sexual orientation you don't approve of that you did to junkies and tweakers?
[/quote]

Shocking as it may be for you, yes, I do.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on July 01, 2015, 11:30:14 pm
]My personal opinion is that LGBTQ lifestyles are misguided and harmful to society...not to mention many of the people who embrace those lifestyles.  YMMV.  If so, we'll agree to disagree.

How does anything that is non-aggressive harm "society?"  What do you see as "society?" It is a gathering of individuals, not an entity in itself.  Only individuals can aally do harm or be harmed. When individual homosexuals engage in aggression, as so many seem to do now, using the force of government to impose on others - not only acceptance but forced "approval" or even participation (cakes, etc.) THEN we are getting into real problems, of course. But it isn't "society" that is being harmed, but individuals by individuals. That some of these individuals form groups, both homosexual and other, is beside the point. It is the aggression that is the problem, not the "lifestyle."  And it is people being hurt, not "society."

Poor word choice. (Society)  I agree with the notion that aggression can only be directed at individuals rather than some collective group.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on July 01, 2015, 11:43:00 pm
I'm not sure how requiring the government tfor o treat you like they treat everyone else is aggression, but whatevers on that.

My "So?" to his complaint about posters had nothing to do with the content of said posters, it was meant to ask why is it any of his business what's on someone else's wall, he's hired to do a job at that location, it would be no different than if he was hire to remodel a home and then had a hissy about them having guns.

Someone is already writing a rebuttal saying "but this is a public school paid for by tax dollars" yes, and yes too that public schools shouldn't exist, but they do and when Novak lined up at the trough for taxpayers money he loses any credibility in complaining about the very entity that's paying him

How about they argue that government cease to exist, or, at minimum, that government get out of licensing marriages altogether?  If they find someone to marry them, so be it as long as it's not the government - federal, state, local, or otherwise.

Lined up at the trough, huh?  I bet there's not a single person here who does not derive income from tax dollars.  Sell organic produce?  What if a schoolteacher wants to buy some?  Do you refuse them because they've "lined up at the trough?". Write books?  Do you refuse me a book because I'm a private sector employee who worked on a government-funded project?  What if that private sector employee purchased organic produce from the farmer who used the money to buy something from you?  Now you're " lining up at the trough. ". Get off your high horse, idiot.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: heyoka on July 02, 2015, 06:27:32 am
I'm rooting for Chase. 
 :popcorn:

Naw, I'm joining the saggy fan boy's club. It's super kwel when he turns green and gets all puffed up and rips his shirt n' shit.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Novak on July 02, 2015, 10:50:44 am
I still reserve the right to be a bigot, just one who doesn't agress upon anyone else.:)
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: heyoka on July 02, 2015, 11:00:37 am
Welcome to the forum. Just understand we likes to do a short arm inspection straight away. Just makin sure you ain't one o them.
(https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fimg0.etsystatic.com%2F034%2F0%2F5128700%2Fil_340x270.517669746_d5zh.jpg&f=1)
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: StillaGhost on July 02, 2015, 12:51:22 pm
I still reserve the right to be a bigot, just one who doesn't agress upon anyone else.:)

 
 
 Exactly.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind. on July 03, 2015, 03:40:43 pm
It doesn't matter.  There isn't much work left in America, or probably the world that isn't funded with stolen money from government plunder coffers, since... well... the governments of the world have PLUNDERED EVERYTHING.  Hell, I was as staunchly disapproving of government parasitism, but frankly... after moving to Wyoming I discovered that Boston was full of shit.  YOU CANNOT SURVIVE HERE WITHOUT TAKING PLUNDER MONEY FROM THE GOVERNMENT!  The mines and oil fields are union run and very politicized.  The rest... well, lets say if you don't work in those fields, you are a rancher or unemployed and your wife is working at one of the in town offices, probably a government one, since there are very few things such as utilities or newspapers that aren't run "by the family" or "by friends of the family."

