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[da gooch]

quote HWG

"Gooch: The Mosin manual I downloaded said it included "Carbines".

Does that cover the M44?"

I am thinking that it does Hwg.

These are the second chapter headings from it:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 II.   DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MODELS

                 Rifle M1891
                 Dragoon rifle M1891   
                 Carbine M1910
                 Rifle M1891/30
                 Sniper rifle M1891/30
                 Carbine M1938
===>>>   Carbine M1944    <<<<====
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I haven't read it yet but I am hopeful that it is the manual for my M44.
I think it is.

I was going to get the M1 Carbine manual BUT it is 18 MB's and it is too late for that now.
Tomorrow maybe.


SO ...

Just what was it that the sabbie got to the bottom of I wonder ?

Clip:

He was and no problem, just helping and he did. I used the search function and tried "gun", "Manual", "Mosin", "mauser" and got zip. Leave it to a sabbie to get to the bottom of it.

I used Steve's pages for some time and was sorry to see him shut down/turn off. I am very glad to see him back.

 Â   

[Hollywoodgold]

quote HWG

"Gooch: The Mosin manual I downloaded said it included "Carbines".

Does that cover the M44?"

I am thinking that it does Hwg.

These are the second chapter headings from it:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 II.   DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MODELS

                 Rifle M1891
                 Dragoon rifle M1891   
                 Carbine M1910
                 Rifle M1891/30
                 Sniper rifle M1891/30
                 Carbine M1938
===>>>   Carbine M1944    <<<<====
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I haven't read it yet but I am hopeful that it is the manual for my M44.
I think it is.

I was going to get the M1 Carbine manual BUT it is 18 MB's and it is too late for that now.
Tomorrow maybe.


SO ...

Just what was it that the sabbie got to the bottom of I wonder ?

Clip:

He was and no problem, just helping and he did. I used the search function and tried "gun", "Manual", "Mosin", "mauser" and got zip. Leave it to a sabbie to get to the bottom of it.

I used Steve's pages for some time and was sorry to see him shut down/turn off. I am very glad to see him back.

 Â   

Gooch:

I couldn't find the corrosive discussion so I'll post a response here. It is from my research library. By the way, my 54R supplier swears by spraying the works with windex at the range then a normal clean when return to base. He has shot thousands of corrosive.

Years ago I called and spoke with a chemist at the company that supplies Ace Hardware brand Janitor Strength Ammonia. It is a 10% solution, nominally. He told me that they often add small amounts of ammonia to steel drums filled with water to prevent rusting in the drum. But that was a tiny amount, and probably just enough to bias the pH slightly above 7.

The 10% solution is right on the borderline for etching steel. Back about 1990, I had a .308 Redding FL sizing die I'd got a case stuck in and that the head tore out of when I tried using an extractor. I set it in the 10% ammonia solution in a glass jar to eat out the brass. It took about three months. After that time, the surface of the die looked gray. It was clearly micro-etched and activated, as it rapidly formed surface rust. I needed to polish it lightly, but it worked fine. There was not enough etching to change its dimensions measurably, even after three months.

I also spoke with the maker of Butch's Bore Shine a few years back. It's ammonia is not as concentrated as Sweet's, but it is still pretty strong. He told me they had put a bar of 4140 steel into a jar of Bore Shine for six months and inspected it for surface etching under a microscope afterward and found none. So it is either safely below the etching threshold, or its additives control it better. It is a good copper cleaner that I can recommend if an ammonia cleaner is how you want to go. I used it for a number of years with no problems. I have pretty much switched, now, to the Boretech Elimenator for metal fouling simply because it works faster and leaves a corrosion inhibitor behind when it dries, so, even though it is water base, you can leave it in a bore. I also use Gunzilla wherever carbon is the main problem, such as in shotguns or in detail cleaning. It is vegetable oil based. It is also one of the few cleaners I've ever seen actually soften carbon cake over night, such as you see on a Garand op-rod. Neither product is toxic nor do they leech oil out of your skin. Gunzilla leaves a thin, dry lubricating varnish-like surface behind. The military has apparently adopted it enthusiastically because that feature reduces malfunctions.

