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[StillaGhost]

Silver and gold DOES have a purpose, but only in a rebuilding phase. Barter doesn't always work. There IS a use for money, but not until the dust settles.
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   Sure , problem is the period of time before that " rebuilding phase " will be reached , you could be waiting many decades ( or longer ) prior to reaching said phase.  During that waiting period a hundred lbs of seed corn will stand you in much better stead than a hundred lbs of gold.

[DiabloLoco]

   Sure , problem is the period of time before that " rebuilding phase " will be reached , you could be waiting many decades ( or longer ) prior to reaching said phase.  During that waiting period a hundred lbs of seed corn will stand you in much better stead than a hundred lbs of gold.

Agreed, but once you have yourself set up to be fairly self sustained and have a few marketable skills that will be needed during the worst of it, putting extra income into silver and gold makes a lot of sense. I call my "collection" my "back-up 401k". Heck! I'd bet that if you had some skills with working with silver, there would be a market for silver spoons and such during the worst of it! Medicine and refrigeration will be scarce, and eating with silver utensils would at least limit the amount of bacteria that you are putting into your body. Gold on the other hand is about worthless. I personally, only buy gold in 1/10 oz. coins, and not many of them. 

[StillaGhost]

   Sure , problem is the period of time before that " rebuilding phase " will be reached , you could be waiting many decades ( or longer ) prior to reaching said phase.  During that waiting period a hundred lbs of seed corn will stand you in much better stead than a hundred lbs of gold.

Agreed, but once you have yourself set up to be fairly self sustained and have a few marketable skills that will be needed during the worst of it, putting extra income into silver and gold makes a lot of sense. I call my "collection" my "back-up 401k". Heck! I'd bet that if you had some skills with working with silver, there would be a market for silver spoons and such during the worst of it! Medicine and refrigeration will be scarce, and eating with silver utensils would at least limit the amount of bacteria that you are putting into your body. Gold on the other hand is about worthless. I personally, only buy gold in 1/10 oz. coins, and not many of them.

 
 
    Agreed that silver is much more useful than gold , that said personally I would rather have workable metals , lead , linotype , antimony , copper , iron , steel etc. With a casting setup and/or a forge you could do a lot of things that folks would be willing to trade all sorts of other things for , including silver.
 
   Gold pretty much useless from the standpoint of doing anything other than jewelry with , and I'd hazard the guess that jewelry will be a low priority item after a crash.
 
   Frankly items such as medical supplies and ammunition could well become the " new gold".

[knobster]

   Frankly items such as medical supplies and ammunition could well become the " new gold".

+1

The little ol' 22lr round could soon become the most sought-after item.  Heck, it's pretty rare right now during 'normal' times.

[Rarick]

I have some neat simple forge patterns for air compression, which would also take steam heat............combined with wind and solar you now have a means of generating electricity several ways.......  I'll store the jewelry traded for that for later.   Now I just need to figure out a workable solar furnace to melt stuff in.........


Oh silver! yes.....um damn.......I guess I need to figure out silverware molds?  either that or ingot molds for the silverware taken in trade?

[DiabloLoco]

I have some neat simple forge patterns for air compression, which would also take steam heat............combined with wind and solar you now have a means of generating electricity several ways.......  I'll store the jewelry traded for that for later.   Now I just need to figure out a workable solar furnace to melt stuff in.........


Oh silver! yes.....um damn.......I guess I need to figure out silverware molds?  either that or ingot molds for the silverware taken in trade?

I think I remember reading somewhere that the screen from the old tube tv's can REALLY concentrate sunlight to create massive heat. I could be wrong about that though. I seem to be suffering from CRS lately.

[StillaGhost]

I have some neat simple forge patterns for air compression, which would also take steam heat............combined with wind and solar you now have a means of generating electricity several ways.......  I'll store the jewelry traded for that for later.   Now I just need to figure out a workable solar furnace to melt stuff in.........


Oh silver! yes.....um damn.......I guess I need to figure out silverware molds?  either that or ingot molds for the silverware taken in trade?

 
   Discussion of rocket forges perhaps? The ingot mold should be relatively easy. Wonder if sandcasting would work for silverware.

[StillaGhost]

 
 
   Could be this simple...........
 