There are good people, and there's guys like me who fell through the cracks and kept working elsewhere while living here.  Again, back to it, you can't just discredit someone's views.  I noticed mine have been changing after living here.  I still consider what they do THEFT.  However, I've realized I'm living in the land of the Thief God.  I no longer shun government employees.  I simply treat the worshipful ones as the shitheads they are.  The ones who see it as wrong but also don't want to starve, I see them as people who'd probably seek employment elsewhere IF THEY COULD GET IT... In Wyoming, no such luck.  Carry a gun as a young guy, and expect to be treated as a leper.  View government as crooks, expect to be treated as a leper.  Worship at the unholy altar of their GodVernment and they'll "rove you ronk time" as my now deceased buddy used to joke.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 08, 2017, 10:10:47 am
OK, having been here for two years, I can say, this is so much better than any other place I have lived.

It can get windy here, couple of days ago, we had a little breeze of 55mph with gusts to 75mph.

so what do we call this?  Tuesday.

the snow is light, so most of it blow into Nebraska after a few days.

summers are nice, with low humidity.

the big cities here are smaller than most cities, which I am enjoying.   
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 08, 2017, 10:17:12 am
the big cities here are smaller than most cities, which I am enjoying.

Heh... I love the shocked response when I tell folks in other places that this county has only one "city," and it has fewer than 2,000 regular  residents. Only about 5,000 people in the whole county.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: knobster on December 11, 2017, 07:46:30 am
the big cities here are smaller than most cities, which I am enjoying.

Heh... I love the shocked response when I tell folks in other places that this county has only one "city," and it has fewer than 2,000 regular  residents. Only about 5,000 people in the whole county.

Now THAT is elbow room!  Sigh...
Maybe when I retire and the kids are out of the house I will finally build the log cabin my SHW has been dreaming of.  If I build it in Wyoming then I might get her out there!
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 11, 2017, 08:09:57 am
the big cities here are smaller than most cities, which I am enjoying.

Heh... I love the shocked response when I tell folks in other places that this county has only one "city," and it has fewer than 2,000 regular  residents. Only about 5,000 people in the whole county.

Now THAT is elbow room!  Sigh...
Maybe when I retire and the kids are out of the house I will finally build the log cabin my SHW has been dreaming of.  If I build it in Wyoming then I might get her out there!

Plenty of land here still.

may want to think about getting the land now, and build on it as you can, with time, cash, etc.

so when you do give up the rat race, you will have a place mortgage free.

but that is just my .02  :twocents:
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 11, 2017, 08:11:15 am
Now THAT is elbow room!  Sigh...
Maybe when I retire and the kids are out of the house I will finally build the log cabin my SHW has been dreaming of.  If I build it in Wyoming then I might get her out there!

Lots and LOTS of room here. Quite a few 35+ acre places available too. Most have nothing on them. Some have no utilities either, so they are much less expensive than places closer to "civilization." If she's willing to live at least partially off the grid, you could make out like a bandit. :)

Here is a picture of the view out off my back deck...

Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 11, 2017, 08:28:01 am
And, BTW, if you want "trees" and running water, we've got that too... but it is more expensive. :)  Here is a place that's for sale... but it is very large.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: knobster on December 11, 2017, 11:22:05 am
Trees!!!  Running water... well, as long as I can have a well dug.  But yes, I will want trees.

Going off grid is a goal.  A large propane tank to heat water and run refrigeration items.  A/C in the summer is important in Iowa during the humid days but I hear Wyoming doesn't suffer as much of that.  Dare to dream...
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 11, 2017, 12:18:30 pm
  A/C in the summer is important in Iowa during the humid days but I hear Wyoming doesn't suffer as much of that.  Dare to dream...

I don't have any central heating, much less central "A/C" - I do have a small window A/C I bought the first year because it got pretty hot for a while in August, but I've only run it a few times since then. With box fans, I manage quite well in the summer. The humidity is so low that even temps in the low 100s are not much of a problem. But then, remember that I came from the desert of So. Cal. and never had A/C there at all. :)
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 11, 2017, 12:52:57 pm
High Humidity in Casper this last summer was about 45%, most times was around 10 to 25%
at 45% we got a little rain.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 11, 2017, 02:31:11 pm
High Humidity in Casper this last summer was about 45%, most times was around 10 to 25%
at 45% we got a little rain.

