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[DiabloLoco]

You have no idea!!!

Sure I do. I have a few uber religious people in my family. At least you are open minded enough to hang out here. My religious relatives......No way. They worship the government (Republicans of course) just as much as they worship "god". 

[Shanks Mare]

In some areas, you must draw a line in the sand....but there are so many others where many Christians get it wrong. We become Pharisees....we see our own righteousness, and miss the beam in our eyes.

The trick is to not be religious, to follow God. He gave us a guide book!

I don't believe I've met anyone on this site that is beyond saving, that including myself. 

There is still hope!

[StillaGhost]

In some areas, you must draw a line in the sand....but there are so many others where many Christians get it wrong. We become Pharisees....we see our own righteousness, and miss the beam in our eyes.

The trick is to not be religious, to follow God. He gave us a guide book!

I don't believe I've met anyone on this site that is beyond saving, that including myself. 

There is still hope!

 
   Frankly , some of us don't care to be " saved ". Lets refer back to a statement you made , though it might well have been tongue in cheek.
 
    " I believe in The One True God."
 
   Whilst it may well have been in jest such a statement highlights what the problems with humanitie's applicatory models of religion hinge upon.
 
  Just about *every* system has their " One True God" model , many are quite willing to abuse and/or eliminate other human beings to teach 'em all about their " One True God"...........

[Shanks Mare]

Truly the One True God will make Himself know if but asked.

If you have no desire, then don't ask. If a debate is what you are after, then ask.

There are no better people to "prep" with, than True Christians. And those are easily seen, by their Works.

Be Well. 

[mothercirce]

Mother Circe ask, but what about all those buddhist preppers ? 500 million buddhist on this orbiting mass, certainly some would make great flesh humans to prep with !

[DiabloLoco]

Truly the One True God will make Himself know if but asked.

If you have no desire, then don't ask. If a debate is what you are after, then ask.

Be careful what you wish for. SAG is a seasoned debater...... with a mean streak. I promised myself that I would not debate religion anymore, but there are quite a few members here that would argue their stance against you, with zero logical fallacies. Many of them (myself included), know more about Christianity, than 95% of the people that say that they are Christians. If you care to look, past debates are easily found. My advice to you is to just let it go. Your efforts would be wasted. You won't be "saving" anyone here. Sorry to sound so callous, but I'm just trying to preempt you of the inevitable outcome of such a debate.

[mothercirce]

Truly the One True God will make Himself know if but asked.

If you have no desire, then don't ask. If a debate is what you are after, then ask.

Be careful what you wish for. SAG is a seasoned debater...... with a mean streak. I promised myself that I would not debate religion anymore, but there are quite a few members here that would argue their stance against you, with zero logical fallacies. Many of them (myself included), know more about Christianity, than 95% of the people that say that they are Christians. If you care to look, past debates are easily found. My advice to you is to just let it go. Your efforts would be wasted. You won't be "saving" anyone here. Sorry to sound so callous, but I'm just trying to preempt you of the inevitable outcome of such a debate.

Mother Circe says that the son jesus is actually the "sun". Every year the son/sun dies during the winter solstice, oh, around christmas time, where after a lull in the sun/sons movement, the son/sun is resurrected and starts to rise further into the sky with each passing day, bringing the promise of warmer days and LIFE ! Mother Circe loves the son/sun ! Mother Circe finds the symbol of the cross to actually be a symbol of the zodiac calendar. Mother Circe also thought that wearing symbols of the son/sun was a no-no according to the teachings of some of the bibles. Remember, there are so many versions and conflicting words, it can be hard for an old island nymph to keep it all straight. Mother Circe is on a BOAT...in the Aegean sea.

Jesus the sun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXxBpel9iMw

[Shanks Mare]

Truly the One True God will make Himself know if but asked.

If you have no desire, then don't ask. If a debate is what you are after, then ask.

Be careful what you wish for. SAG is a seasoned debater...... with a mean streak. I promised myself that I would not debate religion anymore, but there are quite a few members here that would argue their stance against you, with zero logical fallacies. Many of them (myself included), know more about Christianity, than 95% of the people that say that they are Christians. If you care to look, past debates are easily found. My advice to you is to just let it go. Your efforts would be wasted. You won't be "saving" anyone here. Sorry to sound so callous, but I'm just trying to preempt you of the inevitable outcome of such a debate.

No Worries! And Thanks!   No need for debating for the sake of debate, I've been there quite a few times, of course as has anyone that believes in, and tries to follow Christ. I can fairly well cut to the "chase", and know if I'm wasting my time.

The reason I believe to only prep with a Christian, if interested, is the moral background. No drugs, no alcohol abuse, non-homosexual, etc. Like you guys, I've lived on this earth a long time now....and lived in some of the ghettos of some very large cities as a kid. Seen a lot that I didn't like, and some things I don't want to expose my family to. Definitely not my children.

Does that make sense?

[Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind.]

The reason I believe to only prep with a Christian, if interested, is the moral background. No drugs, no alcohol abuse, non-homosexual, etc. Like you guys, I've lived on this earth a long time now....and lived in some of the ghettos of some very large cities as a kid. Seen a lot that I didn't like, and some things I don't want to expose my family to. Definitely not my children.

Does that make sense?

Yes and no.  I find that if one teaches one's kids properly, one's kids will not be so easily influenced by evil.  And The Man once made a very big deal of calling hypocrites those folks who make a big show of their public and group prayers... I wonder how many churches and believers today he'd take to disliking, somethin' fierce?  Maybe even grab a whip and kick some ass, upturn some tables?