Sweet's, on the other hand, is what I had been using until I found surface rust in my M1A barrel one day, also in the early 90's. I don't know if that is because I'd failed to follow up with my usual patch of LPS-2 (Birchwood-Casey sheath is the same thing) or what? Some error of mine was clearly involved, as that was not normally a problem. So, Sweet's may be a tad too strong if it isn't removed. I also experimented with a lot of cleaners back then, so it is possible I mixed a couple by using one then the other in the bore when I should not have. I didn't keep records of that, and was kicking myself afterward when I tried to figure out what had happened? So, I can't blame Sweet's with any certainty.

You can take PDGXS's suggestion to follow up ammonia with a patch wet with hydrogen peroxide solution. That will drive off any remaining ammonia as gas, but it also supplies oxygen which will promote oxidation if there has been any surface etching. I think a better way to insure all the ammonia is gone is to use the black powder shooter's method of pouring boiling water down the bore to drive the stuff out. After that, flood it with WD-40 (Water Displacing formula number 40) to remove the water. Then remove the WD-40 with a couple of dry patches and finish with a patch wet with gun oil or the storage lube of your choice. WD-40 gets a bit tacky and attracts dust if you leave it on something.

If you discover you've got a bore that rusts easily, use Flitz on a patch or use JB bore compound or Remington Bore Cleaner or Iosso Bore Cleaner, or any of the slightly abrasive cleaners to polish it lightly. That will clear off the activated surface.
__________________
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Patron Member

[Mad Wet Hen]

Well the site is back up I just visited it but am going to wait to download until I can pay something.

[Dealsmaker]

I am looking for some good manuals for sniper training and what you would say is a the best read to learn basic sniper tactics.  I am going to attend Front Sights percission rifle class in November.

[ken1944]

great site i will check it out closer

[scorpio]

Sent in a manual today. Seams like the site is still going strong.

[da gooch]

quote HWG

"Gooch: The Mosin manual I downloaded said it included "Carbines".

Does that cover the M44?"

I am thinking that it does Hwg.

These are the second chapter headings from it:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 II.   DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MODELS

<snip - snip>   (body of text snipped for brevity of response)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I haven't read it yet but I am hopeful that it is the manual for my M44.
I think it is.

I was going to get the M1 Carbine manual BUT it is 18 MB's and it is too late for that now.
Tomorrow maybe.


SO ...

Just what was it that the sabbie got to the bottom of I wonder ?

Clip:

He was and no problem, just helping and he did. I used the search function and tried "gun", "Manual", "Mosin", "mauser" and got zip. Leave it to a sabbie to get to the bottom of it.

I used Steve's pages for some time and was sorry to see him shut down/turn off. I am very glad to see him back.

 Â   

Gooch:

I couldn't find the corrosive discussion so I'll post a response here. It is from my research library. By the way, my 54R supplier swears by spraying the works with windex at the range then a normal clean when return to base. He has shot thousands of corrosive.

Years ago I called and spoke with a chemist at the company that supplies Ace Hardware brand Janitor Strength Ammonia. It is a 10% solution, nominally. He told me that they often add small amounts of ammonia to steel drums filled with water to prevent rusting in the drum. But that was a tiny amount, and probably just enough to bias the pH slightly above 7.

<snip - snip>  (body of text snipped for brevity of response)

If you discover you've got a bore that rusts easily, use Flitz on a patch or use JB bore compound or Remington Bore Cleaner or Iosso Bore Cleaner, or any of the slightly abrasive cleaners to polish it lightly. That will clear off the activated surface.
__________________
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Patron Member

Thanks HWG

Sorry it has taken me so long to respond. Things have been rather hectic hereabouts lately.
I do appreciate your research on this subject.
The corrosive ammo is much cheaper and as long as I can use it without damage to my rifle the "cheap stuff" may just be the way to go.

stay safe,

gooch

[scorpio]

Got my manual back, no problems, hope it helps someone. If you have been hesitant to send one in I hope this builds confidence.