Here in the NE, the summer humidity ranges from 30 to 40% most of the time, with occasional dips. Winter is very dry. The humidity right now outside is 16% and has already been as low as 5% this year. It is hard to maintain a healthy humidity indoors in winter, especially if you use wood heat. But it can be done. I keep the humidity around 60% as much as possible in the upstairs bathroom where I have the orchids.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Bill St. Clair on December 12, 2017, 09:18:37 am
Wyoming winter = plenty of chapstick
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 12, 2017, 12:20:42 pm
do most Wyomingites know how to correctly handle a firearm?

in a short answer, YES

http://mycountry955.com/do-most-wyomingites-know-how-to-correctly-handle-a-firearm-poll-results/
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 12, 2017, 12:33:17 pm
That's very interesting. Of course, self reporting by any group of people is not usually accurate. I'd love to gather lots and lots of these folks and actually watch them handle their guns and shoot...

Almost anyone can benefit from some instruction. I've had people in my classes who had been "shooting all their lives" and yet had no idea of the safety rules. They didn't always know how to safely clean and maintain them either.

So such knowledge is relative.  But yeah, we've got guns! :)
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 12, 2017, 01:07:31 pm
everyone can learn something from someone, if they are open to learn.

no one knows everything about everything
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 12, 2017, 01:58:51 pm
everyone can learn something from someone, if they are open to learn.

no one knows everything about everything

You bet! But I'm always amazed at the people who think they have nothing to learn.

Had a 77 year old man in a class one time, wanting a CC "permit." He muzzled everyone constantly, would not take his finger off the trigger for more than a few minutes, and resented being told about it. Thank goodness I start with simulated guns. He insisted that, since the guns were fake, that there was no problem at all. I have no doubt, however, that he treated real guns the same. He'd been "shooting all his life," and saw no reason to change anything. He was the only person in ten years that I asked to leave the class. I'm hoping there are not too many like that around. My only consolation was that he'd not managed to kill anyone or himself in 77 years, and had to leave it at that.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 14, 2017, 07:22:44 pm

Going off grid is a goal.  A large propane tank to heat water and run refrigeration items.  A/C in the summer is important in Iowa during the humid days but I hear Wyoming doesn't suffer as much of that.  Dare to dream...

knobster,

 I certainly support anyone and everyone, going "off grid". I have been attempting to do so for forty some years. One thing I realized and wish to pass on to you and everyone is that being "off the electric grid" is one thing, which I enjoy but even though I have solar panels and not connected to any power company, I am still on a grid. The electrical components to my system (charge controller and inverter)  have failed twice now and the batteries are wearing out so I am still "on a grid" of sorts, mostly the UPS or Fedex grid for parts and supplies. I still cook in the summer on a propane stove, so I am still on the propane grid. Even when I use a chain saw, I am on the chain,  gas and oil "grid".

I firmly believe in learning to live in a primitive, 1920's lifestyle, AS A BASIC, and then moving up the scale when possible is important. If everything fails and it could, reverting to a crosscut saw and not relying on those items which are dependent upon "delivered" systems, could be the only thing which allows a family to survive. Modern conveniences are wonderful, when they work, but a working system not dependent upon outside delivery is the only long term method of continued survival I can envision.

Many families were happy and comfortable prior to the "delivered systems" and true happiness is not dependent upon them. A comfortable home, a secure water source that is available regardless of modern technology, growing and storing your own food is what makes life comfortable and worth living.

Having propane and solar electricity is wonderful, along with the other modern contrivances but not necessary to survival, comfort or happiness. They will certainly extend your ability to living a modern lifestyle in the short run if other things fail but not in a long period of distress. When you put in a well, make sure you can still access the water by hand. Use a chainsaw (I do) but have a good crosscut and accessories as a backup. Even better, teach your children how to survive and prosper, the "old fashioned way". Everything is like having a propane lighter, then matches but also know how to use a flint and steel. Same with every aspect of life.

