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Author Topic: I want to buy land.  (Read 7450 times)

GigaBuist

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I want to buy land.
« on: September 29, 2005, 08:23:48 pm »

I want to buy land... but I want as few government agencies as possible to know I did it.  I'm not looking to avoid propety taxes or anything, or do anything nefarious... I just want to keep them out of my friggen life as much as possible.

So, here's the deal.  I'm looking at a nearly 4 acre plot of land that was recently purchased by the father of a friend of mine.  He actually purchased a number of lots and is dividing them up to be sold off -- the lot next to the one I'm thinking about buying will be owned by a long time friend of 10 years and my cousin.. as they're getting married.  A bit odd, I know.

That makes it pretty attractive to me though... since I'll know my neighbors on one side, and it's wooded on the other side.  Pretty good privacy... which is important for me.  The bonus for them is that if a new Civil War/SHTF breaks out they have a place go, right next door.  They're aware of how "weird" I am I actually -want- me living next to them.  Go figure. :)

Maybe they're thinking cheap babysitter... anyway...

Is there anything I -should- do outside the norm here?  Or rather is there anything I can do?  Should I form an LLC and try to buy the land through that?

Basically I have no idea what I'm getting into.. and I'd like any advice from felllow freedom lovers in on this one.  I got the old man to advise me on finances, but for everything else I'm clueless.
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Joel

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2005, 09:09:03 pm »

Well, I'm not the person to answer this, since I have no practical experience.

But that never stopped me before.

Learn what you can about LLC's.  Don't know what state you're in, but it's a good way to own the land and yet not have your name associated with it, "in a very real and legally binding way."
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GigaBuist

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #2 on: September 30, 2005, 07:22:46 pm »

The state would be Michigan.
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javafiend

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2005, 05:14:02 pm »

See J. J. Luna's book, How to Be Invisible, for his discussion of how to own land and personal property.
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Lightning

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2005, 06:41:41 pm »

You could draw up a private promissory note to purchase the land from him with the seller financing you, if he's willing and you need him to.  Consult a realtor or attorney, or a legal documents source, to make sure you cover all the bases, though.

In the meantime, you can establish a living revocable trust that you control, and have the property deeded in the name of the trust.

The advantage of a trust is that you don't have to register it anywhere with a government agency - you just have to have it notarized in most if not all cases.  Then you hold the paperwork to show that you are legally the trustee.  Once you own the land, though, the local government will of course take your property's physical address so they can send your trust the tax bill for it.  But you can give them a different mailing address.

An LLC name has to be registered with your state business regulation agency, which costs a fee.  Again, you have to think about a mail drop (which could also cost, unless you use a friend's address).  It can be done, and I've heard of it being done under a made-up individual name or a friend's name.  But be aware that the state will demand a valid address at which to contact you (as the owner of the LLC).

You could also avoid all the property tax and other government troubles by agreeing to lease the land from the owner, and maybe even having him put up any house or building (and dealing with the permits, etc.), while you retain use of all the above by right of your lease agreement.  Depends on what you and he want to do with the land.
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hypoluxo

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2005, 10:52:43 pm »

See J. J. Luna's book, How to Be Invisible, for his discussion of how to own land and personal property.

Some of the best advice you will get...

http://www.howtobeinvisible.com is his web site.
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Delos

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2005, 10:37:50 pm »


Dude,

Apparently you are already aware of the fact that "owning" land merely makes you a renter from the government.

I'd like to learn more about land patents if anyone can post a good link. I know, I know . . . google!
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GigaBuist

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2005, 11:23:55 pm »

I finally got a chance to take a look at the plot, and this is definately a GO!

I'm thinking it's a pretty good setup for freedom lovers, which is why I post it here.  I just got really danged lucky I think.  Aside from living WAAAY out in the boonies this is great.

The road runs north/south.  To the north of me is a wooded plot that nobody's too geeked about buying right now.  However, if anybody does it's unlikely that they'd rip out ALL of the trees which means I'd still have privacy from them.  To the south will be my buddy and cousin.  Across the road the guy that's selling this all off is going to build a house, and I've known him since I was 8 years old.  Not the kind of guy that likes to meddle in other's affairs.