Seen plenty of cliquish evil behavior from "super" christians...  Not the kind of charitable "good samaritan" behavior one expects from those borrowing the word "christ" to attach to themselves as a descriptor.  So just saying, you might be bible thumping, but thumping a bible isn't a requirement for being a good, moral, or Christian man.  Abiding by the lessons The Man taught... well... you know... that might be a better start.  Actually learning those lessons in context helps immensely.  Average American living in a non pastoral society is more akin to a Pharisee than anyone who followed The Man in the day.


And DL, don't feel bad about backing down as politely as you did.  I'm trying to figure out if I want to go to Colorado and stash my guns, or stay here and clean house, become a preacher, and probably get crucified for teaching the actual word, rather than the milquetoast, lukewarm Caesar worshiping bilge that passes for the good stuff.

[DiabloLoco]

And DL, don't feel bad about backing down as politely as you did.

Why would I feel bad? I am upholding a promise that I made to myself a year or so ago. If I can't hold promises to myself, what does that say for my integrity, or my ability to hold promises for others? My integrity is my most valuable resource. Honor as well. I take it very seriously. I will not be compromised. The earlier posts with Shanks Mare and I, were just good humored ribbing. Not a serious religious debate.

[Adventurer, Explorer, Inquiring Mind.]

And DL, don't feel bad about backing down as politely as you did.

Why would I feel bad? I am upholding a promise that I made to myself a year or so ago. If I can't hold promises to myself, what does that say for my integrity, or my ability to hold promises for others? My integrity is my most valuable resource. Honor as well. I take it very seriously. I will not be compromised. The earlier posts with Shanks Mare and I, were just good humored ribbing. Not a serious religious debate.

Hah.  yeah... you get to a certain point, and integrity's all you've got, too.

[StillaGhost]

Truly the One True God will make Himself know if but asked.

If you have no desire, then don't ask. If a debate is what you are after, then ask.

There are no better people to "prep" with, than True Christians. And those are easily seen, by their Works.

Be Well.

 
 
   Ah yes , the old approach of " if you don't care don't ask" , which of course falls for nought with me.
 
   I'll damned well ASK if I choose to do so , likewise I'll make any damn open statement as regards religion , including Christianity , that I damn well please to make.
 
  And ya might as well ashcan the elementary " true Christians " approach with *me* , I originally came from " true Christianity" and have found over a life time that folks who utilise such arbitrary labels and make such claims are in general about the most hypocritical , judgemental , divisive and exclusionary of all segments of humanity.
 
  " You don't see it my way so you're not in our club." is nothing more than an applied control tactic oriented towards abrogating the " Free Will " that " God" allegedly gave to each and every human being.
 
  Furthermore I can point out " works " by " true christians" over quite a span of mankinds history that " Christians" in general are quite unwilling to step forward and OWN , the excuse being quite frequently " those weren't TRUE christians ". Same old song and dance. Same snake oil.....different vendor.

[StillaGhost]

No Worries! And Thanks!   No need for debating for the sake of debate, I've been there quite a few times, of course as has anyone that believes in, and tries to follow Christ. I can fairly well cut to the "chase", and know if I'm wasting my time.

The reason I believe to only prep with a Christian, if interested, is the moral background."********* No drugs, no alcohol abuse, non-homosexual, etc**********. Like you guys, I've lived on this earth a long time now....and lived in some of the ghettos of some very large cities as a kid. Seen a lot that I didn't like, and some things I don't want to expose my family to. Definitely not my children.

Does that make sense?

 
 
   Really ( see highlighted)? Want me to fill several pages with examples of " Christian Stalwarts" , who couldn't get their noses off the mirror , who beat their wives , who had extramaritial affairs , who had dalliances with the same sex , who lied , cheated , embezzled....who stole from others on a mass scale........
 
 
   But hey they weren't " true Christians ".......were they?  We'd nought be arriving at this juncture had you not made it quite clear how little respect and how much disdain you hold for folks that aren't " christian "........in that respect you're exactly as are the Islamics who hold all non Islamics in disdain as lesser creatures.

[MamaLiberty]

" You don't see it my way so you're not in our club."

That's called voluntary association. And the right NOT to associate. Why would you want to be in their club if you didn't agree with their way? Form your own club.

The problem isn't freedom of association, but various attempts to force association - isn't it?

[StillaGhost]

" You don't see it my way so you're not in our club."

That's called voluntary association. And the right NOT to associate. Why would you want to be in their club if you didn't agree with their way? Form your own club.

The problem isn't freedom of association, but various attempts to force association - isn't it?

 
    That's quite correct ,and the myriad and sundry attempts you refer to are passively  aggressive acts geared towards control of the individual , dependent on how far they are taken they can be highly sociopathic , inherently segregational based on thin criteria , extremely hypocritical and out and out *dangerous*.
 
  The ever present " us versus them" mentality espoused by the vast majority of religions on any stripe or doctrinal stance promotes a smugly self superior attitude along with a " y'all are lesser beings" stance that promotes conflict.
 
   A small demonstration of that syndrome has transpired within this thread. Of course Christians ( and other Systems) have the absolute right to worship as they believe , others have the right to be free of such beliefs and not be penalised economically , socially etc..etc......simply for not espousing belief in a given system.
 
   While I appreciate your attempt here M.L. ( yes I actually do) it's nowhere near as simplistic as " form your own club" when the applied model is " no club but ours" in many cases , some of which have been discussed at length previously in this forum.
 
   Man persecuting other Man for the sole reason of worshiping the wrong version of " God" or no version at all of same is about the STUPIDEST freaking reason the socalled " human race " ever came up with as justification for it's abusive , genocidal , territorial tendencies.