You and your family are a wonderful example of self sufficiency and I have followed your adventures with great interest and pleasure. Just don't forget the "basics" which have worked since forever and don't assume that necessary "stuff" will always be available, through some delivery grid. Have a back up that works regardless.

May God continue to bless you all.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 15, 2017, 05:02:30 am
Living "off the grid" is really possible for only a few people, Tahn.  The young, as long as they have plenty of help have the best opportunity, if that's what they want. I am old, alone and disabled. I can't do any of those things myself, and there is nobody here to do them for me.

But I would not want to live that way. I see no reason to retreat to 18th century methods, except for a temporary emergency perhaps. I look to the future, and many MORE "modern conveniences" myself. I love running water and lights at the touch of a switch; my little car to take me to the grocery store, my computer to keep me in touch with friends and family.... I love my wood stove, but I am not always well enough to haul in the firewood and rely on the electric heat. I don't see that as a failure of any kind, just the way it is.

Our modern conveniences are not the problem. Even the "grid" wouldn't be a real problem. The problem is the controllers, the vampires who suck out the blood of us all. Let's get rid of the vampires, goons and controllers, not the progress humans have made. Each to his/her own, of course. As for me, I want to reach the stars. I want to have (real) science find a cure for cancer, and all of the other things that make life shorter and more miserable than it needs to be.

Let's not just curse the dark. Let's light a bonfire of individual liberty and justice.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 15, 2017, 06:19:43 am
Hey Than

being "off" the grid is more than that.
even back in the late 1800's, people would still go to town for things and food.

I see being off the grid as not being dependent on someone else for my living.

some people can not live like that, but that is ok.
How I want to live is up to me, and no one else.
So I will have my own well, have my own septic field.
have my own power source, but there will always be things I will need that I will have to go to town for.

remember, two is one, and one is none
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: knobster on December 15, 2017, 06:57:53 am
Appreciate your kind words Tahn!

Yes, my family and I will never be completely off grid.  With two family members dependent on insulin to make it through their daily lives, we very much need modern technology! 

I guess I should have stated that reducing my dependence on the 'system' is a goal.  Striving to 'shrug' more and more with each passing year.  You bring up good points though.  I have my Stihl chainsaw but I don't have a hefty crosscut saw.  If gas/oil runs out I'm stuck with my little 18" bow saw and an axe. 
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 15, 2017, 12:10:18 pm
I have my Stihl chainsaw but I don't have a hefty crosscut saw.  If gas/oil runs out I'm stuck with my little 18" bow saw and an axe. 


knobster, An axe and a small bow saw are better that what the majority of people have. A good one or two man cross cut saw is a real marvel of technology and IMHO, a necessary requirement if you heat with wood. Don't forget a proper file and a saw set.

I lived in a tipi up in the Colorados for a year, with only an axe but that worked because I was not cutting wood to a short length to fit into a stove. I could use "almost" any length of wood by just dragging it inside to the firepit and keep inching it forward as it burned. Worked.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 15, 2017, 12:24:45 pm
Hey Than

being "off" the grid is more than that.
even back in the late 1800's, people would still go to town for things and food.

Oh I agree FDD. Ever since the industrial revolution, people have traded for manufactured items they could not make. Even before that, people traded for food they could not grow themselves or useful crafts that others could make better or with less energy.


I see being off the grid as not being dependent on someone else for my living.


Good definition.




So I will have my own well, have my own septic field.
have my own power source, but there will always be things I will need that I will have to go to town for.



Just try and have access to your well water when/if your "power source" fails.



remember, two is one, and one is none

Yep, I "had" two charge controllers and inverters and it went quickly to none, after a lightening strike.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 15, 2017, 12:53:56 pm
Living "off the grid" is really possible for only a few people, Tahn.  The young, as long as they have plenty of help have the best opportunity, if that's what they want. I am old, alone and disabled. I can't do any of those things myself, and there is nobody here to do them for me.

I agree ML, not everyone can live that way and I am approaching the age where it will be more difficult, not that I am even close to being self sufficient. I do wish my family lived closer.