The actual lot is wooded enough that I wouldn't see anybody aside from my buddy and cousin to the south... and the neighbor to the south of them.  Who's that guy?  Well, I got lucky and found out.  I saw a guy I know (about my age) on his land packing up his truck w/ hunting gear when I pulled in the other day.  His uncle owns the land.  This is a family that I get along with pretty well, and they're also of the "do your own thing" camp.  Pretty sweet!

Behind us to the east... big creek.  BIG creek.  Even if somebody bought up that land and built on it it's .75 miles from the next road on that side.  It'd take a while, and it's all wooded, but even if that did hapen there's a 40 foot ravine there to seperate us.

The one creepy/weird thing (not to me, but to some): there's a half circle cut out of this plot where it attaches to the road for about 30 yards.  It's a cemetary from the 1850's.  I thought I was "next to" a cemetary.. turns out I'm SURROUNDING a cemetary.  Pretty sure they won't give me any trouble though.  They seemed pretty quiet. :)

Oh, and the creek gets pretty full in the spring time... Salmon like to run up it.  Sounds like some fishing opportunities right out of my back yard.  There's enough room and woods to hunt deer on there too, obviously.  Looks like I better learn to clean squirrels too, 'cuz there's plenty of that running about.

Everybody else on the road (about 5-6 miles long) is a farmer.  Good to know that we're zoned agricultural... 'cuz I'd like to maybe raise some chickens for some good clean meat.

I spent about an hour walking around there with my buddy, checking it all out, and did hear some gunfire too.  Seems like I'll fit in in the neighborhood just fine. :)  Yes, I've got plenty of room to put up a backspot and practice with a .22LR rifle.  Centerfire would be safe, but for noise reasons I'd just keep it to rimfire, unless I had all the neighbors approval and it was a weekend afternoon or something.  Heck, given that I know about the people living there they'd probably just come on over and join in.  Although, I'm only going to be 10 minutes form the shooting range, about 20 minutes from work, and 15 minutes from my parents place.  Right now:  15 minutes from work, 30 minutes from the shooting ranges, and 45 minutes from the parents.

I'm stoked... this looks like the -perfect- place for me to be living... and if I can do it anonymously all the better!  Yeehaw!

All TCF members in the area will, of course, be invited to the 1st BBQ whenever I finally get settled out there. :)
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Joel

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2005, 09:28:19 am »

Kewl!   :thumbsup:
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Lightning

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2005, 03:13:13 pm »

Good luck, GB!  It sounds wonderful.
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thistle

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2005, 07:31:43 pm »

Quote
I'd like to learn more about land patents if anyone can post a good link. I know, I know . . . google!

The extent of my research is Wikipedia:

Quote
A land patent is the right of ownership to a tract of land, usually granted by the federal or state government to an individual or private company. In the original 13 American Colonies a proprietor would grant land patents. Besides patent, other terms for the certificate that grants such rights include first-title deed and final certificate. In the United States, all property can be traced back to the first title deed and to claims document titles for land originally owned by France or Spain.

Isn't this the same as allodial title?

My opnion: Even if you do obtain a land patent lawfully, do you really expect the government to respect it?

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Junker

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Re: I want to buy land.
« Reply #11 on: November 05, 2005, 08:13:09 pm »

Exactly, Thistle. Reminds me of the income tax fight-- there are no magical legal words. If you sit where you are, you pay land tax; if you move around, you pay vehicle 'inspection fees' and taxes.

The colonists threw off the yoke of the king's owning them and the US citizens took it back on with the constitutional govt owning them. Two centuries later...some of the US citizens are noticing the problem as did some of the anti-federalists way back when and in turn Lysander Spooner. The court system has tended to remain consistent-- what the govt says, goes, basically because the govt inherited all royal preogative including implied ownership of everything. At this point, you pay your taxes or go to jail.

For those who cannot accept that, there remains only going 'underground' and avoiding the king's sheriff. Well, there is the War of Independence III, but even there, those in it are underground, paying taxes, dead, or in jail.
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