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Author Topic: Being left alone  (Read 5661 times)

JillPruett

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Being left alone
« on: June 23, 2004, 10:35:14 pm »

I got to thinking that the other side of what we have been discussing is being left alone by the State.  
« Last Edit: July 06, 2010, 09:55:51 pm by JillPruett »
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Jill Pruett


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BaRbArIaN

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Being left alone
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2004, 10:55:57 pm »

Always a good idea.  

Living in a police state is no doubt difficult.  We could profit from advice from people who have done so in the past and what they did to get around it the best they could.

I think to survive under the radar you need to misdirect them, by having a visible existence that is minimal enough to satisfy the statists that you pay minimal taxes on your minimal income and that minimal income is enough to support the lifestyle that shows up in the various databases available now to even the most minor bureaucrat with the strokes of a keyboard.   What you do in your off time can be stealth capitalism, communication, political activity and whatever you like to do that harms nobody else but would drag you into "the system" if it was above ground.  

Sad that this might have to come to pass in the USA.    Sadder still that there are no nations left that are any freer to expat it to if you had to.   We need a frontier but I'm afraid that even with the first private space flight we are still 50-100 years away from one any large number of people could use.
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unstructuredreality

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Being left alone
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2004, 11:08:11 pm »

Wow, that's a broad subject.  Extremely important though.  Perhaps posing a few questions would help at least me out. I'd be happy to go into a few of the subjects but would have to write a book to cover all of those bases.  Hmmm.

I'll start off with some general suggestions.  Never give your name, ssn (even the last four digits of it) to anyone.  Never receive mail at your real address.   If you have money, pay deposits and rent up front to avoid credit and backround checks.  Change your name from time to time by the "use method" every once and a while.  To make it impossible for the persuers to find you, it may cost some money but the rewards might pay that off with peace of mind.  Make it really expensive for people to find you.  Set yourself up so that you know exactly who is contacting you for any reason and when.  To go deep cover, remember all state transactions are marked and tracked, you must decide whether or not to venture into a paperless lifestyle.  Read and learn as much as you can about how the gov uses different databases.  Network with people here or elsewhere that will have your back if you are in need.  Talk with people about this issue as much as you can, perhaps you will find a group of people that will agree with you and act as a base.


Maybe this thread can grow, I'd certainly love to help in any way I can.

Peace and Good Day    
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rick

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Being left alone
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2004, 05:32:39 am »

Experiences from other tyrannies tel that you simply can't live a zero-profile life. No matter what you'll try you can'avoid or escape "them". Most damage though, will come either from stupidity or treason - by those people you think are on your side. Hunter is a good example for what can happen, I think I don't have to go into details. To fight is good, but accept that you all will have to take damage, even severe damage sometimes. Freedom is not free, the price we'll have to pay will often be demanded in blood - our blood as well.
Did it ever occur to you that an armed revolt mostly results into another tyranny? Those tyrannies who fell because people withdrew support and let it collapse under its own stupidity were replaced by systems of greater freedom...
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rick

I bear no hate against a living thing I just love my freedom all above the King

goingpostal

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Being left alone
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2004, 06:25:20 am »

Quote
Experiences from other tyrannies tel that you simply can't live a zero-profile life.


Read, or re-read "We The Living." No matter how small you try to be, in a slave society you can become the object state interest. Random IRS audtis, random Terry stops, undercover goons looking for the latest person of interest (right now the'yre "terrorists'),
and the more you try to have just a little privacy, the more of interest you become.

A few years ago I was working temporarily several hundred miles away from home. So I went into a rural post office to set up temp mail delivery. They had hired some woman recently arrived from what had been East Germany. She "vanted to know just VWHY do you vant mail delivered here?" At the time it was funny. Not now. Just one major terrorist incident and our country is turning into a police state.

And I think people are beginning to realize this. Probably why Bush and his bunch will be booted from office this fall.

Frank
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Bear

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Being left alone
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2004, 10:27:35 am »

I don't think the goal here is to be invisible. The goal is not to be bothered by the State.

If you succeeded in having no records, no trace at all, and were stopped for some reason and they ran a
background check on you, the lack of records could be a red flag in itself. I think it would be wiser to have
just enough information on you so that you are of no interest to the State, but not so much information that
it prompts other questions.

Whatever steps you take to protect your privacy, there ought to be a plausible explanation other than just
wanting to protect your privacy, as a desire for privacy itself is being painted as suspicious.

Bear
 
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Scarmiglione'

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Being left alone
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2004, 11:13:03 am »

I have been using the credible explanation of "identity theft" to justify my privacy efforts.  It is a buzzword for the contact points and if you say "I don't want to be a victim of identity theft again" you can justify your requests/refusals.  So far it has worked wonders for me.

It's a climate of fear.  We can use that to justify our fearless actions.  :D
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Elias Alias

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Being left alone
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2004, 12:53:49 pm »

Quote
I have been using the credible explanation of "identity theft" to justify my privacy efforts.  It is a buzzword for the contact points and if you say "I don't want to be a victim of identity theft again" you can justify your requests/refusals.  So far it has worked wonders for me.

It's a climate of fear.  We can use that to justify our fearless actions.  :D
Very good angle there, Scarmig. It should be a good and acceptable "excuse" for withholding one's social security number in industry queries of all sorts, from having a baby in a state-sanctioned hospital to purchasing a telephone line connection, to whatever else today's marketplace requires of one's social security number,  for quite some time.