But I would not want to live that way. I see no reason to retreat to 18th century methods, except for a temporary emergency perhaps. I look to the future, and many MORE "modern conveniences" myself. I love running water and lights at the touch of a switch; my little car to take me to the grocery store, my computer to keep me in touch with friends and family.... I love my wood stove, but I am not always well enough to haul in the firewood and rely on the electric heat. I don't see that as a failure of any kind, just the way it is.



It's not a bad way to live ML, as long as you have food, shelter, water. I too, love my high tech stuff, especially the landline and internet. I also have running water, as long as I run to the well and hand pump it out  :laugh:  but I also have a bucket and rope if the hand pump fails. I know several people who actually prefer to live a simple 18th century lifestyle and enjoy it. Several Amish families around here also give it a valiant effort.



Our modern conveniences are not the problem. Even the "grid" wouldn't be a real problem. The problem is the controllers, the vampires who suck out the blood of us all. Let's get rid of the vampires, goons and controllers, not the progress humans have made. Each to his/her own, of course. As for me, I want to reach the stars. I want to have (real) science find a cure for cancer, and all of the other things that make life shorter and more miserable than it needs to be.

Let's not just curse the dark. Let's light a bonfire of individual liberty and justice.

I agree MamaLiberty on who the problem is and I hope I have done some small part to expose them. Not as much as you but I try.

Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: jamie on December 15, 2017, 01:34:35 pm
I have my Stihl chainsaw but I don't have a hefty crosscut saw.  If gas/oil runs out I'm stuck with my little 18" bow saw and an axe. 


knobster, An axe and a small bow saw are better that what the majority of people have. A good one or two man cross cut saw is a real marvel of technology and IMHO, a necessary requirement if you heat with wood. Don't forget a proper file and a saw set.

I lived in a tipi up in the Colorados for a year, with only an axe but that worked because I was not cutting wood to a short length to fit into a stove. I could use "almost" any length of wood by just dragging it inside to the firepit and keep inching it forward as it burned. Worked.

why don't you write a bit about your experience?  I'm sure most folks would be interested.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: knobster on December 15, 2017, 01:43:50 pm
I have my Stihl chainsaw but I don't have a hefty crosscut saw.  If gas/oil runs out I'm stuck with my little 18" bow saw and an axe. 


knobster, An axe and a small bow saw are better that what the majority of people have. A good one or two man cross cut saw is a real marvel of technology and IMHO, a necessary requirement if you heat with wood. Don't forget a proper file and a saw set.

I lived in a tipi up in the Colorados for a year, with only an axe but that worked because I was not cutting wood to a short length to fit into a stove. I could use "almost" any length of wood by just dragging it inside to the firepit and keep inching it forward as it burned. Worked.

Heh, just noticed that Jamie beat me to the request for more info.  I would love to hear about how you lived like this for a year!
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 15, 2017, 01:51:00 pm
not that I am even close to being self sufficient.

Why is that even a goal?  I mean, that's great for anyone who wants it, but I can't imagine wanting it.

Nobody can do everything or produce ALL of the things they need, let alone other things they want. Even the most primitive cultures traded and worked together.  Trade and the free flow of ideas, working toward a better life for oneself and family - the opposite of "self sufficient" in my book.

Quote
I agree MamaLiberty on who the problem is and I hope I have done some small part to expose them. Not as much as you but I try.

Thanks, but I don't think I've done much of anything except a lot of bitching. :) But I keep trying too.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 15, 2017, 02:24:15 pm
not that I am even close to being self sufficient.

Why is that even a goal?  I mean, that's great for anyone who wants it, but I can't imagine wanting it.



Self sufficiency is just another word for freedom. Lack of dependency upon others. The "State" is against it. They want everybody to be dependent upon them.

No ML, its not for everyone, neither is freedom but as I hoped to explain, it can be a good and rich life. Again, health, food, clothing, water, shelter and family is where it's at, not the neat stuff we have, although a lot of that neat stuff can be wonderful.

Jamie and Knobster,

Thanks for the encouragement.