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71s6HpuG_hQ

[Rarick]

Probably more of a plaster/lost wax technique for the silverware, less loss of silver in the finishing process.  A simple sand cast of ingots would be fine.

StAGh-  I was actually thinking of a 10 gauge fire bowl barbeque that sportsman's guide used to sell (no signs of it now).  I bought 2 with grillin' and smithin' in mind  One would probably go in the workshop and some refractory cement I picked up after a certain chimney was finished would be used to build up a forge furnace that could also be used for Crucible work......... I have enough sections of triple wall chimbly pipe to provide for inhale and exhale circulation too.  I have been acquiring a lot of construction scrap over the years that adds up to quite a pile of flexibility.....

[StillaGhost]

Probably more of a plaster/lost wax technique for the silverware, less loss of silver in the finishing process.  A simple sand cast of ingots would be fine.

 
   I would tend to agree , of course during the finishing process you'd save the scrap , dust etc. for resmelt -remelt.
 
   Jewelry gold i.e. 14k and the like can be smelted with a hot plate and nitric , the gold will end up as "curds" that can then be melted down into ingots whatever , the solution gets saved and you then suspend a copper plate in it and the silver in the alloy will precipitate on the copper and can be saved for melt.
 
  14k is only 58 and one half percent actual gold.
 
    On another note , have you ever saved used mower blades , leaf springs and the like and forged and finished 'em for knives and tools? One can make a pretty fair Parang or Bolo machete out of a used mower blade.

[Rarick]

Yeah, jewelry stuff.  Something me or a kid is going to learn as part of developing "Finework" skills.....  I have the book, someone will have to experiment from there.......  Damn on the shelf at the gulch, can't look up the title.

[rbryant]

Silver does have a couple of properties that are "magical" to me.  The first is that the government can't create it willy nilly from thin air as they do dollars.  The second is that, unlike pork bellies, it doesn't lose its value with passage of time.

The "price of gas" is important (to me, at least) because it give a person a some rough sense of the value they can expect to derive from their silver when the value of the dollar begins to plummet.

 
    If it's " magical " then you're living in a fantasyland. If what we all expect to come eventually happens you wouldn't get a gallon of gas , a lb of beans or rice or a box of ammunition from me with useless precious metals.
 
  Bring me lead I can cast with , trade goods I can barter further , food , medical supplies , ammunition , tools etc...........then we'll have a trade........silver or gold?
 
  NOPE.

Silver and gold DOES have a purpose, but only in a rebuilding phase. Barter doesn't always work. There IS a use for money, but not until the dust settles.

I agree here, and also believe that gold and silver will be useful if the social decline is not precipitous.  If we go into "Wiemar Republic" mode then I'll be paying off my mortgage with the little bit I've accumulated.  I would prefer to be defending a home that I own free and clear than to get evicted (e.g. "Great Depression") and defending myself from the road.

But I certainly don't advocate acquiring metals as a first step on the road to preparedness.

[DiabloLoco]

Silver does have a couple of properties that are "magical" to me.  The first is that the government can't create it willy nilly from thin air as they do dollars.  The second is that, unlike pork bellies, it doesn't lose its value with passage of time.

The "price of gas" is important (to me, at least) because it give a person a some rough sense of the value they can expect to derive from their silver when the value of the dollar begins to plummet.

 
    If it's " magical " then you're living in a fantasyland. If what we all expect to come eventually happens you wouldn't get a gallon of gas , a lb of beans or rice or a box of ammunition from me with useless precious metals.
 
  Bring me lead I can cast with , trade goods I can barter further , food , medical supplies , ammunition , tools etc...........then we'll have a trade........silver or gold?
 
  NOPE.

Silver and gold DOES have a purpose, but only in a rebuilding phase. Barter doesn't always work. There IS a use for money, but not until the dust settles.

I agree here, and also believe that gold and silver will be useful if the social decline is not precipitous.  If we go into "Wiemar Republic" mode then I'll be paying off my mortgage with the little bit I've accumulated.  I would prefer to be defending a home that I own free and clear than to get evicted (e.g. "Great Depression") and defending myself from the road.

But I certainly don't advocate acquiring metals as a first step on the road to preparedness.

It's actually the last step.