Here is a corporate presentation on identity theft:

http://wserver0.prepaidlegal.com/Multisite...assoc=djoenaedi

PrePaid Legal last year merged in some ways with a real ball-buster company, Kroll International. Now PrePaid Legal offers, in addition to their customary legal-services insurance policy, a rider policy from Kroll for protection against identity theft. Less than thirty bucks a month gives a consumer both policies.

According to both Kroll and PrePaid Legal, the most costly crime in America right now is "identity theft". Everyone in law enforcement, at whatever level, understands a citizen's fear of identity theft, which has much to do with your ingenious approach to using the crime's rampant presence in today's "system" as a viable excuse or reason to NOT give one's social security number to corporate entities such as phone companies and etc.

I learned last year that PrePaid Legal, in their home offices in Oklahoma, began the removal of their customers' social security numbers from the company's primary or most-available intra-company records systems, regressing them to lower levels of company record-keeping systems in order to further protect customers from vulnerability to identity theft.  I am expecting to see many across-the-board corporations initiate the same sort of response, i.e., using alternate means of identifying their customer base in a massive effort by corporate Amerika to stop the bleeding. Heck, the "wrong" crooks are becoming too active in this crimewave of identity theft, thanks largely to corporate Amerika's habit of illegally using Social Security numbers  identify their customers. LOL!

However, lest anyone reading here think I'm suggesting PrePaid Legal's and Kroll's monthly pay plan for protection from a problem created in the first place by corporate-government collusion, just remember that Kroll also works for CIA and numerous other government and military clients.

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/stori...29/daily25.html

From here, we note Kroll's romance with the U.S. legal system:

http://www.krollworldwide.com/news/release...sp?reqid=494021

That article (Feb 11, 2004) begins thusly:

"Kroll Retained By Administrative Office of The United States Courts to Conduct Substance Abuse Screening of Federal Offenders".

In another article, we read:

"Kroll is charged with reviewing Pennsylvania State Police policies and practices against best practices and standards across the United States. Kroll currently serves as the Independent Monitor of the City of Los Angeles Police Department, and earlier this summer, the U.S. Department of Justice and the City of Detroit selected Kroll to serve as the independent federal monitor responsible for overseeing reforms at the Detroit Police Department."

And as I noted, Kroll works closely with CIA.  It probably, (but I cannot "prove" this), interfaces with Booz-Allen, who is currently militarizing the New York City police department for CIA. Sitting on the board at Booz-Allen is none other than James Woolsey, former DCI of CIA. Don't *even* ask me how I came by this info.....   :ph34r:

Of course there's much more, but all I intended to do here was confirm your tactic as being supreme in methods of protecting your privacy. Salute, Bro!

But let us beware, as this sort of corporatized problemo is bound to drive the powers that be to mandate bio-metric ID techniques and/or implanted chips. Still, at the moment, identity theft is a mighty fine reason to withhold one's SSN in business contracts.

Elias
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Tim Osman

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Being left alone
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2004, 02:00:15 pm »

Quote
I have been using the credible explanation of "identity theft" to justify my privacy efforts.  It is a buzzword for the contact points and if you say "I don't want to be a victim of identity theft again" you can justify your requests/refusals.
Absolutely brilliant.   Now THAT is why I read boards like this - practical, realistic actions we can take right now to increase our freedom and retain our privacy.   I'm actually kicking myself because I never thought of it.

Thanks a lot!
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unstructuredreality

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Being left alone
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2004, 02:22:27 pm »

"identity theft" is the best explanation you can give.  Everyone seems to know about it over the past few years and seems to understand better than even the stalker/ex-spouse explanation, quite possibly if you are a woman, that can be of some value too.  Even government agencies seem sympathetic to it in my experiences.  I've managed to rent a couple of apartments using ID theft, bypassing backround checks and the ssn because the managers felt my pain.

Good point about not disappearing completely as indeed it will flag you.  Nothing wrong with some a trail of breadcrumbs that might lead somewhere where you are not. though.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2004, 02:25:04 pm by unstructuredreality »
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EconGeek

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Being left alone
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2004, 07:34:33 pm »



I think its relatively easy to make your financial transactions harder to trace... just use cash.  And when you can't use cash, there are lots of cash equivilent debit cards.  For instance, my local mall has gift cards with the visa logo.  Costs $1.50 to buy the card, and it can store up to $500.  No identifying information necessary, you pay cash, you use the card where you like.  Paypal also has a debit card, allowing you to get online cash from local atms.  Paypal wants a street address, but you can use one of the mall's cards with the correct street address to verify a street address, then get the paypal card, and then deplete the mall card.... course then you have to move.

Another thing, if you're concerned about inflation you can keep your savings in gold or silver.  Every town has a rare coin dealer who will redeem your bullion for you at the spot price minus a couple percent.  There's risk there, so look into it further before counting on metal values, of course...

The hard thing is driving.  A drivers license is the core piece of ID that they saddle you with, and to get one, you have to pretty much prove your id.  It would be kinda hard to have an alias put on your DL, when your birth certificate says differently.... and now they require a SSN to get a DL.   Passports used to be good too, cause they just wanted a Birth Certificate, but now apparently they are making these biometric or something.  (Which reminds me, I should lose mine and get a new one before the new standards go into effect, buying a little time with an old style passport.)

You know we're kinda like the iron curtain now... you can't fly without a passport, and if your passport is flagged, they will keep you in the country. You can't drive across the border to effectively either without ID, or at least without risk.  I guess you could go to canada and then fly to a freer country if you wanted.

But we effectively have an exit-visa system like the USSR... its just that you don't have to apply for permission before hand, they just check at the time you try to depart.

 
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