 I have been working on my "autobiography" for a while now and my Daughter keeps pushing me, bless her heart. Maybe I can do that chapter before I work on the ones where I rode "shotgun" on a stagecoach and fought off "Indians" or was a wrangler for a six pony hitch, including being the "fireman" of a red, racing fire wagon, being pulled by 6 galloping steeds. Or being taught to drink beer by the wranglers for the Budweiser 8 horse hitch when I was 12. I have had some shinning times for sure. I will work on the tipi chapter. It started with being broke in Colorado and my gal and I living out of our 54 chevy wagon, when somebody loaned us a book.

 https://www.amazon.com/Indian-Tipi-Its-History-Construction/dp/0806122366
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 15, 2017, 02:42:19 pm
Self sufficiency is just another word for freedom.

Those words are not the same. Independence has nothing to do with whether or not people depend on each other... VOLUNTARILY. :)

Freedom is the power to choose for oneself. One can choose freedom in many different ways. Good luck with yours. I much prefer the voluntary association, working together for mutual goals and benefits... VOLUNTARILY. That's the difference between freedom and dependence on government - not if you can do everything for yourself.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 15, 2017, 03:14:25 pm
Self sufficiency is just another word for freedom.

Those words are not the same. Independence has nothing to do with whether or not people depend on each other... VOLUNTARILY. :)

Freedom is the power to choose for oneself. One can choose freedom in many different ways. Good luck with yours. I much prefer the voluntary association, working together for mutual goals and benefits... VOLUNTARILY. That's the difference between freedom and dependence on government - not if you can do everything for yourself.

ML, You know that I believe in voluntary trade and association but one can still be dependent upon someone you voluntarily trade with. Even absent government or coercion you can still be dependent. The only way to be totally free of dependence is to be self sufficient. Now, as I have explained, I am not there or even close to being there and doubt that I ever will be but if things go bad, the less dependent you are, the freer you are, IMHO. 

Especially with the basics of food, heat and water. Maybe it's like the difference of needing aspirin and not being allowed to obtain it, either through shortage or rationing and having the knowledge and ability to scrape off the inner bark of the red willow. Dependent on outside sources or being self sufficient to obtain your own. I am not suggesting that everyone need be totally self sufficient upon their own resources, as that is unlikely to happen, even for a small minority but not being dependent upon an electronic part to get your water or a manufactured chain saw part to obtain your firewood for warmth and cooking is a basic component of both, staying free and staying alive.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Tahn L. on December 15, 2017, 08:37:25 pm
  With two family members dependent on insulin to make it through their daily lives, we very much need modern technology! 

Knobster,

   I know absolutely nothing about such things but with a small greenhouse, you might be able to supplement , or in an emergency replace, your insulin requirements with this or other herbs.

 https://www.nutraingredients.com/Article/2005/02/14/Indian-herb-cuts-insulin-blood-sugar-levels

Again, I don’t know anything at all, except the pharmaceutical industry exists to make a profit and not necessarily to heal AND “God created all the plants bearing seeds and looked at them and said, “This is good”. (Genesis 1 – 11 &12)

Just saying.

Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 16, 2017, 04:48:24 am
   I know absolutely nothing about such things but with a small greenhouse, you might be able to supplement , or in an emergency replace, your insulin requirements with this or other herbs.

I wish, Tahn. Some forms of mild diabetes can be controlled by diet, but serious types can only be treated with insulin. Insulin, in its natural form is made from the pancreas of animals, usually pigs. It has been available in synthetic forms for many years now, but neither of those can be made in the kitchen.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: knobster on December 18, 2017, 11:47:13 am
   I know absolutely nothing about such things but with a small greenhouse, you might be able to supplement , or in an emergency replace, your insulin requirements with this or other herbs.

I wish, Tahn. Some forms of mild diabetes can be controlled by diet, but serious types can only be treated with insulin. Insulin, in its natural form is made from the pancreas of animals, usually pigs. It has been available in synthetic forms for many years now, but neither of those can't be made in the kitchen.

Unfortunately, ML is right.  Despite lots of research by yours truly I have yet to find a 'natural' method for managing type 1 diabetes.  Both wife and youngest daughter are dependent on insulin injections (or, in their case, insulin pumps).  That being said, we do take steps in cutting out unnecessary carbs (processed sugars) which would require more insulin so we can, if need be, stretch the current supply.  But at the end of the day, we are completely dependent on very modern technology.

Wow... this thread went sideways.

So, Wyoming.  I hear it's windy there...
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 18, 2017, 07:09:30 pm


So, Wyoming.  I hear it's windy there...

defined your meaning of windy?

5mph, 10mph, 20mph?

if looking for wind power, then Wyoming is a good place.
but is not for the faint hearted.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 19, 2017, 04:11:33 am
if looking for wind power, then Wyoming is a good place.
but is not for the faint hearted.

Wind power wouldn't work here. The wind is very fickle and sometimes we have none at all for days at a time. Then, there are times when it blows hard. Last week the wind knocked over most of my stacked firewood! LOL
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on December 19, 2017, 02:33:07 pm
if looking for wind power, then Wyoming is a good place.
but is not for the faint hearted.

Wind power wouldn't work here. The wind is very fickle and sometimes we have none at all for days at a time. Then, there are times when it blows hard. Last week the wind knocked over most of my stacked firewood! LOL

yea?, maybe because your to close to SD.

here in central Wyoming, it is always windy.
a clam day is a 5 mph wind, a typical day is about 25 mph, a hard wind is about 45 mph.
just got to learn how to deal with what you got.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: Bill St. Clair on December 22, 2017, 01:35:10 pm
(https://etwof.com/gab/Wyoming_Wind_Sock.jpg)
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on December 22, 2017, 02:12:55 pm
Love that one, Bill. 

Just got back in from a trip to the firewood pile. I've been snowed in, with a pile of ice on the deck that wouldn't allow me to open the storm door. Finally got it melted enough (pans of hot water carried around from the front door) to chip a track for the storm door, so went out to replenish my wood... burned the last chunk I had inside this morning. WHEW. Thank goodness I was bright enough to wrap my head good because I didn't even make it down the steps when the wind came up... and boy, oh boy, do I know now what "wind chill" means. I used to laugh at the idea... but no more.  It was a balmy 25 degrees when I went out, going to be much colder tomorrow. And more snow tonight. But I'm managing.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on March 14, 2018, 10:14:32 am
I know there are some county's with more people in them, but I like the fact that there are so few people here.

http://www.togetherweteach.com/TWTIC/uscityinfo/50wy/wypopr/50wypr.htm
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on March 14, 2018, 10:40:22 am
I know there are some county's with more people in them, but I like the fact that there are so few people here.

http://www.togetherweteach.com/TWTIC/uscityinfo/50wy/wypopr/50wypr.htm

(Source: U.S. Census Bureau, Census 2010)

Seriously needs an update. I don't think there are still 3500 people in Newcastle. Maybe 5,000 in all of Weston County.
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: FDD on March 14, 2018, 11:08:26 am
I know there are some county's with more people in them, but I like the fact that there are so few people here.

http://www.togetherweteach.com/TWTIC/uscityinfo/50wy/wypopr/50wypr.htm

(Source: U.S. Census Bureau, Census 2010)

Seriously needs an update. I don't think there are still 3500 people in Newcastle. Maybe 5,000 in all of Weston County.

they will do another one in 2020
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on March 14, 2018, 12:53:08 pm
they will do another one in 2020

Yeah, I know. Not that it is accurate, of course. A lot of us here tell the "census" people to go to hell.  :ph34r:
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: knobster on March 15, 2018, 07:50:49 am
they will do another one in 2020

Yeah, I know. Not that it is accurate, of course. A lot of us here tell the "census" people to go to hell.  :ph34r:

So the census folks count the number of voices coming from the house when such demands are yelled at them!   :laugh:
Title: Re: WYOMING: consider this...
Post by: MamaLiberty on March 16, 2018, 06:04:53 am
So the census folks count the number of voices coming from the house when such demands are yelled at them!   :laugh:

I'm not sure they are bright enough for that... :) The last census person I saw was too busy gawking at the gun on my hip to ask any questions. I answered the door and said hello... not sure she heard me either. She held out the paper and I said, "no thanks," and shut the door as she went back to her car. I'm sure it is a very frustrating job out here. :)